Why is abortion bad?
The abould could have removed me from society. isn't it basically wonderful thing?
It's not.
Fetus is not alive until birth. God agrees, says life is breath/breathe
All arguments from the rights-grabbers and women haters are emotional and irrational.
Case closed.
Abortion is only good if it lowers the number of brown people
>her body, her choice
This is like the worst argument ever. Abortion is good because it's basically eugenics.
>>78945046
Wrong.
The baby does "breathe", otherwise how does it get oxygen? You expect me to believe all that tissue can grow and develop in the absence of oxygen?
Are people who cant use their lungs on their own alive?
0/10, learn basic anatomy brah. not mad, just laughing too hard smdh
>>78942643
I don't believe in making abortion illegal, but I believe it is completely absurd to pretend the unborn child is not a human life.
>>78945046
>It's not allowed to be alive till I say so
>Using the Bible as a bludgeon
>Using the Bible as a justification of your degeneracy
>>78942643
FUCKING KEK
THEY EVEN SEPARATED THE BABY BY HIGHLIGHT IN THE WOMB!
IT'S NOT HER BODY THAT'S BEING ABORTED IT'S THE BABY'S
KEKEKEKEK
>>78945288
Are you so retarded that you think that babies are breathing in the womb? You're memeing, right?
We're fucked.
>>78945288
Babies don't use their lungs until after they're born. Before that they take in oxygen and nutrients via the umbilical cord. Try again.
>>78945288
>The baby does "breathe", otherwise how does it get oxygen?
Blood transfer through the placenta supplies oxygen, not "breathing"
>You expect me to believe all that tissue can grow and develop in the absence of oxygen?
I expect you to believe utter nonsense, the limit of which is currently inconceivable.
>Are people who cant use their lungs on their own alive?
Are you calling God a liar?
>>78945616
How many African Americans would be alive right now if we had no abortion?
Not even religious. Killing a human is wrong. Killing a child is even more heinous.
>>78945713
Women dont care. if something cant provide for them and make them feel like the center of attention, its not a real thing to them.
>>78945832
The guy who we are replying to is memeing, right Anon? Sometimes I worry about our species future.
>>78945449
>I don't believe in making abortion illegal, but I believe it is completely absurd to pretend the unborn child is not a human life.
It's human, but not a human being. It's living tissue, like your arm is living tissue. But it's clearly not alive on its own, not a living being yet.
It's bad because it takes away an entire lifespan from someone.
It's morally wrong for the same reason as murder. Who are we to take someone's life from him or her?
A fetus isn't a sperm cell or egg cell. A fetus is an individual member of the human species in development, so to take that individual's future from him or her is a... well, horrible thing to do.
There'd be FAR less abortions if there wasn't mandatory child support from fathers, regardless of if they wanted the kid. Women would be forced into better choices.
Her body. Her right. Her RESPONSIBILITY.
>>78946084
Go fuck a tranny, MRA wash out.
>>78945887
>Killing a human is wrong
Great. It's not a killing if it's not alive, so we have no disagreement here.
it's hard to say :)
lol
>>78942643
Why would something that kills so many niggers be bad?
The more I think about it, the more it seems that liberals would be against abortion.
Maybe if it wasn't for "mah body"
>>78946060
>It's morally wrong for the same reason as murder.
Then why isn't it murder?
ProTip: Because it's not.
>>78946002
Scientist define alien life as a single living cell, but humans aren't alive until their out of the womb? Just Jew logic so they can continue to enjoy baby smoothies.
>>78942643
Abortion fucking rules. Never put your dick inside a girl who is against abortion.
>>78945046
that's not a scientifically sustainable position
the only logically consistent and reasonable point you can make an argument for a fetus becoming human is fertilization.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p59AjrBscc8
>>78942643
>My money
>My choice
>Half my genes
>Half my choice
Abortion is not, and should never be, just the woman's choice. I want to know that my future offspring have a well-off life, and if I can't be certain of it by being there, I don't want it to be born.
>Abortion is bad
>We should allow unwanted babies to be born
>We should give more free money to single moms
>We should have more degenerate kids running around
>Abortion is bad, but let's not do anything about the mass amount of orphans and street gangs caused by unwanted pregnancies
>Abortion is bad
>>78946444
Based trips
>>78946291
Liberals are just anti-west/anti-traditional hence the support for abortion.
>>78946321
>it's not murder because it's not murder even if it has the same intention of ending a life, even if it's the same act of ending a life
Why are we not allowed to kill a child right after it is born? Where do you draw the line? Just because it is unable to sustain itself in the first few months? Following that analogy, old people who're in the hospital should die aswell, coma patients should be killed aswell.
>>78942643
It isn't without abortion we would be overrun with niggers
These are the real arguments.
When the women decides childbearing for herself, society thrives.
When the state decides childbirth, society declines. Hitler, Mao and Stalin all prohibited abortion.
>>78942643
No, it's a great thing if done right. I'd rather pay for the idiots to not reproduce than to support their retarded offspring.
The apple never falls far from the tree, shitty parent(s) make shitty people.
>>78942643
abortion is good
all autistics/minorities should be aborted
>>78946450
a fertilized egg is as much a human as a cancer cell in my cock
>>78946490
don't forget that if it weren't for abortion, america would have an extra 50 million blacks.
that would bring the total number of blacks to a 100 million.
do you have an economic plan for a country of 450 million when nearly a quarter of it is on welfare?
>>78942643
Abortion may or may not be questionable ethical, but if it is still support it, let me explain.
