>Obama to the People: "SOME JOBS ARE JUST NOT GOING TO COME BACK DEAL WITH IT"
https://youtu.be/CKpso3vhZtw
he's lying. Obama, Is outsourcing real? He pretends it's not. The jobs that are being outsourced are real jobs... keyboard jobs or otherwise. Actual paying jobs. They aren't outsouring because automation is cheaper. ...even if they are. We need to save all manufacturing of all types....new style jobs or old style jobs.
All jobs
All manufacturing.
>>76226437
Lol you just mad Obama owner Trump and all the redneck retards...lol...
Reminds me of Shillary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksIXqxpQNt0
It's funny how the Democrats have become the anti Labor party and Republicans are now the pro Labor party
>>76226437
Obama: Your fucked.
>>76226437
but if if if if if if if if if if if if if we bring jobs back
>>76226437
Obama forgets that he loves poo in the loo immigrants so fuck you if you plan to work in stem.
>>76226437
See this shit was funny back when those jobs were in manufacturing. I mean who wants to do that shit anyways right? However now all of our six figure starting tech jobs are going overseas too. This is starting to get out of hand.
D
O K I E
K
E
>>76226437
>how are you going to bring them back
>he doesn't have an answer
he's stated multiple times, tax the shit out of companies that outsource jobs.
fucking liberals
>>76226437
Nobody can make textiles in this country competitively. And nobody should *want* to because those jobs suck dick.
Comparative advantage *IS A THING*.
>>76229069
kill yourself kike
you only want that cheap east asian labor.
>trying to negotiate deals with other countries to raise THEIR wages and environmental standards
Pls gib jobs and money to me too mr president obongo
>>76226662
speak english please.
>>76226437
Shit will get messy in the sweatshop countries when suddenly the western world no longer need cheap labor.
>>76229143
No shit? Because that lets products be cheaper so more people can buy more of them?
>>76229069
>no one can effectively compete with slavery so we should just allow it
Not even mentioning that most clothes made in asia are polyester and designed for planned obsolesce.
I can buy a pair of levis that are ruined in less than a year or a pair of US or Japanese jeans a little more that last significantly longer
>>76229069
>implying that skilled labor won't also be shipped over there once their workforce gets educated
>>76229351
>buying jap jeans
weeb get out.
Are there any companies in which someone brought their company back to America like Obama says?
>>76229351
I was unaware making a deal with someone else for them to buy your labor and for you to sell it was slavery. Like... Woah. Mind = blown.
Freedom of association = slavery. Wooooah...
>>76229325
>lets pay whites lower wages so they can live like impoverished Chinese
Kill yourself, kike
>>76226437
It was an inevitable conclusion. Are Americans really that naive to believe their cost of low-skilled labor would compete on the international market? Automation is only going to further exacerbate the employment prospects of low-skilled, unqualified workers. I am not a fan of Obama, but outsourcing was a occurring problem before Obama decided he wanted to be a politician. It's only going to get worse.
>>76229359
That's fine too. Do your best wherever you are. More things and smarter people is a good thing. Economics is not a zero sum game.
>>76226662
Trump is Obama's owner?
what a House Nigro
>>76229495
It is when you live in a country where there is a low standard of living and low wages and you have no choice but to work in sweatshops
again please kill yourself, kike.
>>76229513
i have no problem with that
>>76229513
You don't have to work for a wage you don't like. And nobody has to pay a wage they don't want to pay.
Deal with it Jamal.
>>76229634
You have a choice - you can grow berries on a hillside and sell them. You can fish and sell fish to people. You literally always have a choice - you not liking other choices and preferring others a non-choice does not make, oh Tyrese the Giga-nigga.
>>76229591
>More things and smarter people is a good thing
you mean lower wages for workers and higher profits for companies that outsource
>>76229641
kike
>>76229651
>just starve
>comparing welfare to working for a good wage
kill yourself, kike
The west was built on high wages for white workers
if you're against it you're another rootless cosmopolitan (jew)
>>76229561
The problem is that politicians refuse to do anything to stop it even as more and more of the so-called "new economy" jobs are getting shipped out to India and China.
>>76229433
It's not his fault nipland is one of the few places that still makes decent clothes without insane prices.
>>76229754
You don't have a choice you live in a shitty 3rd world country with a low standard of living
kikes like you should burn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-PlqqK9B9Y
If you are pro outsourcing you're anti white.
>>76229069
It is, but you don't understand it. Here's a fun fact: the guy who came up with the whole concept of comparative advantage said you shouldn't have free trade unless you have full employment.
>>76226437
>any company looking to do business in America must purchase and use American made products
>>76229561
Yeah, what Obama said in this video was really reasonable, even if it's not what the man wanted to hear.
>>76229433
japs make good raw denim
>>76229495
you don't even address the main concern that planned obsolescence is somehow supposed to produce a healthy long term economy
>>76229786
>I rely on other people to not starve so everyone else must
Well since you're a welfare leech it doesn't surprise me you think that's the case.
It's natural progression for nations to transition from manufacturing to service with a basic income. Basically a wealthy elite that own and manage the corporations while the rest of the population services them with supplemental govt provided income.
>>76229884
Grade A senpai. 10/10 white wimminz.
>>76228998
yeah they're blind to obvious shit
>>76229932
You think having substitute goods is unhealthy?
Are you high?
>>76229935
>comparing productive work to welfare
kill yourself, kike
>>76229905
comparative advantage was always bullshit
>>76230005
kill yourself, kike
>>76229982
OK so who will be paying for all that welfare? Because there is no way in hell it will be the wealthy elite.
>>76230111
putting native workers out of business is unhelathy
kill yourself, kike
>>76229069
comparative advantage with the third world doesn't exist. there's NOTHING that they do better, they only do it cheaper.
if you understand value added chains, if they simply do it cheaper, then all it does it cause a trade imbalance, because in turn, there's nothing that they can buy from us which restores the trade balance.
we need to close off non materials trade with third world countries
>>76230123
Shitposting on 4Chan is real productive. Ja ne~
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9STBcacDIM
>>76230255
>comparative advantage with the third world doesn't exist. there's NOTHING that they do better, they only do it cheaper
Try to recall what comparative advantage means.
