Are the libertarians right or left wing? What about greens?
Are there any other relevant third parties? From what I've seen basically libertarians are republicans with a freedom/small gov emphasis and greens are just environmentally focused liberals.
they are both far leftists
libertarians just pretend not to be leftists
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb8cErokGFs
>>77175751
those thot nails
greens are communists
The economy is more important, therefore libertarians are right wing.
Do you consider the USSR to have been right wing because of strong nationalism?
>>77175751
Libertarians are right wing. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar. Praise Hans Hermann Hoppe
>>77175850
Libertarians promote fiscally conservative policies.
You can't accurately judge political views on a two-point scale.
>>77176133
Libertarian "economics" is essentially left wing globalism
>>77176517
Yes "conservative" policies like globalism and open borders
>>77175751
>>77176574
"Globalism" is a statist creation and inherently non-libertarian
Open borders wouldn't be a problem if welfare didn't exist
>>77176818
crime
>>77175751
>Are the libertarians right or left wing? What about greens?
Libertarians and greens are both on the left.
>Are there any other relevant third parties?
No.
>>77176914
What did you mean by this?
>>77176950
How are libertarians on the left? because they don't hate "muh gays!"?
>>77176818
>Open borders wouldn't be a problem
except all the cheap labor and outsourcing, not to mention flooding the country with non-whites.
libertarians believe in dissolving the nation-state for their globalist race mixed utopia ruled by multinational corporations.
Is she really thicc, or is it just the angle and body position?
>>77175751
whats up with all the fucking traps?
>>77176818
>Open borders wouldn't be a problem if welfare didn't exist
I don't want shitskins in my country if they work for their stay either.
And they would come. They'd come to be criminals. They'd come because we can create societies that are better than theirs, in environments that are more comfortable than the hot and sandy shitholes they crawl out of.
>>77175966
This. They just scapegoat fossil fuel companies instead of all companies.
>>77177041
libertarians are against the nation state and collective action in the interest of the nation.
They are autistic individualists who ironically share all the same end goals as collectivist communists, that is one world free of nations and governments.
>>77175751
Libertarians are economically and socially liberal even though economic liberalism eventually goes back to being or turns into economic tyranny.
Greens are just far left with a friendly environmentalist facade.
libertarianism is probably better described on the autism spectrum than the political spectrum.
>>77176133
after uncle joe took over yes. USSR was a classic eastern depotism.
>>77175751
>being a cuck to left/right wing mantra
>>77177065
>libertarians believe in dissolving the nation-state for their globalist race mixed utopia ruled by multinational corporations
I think you're confusing libertarians with anarchists.
>>77177206
It was big government EU that let shitskins into your country, not libertarian policies
>>77177249
>collectivist communists
>one world free of nations and governments
What?
>>77177329
That's a trap m8
>>77175751
>Are the libertarians right or left wing?
They use to be on the right, but they've since shifted towards the left.
>What about greens?
They are definitely on the left.
>Are there any other relevant third parties?
Those two aren't even relevant in the scheme of things.
>>77177041
letting a bunch of spics in will raise crime drastically
>>77177432
*tips fedora*
Modern green is left wing militant. They are also a protest party, their leaders have a toy said they don't want to win elections.
Libertarians are just retarded, till they move the goalposts so far they just become republicans
>>77177249
The only real difference between libertarians and communists is that libertarians can't even comprehend society as a whole because it doesn't factor into their autistic outlook on the whole
They can only perceive "individual" issues like "the state says I should pay taxes therefore it is evil, let's abolish the state"
>>77177503
You mean like what is already happening with our entirely non-libertarian government?
>>77177601
>"let's abolish the state"
Libertarians are not anarchists.
>he's never seen a political compass before
Look at Ron Paul and Gary Johnson to see the left and right differences when they're on the same authoritarian/libertarian positions.
Look at Hillary Clinton and Ted Cruz to see they're both authoritarians who want to shit on your freedom from the left or to the right.
Social conservatism is a cancer that has rotted your brain into thinking YOUR rituals should be law for some morally sanctified reason.
image unrelated
>>77175751
These days libertarians are all about feelings, so left.
>>77176517
watch this video cunt.
He explains that the difference between right and left wing is race realism, therefore libertarians must be right wing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO68Kvb9fD4
>>77176471
closest I could do
>>77177494
>It was big government EU that let shitskins into your country, not libertarian policies
Yet libertarian policies would let them in just the same, if not more so.
>>77177494
>confusing libertarians with anarchists
The logical end point of libertarianism is just ancapistan
and if ancapistan is ever implemented it just becomes feudalism.
>>77177494
libertarians and communists want to destroy the nation state
>>77177494
lol this fag doesn't know about sabina altynbekova.
Central Asia = Best Asia
>>77175751
>slight indentation on her thigh
2/10 would not bang
yeah, libertarians have definitely shifted towards the left, which is why i abandoned the party. green is 100% left, just libs who really like trees i guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
A basic Left Right analogy is based upon freedom vs security.
Security is right wing, freedom is left wing. Obviously this breaks down in the complexity of actual reality, but for the sake of the analogy, Libertarians are leftists.
>>77177855
welcome to the modern libertarian party
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_toYr_Hcdo
>>77177752
You clearly do not understand the reasons why shitskins are flooding your country.
>>77177791
>The logical end point of libertarianism is just ancapistan
That is a false assertion.
