Stefan Molyneux is absolutely insane. He actually thinks a peaceful, stable society could exist without any government present at all.
He has other good points that make sense but his understanding of human nature is virtually zero. For a person who has read Aristotle and others how can he fall flat on this?
>>75668585
He probably hasn't even read Aristotle. He has a MA in history.
He has figured out the truth by now, but is scared that he will lose his audience if he goes full redpill
Now that he has accepted that he does it for the money, he's not so worried with keeping up his philosopher personality. Instead he's now making videos to get more viewers; such as movies and video-game reviews
>>75668780
He claimed in one of his videos countries invade other countries to take over their tax system. This guy is retarded.
>>75668585
>>75668585
He also tries to convince people to break all contact with their parents EVEN IF THEY SAY THEIR PARENTS DID NOTHING WRONG TO THEM because he has severe mummy issues.
>>75668585
>Peaceful stable society without governments
A limited, minimalist government is a good thing.
No government would be gay as hell.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CM_--di7L8
>>75669377
Not an argument.
>>75669377
He's never experienced any real parenting throughout his childhood. It's amazing that this
is the most fucked up he ever turned out to be, considering how fucking insane abused kids tend to grow up to be.
I suppose he tells people to cut their parents off if they refuse to even attempt to see their way; he probably thinks that abuse is a much more likely circumstance than it actually might be.
>>75669730
He literally said he'd have murdered his mother is she wasn't his mother and also constantly talks about spanking and how bad it is. He's got severe mummy issues.
I know not an argument is a meme,
but I've literally never seen an argument against this guy.
>>75670088
ONE DOLLUH
>>75670088
I've never heard him make an argument himself
dude just rambles on being smug for an hour
>>75670088
NOT
AN
ARGUMENT!!
DO YOU SUPPORT ME BEING SHOT
>>75668585
If we gas all the sub 100 IQ trash, it could easily exist.
>>75668585
He argues it on a very hypothetical basis from our current situation. A generation or 2 down the line, everyone brought up with these values. Not just flipping a switch and magically no longer having government.
What's so exceptionally odd about Stefbot is that he tries to unify AnClapism with "virtue" and empathy when the axiom of AnClapism is just liberty. Most Anclaps do not give a singular fuck about how their society turns out as long as property rights and NAP are obeyed. For example just look at Murray Rothbards psychopathic ramblings about how parents have the right to let their children starve because the children are their property, and how they can just sell them and there will be a "flourishing market of children". Or any time they call any sorts of horrors that must be tolerated "a tribute to our liberty". A choice between starvation and wageslavery is completely legitimate according to libertarian thought because it is, after all, a choice.
Generally he just keeps harping on about how initiation of force is evil, period. I guess that's because it's a pretty simple point to make that anyone can understand while political theorizing is complex and doesn't get views.
>>75668585
He also thinks that parents spanking their children is one of the most paramount, serious issues facing the world today, and that rectifying it is one of the few factors that will lead to a utopia. I'm not exaggerating any of that--regardless of where you fall on the issue of spanking, he genuinely does believe that if all parents were to stop spanking their children tomorrow, it would usher in a new era of peace. The guy's a maniac.
>>75668585
By his own logic his world view is warped because he had an abusive mother and a nonexistent father figure.
>>75669032
>full redpill
give it to me Pablo.
The Jewess controlls everything? I already know that.
>>75671359
I'm quite curious to see how his daughter will turn out.
I'm actually curious, how does he envision a stateless society functioning?
Without a tax-sponsored legislative government, police force and justice system, who would create, enforce and uphold laws? Does he think that everyone will spontaneously agree upon a universal ethical system and willingly stick to it under all circumstances?
How would scientific research that has no immediately obvious practical applications get funding? Think LHC and similar big expensive projects. No profit-oriented business would ever invest in something like that.
I get that 'Who would build the roads?' isn't an argument, since companies could still build roads on land they own and charge people fees to maintain them. But would planning and maintaining roads really be done as well by companies as by governments? Like, if a company built a really shitty and dangerous road that people HAD to use, like on a mountain pass with no alternative road for hundreds miles, what incentive would that company have to build a better road? In the case of a government, people could hold their elected officials accountable if someone died on that road.
I agree that smaller governments are usually better, but no government at all just doesn't seem like it could work.
>>75668585
Keep whining you butthurt faggot. You're just making him stronger.
>>75671230
>AnClapism with "virtue" and empathy
advertisment.
>>75670525
This
>>75671957
>How would scientific research that has no immediately obvious practical applications get funding?
He doesn't want it to
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UB9kkmwR5w
"Fuck Physics, go make iPhones"
What does /pol/ think of based Bill Whittle?
Is he redpilled?
>>75670525
Lol no it couldn't, retard. Then you'd just get conquered by smarter people.
>>75669036
Are you sure you didn't mishear him?
I thought he might have been referring to when the US interfered in the Iraqi economy and then abandoned it once it went to shit, basically destabilising the whole economy.
>>75672603
This fucking bot again.
>>75672344
Wow, that's just tragic.
You could easily argue that philosophy, which is his self-proclaimed occupation, is just as if not much more useless than theoretical scientific research.
He makes some good points on certain topics, but Stef really is cognitive dissonance personified.