>>76229884
Wow how come people don't speak like this anymore? All politicians are robotic these days seemingly with the goal to pacify rather than inspire
>>76230304
>quoting Milton "Crashing Chile With No Survivors" Friedman
lmao
>>76230304
kill yourself kike
the US became rich off of protectionism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_System_%28economic_plan%29
leeches like you and jews like you need to be purged
>>76229069
>*IS A THING*.
>namefag
Go back to whatever shithole you crawled out of.
> And nobody should *want* to because those jobs suck dick.
Low level work by non-academic workers will always be needed because you never run out of them.
Instead of 10 year old Bangladeshi children you could hire just uneducated but good workers for a good wage, using more complex machinery than they do in the shit part of the world.
"Competitive advantage" is the acceptance of exploitation for shitty products due to unfair labour differences.
inb4 "b-but you'll pay more"
More people will have work, there will be overall more money in the economy, the extra cost is not a problem.
You have bought the jewish marketing for the globalist agenda.
>>76230352
it means paying shit wages in east asia so that whites in the US can be unemployed.
>>76230398
Any and every protectionist policy throughout all time has hurt the majority of people to benefit a minority.
Being a nigger, I understand why you'd want some gibs me dats though.
>>76230380
His ideas worked great for America though. No idea why third worlders believed that they would help them out however. Sucks to be them I guess.
>>76229982
>>76229982
There's nothing "natural" about basic income.
"Natural" is organisms clawing each other to shreds over limited resources.
Also. Since the housing collapse in 2007 I've had a phrase lodged in my head, and every year it gets louder:
"Controlled descent."
>>76229561
yeah but this is the thing not everyone can educate themselves out of unskilled labor jobs, id rather products get more expensive and be made locally then have half the population unemployed and on welfare/crime because there are no unskilled jobs available to them.
>>76230494
Protectionism made America the richest most prosperous and productive nation on earth
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_School_%28economics%29
outsourcing made us a poor shithole again where the working class is getting raped and the rich gloat about it
people like you need to die.
>>76230466
Life is not a zero sum game. You know what happens when other people make a product and the cost for doing so is less? The product can (and almost always is) be sold at a lower price. You get cheaper goods because of free trade, and other people get access to our goods and gain another market in which they can sell their own goods.
>>76226437
He isn't lying. How are you going to bring back an automated job?
>>76229069
take your "a thing" and shove it up your ass fuckface
>>76230111
yes
additive goods are better.
>>76230494
biggest lie ever.
Yes I'm sure the Vietnamese are so much better off working for 3 cents a day you can shorts for $40. Instead of creating their own consumer class they're perpetually enslaved by globalist trade.
>>76230663
Keep repeating that. It'll be false forever.
Ja ne, nigger-kun~
>>76229982
Except, That's not true.
>>76230352
you're forgetting EXTERNALITIES
there's a point in a supply curve where it is internally beneficial to a supplier to keep his production domestic because even though his margins grow by exporting production, the domestic supply of cash falls for his own goods.
this is called exporting negative externalities, you fucking idiot.
when we send jobs overseas to niggersville, we get NOTHING in return, but THEY get a piece of american fiat supply, which then, in turn, devalues our currency and puts us in debt to foreign held equity.
this is what economists mean when they talk about FREE TRADE FOR DEVELOPED NATIONS ONLY
>>76230568
yeah they worked really great
>>76230694
It is when you remove all production from teh economy
Now we are a debt based economy where all money goes to wall street in the form of interest and rent while productive jobs are moved overseas or flooded with cheap immigrant labor that drives down wages further
your vision is one of debt and poverty
>>76230778
Thanks for proving all anime posters are shitposters
>>76230778
avatarfagging while extolling globalism should be a lifetime ban.
>>76230694
you need to stop reading "econ for dumies" and pick up a book for the CFA.
life isn't zero sum, but ACCOUNT BALANCES ARE ZERO SUM.
sending money overseas causes problems. fucking. period. you autistic asshole
>>76230769
Then why do people buy alternatives? Are their tastes *wrong*?
They objectively are.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3N2sNnGwa4
>>76230748
He is lying, automated jobs aren't the factories moving to Mexico, idiot.
>>76226437
>how are you going to negotiate
>is it a magic wand
our president, everybody
>>76230133
If they won't pay then it's involuntary population control. Forced sterilization. That won't go over well so they'll be forced to pay the basic income or its open revolution.
It'll probably be a bit mixed of the two. Like cheap modified food that supresses the libido and lowers fertility with out outright eleminating it.
>>76230975
the outsourcing policies are wrong you fucking retard
and stop posting that neoliberal kike as if he has anything to say
>>76230820
The existence of externalities doesn't make your insinuation that "cheaper not better" establishes a lack of comparative advantage being instantiated.
You must have failed miserably in the single econ class you tried to take.
>Economically illiterate tripfag
Why are you guys giving him (You)'s again?
>>76231167
It's the summerfags.
>>76231165
It just means you have a bunch of poor low paid workers in east asia instead of high paid workers in the west
>>76230975
>Are their tastes *wrong*?
Yes.
They also eat 5000 calories a day, smoke, abuse alcohol and drugs, enter into thousands of dollars of credit card debit, etc
>>76230849
Show me the country that produces nothing and I'll show you a square circle.
We produce the most value per capita out of any country in the world, and that's has continued and will likely continue going into the near future.
>>76229935
>tripfag animeposter thinks he won't be the first to die of starvation
this is rich
>>76230950
I was unaware posting random anime girls was avatar'ing. You've enlightened me with your intelligence.
>>76226437
They're all the same breed of kike. I sincerely hope Trump ruins all of their lives.
