For all things Christian
Catholics and Protestants alike are welcome to discuss theology. Try to be polite.
Atheists also welcome, but try to be constructive.
Pastebin for believers and curious folk.
http://pastebin.com/xMQ9wAwW
Friday, June 4, 2016
Liturgical Year C, Cycle II
Readings for Mass
First Reading: Ezekiel 34:11-16
Responsorial Psalm: Psalms 23:1-3, 3-4, 5, 6
Second Reading: Romans 5:5-11
Gospel: Luke 15:3-7
Today's Rosary: The Sorrowful Mysteries
Good Scenes to watch
>Jesus Anime
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d-uB0vaoQo [Embed]
>Jesus of Nazareth Sermon on the Mount:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDCbJ4vnMNg [Embed]
>Jesus chases Jews out of the Temple
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEtBs6j7QgU [Embed]
>Jesus gives sight to the Blind....and takes sight from those who can see
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY7vamVg99E [Embed]
>Roman Centurion has more faith than anyone in Israel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNLSBjYDPko [Embed]
>Ben Hur scenes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVlf7OiiTJE [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbt2UUthWg0 [Embed]
I LOVE YOU JESUS.
Yaaaaayyyyy the more the better
I get so hard thinking about Jesus Christ my lord and savior
Pleeeeaaaseeee, make more!
i bet you people don't even go to church
Why did we let the wop take over these threads...
>God's Word is so divine, we are not able to see it as God does. That's why a person can read a single chapter in the bible several times, and discover something new in it each time.
And you might be wrong each time. The point is, everyone will read everything differently. God is absolute and there is only Truth in him. By coming up with different interpretations and understanding of his nature, you prove that you are wrong about Him. If you saw the Truth, you wouldn't have different versions of it.
>We aren't God.
ok
>We aren't able to just absorb 100% of the Word of God in to our spirit without trying
This does not make any sense. You don't absorb the words, you absorb the Spirit. The Bible is a book, even though it has the Truth in it, it does not give you the Spirit. Baptism does.
>God is working in all of His children as best as we allow Him to, and we are all at different levels of understanding and progress, and all different.
If His children have a different understanding of Him, you imply that God is lying to them. Which is absolutely ludicrous.
>God sent prophets because people went off-track
Who assures you that you are not off-track then?
>Then it was all written down for future generations
But when they went off-track it was already written. The Torah existed already and yet people went off-track. What makes you think you are not off-track to? Clearly just reading the Bible is not enough to avoid that.
>Did Aaron have 'priesthood' infallibility? No.
Never claimed that
>So why does the pope?
It is not the Pope as person who does, it is the Magisterium. The Holy Spirit simply protects it from teaching error. In all other instances the Pope is just as wrong as anyone else.
>>76121367
Nope. Literally google that shit up. No matthew
>You don't believe that Christ will come as the Lion later?
yes, has nothing to do with what I said
>The Catholic church didn't exist until 393 AD
This is completely wrong, the Church Fathers rebuke you
>Clement of Alexandria
>[T]he blessed Peter, the chosen, the preeminent, the first among the disciples, for whom alone with himself the Savior paid the tribute [Matt. 17:27], quickly grasped and understood their meaning. And what does he say? "Behold, we have left all and have followed you" [Matt. 19:2 7, Mark 10:28] (Who is the Rich Man That is Saved? 21:3-5 [A.D. 200]).
>Cyprian
>With a false bishop appointed for themselves by heretics, they dare even to set sail and carry letters from schismatics and blasphemers to the Chair of Peter and to the principal church [at Rome], in which sacerdotal unity has its source" (Epistle to Cornelius [Bishop of Rome] 59:14 [A.D. 252]).
I could post thousands of quotes but there is no need. What matters is that you are full of shit
Hello, everyone. I have no denomination but still consider myself a Christian. Is this valid or do I need to stick with a particular denomination to practice my religion effectively?
>>76122871
>The Holy Spirit simply protects it from teaching error
Does the Holy Spirit want someone who represents almost 2 billion Christians to bow down and kiss Muslim invader feet?
The pope is not infallible. Neither was Adam, Moses or anyone else in the bible.
Don't you understand? Men die, man comes from dust.
What do you think would happen if the pope was the leader of the Israelites in the wilderness, and then invited the Canaanites in to the camp and gathered everyone around and then washed their leader's feet and kissed them?
Do you think God would have been impressed?
Why is this so difficult for you to accept?
>>76123004
Better to play it safe and become Catholic. It is the True Church
https://my.mixtape.moe/yerinm.webm
>>76123170
>anyone else in the bible
Anyone except God, I mean.
I need skydaddy to keep me happy and make me feel safe
>>76122265
The shillposters on 4chan and specially on /pol/ are really going into hardcore mode.
The latest few weeks we had regular christian threads praising Jesus Christ on 4chan. Already then shillers tried to break the threads.
They are trying to break us and create division by on purpose exclude Orthodox Catholics and promote degeneracy.
These shilling will increase heavily.
Be aware folks
Trust no one.
God bless you.
>>76123170
>Does the Holy Spirit want someone who represents almost 2 billion Christians to bow down and kiss Muslim invader feet?
As I have already told you, the Holy Spirit protects the Magisterium. The Pope, apart from when he is speaking ex-cathedra, can be wrong just like everyone else. So the answer is: no
>The pope is not infallible.
As a person no, but the office he holds is infallible in the sense that when speaking ex-cathedra and in matters of faith and morals, the Holy Spirit protects him from teaching error.
It is a very rare occurrence anyway. For example Pope Francis has never used it so far.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magisterium
>Don't you understand? Men die, man comes from dust.
Nothing to do with the argument in question
>What do you think would happen if the pope was the leader of the Israelites in the wilderness
He is, Israel is the Church and we are currently in the wilderness
>and then invited the Canaanites in to the camp
The Pope didn't invite millions of muslims into Europe. European secular governments did.
>and gathered everyone around and then washed their leader's feet and kissed them?
I don't agree with his gesture at all, but that in no way rebukes the papacy as an institution. There have been much worse Popes in the past, who did much worse things
>Why is this so difficult for you to accept?
I only accept the Truth and have no difficulty in doing so. You are the one basing your arguments on prejudice and superstition.
>>76123477
He does it even though you are a loser. Such a good guy.
Thanks God! I love you!
Does anyone here actually go to church? Or is it just roleplaying?
>>76123581
>implying orthodox aren't protestants
>>76122265
>>Jesus Anime
Holy kek you are degenerate
>>76123170
This pope is bad, but the unity of the church is a divine commandement, look at your religion,protestantism is filled with sects and their numbers is growing every day you aren't one like Christ wanted.
>>76123779
I go to church with my parents
>>76123589
>the Magisterium
"The magisterium of the Catholic Church is the authority or office of the Church to establish its own authentic teachings."
>establish it's own teachings
Kissing unclean Muslim invader feet is not authentic, it doesn't come from God, and it is not holy.