>libertarians want to destroy the nation state
This is also a false assertion.
>>77177811
I'm sorry to break it to you, but if you're attracted to that then you are a faggot.
>>77178065
>libertarian
>is one of the trap fetishists that call actual women traps
nothing to see here, move along boys.
>>77177982
>WE WUZ XYZ LOLBERTARIANS AND SH- AND SHIIIT!
Autism confirmed. Ouch.
The problem with Libertarians is that they don't have a coherent message. Some are dyed in the wool anarchists, others believe there should be a Government, but then argue as to how it should perform its governing function.
>>77178065
>You clearly do not understand the reasons why shitskins are flooding your country.
They want to be here and we allow them to come.
None of this would change under libertarianism.
>>77175751
Libertarians are a variation of anarchist
>>77177693
>implying the wall wont keep them out
>>77177731
saved. Thanks mate
Libertarianism is a pol meme, but its actually the final red pill. Screaming nationalism and ranting about immigrants is only going to make a political movement smaller and smaller and pegged as racist.
Cut off the government gibs that nourishes the sjw parasite and a lot of the problems fix themselves.
>>77178376
Do you really think that 100% of immigrants in your country are there to find a job? That certainly isn't the case here in any case.
Would you be against libertarianism if it was more restrictive on immigration?
>>77177503
Statistically speaking, immigrants, from whatever country, have a much lower crime rate than their native counterparts of the same age and sex. The high crime rate among latinos comes from those born here. The same thing applies to Muslims, by the way. The ones that moved here know the kind of crazy shit they're leaving. Those born here are three times more likely to be sympathetic to terrorists.
In other words, the come-here's are fine. It's the born-here's that are the problem.
>>77178376
It would change under anarchism though. If all property is private then they have nowhere to land without being shot and no property to buy without permission from exisiting races.
>>77178567
I don't see any wall m8, and judging by Trump's poll numbers it's not going to happen.
>>77178385
>libertarians are anarchists
That is a false assertion.
>>77178706
>Do you really think that 100% of immigrants in your country are there to find a job?
The first sandniggers (Turks) came under the guise of guest workers. Why take any chances? Even if they don't work, they could still make a living as criminals.
>Would you be against libertarianism if it was more restrictive on immigration?
I'd be less against it. How would it ensure this?
>>77178803
What's stopping them from just marching into your country like the refugees are doing at the moment and taking your shit?
>>77178706
there is no immigration under libertarianism. All private property is already owned so you can shoot them for crossing the border; private property
>>77177118
Is that really a man?
If you think that Govt will ever need to stop expanding and have to retract some then I consider you libertarian in that aspect. To be generally libertarian your opinion, as I see it, reflects being upset with a govt that has done too much and is too big. All parties drag you in a direction. We don't need the theft of welfare or handouts. We don't need bathroom laws! We don't need speech laws for libel or for hate speech. We don't need laws on our preferences or on "crimes" concocted by some unnecessary laws that are by definition victimless. We don't need a drug war primarily based on tame ol' weed while maintaining a oligopoly of dangerous drugs to our public. We don't need cronies making our college arbitrarily more expensive under the ruse of "making it affordable". We need income mobility to be possible. We need to allow a meritocracy.
>>77178710
so we give all immigrants the snip then?
>>77177791
>if ancapistan is ever implemented it just becomes feudalism.
Anarcho-capitalism, at a practical level, results in panarchy.
We still have the remnants of feudalism today. You can see it most clearly in the concept of eminent domain, which means "Supreme Lordship." Who is the modern day "Supreme Lordship"? The government. The government owns all of the land.
>>77179134
no you don't fuck men don't get cellulite that young or any at all
>>77179004
Most Libertarians believe that government power is limited to what's in the Constitution. Luckily, the Constitution allows for the restriction of a certain class of people from entering the country if it serves that nation's interests. So basically, Libertarians would be down with a Muslim ban because it is Constitutionally valid.
>>77179324
No it results in feudalism
a small minority of mercs just take over whatever territory they want and name themselves king.
>>77178376
>They want to be here and we allow them to come.
They're fleeing a war zone because half of the Middle East has been destabilized, largely thanks to western governments toppling dictators, creating a power vacuum and incentivizing extremism.
>>77178629
>stop being racist
>my small government society will work as long as we bring in enough brown people
brilliant """"logic"""""
>>77179134
yea his insta is realestjennycarter
>>77175751
There are both
>>77179694
They can move east and south. Yet they don't - they come here. Even to countries like mine that did nothing of the sort.
>>77179481
What if someone comes in anyway - how do you get rid of them, who's going to enforce that?
>>77179694
>thanks to western governments
>using this level of leftist narrative
No it's thanks to jewish interests corrupting western countries and having them act in the name of Israel.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815
>>77179568
I would still prefer fuedalism to democracy everyday
>>77179930
Law grants police powers to the Federal government. So Border Patrol or ICE would probably be in charge of immigration still.
new
>>77180086
How's that any different from the current system then?
>>77179568
Do you not understand what panarchy is?
>>77180457
It's unbridled autism just like all libertarian ideology.
http://reason.com/blog/2011/07/20/being-libertarian-may-cause-au
>>77179930
You still seem to be under the misapprehension that they are moving to Europe out of revenge. That's not the motivation.
>>77179949
It was still western governments, even if you believe Jews control them.