>>76229069
This. Welcome to capitalism
>>76231165
comparative advantage breaks down in the face of negative externalities that dont exist on the balance sheet
okay, so I hire nigger A to pick my cotton for 1/4th the cost of hiring a white guy. now nigger A has the money to shoot my neighbor and rape his wife, and produce nigger b and c. for the moment, it's still cheaper for me to hire him. is that a comparative advantage, or is that the breakdown of society, whereby I hire a MURDERER and give him money which he uses to kill white people ,and I DENY wages to white people?
is that comparative advantage, you fucking cunt? I think that's FINANCING CRIME
>>76230968
You create value. You can literally create value for yourself out of air and dirt.
That's not how trade balances work dipshit~
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9STBcacDIM
I actually am strarting to like Obama, IDK if its just juxtaposition against trump and hillary, perhaps its since he does not need to give a shit about reelection. But everything he says here is 100% common sense and correct. Frictional unemployment is a short term problem, long term unemployment is really low, especially amond skilled workers, the new industries america is taking in to replace shitty factory jobs are much better anyway. Back in the day a Vast majority of jobs were in agriculture, the plow cultivator put all those people out of work, the trumpsters of the world were all up in arms about how we were fucked, and what could they all possibly do now? they didn't have other jobs. Turns out the world progressed, and we had a big innovative boom from all the freed up labour, fast forward a while we repeated the phase with factory labour. We are moving passed it.
Obama also hit the nail on the head with trump not having a solution. He is gonna bring back all the shitty jobs everyone wants, okaaay how? mass protectionism? he never said how, because every possible solution has serious negative consequences he doesn't want you to consider.
>>76229069
With enough manpower and enough disregard for life and property, a country could destroy another's well-being through free trade. Comparative advantage is only relevant when your people have something better to do with their time. We don't. We have too many people, and we're bringing in more to prop up failed welfare schemes. The same welfare schemes being the only reason people are willing to tolerate the loss of job opportunities so far. The internationals will happily screw their future over for profits now. They have other markets with much looser standards, they aren't bound by borders, they no longer hold any nationalist sentiment.
>>76231539
A Fucking Leaf
>>76231239
Yes some do. But they buy substitute goods from people, and those people benefit from the trade. And those same people at least *believe* they benefit from the trade, or else they wouldn't generally *MAKE* the trade.
>>76231336
>implying I don't tend my own garden and have my own chickens
l e l
>>76231614
great argument.
here is your (you), show your mom, maybe she will put it on the fridge!
>>76229069
>And nobody should *want* to because those jobs suck dick.
they suck but people need to survive. Taking those jobs away just turn people to welfare
>>76231462
What negative externalities are there when I'm a better writer than my editor, but also a better editor, but I'm *more of* a better writer than my editor than I am a better editor and so use my time writing instead? Where is the negative externality Carlos?
>>76231654
>encouraging societal decay
disgusting
>>76231539
>he doesn't want you to consider.
like what?
>>76231555
>a country could destroy another's well-being through free trade
Expound.
>>76231863
>nonresponses
K e k
You're fucking brilliant m8. I bet you even graduated high school top 60%!
>>76229634
Fuck off bernie, what's your solution?
Take away their jobs, let them starve to death, then pat yourself on the back and say how great you are for ending cheap labour?
>>76231788
Nobody in this country is in danger of not surviving unless they isolate themselves and have no idea what they're doing.
> Thinks that paying Americans minimum wage for the same shitty jobs will somehow solve all of our problems
The delusion is real.
LIE : "jobs are automated, your job is vanishing because of technology"
Complete bullshit
https://youtu.be/Y3ttxGMQOrY
>>76231462
we account for that externality in our system retard.
It's called the justice system, we discourage this via locking up murderers for life. Further more, why the fuck do you need a job to kill people? if you take the job, if anything isnt he more likely to kill since he needs the money.
ALso not really an externality cause it is unrelated to the actual transaction.
>>76231295
The US produces debt
>>76232032
or do what the west did during the Industrial Revolution, pay high wages.
>>76232120
are you in college? just wondering?
>>76232014
>nonresponse
>allowing people to poison themselves because they think it's good is fine as long as they think it's fine
literally societal decay
>>76232032
>Caring about the wellbeing of foreigners.
Great flag.
>>76232216
Buying cheap jeans is societal decay.
You are a sparkling mind.
>>76226437
other jobs will be coming back
pic related
>>76232368
>strawmen arguments coming from a tripfag
shocked 2bh
>>76231885
Insane increase in cost of final goods, huge losses in total surplus. Burden on tax payer to keep factories afloat, decrease in supply of labour for other unskilled positions, tariffs, trade wars, being left out of international trade agreements, less foreign interest in the US dollar, a stagnent economy from dedicating such a large portion of our workforce to such mundane tasks.
some of these can be traded off for the other, but you are gonna need to accept some of them.
>>76231836
the negative externality in this scenario is that your editor is a third world sweatshop worker instead ofyour white neighbor, and that third world worker then uses his wages to build a bomb, and kill me
>>76232189
our justice system which gives more money to criminals than to victims.
got it.
I wish I had a system that gave money to my allies, allowed me to kill my enemies without repurcussion...
I think that's called a warlord system
>>76226662
Damnit Paco, you have been here for how long now and you don't know English yet?
>>76231022
Not all jobs are being sent overseas. He even said that by specifying that factory jobs that required 30,000 workers only now require 10,000. This is due to automation, not outsourcing.
>>76226437
>denies outsourcing is real
He straight up said that some of the jobs are gone and won't be coming back though. are you delusional?
>>76232456
Read your own posts - haven't strawmanned shit. I don't exactly expect self-awareness from a mong drone.
>>76232194
>pay high wages.
okay, and how do you plan on doing that? removal of capitilism? their wages are decided where supply and demand meet. Businesses will move elsewhere if you increase their wages, costs can increase for consumers, and businesses can afford less workers, hurting tonnes of poor people.