>>76123173
Aren't things like the veneration of Mary, the Holy Trinity, the Eucharist, and all the sun symbolism behind Jesus's head kind of pagan in origin? Is Catholicism like pagan monotheism?
>>76123832
it's actually pretty good
>>76123883
It establishes the teachings in the sense that it formalizes them. No new teachings are created, they are simply regulated and put black on white so that heretics cannot emerge and distort the interpretation of the Church by claiming that "it is not written anywhere so it was never believed".
All the things Popes have declared through papal infallibiliy (very, very few) were always believed by the Church since 33AD. They simply made it dogma so that nobody in the future could try to pervert the doctrine.
>Kissing unclean Muslim invader feet is not authentic, it doesn't come from God, and it is not holy.
I have already explained this, but you choose not to hear, and choose not to see.
>>76123833
God's church is living. It is made up of Christians. Each person is like a brick in it. The headstone is Lord Jesus. The Holy Spirit dwells within.
Peter was the apostle that Lord Jesus turned to, and laid down to be the first brick, when God knows his name being synonymous with 'rock'. None of this implies establishing a heretical mega church in the center of the pagan world and changing God's commandments, times and seasons.
Matthew 21:42
Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
1 Corinthians 11:3
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
>>76123797
The Orthodox are the only allies for Roman Catholics.
Who here knows about the dimes and angels?
>>76124103
>Aren't things like the veneration of Mary, the Holy Trinity, the Eucharist, and all the sun symbolism behind Jesus's head kind of pagan in origin?
No
>Is Catholicism like pagan monotheism?
No
That is protestant propaganda that has literally 0 ground on reality. We preach the good news to convert people to Catholicism, whereas they preach fear and hate. Not hard to guess who the Holy Spirit is working through 2bh
>>76124174
Please spare yourself the effort of replying to me. I cannot help you.
>>76124296
pic related
>>76124219
>that fan-fiction
The Bible says "Church", not "churches". Even if you took it as meaning all Christians, you could not be considered a single Church because all protestants interpret things differently. Therefore even taking your argument for true, you still wouldn't be part of the Church of Christ
>>76124295
Pure coincidence.
>>76124295
>>76124911
God doesn't teach people by arguing against them. He speaks the truth. Some people accept it. Some people don't.
When He came in the flesh, many people plotted to kill Him for doing it. They didn't treat Him kindly, and they must have frustrated Him many times. But His hand is always stretched out for us.
>>76124644
God's church is made up of everyone who is saved, i.e. people who believe on the name of Jesus Christ.
Unfortunately, many people will be turned away for treating people like shit.
>>76124295
>>76124911
>>76124941
>>76124999
>shamash
that is a cross, you must be blind lmao
bottom left too. bottom right is simply a damn circle. That shape is actually meant to represent extended arms that welcome the faithful
>>76124999
Matthew 22:32
I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
>>76124911
>>76124911
DUDE CIRCLES LMAO
you totally got us anon.
Those on the bottom right are cherubims, not a moon. They were on the ark of the covenant. On top of the ark is mary, who is the new ark of the covenant. Under her feet there is the moon, as seen in Revelation 12:1.
100% biblical and not pagan, stay mad lmao
>>76125163
The cross is derived from the zodiac, which was understood by pagan priests over 1,000 years before Christ's birth.
>>76125163
Nice try, kiddy-diddler.
>>76124946
>God's church is made up of everyone who is saved, i.e. people who believe on the name of Jesus Christ.
Faith alone is dead. You need works and sacraments too.
Only the sacraments in apostolic churches are valid.
>God doesn't teach people by arguing against them. He speaks the truth.
That is literally the same thing. How can you not argue against someone, if you speak the truth and they speak falsehood?
>>76125330
>The cross is derived from the zodiac, which was understood by pagan priests over 1,000 years before Christ's birth.so Jesus was a pagan?
>>76125321
>>76125321
So why is the Bible full of pagan symbolism which was widespread long before Christianity? I'm not saying the cherubim aren't Biblical, I'm saying the Bible derives a lot of its symbolism from the multitude of pagan cultures existing in every direction from Israel at the time of its conception.
>>76125330
No, the cross is derived from a two pieces of fuckin wood on which Christ was killed.
>>76125501
fugged up the greeen text. So are you implying Jesus was a pagain? lmao
>>76123173
>Catholicism
>true church
>worships a sun god
>worships saints
>religion of Mexicans
no thanks
>>76125525
this pictures, through the power of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, nullifies the oath breaker
>>76124103
No, not even if they were to derive from such things.
>Some Protestants (usually anti-Catholic ones) falsely accuse Catholics (and often other Protestants as well) of superstition and paganism, even as they themselves hypocritically and ironically blatantly indulge in it, neglecting the crucial role of inner meaning and the heart (very Pharisaical . . .). They view a crucifix as a talisman or a charm. We view it simply as an aid to devotion to our Lord Jesus (an entirely different concept), just as Passover was a means of remembrance to the Jews for God’s deliverance of them (Ex 12:13-14). Many other similar biblical analogies could be brought forth also.
This thinking is not unlike that of certain people who condemn the oeuvre of an artist because he may have one point been a racist. It's pure idiocy.
God's creation is good (very good!) and therefore we can use it as we please in service to Him.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/davearmstrong/2016/04/is-catholicism-half-pagan-2.html
>>76122864
We don't have a set OP, we use the thread of whoever makes it.
>>76125527
>So why is the Bible full of pagan symbolism which was widespread long before Christianity?
You are asking me why geometrical shapes existed before the birth of Jesus? lmao
>>76124911
>>76124941
>>76124999
>>76125330
Why do Protestants deny the Incarnation? Was Jesus lying by saying "I make all things new"?
Also, your argument is literally "HURR DURR FUNNY SHAPES XDDDD"
>>76125595
*tips tin-foil hat*
>>76125501
Not an argument.
>>76125529
Yeah, no. Here's a depiction of the cross found on a slab in Egypt dating roughly 2,000 years before Christ. it was a symbol of luck and fortune to the Babylonians as well. It was also used in South America quite a bit.
This is a beautiful Bob Dylan album he made right after he found Christ. Enjoy /csg/
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLknidvzcLCRFU2E_2wLM6PK9VWfCsHDVi
>>76125827
>not an argument
it literally is
>>76125721
>lmao
>>76125827
Oh, no, not a shape that scares me! Those Egyptians sure are filthy pagans.
>>76125789
To be fair though, that's some Jew Tier thinking in that comic.
>>76125921
it is my preferred pronoun, check your priviledge kek scum
>>76122265
i will never be worthy of him
>>76125601
can he deal with this one though?
>>76122265
Hey Im an Orthodox Jew! Can I be part of the discussion?
>>76125998
longest-standing institution on the planet, baby
>>76122265
>>76126113
he can deal with everything
>>76126115
only if you convert to Christianity
>>76125627
I'm saying Christianity hijacked pagan symbolism for its purposes. Not even saying that's bad.