The her-body-her-choice line is going to pave the way to better public health. Identity politics has made mental illness and physical abnormalities something to be celebrated other than something to seek treatment or cures for, especially mental illness. People are suffering from the defects they were born naturally with, but cultural Marxists are convincing the mentally ill and the neurotypical that it is the fault of our intolerant society that is causing these special snowflakes misery, and not the conditions of their defects themselves. Engineering of genes and Importantly embryos are right around the corner of being incorporated into mainstream medicine. And when we start finding causes to illnesses such as gender dysphoria and autism and have the means to provide a solution to it, I bet my soul that the regressive left is going to cry ableism and eugenics. And future parents will use this if accessible to them because while they may love their autistic, or polygendered child, deep down they wish they were normal for their sake. And the regressive left are going to have a hard time driving forth that rhetoric, because her body her choice. If they can abort the embryo why can't they modify it as well? This pro-choice movement is a blessing is disguise, we are going to use feminists to shut down the ableism crowd.
>>78946213
>fetuses aren't alive
You might be a bit 'tarded, son.
>>78945887
exactly and since what's being aborted is just a fetus, there isn't a problem.
>>78946785
>When the women decides childbearing for herself, society thrives.
>[citation needed.]
I would be pro-abortion only if the father doesn't need to pay for shit if he doesn't want to. He has no right to say in whether it is born or not because "muh own body" so why do you have the right to force him into this. No taxation without representation.
>>78942643
I don't care about abortion. But the way it's argued is pathetic. Both sides take the position of fucking morons; creating this non stop cycle of bullshit. The left only concerns itself with the woman involved. The right only concerns itself with the fetus involved. The argument is whether or not it should be legal to stop a human brain by choice until a certain development level. Why does no one argue this.
Fuck everyone that cares about abortion one way or the other using the common arguments.
>>78946321
Abortion isn't considered "murder" because abortion is legal, and murder means an unlawful killing.
However, as I said, if you look at the issue of abortion, it's morally wrong for the same philosophical reasons as murder. It takes away an entire future from someone.
>>78946914
>do you have an economic plan for a country of 450 million when nearly a quarter of it is on welfare?
It'd be even worse than that. We are already at roughly ~30% on welfare. With the extra blacks, it'd probably be at 40-50%.
I think marriage should be a requirement to have babies. The black population would decrease immediately.
>>78942643
It has a life force as soon as it becomes two-cell organism that makes him multiply to form human in the end.
It's murder but whatever.
>>78942643
if its an egg, ok
if it's a tiny fetus, ok
if it's due at any moment, FULL STOP
>>78946980
>The argument is whether or not it should be legal to stop a human brain by choice until a certain development level. Why does no one argue this.
Are you retarded? Because that exact argument boils down to who has the bigger right, the woman deciding to end the development, or the fetus deciding to continue the development.
>thinking you're all that intellectually superior even though you just posed the exact same question that has been argued about for the last decaded
moron.
>>78942643
It isn't.
>>78946153
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJrjj333B1c
>CARNELL SMITH, an engineer-turned-lobbyist in Georgia, is the leading advocate for men like Mike. In 2001, after Smith’s own paternity struggle, he formed U.S. Citizens Against Paternity Fraud, to help the men he calls “duped dads.” In his most notable success, Smith persuaded Georgia lawmakers to rescind nonbiological fathers’ financial obligations, no matter the child’s age or how close the relationship. Smith then became the first man to disestablish paternity under that law.
>>78947099
i have no empathy for a few clusters of cells that haven't formed into the human shape fully.
and with overpopulation being a thing, we can't afford to humanize eggs.
>>78946932
wow. nice word salad.
>>78942643
'her body'
the body inside her belly is NOT her body, its her baby's.
Fucking idiot.
>>78946785
the women made her choice and took the risks when she consented to sex
now she just wants to weasel out of personal responsibility by killing her own child, who I might add, is the most innocent party of the entire situation
>>78946913
a fertilized egg will become a fully grown person unless you use physical force to stop it and kill it
not an argument
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhoFNmMeO8k
Women selfishly murder their unborn child, putting herself before the life of her unborn child.
>>78946977
he represented pretty well a few weeks earlier.
>>78942643
Cuz Jesus said so, lol.
>>78942643
Abortion is bad because it's murder. Cased closed.
>>78947292
>only seeks physical resemblence to human to regard it as human
>what is mind/spirit/life force
>>78947319
she still makes all the decisions for that body.
it can't tell her to not drink or smoke crack or date captain falcon.
>>78945046
hahaha murican using bible instead of brain/logic
>>78947403
Why is murder bad?
>>78942643
>>78947403
I'm not a Christfag. I'm just moral.
>>78946606
>Why are we not allowed to kill a child right after it is born?
Because then it is a living *breathing* human BEING.
That really makes all the difference
>>78947428
>what is non-scientific hubbabaloo
>>78942643
It infringes on the right to life of the unborn human.
>>78947514
Do you want to be murdered?
>>78947398
What did Jesus say?
>"Her body, her choice"
What if she makes bad choices? I mean, parents of born children get their kids taken away by Child Protective Services all the time.
Why should I respect someone's choice just because he or she is the parent of a child? Maybe they don't want what is best for the child?
>>78945763
they take oxygen from the mother dumbfuck, they just dont get it themselves
>>78947595
No, but that doesn't answer the question.
>>78947196
>Are you retarded? Because that exact argument boils down to who has the bigger right, the woman deciding to end the development, or the fetus deciding to continue the development.
No that's not the argument. The argument is "it's a woman's choice to do with what she wants in her OWN body" -- states nothing about the fetus.
And the right "the baby deserves to live" -- states nothing about the woman involved in the situation.
The two sides don't meet on the same field to argue anything.
>>78942643
>The abould could have removed me from society
>abould
dafuq is this is that like the jafar thing muslims talk about but a gook version?
>>78947681
it kinda answers it, nobody wants their life ended out of their will.
however
>embryos
>will
>>78945902
The fetus does not have the mental capabilities of feeling pain/emotions/ect. The simple fact that it could have been a human does not make it a reason not to kill it. If it can't feel, who gives a shit
>>78947791
>nobody wants their life ended out of their will
It still doesn't mean murder is automatically bad.