>>75669897
If you feel the need to physically abuse your child, it means you don't respect them and cannot control them, they'll never want to learn the world from your perspective because all they see and will remember is violent abuse. Hitting a child is cowardly and pathetic frankly.
>>75668585
Yes. Without visible government. Rule by corporations.
Because government can be elected and the people are too retarded to stand up for democracy.
So it is possible, that corporations would just cancel public politics.
>>75672344
>Shilling your political opinion on the Internet for handouts is more valuable than expanding our understanding of the universe.
>>75671957
Alot of those things can easily be administered by normal fucking people why should the politicos play middlemen to the elites. cut the middleman out and learn to wipe your own ass...when it comes to life. Putting your trust and sovereingty in the hands of businessmen was never really guna fucking work out.
>>75668585
with white people alone, it'd work
but you need strong borders to keep it white
>>75671512
the guy is intelligent but you can see the cracks begin to show when he talks about his own upbringing
i believe him when he says he had it hard, but you can tell he is still deeply troubled by it
/pol/ is so bad at making arguments on WHY Molymeme is insane. It's hilarious.
>>75672830
>You could easily argue that philosophy, which is his self-proclaimed occupation, is just as if not much more useless than theoretical scientific research.
That's his stance. If you want to learn about philosophy, do it in the agora. He's doing it on Youtube, not in Academia.
Same thing with Physics. If it's useful, you don't need taxpayer's blood money.
>>75669032
this, note how he's toned down the anarchism shit a lot in his newer content
History pretty much proves you need an external authority to keep peace.
You can even manage to have some form of anarchism working but it's worth shit because your authoritan neighbor gonna fucking destroy you.
>>75668585
You can read between the lines that his vision is government with absolutely minimal power that the people can overthrow easily or even people's government, kind of mob rule but without mouthbreathers demanding unreasonable things.
Of course if there was an external and powerful threat liberty would have to suffer, but he never talks about that kind of scenarios.
>>75671230
No one is going to sell their children in our day and age, retard. These slippery slopes are so desperate.
Any way you look at it, parents who starve their children automatically get eliminated from the gene pool.
>>75673119
Problem is the female parenting skills for whites makes each successive generation worse.
>>75672830
>>75673017
I can't believe you are this retarded. If you can get people to voluntarily fund your theoretical physics research, he would actually promote the fuck out of you, but if you can't get people to do that, then you should better put your intellect to productive use instead of living off government handouts.
>>75669032
>>75673388
>People still don't understand why Molymeme is shifting paradigms
Because of immigrations policies + welfare, the white secular culture will disappear in no time. Before establishing a peaceful society and a free market, you have to learn some self-defense first.
That's not throwing every principles out of the window, it's self-defense + survivalism.
>>75668585
>people are so violent that we need a government full of people to protect us
Either your claim is true and thus the last thing we should do is give people power or your claim is false and we don't need government to protect us.
>>75673146
I always thought he sounded more vindictive than traumatized or unstable because of it.
>>75671957
>who would create, enforce and uphold laws?
There would be no government and therefore no laws. Are you fucking retarded?
"Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one." - Thomas Paine
>>75673278
Stef's stuff is sponsored by donations. That works since the cost of one dude recording himself on a camera and maintaining a website isn't ridiculously high.
Individual donations aren't going to build you a particle accelerator that costs billions of dollars to build and maintain, though.
Plus, the usefulness of a lot of scientific research isn't always immediately evident, but could still lead to huge improvements to technology and society down the line.
>>75673669
>No one is going to sell their children in our day and age, retard.
Not a fucking argument. This is exactly what the founding father of AnClapism argued you fucking retard.
>These slippery slopes are so desperate.
It's not a slippery slope. He's fucking explicit about and and literally even argues against any other interpretation. How about you actually read his works.
>Any way you look at it, parents who starve their children automatically get eliminated from the gene pool.
Sociopathy isn't some genetically heritable trait you fucking retard.
>>75668585
He believes that is the natural progression of humanity. He doesn't think we can just abolish the government today and everything will be great. He disagrees with Donald Trump fundamentally on almost every issue, but still defends him because he understands we are reaching a point of no return in regards to government expansion. The founding fathers made the push for less government, and we have been regressing back to tyranny with every year the government grows larger. You clearly don't understand his argument, and thus, your 'argument' is not an argument.
>>75671957
>Does he think that everyone will spontaneously agree upon a universal ethical system and willingly stick to it under all circumstances?
He believes that social ostracism will essentially create this. The problem is he overestimates the average person. The average white with 100 IQ doesn't even have basic philosophical or moral knowledge, they need religion to shove values down their throats, in other words they will just be indoctrinated by whatever authority figure exists at the time. Forget about your typical spic or black. If everyone was a Molyneux, then an anarchist society not could but would exist, but the physical realities of our condition seems to be ignored by him. The dumbness of your average voter has created what we have today - massive statism and irrationality. It just is.
>>75673949
So privatize and do some R/D ?
Or is physics so fucking useless that literally nobody want to pay billions of dollar for simulating black holes?
>TFW you realize all of these comments are ad hominem insults
>>75668585
>his understanding of human nature is virtually zero
Le "homo homini lupus" meme.
If all governments disappeared tomorrow, we would have a small period of massive chaos and violence, sure, but then we would settle back into peaceful communities.
