Who here /reactionary/? It's the logical endpoint. Eventually, you will end up there.
Wasn't neoreaction a fad? Libertarianism has degenerated significantly since that time. Can you name any contemporary neoreactionnary blogs? I can mostly only find stuff from 2013.
sup goyim
>>77386517
Spandrell @ bloodyshovel is pretty good.
Neoreaction is the best when they do history.
>>77386949
So what is the economic alternative?
Honest question
>>77387404
Economic regulations designed to preserve tradition and non-degenerate culture, not to redistribute wealth or create a socialist state.
Free market with limitations. Think of National Parks as a model.
>>77387404
A strong nation state that doesn't drink the degenerate kool-aid of post-modernism and consumerism.
>>77387618
>>77387623
Sounds good. Basically a state with an ideology that it actively enforces.
One day..
>>77387947
>Basically a state with an ideology that it actively enforces.
An ideology that isn't built on a naive, implausible-at-best utopian-esque view of the future.
Just dropping redpills. Too much shitposting going on lately.
>>77387947
We roughly have that now in parts of Europe. The issue is people are disagreeing with it.
The core of the issue should not be political change but philosophical change. Modernity's morality is basically conflict resolution and their principles were based on trying to end wars by empowering the individuals over their ideologies. This is where things like existentialism extend from. And while there are decent defenses for existentialism, most accept it because it sounds nice and that it sounds reasonable without critical examination.
A proper enforcement of ideology outside would need a reason for it to be enforced rather than just consensus. The capacity for the west to have an objective morality again is the only hope for it. That would mean accepting essentialism again. That could also mean accepting concepts such as final causality again as well, but who knows.
Ultimately you aren't going to get anywhere without a morality defensible in ways beyond emotional appeals like the west has now. It need be grounded in something rational and sound to get anywhere. Else the people wanting change like those in this thread whine constantly with no way to substantiate viable solutions.
>>77388129
Wouldn't that require a leader who can literally see the future? Even validated trend statistics can only be compared to an ideal that may or may not be realised.
>>77389072
Exactly. And good to see you around Wolf.
When the West abandoned Christianity, it sealed its fate. Without objective morals and truths, civilization will fall.
>>77389291
Indeed, but there is a clear difference between idealism and realism. Mass immigration and welfare states are not going to end well, even though it sure would be nice to save people from poverty and opressive regimes. Sure, demilitarization would be nice, but it's not going to end well because there will always be a threat to your sovereignity, and assuming otherwise is dumb and idealistic. Sure, dismantling things like 'toxic masculinity' sounds okay, but it won't end well when ninety percent of all men are emotionally fragile whiners, more effeminate than their own grandmothers.
>>77389291
What do you mean?
>>77386347
I'm pretty sure the actual evolution of most people around our corner of the internet is
Generic Conservative > Lelbertarian > Nrx > The Radical Right
>"According to Maistre, any attempt to justify government on rational grounds will only lead to unresolvable arguments about the legitimacy and expediency of any existing government, and that this, in turn, will lead to violence and chaos.[21][22] Maistre therefore argued that the legitimacy of government must be based on compelling but non-rational grounds, which its subjects must not be allowed to question.[23] Maistre went on to argue that authority in politics should therefore derive from religion"
>According to Maistre, any attempt to justify government on rational grounds will only lead to unresolvable arguments about the legitimacy and expediency of any existing government, and that this, in turn, will lead to violence and chaos.[21][22] Maistre therefore argued that the legitimacy of government must be based on compelling but non-rational grounds, which its subjects must not be allowed to question.[23] Maistre went on to argue that authority in politics should therefore derive from religion
>>77389685
In order to enforce an ideology or philosphy through in all aspects of a state, trend analysis must be used, as it is practically the only way to make informed decision, especially in economics. The problem I put forward is that the metrics used to calculate future trends rely on the assumption that the ideology can continue to be enforced. Therefore using trend analysis to make decisions on the future is a contradiction, at least the way I see it.
>>77386347
Reporting in.
>>77386517
Neoreaction should simply change its name to reaction or traditionalism.
Try:
socialmatter.net
thefutureprimaeval.net (This one is really great)
blog.jim.com
xenosystems.net
kakistocracyblog.wordpress.com
unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com
slatestarcodex.com (Not reactionary but makes very good points. Good critique is always welcomed and highly valuated)
freenortherner.com
amerika.org
The official traditionalist propagandist is on Twitter @wrathofgnon
I discovered reaction and traditionalism through him.
>>77390626
I don't see why a government would need "trend analysis" or what it would be used for.
Traditionalist here. Was redpilled through tumblr by Evola, Carlyle, and Radix 4 years ago.