>>78942643
>kills the potential offspring of shitskins and liberals
>bad
>>78945046
wrong
>Jerimiah 1:5
>Psalms 139:16
>Luke1:41-44
>>78947753
They do, because her own body includes the fetus. The "baby has a right to live" is the exact same thing as saying that the woman does or at the very least should not have the legal right to stop the fetus human brain by her choice, at all.
Both are exactly opposites at the same argument. They meet on the same field.
>>78945140
second post best post
>>78947963
right. it all depends on the justification.
but by default, killing is bad. again, justification can make killing a necessity.
>>78947514
Because it disrupts the natural end(s) of the human.
>>78942643
> Why is abortion bad?
Because that`s how you born jap.
>>78942643
>Death (end of life) is medically and legally defined as the end of brain functions.
Ergo, the beginning of life life should be defined medically and legally as the beginning of brain functions.
>Fetal brain activity begins to exhibit regular wave patterns around 25 weeks and can be measured by EEG.
Ergo, I submit that the beginning of life can not occur later than the 25th week of pregnancy.
>>78948220
I can agree with that. I would say abortion is easily justified by the statistics of who gets the most abortions (leeches on society).
>>78948243
So? What if it's an undesirable person?
>>78942643
>Why is abortion bad?
Depends if you think a foetus is a human or not. If you don't there's nothing bad about it. If you do it's murder.
Only positions worth respecting are the extremes at each end of the debate - no abortion should be legal or all abortion should be legal.
If a foetus is a human then it should never be aborted - that it was conceived cos of rape/incest whatever is irrelevant because an individual isn't guilty of their parents crimes.
If the foetus is not a human it's not a human until it's born - and there's no arbitrary magic point in development where you can say "Ok this foetus is 23 weeks, 6 days, 23 hours, into it's development so it isn't human we can abort but this one here is 2 hours older and is fully human so is legally protected" - so all abortion should be legal.
The 'moderates' who say abortion should be legal up to a certain point or at any point in instances of 'rape etc' are fucking hypocrites.
>>78942643
OK for niggers, abomination for whites.
>>78947504
Let's not forget it was the Christians who went full terrorist and decided to blow up abortion clinics.
>>78945878
Looked it up. It said 16 million on one source I saw
>>78948072
>They do, because her own body includes the fetus.
hahah they are actually arguing that a separate brain is their body? Alright, then the most popular pro-choice argument is moronic.
Well, if you can't beat em, join em
They can have all the abortions they want. As long as the tax payer isnt paying for it.
>>78942643
i think people should be able to abort children but the reasoning behind it is fucking cancer
the entire pro abortion argument revolves around women wanting to remove themselves from responsibility rather than thinking about the future of their child
>>78948342
>So? What if it's an undesirable person?
As all things are directed towards ends which are our natural good. Good is to be done and pursued, and evil is to be avoided as it works against the quality of our nature. In other words, to describe something as evil is to simultaneously prescribe that it is not to be done. If something is evil, we ought not do it as it works against our nature.
>undesirable
Why would that be relevant.
>>78948292
I don't respect your position though because a fetus isn't frozen in time.
In a few more months, the fetus will have measurable brain activity and will physically resemble a born person.
You're acting all "AHA, THIS YOU CAN'T DO X AT THIS BRIEF MOMENT IN TIME! THIS PROVES ME POINT!" How is that reasonable? Humans don't exist frozen in time. We exist now, we exist a few months in the future, and we exist 20 years in the future. Our lives are a span of time, like a line plot.
>>78942643
>isn't it basically wonderful thing?
Not really, it is a social problem in itself when society is so fucked up that women would actually prefer not to have children if given the option.
The solution is to improve quality of life and increase societal value of women who choose to be traditional housewives and focus on their children. Men should be payed enough to support a household alone withoun't the need of 2 income gainers in the family to support a family of 2 adults and 2 children.
Also, the elderly should be respected and properly taken care of, not just thrown into a creppy nursing home to wait for death when they become a nuisance.
>>78948777
>i think people should be able to abort children but the reasoning behind it is fucking cancer
>the entire pro abortion argument revolves around women wanting to remove themselves from responsibility rather than thinking about the future of their child
this
>>78942643
Why are ALT weaboos from Japan such unbearable shitposters on /pol/?
>>78942643
For the same reason murdering an adult is bad.
>>78948827
I don't care about good or evil or other pointless moral philosophies. I care about results. In the US, most of the abortions occur among demographics that are more likely to commit crime, be on welfare, be more unintelligent, etc.
>>78942643
>her body
Every. Fucking. Time.
So what's inside her? Air? Do these people even think before they speak?
I'm atheist and I disagree with abortions mainly because it fucks me off irresponsible cunts can play with life because of convenience.
I say you must agree to sterilisation after an abortion and also halve the limit from 24 to 12 weeks.
>the only argument against abortion has to do with religion
>I'm not Christian
so whats the argument against abortion now
>>78949063
this
if they want to abort, thats ok, just let them be judged in the court just like any other murderer
>>78949088
>>78949088
>I don't care about good or evil or other pointless moral philosophies.
THEN WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU TRYING TO DISCUSS ETHICS WITH US, ANON
IF YOU ONLY GIVE A DAMN ABOUT UTILITARIANISM THEN YOU SHOULD START OUT SAYING SUCH
>>78942643
>Her ody her choice
shitty design. tits and fetus doesn't make a B.
>>78945154
No, it's even a worse argument than that.
It's literally not her body.
I can't believe I never see my argument ever used except by me.
It's a unique human genetic code separate from the mother and the father. It's literally a different person, and when you snuff out all living human cells belonging to a unique genetic code, you kill them.
>>78945878
>how much better off would the African American community be if they were allowed to experience negative consequences
every abortion should come with a mandatory sterilization
if you want to kill your own child, you've lost your reproductive rights
>>78949349
The craziest shit is when they then try to counter that
>b-b-b-but it's not human
So wat the fuck is it then?