Humans are tribal by nature, mister "I know human nature". Put a hundred of them together and they organize themselves spontaneously and give themselves rules that they respect on their own, because they realize that they need the support of the rest of the community to survive and thrive. Put a thousand of them together and they will spontaneously divide themselves into 3-4 tribes of like-minded people. Groups small enough (google Dunbar's number) that nobody can break the rules or profit from other people's work without being immediately identified and punished/expelled.
A complete anarchist society could, in fact, be very organized and peaceful. Countless tribes managed to do it for tens of millennia.
>>75673905
So what would stop society from becoming The Purge 365 days a year?
>>75673995
People who would do this kind of stuff would be socially ostracized so hard that they would stop.
If not, their children are going to be so fucked up that they won't survive in a cooperative environment.
https://twitter.com/StefanMolyneux/status/737664293836103680
hes linking infowars now hes gone mental
>white male talking about philosophy
>Privelleged
This guy is just as fake as Trump about policies.
baka
>>75674396
You go to war with the army you have.
>>75674541
id really like it if alex stopped talking about the antichirst and chemtrails
>>75668780
>He has a MA in history.
isn't it philosophy? I think his bachelor is history.
>>75673942
I used to be an AnCap meme but after failing to understand how an NAP could be inforced in the world I feel that a very limited government is a necessary evil for the protection of the individuals property rights and nothing else.
>>75673995
>Not a fucking argument
You don't understand what an argument is then.
>It's not a slippery slope.
It is the common pattern: if we legalize x, everyone is going to start abusing it. It's presumptive and obnoxious.
>Sociopathy isn't some genetically heritable trait you fucking retard.
That's why people have a strong desire to nurture their children instead of starving them or selling them into slavery, the people who did that were eliminated from the gene pool, this isn't hard, Sven.
>>75674242
>A complete anarchist society could, in fact, be very organized and peaceful. Countless tribes managed to do it for tens of millennia
>implying those tribes weren't in a state of non-stop endemic warfare
>>75674188
>haha he has this no argument meme so funny xD
>what do you mean I have no arguments, it's just a meme you idiot
>omg stop muh feelings reeee cult leader white CIS male nazi trump
Love Stefbot threads, exposes all the invaders.
>>75669036
What's retarded about that? Taxing a conquered populace is a classic motivation for war.
>>75673278
You know that without quantum mechanics you wouldnt be able to write any message here,as transitors could would have not been invented right? Things like lasers,nuclear energy,missiles or electricity were developed by this nerds that only play with toys. This bold motherfucker is just a cult leader and a moron if he thinks that putting people like Laurence or Faraday in making Iphones would bring more things to the table.
>>75671037
Underrated post
Yea ancaps are pretty retarded. Private industry definitely does everything more efficiently, but with zero government intervention theres no stopping companies from dumping their toxic waste onto playgrounds. And we know companies will do this, because they did it until the EPA existed.
>>75674764
>It's not gonna happen cuz I say so!!!
Is not an argument. So on top of being a psychopath you are also braindamaged. Either come up with a real reason why people wouldn't starve their children or stop posting.
>It is the common pattern: if we legalize x, everyone is going to start abusing it. It's presumptive and obnoxious.
Why don't you tell that to Rothbard? He's the one who argued that this would happen. What part of "we will have a flourishing market of children" is your tiny rat brain unable to comprehend?
>muh meme idea of biology tells me that evil people get wiped out because they don't procreate hahaha because the evil is like in their genes haha
This is what you sound like.
stef kinda strikes me as a borderline insane cokehead
>>75674178
Yeah,because companies are always investing for projects that would run loses for 50 years straight,eventhough,that research cpuld lead to fucking warp travel. You ancaps cant understand that the indivodual if it isnt backed by a strong leviathan behind it,would never achieve anything. Everything high tech that you are using was at first a useless meme,but know things like X rays or Computers are huge things in our daily lifes
>>75675368
no one here is pro ancap were all just waiting for stef to turn authoritarian
>>75675562
I'm an anarchist though.
>>75673493
This
>>75674242
>we would settle back into new goverments or goverment like figures. Dont be delusional. That happened once and we ended up with socialism. Ending the goverment is a meme. Privatizing it in the other hand would be viable.
>>75675638
Then move to somalia
>>75672648
>Then you'd just get conquered by smarter people.
Aren't we all already?
>>75675038
Hi fellow swiss, let me give you some examples of non argument
>is absolutely insane
adhom
>He actually thinks (...)
Poisoning the well
> but his understanding of human nature is virtually zero
A claim with no arguments
>how can he fall flat on this?
Poisoning the well
>He probably hasn't even read Aristotle
False. He recently made a video about Aristotle, one of his favorite philosopher.
>but is scared that he will lose his audience if he goes full redpill
Not true, he shifted from prevention to survivalism.
>He also tries to convince people to break all contact with their parents EVEN IF THEY SAY THEIR PARENTS DID NOTHING WRONG TO THEM
tries to convince is a weasel word. He suggest therapy and recommend professional guidance. The "NOTHING WRONG" is a clear mischaracterization. Abuse has a shifting defintion but spanking, neglect, etc ... are defined as abuse and have repercussions.
>(He's wrong) because he has severe mummy issues
Not an argument
See? Nothing is even worth discussing. You can dismiss pretty much everything as attacks or fallacies.
