I'm sick of the Alt-Right circlejerk, give your problems and solutions to what you see to be societal problems.
Problem: Corruption
Solutions: A. Move toward confederated model and let each state have a bigger role in their own fate
B. Public funded elections. Anyone can run, candidates are narrowed down on the internet by Tinder type app.
Top 15 or 12 are given debate platforms and their campaigns paid for.
C. Constitutional Technocracy with referendums.
If 50% of voters vote against a bill, it can't pass. Otherwise everything the technocracy comes up with goes through.
Also all land and resources are public until someone buys that land from the public for living. Resource extraction would be a state enterprise.
>>78678088
Oh right, strawmen and logical fallacies in general will be ignored. You want to have a discussion, prove you're not an idiot by learning how to argue.
>>78677714
kys fag
>>78678411
Insults too. You want to contribute to this thread, do it like an adult.
Too many kiddies on 4chan.
>>78678244
>tfw talking to leftists
>>78678515
>adult.
>4chan.
is this shitter serious lmao
Also public central bank with no interest.
>>78678657
Maybe you're a kid, but there are definitely adults on this board.
Usury is a kind of tax on the people that I don't see as necessary.
>>78678763
>>>/reddit/
>>78678244
How does communism take into account: Most businesses fail and even most successful ones cycle through life in decades. Most humans are neither willing nor capable of undertaking the task of owning a business with all its Risks. So the average working is MORE than happy to accept payment below what the owner makes because the owner is actually shouldering an equal cost in the form of Risk.
Even most of my well educated and hard-working dentist colleagues would rather just work than be involved in ownership. You make less, have less self direction, but you take on very little Risk. This fundamental part of human nature seems to be ignored in communist thought.
Actually a LOT of human nature is ignored in communism. Why try to reinvent the man? The only real way to change nature is to selectively breed. But it's very obvious that communist ideas shove humans into square holes.
I Don't want to pay higer taxes to pay for some populist faggots campaign
And electronic voting is retarded
>>78678958
I'm not a communist man, I think that's a bad idea. You can be a leftist and liberal without being a Communist.
>>78679011
It would be a very small increase amongst hundreds of millions of people. Less than a penny per dollar. You'd show up at your town hall then and narrow down the candidates by watching videos of their proposals and picking your favorites.
>You'd show up at your town hall then and narrow down the candidates by watching videos of their proposals and picking your favorites.
>people will take the time to do this
stick with your tinder app you mong
>>78679445
Yeah I know this board is a circlejerk.
>>78679491
12 get
>>78679491
Yeah it would just be another step in voting.
/pol/, like the rest of the world, is a shithole full of idiots. I don't see any way out. I'm not smart or motivated or rich or anything. I'm just going to wait for my death. The world can go to hell.
I've been liberal most of my life. Conservative shitposting has tainted me, but I haven't been converted. It's just more reason to hate myself. They can all go to hell. "kill yourself" or "we'll kill you when Trump's president" whatever.
>>78677714
>their campaigns paid for
The money's just to pay for advertising on mediums like TV. Probably unnecessary soon, if we could inform people through the internet. but for now TV still matters.
>>78679491
Watch me roll the Führer
>>78677714
Can we just institute a voting test.
To make people prove they actually know what/why they're voting?
>>78679629
I fully agree, forgot how much of campaign money goes toward commercials.
Hi cucks, why are you so intent on filling my country with sandniggers?
>>78679735
I'm on board for that.
>>78679758
That's not how every liberal or leftist thinks.
>>78677714
And who will make all your technocracy applications that you became aware of because Stellaris had it as an option?
Because I remember 15 years ago when you liberalfags were up in arms over voting machines because "DIEBOLD SUPPORTS BUSH ZOMG!!!!!"
>>78678871
/pol/ is predominantly the 18-34 demographic. Just because you're 13 doesn't mean everyone else is, Jenny.
Classical Liberal here
plz bring back the bomb-throwing anarchists and the trigger happy marxists, senpai. We can't take this post-modernist left anymore. anything but this
>>78677714
Fuck off, newfag
>>78679735
It would have to be a civics test.
>>78679852
I have no idea what you're talking about. Don't know who Stellaris is, don't know who Diebold is.
>>78679626
nigga people already dont wanna go and vote let alone have people go there WATCH VIDEOS and decide among 'dozens' of candidates which lets be honest, most would be suppressed unless theyre lefties.
think about it, think of those shitty 18-25 yo millenials who have 0 attention span and 0 political education. How many of them would even watch every video and comprehend political and economic terms there. Even if video are made for 5 year old they dont know cause and effect.
technocracy is shit and a socialist one is even shittier
>technocracy
i bet youre an Apple fag
>>78679688
>roll the führer
>even roll him with a 88
>nobody cares
Atleast it made me happy.