>>76125721
No, I'm asking why Christianity uses symbols that were developed and worshiped by Pagans. If they were just geometric shapes with no real meaning, then why are they ALL OVER your churches and made of fucking gold?
>>76125735
Strawman. BTW pic related is just a bunch of funny shapes so if I wear a Baphomet shirt to your local church don't think anything of it. Fucking twats.
>>76125964
There is literally nothing wrong with paganism.
And if the shapes don't matter, why are the prominent in every single Catholic and Orthodox church? They don't matter when they're being venerated by pagans but they do matter when being venerated by Catholics? This is a feminist-tier double standard.
>>76126236
see >>76125735
For example water in the OT represented the gentiles and the enemy in general. In the NT it becomes the means through which we are born again.
Jesus overturns the order of the world, makes everything unclean clean, makes death eternal life.
Those symbols are not pagan unless you use them with the intention of being a pagan.
>>76126236
>>76126424
m8 the problem we have here is it's very difficult to tell the difference between you and a protestant fundamentalist right now because your understanding of christianity is on that level
>>76126115
>Orthodox Jew
Why did you reject your king?
>>76126131
What defines an institution?
>>76126131
>longest-standing institution on the planet, baby
No, God's church is. It pre-dates Catholicism.
>>76126882
>I have never read the Apostolic Fathers in my life
>the post
>>76126957
I don't need to. I've read Acts, Romans and the rest of the N.T.
>>76126882
God's Church = Catholic Church
Protestantism was born in 1500, you are the last one to talk here
>>76126833
Hierarchy, leadership, unity.
>>76127043
Then you clearly skipped over some incredibly vital parts because meant you wouldn't feel good.
God help you if you ever actually pick up Ignatius of Antioch or Justin Martyr, you'll shit yourself. Every single element of Catholic doctrine and practice was present in the first century whether or not it makes you butthurt.
Dear sky wizard,
Please cause another great extinction like you did with the flood
>>76119186
[26]"When Jesus saw His mother and the disciple whom He loved standing nearby, He said to His mother, “Woman, here is your son.” [27]Then He said to the disciple, “Here is your mother.” So from that hour, this disciple took her into his home. [28]After this, knowing that everything had now been accomplished, and to fulfill the Scripture, Jesus said, “I am thirsty.”
I was taught in a sermon that this was when Jesus parted ways with Mary, and in ascending he would no longer be her son, but her father in heaven. I figured it was also to make sure Mary wasn't designated as divine like God, or something.
I'm just saying here, I can certainly see it this way.
>>76127043
>No, God's church is. It pre-dates Catholicism.
The Martyrdom of Polycarp
When finally he concluded his prayer, after remembering all who had at any time come his way – small folk and great folk, distinguished and undistinguished, and the whole Catholic Church throughout the world – the time for departure came. So they placed him on an ass, and brought him into the city on a great Sabbath (The Martyrdom of Polycarp 8 [A.D. 110]).
>>76127184
>Ignatius of Antioch or Justin Martyr
They aren't in the bible. They didn't write God's Word.
Traditions of men.
>do this
>do that
>i'm adding this, so just do it
>don't ask me why, it's tradition
>>76127048
Then I'd argue that the Catholic church didn't exist until the First Council of Nicaea because beliefs were widely different and thus lacked unity.
If it's simply "leadership" then Pharisaic Judaism which became the basis of Rabbinic Judaism is the longest held western "institution."
>>76126587
I haven't said very much at all that would reveal what I know/believe about Christianity. I'm just trying to deal with the issue of ancient pagan symbols being used extensively by the Catholic church. I'm not saying I don't know what those symbols represent TO CATHOLICS, or that they are inherently sinister because of their pagan origin either. Literally just tackling this one point and you're all freaking the fuck out making all these very telling assumptions.
>>76127217
Like the flood? Please, Yahweh's apocalypse is the most metal thing imaginable.
Wonder if it's really just gonna be earth or a Big Crunch though
>>76122265
> kike fantasy fiction General
>>>>>/lit/
>>76126432
THAT is totally fine and I agree 100%. I was just asking the blind fanatics to reconcile the ancient symbols with their use in the Catholic church. You did that just fine.
>>76127279
>They aren't in the bible. They didn't write God's Word.
So you think you know better than a student of the Apostle John? Who the fuck do you think you are?
Ignatius of Antioch
Follow your bishop, every one of you, as obediently as Jesus Christ followed the Father. Obey your clergy too as you would the apostles; give your deacons the same reverence that you would to a command of God. Make sure that no step affecting the Church is ever taken by anyone without the bishop’s sanction. The sole Eucharist you should consider valid is one that is celebrated by the bishop himself, or by some person authorized by him. Where the bishop is to be seen, there let all his people be; just as, wherever Jesus Christ is present, there is the Catholic Church (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).
In like manner let everyone respect the deacons as they would respect Jesus Christ, and just as they respect the bishop as a type of the Father, and the presbyters as the council of God and college of the apostles. Without these, it cannot be called a Church. I am confident that you accept this, for I have received the exemplar of your love and have it with me in the person of your bishop. His very demeanor is a great lesson and his meekness is his strength. I believe that even the godless do respect him (Letter to the Trallians 3:1-2 [A. D. 110]).
>>76127286
Beliefs weren't different at all. There were some non-apostolic Churches trying to spread heresy and so the Council was made so that a written agreement could avoid heresies from spreading in the future. Apostolic Churches always had the same beliefs
>If it's simply "leadership" then Pharisaic Judaism which became the basis of Rabbinic Judaism is the longest held western "institution."
Nice 19th centuy fan-fiction, anon, but it's getting a bit stale.
>>76122265
>try to be polite
Aren't you a cucklic shitposter? How many Italian cucklic shitposters *are* there?
>muh one true catholic church
Genesis 4:26
And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.
Pre-flood, people walked with God in faith.
Are they not in God's church, too? Because the Pope didn't meet them? Genesis 4.
>>76122265
> cosmic jewish zombie
>>>/x/
>Mfw Christianity is dying a slow and painful death.
>>76127550
>So you think you know better than a student of the Apostle John?
Was John's apostle's works in the N.T.?
Mine aren't either. When I am trying to help people, I give them God's Word, and any revelation or insight I have in to it. I don't write my own traditions to teach people to replace God's commandments.
>>76127659
The world will end before there are no Christians left bongy-bong. And they'll be right all the while.
I'm going to start going to church at my local united methodist church next sunday, did I choose right?
>>76127279
Ignatius of Antioch actually IS in the Bible, he's one of the children that Jesus met. And then he went on to die a heroic death being eaten by lions defending the faith to his last breath, all the while not having any Bible.
>inb4 HURR DURR BUT IT DOESN'T SAY "IGNATIUS OF ANTIOCH" IN THE BIBLE
You know what else the Bible doesn't say? What books go in the fucking Bible.