>>77390666
>blog.jim.com
>le little girls' menstruation obsessed man
No thanks. Nick Land is nuts too with his silly singulatarianism but he's fun to read and I've followed him for years. Also
>Leaving out Spandrell
>>77386517
And also orthosphere.org
Reactionaries and tradfags are people who retreat to esoteric bullshit because they don't want to nut up and be politically relevant nationalists.
>>77390758
How do you think governments come to decisions on economic and social policies that affect the future?
>>77391318
That "esoteric bullshit" you speak of is often the result of years of research and observation. Your nation is built upon "esoteric bullshit" so I'd be careful how you label it.
>>77390666
Thanks, good list.
>>77391401
We favor free markets, with specific government intervention to preserve tradition and culture. Just like National Parks and museums, but on a larger scale.
>>77386517
Also radishmag.wordpress.com
>>77391214
I don't remember reading anything from Spandrell. I'll check it.
>>77389331
More than that. Modernity kept and reformed Christianity in Western Europe. Christianity being there changed nothing. What was gotten rid of was any intellectual backing to reinforce its views compared to others.
You cannot have a strong civilization without social cohesion and you cannot have social cohesion without ideological similarities. We cannot have ideological similarities that keep up together without an ideology for them to share. We cannot have an ideology worth sharing and defending between all people without a rational defense for it.
The culture clash of the west with others is one of trying to tempt people with empowerment and destroy social/intellectual structures in their way without building up much of their own and others (whether they are right or wrong) unable to fight back in this temptation or violently revolting to change not because they simply disagree in principle but because the emotional appeals (such as the emotional appeal to "rights" rather than anything intellectually defensible) do not have an intellectual backing first and foremost that the dissenters could see.
Heading to work. Good night.
I would say fascism is a higher degree of redpilled than straight up "traditionalism". Fascism allows the application of traditional ethical principles and ideas with the contemporary world, whereas traditionalism (as shown in the graph) seems to be wholly reactionary.
>>77391687
I can tell you right now bro that policies and changes that affect your interest rates and government expenditure are derived from a form of trend analysis.
>>77392371
Yeah okay great, but what does that have to do with the topic at hand? What is your point?
Reminder that constitutional monarchy, parliamentary democracy, civil nationalism, freedom and a faith in God are the ingredients for the best system known to man and the path to happiness.
>>77386347
All reactionaries end up in the gulag in the end.
>"I’ve heard many on the right say that the liberals have overplayed their hands by becoming so blatant with their liberalism – their outright advocacy of the Moslem invasion, their aggressive pro-active stance on homosexual marriage and transgender rights, and their complete capitulation to black murderers and rapists. Have the liberals overplayed their hands? It’s certainly possible; they are not infallible. But I don’t see any signs that white people understand what liberals are, the aforementioned demon-swine, and thus I see no signs that white people are determined to fight the liberals. It is my hope that the grace of God is working in the unseen recesses of a handful of Europeans’ hearts, and that indwelling spirit of God will soon bear good fruits. That is my hope and that is my faith, for what is faith if it is seen? Will Satan have the last sneer? Will all of old Europe perish while the sneering liberals and the triumphant heathens of color dance on her grave? My mind says, yes, that is precisely what shall happen. But my heart tells me that such shadows will be altered at the last trump, at the twinkling of an eye, by men and women of European blood who still love Him in and through their people. "
https://cambriawillnotyield.wordpress.com/2016/06/11/the-trumpet-shall-sound-and-the-europeans-shall-rise/
>>77392428
Well I first mentioned trend analysis in response to some other poster. You asked me for an explaination on what I meant and I gave you answer. You then questioned if governments need trend analysis, which I can only answer by saying that there are no better proven methods, despite its disadvantages.
>>77392428
it's not about "preserving tradition and culture"
>>77392689
Put in there by reactionaries...
>>77392596
NAPOLEON III
A
P
O
L
E
O
N
III
>>77386347
desu OP I have been so far to the reactionary side that I reached Maoism and ended up back to feudal monarchism.
>>77386347
I'm making videos on Evola right now, and reading his works. So I guess I'm working through the meat and bones of the ideology. It's interesting that in his first two books he advocates political restructuring of society, but then in Ride the Tiger he advocates building a kind of inner sanctum to fend off what nRx call 'The Cathedral', which is the collective power of progressives in the world.
>>77386517
Neo-reactionaries are literally technocratic authoritarian capitalists that just want the reactionary forces to carry them to their utopia. They aren't reactionaries, just more pragmatical marxists.
>>77387404
Don't think about economics. New models of politics will come about.