>>75675685
>we would settle back into new goverments or goverment like figures.
Dont be delusional. That happened once and we ended up with socialism. Ending the goverment is a meme. Privatizing it in the other hand would be viable.
Fucked up the greentext
>>75675638
my dude there will literally be a tollbooth at every inch of your beloved privately owned and maintained strips of "road"
thats what an ancap paradise looks like
>>75675558
That's what Microsoft did though. 10+ years of investment for a GUI. Also don't compare physicists and engineers because engineers do work for their money where physicists are hidden in Academia.
But yeah, that's why nobody wants physicists to get billions of dollars because the return on investment is poor. Deal with it and stop being a fucking dead weight on society.
>>75668585
>He actually thinks a peaceful, stable society could exist without any government present at all.
you mean like this one did? https://mises.org/library/pennsylvanias-anarchist-experiment-1681-1690
>nine years
>it didn't eat itself alive... a government came in and took over
government is force. it is an inherent violation of the non-aggression principle, and it is nothing but a nice word people use when they don't want to say "mafia."
there is a battle shaping up in the world.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/1970/01/roy-a-childs-jr/objectivism-and-the-state-an-open-letter-to-ayn-rand/
and you are on the side God will cast into the pit when he puts an end to it.
>>75673493
Throughout most of history, armies had far better weapons and armor than were available to the common people. In a country like the US, if the government were dissolved, nothing would stop the common people from producing or owning automatic weapons, ballistic weapons, full Kevlar armor, etc. Who would invade a stateless America? Canada? How could they beat a guerilla army over 150,000,000 strong in their own territory? Look at Vietnam.
>>75675834
Exactly, that's why I like the not an argument phrase. Because when discussing political matters, only arguments matter.
It's also no suprise that OP is cancuck posting.
>>75675927
Consumers own an ancap market. Nobody will pay for services that are so fucking inconvenient if they're not forced to. If the money leaves a company because they try to monetize every single road with toll booths, the company will fail and someone will find a way to draw in their former customers. Capitalism.
>>75676071
>Also don't compare physicists and engineers because engineers do work for their money where physicists are hidden in Academia.
>Says this using a laptop that would have never been developed with transitors that were a direct result of a "meme" theory like Quantum mechanics.
Pls have a brain. The private sector is not capitalized enough to take care of research,until megacorporations arises,ancap is only a backwards ideology,as private companies havent been able yet to open a fucking nuclear plant by themselfs,let alone take care of the world's research supply.
>>75675537
>Either come up with a real reason why people wouldn't starve their children or stop posting.
I already explained the rationale 2 times why people don't starve their children, you can you know go outside if you don't believe me. Your blatant non argument spamming is retarded, Sven I expect better of you.
>>muh meme idea of biology tells me that evil people get wiped out because they don't procreate hahaha because the evil is like in their genes haha
>strawman
Relax Sven, you don't want to be indebted to us again because of your reckless destruction.
>>75674242
In the study of social animals there is always an Alpha male leading a group of betas, and sometimes an Alpha female.
Humans are animals and are no difference in this respect when returned to the primal state.
In a complete stateless society you really think no one would try to take over and lead the others? You are naive if you think so.
Eventually an ambitious individual would seize power with the help of other men serving him. What he did with that power nobody knows, but it would just revert right back to the dictator-type system of government common to ancient & medieval times.
>>75676423
No you get it backwards: taxpayers money is used to fund "research" that's pure gambling. Where's the accountability on that?
If billions of dollars goes somewhere that may discover subparticles, I'd rather not pay these shitters.
On the other hand, if you got some R/D stuff, I'll buy the next computer/gadget.
The only way that ancap could work is through huge insurance companies that totally replace the state,and people could choose the insurance that they want,but this insurance companies would become megacorporations,which I really dont know if they are preferable to the state. Other than that ancap is a meme.
>>75676139
You would just get divided and conquered. It's why you need a uniform national defense. Go read some history.
>>75676423
>SpaceX
>>75676139
>Canada
I like how you had to choose the most pathetic country imaginable.
What about russia? What if russia just decided to fucking nuke everything im the us? Ballistic missiles and infinite count magazines isn't gonna do fucking shit.
Of course, we do have a missile defense system... but who's employing the people who run and maintain it? Who improve it? Who trains them? Who is paying the trainers?
The.
Fucking.
Government.
Find me a billionaire who's capable of paying for everything I described. He'll, find me a corporation that can do it.
>>75676609
>please don't hurt me o great one i concede!
It doesn't matter how often you explain a wrong thing, it will still be wrong. It's not my fault you aren't intellectually capable.
>>75669036
Well, it's not wrong; it may not be the sole reason for invasion but it's not wrong.
>>75674242
>if all governments disappeared tomorrow
Literally impossible. If we dissolved our own government we would be invaded by a country that did not.
Government is necessary to prevent your people from being enslaved to another one.
