/pol/, let me first get it out of the way that I am pretty new here. I feel relatively in agreement with about 90% of things posted here. The one I have the biggest contention with is the existence of God or gods in general.
I understand religion as a tool of population control and I recognize the aspects of religion that make humans do great things. (Art, charity, Medicine). I believe in the culture of the Catholic Church. I go to confession. I am married to a good Catholic white girl with two beautiful white boys and an adorable white girl. I believe in western civilization.
I just don't believe in god. How do I reconcile this with the fact that my chosen religion, Catholicism, is founded upon a belief in god?
Please no Jew memes. I don't trust the fuckers either, but that doesn't explain the lack of existence in a deity.
>>75720235
>Is it Possible to be an Atheist Catholic
No, you would be a heretic and would be in line to be excommunicated.
>>75720512
Are you implying then, that a man who donates a large portion of his wealth to the church should just give up on one of the pillars of Western Civilization because he doesn't believe in God?
>>75720802
Denying any major doctrines of the catholic faith makes you a heretic which is punishable by automatic excommunication. The catholic faith is founded upon the Holy Trinity, yada yada yada.
Study your own religion before shit posting on /pol/. Look in book VI of the code of canon law for all the shit your not suppossed to do.
I dont believe in god but im still active in my church
>>75721078
Well, the Church has great reasons for a lot of what they do. It's just that they offer little in terms of evidence of the actual existence of god.
>>75720802
Um, yes.
>>75720235
It's weird because I'm the opposite. Convinced of the existence of God but have a hard time with organized religion.
You can certainly live your life as you describe it. Catholicism is a beautiful religion, and Christianity is the great root of western civilization.
On the other hand (and I think this is the better path) you can try to accept the fact that God is real.
I know you may have a visceral reaction against this line of thought, embrace this and ask yourself if you have been truely open to the actual idea that an all-powerful being may have caused the universe to exist.
Allow yourself to be receptive to this thought. I suggest listening to some classical music or experiencing some sort of great art. (I think of Stanley Kubricks 2001 a space Odyssey). Find some sublime beauty in this world and search for a feeling of transcendence. This reality we exist in is fragile.
After this research the actual philosophy of theism and understand the rational arguments for the existence of God. (Read this article http://www.reasonablefaith.org/popular-articles-does-god-exist)
I hope you will consider this path OP. I think it could make you a very content and happy man and bring your life into balance.
Good luck OP. I've said a prayer for you. God bless you.
Why does everyone here mention they're white?
Isn't that the fucking standard for being a racist, misogynist?
You are looking for Confucianism my friend.
I personally am a Taoist Christian. I do not believe god is a single entity, rather god is the universe.
>>75720235
Yes.
Do you think you're the first Catholic to have lost faith?
You are an atheist not an Atheist.
>>75720235
Roleplaying as christian is cancer.
Kill yourself
>>75721193
Then you should probably look within yourself for some answers and find another group to be in, because your own church is not going to be accepting of your beliefs.
>>75721419
My priest differs in his interpretation of my actions. But than again, I do tell him constantly I have issues believing in God.
>>75721333
White men are the most feminist "men". Actually maybe jews are more.
Also 7/10 bait
>>75721193
>It's just that they offer little in terms of evidence of the actual existence of god.
What exactly would you accept as evidence?
>>75720235
Prove it doesn't exist
>>75720235
Here's the proof that it does exist before you start calling out my fallacy
>>75721717
I'm not making the claim God exists. I can't prove a negative.
>>75720235
>I just dont believe in God
read Summa Theologica or City of God
>>75720235
>Is it Possible to be an Atheist Catholic?
it's considered a form of heterodoxy, and is deemed heretical by most
>>75721419
It's better than him becoming a militant atheist, besides there is no such thing as a perfect christian, that's why we are christians anyway because we recognize our rotten nature
>>75721785
Trump is the 3rd coming
>>75720235
A lot of theologians in the Church have been atheists. Certainly you wouldn't want to be open about it, but I find a strict belief in God isn't all that important.
>>75720512
>>75720235
The Pope is so why not
>>75720235
Sometimes I wish those were something else than cardboard.