>>77386347
Here's the first one I made if you're interested :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2jA5VliGpQ
>>77392895
But we're not talking about a state-planned economy here.
We're just talking about limiting capitalism when it encroaches on traditional culture and values.
>>77393288
The problem is we need modern people to put this type of thought into "everyday" language for normies to understand easily and quickly. It is too much to ask people to wrap their minds around this stuff. It's not accessible enough.
>>77393335
The guy I originally replied to was saying that a state-planned economy is the solution. You came to me with a question not a point.
>>77393288
I wanted to hear your voice. (((
>>77393587
I understand that, I have another in the works & I know that both are a bit too much unless you're already inclined to read that kind of stuff but Evola really is a bit dense in his language. I was inspired by a user I found on archive.org that uploaded accessible videos of German conservative revolutionaries. It's actually a good way of learning too.
>>77393587
then it shouldn't be desu, dumbing down your language is dumbing down yourself and your ideas.
>>77393610
Okay. Sorry for confusion.
>>77394110
But that's false. Dumbing down isn't necessary what the name implies. It's just diluting ideas into easier pieces to digest. In fact, that is the essence of a meme.
>>77386347
Nice, it's good to know there are some actually redpilled people in here apart from the usual stormfags and lolbertarians.
>>77394227
Dumbing down is exactly what the name implies: You only dumb something down when you can`t remove anything more without also removing some of the original meaning, yet still go on.
>>77390666
Thanks for that list. If you're interested, Reactionary Expat is a particularly good youtuber in the Reactosphere.
>>77394643
That's not necessarily true though. A meme is the simplest form of an idea communicated - a picture speaks a thousand words, so to speak.
The trick is finding how to narrow a complicated thought into an easily digestible piece of information.
No wonder we're losing the war to the left.
>>77394317
Lolbertarians are mostly dead and gone. Stormfags are seemingly more rare too. The alt-right is the new flavor of the day, and I'm not happy with the move. But greetings based Poland. My favorite country.
>Tradition for the sake of tradition
How are you better than Muslims with this line of thought?
>>77395173
>Easily digestible
>Getting everything across
These two are mutually exclusive. If you think a few memes can give you anything but a rudimentary of complicated concepts, then you are gravely mistaken.
Sure, if you just want some to get the gist of it they are fine, but don't pretend that they do more than that.
>>77393632
I originally did talks but I'll probably just participate in the odd skype with people in the sphere every now and again.
>>77395669
Your thinking is flawed. It's why the left wins and we lose.
You fail to understand the power of memes, among other tools.
A meme creates a new premise and posits that premise as true and unchallenged. We are fighting a war for the premises of the argument, not the argument itself. We are fighting the narrative.
>>77395963
>Changing the topic
Apart from your (mistaken) believe that we are losing at the memefront, that`s not what you nor I were talking about.
You said that's it possible to narrow complicated thoughts into easily digestible pieces of information, giving the exampel of memes. I said that you can`t do that without reducing the amount of understanding achieved by consuming the meme in contrast to consuming whatever the source was.
On all other points I agree. The moment you argue on the premise of leftist, they have won, because now they controll the narrative.
>>77386347
It's good to see there are here some conservatives, not only Milo lovers or Trump's retards.
>>77396448
I mean I agree that any simplification of ideas must be used as a gateway to fully fleshed out, sophisticated ideas underlying it. I think we're in agreeance really.
And I don't think we are losing the memefront. If by "we" you mean the right in general. But I meant specifically for reactionaries, since it has failed to really take hold.
>>77389284
>liberalism can't work because of our nature
"Nature" means a desire for pleasure I assume. So if it should come to pass that we are able to destroy portions of the brain that seek pleasure and re-work cognitive function, why couldn't pure liberalism work? Or for that matter, why couldn't socialism or communism work?
>>77396777
Yeah, I was agreeing in principe, just taking issues with a few specifics.
That`s because we not only have leftists attacking the right in general and by extensions us, but also more easily marketed rightist idelogy taking up space.
>>77396777
The significance of convincing people that society needs to be restructured varies between reactionaries, consider Ride the Tiger & Evola's shift to internal focus versus external political solutions. Maybe I've been reading too much Aurelius & Epictetus but I'm really just focusing on my own actions & future, especially considering the recent headlines in the West.
any /monarchists/ here?
>>77397108
Yep. And it's also so far out of "normal" politics that most people don't even bother to think about it or let it register on their minds.
But I think the important part of reactionary thought isn't necessarily the end-goal government, but the ideas underpinning it that completely undermine the leftist society that we currently live in. And that's good enough of a start for me. I know that in my lifetime the US will never be a monarchy, but that doesn't mean that we can't chip away at the foundations of leftist thought piece by piece.