>>75677016
>>75676926
>>75676885
>>75676872
>>75676652
>>75676609
>>75676423
>>75676329
>>75676297
>>75676139
>>75676133
>>75676071
>>75675927
>>75675840
>>75675834
>>75675771
>>75675720
>>75675685
>>75675657
>>75675638
>>75675562
>>75675558
>>75675546
>>75675537
>>75675368
>>75675201
>>75675142
>>75675088
>>75675038
>>75674764
>>75674880
>>75674723
>>75674640
>>75674635
>>75674541
>>75674460
>>75674396
>>75674350
>>75674281
>>75674242
>>75674188
>>75674178
>>75674043
>>75674038
>>75673995
>>75673949
>>75673942
>>75673905
>>75673778
>>75673701
>>75673678
>>75673675
Not an Argument.
>>75676139
You still need a centralized command to maintain the army. They provide strategies self regulating militias would otherwise lack, and enforce a homogenous army under the personality of a single individual. There would never be an army 150,000,000 strong, we live in a diverse country so you'd only have factions waring with each other over what the future if their country should be.
Vietnam has no where near the size and amount of different cultures that America has.
>>75669032
>>75668780
>>75668585
>>75677078
>>75677031
Also not Arguments
>>75676872
>taxpayers money is used to fund "research"
You know that what you describe as "research" is literally everywhere right now. X-rays,missiles,satellites,computers,mother cells, modern medicine and the likes has made the world a way better place and has set up clear patterns for future research. Quantum mechanics is what made transitors posible,and you wouldnt imagine how influential is that.
Research has to be paid by tax payers,because companies are not capitalized enough to take control of them,as companies just invest a small fraction of theur budget in true research. Ig companies were bigger,you may argue about the viability of it,but as they dont have the capital the simple idea of fully provatising it is dumb. The peivate sector hasnt been able to fully finance a nuclear plant,how the hell do you expect them to go farther into research? Or do you really belief that behind your laptop there is not a huge acumulated theoretical research?
>>75674242
Im starting to notice a similarity between communists and libertarians. Fanatics in both groups claim that their ideology can only work if the entire world adheres to it.
>>75676926
Presumptive stupidity. How does one conquer a stateless society? What makes you think that such a society would be unified to begin with? Again, is Canada going to send 2 million troops into a land of hundreds of millions of gun owners with no central authority or government infrastructure to dominate? Is China going to build a navy and send all 10 million of its troops to get slaughtered here?
Besides, a uniform national defense can be provided as insurance or perhaps even for free by multiple cooperating militias. It's not that hard to imagine how the completely fucking useless government could be replaced by concerned citizens during a power vacuum.
>>75677016
A space agency that was about to go bankrupt until NASA bail them out,and most of its money comes through goverment aid? Is that the best that you can come with. Megacorporations havent happen yet,and until they occur no goverment is unviable,unless you want a bigass recession
>>75668585
That's not an argument.
>>75677258
>Germany getting flooded by migrants
>Communists killing 200 Millions of their own people last century
>Tax income is not pure slavery
Keep telling yourself that "Government is necessary to prevent your people from being enslaved to another one."
>>75677592
Not an argument.
If the German government disappeared, the governments of nearby countries like Denmark and France would immediately extend their government to the places formerly governed by Germany.
>>75668585
Call the show and get #rekt faggot
>>75670381
You must support me being shot. You want to shoot me, right?
>>75676872
>taxpayers money is used to fund "research" that's pure gambling
That's right, it is gambling, because there is no immediate market desire. However it's gambling that has payed off historically. Without this gambling we wouldn't have any modern technology. At all. So when you say we can't force people to fund scientific research you are saying you don't want technology (including the one we currently have because it was gained by this process). In other words, you want to be streetshitter for the sake of freedom.
You keep bringing up muh microsoft meme because in the AnCap mind there are only gadgets to consume. Not in uncovering physical phenomena, which leads to development of new methods, which leads to superior technology (and this is the only part the "market" sees which is where the problem is). Microsoft developing a GUI is not the same fucking thing as experimenting with quantum mechanics.
Of course, there is no reason you should be "obligated to care" about technological progress. If you want to remain an indian streetshitter in AnClapistan for the rest of the planets lifetime so be it. We might take over one day using our laser shooting spaceships though.
>>75677031
Our missile defense systems are already making Russian nukes obsolete. There's no reason why research and development of such systems would cease or slow down without a state. There are intelligent and motivated people designing them who could be hired by new institutions at that point. You act like the government has magic powers that can't be replaced or replicated by any other kind of organized force, but it's not fucking politicians who build roads, put out house fires, or hold guns to defend the nation, it's their owners, the citizens.
>>75677565
>Besides, a uniform national defense can be provided as insurance or perhaps even for free by multiple cooperating militias
Yeah, because several thousands of unaffiliated militias voluntarily working together can defend against a foreign invader as well as a centrally controlled and coordinated military with a clear chain of command.
>>75677413
Damn dude. "If research wasn't done by public funding, it can't happen". How do you know that? You're running on a premise that a system that is not capitalism (tax income, central banks, etc) can't do shit. Of course, it can't do shit if you put regularization and central planning.
If you stop putting so many taxes, the money will flow differently (most likely more efficiently because the Government is taking its share before everyone else). But you're not making sense when saying the private sector can't do shit when it's enslaved though central banks and massive government programs.
Adam Smith has already discussed this 100 years ago, a decentralized system is always more efficient than a centralized one.