>>75722046
Do not get me started on that guy. Trust me when I say that a large number of affluent Catholics in my diocese do not agree with him.
>>75721785
Make my sides great again
>>75721691
Nothing.
>>75722046
The Pope is the living representative of God on earth in catholic belief, why would he not believe in himself when he is essentially God?
I disagree with everything he has done, i am a former catholic, but to say he is an atheist is stretching it.
>Atheist
>Catholic
Pick one you fucking mongrel
>>75722435
>The Pope is the living representative of God on earth in catholic belief
still human
why would he not believe in himself when he is essentially God?
To name himself God would be blasphemy
>>75720235
Jesus existed. He died and rose again, then appeared to his disciples.
https://carm.org/analysis-pre-pauline-creed-1-corinthians-151-11
http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics-more/resurrection-evidence.htm
To believe in this is to believe in God. To disbelieve in this is to not be a Christian, let alone a Catholic. Moreoever, there are even more great reasons to believe God exists:
http://www.amazon.com/Aquinas-Beginners-Guide-Edward-Feser/dp/1851686908
I recommend you read that book.
>>75722585
That's what I am doing, keep up.
>>75722648
He doesnt have to name himself as God, he is the living representative of God on earth. Every Pope is the successor to the Apostle Peter, and has the authority to dictate the faith and doctrine as he sees fit as long as he holds that title.
>>75722680
Thank you. I've been recommended St. Thomas Aquinas by my priest a few times.
Will this however, answer the question, Is God real or was Jesus just a man?
>>75722137
It is allowable to use normal bread for communion. It's just that it is hard to properly preserve after transubstantiation.
Are you braindead or something? What kind of a question is this?
This is your question:
>CAN I FAITHLESSLY HOLD ONTO THE FAITH
The answer is no. There is no illogic you can apply to reconcile faithlessness with faith.
>>75720235
I thought most modern christians were atheists.
>>75720235
>Is it Possible to be an Atheist Catholic?
>>75722938
Okay, suggest alternatives to giving up the culture and traditions I have grown up and supported.
>>75723000
Can confirm these trips are accurate to how I feel.
>>75722875
Aquinas will show why it makes perfect sense to think that God does exist, and so yes is real.
If Jesus was merely a man then He couldn't have done the things He did, or have inspired the Apostles to do the things that they themselves did.
>>75722037
This is heresy
Fake it till you make it.
>>75722864
He's not God though. That is heresy
>>75722680
>Jesus existed
Nope.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79Lmmy2jfeo
>>75720235
Why would you want to be? The whole point of being Catholic is the tradition of the Church, leading from Paul. It's highly dogmatic around the belief in God. If you want to choose the Christian attitude, you don't need to pray or attend Mass at all.
>>75723418
What you don't preach can't hurt you anon. Being an atheist is not a good reason to abandon Catholicism, regardless of your status as a heretic.
>>75723458
My priest told me that God still recognizes the works of a Catholic.
>Christian Atheism
>Christian atheism is a theological position in which the belief in the transcendent or interventionist God is rejected or absent in favor of finding God totally in the world, sometimes after a literal death of God (Thomas J. J. Altizer) or following Jesus in a Godless world (William Hamilton). Hamilton's Christian atheism is similar to Jesuism, which is an interpretation of Jesus as a philosopher rather than a religious figure. Slavoj Zizek is also interested in the idea of christian atheism, seeing Christianity as a fundamentally atheist idea, and at the same time theology as fundamentally necessary for meaningful moving forward in society.
>While most christian atheists see God (at least a sentient god, though the word atheism might imply even rejection of pantheism) as something that never existed, and the goal of theology to work out what religion means in this light, Altizer is a well-known Christian atheist who is known for his literal approach to the death of God. He often speaks of God's death as a redemptive event. He said that God being an archaic primal source could only allow humanity to move forward with its own extinction, since otherwise it would always exist as a focus. And that the concept of fallen angels has a parallel in the fallen or self emptying God. God physically incarnated as Jesus Christ, who on his death remained dead forever. (Note that this is in contrast to Tillich who despite thinking God is non sentient thinks it must be a focus).
