When did you stop being a libertarian /pol/?
that girl is a trap because if i were to transition that's what i would look like
and 16, I'm 24 now
>>76721344
becuase its to hard to consider all factors in a voluentary transaction
>>76721561
nice id
This is your brain on libertarianism.
>>76721344
My IQ happens to be above 80 so I was never a libertarian.
When I realised that libertarianism was an inherently sexist and racist ideology.
18 for me. I'm 19 now and I've been kinda-sorta vaguely libertarian up until now, though over the past year I've sort of considered by self a libertarian as an adjective only. It was a combination of Trump and Sam Seder which shifted me away from it. For about another year prior so I was an edgy Hoppe/Rothbard racialist clinging to nuance.
Libertarianism is a set of doors that lead to more doors of more and more nuanced ideology. You have to stop and realize its not grounded in the real world in anyway.
never, because free countries are always superior to non-free ones
when i hit puberty
>>76722031
Who is this fluid druid?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCozh_vbYdM
How much would you like to bet that the majority of the tards in this video are Libertarians?
Don't think I ever really was one, although I agree with it very much. But some of them are every bit at retarded as ideologue communists.
So they can go practice their brand of extreme libertarianism in their little libertarianism reservations, and best of luck to them. Glad I live in enough of a free country where we can let people do that sort of thing.
>>76721344
Because it's as much of a dream utopia that requires change in human nature as communism
>>76721344
When I learned to reason. So about 10.
Who's the semen demon?
>>76721344
not yet
>>76723877
IG name alterhacker
yw
>>76721344
Never was.
FeelsGoodMan
I was never retarded enough to buy into that garbage
>>76723493
>>76723877
I think this is her
https://www.facebook/
com/anneleighfrank
Though this could actually be her
http://instaliga.
com/alterhacker?page=1012565629779110397_1338869153&loadCount=1
I you reverse-image search her images you will find a lot of archived chan conversations about her.
She reminds me of Creepy Susie. What a sweet and cute girl.
>>76722031
who is this semen demon?
>>76721344
>he wants other people to decide for himself
this ain't r/cuckcommunity.
>>76721344
when it was taken over be lefty cucks that suck dick for video games
>>76724243
You want to decide for all of society whether we have a strong state, cuck.
When it didn't happen. Ron Paul.
>>76721344
When I realised everyone isn't as smart as I am, and need to be told what to do or else they will live pathetic worthless existences.
>>76721344
When I moved to a swing state and couldn't justify throwing my vote away.
>>76721344
When I became a National Socialist.
>>76721344
I never really stopped. I got redpilled to hell and back but I still believe in freedom of speech and all the other such things.
>>76721344
When we realised we were facing the extinction of our peoples and ways of life.
>>76724181
Literally Anne Frank
>>76721344
Never fully stopped. I just disagree with anyone saying the nation's borders should be open, and fully believe that anyone saying "taxation is theft" that honestly believes it is delusional with no idea how society works.
Now, sure, if we have some sort of economic system in place where our currency is backed by labor itself, then and only then could you argue taxation is theft. This is because anything the government wishes to do could simply be paid by work certificates used as currency within that nation. So healthcare could be provided "free of charge" to the citizen by government sponsored doctors, roads would be paved and maintained by government sponsored workers, etc. Taxes on a labor based currency make no logical sense. But we do not have a labor based currency, and so we must have taxes.
When I realized that the growth of a strong authority was an inevitable trait of all humanity. Humans are tribal and ordered by our nature, the formation of a powerful government is a instinctual predisposition for us. To try to limit this is contrary to our nature and will only make the government that will inevitably rise from the relative lawlessness of libertarianism all the more unpredictable and dangerous.
Therefore, we should embrace our nature and work to ensure our government truly serves its constituents. A big government is only evil when we allow it to do evil things, but they are not evil by virtue of being big governments.
>>76724291
you mean a strong state that will make all the decisions for you? is that what you like? then I'm pretty sure that north korea is open for immigration.
>>76721344
When I realized that each race acts according to their best interest and that an open borders policy simply doesn't work especially when you have a neighbor as shitty as the Mexicans.