Sorry, just rambling.
>>77387404
I align with H.P. Lovecraft's "absolute relativist" view that each nation, as a product of unique historical, cultural, racial, and religious traditions, cannot necessarily be governed by universal principles. For the Arab, for example, it may be culturally, genetically, religiously impossible ever to function well without a semi-theocratic authoritarian sultanate and a relatively primitive, somewhat feudal or neo-feudal economy.
The Anglo-Saxon, on the other hand, functions at his best under a system which preserves the individual's capacity for self-determination and self-reliance as much as possible without fracturing society in the name of individualism. Part of this individualism is the freedom to innovate and to profit from success, as long as the merchant class are not permitted to wield too much influence or to betray the interests of their nation.
I don't see the original American Republic, with a relatively permanent constitution, suffrage limited by race, gender, and class, and tacit acknowledgment of Protestant christianity as the social fabric of the nation, as a non-reactionary state. Revolution can be reactionary in nature, the word itself originally meant something like "revolving society back to where it ought to have been".
I think for most, if not all, Europeans some form of "Republic" is ideal — which does not, and should not, rule out a hereditary element, as a Republic is a synthesis of democracy, aristocracy, and monarchy, with the differences between republics being determined by the relative prominence and balance of each element.
There is precisely no benefit to a country like Germany or Italy electing a symbolic head of state every few years versus Britain or the Netherlands having hereditary symbolic heads of state. There are many benefits to having a lifelong custodian of a nation's traditions, as long as he is not utterly neutered, nor permitted to run roughshod
>>77397236
Could you give a brief summary of what you mean?
Because I think I touched on that thought here: >>77397460
>>77387404
Throwing out the concept that corporations are individuals is a good start.
>>77396875
>"Nature" means a desire for pleasure I assume
No, it means that conflict is at the core of being human. That conflict may arise from seeking pleasure but not necessary, there are many triggers.
>So if it should come to pass that we are able to destroy portions of the brain that seek pleasure and re-work cognitive function
Yeah, the trick is to make a system that works out for humans, not some genetically modified drones with fucked up brains. You might as well straight out gas everyone on the planet, that way you can install even the most crackpot system and call it a success. Which is kinda what commies did in the Soviet Union lol.
>>77397519
It makes sense. The difference between wolves, coyote and domestic dogs requires and understanding that all three species, despite their ability to interbreed, require a different social system due to their different genetic heritage.
A wolf might recognize pack systems and order, while a coyote doesnt, being a more loner/individualist species of canine. And finally the dog does best serving a human, even feral dogs can't comprehend hunting like a wolf pack, or even really understand how to scavenge like coyotes; they rely on human scraps, even if it's human garbage dumps.
>>77389072
Purging the universities is the single best way to affect meaningful change. The University is the heart which pumps corrupted minds to the media, government, big business, and, of course, replicates the next generation of academics.
The current western University system is nothing but a factory for creating leftists.
>>77398321
But how do we even start such a monumental task?
you have to attack the root of the modern life: citizenship and equality
>>77398384
>>77399393
Completely wrong. Read these:
http://www.socialmatter.net/2016/04/05/right-wing-activism-always-fails/
http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2011/07/right-wing-terrorism-as-folk-activism.html
>>77399476
well if it makes you feel better call it anything you want. nobodies making you call it rightwing terror.
>a problem
>explosives can't solve
pick one
>>77397521
Sorry for the delay. I'm actually pretty in line with what you said. I can't imagine ever returning to monarchy or imperium here or in Europe as a totality, however I think the merit of reactionary thought lies in its ability to deconstruct leftist thought on a deeper level than the kind of trolling generated by Trump's popularity & gain an outsider's perspective on topics like authority, individuality, democracy & so forth.
>>77391318
Nationalism and reactionary traditionalism are not necessarily exclusive
>>77392689
Right next to the purged intellectuals and useful idiots
ISOLATIONISM IN SPAIN WHEN??
>>77400218
I completely agree. I appreciate what Trump is doing greatly, but he is just scratching the surface of what is possible. Is he just trolling or does he know the power of what he does? Doesn't matter either way really. The result is the same.
But the funny thing is, it's essentially applying "postmodern" and "critical theory" thought - weapons of the left - against the left. Questioning the premise that their society is built upon is incredibly powerful.
I wonder, who in a position of power sees and understands what Trump is scratching the surface of?
>>77398321
Ted K. Already said. It. To change society you can't just have a shift in policy. For that policy to last you have to have a slight societal change and that's completely unlikely given the time's we're in and the propaganda we're against.