>>78949383
>implying they'll ever learn
They already experience negative consequences all the time from their shitty decision making. Even with welfare, black communities still suck. More of them won't help.
>>78949284
Ethics should be grounded in something rational. Not just blanket "good" or "bad" things.
>>78942643
Abortion is great and im 100 percent pro choice. The people who get abortions shouldnt be reproducing.
>>78942643
Some poltards will never realize that abortion is their friend. They whine about broken families and how they cause degeneracy and lead to further support for leftists. But then turn around and attack the only institution that does anything to curb the number of broken families. T B H F A M
>>78945046
>god
wrongo
I don't care about abortion but there should be some punishment for girls who do it more then 2 times... Like make it permanent for her to not have children
>>78949583
NOTHING I SAID WAS IRRATIONAL
THE GOOD/BAD I USED IS IN RESPONSE TO DETAILING FINAL CAUSES OF OBJECTS, WHICH IS A CONCEPT USED BY THE GREEKS AND USED FOR OVER A MILLENNIUM
THERE IS RATIONALE, YOU'RE IGNORING IT.
>>78949583
>Even with welfare
at least without welfare, I won't be expected to subsidize their irresponsibility
>>78945449
this desu senpai
>be christian
>support abortion fully
what fugg habben wid me
>>78949144
>right to life of humans, born and unborn
>saying no to only gaining human rights when you're a human that's born
>religious argument
m8 what
>>78949815
Oh I'm totally for getting rid of it as it's obvious welfare hasn't worked. But lets not pretend that they would be any better off without abortion.
>>78949778
Now you're just sperging. All you said was that murder was bad because its an unnatural end to life. And then gave a non-justification later.
>replying to tripfags
>>78949497
>if you want to kill your own child, you've lost your reproductive rights
Argument disregarded because it is emotional and irrational
>>78949130
>I say you must agree to sterilisation after an abortion and also halve the limit from 24 to 12 weeks.
If you're not allowed to trample on a woman's rights in one aspect, you demand to trample on her rights in another?
Tantrums are emotional and irrational
>>78949583
"good" and "bad" are decided using rationality when conducted in a secular sense. I don't see anyone arguing that there is ONLY good and bad.
Things are not black and white, and rationality helps understand this. Rationally speaking, one can establish what is good and what is bad in the abstract sense but does not need to establish good and bad as concrete rules.
If we are talking utilitarianism, then we shouldn't be getting rid of just the unborn that will populate the welfare programs and ghettos, we should be removing the currently living. The ones in the ghettos, the ones not getting educations, the ones literally leeching off of society. It's only rational.
There should be a limit to how many abortions a woman can get. If it happens more than 3 times then it's far more than just being unlucky, and she should have to deal with the consequences of being irresponsible.
>>78950455
I never claimed allegiance to utilitarianism.
>we should be removing the currently living. The ones in the ghettos, the ones not getting educations, the ones literally leeching off of society
In an ideal world, yes, but that would have severe backlashes with the populace.
>>78947597
>What did Jesus say?
600 very specific laws in the bible and not one single law that deals with abortion or calls it a sin.
In fact, a man "spilling his seed" is a sin treated far worse.
>>78950237
It's not emotional or irrational.
It's a good compromise over complete criminalization of abortion. Every abortion of a repeated offender under such a system would be one less life forcefully ended.
It's an ethical solution to avoid ending as much human life as possible, while still being reasonable to society.
>>78948536
It must be mate, that's the whole argument. You might think it's retarded, and you might be right, but that doesn't matter for the existence of the argument. The argument is quite clearly stated, the woman rules over her own body, since this is an argument in favour óf abortion, it cannot but mean that the fetus is part of the body of the woman. There's no other way to interpret it lest it becomes no longer an argument.
I'll agree that arguing that someone is allowed to have legal rights over a seperate brain is highly questionable (not entirely moronic, there are moments I ask myself whether taking these rights might be for the best (children with down syndrome are a drain on a social democracy like mine), but regardless, it's morally disgusting)
>>78949640
Then surely it would be better (and cheaper) to have them sterilised?
>>78946785
Nah man. Both options are terrible just in different ways. It all depends on what kind of society you want.
>>78947548
>It infringes on the right to life of the unborn human.
The unborn human, isn't that like referring to the egg as an "uncooked omelet"?
Why is it that the emotional crowd is always reduced to euphemisms and emotional pleas?
>>78949896
>what fugg habben wid me
Might hear some bullshit from other christians and possibly become an outcast in your local church. Not much else to be concerned about, god does not care about what we do at all.
>>78950237
>>78950746
>it is emotional and irrational
Really, what you're saying is like calling mistreatment of children being met with parental rights stripped away as "emotional and irrational".
>>78942643
Abortion is awful, it's murdering another human.
>inb4 it's just a featus
It's a human just developing, just as a child developers into a man or woman. Do we say "oh children aren't people because they aren't adults?" No because they are still human just in development. Sure a featus may not have a conscience and doesn't know what's going on when you kill it but newborns aren't really self aware either but for some reason liberals think that killing them is wrong. Sure I hate niggers and most people on here only like abortion because it kills niggers, but most people on here also agree that the west is doomed. We literally have daily threads on how fucked the west is, so just get it over with quick and rip the band aid off. Let the west crumble and then have the niggers stand there when they realize that the west crumbling means no welfare and they are the only ones to blame. Either that or just genocide all shitskins. Do it knowing full well it is morally wrong but the logical thing to do. Pick one or the other.
>>78950388
Where did I say you're not allowed to trample on a woman's "right"? No one as a "right" to murder without due process, I thought a yank would understand this
>>78950680
If you go through the bible some of the laws were clearly written in response to someone wanting to fuck a relative. Sister? No. Mother? No. Aunt? No. Step sister? No. Sister of Stepmother who lives in the same house? No. Mother? We already said fucking NO
>>78950082
>non-justification
Things in nature have natural ends that they are best doing (a heart is to pump blood, for example). Thus there is an innate and objective good for the thing. Disrupting something from its natural end works against the good of the thing listed and thus would make it bad (how bad depending on the necessity of it being done but bad nonetheless). Thus as long as we can establish natural ends, we have an objective good/bad. The view of natural ends is a well known part of the western philosophical tradition for more than 2000 years now. It's heavily debated and contended nowadays, but I will still uphold it for the sake of ethical discussion.