>>76721344
When they nominated Bob Barr instead of Mary ruwart I knew it was over. When that one agitating leftist cunt, can't remember her name, tried to "out" Ron Paul for supporting the other Republicans in TX races, when the bitch doesn't even live here, I realized libertarianism would be lost for a generation or two.
>>76721344
Never stopped. Absolute freedom with personal accountability and no government handouts is my utopia.
I'm not entirely anti-libertarian.
I'm strongly for "social facism" but still believe in a few universal safeguards like freedom of speech just because I don't trust anything short of an AI to not abuse their power.
>>76724675
A strong state to make decisions for me, yes. There are collective action problems which have to be decided by state power rather than voluntary and individual cooperation. For instance if you want infrastructure like roads and electricity, clean water, national defense, care for the poor and vulnerable, and so on.
>>76721344
MUH ROADS!
when I started working as a fire fighter/paramedic
the reason I have a job is because of human stupidity
I am societies damage control
>>76724811
Yeah this.
>>76724811
Well at least you acknowledge its a utopian idea.
>>76724894
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR-F0O6Pyt8
>>76724661
> just disagree with anyone saying the nation's borders should be open
libertarians supporting open boarders are a american invention. the way I see it, and I think its the most libertarian way of seeing it is that you treat the land that your country owns like a big private possession. Thefore its up to the owner/s (in a democracy - the people, in a monarchy - the king) to decide who he wants to let in or not. So in our democracies, immigration should be decided by a referendum, simple as that.
When I didn't want to be associated with a party of multicultural, obese naked dancers.
>>76721344
When i actually stopped and looked at how things in the world works. Hardcore libertarians are basically the same as communists who are screaming "my version of X has never been tried!". It all sounds so good yet will never work in practice, because human nature simply does not work in such ways.
>>76725013
its too complex of an issue to be decided on one vote, that decision should be vetted by economists, law enforcement officials, and representatives from the border regions
>>76721344
I consider myself a national libertarian. Libertarian in my borders but not outside. The problem with free trade is that certain countries can steal all your market as long as they have much cheaper labour. Like with China.
I think taxes in trade between countries are important.
>>76721344
When I thought just for a second.
>>76724661
>fully believe that anyone saying "taxation is theft" that honestly believes it is delusional with no idea how society
having your taxes go to niggers and single mothers and rapefugees is not theft how?
it would be different if you had a say in what you wanted your tax money to go into but currently you get no choice but to pay for others
>>76724884
you fell for the meme that libertarians don't want their gov to buld roads? well then I'm sorry for you.
>For instance if you want infrastructure like roads and electricity, clean water, national defense, care for the poor and vulnerable, and so on.
all goods that are fall in the category of the tragedy of the commons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons) may require government intervention.
The thing however is, that there's ain't that much of that crap. And not all of those mean that the gov has to be 100% in charge. For example we can fight climate change by taxing co2 which would encourage private enterprise for the search for alternatives, but unlike in for example germany: there is no need for the gov to build wind turbines, and or subsidize others. Keep the gov as much as possible out of it, that's my definition of libertarianism.
>>76721344
When I read the Libertarian stance on nation's borders and the use of tort law as a means to deter corporations from environmental abuses.
Also thanks to this last decade I have become increasingly aware of racial differences.
>>76725147
>its too complex of an issue to be decided on one vote
that's more of an argument against the whole of democracy desu
>>76725644
>When I read the Libertarian stance on nation's borders and the use of tort law as a means to deter corporations from environmental abuses.
I agree I saw what this johnson is saying about trump and I think he is totally attacking him on the wrong things. However being fag on open borders is not (in my opinion) a libertarian stance : >>76725013
>>76721344
>libertarian
I was never a libertarian, or a socialist, or a conservative, or a liberal, or a christian, or an atheist or any other of the rainbow of isms, ists, or ians.
>>76725514
Oh gee sorry for not immediately realizing the ends and outs of your own nuanced and personalized version of libertarianism. Ask a room of 10 libertarians what libertarianism means and you'll get at least 11 conflicting answers.