But it doesn't matter, you have your pre-fabricated "MUH TRADITIONS OF MEN!!" excuse to justify your hatred of Christ. Keep worshiping yourself and enjoy Hell.
> See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is administered either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude of the people also be; even as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church.
> Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God… They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the Flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, Flesh which suffered for our sins and which the Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes.
>>76127550
>Beliefs weren't different at all. There were some non-apostolic Churches trying to spread heresy and so the Council was made so that a written agreement could avoid heresies from spreading in the future. Apostolic Churches always had the same beliefs
But you do realize that Christianity is in itself a Jewish heresy?
>Nice 19th centuy fan-fiction, anon, but it's getting a bit stale.
Prove it wrong. Modern Orthodox Rabbis can trace their lineage to the second temple period. I'm not even getting into eastern traditions that could easily be older than both the church, and Jews.
>>76127751
Methodists are generally alright. There's a whole lot of variation between individual churches in how they conduct their services though. Some are much more music based than others, while some have much longer sermons. I prefer the longer sermons to music honestly. Not really a fan of music in church at all really.
>>76126587
He just wants to know stuff, it sounds like.
>>76127550
>In like manner let everyone respect the deacons as they would respect Jesus Christ, and just as they respect the bishop as a type of the Father, and the presbyters as the council of God and college of the apostles. Without these, it cannot be called a Church.
Look, I'm sure there are plenty of trustworthy clergy, but this sounds pretty exploitable. That just doesn't sound like the rest of the Bible to me.
>>76127751
You'll know once you hear a sermon I guess.
>>76127735
>Was John's apostle's works in the N.T.? Mine aren't either.
>>76125721
Topkek nice
>>76127751
Go to your local evangelical Methodist church if there's one nearby; from my understanding, united Methodist churches are liberal feel-good fun centres. Evangelical Methodists are more conservative.
>>76127359
The Church has always incarnated the local cultures and symbols. What we call "Roman Catholicism" is basically Christianity + Germanic culture, but it's Roman because of the Holy Roman Empire.
Pic related, a cross used by Buddhist converts in medieval Mongolia.
>>76127859
>But you do realize that Christianity is in itself a Jewish heresy?
>>76127567
>pot calling the kettle black
I have no intention of dealing with you 2bh, you are obnoxious.
I am not a shitposter and simply stating the beliefs of the Church.
>>76127607
Are we living in pre-flood world now?
The Church was founded in 33AD
>>76127735
The point is, that if the student of John held those beliefs, obviously John held them too. Why would invent it?
The Bible is not supposed to contain all Apostolic knowledge and tradition, just like it is not supposed to hold all human knowledge. You are being irrational
>I don't write my own traditions to teach people to replace God's commandments.
They don't replace any of God's commandments ffs. They are passed down by Jesus and therefore by God anyway
>>76127859
>But you do realize that Christianity is in itself a Jewish heresy?
rabbinial judaism is the heresy
>Modern Orthodox Rabbis can trace their lineage to the second temple period.
Sure, but they departed from that lineage. They have no temple anymore. They broke the covenant and paid for it. Stay mad schlomo
>>76127847
>he's one of the children that Jesus met
And did Lord Jesus congratulate him on commanding people to do things against God?
>Obey your clergy too as you would the apostles; give your deacons the same reverence that you would to a command of God. Make sure that no step affecting the Church is ever taken by anyone without the bishop’s sanction
This is literally making up stuff, and commanding people to follow it. It doesn't come from God. It's earthly from the mind of man.
The apostles were all brothers, it wasn't a hierarchy. Older people tend to have more wisdom, so it's a good thing to give them ear on things, right? Where does God tell you to submit to a single earthly authority? We are told to love each other, and those who are servants will become high, and those who have servants will become low.
This is literally a case of people writing letters to other Christians and making stuff up to add to dogma. God didn't tell anyone to do that.
>>76128066
You're a shitposter senpai. It's all over the archives.
Enjoy your shitposting~
>>76127659
Only in the west. In the east it's growing like wildfire.
>>76122265
>Catholics and Protestants alike
No Orthodox in the OP, nice try schlomo.
>>76128124
>u are because I say u are
k
>>76128066
>rabbinial judaism is the heresy
How so? Literally, the old testament tells you that if anyone attempts to change the laws of the old testament they're a heretic.
>Sure, but they departed from that lineage. They have no temple anymore. They broke the covenant and paid for it. Stay mad schlomo
>Can trace their family tree for centuries due to importance placed on bloodlines
>NO, THEY'RE NOT OF THE LINEAGE.
I don't get Christians, especially devout ones. Like Islam is at least consistent with its bullshit, but Christianity changes with the winds.
>>76126131
which pope is even worse than Francis?
>>76128113
>And did Lord Jesus congratulate him on commanding people to do things against God?
The Lord Jesus gave him the crown of life on October 17, 108 when he was fed to lions in the name of Christ.
How convenient for you that you ignore every fact you're presented, latch onto one easy thing and irrelevant you think you can refute, and then act like this is your victory.
You hate Christ. That's all there is to it. You want to worship yourself and call it Christianity.
Whoever rejects you, rejects me, and whoever rejects me, rejects the one who sent me.
>>76122265
ITT kike lovers are discussing kike philosophy 1.0 Christianity when kike philosophy 2.0 Marxism is the superior updated version that is currently trending in the west. Fucking hypsters.
>>76128144
>Only in the west. In the east it's growing like wildfire.
Yeah, I'm sure they'll make good use of it.
>>76128066
>The point is, that if the student of John held those beliefs, obviously John held them too.
We are both Christians, yet your beliefs are polar opposite of mine. How is that possible? One of us has to be wrong.
>>76128198
>if anyone attempts to change the laws of the old testament they're a heretic
Judaizers pls go
>>76128381
Deuteronomy 4:2King James Version (KJV)
2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.
>>76128283
>Whoever rejects you, rejects me, and whoever rejects me, rejects the one who sent me.
I didn't reject Matthew. I read his gospel first, and was saved on the same day.
Matthew, Mark, Luke & John mentioned nothing about having other people centuries later wearing funny hats command me to do things which are contrary to what I read in the bible.
May God bless you.
>>76128013
>>76126432
Both good answers. Again, I'm just confused as to why so many people ITT outright denied the connection.
>>76122265
>Jesus of Nazareth (1977)
Hands down best Jesus movie. Not flashy but rather sticks very close to the scripture and Jesus' message.
>>76128170
I just copy-pasted the old one, should have added it though. My bad.
>>76128198
>How so? Literally, the old testament tells you that if anyone attempts to change the laws of the old testament they're a heretic.
The purpose of the Law was the atonement of sins by the Messiah. The Law has been fulfilled.
>>NO, THEY'RE NOT OF THE LINEAGE.