And your utilitarianism fails because of the inability to weigh actions as good or bad given the unforeseen consequences. You have a system that we cannot get proper results from, only limited results.
>>78949349
>It's literally not her body.
It is a growth inside her which in biological terms, makes it 100% hers. She gets to decide.
>I can't believe I never see my argument ever used except by me.
Prolly because it's such a stellar argument /sarc
>>78950897
>The unborn human, isn't that like referring to the egg as an "uncooked omelet"?
No. There is no changes in species as it develops. That's unscientific.
>>78950954
Morals are made up, I support abortions the day before birth
>>78951122
>biological terms
By biological terms it's literally a separate organism.
>>78950897
How is it emotional? Your argument leads nowhere friend. Laws AREN'T logical for the most part, you know that, right?
>Gas everyone to make way for masterrace if you disagree you're being emotional
>>78942643
I think it's mostly disliked because the people who are most for it are annoying.
That being said the pro-abortion side is immensely annoying as well so what do I know.
>>78951031
>Things in nature have natural ends that they are best doing (a heart is to pump blood, for example). Thus there is an innate and objective good for the thing.
Completely a non-sequitur. This makes zero sense.
>>78951219
I support your death at this very moment! Dsagree? Well you're just being emotional and morals are made up
I think the best way of dealing with Abortion is allowing if how much they make, their spouse makes and their parent's (if they're willing to help) make.
This stops children that could have had good lives and been productive from dying but it also stops all the shitstains of society from being born.
>>78951122
Under biological terms the baby has half the man's DNA.
Is it 100% hers if it's only half related?
>>78951431
*depending on how much
>>78950746
>Every abortion of a repeated offender under such a system would be one less life forcefully ended.
The fetus isn't alive until it's born, so there is no, "life forcefully ended". That's just made up gibberish.
It sound like you just want to punish women, abortion gives you some kind of flimsy excuse.
>>78951122
>possession is 9/10 of the law
lmao nigga u serious?
>>78951413
Cool good thing I can own a gun unlike someone
>>78951560
I can own one too, I just have to jump through a lot of hoops.
Time you took a break from chan for a while son
>>78942643
Abortion is sick and wrong, it's not her choice and her body, there's another body inside her that she has NO right to harm. If you don't want a baby you don't get knocked up
>>78951538
>The fetus isn't alive until it's born
no, that's made up gibberish
a human life become human life the second the egg is fertilized
after that point, the only want to stop that human from maturing is violent force
>It sound like you just want to punish women
it sounds like you're retarded
women should have to take responsibility for their actions just like the rest of society
abortion is the means to which a women can absolve all responsibility or herself through the legalized killing of her own child
>>78942643
What the fuck are you trying to say, nipmonkey?
>>78950941
>Really, what you're saying is like calling mistreatment of children being met with parental rights stripped away as "emotional and irrational".
No, because that would be a completely different situation.
A fetus is not a child yet. Its not alive yet.
There are laws that protect children from mistreatment.
Terminating a fetus is not "mistreating" it. That's a personification
If it's not born yet, there's no parents yet.
Your sloppy analogy probably sounded pretty good in your head, didn't it?
>>78946084
There should be mandatory dna testing at every birth too, so guys aren't cucked into raising and paying for someone else's offspring.
>>78951682
Kek then go buy an assault rifle.
Bin the knife on the way
>>78951002
>No one as a "right" to murder without due process
How does an abortion rise to the legal definition of "murder"?
>>78950835
We cant force that wothout a totalitarian shithole gov. Plus there's still the hope that those people may stop being wastes of carbon one day.
>>78951963
>women should have to take responsibility for their actions just like the rest of society
I agree m8 everyone must take responsibility but unfortunately the purpose of a large state is to nanny everyone.
I know a woman who uses the emergency contraceptive pill instead of actual contraception. I'm not kidding, she buys i tin bulk. Her insides must be rekt.
>>78952027
>A fetus is not a child yet.
Says who?
>>78951092
See? No rational argument.
Only emotional pleas via memes
>>78947540
>Non-Scientific Hubbabaloo
>"I need something arbitrary like looking similar to a human shape to value its life."
Abortion is a human sacrifice ritual -- the most powerful known to exist. It was invented by eugenics operatives within the occultic elite to cury Satan's favor while gaining his protection of their warmaking, usury, currency manipulation, and control over the minds of men.
Why is abortion the most powerful form of ritual human sacrifice? Because it entails the most defenseless victims conceivable (the unborn) being murdered by the very persons most duty-bound to love and protect them from harm -- their own mothers, and medical doctors who've sworn oaths to their gods to do no harm.
These ritual murders which society misnames abortions are, furthermore, carried out in a nonchalant and routinized fashion exclusively to facilitate hedonistic apathy, laziness, and convenience; symbolically placing ten seconds of vaginal pleasure above the value of a human lifetime's worth of a living, breathing human being's consciousness.
In short, Satan loves abortion because it symbolizes evil within cruelty within evil. It proffers that a few seconds of vaginal contractions mean more than human life itself, and it does this using the greatest symbols of love and compassion (mothers and doctors), satanically inverted into spiritually numbed, unfeeling executioners.
So the next time you see a western woman screeching about her abortion rights on the steps of some state capitol, look into her empty eyes and know that you're seeing more than a simple murderer. Look into her eyes and know that you're seeing a demon, the very definition of evil. And know that the steady stream of death she inflicts on the unborn is what powers the elite's satanic karma.