Even a policy shift and societal shift could only last for a short time depending on how quickly degeneracy spreads. You have to tear the whole system down and rebuild to get what you want. People will never go back willingly.
>>77398384
I think the key is making sure that non-leftist intellectuals do not go extinct, otherwise there won't be anyone with which to people a purged University system.
Sad though it may sound, there's little an individual can do to further this goal aside from attempting to subtly lead those inclined to rational thought towards non-leftist conclusions.
Counter-subversion, academic or cultural is another option, and this means either producing literature, music, or film which acts in a counter-subversive manner, or or simply infiltrating and destroying from within the temples of Marxism, as the marxists themselves did over the course of the 20th century.
Crude though it may be, the captain Sweden cartoon is an example of a powerful counter-subversive piece.
The hold of leftist orthodoxy on people's minds needs to be shaken, to open the desire to seek alternative world views.
In the absence of violent Revolution, there's not much else to be done, and it may very well move too slow, but the Marxist was willing to tirelessly create an "intellectual" infrastructure for his Revolution over the course of decades and lifetimes, and it eventually paid dividends
>>77388156
This is a redpill
>>77400744
I too appreciate how he has shook up US politics; I have never seen another political talk as he does. It is very terse and playground-like at times, but that is part of its charm. As a kind of contrast, it's interesting to look into Pat Buchanan, who ran in your country's 1992 presidential primaries. He had similar policies to Trump, yet the manner in which he spoke (with with flowery language, which has been a point of contention in this thread) was not accessible to the general electorate. Trump has a gift of framing old ideas, & talking to the public in a way which works. Evola would have argued that the necessity to do this in a democracy (speak coarsely to the common people) is inherently immoral...however it may be, it works.
>>77402050
politician*
>>77386347
>neo-reactionary final argument is just a drawn out "lol constitution and rights don't real dude lmao"
truly amazing.
>>77401556
Good points.
I think that any cultural work should harken back to pre-left times. Glorify it, indulge the literature and art.
For instance, I love to read Agatha Christie. Not only are they great little mystery books, but they are a form of time travel. I can see how people talked, thought, acted 100 years ago. It is a completely different society. Being a foreigner was considered negative, whites were considered to be the most civilized, and Jews were shamed.
Pic related, it just shows the type of discourse that went on back then. The left wants to whitewash history. We need to un-whitewash history. We need to champion works that show what Western civilization was really like, and show that whites of the past were not racist monsters but intelligent, funny, sincere, moral people.
>>77402050
>>77402236
The problem, of course, is democracy itself. Democracy forces a lower level of discourse.
But to fight the beast, you must become the beast.
>>77402536
Wow. Even regardless of the dialogue-based around jewishness, the form of language is subversive in itself. I have to cringe when I hear people my age or younger talk in ghetto slang or so forth. I know it's funny coming from someone whose native language has been whitewashed from history, but I also have a huge appreciation for the English language.
>>77400744
>applying "postmodern" and "critical theory" thought
Disagree. Those modes of inquiry posit all of human being as a function of social history. Mankind as the creation of (his)tory. Gender and Race as a "social construct". In this understanding, every individual is essentially servile to society - (s)he is a product of it. Politics is then the process of enacting coercive governmental forces in order to form the utopic being. It is essentially Marxism stood back on its head with the superstructure replacing material conditions.
Trump epitomizes goal oriented personal responsibility. Self-reliance is the only path to freedom.
>>77402640
It does indeed, it's also argued that the demos has no clear will & so it is eternally prone to deliberation. I need to branch out after Evola whom I know is iconic to the movement. I know there are a lot of blogs in the reactosphere but I'm wondering what other seminal works there are out there as regards the movement.
>>77388156
>>77401827
Post the complete diagram
Fixed your image OP
![the-mysterious-affair-at-styles[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/1xoNZbl.jpg "the-mysterious-affair-at-styles[1].jpg")
>>77402964
Indeed. And it's not just the "un-PC" language that is interesting, but the dignity of the speech overall.
I'm not sure how relevant any of this is or how it can be used, but at least someone else has had the thought that reading older works is necessary for fixing society:
http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2011/06/slow-history-extravaganza.html
>>77403344
I'm not too sure. I work through the blogs myself, but there is a lot out there. I'm working through this now:
http://www.socialmatter.net/2016/06/06/rules-for-reactionaries/
>>77388443
>>77388551
>>77388661
>>77388991
Thanks for these, I went off /pol/ for a while but the occasional thread like this makes it worthwhile.