>>75678158
>as well as a centrally controlled and coordinated military with a clear chain of command
Better, in fact. There is no better kind of defensive force to date than an unpredictable, populous guerilla army. The fucking United States military could not defeat the Vietcong on their turf. Who could possibly win a guerilla war against hundreds of millions of armed Americans separated from any major threats by thousands of miles of ocean on either side? Get fucking real.
Plus, when not being told what they can/cannot use to defend themselves, there's zero reason why militias couldn't produce and man advanced weaponry and equipment like AA guns, GPS radars, etc.
>>75677710
>Whole nations committing seppuku through muslims migrants when their purpose is to prevent being enslaved
>Not an argument
Well that's a fact, not an argument.
>If the German government disappeared
You'd have a whole population with the right to bear arms, a complete removal of the bureaucracy, some tradesdeal with other countries, private military and so on
Why the fuck and how would that be an interesting opportunity cost for Denmark to take over a good economical neighbors?
Let's say Germany is using bitcoins or some kind of decentralized money. You can't tax that.
>>75678563
Who decides how, where, and when the guerrilas fight and who is responsible for supplying them all?
>>75678657
>Government is capable of harming the nation therefore the lack of a government is incapable of harming the nation
>>75678188
>Damn dude. "If research wasn't done by public funding, it can't happen". How do you know that? You're running on a premise that a system that is not capitalism (tax income, central banks, etc) can't do shit. Of course, it can't do shit if you put regularization and central planning.
Because there hasn't been megacorporations yet. Private research is mostly none existant,and companies mostly invest on development. Research is not very encoraging by private entities,as it is costly,and soon competition will just plagiarize it,specially in ancap society where pattents dont exist.
>If you stop putting so many taxes, the money will flow differently (most likely more efficiently because the Government is taking its share before everyone else). But you're not making sense when saying the private sector can't do shit when it's enslaved though central banks and massive government programs.
First of all you dont know how the distribution of capital would be after the goverment falls,so everything would be speculation. Without the concentration of capitals societies stagnate. In ancap we dont knwo how capital would be concentrated,but if we just look at the market itself,we would just end up with bigish corporations and tons of micro businesses,and I really dont see this system to be able to gather the capital,and risks needed to make research viable. Until megacorporations appear,if they ever do,ancap would just be regressive
>>75677858
Stop strawmanning me bro. I care about technology. I just don't trust gambling over R/D.
>>75668585
>He actually thinks a peaceful, stable society could exist without any government present at all.
It could but not in all 9 layers of hell could it happen with this current crop of humans.
>>75678916
>I just don't trust gambling over R/D.
All research is gambling and without it we wouldnt have experience 2 industrial revolutions. You know that without things like paterns reseaech in the private sector would be null,and paterns are goverment given monopolies.
>>75678749
>Government is capable of harming the nation therefore the lack of a government is incapable of harming the nation
Yep completely true. Other government are capable of harm though.
The logical issue is "We need a government because other government are dangerous". We want to fucking break that cyclical arguments by pointing out that indeed government is dangerous therefore we have to find solutions without governments. The economical efficiency is on our side, that's why it seems viable.
people think it won't work cus if survival of the fittest doesn't at least have rewards, apart from feudal no government rewards, then they won't want to leave this system, and as molyneux said people would much rather defend those who worship their masters, or farmers that harvest your taxes to keep the status quo, so why have a government? the real priority of a government and humanity should be to make life easier for everybody in terms of getting the basic needs and perhaps encourage voluntary intuition.
when he says no government, he's referring to no money thus no hierarchy, and STEM research like i said in a topic before, including artificial intelligence/hard AI, renewable energy can assist.
>>75679247
But you can't get rid of all governments therefore your entire premise is false.
>>75677349
You don't need a centralized command to maintain a defensive army, if the sole purpose of that army is to defend from invaders. The objective is pretty clear to everyone involved and the motivation is there by default. Cooperation becomes very easy in these situations since people don't care to be slaughtered.
Companies are far more organized than governments anyway. If a national defense is in the interest of the population, someone will capitalize on that. If they suck dick, someone else will gain their market share. We have health insurance, car insurance, flood insurance, fire insurance, etc. It would not be hard to organize invasion insurance + a solution to invasions.
Assuming everyone would be at war within the stateless territory is baseless and retarded. Most people just want to live their lives until governments starts limiting everyone's ability to do so. If this kind of violence did break out here and there, it wouldn't get anyone anywhere. Why would people do this?
>>75679437
I agree
>>75679260
If the private sector cant build alone a nuclear plant,how do you expect it to take all the research in the world? Our private sector isnt sophisticated enough yet to have no goverment,and not going backwards. Only huge conglomerates of capital,megacorporations,could replace the goverment at its fullest,and it hasnt happen yet,and probably will never happen due anti trust and anti monopoly laws.
But a peaceful, stable society CAN exist without any government present at all.
All it needs is white people.
>>75678749
Their respective leaders, of course. Hierarchies exist all the time without force being necessary to create or maintain them. If you're super unsure about that though, understand that with no government a military functions a lot like a corporation. With contracts and incentives and so on. Corporations outperform the government in virtually every capacity do I don't see why they couldn't find a way to keep and supply an organized defensive force.
Tell me, why couldn't Rome conquer the Germans again?
Some kind of power structure will arise and you will have your government,, either that or we destroys ourself or start living in vr or some kind of other simulated universe, or go back were we came from, of course.