>>78952123
>assault rifle
kek now I KNOW you must be a new yorker or commiefag
>>78952027
>A fetus is not a child yet
Why not? At what point does it become human life? There is no scientific justification for what you're saying.
What you're essentially saying is 5 minutes before birth it's okay to murder it, but the second it comes out of the womb it's suddenly off limits.
It's a human life at all stages of development.
>It's not alive
you are retarded
>>78952159
Ok then schlomo, replace murder with "end life".
>>78942643
Even if you don't believe that life begins at conception, you have to admit it's *close* to murder.
>>78951354
>ignoring the utilitarianism complaint
And I wouldn't call it a non-sequitur at all. The good is understood classically as what all things seek and by accepting natural ends we have a way of discerning the good. The conflicting wills of people simply being confusion brought upon by understanding nature, being controlled by desires, and culture.
>>78951161
>There is no changes in species as it develops. That's unscientific.
I don;t follow. A chicken egg does not "change species" to become an omelet.
Do you call eggs, "uncooked omelets"?
Then why do you call a fetus an unborn child?
It could just as easily be an unborn serial killer or an unborn biker, unborn accountant, unborn senior citizen.
Abortion is poor morally but should not be illegal. Seriously fuck off atheist degenerates. Morals are not "made up" but acquired through experience, evidence and discernment.
How is it that there are so many unwanted pregnancies anyway? Even if you don't use any sort of contraception, all you have to do is pull out, there is no sperm in precum.
>>78951292
>By biological terms it's literally a separate organism.
It's literally separate the day it is born, but it's quite literally still firmly connected until then.
>>78952638
Not all atheists support abortion sunshine
Morality certainly is relative but that doesn't mean you can be an irresponsible piece of shit
>>78948858
But how long can the fetus move within the frozen time?
>>78948858
>In a few more months, the fetus will have measurable brain activity
Actually more like weeks mate. You'd be very surprised how quickly humans develop.
t. a new dad
>>78952833
You are right, morality does not require theology, although I would argue that the length of time required for morals to develop had been such that most morality was at one time theological and so many degenerates are drawn to avowed atheism since it seems a bastion of crude behavior
>>78949349
>you kill them.
So what?
>>78953145
Watch that edge son you're doing me a frighten
>>78952674
I don't know but... some stats.
> 54% of women having abortions used contraception.
> 2% of all women have abortions each year.
That leaves 1% of women having abortions and not using contraception.
>>78951432
>Under biological terms the baby has half the man's DNA.
The biological term you're looking for is meiosis. Each partner contributes 1/2 the genetic pairs.
>Is it 100% hers if it's only half related?
Sure. There seems to be a convincing evolutionary advantage in preventing men from having any physical access to the mother's growth.
>>78953223
Seriously, why should we care so much about a sac of genes?
>>78952582
>A chicken egg does not "change species" to become an omelet.
No, I'm talking about humans during different stages of growth. Omelettes are just man-made creations, I'm talking about natural growth.
>unborn serial killer
No, while biology may play into whether they do it, you don't biologically grow into being a serial killer. That's unscientific.
>>78952766
Yes, but physical connectivity doesn'tmatter in biology here. This is why conjoined twins are still biologically understood and two separate people.
>>78946932
BIG WORDS
>>78942643
>her body
What if the baby is a girl?
And isn't it funny how all the pro-abortion fanatics were not aborted?
>>78953302
You are just a sac of genes so why don't you kill yourself? Cowardice?
>>78942643
I have come around to abortion. I am fine with it.
The type of people that get abortions aren't people you want breeding, not to mention it doesn't stop me from making my own moral judgements about them as human beings and not being associated with them.
I don't think the US can ever come to an agreement about this? Why don't we just cut federal funding and stop worrying about this on a national scale?
States decide the legality and states provide the funding for abortion clinics. Everyone happy? Can we move on now?
>>78946473
This, really though
>>78946815
The idiots reproduce because more kids = more gibsmedats and breaks frpm guberment. You don't seem to know how that works. Abortion mostly seems to be a way to justify being an irresponsible whore.
>>78942643
who are these women that don't have access to abortions in america?
>>78953584
Well honestly I think it is wrong that women are drawn to abortion because of income inequality and personal insecurity. We could use federal funding that currently goes to abortion providers and increase public assistance to single mothers. Abortions could still be legal but would become less attractive as an option
>>78951963
>a human life become human life the second the egg is fertilized
The zygote was already living. The gamete was already living.
When the fetus is born, we call it the Miracle of Birth.
Conception uses the same "fertilizer" word that we use for cow manure.
Linguistically, we clearly recognize which event is the real demarcation point.
>legalized killing of her own child
That's just some emotional argument that fools the feeble-minded. The fetus is not a child yet. The fetus is not alive, so nothing is being killed.
Our law, language, culture, history, science all agree.
>>78942643
It's essentially eugenics, which I'm fine with. I don't think it's bad, I just think it should be enforced on some people
>>78953802
It's not the child's fault and they should not be executed because you don't want to pay into the society that supports and protects you
>>78953302
We're all gene reproducing machines. Why does this matter?
Same argument as:
>Foetus is just a ball of cells
We're all a fucking massive ball of cells.
>>78953907
The fetus is alive you fucking idiot
![churchlady[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/51zP3Mj.jpg "churchlady[1].jpg")
>>78952364
>Abortion is a human sacrifice ritual -- the most powerful known to exist. It was invented by eugenics operatives within the occultic elite to cury Satan's favor while gaining his protection of their warmaking, usury, currency manipulation, and control over the minds of men.
Well, it certainly sounds like somebody's mind is being controlled. Hmmm. Could it be?
SATAN?
>>78953907
>The fetus is not a child yet. The fetus is not alive, so nothing is being killed.
Explain why a foetus is not a child
>foetus is not alive
haha nigga you must have missed your basic biology lessons, don't you remember MRS GREN?