>>77387416
Don't agree with this one famalam. When the circle has 'God' as 'Authority' and he 'needs an army' then things are basically at sandnigger logic levels.
It started great though.
>>77404425
Proper authority can only come from objective morality and truths, which come from God - that's the point I think.
>>77388661
this is redpill? really?
fucks sake
>>77404624
>mfw
Oh, are you being serious?
>>77404793
Looks like this isn't the thread for you, friendo.
>"According to Maistre, any attempt to justify government on rational grounds will only lead to unresolvable arguments about the legitimacy and expediency of any existing government, and that this, in turn, will lead to violence and chaos.[21][22] Maistre therefore argued that the legitimacy of government must be based on compelling but non-rational grounds, which its subjects must not be allowed to question.[23] Maistre went on to argue that authority in politics should therefore derive from religion"
>>77403761
This. Check out the Flashman papers. Redpilled, realistic, historically accurate, well-written, unapologetically alpha.
>>77403871
I saw a jpeg posted of a section from this book earlier, looks interesting :
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6177860-the-fate-of-empires-and-search-for-survival
I find that even if it's not 'reactionary canon' general books on the history of civilization can be beneficial. Camille Paglia has the controversial opinion that transsexualism is an indicator of not only civilization decline but more dramatically, its impending collapse. This was all allegedly informed by her own studies of history.
>>77405028
Yes, I posted that picture and I have read that book. I think you can find a PDF version of it online if you google it.
As you said, even if it's not "reactionary canon," understanding history and pre-French Revolution society and empires is essential for forming a world view that is not molded by the modern leftist structure.
That's why preserving older works is so essential. It's like a time machine to the old days. The problem, of course, is that older works are sometimes not very accessible - old languages can be hard to read. I find the sweet spot to be in the 19th century and early 20th century. Things really went off a cliff after the 1920s/30s.
>>77405009
Thanks I'll check them out.
>>77404978
Maistre is an imbecile because even if that idea was ever valid [Protip: It wasn't], the modern world is nowhere NEAR religiously homogenous for that to work.
But again, it NEVER worked like that. People revolted all the time in monarchies over perceived mistreatment, and 'divine right' did nothing to stop them, not least of all because such a doctrine is mentioned nowhere in the Scriptures.
All governments are, and must be, ultimately founded upon force, AND upon the idea of the common man that rebelling would be more trouble than its worth, because life is pretty good. Those two things alone, and not some coming before divine retribution, is what keeps a State alive.
>>77405448
cowering before*
>>77405448
>the modern world is nowhere NEAR religiously homogenous for that to work.
No shit. That's why a nation must be homogeneous.
Revolts will come and go, but as long as the political class is unified on an objective basis for power, it will be okay.
>>77386517
neoreaction is shit, it is literally a cuckholding ideology. You will almost certainly not be part of your "aristocracy." It was developed to be the antithesis that people cling to which is inevitably defeated. Read into Nick Land's metaphysics
>>77393195
this is right
>>77405630
Except as said, authority doesn't have anything to do with religion. A king [or President, or PM, or whatever] derives his authority ultimately by convincing the majority that his reign is in their best interest, and having enough force to convince the minority that revolution is a fight they can't win, or just plain isn't worth it.
"Muh Jesus" is not an effective base for political power, and any king who has to trace his rulings back to some 'objective moral doctrine' is no true king.
OP is right. I've gone through all stages and in that order. Been browsing /pol/ for years.
To me it was when I looked at a country like Japan and asked "why is it that they are so safe in that country and don't have anyone doing anything stupid", and then I found out that it was because the society was 99% Japanese and that they take pride in their culture. Than you look at the left in Western cultures which is like "lets just let every foreigner in! everything is fine" and then you realize the left is crazy.
>>77405862
You are assuming that the common people are atheists. This is an assumption that is inherently wrong. You are missing the entire point of having a homogeneous state.
But if you're talking constitutions and such, then they are worthless without objective principles to back them up.
>>77388661
this is a shit post made by an uneducated American.
Go fucking read before you try to talk politics- all of you. Delete that picture, I'm proving it as a stupid post only an American think is good.
http://whiteresister.com/index.php/8-archives/3-when-hitler-declared-war-on-the-united-states
>>77386347
Reporting in. Writing a book. It's pretty much farewell eulogy to western civilization, beginning with assertion that we have already been dead for 100 years and have maybe 30 years until absolutely nothing is left of western civilization. Looking forward to following in footsteps of Nick Land and emigrating to China, watching the Great Unraveling eating dried squid and drinking baijiu with my waipo.
>>77405859
>>You will almost certainly not be part of your "aristocracy."