I didn't say that. Can you read? I said that their DNA heritage has no meaning to God if they don't accept Jesus as the Messiah. They have broken the covenant. Not all of them did, of course. Those that didn't became the early Christians and therefore the Church. That lineage is uninterrupted, and is not an earhly one, but a spiritual one
>Islam is at least consistent with its bullshit,
Said literally no-one ever
>>76128375
>We are both Christians, yet your beliefs are polar opposite of mine.
I wouldn't say they are opposite. You simply deny the teachings that command you to be part of the Church and observe the Sacraments, not all of them in general
>How is that possible?
Luther wanted to bang nuns and thought too highly of himself. European princes wanted to sack Church property and break away from the ban on usury the Church enforced.
>One of us has to be wrong
Obviously you
>>76128234
Many
Made a vow today to God to never smoke another cigarette in my life. Would appreciate prayers. Much love. /pol/ is what weirdly got me into Catholicism and then Jesus Christ. Love seeing these threads and knowing the gospel and immaculate heart will prevail in some faithful soul out there.
>>76128510
Cut your sanctimonious bullshit. You aren't saved when you hate the truth to make yourself feel good.
You have rejected the authority of the Apostles who were given all power on earth to make yourself a god.
The fact that you've resorted to reddit-tier "LE FUNNY HATS XDDDD" argumentation is proof positive that you've lost, you know it, and you're scared. Repent and believe, or burn in Hell.
>>76128520
I thought you were being a Protestant retard who gets triggered by actual Christianity.
>>76128181
>>76046615
>>76051553
>>76046036
And that's from one thread just yesterday.
l m a o
m
o
o
>>76128381
The ordinances of the law were things like clothing and animal sacrifices for a temple/tabernacle, right?
Since the temple is God's church, we don't need those 'laws' now, right?
So what does that have to do with the sabbath?
Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Why are people claiming the sabbath is no longer valid? Lord Jesus taught on it.
The sabbath is part of the 10 commandments, not the law.
>>76128617
>You simply deny the teachings that command you to be part of the Church and observe the Sacraments
The once-yearly passover (Jewish) feast, that the ROMAN PAGAN CHURCH replaced with 3-times-every-SUNDAY? 3 times per day, 52 times per year.
Who said to do that? Not God. Not the apostles. Someone who came after. They changed this, in favour of their own interpretation. Doctrines of men.
>>76128520
because of your use of the word pagan which suggested you thought we were therefore pagans ourselves. we come across these arguments time and time again, that's also why.
>>76128617
>Luther wanted to bang nuns
Not this meme again, stop shitposting
>>76128751
You have my prayers, anon. I'm trying to quit as well and I know how difficult that can be especially if it was used as a crutch during a time of depression or stress. Stay strong and be a better man than me.
>>76128417
Philippians 3:2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation! 3 For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh
That verse is referring to Judaizers, people like yourself. Christ fulfilled the law in His death and the power of His resurrection. To say we are still held to ancient Mosaic law under the old Jewisg covenant is an attack on Christ, which is why it is heresy. Now that you know, please don't spread these lies on this board anymore.
>>76128823
>i tell you you are wrong when you are sperging out
>I point you to an interesting piece of literature
>I point out who the reasoning behind a statement is very similar the reasoning the devil made to rebuke good through deception
Do you even know what shitposting is, weeaboo-san?
>>76128925
Did Luther bang a nun, yes or no?
>>76127659
why do brits have such awful teeth?
>>76128367
I think we'll be surprised. Western society has secularized itself to the point of falling apart... especially Japan which has essentially destroyed the family and is suffering for it.
>>76128751
good luck, brother. i need to drop that habit (again) too.
first week will suck but it's a lot easier after the chemical addiction is gone and it's just a mental one.
>Catholicism and then Jesus Christ
kek
>>76128997
Luther married a former nun, yes. Implying that he did what he did out of a desire to bang nuns is wrong.
>>76128898
>The once-yearly passover (Jewish) feast, that the ROMAN PAGAN CHURCH replaced with 3-times-every-SUNDAY? 3 times per day, 52 times per year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P45BHDRA7pU
>>76128754
Yeah my first post ITT reveals that I have no denomination. I don't identify as Catholic, Lutheran, Methodist, Episcopal, etc. I have faith in Jesus Christ and that's all and for you and the others to assume I'm part of a group you don't like because I pointed out the obvious symbolic connections represents to me that you need to work on being more objective.
>>76128997
>assert someone is wrong and provide no argument that is a straight up fallacy as to how
>"interesting piece of literature"
>posts shitposting images, "stay mad" and "lmao"
Bruh. You're a shitposter. It's okay to admit it.
>>76128754
I want you to know that I forgive you, and I hope that we do not grieve God by these outbursts. May God bless you so much. I am not being sanctimonious, we are told to forgive each other for trespasses.
If God came to us both now, do you think He would be happy that you're insulting me, and telling me that I hate Him? I honestly don't. His ways are better than our ways. Better than my ways. Better than your ways.
I hope that's the very least we can agree on.
I can only draw from His Word, not the writings of people who have changed what He said, and commanded differently.
>>76128283
>You hate Christ. That's all there is to it. You want to worship yourself and call it Christianity.
>Whoever rejects you, rejects me, and whoever rejects me, rejects the one who sent me.
I'm with him here, that's some backwards-ass thinking. A human can never be God, you can't just tell someone they hate God because they won't submit to a clergyman, especially when examples of corruption in the church have appeared throughout history. Even if you believe in it, I don't think it's right to enforce that on others, else call them god-hating heretics.
I hate to fight against other Christians, especially because I really admire the visible conviction of some catholics, following stricter rules ain't easy. But our pastors don't enforce the same rules, while still preaching the word as truthfully as they can.
Maybe both or only one of us is wrong in this, but I don't believe anyone here is a heretic, and the fact this argument has gone on for as long as it has been, I believe, is an example of humans doing their honest best to speak against sin and corruption. I believe neither side is arguing with evil in their heart.
>>76128898
Be not deceived with strange doctrines, nor with old fables, which are unprofitable. For if we still live according to the Jewish law, we acknowledge that we have not received grace. For the divinest prophets lived according to Christ Jesus. On this account also they were persecuted, being inspired by His grace to fully convince the unbelieving that there is one God, who has manifested Himself by Jesus Christ His Son, who is His eternal Word, not proceeding forth from silence, and who in all things
If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death— whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ, our only Master— how shall we be able to live apart from Him, whose disciples the prophets themselves in the Spirit did wait for Him as their Teacher? And therefore He whom they rightly waited for, having come, raised them from the dead.
St. Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians
>>76128751
Good luck bro. Be strong.
>>76128283
WASSUP JAMAL
YOU'RE SUPER HARD TO FIND IN A CROWD
L M A O
>>76128912
>because of your use of the word pagan which suggested you thought we were therefore pagans ourselves.
My use of the word pagan was to identify the groups I was COMPARING Catholics with. it didn't "suggest" anything, it inquired "why does this connection exist". Don't blame me for your assumptions.