>>78679955
In other words, you're a child.
>>78679949
Been here since /pol/ was created.
>>78679895
They're a vocal minority in my experience.
>>78679688
what the fuck
>>78680085
Nope, 24. 15 years ago was a long time ago bud.
>>78679688
check'd
this thread is so shit that kek doesnt even like the dubs here
>>78680092
Of course you were. What year were the original set of flags implemented?
>>78677714
I don't really see the point of referendums in C. If you draft the constitution correctly then that will protect against corruption and if you introduce evidence led policy then why would you give the uneducated masses the chance to interfere?
A lot of psychology is unintuitive and the evidence often flies in the face of what you would expect. As long as the science is sound then it should be followed. Most people don't know what would make them happy and even fewer knows what is good for them (And I include myself in this number) so lets just take it out the equation.
I sexually identify as an attack helicopter.
>>78678515
>Too many kiddies on 4chan.
Absolutely correct. Every once in a while one can find a thread here with intelligent (meaning "adult") discourse. Getting to be a rare thing.
>>78680139
>under 25
You are still a child. This is the second election season you've ever participated in.
>>78679955
As long as it actually proves they know what is happening on the specific issue(s) that they're voting on.
Democracy should not be swayed by people who are ignorant in their voting, lest that be an excuse for disillusionment.
>>78679688
Well played anon
>>78677714
How about no voting?
>>78680202
The pirate, Nazi, Best Korea, Gay, peace sign America flags and a few others were here from the start or just after the creation of this board.
I used the Peace Sign.
>>78680359
>>78679955
Rather than a civics test, it should be granted by federal or state service. It doesn't need to be military service.
We've got a great need for postal workers, surveyers, teachers, administrators, secretaries, and the like.
Do you know how hard it is to fund education because random assholes think education is unimportant beacuse they dropped out, shit out some kids, and they "Turned out alright" because of welfare?
>>78680296
If you are on 4chan calling people under 25 children you should probably take a step back and reassess your life. Most people here are below 25.
>>78680359
I agree, it's just hard to devise a fair and unbiased way to determine that.
>>78680562
I believe in the liberal values of freedom and democracy.
>>78681158
This is /pol/, buddy. /pol/ and /tg/, my home boards, are significantly older than the other ones.
So fuck off, redditor.
>>78681073
Okay how about this.
Federal, state or military service. If you do neither, you must pass an extensive civics test.
>>78681224
Lmao I stand by what I just told you.
>>78681158
>I agree, it's just hard to devise a fair and unbiased way to determine that.
Do they know who's running?
Can they pick their platform out of a multiple choice (you can make it hilariously hyperbolic)
If they get too many wrong their vote goes into the garbage (but they still fill it out and turn it in like it does something, because muh special snowflake participation vote)
>>78681307
This is hilarious because both of those posts are mine.
You agree with me out one end of your mouth, and denounce me with the other.
Get fucked, kid.
The problem with a civics test is this:
Who devises the test?
How do we prevent people from using it as a way to gate people who should rightfully be able to vote from doing so?
How do we prevent people from lowering the standards so that even retards can vote?
I'm a teacher, and I've watched my own state legislature continuously water down tests to make them look good, for instance.
>>78681444
Retries every cycle or banned from the first time they fail?
>>78681593
Every cycle/referendum/whatever is a new chance.
Maybe they were drunk their first rodeo (this is America)
>>78681573
>insults me because I'm under 25
>is somehow baffled that I don't respect him
>>78681657
Good call.
>>78678244(checked)
Forget it. You cant control the silent masses by spouting out (((rules))) out of your ass. You are even delegitimating yourself by trying to dissallow certain forms of discoursive tactics.
Thats why everyone on here longer then a week knows our sticky is shitty.
>>>/trash/
>>78678958
True, but actually even the least formed worker believes his employeer is taken advantage of him and leaching him off. Thus it's hard to prove he is no taking aany risks so he doesnt deserve to earn more.
>>78681889
If you can't argue without logical fallacies and/or you're just here to insult, I'm not going to engage you. That's very reasonable.
>>78679688
>Watch me roll the Führer
Hail to the Third Reich
>>78679491
gay
>>78681996
>Not engaging you
You just did moron.
And playing the elitist fag wont give you any legitimation on here.