>>75720235
I'm a Catholic who struggled with the same problem and I will tell you what I found.
It is very easy to find that there are good arguments for the existence of a singular object that is agreeable to be defined as God. I prefer Anselm's argument, but Acquinas' are probably better. The problem is that even though we can be convinced of a Godlike object, we currently have no objective, scientific, or reason based way of knowing all it's possible attributes; therefore, we can't know if any specific version of God is the object we can successfully argue to exist. Thus we are left with a choice:
The ultimate problem of Free Will. We can choose to be rational and reject the unsupportable specific details of the Catholic concept of God, or we can utilize Free Will to believe in the irrational simply because we choose to. That is real faith, and that is why I choose to be Catholic.
Now I'm not a priest, I just had 12 years of Catholic School and a lot of time to think. My views are probably not completely in line with the church, but I wanted to share.
>>75723097
If it makes you feel better, most people who claim to be Catholic are actually faithless apostates just like you. They are ethnically, culturally "Catholic" but they have failed in holding the faith, so really they are just Godless apostates that superficially do the things Catholics tend to do.
Pope Leo XIII, Satis Cognitum:
>The practice of the Church has always been the same, as is shown by the unanimous teaching of the Fathers, who were wont to hold as outside Catholic communion, and alien to the Church, whoever would recede in the least degree from any point of doctrine proposed by her authoritative Magisterium. Epiphanius, Augustine, Theodoret, drew up a long list of the heresies of their times. St. Augustine notes that other heresies may spring up, to a single one of which, should any one give his assent, he is by the very fact cut off from Catholic unity. "No one who merely disbelieves in all (these heresies) can for that reason regard himself as a Catholic or call himself one. For there may be or may arise some other heresies, which are not set out in this work of ours, and, if any one holds to one single one of these he is not a Catholic" (S. Augustinus, De Haeresibus, n. 88).
Most American "Catholics" support birth control, so as a matter of fact most American "Catholics" are outside of the faith and alien to the Church, regardless of whether they continue to go to Mass or do whatever things they do.
Vatican 1, Dogmatic Constitution
>Since, then, without faith it is impossible to please God [21] and reach the fellowship of his sons and daughters, it follows that no one can ever achieve justification without it, neither can anyone attain eternal life unless he or she perseveres in it to the end.
You 100% will go to hell for your faithlessness.
Considering that faith is above reason, and a supernatural grace, I recommend in the first that you pray for faith. Pray the hail mary, pray the rosary, and ask God for faith.
He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
>>75722864
>has the authority to dictate the faith and doctrine as he sees fit as long as he holds that title.
>a human has the authority to control God's rules and way of worship
30 different levels of bullshit right there
>atheist catholic
so the pope?
>>75724407
That is a totally false representation of what the pope can do. The pope can merely defend the divine posit of faith, that absolute truth which was entrusted to St. Peter. This is by condemning heresy and clarifying what is that uncreated truth which always existed.
>>75720235
Transubstantiation. Look that shit up. It's weird. Will make you believe less. I believe in God though, but I'm not catholic. I'm not really helping your argument. I just thought you should educate yourself and learn something new. Not a lot of people know what Transubstantiation is, but your pic relates to it. That's why I thought you should read up on it.
>>75720235
It is absolutely possible, Christianity is a religion, a mythology and an system of ethics. You as an individual can take it whatever way you want. Just as most mythology is a collection of parables designed to teach a way of living, the same can be said of the bible. For instance, pride is the cardinal sin of Christianity which promotes humility and modesty. This is something that is often lost on ultra-religious. It is not your place to judge others for their shortcomings and you should diligently confess and apologize for your own. You should be a good person to the best of your ability, be brave in the face of weakness, never underestimate the power of a small act of kindness, and instill those ideals in your children. This is the true way to achieve immortality, by leaving a positive impact that echoes for an eternity.
>/pol/ is degenerate as fuck.
Why would God be bound by his creations' rules?
Read Boethius OP
>>75724536
Correct
he may be a representative, but he is still human and far from God
>>75720235
If you're in a situation where you would benefit outwardly by acting like a faithful Christian, you should definitely do this. Having a wife who is a practicing Christian is a really good reason to either go through the motions or even participate in the church community.