>>76129199
>implying one needs to provide evidence for every statement, especially if the stament had already been rebuked previously and therefore rebukes itself by a lack of self-awareness on the part of the interlocutor
>implying the fact that jews have been trying to infiltrate the church and reform it throughout history, judaizing it is not interesting
>implying that pic wasn't absolutely related to the content of my post, and implying the pic in any way changes the fact that the post contained meaninful and rational obvservations
Why don't you go back to your tentacle-porn and let us grown-ups keep on talking, weeaboo-san? Thank you
>>76127550
What if a "Bishop" tells you to violate God's law? Clearly unless "Bishops" are somehow unable to tell you to violate God's law, which they are not, then Ignatius is saying to commit sin when a "Bishop" tells you to.
>>76128898
But the ten commandments are part of the law.
>>76128993
Where does the New Testament say you no longer have to follow the old Mosaic laws?
>>76129239
>I don't believe anyone here is a heretic
Just to clarify, I'm talking about those in the argument. My bad.
>>76129394
uh i wasn't blaming you for anything. i was trying to explain what might have happened.
>>76129245
>still live according to the Jewish law
The collection of O.T. laws, right?
The Sabbath is a hallowed day by God. He never once made it unhallowed, or commanded to do work on it.
And I can't find any scripture which tells us to change it to the first day of the week, the pagan sun worship tradition.
>10 commandments (1 to keep the sabbath)
>613 commandments (Israelite law)
Matthew 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
>to enter life
>keep the commandments
>lists the ones from the 10 commandments, not the law
Keeping the Sabbath is part of loving God, others like not killing are part of loving neighbours.
>>76129461
You can "rebuke" the interpretation of Matthew 16:18 as being mere words of encouragement and prophecy for Peter without relying on a fallacy?
Because you nor anyone else has ever done so.
>THE JOOS
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
>>76129517
"For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and to deal with sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, so that the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:3-4
For Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. Romans 10:4
and you show that you are a letter of Christ, prepared by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. 2Co 3:3
who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 2Co 3:6-9
Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. Galations 6:2
In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. Hebrews 8:13
>>76129611
>because of your use of the word pagan which suggested you thought we were therefore pagans ourselves.
>which suggested
You are saying that my words suggested what you were really just assuming. That's blame whether or not you realize it or want to admit it. I'm not saying you owe me anything for this, just that you should be more objective.
>>76129517
>What if a "Bishop" tells you to violate God's law?
That's why the doctrine and dogma of the Curch exist. Since our interpretation of God's Law is contained in the deposit of the Faith, a Bishop can never do such thing without being called out on it by everyone else.
Pic related.
>>76129239
>>76128283
My Brothers,
CS Lewis writes that Christianity has many denominations, but you all have a responsibility to do the research and follow what you sincerely believe to be the true path, not which one you happen to like better.
How large was the backlash against the novus ordo or vatican 2 among normal churchgoers? Is the SSPX just a fringe group?
>>76129718
I had already rebuked that with my thourough explanation of that verse nigger, you simply damage control and say that words don't mean what they mean because you don't like it.
There is no way of them as being mere words of encouragement, unless one is dishonest.
You are the shitposter.
>>76129789
um okay
>>76129696
Mt 22:36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?”
37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”
also see>>76129724
>>76129851
sorry, that came out kind of arrogant. Not my intention.
>>76124267
It was kind of a joke. Orthodox are based,
>mfw protestants want a religion of the book
>mfw they're basically just muslims in denial
>>76129899
I was going to answer you but I can't be bothered to write all that stuff 2bh.
Talks are in process with the SSPX to let them back into the flock. Either way Benedict XVI has reallowed the old form of latin mass to appease traditionalists
>>76129918
You don't rebuke an alternative explanation by stating another one. You just provide another way something *could* be interpreted.
Is education in basic logic outlawed in your commie country?
>>76122265
What do you guys think about sainthood. Are Catholics wrong for worshiping people. Not only that, but its not like God picks the Saints. How do they know that a saint is truly wanted by God?
>>76130130
Yeah, I know that for protestants God is an opinion and truth is relative. You don't need to remind me.
>Is education in basic logic outlawed in your commie country?
not a commie country, not an argument
>>76127659
You'll die a slow and painful death when Abdul shanks you to death in your caliphate.
>>76130143
>worship
We don't.
>God picks the saints
This is exactly what happens.
>How do they know a saint is truly...
there are systems in place.
>>76130143
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bFKFrf0sHE
>>76130143
>Are Catholics wrong for worshiping people
Protestants everyone.
How do I overcome lust?
Matthew 24:20
But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day
The nearing rapture; Sabbath observance still in effect.
>>76130039
No, it seemed fine to me. Thanks for stating that.
>>76130143
I believe everyone is called by God. I don't know how everything works in Catholicism, but worship/submission to humans is the single issue I take with it. It just makes no sense to me.
>>76130143
That is what the miracle is for.
Saints are real:
Luther came to criticize Roman Catholics for blurring the distinction between high admiration of the grace of God wherever it is manifested in human beings and religious service offered to them and other mere creatures.
>>76130341
Cold showers and the Rosary
>>76130442
>Rosary
Matthew 6:7
But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
>>76130376
I'll correct myself here, that was brash to say they worship them. I thought the anon had a better idea of what he was talking about.
>>76130143
>Are Catholics wrong for worshiping people
we don't worship people
>How do they know that a saint is truly wanted by God?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8227Vy4d28
If you are talking about the process of canonization, the Church takes its time to examine their life and deeds, I don't know the details.
If a person is a saint it is pretty obvious though
>>76127659
Christianity is actually growing world wide because of South America and Africa. Atheism/Agnosticism/unaffiliatied is actually on a decline world wide.
Why do satan fight against God when apparently it is preordained that he will lose? Seems pretty retarded or is he just looking to get as much out of it before the ride ends?
I'd be depressed if I was him
>>76130499
>vain
Hail Marys are never in vain.
>>76130499
>praising God
>vain repitition
PROTTIES
R
O
T
T
I
E
S
>>76123779
My wife goes to church all the time. I go some of the time. It helps.
>>76130341
Rosary everyday has worked for me. I am even able to suppress lustful thoughts now. And this is coming from someone who used to fap 2 times a day and felt phisically ill if he had to go more than 2 days without fapping
>>76130226
You obstinately asserting what you believe is true won't make it so - you have to actually be able to instantiate it as being so, or else it could just as easily be as wrong as anyone else.
And you can't do that. All you can do is rely on straight-up logical fallacies in appealing to authority/tradition. Illogical *as fuck* mane.
Italy is commie. The largest party in your country is commie in everything but name, and literally came out of a commie party.
>>76130372
That was before He fulfilled the law and established the new covenant.