>>78954250
Nah Satan loves us and only wants what's best for us. God is actually the evil one. He gave us the means to do evil shit, Satan just wants us to be happy.
ave satannas
>>78953848
Although I don't like incentivizing motherhood among the poor, I'd be fine with this. Only 2% of women get abortions each year, this is not enough to warrant a national discussion.
>>78953907
the fetus is alive and human
please provide a source that proves fetuses are somehow not human or not alive
please explain the point at which a fetus which is somehow not human and not alive, magically becomes off limits because it's suddenly human and alife
use scientifically backed reasoning or sources, please
>>78952367
>At what point does it become human life?
Birth. That's been the starting point for hundreds of thousands of years.
>What you're essentially saying is 5 minutes before birth it's okay to murder it, but the second it comes out of the womb it's suddenly off limits.
No, that wouldn't be what I'm saying.
I'm saying you can't "murder" something that's not alive.
I'm saying (and God agrees somewhat) that until a fetus can breathe on its own, it's not capable of sustaining life.
>>78946598
Nice meme
>>78954682
>>At what point does it become human life?
>Birth. That's been the starting point for hundreds of thousands of years.
lmao genetics decide you fucking moron not birth.
How can there be pre-birth down syndrome tests if it's "not human"?
You're a mong
>>78954503
It is used as a wedge issue for both sides to promote their loosely related agendas..
>>78954682
>Birth
So 5 seconds before birth it's okay to forcefully stop a fetus from "becoming alive" by crushing it?
>>78952473
I'm not a utilitarian; I have a strong in-group preference. The complaint is unfounded. Abortion has resulted in lower crime rates and less welfare leeches. I view both of these effects as positive for society.
Regardless, your argument makes zero sense. It's literally just "nature does some stuff so obviously this must be good."
I'm all for abortion since it's hard enough with 7 billion or so people already ruining this world.
>>78954682
It's pretty obvious that there is something morally wrong with abortion. Why continue down this logic path just for political reasons? Maybe it's not murder but it's pretty close to murder.
>>78954682
God doesn't agree with shit. You're trying really, really hard here, fool. Fortunately others see through your cognitive dissonance--mind you, a woman isn't going to sleep with you just because you support Her Choice.
>>78953332
>No, I'm talking about humans during different stages of growth. Omelettes are just man-made creations, I'm talking about natural growth.
So why don;t you say "unborn senior citizens"? That would be a natural growth too, but it might expose the silliness of your irrational euphemism.
>No, while biology may play into whether they do it, you don't biologically grow into being a serial killer. That's unscientific.
Yet we all grow into something. It is your futile reluctance to call a fetus what it really is,rather than what is might become, that is not rational.
>>78951122
I don't get to murder you because I change my mind after inviting you into my home
Liberals have to jump through so many hoops and resort to the most amoral arguments to justify killing babies
I don't give a shit since only niggers and the worst people alive use it at a meaningful rate, and they'd have passed on those shitty genes to their spawn
>>78953584
>States decide the legality
Let each state decide the beginning of life? I though government was the enemy?
Abortion laws are only being fought at the state level because of a deliberate divide and conquer strategy by State Policy Network.
>>78947667
>oxygen transfers in blood
>breathing
Oh boy. We ARE fucked if this is le altright intellectuals.
>>78942643
I'm against it, because the whole pregnancy thing change the brain chemicals of the women forever, even if she murder her child.
They're usually more inclined to develop depression.as well.
But if the idea is legalize it, we need some points:
1. The man and the woman should choose to keep or not the child, not only the woman.
1.2. If only women has right over her child's life, the men should not have any responsability over the child
2. Women that choose to do a abortion should use a mark. Preferably a tattoo on the face to show everyone what she did, because if she's able to kill someone of her blood, she's able to kill anyone else.
>>78955963
The government isn't the enemy on this issue.
The enemy is unwanted pregnancy and deciding the morality of abortion. This is a religious issue and the entirety of America probably cannot come to a consensus on this. Just leave it to the states.
> Abortion laws are only being fought at the state level because of a deliberate divide and conquer strategy by State Policy Network.
Do you even want to be taken seriously?
>>78956575
Theres no such thing as unwanted pregnancy.
Everyone could choose not to fuck, or not to fuck without condoms.
Also, unwanted pregnancy is just a concept in a societies where the whole family structure is destroyed.
>>78955674
>"unborn senior citizens"
Because senior citizens isn't a biological term. I'm sticking to biology, despite you wanting to be unscientific and irrational.
There is no euphemism. Unborn human is a very literal and blunt term.
>Yet we all grow into something. It is your futile reluctance to call a fetus what it really is,rather than what is might become, that is not rational.
Yes, a fetus will grow into something else. But that's just a stage in development of a human, not changing into a human. You trying to beat around the bush with with bullshit isn't going to make science disappear.
>>78947304
>>78953353
>fem-nazis and leftist like abortion because her body her choice
>Special snowflake tumblristas like mental illness and saying they have one because it's kewl
>research to any other illness other than depression is seen as oppression by special snowflakes
>Everyone else agrees by being shouted at by special snowflakes
>We can soon prevent actual disorders from happening because science
>snowflakes will rally against this
>can't win because fem-nazis on same side of the political spectrum won't let them even imply that an embryo shouldn't be tampered with in any form.
>snowflakes btfo
Better?
>>78956906
~50% of women who got abortions were using contraceptives.
>Also, unwanted pregnancy is just a concept in a societies where the whole family structure is destroyed.
Well, the family structure in the US is destroyed.
>>78955674
>what is might become
you mean what it is?
babies can be born at fucking 24 weeks, so why are they considered not human while still in the womb if they're instead born later?
it is quite literally a human life at all stages of development
>>78954578
>the fetus is alive and human
>please provide a source that proves fetuses are somehow not human or not alive
I never made the claim that a human fetus it not human although that would be a great strawman fallacy.
A human fetus is human. A human arm is human A human arm is living tissue the same way a fetus is living tissue.
But neither is a human being. A fetus becomes a human being when it is born.