>>76231924
They can outcompete every unskilled field. We still have a large number of unskilled workers who will not realistically obtain the skills for white collar work in their remaining lifetimes and even if they did it would only drive wages down in those sectors as well.
You know damn well the drop in prices won't make up for this because the Chinese live like filth despite working for next to nothing.
The reality of global economics is not lower prices for higher quality of life, it's everyone being forced to live at the lowest level that a productive civilization will tolerate. It's equilibrium. It's bringing the successful west down to the level of the Chinese and Indians because we had the nerve not to breed uncontrollably and destroy the value of our labor. Any increase in global GDP and quality of life comes at our expense.
>Trump has no solution
>wants to force China to do shit and typically same stance as Trump
Yeah, were headed towards a civil war. It's not the issues, the Trotskys and patriots can't stand each other anymore.
>>76232032
Hence the natural progression to a basic income. The people will be free to pursue higher education and get better jobs while those who don't have the mental capabilities are subsidized. We already do that more or less now. We just don't feel comfortable socially declaring it out loud.
>>76232479
Are you high or something? You're not saying anything on point at all.
>>76232619
are you in college?
>>76226437
Pretty much destroyed Obama's last hopes of appealing to black people who lost their jobs to outsourcing. On the bright side, Detroit's going to burn down even faster.
>>76232630
industrialization results in high wages you fucking retard. Ever heard of the industrial revolution?
the only thing keeping wages low in East Asia is outsourcing.
>>76232218
He was the one virtue signalling though.
>>76232479
>our justice system which gives more money to criminals than to victims.
Fuck I know right, remember when that guy was sentenced to $1million dollars and a brand new yacht for first degree murder?
>I wish I had a system that gave money to my allies, allowed me to kill my enemies without repurcussion...
Move to africa.
>>76232648
They can't actually, given most unskilled labor requires proximity. You can't have someone in China clean your sink in the United States. You can't have someone in Taiwan move boxes in your warehouses.
>>76232788
Obongo doesn't give a shit about niggers. They will support him no matter what because he is "one of them" even though he really isn't. Like most upper class half-blacks he spends all of his time avoiding non-elite niggers and only pretends to care about them when the camera is on.
>>76232817
Shut the fuck up
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/19/health/cash-for-criminals-richmond-california/
>>76226437
So why can't we pushleigslature that limits automation?
>>76232494
it's funny but most students in ESL are actually mexicans born here who only speak english. some 70% of them don't even speak spanish.
mexicans are literally just less capable of speaking than whites.
when you examine it from a linguistics angle, mexican spanish has a compressed information band where it drops/omits information conveyed in castilian spanish, which results in their "dialect" or ebonics. when those mexicans come here and their kids learn english, they also drop nformational content in their language. it probably relates to the processing power of their brains.
this is an important issue in economics because if these people cannot be made to understand high information content language, they cannot be trained to do many jobs.
this is actualyl a pretty important question being teased out by fortune 500 companies right now. the question is: how do you teach epople incapable of understanding a sentence longer than 10 words, to do a job which requires them to be able to read sentences longer than 10 words?
english fluency is a nonstarter. they ONLY speak english. so what's the issue, then? neurological capacity? lowering the information content in technical writing (is it even possible?) breaking down things into arbitrary smaller steps (which leads to higher error.)
>>76232804
I think you are confused, the insustrial revolution was because high wages in the UK couldnt compete with Indian labour prices, and protectionism almost killed the country, industrialization to save money was made out of necessity to survive. Asian economies will advance on their own thanks to industrialization and wages will increase, so that they get their shit made in africa or made by robots, as their workers have moved to far in value to be viable in sweatshops. But I still don't get your point? are you agreeing its a natural process? or are you saying their is some sort of magical solution? also east asia is WHERE it is getting outsourced to.
>>76232630
The guy you're speaking to is quite literally retarded senpai. That or it's a strong bait posing as a poorly disguised bait.
>>76232876
On the other hand just about any tech job can be outsourced to China.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/17/business/us-outsource-job-china/
>>76232910
Yeah, comparatively that small portion of blacks with an IQ over 95 doesn't make up for the hordes of apes abusing welfare to buy shit they don't need.
>>76233141
lol still no asnwer? are you in college?
i get this feeling your first year in .
wait ti ll you get to the real world you are going to get a srs surprise
>>76233119
>I think you are confused, the insustrial revolution was because high wages in the UK couldnt compete with Indian labour prices
No you fucking moron. The Industrial Revolution happened because intelligent Brits invented better technology that was far more productive than the old methods of textile production.
As a result production increased and so did wages. Wages increase with production "unless" you begin outsourcing or bringing in cheap labor to drive down labor costs.
>>76233142
You can technically outsource you janitorial work too. You can pay for your janitor to fly over from Vietnam every day to wash your sink and then fly back home.
There's a reason people are making the decisions they are, and why we produce what we do and why other people produce what they do.
>>76232817
you're an idiot. the main feedback loop in play here is that you think VALUE ADDED in the chain occurs at the site of production because of lower wages.
so that means you think if we QUADRUPLED the number of niggers in america, because they're low wage in the supply chain, we would QUADRUPLE value added.
this is retarded. you're retarded.
value added happens at the site of the individual, EVN IF it's higher wage. if we quadrupled that supply of iq 140 individuals, we'd have a better economy.
this is a simple mathematical proof.
>>76232804
the industrial revolution initially drove wages down in most sectors
factories and machines deskilled artisans and allowed women and children to compete with men since the tasks were so simple... you're not just competing with humans but also machines
early industrialization was horrible
>>76232975
>http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/19/health/cash-for-criminals-richmond-california/
so they gave them money NOT to commit crimes.
CAn you read? furthermore if it works it works, if it's cheaper than paying tonnes of money into less effective policing why not? giving money to victims instead might make your tummy feel better, but I care more about stopping the crime. Having said that hood nigguhs shooting hood nigguhs is none of my concern, I say just wall of american favillas and let them have at it.