>>77179481
>the Constitution allows for the restriction of a certain class of people from entering the country if it serves that nation's interests. So basically, Libertarians would be down with a Muslim ban because it is Constitutionally valid.
Which part of the Constitution does that?
>>77180278
It's not. Libertarians still acknowledge that the government should do some things and do them very well. The problem is that the government does a whole lot of things they have no authority to do. National security is definitely something the federal government can and should be doing though.
>>77180831
>Israel
>western
and
>believe
Technically US foreign policy is controlled by Israel and Saudi Arabia along with the Sunni dominated gulf states.
There's nothing western about US foreign policy besides the white soldiers used as cannon fodder for the kikes
>>77175751
Greens are left. Libertarians are right.
>>77181132
>>77180692
The reason WHY they're moving here is a non-issue to me. They shouldn't be.
>>77181126
>The problem is that the government does a whole lot of things they have no authority to do.
Who decides what authority they have though?
>>77181102
8 US Code ss 1182
"Whenever the president finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or nonimmigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate.”
Which is how obama could legally temporarily ban Iraqi immigrants in 2011.
>>77175751
Green party are fascists fyi
>>77181293
muh libertarian principles
>>77181515
And all it takes is a leftist president to let in everyone.
>>77181293
>The reason WHY they're moving here is a non-issue to me. They shouldn't be.
It's not important TO YOU. But they are moving for a reason. And that reason occurred because of a world that rejected libertarianism.
>>77181293
That was the entire point of our Constitution. It was meant to limit the power of the federal government. The idea was that the feds could do a few very important tasks and the individual states would figure out the rest. So, for example, if you were a stoner you could move to a state that allowed weed if you desired.
>>77181737
>And that reason occurred because of a world that rejected libertarianism.
So that libertarianism of yours would only work when the entire world embraces it? Sounds familiar.
>>77181737
reality rejects libertarianism
>>77181846
I have another definition of libertarians: communists in denial
>>77181515
>Which part of the CONSTITUTION does that?
>>77181852
>a Socialist caricature from Nazi propaganda shouting Libertarian explicits
What did /lit/ mean by this?
>>77181688
Very true. Guess that's up to the people to elect a president that reflects their opinions on immigration.
>>77177791
>The logical end point of libertarianism is just ancapistan
man what happened to /pol/
>>77175927
Well she does fuck niggers..
>>77181947
>>77181852
shit tier stirner worshippers coming through, time to endure pinpoint nihilism to whatever seen fit
>>77175751
>still believing in the left/right false dichotomy
you can't make this shit up senpai
>>77182023
So you have 50%+1 vote dictate over everyone else, potentially altering your nation forever?
That shit is the exact same nonsense we have now and it evidently does not work.
>>77181988
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_welfare_clause
>>77182008
It still works
>>77182059
autistic "government always bad" ideology leads to anarchism
>>77182160
>worshiping Stirner
no he just pointed out the obvious
laws only exist because people enforce them.
If there's no one to enforce the law then there effectively are no laws at all.
>>77181846
In this case, a number of countries acted together to destabilize the area. I don't recall off hand how many were involved in Iraq War 1 & 2. It was mostly the US, obviously.
But no, the entire world does not have to embrace libertarianism. There are obviously a large number of countries that are unaffected by the chaos created in the Middle East. But the closer the world gets to it, the better off we are.
>>77175751
Greens vary from country to country. Our Greens are fiscally conservative libertarians who want to shrink government and make it more efficient while protecting the environment and growing our tech sector (and don't give a flying fuck about the refugees - you never hear them mentioned at all and political compass shows them as wanting to reduce immigration), but in Germany they're fucking commies who don't seem to have much of any concern for the environment, economic stability or national security.
>>77182059
summer + reddit
>>77182160
Who's Stirner and what does he do?
>>77181852
That's like saying reality rejected capitalism in the USSR.
>>77181947
Literally every thread involving libertarianism you have to shill your philistine master spoopster.
>>77181988
how many people in here, other than you, do you think know the difference between constitutional and statutory law?
>>77175751
Rothbard, the King Liberjew himself, claimed that they were more left wing than even the most fervent of communists and the true heirs of Enlightenment thought, so that pretty much settles it. Lelbertarians gtfo.
Oh and C4SS, BHL, etc. are the true libertarians rather than the Paulbots and Mises autists by this definition.
>>77175751
Libertarians are near-right to right depending on platform availability.
Their leftist equivalents are Social Liberals, not to be confused with Social Democrats.
>>77175751
They're right wingers who still care about having friends. That sums up the libertarian.
>>77182312
nope, we have the electoral college to decide how to alter the nation. congress and the supreme court still exist as well. albeit barely. i'm not sayin shit works right now. it definitely isn't legal what's going on but no one gives enough of a damn to do something so it continues.
>>77182372
based philosopher that pointed out ideologies are just ideas
Ancapistan breaks down when you have no one to enforce property rights
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Stirner
>>77182403
reality rejected communism
>>77182405
>capitalism
>libertarian
kek no
We have been part of a federal system since based Hamilton set it up
Washington crushed you anti government faggots years ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion
>>77182316
His philosophy is still misused as tactical nihilism for edgy litfags/leftypolfags
including yourself
>>77179753
Literally nothing that any actual libertarian said.
Libertarian "keep the bern going" containment party excepted. There is a reason why most libertarians don't vote.
>>77182316
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_welfare_clause
The General Welfare clause refers to the list of enumerated powers, according to James Madison.