>>78946913
kek no
it is alive, it has unique dna, and it is a moment on a human creature's lifeline
none of these can be said about your cock
>>78955440
>It's pretty obvious that there is something morally wrong with abortion. Maybe it's not murder but it's pretty close to murder.
The problem is that we have idiots running around saying it's murder when clearly it is not. That precludes any intelligent discussion about it.
Morals are products of our rational thinking, but they are corrupted by the cognitively impaired and weepy emotional whiners.
Give me a rational reason abortion is even the slightest bit wrong. If you can't do it without irrational terms, then that right there tells me everything I need to know about what is true.
She made the fucking choice when she decided to fuck why is it so hard for women to grasp this.
>>78958074
a human arm isn't a human life, and you know it isn't
a fetus is human life and you have yet to prove otherwise
there is absolutely no scientific justification that says any point before a baby is physically born, it's "just human cells"
arguments like, "it's not human until it draws its first breath" or "it's not human until the umbilical cord is severed" are all nonsense with no scientific justification
they are completely arbitrary
>>78956906
>Everyone could choose not to fuck
Bullshit sex is necessary for bulding intimacy. Without intimacy man/woman relationships fall apart and you get cheating, divorce, people growing old alone, etc. etc.
>>78956906
>Theres no such thing as unwanted pregnancy
Yes there is, it's when at least one of the two partners doesn't want children.
>>78945288
Just because you can't use your lungs on your own doesn't mean you aren't breathing. However breathing requires using your lungs by some means, which fetuses don't do.
>>78955693
>I don't get to murder you because I change my mind after inviting you into my home
If you are a reasonable person, you'd need a really good reason to kill me. This is hat I'm asking for - good reasonable thinking.
>Liberals have to jump through so many hoops and resort to the most amoral arguments to justify killing babies
Is that your best swipe at being rational? Here's mine: It isn't "killing babies" because the fetus isn't a living being ergo it cant be "killed"
. The fetus isn't an infant, either..
>>78945046
Can you please let me know where it says life is breath, I want to be buds with Christians but this abortion thing sometimes gets in the way.
>>78942643
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyhz8Zjm1i0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AFjCA9ZzyE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rpmh4SSq2xE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMwkQVpy98A
>>78959226
>>78958604
Morals aren't a product of rational thinking. They are based in tradition and culture and that is not always rational.
If it is, why is canibalism / theft / lying / war immoral? Don't use irrational terms please.
>>78942643
Murder.
>>78959311
Murder at Day One.
abortion doesn't teach responsibility for carelessness
>>78958604
>Give me a rational reason abortion is even the slightest bit wrong
Give me a rational reason why any unjustified, legalized killing is wrong in general.
Why not make a law that legalizes the killing retards or the mentally ill?
This is your line of thinking.
>>78959370
There's plenty instances where murder is ok and justifiable, generally when someone is ruining your life without you having done anything to them. Abortion is one of such cases. Unwanted children are like roaches that come to infest the womb.
>>78945140
well it doesn't.
>>78959492
>Why not make a law that legalizes the killing retards or the mentally ill?
Impossible to define "mentally ill" I think you are mentally ill but you are going to deny it.
>>78959492
The nigger population would be twice as large right now if it weren't for abortions
Why is this a bad thing?
>>78942643
any woman who would get knocked up by someone and unwilling to have the baby is just trash of a person. That's really all it is. The woman who believes she doesn't have a choice due to her respect for creation, is infinitely superior to a woman that would just go right to the abortion to solve her issues. The ONLY exception is if the woman has cancer or someshit that will kill her or result ina deformed baby if she goes through with it.
having an abortion for any other reason is just a reflection of the sack of shit would be mother
any woman who would get knocked up by someone and unwilling to have the baby is just trash of a person. That's really all it is. The woman who believes she doesn't have a choice due to her respect for creation, is infinitely superior to a woman that would just go right to the abortion to solve her issues. The ONLY exception is if the woman has cancer or someshit that will kill her or result ina deformed baby if she goes through with it.
having an abortion for any other reason is just a reflection of the sack of shit would be mother
>it's a "pro-choice trying to win an ethical debate" episode
>>78959417
Yeah let's ruin lives and force people to be poor and hate their children instead. Hey finally a justification for beating toddlers to death.
In Russia over 70% of babies get aborted
That's a bit fucked up don't you think
>>78956575
>The enemy is unwanted pregnancy
Contraception is the answer!
Unless churches and Republicans against somehow against women using their own health care insurance to cover contraception.
>and deciding the morality of abortion.
Miscarriage is natural. Abortion is nothing more than wanting and intending the miscarriage
>This is a religious issue and the entirety of America probably cannot come to a consensus on this.
Abortion is never once mentioned as a sin in the Bible, Talmud, nor Qu'ran, so it's been co-opted as a religious issue, but it's clearly not.
Also, if you search the Bible, you find that God very clearly equates "life" with "breath". There is no religious basis to suggest life begins at conception that is not purely manufactured by political agenda.
>>78947403
Actually it's a hill of beans thing, eg: how many beans makes a hill of beans? There is no clear number that should be regarded a hill or not. There will be some hillish beans that are not called hills, and or some unhillish beans that are called hills without really amounting to a hill of beans.
Most of the abortion argument is people on both sides staking out a binary fetus is a person fetus is not a person stance which at the extrema is indefensible.
Is an egg/sperm a human life with a right to exist, is a fertilized egg a human with a right to exist? Is a blood spot a human with a right to exist? Is a jelly bean with some recognizable parts a human with a right to exist? Is a viable fetus that would survive delivery a human with a right to exist? Somewhere in the middle ending a fetus is a little bit bad and gets worse as the fetus matures.
At some point the benefits of planned parenthood outweigh that badness. And that point is not really a point but a gray area where neither decision is clearly good and right.
People never change.
>>78959744
>Impossible to define "mentally ill"
extra chromosome.
Not really his point though.