Really, try your tactics on leftypol or maybe TRS, but you wont win anything doing it on full/pol/
>>78678088
>>78677714
>A
This is actually more of a conservative value, especially in the US. They push towards decentralizing government while the left strongly pushes towards government expansion and fine-grain regulations of everything, from social issues to industry.
>B
Elections are already publicly funded... by small groups of special interests and wealthy individuals.
>C
>Everything the technocracy comes up with goes through
You have a lot of faith/trust in government, don't you? What if one of these nitwits are bought and paid for by a special interest group, then advertised as the best thing since sliced bread to the public? Are they even voted in? Who checks their credentials?
>D
Here's a new option. Suppose we create a voting system that would be incredibly difficult to tamper with. Use a proprietary encryption algorithm for vote information that needs to be validated by at least 3 forms of ID. Use those IDs to generate a key that has a short expiration period with a distributed network of very large server farms that transact/store the data. Protect these farms with armed guards; allow nobody on the premises that isn't an auditor during an election (not even the president). Have the results analysts rotated out and cross-referenced by 4-5 groups of auditors. Make all auditor results publicly available. Voter identities are hidden behind one time 'ID's printed for a voter that consist of 50-100 randomly generated characters so they can look up their vote and see it counted. Make new laws that punish voter fraud severely; no little $2k slap on the wrist and a year or two in prison. Myself, personally, I would demand the death penalty for trying to fraud the people of this nation; make it an act of treason to commit such fraud. Maybe I'm a bit extremist on this, but there needs to be steeper penalties; our voting should be taken very, very seriously. More people would care and vote if they knew that their vote was treated with respect and it actually mattered.
>>78681889
Truly if you can't argue your points without committing logical fallacies, it's safe to assume that you don't have any good arguments and that you're likely flat out wrong. I take it as an admission of being wrong.
Problem: corrupt races are moving in and as soon as they get in, they stupefy and corrupt our democracy. these races were not domesticated in ancient times so we have to get rid of them or domesticate them.
Solution: http://krautchan.net/b/thread-10711100.html
>>78682266
>classical liberalism is a liberal value as well, but I see what you're saying
>That's not what I mean by publicly funded, I mean taken equally from a public pool of money collected from taxes.
>Keep the leaders under surveillance by another branch of intelligence services. Make all their conversations public record. It would be a huge personal sacrifice but they would need ot be watched very closely.
I like your option, but I don't believe that most political corruption comes from voter fraud.
>>78682500
This is some pseudo-biology anon. No human population was ever domesticated.
>
>>78677714
>Elections
>not randomly selecting citizens to represent themselves as a public duty
Enjoy your tyrants.
>>78677714
>Anyone can run, candidates are narrowed down on the internet by Tinder type app.
Interesting concept. Considering Bernie Sanders won over the millenial population over topics like electoral reform and with the rise of technology I can totally see this coming to life soon. Finally we'll be an actual democratic nation and not just a title to represent a party based off big money.
>>78682692
central europeans are more domesticated than Anglos because during the Holy Roman Empire they really cracked down on criminal genes
to this day, saxons are less likely to lie, cheat, murder or steal compared to anglos, and they're more likely to severely punish someone who lies, cheats, murders or steals
>>78682848
It would be cool right? I just don't know enough about telecommunications to say how they could stop it from being hacked.
>>78682821
A lot of people wouldn't want the jobs or wouldn't be qualified.
>>78682968
Once again absurd pseudo-biology. There are no criminal genes specific to crime. That's a ridiculous oversimplification of genetics. The same genes would be present in soldiers or any kind of person gravitating toward violence. Criminals do not have a monopoly on aggressive behavior.
>>78682968
Hell, I'd argue that the most successful people have pre-dispositions to aggressive thinking.
>>78682821
> expecting average citizens to put their work and family life on hold to represent themselves personally in parliament
M8 not only is this unrealistic it's a stupid idea.
>>78683255
yes, there are criminal genes
dark skin also correlates to violence
ur spreading bad infos
>>78683337
aggressive and pushy is not criminal though
criminal is when you do something that, if everyone does it, its net negative, or bad for civilization
>>78683368
>>78683425
You don't know what I'm saying and you have a very tenuous grasp on how genes work, what they do and what they don't do, as well as selection pressures and how long they take to have a significant effect on a population with breeding habits like humans.
>>7868226(9)
And again you engage me, by using a) a fallacy fallacy and b) a sneaky ad hominem, trying to delegitimize me
But lets do this:
>>Corruption
>A. Move toward confederated model and let each state have a bigger role in their own fate
Making it even easier to be corrupt, as a smaller administrative corpus means closer connections means more "Freundlwirtschaft"
>B. Public funded elections.