>"Some, who have not denied the necessity of the power of taxation, have grounded a very fierce attack against the Constitution, on the language in which it is defined. It has been urged and echoed, that the power “to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises, to pay the debts, and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States,’’ amounts to an unlimited commission to exercise every power which may be alleged to be necessary for the common defense or general welfare. No stronger proof could be given of the distress under which these writers labor for objections, than their stooping to such a misconstruction. Had no other enumeration or definition of the powers of the Congress been found in the Constitution, than the general expressions just cited, the authors of the objection might have had some color for it; though it would have been difficult to find a reason for so awkward a form of describing an authority to legislate in all possible cases." James Madison, Federalist Paper #41
>>77182372
everything is a spook except spooks those aren't spooks
>>77182372
Forget about it, he's just a spook.
>>77182714
>Kills you when you step on my snake.
>>77182714
>reality rejected communism
Eventually. It's also in the process of rejecting a neo-con foreign policy.
R8 my gf /pol/
>>77175751
Who's the skank
>>77182795
when you talk of spooks that aren't spooks are you referring to niggers or spies?
>>77176574
>>77175966
>>77176471
>>77175850
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autism
>>77175751
There are left libertarians and right libertarians. The prominent strain of libertarianism in the west is right libertarianism. It's the idea that whoever has the most money should act as an authority, which defeats libertarian values at their core.
>>77182715
>libertarian that wants to destroy society calling anyone else a nihilist
that's rich
>>77182765
Nope
The General Welfare Clause and this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necessary_and_Proper_Clause
effectively let the government do whatever it wants
>>77182939
He thinks he's up against one guy and not an army
kek
>>77183229
http://reason.com/blog/2011/07/20/being-libertarian-may-cause-au
>>77175751
>Fucking left/right political dichotomy
They're both on the left. Protip: if you're discussing American politics, there is no right wing.
>>77175751
Classic libertarians are right-wing but the modern millennial infiltrators are trying to make it left-wing
>>77183375
Oh and the commerce clause
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause
Beyond the Bill of Rights the government is essentially unlimited.
The only thing we have protecting us, in reality, is the white tradition of limited government going back to the magna carta
>>77175751
Right and left wing are concocted distractions.
Libertarians seek to build a 'big-tent' political party, including people whose voices are not heard through either of the establishment parties, uniting all who are generally in favor of returning the Republican form of government and a system of personal liberty and personal responsibility; as against all who are generally in favor of continuing the past centuries relentless march towards a totalitarian would-be empire instead.
Libertarianism is neither right nor left. Individuals come to it from the right or the left, but it is something apart. It is morality itself, as expressed here <)<)
>>77183258
whoever told you that lied.
Libertarianism is about the non-aggression principle. You can do as you please as long as you're not harming anyone else. That is, all social behavior is completely voluntary and agreed upon by the two parties involved.
>>77183758
Who will enforce this fantasy?
>>77175751
Libertarians are left wing by the standards under which the terms "left wing" and "right wing" were coined.
Those on the "right" supported monarchy. Those on the "left" supported classical liberalism.
Libertarians are mostly classical liberals, with a sprinkling of anarcho-capitalists. But the modern left has become socialist. Classical liberalism today is neither left nor right.
>>77183758
So many flaws to your reply. How on earth could ALL social behaviours be voluntary? How do you work out economic relations?
The problem is that the internet has cheapened political discourse and people like this end up forming their political ideas via internet conversations and whatever brief Youtube video seems to portray a political ideology that is align with their particular prejudices (for better or worse).
Libertarianism (right) is a flawed and broken ideology that is rooted in ignorance toward economic affairs and the role they play in shaping civil society.
>>77184024
It's a matter of most people being moral and not sociopaths that attempt to enforce their will on society using agents of the state. It enforces itself once the standing army is replaced by widespread gun ownership and a broadly defined militia making the country utterly undesirable for foreign invasion.
>>77184061
These political charts unnecessarily dichotomize political attitudes. There are alternate ideas that these measurement tools never respect. Not to mention there are 1000 other ways (or more) that society puts itself together and manages itself that are completely apolitical.
>>77184061
>Those on the "right" supported monarchy. Those on the "left" supported classical liberalism
Those on the left supported Republicanism.
>>77184253
not just that
you can't even have order in a libertarian society, because there is no enforcement of law
>>77184413
>organization without a central authority
nice try, cultist
>>77183375
>>77183601
You are literally arguing against the man who wrote the Constitution.
>The only thing we have protecting us, in reality, is the white tradition of limited government going back to the magna carta
I take it you aren't white then? Because you are arguing against that tradition. All of your references (commerce clause, general welfare clause, necessary and proper clause) are the justifications used by those who advocate unlimited government. They were specifically rejected by the founding fathers.
It is true, though, that the Constitution does not limit government at all. Which is why we have ended up with the government we have. However, just because the Constitution was incapable of limiting government, it should not be interpreted as having authorized our present government. It clearly does not.
>>77184253
Economic matters are simply allowed to sort themselves out- I know living in a communist state makes that hard to understand, leaf, but it works. It's a thing called capitalism.
>>77184413
>enforce their will on society using agents of the state
That's the whole basis of private property
>>77184575
Libertarianism isn't anarchy. Libertarianism is a society that civilized people create; anarchy is what autists like you would turn society into.