You should explain your beliefs to your wife and what you stated here if you believe she will take it in a neutral/good way.
>>75723097
Not our responsibility.
IF no god, it literally does not matter what you do.
IF god, it matters what you do.
We're only telling you that if there is no god the onus is on YOU to defend why you would hold those traditions/culture, since God is the very reason they worth pursuing over the alternatives. Reject God and they're as valuable as anything. IE: absolutely worthless.
It doesn't make you a bad person to not believe in God. Shit. The people in Santa Biblia believed because he was more of a presence. They could see a direct correlation of power between God and the physical realm. The text also says that the "Devils believe and tremble", they can see the working of spiritual power. Text says that man is a little below what an angel is, but if you think about it, Jesus didn't die for angels. Jesus didn't come talk to angels and heal them. They're robots, created to do a certain thing. The entire point of the religious text isn't to give you a set of rules, or a religion per se. It's a guidebook to how God thinks. And what he wishes to get from mankind. Sort of like a lovemployee letter. It's put in place so that you can see the ways that God deals with man. Of course, if you really get into it, and read for yourself, you soon find that God seems to be finding the best way to co-exist with us. BUT thno of it this way. If I was a kid that created an ant farm and watched them grow and populate and do their thing, I wouldn't have a relationship with the individual ants, I wouldn't understand what made them tick. Hell, I would need to study them for weeks to really know them as a species. Now imagine speaking everything into existence, that one sentence "let there be light" exploding outward and creating suns, galaxies, galactic cluster, and so on, into what seemed to be an infinite space. God would need to be outside of that to be omniscient and omnipresent. He would have to be so fundamentally, unbelievably large and intelligent, we wouldn't even begin to be able to measure him. That is science, not religion. So if gods that unmeasurable how the fucking hell do people think that they can just demand God show himself, or beg for proof? We're nothing but a whisper in eternity. If there is a God, meditating and bettering yourself, becoming more than just another existence, would be the way to his heart. But what do I know.
>>75725010
My wife is aware and this has not caused much issue because she and I consider it a personal struggle. A good woman is very supportive.
>>75720235
>The one I have the biggest contention with is the existence of God or gods in general.
so the world came out of nowhere and there is nothing metaphyiscal being responsible for it in the first place? how is that supposed to work? is that what you can't even grasp as a basic concept? like seriously, look at yourself, you can't even take that into consideration because the fedora sits too tight with you.
>I understand religion as a tool of population control and I recognize the aspects of religion that make humans do great things. (Art, charity, Medicine).
you understood NOTHING. religion is based around the big questions. as in "where do we go after we die?"
"tool of population control" is not a fucking thing in a decent religion. it's about spiritual guidance. that's the important part. so that life doesn't seem that fucking terrible anymore and so that even a retard fedora has a religious community backing them once shit hits the fan. how many atheist groups are there that have the same kind of compassion while virtually not upholding any ideals.
also, "make believe in god, /pol/" is usually not going to end well if you don't have any connection to it yourself. some feel the spirit and some would rather see themselves as soulless bio-robots. I'd rather feel the holy spirit if you ask me. even with heart and soul aside, that's a no-brainer.
>>75720235
Why don't you believe in God? Now, there's no hard evidence, but I've seen enough weird shit that can't be explained logically, however can be explained via the Catholic Church's beliefs that have convinced me that God is real. Not only that, but have you ever seen the miracles? The Eucharistic Miracle of Lanciano, for example, where in the eighth century, a priest gave a prayer over the Eucharist, and the Eucharist turned into a piece of flesh and a cup of blood. It was kept until 1970, where it was tested. They found that it was real flesh and real blood, that the flesh was from the wall of the heart, that the flesh and blood shared the same genetic code, and this is the kicker, the flesh and the blood were in extraordinary condition, hardly any decay at all, and there was no sign of any preservatives whatsoever. The tests were done again in 1981. Now, you tie this in with the fact that a lot of saints' bodies tend to decay much slower than that of a regular person, and the fact that the Eucharist is the body and blood of Christ, and you've got an interesting thing. And that miracle is one of many.