"He says, “Heaven and earth will pass away, but not an iota, not a dot will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.” All is accomplished when He is crucified. That’s when all is accomplished. In the theological Gospel of St. John, the last word of Jesus from the Cross is one Greek word, Tetelestai, which means, “It is accomplished.” In Latin, it’s two words: “Consummatum est.” It’s usually translated in English as, “It is finished,” so most people think He’s going to die, especially because it says, “He cried out, ‘It is finished,’ and He gave over His spirit.” But it doesn’t mean that He’s going to die. That word means it’s fulfilled. It’s accomplished. It’s perfected. There’s nothing more that God can say, there’s nothing more that God can show, there’s nothing more that God can do. In the death of Jesus of Nazareth, the Messiah, the Son of God, the Lamb of God, God has done his final act. That’s it. It’s fulfilled. Nothing can surpass it. So, not one word of the Law passes away until it’s accomplished, but when He’s crucified, it’s all accomplished. Therefore, all the word is fulfilled in Him.
So when we ask the question: What does it mean that Jesus died for us? Simply put, it means that he revealed the truth, he did the truth, the truth is love. He fulfills it completely, therefore the law is now kept. Therefore God has no case against us, because he can’t have a case against us if the law is not broken, and he didn’t break it! And therefore he voluntarily enters into the realm of sin, curse, and death in order to obliterate it, to wipe it out once and for all forever." - Fr. Thomas Hopko
>>76130568
Free will is a hell of a drug.
>>76122265
Hey I just got an idea:
Why not, for people wanting to escape degeneracy, starts a /csg/ - Sunday Mass thread?
You could host a video or something on a stream with a chatroom.
>>76130578
>>76130569
>muh pagan tradition given to JUST OUR CHURCH
I can't help but see the worship of Mary as anything other than goddess worship.
>>76130499
>meditating on the life of Jesus through the words of an Archangel is vain
This is what Protestants actually believe.
>>76130648
I have a masturbation problem and I'm going to make it a habit for when I feel urges, I will pray the rosary instead and pray for God's strength to abstain from lust.
>>76130723
>worship
>mary
PROTTIES
R
O
T
T
I
E
S
Hail Mary, full of grace,
the Lord is with thee;
blessed art thou amongst women,
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners,
now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
>>76130341
It definitely gets easier with practice.
Tips:
1. Focus on a girl's face. Try and make it a habit to focus on her face/soul and what kind of person she is. This has the added benefit of finding someone who is actually wife material.
2. Strenuous exercise. Wear yourself out with it. Get a door gym for when you get urges.
3. Cold showers and hot baths in Epsom Salt.
>>76130747
>through the words of an Archangel
Why do you have to chant them?
And what's wrong with your own words? Can't you think of anything to say to Father God or Lord Jesus?
>>76130723
>I can't help but
Because you don't fucking want to. That's all it amounts to.
>>76122265
>>>/gif/8657983/8669822
We need to pray for Ellis
is this right, catholics?
not worship (dulia/hyperdulia):
>kneeling in front of a statue of saint and praying/praising to (through?) it
>sacrificing a goat in front of said statue and chanting latin at it
worship (latria):
>believing target of prayer/praise is divine
>>76130669
wtf does free will have to do with it?
Imagine having ONE dream in life and you knew it is 100% certain you will never fulfill it
>>76130818
You don't have to chant them, you obviously don't even know what you're talking about. And what's wrong with chanting? Are you scared of singing when you use a French word instead of an English word?
Nobody said you can't pray with your own words.
>>76130849
>>>/gif/8657983
Once you are there; CTRL+F: 8669822
>>76130568
I think Milton mentions this in Paradise Lost.
Basically god never revealed that he was omnipotent and the rebelling angels only realised it afterwards. As to why he still fights? Because god allows him to I suppose and he has no chance of being redeemed so why not?
>>76130881
>actually thinking Catholics sacrifice goats
>>76130723
she is the mother of all those who believe in Christ. Why do you not want to honour your mother?
This election has made me question my faith. Like I've been openly atheist for years and I'm now starting to say a little prayer from time to time. My fucking brain hurts man. I'm praying for you, Donald. Save all of our souls.
>>76130884
Without free will he couldn't rebel in the first place. I don't think we'll ever know the mind of a creature that much higher on the order of creation than we are, but whatever the reason it was entirely due to free will. Same as all the other demons.
>>76130818
1 Thessalonians 5:16 Rejoice always, 17 pray without ceasing, 18 give thanks in all circumstances; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.
>>76130935
Been meaning to read that book.
Sounds like a pretty good explanation, thanks
>>76123477
*tips*
What do people think of the fact that Jesus Christs lineage went to Adam and Eve?
I believe it and I know Jesus Christ is real yet this is affront to the worldly beliefs..
Do I just ignore the world or do I look for proof of what God said?
>>76130911
So what's the point in counting your prayers and chanting and using someone's words instead of your own? I don't get it.
Why pray to Mary?
I noticed that Catholics are quite calm because they've heard all the criticism millions of times, they just switch off and don't respond, but as soon as someone criticizes worshipping or praying to another saint, they immediately flip out and spew memes and get angrier.
>>76131016
>she is the mother of all those who believe in Christ. Why do you not want to honour your mother?
That sounds like blasphemy, to imply that God has a wife, when we are not told that in the bible.
>>76131042
Nothing in your posts says to use chanting heathen prayer beads.
>>76131157
Uh. *Everyone's* lineage stems from Adam and Eve by the Biblical account.
>>76131157
Death to the world, brother. Science is just the new cult in vogue.
>>76130712
>>76131226
So where do I go to read about this? I want to know why evolution is wrong.
>>76131212
>That sounds like blasphemy, to imply that God has a wife, when we are not told that in the bible.
nice strawman faggot
>>76131212
It would really help your case if you would quit confusing worship with prayer.
>>76131315
I started with Kent Hovind's seminars and went on from there.
>>76131315
Why worry about it? You're not changing any minds. Focus on your own soul.
>>76131157
Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
1 Ti 1:4 or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God's work--which is by faith.
>>76131271
I only got baptized on March 15th. Forgive my newness. I want to learn more about the lies the world has taught me to replace God.
>>76131315
It's presuppositionalism. It's a chain of unconfirmed and what'd I'd qualify as unconfirm*able* assumptions. Naturalist types needed an account for how life came to be as it is, so they developed one ad hoc.
>>76131299
Honestly I think it's a good idea. There's a lot of people who probably come to these threads because they lack some form of guidance.
What better way to ease others out of degeneracy than with the babby step of "I'm going to wake up at 7:30 AM and go on 4chan for Sunday Mass."
It even felt fucking weird typing that, going to 4chan for Sunday Mass. But honestly I think it'd be effective.
I'm also curious about Christians who argue that we ought to keep the O.T., because it seems like the only reason churches have become more degenerate is by ignoring the clear dictates of the Torah. Obviously we can't sacrifice animals without a functioning altar, but what's so hard about taking Friday evening to Saturday evening off, and not eating shrimp/bacon? Also, iirc, the word used for 'end' of the Law is telos, which can also mean purpose, or goal, which would strongly support the idea that Jesus came to give correct interpretation of the Law, not to change it.