>>77184633
Capitalism only works in an economic environment where physical labor and unskilled clerical work is in high demand, otherwise a large portion of society is disenfranchised and subject to radicalization.
>>77184575
You don't understand what panarchy is and you don't understand libertarian enforcement of law (not even anarcho-capitalist law enforcement, just classical liberalism.) But you'll, keep arguing as if you do, I'm sure. Why are we even bothering to discuss anything with you when you don't take the time to look up what you are arguing against?
>>77184253
The good analogy in this is marriage.
In backwards, third world countries (like yours, leaf), you get dictate whom to marry and when. In freer, more civilized societies, you work out who to marry based on a mutual beneficial arrangement in terms of interests, compatibility, sexual attraction, etc. There's no one to arrange social/economic behavior in that regard, because it works itself out.
>>77184633
We don't live in communism.
>>77184602
The Constitution is not a "tradition" by itself it's just a piece of paper that represents the ideals of a tradition that was created and promoted by whites that is "individualism, self reliance, private property," etc all the ideals that whites have come to support and all the ideals that non whites despise.
I support private ownership of the means of production, but the government also needs the means to defend the nation and promote the good of the nation.
libertarians want to destroy those so that we can be flooded by non whites and dominated by leftists.
>>77184837
It is for all intents and purposes
when you make the government so weak that it can't do anything you get anarchy and a power vaccum that is replaced by a new, probably worse, ruler.
>>77184992
>libertarian enforcement of law
There is none
a weak government has no ability to enforce the law
>>77184743
I'm talking about enforcing tyranny with the stasi- there would be some limited law enforcement in a libertarian society to enforce laws that actually involve victims. But we wouldn't have sodomy laws and drugs would be legal; no DEA, no ATF because they wouldn't be needed.
>>77184865
Are you presupposing a place absent the availability of educational services?
>>77175751
sauce on the girl?
>>77185032
Your ideas are what is backward, are they not? You suggest not having the ability to marry who you want to marry a mark of a free society. Well that doesn't sound very free to me. I am a conservative, by the way.
>>77185234
Of course- that argument only makes sense if one assumes most of society cannot be educated to do something useful.
>>77185234
>>77185413
>everyone can do any job
>just ignore IQ averages and the fact most of the world can't do high skilled labor
>>77185069
And everything you say is just another strawman argument. There is no logical reason why a government that is limited in a country based on individualism and private property is by default going to have completely open borders.
>>77175751
they're just Marxists/communists from another angle- an intermediary government. You could get to communism just as fast with "socialism".
>>77185069
>The Constitution is not a "tradition" by itself it's just a piece of paper that represents the ideals of a tradition that was created and promoted by whites that is "individualism, self reliance, private property," etc all the ideals that whites have come to support and all the ideals that non whites despise.
>I support private ownership of the means of production, but the government also needs the means to defend the nation and promote the good of the nation.
You don't see how "promote the good of the nation" is at odds with "individualism and self reliance"? You are rejecting the ideas of the founders and embracing what you term "non white" ideals.
>a weak government has no ability to enforce the law
There was law enforcement in the late 1700's and early 1800's. In the north, there were elected sheriffs, governor appointed constables, and the militias, to which all able bodied men belonged. Three competing law enforcement factions worked to limit corruption and abuse of the law, as a person could appeal to another faction if they were being unjustly harassed. The south was a whole different animal. In the south they had slave patrols, which eventually morphed into our modern police forces.
https://www.lp.org/platform
Fuck off memesters
>>77175850
This is very false.
>>77185590
IQ's are rising world wide, for a variety of reasons, including adding iodine to food and improved access to schools.
>>77178065
Salty old white woman detected
>>77177065
Implying protectionism is a viable economy strategy
>>77186371
It works so well in North Korea...
>>77186371
It's what we did from 1812~1979
>>77186371
Worked for well over 100 years in the US.
>>77186636
> middle class stagnant until mid 20th century
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tariffs_in_United_States_history
Oh look there, trade opened up around the 1940s
Protectionism is about getting money out of the middle class and putting it in the hands of unions
>>77186636
>>77186664
>>77187145
Combined federal, state, and local taxes in the 1800's were 6% - 8% of GDP (the blue bars in the pic)
The early US did not flourish because of trade protectionism. It flourished despite trade protectionism and because all other government interference in the economy was so minimal.
>>77177118
it's cecibel vogel u dumb dumb
>>77187803
Without protectionism, local industry in the US would have been wiped out by the British and the French.
>>77187145
World War II destroyed the rest of the industrialized world and allowed the US to prosper freely. We had high tariffs and prosperity in the 20s.
Hang on is that Katie Gregoire in the op pic? She's a Christian youtuber
>>77186087
The Flynn effect has stopped in the west
The world IQ is actually decreasing
>>77188231
>Without protectionism, local industry in the US would have been wiped out by the British and the French.
Literally the same argument being put forth today, except substitute Mexico and China for Britain and France.
Some would areas would become more competitive globally, and some industries would be virtually eliminated.
>>77187145
>>77187803
And let's see what has happened since.
>>77187145
wages rose until your precious outsourcing began
>>77189531
that's because the niggers are outbreeding the whites and gooks. african population is increasing the most in the world.
>>77189550
>Literally the same argument being put forth today, except substitute Mexico and China for Britain and France.
Sure. And it's true.
>>77187803
>ignoring the high productivity and wages prior to your precious outsourcing
kek classic libertariancuck
>>77189805
Except it's not.