I have never understood why people assume that neoreactionaries aspire to become aristocrats, I think they are pretty much fine with remaining at the same station that they currently occupy.
Moldbug even wrote a post on the merits of protectionism as a solution to the dire problem.
Also, what do you think of their criticism to demotism?
>>77406787
Where will we find this book?
>>77406495
No, I am saying that even in a society of devout persons, the main things that sustain the State are the force of the ruler's armies and the people's belief that they are getting a fair deal from the state.
Even in ancient times, people would revolt if they thought the kingship was more hurtful to them than harmful. Hell, the entire reason the old regime fell was for this very reason, and all the religiosity in the world did not save them!
I am saying that at its most base, its most simple, its most obvious, the State's authority rests on the same thing all authority rests upon. Force.
>>77386347
daddy issues.
>>77406787
Fucking kill yourself, you think you have the right to have an opinion on " western civilization " when you're so quickly to ditch and run to a foreigner?
Title your book " I'm a weak little cuck and I ran to China and here is my opinion on things "
>>77407031
this
>>77406787
Well all you will end up being is the exact same thing that you hate now, which is immigrants. So now you will become a hypocrite, and probably complain about racism in China or something.
>>77388661
good and true, but the great depression carried out into ww2; there was no gap
>>77406936
Force is obviously required for a state to exist. But for those who determine who rules (in democracy, the people; in monarchy, the nobility) must be unified with an objective source of legitimacy. A ruler MUST have a source of objective legitimacy to call to when his authority is challenged.
"Might makes right" is not a great way to make political allies.
>>77403759
What is it called when you realize politics are just the sum of millions of interacting opinions, which cannot be changed without changing those opinions, which you (having a single opinion) cannot effectively do?
tl;dr politics are weather, and /pol/ is constantly doing a rain dance
>>77407514
History is replete with examples that quite clearly don't coincide with your legitimacy theory. The emperor of china is the son of heaven and has had the mantle of divine right predating the Han dynasty. Yet when disaster strikes and the people are starving he is inevitably removed from power. If the emperor is weak he is not fit to carry the mandate of heaven.
>>77386347
>monarchy
>redpilled
>>77393181
Looking forward to it. Links to where you are?
>>77386347
Monarchist reporting in.
It's a shit movement that's based on the conceit that everything's getting worse and we need to go backwards, while in real life technology is always advancing, violent crime is going down around the world, people are living longer, suicides are going down, quality of life is increasing, wars are decreasing, terrorism is decreasing, ect ect ect, you are a fucking faggot retard if you want to live in any time in the past.
And the funny thing is you think you're so edgy and anti-liberal, when liberals say the E X A C T same horseshit about how we're on the brink of doomsday because global warming is going to kill us all and there's a supposed pandemic of gun crime and modern capitalism is so corrupting and we need to go back to le ye old glory days of being serfs to your chosen benevolent overlords from your autistic power fantasies you imagine you'd be in charge of somehow but would fail horribly under and literally die.
>>77408755
Technology masks social decay. If you don't see how society is fundamentally going down the drain, then I can't help you. Your culture is being overrun by Muslim, chavs, wiggers, Africans, etc and you think everything is fine and dandy. Go back to your le upboating site and post about the latest Miley Cyrus news, degenerate.
>>77408964
Of course in actual history people worried about dying from basically every disease and infection, getting asspounded by bandits pirates thieves in broad day light or having their farm burned to the ground because your ruler told the stronger state next to him to eat a dick. Oh dont forget you cant call in sick to work when your boss is the king, the cows dont give a fuck if you are throwing up you better go fucking milk them. Heaven forbid you actually are injured. You think social security is going to help you in 1400 ad? You're fucked, and you're a complete idiot if you think life was better.
>>77408340
What the chances that Charles will go all authoritarian on us and declare the reinstated Empire?
I'm at 3. now, this is my progression.. 0. was socialist though, so I went a long way in the past 6 years.
I don't quite understand traditionalism though, anything or anyone I should read to "get it"?
>>77409507
Yeah, because technology is completly dependent on social norms?
If we didn't have Kenboy spreading HIV, there would be no fucking Iphones.
>>77409795
Start with Peter Hitchens to get an accurate and detailed idea of the problems but ignore his solutions (usually he doesn't have any). Then proceed to Julius Evola and Roger Scruton for the solutions.
Thomas Sowell is a good vehicle to get out of leftism but you've already done that.
I wish somebody here could just tell me which literature I pick up to get into reactionary ideology.
Ideally historical stuff.
>>77409795
>>77410691
I'm not too "expert" on it myself. I didn't find it through reading lots of pieces. I kind of came to it organically. Essentially my journey there was a result of realizing that current society and norms are built on a leftist foundation, and that being a modern conservative is simply playing by their rules.