>>76233272
Why would I answer personal questions that have no relevance whatsoever to the discussion?
You can read the archives if you care so much.
>>76229561
The problem is that every company wants to commerce and sell their shit in America but aren't willing to pay the people in america a living wage and give them jobs since they can outsource works to cheaper places.
Shit I am in whiteland because IBM send me to train some argies that will replace the US based team. And as such they are doing shit ton of more outsourcing to other countries as well.
But the clients of IBM are mostly american companies. This is getting out of hand either we kill globalism and go full national socialist or we are going to suffer a lot in the future.
>>76233119
Asia particularly China is fucked because they have a population of 4 men for every woman. I wouldn't be surprised if they engineered a war to dispose of their surplus disenfranchised men.
>>76233396
>the industrial revolution initially drove wages down
But the increase in production increased living standards and wages so you are talking out your ass
>>76233408
They are effectively being paid because they committed a crime in the past
I thought you faggot libertarians believed in "moral hazards", but I guess not.
>>76226437
You sound both innumerate and illiterate. I sincerely hope you are still in high school.
>>76233119
the natural process during the industrial revolution was that wages fell, but that cost of goods fell by FAR MORE.
a good example would be the price of gold or land in japan or the UK during their industrialization periods. a factory worker made LESS wages in terms of gold or land but their abilityt o consume consumer goods went up.
we STILL see this happening today. land is getting more expensive, as are a lot of base commodities or access to institutions. the DIFFERENCE is that today we have a consumer economy, and the fed things boosting consmer prices will help. by boosting consumer prices they'd offsetting the beneficial deflation in prices for non-equity holders that historicalyl existed
>>76230494
Fuck you. Libertarians are fucking cowards who suck nigger dick
>>76233408
you think the step that the money enters int othe value added chain is irrelevant?
how can people like you even exist?
>>76230380
What is happening at Chile? I thought Venezuela was the shithole of this subcontinent.
>>76233322
increased output just decreases the unit value of your product, that's why corporations try to scheme to keep supply low... also there's no real tendency for wages to increase along with increases in productivity
>>76233838
The only one who sucks cock is you when you beg government to fuck you in the ass, or else fuck other people in ass for your gibs me dats.
>>76233322
>The Industrial Revolution happened because intelligent Brits invented better technology that was far more productive than the old methods of textile production.
Yes, because Brititain put tariffs on indian goods, and britisih labour cost to much...
you should really read a history book. I'm a free trade advocate admitting the one time protectionism worked.
>Wages increase with production "unless" you begin outsourcing or bringing in cheap labor to drive down labor costs.
You are reffering to the economies of scale. marginal revenue increase, but that does not necessarily mean wages increase. they could, could not, it really all depends. In theory it should increase because to make more you also need more labour, and thus shifing your demand for labour, meaning you need to pay a higher wage to get the amount of workers you need. But that is not necessarily a good thing in anyway either, the cost of the goods can increase if marginal cost of labour increases more than the marginal revenue. ADitionally you will be hurting other industries, and yadda yadda yadda. also you treat outsourcing as if trade is unnatural, and protectionism is the natural state, that's silly. You should understand you are argueing about ARTIFICIALLY increasing wages, by ARTIFICIALLY limiting trade/ limiting capitilism.
At any rate it isn't that simple, there is more than one industry in America. Even in the US, by worldwide standards you are reasonably educated, and hitting a button all day is a shitty tedious job, so you have to pay for the guys skillset, and his willingness to hit a button all day, thats well BEYOND world equilibrium for manual labour already.
"innovation" "clean energy" "nanotechology" what a fucking meme
>>76233871
the entire continent and race is subhuman. they just sometimes differ at the stage of collapse that any given country is in, and they gloat that temporarily, they are "better"
>>76233879
come on now, stop being stupid.
companies use their surplus capital from their sales to invest in new ventures or invest in equities to increase the efficiency of capital allocation, which is precisely why capitalism never stopped improving.
idiots focus on the process of an individual factory and don't see how it can make things better ad infnitum without identifying WHERE in the process of capitalism the improvement comes from. it comes from management of moral hazard and capital efficiency, which NEVER stops abruptly with some arbitrary supply curve threshold/facotry
>>76233879
No one is this stupid. Surely not.
A fucking. Leaf.
>>76233879
>there's no real tendency for wages to increase along with increases in productivity
There was until faggots like you started outsourcing/importing cheap labor
>>76234234
The Brits wanted cheap Indian cotton you fucking moron
>You should understand you are argueing about ARTIFICIALLY increasing wages, by ARTIFICIALLY limiting trade
Because that's what you want when you are dealing with 3rd world shitholes
This is hilarious.
Capitalism is bringing wealth distribution on a global scale, something the commies have cried about across at least 3 centuries for, and the result is pushing right wing people into defending socialist ideas.
>>76233614
>"moral hazards"
When did I come out as a heartbleed lib/trumpster?
I don't give a fuck about your feel feels.
>>76233853
>you think the step that the money enters int othe value added chain is irrelevant?
Not sure what you are implying? I can see why it would have a negative impact on incentives, since people could see if they become dangerous they could get paid not to be, etc. I lack the information on whether or not the program is efficient or not or if it even works. But if it works then why not?
>>76234020
lol,
typical libertarian, assumes I love the state.
The free trade you speak of is state enforced, and manipulated by Jew bakers.
Unfortunately, your utilitarian outlook on life only accounts for the preference of maximizing money.
The same companies that outsource lobby for more local regulation, more rules.
You never take into consideration that people would have a preference to buy goods and services in their local community, even if it meant paying slightly more.
We don't have free trade today, we have controlled trade.