>all goods that are fall in the category of the tragedy of the commons may require government intervention.
No shit Sherlock, I even gave you a list of some such things. At least you've conceded they should be provided by government, though I'm not sure what your objection is.
What we deal with in societies are not simply variations on the dilemma of who owns the land used for grazing.
>Keep the gov as much as possible out of it, that's my definition of libertarianism.
And its totally void. This says nothing about what the government should or not be involved in and to what degree.
>And not all of those mean that the gov has to be 100% in charge. For example we can fight climate change by taxing co2
Yes that's pretty mainstream economic thinking. Obama tried proposing carbon taxes and was totally lambasted by the right and libertarians alike.
>but unlike in for example germany: there is no need for the gov to build wind turbines, and or subsidize others.
Government is the key engine in basic research, which in turn is the key engine in economic growth. We need to significantly increase this type of funding.
>>76725975
> that's more of an argument against the whole of democracy desu
> implying lobbyists wouldn't botch the wording of the referendum to fool voters, along with MSM
those experts will do just fine, thanks
when I realized jews invented american libertarianism
>>76721344
Freedom yes.
Muh >I can steal and lie no.
>>76721344
When I decided it was too hard or impossible to convince people to want freedom. Most people want to be taken care of.
Expanding the vote with women and eliminating the poll tax and other changes, namely welfare to incentivize people to slack has ruined it.
I can't convince a friend that works a shit low wage job that they want freedom when they make enough scratch for weed and video games. The only time they become politically active is for a Bernie Sanders who offers to give them more money.
People don't want freedom. They want to be a child forever.
>>76725975
Labels are useless,drop them.
Even among libertarians, there are people fighting over what the label really means.
People will judge you on their idea of the label and no one's really benefiting from all that confusion.
>>76725975
>libertarianism is for open borders
>libertarianism is for closed borders
What a both very robust and totally ineffectual ideology. It's not a useful tool for either understanding the world or prescribing what we should do in it.
Libertarianism is the principled stance of nothing.
>>76721344
when i was born
>>76721344
>>76722031
>>76724181
>>76726214
>>76726621
more banshees pls
>>76726214
>And its totally void. This says nothing about what the government should or not be involved in and to what degree.
If I was to give what you are asking for I would have to write up for you 200 pages long pdf, sorry I don't have that much engagement for a shitposting board.
>Yes that's pretty mainstream economic thinking. Obama tried proposing carbon taxes and was totally lambasted by the right and libertarians alike.
because the libertarians and republicans in the US (the country of evolution deniers, what a surprise) are ignorant. they simply don't think its a threat but rather throwing money into the void. in that case their reasoning would make sense but its built on a lie that climate change doesn't exists / is irrelevant. the carbon tax makes perfect sense libertairan wise. its simply paying the hidden cost of coal emissions.
>Government is the key engine in basic research, which in turn is the key engine in economic growth. We need to significantly increase this type of funding.
If you have trust in your unis then go ahead, fund them for their gender studies. I rather not. also correct me if I'm wrong (im not a usa citizen) but aren't the privates ones always better?
>>76726187
what are you then
Honestly, as soon as I started trying to actually learn about economics. I still have relatively poor knowledge, but it seems obvious that a completely free market leads to so many problems (e.g. monopolies, cartels, negative externalities) that can only be controlled by a central government. Still have libertarian principles from a social point of view, but economically it just doesn't really seem tenable in the modern world.
>>76721696
Mine is below 80 but I still know there wont be any libertarian who will fix the roads.
>>76726567
Welfare i'n't so bad when reformed. The reforms were washed away though.
Bernie Sanders does touch on something really real. I think a higher minimum wage and high marginal tax rates for the wealthy would bring us back to a cozy way-things-used-to-be world. They become politically active for him because they're hurting. No one is convinced by more freedumbs because they've watched what happens with lower taxes and gutting public spending and are not impressed. They probably just like you to much to let you know you're full of shit.