There needs to be a green alt right.
That would be the perfect affiliation for this time.
>>77189624
or, you know, we took the dollar off the gold standard and it's worth shit now.
But your fairy tale works too, I guess..
>>77190140
Wages were higher - total compensation was not. The increase in wages is being eaten up by health care costs. That's the government's fault.
In addition to rising compensation, expenses - excluding taxes - have fallen. That gives people more disposable income. Or it would, if the government wasn't fucking up a major expense and piling on ever increasing taxes.
>>77190176
>comparing your autistic fantasies to real life
In reality outsourcing creates unemployed people in the US so that we can pay people 10 cents in China to live in cages to do work that used to pay an American a good salary.
>>77190290
>muh gold standard
you have no idea what you're talking about
The dollar was taken off the gold standard in 1933.
In 1971 Nixon closed the Gold Window, but that has no effect on "real wages" since any inflation will only affect "nominal wages"
nice try though.
>>77190176
That little thought experiment ignores reality. Most notably, when our trade tariffs were high, we were also importing more labor through immigration.
>>77190176
>a dumb eco 101 competitive advantage lesson
I don't know if I can take this nonsense. It's already incorrect by assuming all workers in different countries get paid the same wages, have the same labor regulations, same living costs, etc. as US workers. The very first example after the question is moronic as the tariff saved US businesses from going bankrupt and laying off people. In practice, the said dumping of steel would allow large firms to buy up large quantities of cheap steel, undercut smaller firms, and fuck over small businesses and their employees. I'm not going to bother with the rest of this drivel; this is stupid.
In a perfectly Libertarian society, the person with the most Guns is the Government.
>>77175751
Libertarians are autistic degenerates and Greens are insane hippies.
>>77190593
Meanwhile in reality (outside your libertarian fantasies) the actual problem is the US consumer being flooded with debt to afford housing while his wages are stagnant.
Want to know why expenditures for housing are lower? Because now everything is debt financed. You don't buy your own home anymore you get a mortgage that you're tied to for life. And it's all thanks to deregulating wall street and open borders, policies you support. Bravo libertarians.
>>77189624
Wages increases have been sacrificed to non-wage compensation.
>>77175751
Right wing libertarians are usually republican desu, the libertarian party is leftist af right now
>>77190593
People spent more on food, clothing and housing cost more in the early 1900s because there were less consumer goods you and real wages were lower. Duh. Also, the green revolution massively cut food prices.
>>77177601
>implying having knee jerk emotional reactions to everything is a better way to make decisions
>>77190889
Houses are more expensive because of what goes into them these days. Up until the 70s, insulation was an option. If I built a house to 1940's specs, you'd be able to easily afford it on 1yrs salary today.
>>77175751
who is that in the OP's pic? is it lauren southern?
>>77190911
can you afford your rent, utilities, or food with non wages? Do you not realize providing insurance for everyone just bids up healthcare prices even more effectively giving you far less coverage?
This is why libertarians are seen as autists they can only understand a few key words and ideas and repeat them ad nauseam.
>>77191173
>society will collapse if you don't have a government
normal person: oh no that's bad better have a govenrment
libertarian: who cares? at least I have my autistic principles.
>>77190737
It absolutely does not assume all workers get paid the same or have the same costs. There are advantages to manufacturing in the US other than wages, such as intellectual property protection, access to reliable infrastructure, low levels of corruption, and so forth.
So what if large firms put small business out of business? Are you appealing to some bleeding heart liberal, here?
>>77191265
>this is what libertarians actually believe
housing prices are bid up by mass immigration and cheap credit you literal retard
>>77191372
>There are advantages to manufacturing in the US other than wages, such as intellectual property protection, access to reliable infrastructure, low levels of corruption, and so forth.
And in reality most of it gets outsourced to China.
>So what if large firms put small business out of business?
Autistic libertarians do it again. Large firms buy our government and lobby for restrictive legislation.
>>77191372
>It absolutely does not assume all workers get paid the same or have the same costs
yes it does, idiot
There's no reason to outsource to China beyond the low wages and nonexistent environmental laws
>So what if large firms put small business out of business?
There's that autism flaring up again.
>>77175751
> cant read party platforms
> too stupid to understand that Right and Left are pretty much meaningless outside the two party dichotomy
> too ignorant to understand that Right and Left have been corrupted and really dont mean shit in US politics
let me spoon feed you
> libertarian
literally all about Personal Liberty and the Liberalism Of The Enlightenment, which makes them "right wing" in US political parlance
> Greens
full on marxists with eco-lunacy as their proletarian propaganda tool
Left Wing Authoritarians
> Democrats
Left Wing Authoritarians big govt turds with marxism simmering under the surface
> Republicans
Right Wing Authoritarians who betray their claimed core principles and pretty much are just democrats without the marxism
> Peace and Freedom
literally a waste of time
their platform is fucking retarded and schizophrenic
hippie burnout retreads from a san francisco drum circle
> Socialist Party
seriously, the just plain old tired whore of marxism
References:
Republican and democrat platforms through the years:
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/platforms.php
Third party platforms:
http://www.john-uebersax.com/parties.htm
>>77191377
That's what a home builder who has worked on everything from 250year old farm houses to modern mansions believes. Old homes were built like shit and as cheap as possible.
Was it a shack or was it that property location which sold for £1m?