>>75671957
No group of private citizens has ever built or maintained a complete functional road system of any size. Paved roads were a state function as far back as Rome.
>>75678859
>First of all you dont know how the distribution of capital would be after the goverment falls,so everything would be speculation
Neither do you so case closed?
Jokes aside, the economical efficiency argument that removing a huge ass parasite like the State would be profitable for any innovation and risk-taking. And because there's accountability from the people doing R/D, you'll have a better control on who is a good researcher and who is not. There is no economical reason to believe that innovation is not able to arise at the same rate if not faster than now.
>>75679107
Nope, not all research is gambling. You can have efficiency issues though.
Patterns are a shitty systems at least in software: the big names (Intel) have paid laws to protect their interests and any small company can be broken down as soon as they get a lawsuit.
Richard Stallman has some good videos why pattents are a terrible system for innovation. That's the fault of the governement.
>>75679740
States are made of people. People have built every single road ever under various different means and circumstances. If a road is desired, a road is built. Parking lots are almost always built by the companies whose building are located in them, and many roads leading to parking lots are also built by the companies expecting profit from locals. If it were up to you to build and maintain roads, could you really not do it without politicians telling you what you can and can't do? A fucking joke.
>>75679357
1) You can have private armies.
2) >your entire premise is false.
Just like slavery has always and will always exist, right?
>>75679630
>All it needs is white people.
Add asians and we have a deal.
What do you guys think of based Red Pill?
is he billwhittled?
>mfw Stef answered my question in the youtube comments.
>>75679973
> Neither do you so case closed?
Jokes aside, the economical efficiency argument that removing a huge ass parasite like the State would be profitable for any innovation and risk-taking. And because there's accountability from the people doing R/D, you'll have a better control on who is a good researcher and who is not. There is no economical reason to believe that innovation is not able to arise at the same rate if not faster than now.
I think that I am not making myself clear. The state is parasitic,you are right,but this has allow it to concentrate great amounts of capital,and this allows them to make bigger investments without the dangers of bankruptcy,unlike companies. The main driven force in progress is capital accumulation,and I dont think that the market is sophisticated enough to capture as many capitals as the state through violence. Which in the long run would hurt progress. Is the agression of the state inmoral? Probably. Does it bring overall benefits to society? For sure.
> Patterns are a shitty systems
I agree,but without them,private research would be null,as the competition would just steal away the knowledge,and made your investment a waste. That is why most companies just focus on development and redifining products,as it is way cheaper. To sell and improved product than to create one. The only way that I can see research working would be through donations (which wouldnt capture any real capital at all,as most people dont give a fuck about research) or millionaires patronizing scientists as they did with painters,but we dont have that many rich people yet,to fullfill the global demand for research.
>>75680186
east asians are acceptable.
>>75680336
Nice!
Somebody is using my oc.
>>75679685
>the people will always go to war against a foreign government without one of their own
Just like the Russians in 1917? get real
Germanic tribes had strict leadership hierarchies.
>>75680698
Oh I see, your position makes more sense.
I still don't get why "bigger investment + a big share for the State" is a better investment method than R/D controlled by private investors. To me this looks like gambling and gambling is not an efficient way of dealing with money.
> without them,private research would be null,as the competition would just steal away the knowledge,and made your investment a waste
I don't know for all system of patents. But patents on software is a disaster, and you can get Tesla's patents online, they put it voluntarily. There is also all this open source community.
It's not a clear cut answer. But I would argue that right now patents are way too impenetrable to be useful. If you are for innovation, being for patents seems to be counterproductive
>>75675720
I'm a fucking white male
>>75681354
>Just like the Russians in 1917?
You means after they were stripped of their guns and sovereignty by their own government?
>Germanic tribes had strict leadership hierarchies.
And no fucking centralized command. When they faced Caesar, they willingly came together under one command to fight him, and then went there own ways again after Gaul was conquered. No German blood spilled by Germans (except the ones who'd joined Romes military), and no more German lands taken afterward, not even by the fucking Huns.
like could you seriously like just GET FUCKING REAL?
>>75682031
But then, they were germans, not Rome, so throw out of window good chunk of civilization achievements.
>>75681463
>I don't know for all system of patents. But patents on software is a disaster, and you can get Tesla's patents online, they put it voluntarily. There is also all this open source community.
>It's not a clear cut answer. But I would argue that right now patents are way too impenetrable to be useful. If you are for innovation, being for patents seems to be counterproductive
I know about this,but Tesla was built,in theory,as Musk's attempt to replace fossil fuels,so sharing patterns makes sense. My point is that investment heavy research,is not really profitable,if your competition can take the knowledge and make your advantage null. That is why the current patronizing system of research is so effective,as avery discovery,is open for everyone to explore and create stuff around. What I question is if the private sector would be able to replace the state as the patronage of science. Capital acumulation is fundamental for the advancement of technology. As they can take riskier investments or way more sopjisticated and expensive alternatives
>>75682310
Sorry, could you rephrase that?
Who?
>>75677319
>>75682381
Fair point. Intuitively it feels wrong to me because of all the dead weight of State legislation and bureaucracy but I can't argue much further than that.
I'll leave this thread at that. Nice chat though.
governance unites splintered tribal interest into a whole, the ME is a good example of tribal self interest. However governance can also become terribly corrupt, so it is a dangerous tool.