>Top 15 get shekel
Better then your current state of affairs but still not shielded from corruption
>Anyone can run, candidates are narrowed down on the internet by Tinder type app.
CNN: And again the hacker named 4chan rigged a vote and made Best Korean Führer POTUS.
>C. Constitutional Technocracy with referendums.
>If 50% votes against, no decision
Wew Lad thats even full retard. Just consider how easy it would be to form alliances, mabe even sharing the money from B), to provoke literally state stasis on every issue, or flood the system with non issues.
>Also all land and resources are public until someone buys that land from the public for living
>Expropriating every current land owner
Wot, now just fuck off commie.
>>78682692
Alright, that seems a bit better for option C. Complete transparency, regardless of the topics being discussed, would likely make it possible to implement such a technocracy. You may even wish to distribute the legislative powers to many small odd number groups of technocrats that focus on specific subjects, like economics, technology, transportation, etc.
On top of putting competent decision makers into positions of authority, this kind of system treats knowledge and education as the ultimate form of power. But.. it does introduce a new problem. The ability to corrupt these individuals shifts to the educational institutions; now your special interests can invest in these places and 'groom' our future technocrats towards specific dispositions.
Hmm... it feels like all we can really do is shift the corruption to another institution. I suppose that's where the transparency comes into play.
And as far as my voting option goes, I simply would love to see more people at least feel they have a voice. We see abysmal turnouts because people know the system is just being played behind the scenes; the elections feel like a depressing circus to these sad individuals. I want to give the people faith in a nearly incorruptible system that they can trust to at least have counted their personal vote.
Also, we need to do away with electoral colleges; their use is deprecated now that we have instantaneous communication. We can actually tally every single vote almost instantly using secure internet connections from a select group of secure devices. The more hands involved in trading a vote, the more likely it is to get 'lost'.
>>78682821
>Getting a letter that you've been mandated for Super Jury Duty
I don't think your system would last too long.
>>78683780
I truly don't believe that our educational systems are as corruptible as you believe. The need for evidence really limits their ability to twist the truth. Certainly less corruptible than a system where our politicians are sponsored like Nascar drivers.
It does suck how many people are disillusioned with voting and think it's rigged. The electoral colleges aren't helping. Making sure no one in power breaks rules they're supposed to adhere to is a complicated endeavor.
>>78677714
The alt-right is actually part of the left, Richard Spencer has even said as much. They accept fags and degenerates, so please take them we don't want them on the right.
>>78684494
Nope. the alt right is not leftist. This is not a debate, this is simply a matter of the definition of concepts. The Alt-Right is a Right wing ideology.
>>78684280
Our educational systems can be used as a breeding ground for reinforcing certain sociopolitical ideas, especially when we venture into the sciences.
http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/nazi-germany/nazi-education/
A trite and obvious example, but Hitler's regime was able to manipulate education very effectively to groom the next generation of national socialists. Pseudosciences, like eugenics, can be presented as fact to a classroom full of trusting, naive school children. Evidence for the theories can be fabricated by individuals that we're supposed to trust to be intellectually honest. Unfortunately, without doing a lot of the research individually and confirming these pseudosciences as false, the research will be given artificial validity. What about other researchers in these fields exposing the truth? Well, what if they are silenced? Lose their careers for 'denying' the 'science' that everyone else touts as indisputable fact?
Corruption of any system is easier than you'd think. Protecting from that corruption or stopping it outright is extremely difficult, especially with the powers that are in place today.
do lefties still want to save the whales?
>>78685189
Man I hate to tell you, but eugenics isn't a pseudo-science. It's just artificial selection of human populations.
>>78685346
I do. I think it's depressing as fuck that we're causing a mass extinction. 50% of all animal populations on Earth have been killed since the 70's. We have half as many animals on Earth as we did 40 years ago.
>>78685369
Well, yes and no. It's a sociopolitical belief that you can bring about or reinforce certain 'positive' genetic traits in a population via selective breeding, but that's all it remains.
From a scientific perspective, there has been much doubt cast on genetic inheritance being able to reliably improve upon the displayed traits of the next generation due to the widely known phenomenon of genetic mutation. However, as the concept was taught in Nazi dominated schools, it was presented as 100% factual science, hence my classifying it as a pseudoscience in this context.
>>78684955
What pray tell makes the alt-right part of the actual right? Racism? Anyone can be racist. Anti-Semitism? Lots of lefties hate Israel. Nationalism? The original nationalists were lefties against monarchy. The Catalans are nationalists.
Face it, the alt-right is where all these lefties go when they get sick of feminism but don't want to change their degenerate lifestyle to fit in with social conservatives.