>>77175751
Libertarians are both right and left wing. It depends on their specific social policies. Green party is on the line between left libertarian and left authoritarian.
>>77191852
The land is what matters you fucking moron not the house itself.
>>77178065
>she's not even pretty!
kek bootyblasted white woman
>>77177065
Libertarian-ism creates social Darwinism if your race cannot survive a free market its objectively inferior.
>>77191291
>society will collapse if you don't have a government.
Whew lad, I'm going to need a source for that.
>>77192161
social Darwinism is a meme created by a lying jewish hisotrian
http://reason.com/archives/2008/07/29/the-unfortunate-case-of-herber
>>77192196
reality
>>77191998
When you buy homeowners insurance you're not buying insurance for the replacement cost of the land dipshit. Property values change, yes. I was speaking strictly of the building itself. Apologies for not making myself clear.
>>77191291
>can you afford your rent, utilities, or food with non wages? Do you not realize providing insurance for everyone just bids up healthcare prices even more effectively giving you far less coverage?
>This is why libertarians are seen as autists they can only understand a few key words and ideas and repeat them ad nauseam.
What gave you the impression that I or any libertarian was in favor of what the government has done to health care markets.
In addition to not understanding panarchy, limited government law enforcement, or the economics of trade, you can add the libertarian view of market based health care.
>>77192196
The civilization you enjoy today is the result of statism.
>>77192287
Then reality would have an example you could share. Now please do or head back on down to reddit.
>>77192390
Nationalism. We didn't used to put the continuation of the state above the continuation of the nation.
>>77191778
>yes it does, idiot
>There's no reason to outsource to China beyond the low wages and nonexistent environmental laws
Low wages and non existent environmental laws are not the only considerations for manufacturers.
>There's that autism flaring up again.
Nice non existent argument.
>>77175751
leftists. they willingly or accidentally get subverted with hardcore anarchists and communists every time.
>>77191731
>And in reality most of it gets outsourced to China.
Bull shit. US manufacturing is near all time highs.
What has dropped in the US is manufacturing employment - not output - and that is due to increased technology.
>>77192505
It's called the nation-state. George Washington used force to put down rebellions left and right. Lincoln forcibly took back the South. Without that, we wouldn't exist as we do today.
>>77192455
There's a hard limit to the number of people who can live in a society without some form of government. That number is 148. Your libertarian fantasyland can only exist in preagricultural societies.
>>77192390
Going share a source? Early United States was libertarian.
>>77178065
Anarcho capitalism actually is the logical end point of the non aggression axiom though.
If the non aggression principle is an immutable axiom, then there can be no government and there must be no market controls, which is the literal definition of anarcho capitalism. No aggression is justified under the nap, thus, you can only have anarchy.
That humans could operate cooperatively, voluntarily, without any aggression, in such a state of existence is where libertarianism is shown to be utter hog wash; an impossible mystical belief system.
>>77175751
Libertarians are as far right as you can get.
>>77192639
Nice bullshit.
>>77192390
Civilization is the division of labor.
anyone got more pics of the girl btw?
>>77192639
>>77192820
Sorry I didn't read your last statement. Output being high does not negate the fact that we have way less manufacturing unemployment.
>>77192687
Indeed. But the backdrop was always "we the people". These days the government sells out "the people" through outsourcing and importing labor to increase revenue and insure the continuation of the state while engaging in the wholesale destruction of the culture which made that state possible.
>>77186371
Doesn't matter if it isn't.
>>77192314
so property values can change but cheap credit and mass immigration have no effect?
nice "logic"
>>77192455
>>77192507
>Low wages and non existent environmental laws are not the only considerations for manufacturers.
They are the primary ones
>not an arguement
not caring about the composition and decentralization of the economy is autistic.
>>77177249
> implying the Libertarian Party is leftist because they have a silly Open Borders plank that almost all libertarians object to
the national party bosses put that shit in ther because they are "free trade" laissez faire retards who see ALL regulation as bad.
most libertarians dont support complete abandonment of regulations and reject the idea of open borders
the party bosses of the Libertarian party are "anarcho-capitalists" which is an oxymoron.
all the rest of their platform planks are firmly "right wing"
>>77192455
meant to say
"The domination of state societies over hunter gatherers"
>>77175850
Don't listen to this fucking dumbass.
>>77175751
Libertarians are pretty an attempt at the best of both worlds. Economically conservative, leaning socially left in the sense that you are free to do as you please as long as it doesn't infringe on other people. Not the "Communist, totalitarian for feminazism" left we have now.
Freedom and inalienable rights trump everything. Government is limited to national defense more or less.
but like fucking everything in this god damn age everyone takes every fucking titty tearing thing way too far into schizophrenic induced insanity. So now you have Right wingers declaring race war and death squads and degeneracy.
Leftists screaming MUH BLOODY VAGINA ART! CHECKYOPWIVILEGE! DIE RIGHTIST SCUM! ISLAM IS RELIGION OF PEACE!
And for fuck's sake you have Libertarians booing incessently NO to the idea that blind people shouldn't be allowed to drive vehicles.
This world is absolutely fucked beyond belief.
>>77177329
> libertarianism is probably better described on the autism spectrum than the political spectrum.
true dat
>>77192732
The early US was statism.
>>77192955
Fair enough, but anarchy land wouldn't have accomplished 90% of what the US did.
>>77192820
What? I said manufacturing employment has dropped while manufacturing output is near all time highs. You posted a chart of manufacturing employment. It dropped, just like I said.