And it just doesn't make sense why God would talk about an eternal Law and covenant while having a backup plan to get rid of it.
That and the fact that Jesus always taught from the Torah would seem to strongly imply that it held valid authority for him.
Or the fact that Paul describes himself as zealous for the Law, and makes a burnt offering with the believers in Acts.
Atheists and others always like to taunt me about my faith when they sarcastically ask if I also don't eat shrimp, or wear mixed fabrics, and are completely and utterly BTFO when I tell them that I do not, and am therefore perfectly consistent with my beliefs to denounce homosexuality as being against the Bible.
The sooner Christians begin following the WHOLE Bible, the sooner we can start reversing the Cultural Marxism which has overtaken the world.
>>76131329
>It would really help your case if you would quit confusing worship with prayer.
Back at you.
>>76131212
>sola scriptura
No. Nothing says to celebrate Christmas on Dec 25th either, or are you one of "those" anons.
>>76130964
my question is whether or not that would be considered latria (worship)
there are actually catholics who practice this, but i realize it's not something prescribed by the church, just allowed.
>>76131515
Who do you know that *DOESN'T* want the OT in the Bible? Without it the NT makes hardly any sense.
>>76131212
>spews memes and then getting butthurt when someone memes back at you
>>76131520
What, pray tell, does that mean?
(note that I am not worshiping you.)
>>76131515
Judaizers get out! OUT OUT OUT
>>76131394
I don't think he's talking about what you think he's talking about. He was addressing bickering from Jews and Gentiles and we are all made one body through Christ.
Yes in this case its futile and pointless but we should be able to tell the world and point out proof of Gods creation without having to use worldly beliefs to do it but look to what God said alone and look for it and find it.
>>76131489
I understand that there are a great deal of assumptions made by evolutionist. I used to read books by them rather religiously and believed in them despite their bickering over which assumptions over more assumptions were okay to make.
It finally clicked to me maybe they don't know what they're talking about. I just want to know where to look for the truth now.
>>76131226
>>76131315
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-Adamite#Racist_pre-Adamism
Christ is a great moralist, borrowing from Hellenic traditions of dualism. We are 100% man, 100% god, and the battle between these two forces is life. I like the Sun imagery and the suffering servant imagery, as well. Are we not made from stars, from suns? are we not all the offspring of this unnameable life force? is true peace in life not found in service to others through a humbling of the ego? this is not to say all egoistic drives are immoral, in fact they are great fuels for future altruism, say, dedicating a life of passionate work to your respective vocation, seeking respect and validation in your field, is in some sense selfish, but a selfishness that is fed back into society as a whole, serving all through your individual strivings.
>>76131443
Understandable. You should start with the baltimore catechism.
>>76131558
>there are actually catholics who practice this
nope
>just allowed
NOPE
Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death
>>76131020
You know it's funny...
Christianity starts with "Deus Vult" and "Remove Degeneracy" but seems to end in heroic self-sacrifice, mercy and compassion in your heart.
SJW and secularism starts with "free love" and "equal rights" but seems to devolve quickly into vanity, enmity and strife.
/pol/ knows what's up.
Recall the very first time that you read the entirety of the canon for your chosen form of Christianity.
Describe your opinions of the apostles for me please.
>>76131663
>He was addressing bickering from Jews and Gentiles
If He was against it then it doesn't make much sense to debate if Christ was really related to ancient Jewish folk characters now does it.
>>76131677
>wikipedia
Sorry but that place is just rife with a lot of lies.
>>76131157
Christ was fully man and fully God, just like the Eucharist is fully bread and wine and fully His body and blood. He descended from Adam, from David through Joseph, yet was conceived immaculately. Christ is a mystery, anon, and requires faith and trust. The Nicene Creed, dude, read it
>>76131315
"evolution" means a lot of things. there's plenty of evidence for things like adaptation and natural selection. it falls apart though when it's used to explain the origin of life and the tree of life.
i like this overview of an old-earth creation model that comports with the biblical account. it explains well some of the problems with darwinian theory and why we are under no obligation to buy wholesale some of its assumptions:
http://www.reasons.org/articles/who-was-adam-an-old-earth-creation-model-for-the-origin-of-humanity
>>76131315
Watch this, to anyone who's unsure about God https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiMqzN_YSXU
>>76131753
i'm going to post this link to show i'm right:
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2011/dec/15/no-role-animal-sacrifice-christianity
and then you're going to say the source is shit, and then i'm going to wonder why i bothered.
How often is the issue of saints and veneration vs worship addressed in catholic apologetics/catechism?
I'm still having doubts as to whether veneration is at best useless or at worse blasphemy.
>>76131515
>I'm also curious about Christians who argue that we ought to keep the O.T
The Torah is pure, and tells us to love God and each other; to be righteous and merciful, to give to the poor, and not to mix with filthy goyim.
Unfortunately the pope has switched to kissing their feet.
The N.T. gives us the same commandments as the Torah, i.e. love God more than anything, and to treat your neighbors how you want to be treated and it's better to be merciful and not to cause foreigners to stumble.
The use of violence is debated, but God hates violence. He personally commanded other nations to be genocided for their behaviour in the O.T. and we aren't required or told to do that any more, we just preach to them.
>>76131878
the theory exists trough.
its a possible answer
>>76131513
I agree wholeheartedly.
>>76131840
2 Peter and Jesus Christ both talked about Noah and the Flood being real. Why wouldn't the rest of Genesis be real as alluded to in the Gospel of John? I find this repulsive to believe its allegory.
>>76131663
They really really *WANT* to know what they're talking about, which is why you find people get so rabid over the subject.
I don't think you can find the truth in this world and *know* it is the truth. You have to make a bet with your beliefs and hope it's the right one. For me that's God/Christ. I can bash on macroevolutionary theory all day, but it's much harder (I think seemingly impossible given the limits of our reasoning) to establish an alternative as *BEING* the case with 100% certainty.
>>76131941
>asking people to pray for you
>at best useless
Wow, I'm sorry for whatever happened to you.
>>76131812
>brave new world
promiscuity and pervasive, more potent drugs are the symptoms of an oppressive, secular society that has lost its sense of the human spirirt, of the truly divine. or as the greeks would say, eudaimonia, living well
>>76131924
Thanks.
>>76131912
Old earth doesn't really match the biblical account in shape or form if we look at the actual Hebrew. I don't want to compromise and be lukewarm about Gods Word.
>>76132103
>Old earth doesn't really match the biblical account in shape or form if we look at the actual Hebrew.
Tell me where in the hebrew it tells us exactly how old Earth is. Tell me where exactly it states how long each of God's periods of creation were.
>>76131928
>thinking Arab peasants count
Thoughts?