>>76234463
>Capitalism is bringing wealth distribution on a global scale
To a few bankers while the world on average is becoming more unequal.
http://reports.weforum.org/outlook-global-agenda-2015/top-10-trends-of-2015/1-deepening-income-inequality/
People aren't getting higher wages they are getting higher debts
>>76234275
Nah, argies aren't that bad if it weren't for the fact that they are taking american jobs. I thought this was going to be like a warzone or something really bad but this place is actually nice and the people are friendly and fun and food is great. It is opening my mind to visit more of South America once this assignment is over or at least visit other places of Argentina before leaving.
>>76230380
Chile is the only country in south america that is not shit.
>>76234540
If you support protectionism you necessarily love BGC, shilly-boy.
I'm a moral absolutist - there's nothing utilitarian about my outlook on life.
Ja ne~
>>76234526
It's common sense you fucking retard
you are rewarding criminals for killing people. How are you this goddamn stupid?
>>76234687
If you oppose protectionism you are necessarily a globalist kike
>>76234625
This is happening at the same time that poverty is going down and it's due to the fact that governments and central control are rising at the same time global markets are developing.
If not for growing governments, poverty would be lowering even faster.
>>76234625
Third worlders are getting richer though. Developed nations are just stagnating. No idea why our politicians are letting this happen.
>>76234771
Because valuing freedom and prosperity is "globalist".
Oh how deluded you people are.
Keep. Sucking. Boyo.
>>76233879
That would be an accurate statement if executives weren't still making money hand over fist. You think that extra money came from nowhere?
Certain wages DO increase. Just not usually the workers unless they have some sort of collective bargaining ability and no competition from cheap international labor.
>>76229651
You do have to work for a wage you don't like if you want to eat and not be jailed for lack of health insurance
Outsourcing means you have to be on welfare but can afford a 40 inch 200 dollar flatscreen and get a 500 dollar iPhone for 20 bucks if you sign a two year contract.
It has it's pros and cons. You can't afford to eat without food stamps and you live in an income based rental but it's full of the top of the line gadgets and technology.
>>76235003
No you don't. You can produce your own shit and sell it. You can produce your own shit and *eat it*.
>>76234687
yes there is.
You love state enforced free trade because it supposedly generates the most money, is the most efficient.
You are the kind of asshole who doesn't understand why someone would bake a cake instead of buying one from a baker. Even if it was the least efficient way to do the job, it all comes down to preferences.
If the State did not exist, we would not have mass immigration into the US, nor would we have such a trade deficient.
Sorry, but we can't just keep printing the reserve currency and buying shit. The US will have to make shit.
>>76230694
Life isn't but economics pretty much is.
Checkmate atheist
>>76234906
>>76234865
They aren't
Common people are getting more in debt, and wealth inequality is getting worse.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/feb/08/whats-holding-back-world-economy-joseph-e-stiglitz
>>76234977
It's only "freedom" for a few multinational corporations to destroy and impoverish nations.
I bet you support TPP just like you support NAFTA.
>>76234699
did you read the article? are you illiterate or something?
They were literally rewarding them FOR NOT killing people. I even acknowledged the concern for if this sippery sloped into people becoming "dangerous" so they could be paid not to commit crimes.
I don;t know if it works or not. My guess is you don't either but just decided upon reading the headline (which Im not sure you read either, based on your lack of understanding of what they were doing)
>>76235238
I'm an anarchist bro. I don't love state enforced *anything*.
You can do *whatever the fuck you want* so long as you keep your hands to your fucking self.
>>76235249
Economics isn't a zero sum game.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-sum_game
>>76226437
he means some jobs aren't going to come back due to automation, which is completely correct
>>76235269
I don't support anything government. You keep sucking though.
>>76235203
It takes resources and capital and land to do that
Land you have to pay taxes on
Seeds, dirt, chickens you need to acquire, feed and water.. you can't buy things if you're broke
Tripfags are so stupid. Put your ego away for a minute.
>>76235269
This, I want to go back to the good old days, where everyone was so rich they could afford a carphone and there was no 4chan to discuss this on! America was so much better in those days!
Also sidenote the poor are getting richers, just at a slower rate than the rich. So if everyone is getting richer, why do you care about "muh gap"
>>76235320
Then you should realize that Trump is a means to in end.
>>76235319
>I even acknowledged the concern for if this sippery sloped into people becoming "dangerous" so they could be paid not to commit crimes
then you're an idiot for thinking it's a good idea.
>>76235407
yes it is
jobs that go to China means people are not unemployed here.
>>76235501
Oh another enlightened ancap
how special.
>>76235269
Wealth "inequality" is the latest sham, the only thing that matters is your standard of living, a poor person now has an objectively better life than 100 years ago, the poor and the rich have never lived more alike in history.
>>76234275
>companies use their surplus capital from their sales to invest in new ventures or invest in equities to increase the efficiency of capital allocation, which is precisely why capitalism never stopped improving.
What really happens, since the Friedmanites convinced corporate America of the importance of share holder value, is none of that goes back into reinvestment or the real economy but gets cycled inflating the value of stocks and real-estate to enrich a particular sector of the economy
>>76234461
What happened in the post war era was an anomaly, wages and productivity moved together because of high unionization and full employment policies... monetarism became orthodoxy in the late 70s and Friedmanites said full employment policy was the cause of stagflation
>>76235547
>comparing technology to the structure of the economy
kill yourself.
Debt levels and real estate prices have skyrocketed while wages are stagnant
You're a fucking moron if you think that's a good thing.
>>76235502
It takes you being able to move your body, pick up seeds, and put them somewhere they'll grow. Or else fishing. Or else foraging.
If you're going to tell me how oppressive it is that you might have to move your body in order to not die, I don't have much left to say to you.
>>76226437
Why?
[iffing intensifies]
>>76235553
I'm a moral absolutist. Ends don't justify the means.
>>76232032
Why are we responsible for foreigners?
>>76235407
Yeah it is. Prove me wrong by explaining how it isnt. There are static resources on the globe and a set carrying capacity for the maximum amount of people and biomass. These things cannot change. All economics derive from that, and even if you ignore the natural factor and focus on mental mathematical gymnastics you cannot escape that reality. Suck my dick while you're at it.