>>75669036
>what wellfare and Jizya tax
remember that ryan dawson rekt stefan molyjew
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndSyIkf79Tg
>>75683384
what the fuck is a woodshed?
>>75682381
It depends on the science. A lot less would get spent on psychology, pharmaceuticals, and surveillance tech than on physics, nuclear energy, and computer tech as the former is generally economically useless or even wasteful while the latter tends to lead to very profitable innovations.
Many private companies are investing billions of dollars into space tech research and development, and many more are funneling money into science research that gives them an edge in their respective industries. Taking out the state just means research funds are spent more wisely. Companies could also market different sciences extensively in order to generate more interest in a field by consumers looking for innovative breakthroughs, which would allow them to generate public funding for their pursuits. Bank loans would also still be a thing.
>>75668585
yeah, we've had thousands of years trying to make a fair and accountable system of power, it might not be perfect but you don't just fucking throw it all out
there's no such thing as a an cap society, the biggest warlord just takes over..
>>75684242
This is so stupid. In majority white countries, people aren't going to just revert to pagan savagery overnight because there are no more politicians in their land. We have thousands of years of philosophical and ethical development separating western people of today from the people of the first civilizations who ruled their people like literal slaves. We understand voluntarism and diplomacy now well enough to get by without killing each other most of the time.
>>75684840
I get where your coming from ANYTHING works better if its only whites (ex scandavian socialism)
but last time i checked, our white majorities were already on the way out..
>>75668585
Molyneux got destroyed by his most recent competent statist guest, IMO. I'm thinking about calling in and doing it too, there's pretty much nothing better for humans than a meritocracy, including their own freedom.
>>75685046
Well that's not going to get any better until we oust the fucking traitors responsible. They happen to run our government by a very tight and intricate web of propaganda that they pay for as well. We are really really better off without them.
>>75683773
>It depends on the science.
True. But most true research is done in Maths,Physics,Chemestry,biology,engiering and biology
>A lot less would get spent on psychology(probably true)
> pharmaceuticals,
Probably one of the few private research success
> and surveillance tech
Sport companies invest on this I think. Not sure.
>than on physics
Very little private capital in here for the moment and depends on publuc grants a lot. Would probably need the biggets reform of ant science,
>nuclear energy
I question this. Energy would probably become more decentralized without goverment and rely more on oil gas and renewables than nuclear
,>and computer tech
Probably true
>as the former is generally economically useless or even wasteful while the latter tends to lead to very profitable innovations.
It really depends. Physics research only returns profits after 50 years on average,and most companies dont really like to do so long term investments
>Many private companies are investing billions of dollars into space tech research and development, and many more are funneling money into science research that gives them an edge in their respective industries.
True,but without the goverment's initial investment this new investments would have taken way longer
>Taking out the state just means research funds are spent more wisely.
>Not really.
>Companies could also market different sciences extensively in order to generate more interest in a field by consumers looking for innovative breakthroughs, which would allow them to generate public funding for their pursuits.
It is easier to get profits from modifying and improving the same product than to create a new one. Just look how many iPhone classes there are. Most purely profit driven companies dont really invest that much in researvh as they do in development.
> Bank loans would also still be a thing.
Never deny this. But without fiat currency interest would be higher.
>>75685196
Say something I can know you by in case you really do it.
>>75668585
Well, that depends on the structure of the society and the size of individual units. It's not impossible in theory.
>>75685268
well thats the whole marxist takeover
the best society model in the world is like the USA, say 200 years ago before this shit
>>75668585
>>75685343
>Probably one of the few private research success
Wouldn't really call it that. Pharm companies get ridiculous subsidies, grants, and legal privileges from governments, which is what allows them to be so economically viable despite wasting hundreds of millions of dollars on drugs that are killing people. If they don't retain government support, it will be much easier for word to spread about the toxic nature of this industry today.
>Very little private capital in here for the moment and depends on publuc grants a lot. Would probably need the biggets reform of ant science
Physics must be researched to develop automobiles, bullet trains, planes, factory machinery (which is replacing human workers at an alarming rate), and pretty much everything else that's produced by industry.
>Never deny this. But without fiat currency interest would be higher.
Yes, but not so high as to prevent their usefulness.
>>75686192
That model directly led to the current one.
>>75686246
Not as much as this gentleman. Go shitpost in a Trump thread instead.
>>75686946
well its always been a fight vs the jews, just look at the history of your central banks
but mccarthy was your last chance for america, he failed...
>>75687194
It's always been a fight between the knowledgeable and the ignorant. The advent of the internet is already beginning to level the playing field.
Hey OP You're saying that we can't live with out a group of men and women calling themselves "government" who threaten people with violence if they don't obey their rules?
OP I have a question for you: Should a service or product be provided at the barrel of a gun?
>>75669377
>He also tries to convince people to break all contact with their parents
For what purpose?
>>75669667
So that's where this meme came from. holy shit that's great.
>>75688321
Not all services and goods but the ones I find essential must be!
>>75688484
Sinister, cultish purposes, obviously.
DO YOU WANT ME DEAD?
It certainly could, if everyone's iq was 130+
>>75668585
All it requires is a high minimum general IQ among the populace.
>>75689957
Or if the high IQ population refused to submit to the low IQ people's demands.