>>77410691
Ride the Tiger and Fascism Viewed from the Right by Julius Evola
Anglocentric traditionalism:
1. The Abolition of Britain by Peter Hitchens
2. The Soul of the World by Roger Scruton
3. Culture and Anarchy by Matthew Arnold
Fiction:
Fyodor Dostoyevsky
Tell me, is immigration necessary?
If immigration wasn't allowed, people would have to fight for their own country, and make it better, rather than flee and bring in their problems.
>>77410691
Case Against the Modern World by Daniel Schwindt is a good entry-level, layman stuff just to become familiar with the general idea behind traditionalism.
>>77411718
I was thinking primary sources..
If you are not a Christian (orthodox or Catholic) reactionary you have not finished your intellectual journey (or you are not white).
>>77412478
Book of Ecclesiastes. "What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again. There is nothing new under the sun." Eccles 1:19 - I had that memorised, correct me if I'm wrong. How's that for a 'primary source'.
>>77412639
>> (orthodox or Catholic)
This meme has to stop.
>>77412734
I guess its a start?
All I want is pre-20th century writings on traditionalism. That should not be too freaking hard.
>>77406861
>I think they are pretty much fine with remaining at the same station that they currently occupy.
Which is exactly why it is a cuckolding ideology, it literally just gives a few Jews and crypto-kikes more power because authority is more efficient goy.
Just because someone is right about something doesn't mean they're right about everything. Again, as a poster previously pointed out, it's meant to be the antithesis to Marxism so that the synthesis will be the (((elites))) winning no matter what.
What Moldbug doesn't get about demotism is that power tends to move toward power. Egalitarianism is literally the only thing that puts any friction in this process.
Neoreaction is one of the most ass-hat pants-on-head-retarded pseudo-intellectual propaganda act that has come out in the last 40 years. They misuse Christian religious terms to describe anti-christian social movements (no doubt this negative association with the religious terminology from their fedora days), and unironically believe that we should give up all our rights to be run by by totalitarian dictatorships.
Neoreaction is only around for formerly libertarian spergs to funnel them away from traditionalism.
If I'm a Herman Hoppe libertarian, does that make me a reactionary?
>reading " literature " of men who did nothing themselves
>not focusing on the man who actually Did do something and wasn't just talk
>>77411894
No, immigration is not necessary. That's one of the big lies of the modern system.
>>77412744
I want to raise an issue, especially from a German and by extension, a Germanic/Anglo Northern European perspective. Jesus is first and foremost a symbol of Judean persecution by the Roman Empire. 'Render unto Caesar what is Caesars and render unto God what is God's', 'the is no Jew or Greek' etc. etc. Matthew Arnold perfectly describes how Europe has cycled between Hebraic Christianity and Hellenic Christianity. All well and good but what about the Viking North!?
You may be familiar with pic related. It's Arminius, a German who lives about the same time as Jesus but instead of being crucified by Rome, he actually lead a battle for independence from Rome and won. I have always felt that the Protestant reformation was a contradiction of two opposing forces: a) a rebellion against the corrupted Roman Church while wishing it was within a Roman Church that was not corrupt (a reform from within, should we stay and reform or leave i.e. Brexit), and b) a return to the Pre-Christian Germanic past. In the end, I believe that this is a futile attempt to find a 'Germanic Jesus'.
>>77413064
Joseph de Maistre, Louis de Bonald, François-René de Chateaubriand. Edmund Burke.
>>77386347
You know all well I am.
>>77412639
Catholic reactionary here.
>>77416021
Greetings brother.
>>77393181
>It's interesting that in his first two books he advocates political restructuring of society, but then in Ride the Tiger he advocates building a kind of inner sanctum
He wrote Ride The Tiger when he was already old. He saw what went down, he saw how few people of this new age hold 'values' that make no sense. He already wrote about how feminists will destroy civilization in the 1930's. I think in his old days nothing could surprise him, as he said, our folk and our culture can only be saved if something big happens (like an outside attack on Europe), otherwise, by order of things, it will completely disintegrate and die out. He knew decadence very well. He knew the majority of society is already doomed, and because of the broken up hierarchy, there are no elites left in their rightful places.
Just read the book's opening words, and you'll understand.
He wrote the book for people who are alone or are too few and therefore winning against the system of decadence itself is impossible. What the title means is "You can't act now, so wait for the best moment of chance. Use the time to get stronger and smarter".
And the time is near, my friends. The collapse have begun.
I wish for all of you here a strong body and a sharp mind.