>>76235637
standard of livings are decreasing due to higher debt and costs of living
>>76235638
>muh anomaly
Right because nothing is better than bombing an entire continent.
>monetarism became orthodoxy in the late 70s and Friedmanites said full employment policy was the cause of stagflation
In reality it was caused by the energy crisis started by the Israeli/Arab conflict
but you bought neoliberalism because you're a good goy.
>>76235602
So. Fucking. Stupid. This has to be bait. You are a master ruseman - disguising your bait as obvious bait in a bid to make people think "there's no way someone would be dumb enough to make such a poor bait; he must be for real", when in reality it was just an intentional ploy all along.
You enjoy that cock Tyrone.
>>76235678
Fishing licence costs money, you can't forage on state land that's trespassing, you can't farm on land you don't own.
You're either not trying or a time traveller from medieval europe. What you are saying is not possible in the modern world. You need to go outside every now and again.
>>76235150
Basically.
Cheaper goods, less real wages.
vs
Expensive goods, more real wages.
>>76235880
not an arguement
>>76235723
Many economic situations are not zero-sum, since valuable goods and services can be created, destroyed, or badly allocated in a number of ways, and any of these will create a net gain or loss of utility to numerous stakeholders. Specifically, all trade is by definition positive sum, because when two parties agree to an exchange each party must consider the goods it is receiving to be more valuable than the goods it is delivering. In fact, all economic exchanges must benefit both parties to the point that each party can overcome its transaction costs, or the transaction would simply not take place.
There is some semantic confusion in addressing exchanges under coercion. If we assume that "Trade X", in which Adam trades Good A to Brian for Good B, does not benefit Adam sufficiently, Adam will ignore Trade X (and trade his Good A for something else in a different positive-sum transaction, or keep it). However, if Brian uses force to ensure that Adam will exchange Good A for Good B, then this says nothing about the original Trade X. Trade X was not, and still is not, positive-sum (in fact, this non-occurring transaction may be zero-sum, if Brian's net gain of utility coincidentally offsets Adam's net loss of utility). What has in fact happened is that a new trade has been proposed, "Trade Y", where Adam exchanges Good A for two things: Good B and escaping the punishment imposed by Brian for refusing the trade. Trade Y is positive-sum, because if Adam wanted to refuse the trade, he theoretically has that option (although it is likely now a much worse option), but he has determined that his position is better served in at least temporarily putting up with the coercion. Under coercion, the coerced party is still doing the best they can under their unfortunate circumstances, and any exchanges they make are positive-sum.
>>76235880
people are tired of having their jobs outsourced and their wages lowered, they're tired of people like you that say they should "live with it"
hopefully in the future people like you will be hung from lamp posts.
>>76235890
So your complaint is against the state not allowing you to use resources they have no claim to then.
Welcome to anarchism!
If you can't afford to live why not just voluntarily go to jail. It's essentially a labor camp but with health care and guaranteed food.
I willingly went into the mental hospital on MHMRs dime to get my bronchitis taken care of. Just told my family I was letting it get bad on purpose to die and I got free health care out of it. Had a lady go in same time as me to get her teeth fixed for free. No bills no debt.
>>76236031
And you lose jobs when you outsource them to East Asia for lower wages
it's not a difficult concept
>>76236086
People are more tired of people who *ACTUALLY* think what you're typing (but are in fact just baiting with) completely misunderstanding everything about how trade works.
>>76236118
>muh NAP
>>76236256
That's why there's been this mass movement to ancap ideology right?
>>76235676
well standard of living, the indicator that actually matters is effected by technology. debt levels in the US are getting a bit much sure, real estate prices are increasing for several reasons. Both unrelated to this discussion, and I can't think of anyone I give a fuck about that works for "wages." if you can't finish Highschool, then a life of renting doesn't seem so unreasonable.
>>76235722
We are not.
The far left says free trade is bad and should be abandoned because we benefit and foreigners are hurt by it.
The far right says free trade is bad and should be abandoned because foreigners benefit and we are hurt by it.
Both are objectively wrong. it's mutually beneficial, that's why it exists as "free trade" not "coerced into trade" if it doesn't benefit you, you don;t make the deal, if chinese labour makes you worse off, don't use it. If sweatshop jobs make you worse off, don't take them.
>>76236186
"Jobs" aren't a good. You can't "lose jobs" - you can only not be utilizing your labor. If you "want a job", do something Jamal.
Why do I keep responding? Are you the master ruseman?
>>76236186
true that's why I went to college.
Google Frictional unemployment it will blow your mind.
Turns out the economy is a dynamic thing, and different industries come and go.
>>76236345
No, since it doesn't make empty promises to immoral retarded sheep who can only think with their dicks and feels.
I'm gonna stop responding now. I am full of bait.
>>76236118
Uh no my complaint is that you need to work to earn a living, and because of that, there are plenty of times where you can find yourself working for an insufficient wage for the work you do. That was the original thing you and I were talking about before you jasmd ADHD tangents all over the place... Like saying I could go forage for food and become a peasant or some dumb shit. You sound like a fucking highschool kid who just took his first economics and philosophy courses.
>>76236497
You can work at *anything*. Mow people's lawns. Grow strawberries in the woods.
You can literally *do anything*. You just don't *LIKE* those options. Well here's a memo - reality doesn't cater to your preferences.
>>76226437
>YOU DIDN'T BUILD THAT
>I KNOW YOU DIDN'T BUILD THAT BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPER TO GET 1.5 BILLION CHINESE AND INDIANS TO BUILD THAT
>I'M NOT GONNA LET YOU BUILD THAT, WHY DON'T YOU WANT A FREE MARKET?
>CHINA DOESN'T HAVE A FREE MARKET EITHER BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULDN'T
>>76236361
>debt levels in the US are getting a bit much sure
Debt the entire world over is getting far too high.