Now here's a chart of manufacturing output.
>>77193100
>almost all libertarians
Here's your candidate
>My vision of the border with Mexico is that a truck from the United States going into Mexico and a truck coming from Mexico into the United States will pass each other at the border going 60 miles an hour. Yes, we should have open borders.
http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Gary_Johnson_Immigration.htm
>>77192771
Libertarianism is about finding the maximum amount of liberty people can have. Anarchism and the NAP are not foundational to it.
>>77193199
>lowest unemployment ever
>manufacturing is at all time highs
sure thing buddy
>>77193024
Cheap credit has allowed us to buy outside our means. Like I said, if I was to build a house to 1940's specs (meaning you would be living in an uninsulated chicken coop), you would be able to afford it on a year's salary. You're getting too abstract.
>>77177065
Nothing wrong with open borders when you have a free-market. We have mass immigration because the state provides housing and food and so on.
In a libertarian state they'd either get a job or go back.
>>77193024
>They are the primary ones
Really? Explain >>77193199
>not caring about the composition and decentralization of the economy is autistic.
Those are not goods worthy of government interference in or management of the economy. You aren't explaining why anyone ought to care.
>>77193325
Improved technology = greater output per employee. Fewer and fewer employees are needed to maintain or grow output.
>>77193190
>Fair enough, but anarchy land wouldn't have accomplished 90% of what the US did
I agree. Most of the early US could possibly be described as "libertarian", but mostly because it was made up of subsistence farmers. Everyone could do their own thing because they had the room to be left alone. They also went to work at 9 and died at 45.
>>77193679
And with increases in the population, this is surely a good thing.
>>77193398
>buy outside our means
No you idiot, it's forced us to live outside our means by bidding up prices.
You can't afford housing now without mortgage debt this was the plan all along because you'll be paying interest long after you're dead.
>>77193504
mass immigration lowers wages and raises prices
not to mention the non white part
>>77193566
explain the millions of jobs sent overseas?
It's because of the outsourcing that libertarians push for
http://www.epi.org/blog/fast-track-to-lost-jobs-and-lower-wages/
>up to 5 million jobs lost
>more people on Government assistance than ever because only jobs left are low wage shit
Bravo libertarians, Bravo
>>77193832
meanwhile Trump giving out government assistance like candy and wonders why he needs to be tough on immigration.
>>77193760
It is.
We are better off with a computer and without 5,000,000 switchboard operators employed.
The switchboard operators can get new jobs. Humans have unlimited wants. That means potential employment is unlimited. There is no need for government to lock things in place - protect industries - other than fear of the unknown.
>>77193252
and thats why gary johnson will never be president.
>>77194030
Mass immigration of low skill workers and the loss of blue collar jobs is a good thing. Only in libertarian land.
>>77193504
> open borders are good
> in a country NOT bordered by mexico
suck a thousand cocks portagee retard.
>>77194018
>wonders why he needs to be tough on immigration
Mexico is a shithole
we will be flooded regardless unless we build a wall
>>77194030
>comparing losing jobs to technological progress to losing jobs to low paid overseas labor
like I said, pure autism
we shouldn't be losing "any" good paying blue collar jobs to Chinese people paid 10 cents an hour or Mexicans getting paid under minimum wage.
Low paid work just means a low standard of living.
>>77194158
>Mass immigration happens in a place without a welfare state
ah yes, the tsunami of immigrants to poland. what a memorable proof of your comment
>>77194456
Mexico is a shithole with no economic opportunity you moron. They'll come here without the welfare state.
>>77194030
>5,000,000 new jobs suddenly pop up for switchboard operators, while corporations continue to leave the US
wew lad
>>77193832
>You can't afford housing now without mortgage debt this was the plan all along because you'll be paying interest long after you're dead.
You don't know the first thing about what goes into building a house do you? Let's try something different. In 1900 your evening family entertainment could be handled with a 10cent deck of cards. Today you need $700 worth of gaming and video equipment. The cost of your evenings entertainment has not gone up due to easy credit. It's gone up because there's more shit involved.
In 1960 a new Camero cost $2500. Now it costs $25000. Why? Because in 1960 it was basically a piece of steel wrapped around an engine with an old couch for a seat. Now there's a lot more shit that goes into it. Cheap credit is not the cause of this.
>>77194018
>Trump giving out government assistance like candy
Where the fuck did you get that idea?
>>77175751
>>77175966
>>77176133
>>77176471
>>77176517
>>77176574
>>77176799
>>77176818
>>77176914
>>77176950
Robot OPs usually deliver short OP with bait images and some of the following recurring themes:
is/are X white?;
is X Red/Blue Pill;
sexual & racist bait;
fap/no fap/ porn abstinence;
What did X mean by...;
Where were you when you realized ...;
[image] + well, pol?;
[image] + POL BTFO;
[image] + Hmmm, really made me think;
[image] + Hmmm, really makes you think;
[image] + Hmmm, I never thought of this;
[image] + I think X has a point;
Settle for [asian/arab/latino] women;
Genuinely curious as to why...;
Pretty sure they can be both, or at least I've met libertarians that have voted for Obama and some that voted Bush.
>>77194776
why do you keep talking shit?
The land value is what matters, not the house itself.
And the land value is bid up by cheap credit and mass immigration (population increase).
The majority of debt goes to afford housing not fucking video games.