>>76726703
>>76726856
What else can you expect from economics that make up a bunch of bullshit mystic axioms and then says LALALALA WE'RE RIGHT REGARDLESS OF WHAT SCIENCE AND EMPIRICAL DATA SAYS
>>76726847
I am a meat popsicle
>>76726932
Who is this bug-eyed armenian?
>>76726621
No, I said that I think libertarians should be for a referendum for reasons that I covered in a earlier post.
>>76726818
>If I was to give what you are asking for I would have to write up for you 200 pages long pdf, sorry I don't have that much engagement for a shitposting board.
I think it's just esoteric and nuanced drivel. It's time for you to just part from this ideology. You won't even describe remotely what you mean.
>If you have trust in your unis then go ahead, fund them for their gender studies. I rather not. also correct me if I'm wrong (im not a usa citizen) but aren't the privates ones always better?
I don't trust the universities, don't get that impression. That does not however change the fact that research will always get more funding when paid for through taxation. Private research gives us boner pills, government research gives us the cure for cancer. Private research gives us earth-shattering fracking methods, government research gives us renewable energy.
>block of text
I don't think Americans deny either climate change or evolution, particularly not evolution anymore. I've not looked at polling on that in a while though.
I don't know if private universities are better; I think that public ones however would be much better if the bulk of their costs came from government spending rather than tuition. Tuition used to cover like 20% and government spending the rest; now its reversed. Most states even had effective free college systems and that's been systematically eroded as well.
>>76722031
>Libertarianism-classical liberalism
>purest form of christian values
>purest form of individual freedom
>best defender of constitutional texts including US constitution
>philosophical framework of the western civilization
>economic tenets of the real capitalism and free-markets.
>All the relevant thinkers and leaders were anti-collectivism libertarians
But of course faggot. Libertarians are stupid, racists and utopians. If you are 19 years old you should be sucking cocks and not discussing about political philosophy and human nature. Come back when you´re 30 years old at least, sissyboy.
>>76727366
My point ran right passed you then.
>>76727079
My gf. Just click google.
>>76721344
I never was (a faggot anarchist)
>>76727386
>Private research gives us boner pills, government research gives us the cure for cancer.
okey I just given up on you with this sentence. Its obvious to me that you are just shitposting for whatever purpose.
>>76727469
If you're a Spanish christfag should you be a Catholic fascist anyway? I never called libertarians racist, I was describing my ideological progression.
Do you have any criticisms of anything I actually said? There's no point in my taking cracks at those points you made. Some of them are just empirically wrong; others are value judgments which are irrelevant to libertarianism being right.
I realised the private property is totally illegitimate and that capitalism was straight up exploitation.
>>76727923
Oh okay, I don't see why.
I was being quite serious actually, though hyperbolic about the cancer part. Though it's true nonetheless.
What incentive is there for a private corporation to devote money into costly cancer research? It's easier and more profitable to produce medicine for achieving an erection or reversing hair loss.
>>76721344
When I turned 16.
>>76723723
I would be surprised if 100% of the "sovereign citizens" in the video weren't libertarians.
Probably freshmen yr of highschool so like 14-15
I still agree with libertarianism philosophically. But at the same time, I also understand that if we were to wake up to a libertarian society tomorrow with no borders and no central authority, then complete chaos would ensue. Eventually I said to myself that even though I dislike the fact that society is kept together through force and coercion, I would rather have the relative stability that is obtained through such measures as opposed to the alternative. The idea of a functioning libertarian society is attractive but I have to be realistic and accept that most people do not act rationally and would gladly fuck over their neighbor in order to obtain more resources. This is simply human nature. The same also applies to communism.
>>76729167
most libertarians aren't anarchists but minarchists supporting a tiny and limited government
>>76721344
>>76728017
>implying you can refute a scholastic vision of the property rights using valid non-libertarian concepts
>implying you can understand modern economic and social interaction without marginalist revolution and neoclassical observations
>implying you can deny that libertarian ideology built the most important rights of the modern world: due process and freedom of speech.
You can suck my non-collectivist western white cock anytime, faggot.
>>76728239
Does she have hyperthyroidism or something