>real estate prices are increasing for several reasons.
Due to the deregulation of wall street (cheap credit) that cunts like you desire and the mass immigration you promote.
>>76236364
>You can't "lose jobs"
Holy fuck you're too retarded to exist
yes you can lose jobs if every job goes to cheap east asian labor you are effectively making millions of Americans unemployed.
>>76236430
>haha I escaped the decline in wages so fuck everyone else
truly enlightened
>>76236489
yes that's right you're much smarter than those blue collar rubes. They don't even know that technological singularity is coming. What losers.
Daily Reminder that the Earth's human population currently cannot sustain itself and if jobs keep going missing and automation becomes more and more a thing, there will be a natural shift to kill off a large portion of the population at some point.
You will witness the Black Death 2.0 in your lifetime.
>>76236629
yes work these low wages jobs we flooded with Mexicans
can't afford a family or a high standard of living?
Well fuck you
That's a real winning strategy. Have fun with that.
>>76236031
If all trade is positive sum, then why did NAFTA result in the destruction of the small Mexican farmer, the collapse and subsequent defaulting of the peso, and the vampirism remittance system we see today?
All trade is zero sum, but perspective and subjectivity hide that fact.
>>76235829
>everyone, even the poor have smartphones, cars, Internet, clean water and food
>constant breakthroughs are making these better, more affordable or easier to create
>worse standard of living
So how much did you pay for your liberal arts and gender studies degree again?
>>76236364
Why do you use so much memespeak?
>>76236782
those Mexican farmers deserve to go out of business because "muh free market is god" pbuh
>>76236843
>comparing technology to economic structure
You have no idea what you're talking about.
workers are soaked in high debt high cost economies now with no room for savings and investment. No one can "move up" in the world anymore due to debt. But you think that's ok because "muh Iphones"
>>76236782
So when I put a computer together, and you buy it from me, I don't actually gain by wanting and getting your money more than the computer. And you don't actually gain by wanting and getting the computer over the money. We didn't gain anything. Yeah. That's why we made the trade. To get nothing.
>>76236893
Look at that guy's fucking posts man. It's not like they're not all over the thread.
Damn these whitu with high wage on welfare replies are delicious.
>>76236843
Would you rather have a smartphone and internet or your own house, two cars and a family on one income?
>>76236629
Again, you do have to work for a wage you don't like if you want to eat and not be jailed for lack of health insurance. You said "you don't have to work for a wage you don't like" which is really not true. If you don't like your wage, you can look for another job and hope that you find one that pays better, or petition for a raise. But most likely you WILL have to keep working at that wage.
You le baitmaster meme
>>76236743
You're not entitled to a family or high living. We have too many people already and China is fine living in factory dorms 6 to a room. You either live it or check out with a rope for a neck tie.
Welcome to the new standard
>>76236782
first of all, correlation =/= causation.
Second of all For the hundredth time, economies are dynamic, Industries come and go. there was a time where 90% of the population worked in agricutlure, a lot of those poor sods lost their jobs, and WE ARE BETTER OFF FOR IT. frictional unemployment is not a serious problem, different industries become more important than others etc etc.
Trade as zero sum is stupid. Its a no fucking brainer. If you took out all the raw metals in my cellphone and all the silicon etc. It would be worth fuck all to me, I am much happier with the cellphone, value was CREATEd when it was transformed into that.
Second of all comparative advantage and diminshing returns on utility. Sony makes cellphones, I make IDK lets say food. Sony has millions of cellphones, more then they have employees, having 2 or three cellphones is of no value, where as they need food for substenance, I can't even make my own cellphone, but make more food than I can consume for myself, by trading my food for a cellphone I lose little utility, the food was to go bad anyway, they lose nothing they didn't need the cellphone, gain a lot they need to live. VALUE IS CREATED.
IF sony made half as many cellphones and started making their own food, they would have Half less cellphones AND less food. I would not be able to make my own cellphone anyway. So value is created in the exchange.
>>76236782
If you are arguing that trade is zero sum you are literally arguing against the entirety of formal economic theory of all stripes except for maybe center/periphery theory which led to absolutely devastating consequences for the countries which were pink enough to actually try it.
>>76226437
>comments disabled
Typical PBS
>>76237303
You literally don't.
Literally. I could go out and live innawoods - right now - and wouldn't have to work for anyone else, and if no one knew where I was they'd likely never find me. So
>you do have to work for a wage you don't like if you want to eat and not be jailed for lack of health insurance
is an *ENTIRELY* untrue statement.
>>76237333
>You're not entitled to a family or high living
That's the ideal America was built on
If you are against good wages and want to turn us into an Eastern European/ East Asian/Latin America style shithole you should kill yourself
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_School_%28economics%29
>>76237003
>Russian cucking for a kike
some things never change
>>76237527
I was being sarcastic stating out loud the current desire our govt and their buyers have for us.
>>76226662
>Shitposting and shilling outsourced to India
>>76236965
Yes it IS okay because "muh iphones".
The only measure of poverty that matters is asking whether or not the person has access to sufficient water and food so they don't die from lack of bodily needs.
The only difference between the poor and the rich in first world countries is that they have less luxuries, they still have access to everything rich people have on a basic level as opposed to olden times where only the ultra rich could own a car or know how to read and write, or have a doctor tend his ills.
This is the blatant truth and only somebody "college educated" could be stupid enough to deny it.
>>76237729
Oh
I honestly can't tell the difference between sarcasm and actual globalists
>>76237768
see
>>76237220
>>76237768
>only educated people dispute an alleged fact therefore it is wrong
>this is the best you can come up with
Why do you participate in these threads if you, by your own admission, know nothing about these issues?
>>76237220
That's a stupid argument, everybody wants more, the difference is that smart people make good decisions and get there while poor people who stay poor don't.
>>76237900
It's clear that you can't deny the truth pinko scum, go to your safe space where you can ignore facts that upset your feelings
