Prove that immigration or accepting refugees has a net negative effect on western nations.
I'll wait...
>>75655487
>prove an opinion
No.
75% of immigrants are on welfare and don't pay taxes. They're leeches. That isn't good for the economy.
>>75655712
But is it an opinion?
I imagine you guys take it as fact? Don't you have some economic or criminal data to support your case?
If a leftist came up to you right now and asked you to justify why you are a detractor to the west's immigration policies, how would you respond?
>>75655859
>75% of immigrants are on welfare and don't pay taxes
OK good, but source?
>>75655487
premium b8 from my aussie shitposting m8
>>75655985
>>75655487
Look up the fall of the western empire
>>75656013
He wants to win a Facebook fight but he's too timid to just ask us.
>>75656013
Consider it to be productive bait. /pol/ needs to justify their views from time to time in order to stop them from becoming like a slovenly SJWs who operate in hug boxes.
Not that a poo in loo would understand the dialectic process anyway.
>>75655985
>net negative effect
Yea it's a fucking opinion.
>>75656143
I don't post politics on facebook, I'm legitimately interested in this issue and want to hear the best case for the anti-immigration argument.
>>75655985
I am a leftist btw. But there's plenty of rational, realistic explanations as to why we don't need the immigrants. The "west's immigration policies" is a vague statement. Comparing US immigration to Italian immigration is fucking stupid.
>>75655487
There actually are stats for that.
Immigration
IS
POSITIVE
but only if it's from EU countries.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/european-immigrants-contribute-5bn-to-uk-economy-but-non-eu-migrants-cost-118bn-9840170.html
>>75656528
No it's not. Our salaries have stagnated ever since 2005. Coincidentally around the time you fucks joined the EU. Meanwhile Eurozone inflation is massive (prices have trippled). Our purchasing power is plummeting.
>>75656227
No not really.
For example if you were to make the case that immigration causes an economic drain then it would be useful to provide data which shows that immigrants are taking out more than they contribute. Hence why I used the term "net negative".
>>75656390
>But there's plenty of rational, realistic explanations as to why we don't need the immigrants.
Then let's hear them.
>The "west's immigration policies" is a vague statement.
It is. But it is you guys who lament the western movement towards open immigration in general. I actually don't care if you only focus on one country, I was trying to open it up as wide as possible for your benefit.
>>75655487
Use your fucking head you stupid cunt.
We aren't your personal army to go out and spoon feed you all the information.
It doesn't take a genius to realise that the most successful societies are the ones that have a combination of a shared set of values and beliefs.
Look at history and you will find case after case of 'diverse' nations all having the same end result and that is civil war and genocide.
http://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2015/09/latest-study-of-refugees-settled-in-australia-90-on-welfare-50-never-held-a-job-here-or-home-country.html
>>75655487
That net negative enough for you?
>>75656713
>Call the white black
>Conchita Wurst
ah, I see
Because unless you're UAE, you have to support these people, competing with locals for jobs and clashing cultures.
>>75655487
Because I said so.
I don't like it, so it's bad.
>>75655487
>Sweden: 5% of the whole population commits 77% of all rapes.
http://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2012/08/20/the-living-hell-for-swedish-women-5-muslims-commit-nearly-77-6-of-all-rape-crimes/
http://affes.wordpress.com/invandrarna-och-brotten-5-utrakning/
>Norway: 90% of all rapes committed in Oslo by non-western immigrants.
http://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2012/08/06/norway-90-of-all-violent-rapes-in-oslo-committed-by-muslims/
https://www.politi.no/vedlegg/lokale_vedlegg/oslo/Vedlegg_1309.pdf
>France: The muslim population of France is 12%, yet they make up 60 to 70% of all inmates in France's prisons.
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/28/AR2008042802560.html
>France: 70% of the population think there are too many foreigners & 74% think that Islam is not compatible with french society.
http://www.thelocal.fr/page/view/too-many-foreigners-in-france-french-say#.UU-a1xxhWnI
http://lajeunepolitique.com/2013/02/07/what-remains-of-our-douce-france-ipsos-survey-reveals-divisions-concerns/
>Crime statistics 2010: roughly 15% of Americas population is black, yet they commit overall 48% of all murder, 32% rapes and 55% robbery.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/table-43/10tbl43a.xls
>Multiculturalism has utterly failed.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/10/16/us-germany-merkel-immigration-idUSTRE69F1K320101016
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12371994
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/11/us-france-sarkozy-multiculturalism-idUSTRE71A4UP20110211
>Sweden, 48% of assault rapes committed by non-western immigrants
http://www.thelocal.se/28580/20100825/
>Immigrants in Norway are a net loss to the economy
http://www.emnbelgium.be/publication/report-norwegian-welfare-and-migration-committee
>Immigrants in Sweden are a net loss to the economy
http://www.amid.dk/pub/papers/AMID_48-2006_Jan_Ekberg.pdf
>>75655487
>Public opinion in most countries are not in favor of immigration
http://www.ipsos.fr/sites/default/files/attachments/globaladvisor_immigration.pdf
>Norway has begun to self-segregate pupils based on ethnicity to avoid ethnic conflict even with just a tiny bit of diversity
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/8916947/Apartheid-row-at-Norwegian-school-af
ter-it-segregates-ethnic-pupils.html
>Increases in diversity correlate with problems worldwide, and the downsides of diversity effect everyone, it's a universal human problem:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/higher-education/the-downside-of-difference/story-e6frgcjx-111111291
4289
>Increased diversity correlates sharply with decreased community spirit, decreased altruism, depressed social capital, less ethical behaviour, more crime, fear, isolation and depression:
http://www.city-journal.org/html/eon2007-06-25jl.html
>Diversity experiments in Germany end in disaster
http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany-s-immigrants-integration-in-theory-alienation-in-practic
e-a-433006.html
>Denmark saved billions by restricting immigration:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/putting-a-price-on-foreigners-strict-immigration-laws-sav
e-denmark-billions-a-759716.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/denmark/8492822/Denmarks-immigration-laws-save-country-6-billion.html
>Swedish politician speaks on camera about immigration issues and expresses different views when secretly filmed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DO1vQHHgjmk [Embed]
>Paul Weston, chairman of Britain's counter-Jihad party 'Liberty GB' speaks about the Woolwich murder, Islam and the state of Britain today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bG77qpLi4oc [Embed]
>>75655487
In the United Kingdom:
Approximately 2.8% of the population is black. (Source: 2012 Census)
In 2011-2012, 23% of arrests were of blacks, 4 times higher arrest rate for blacks than whites, taking population into account (Source: MOJ publication, "Race and the Criminal Justice System")
In Australia:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/african-youth-crime-concern-20120819-24glt.html
In the UK, ethnic minorities disproportionate source of crime and asocial behaviour:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7856404/Police-statistics-shed-fresh-light-on-link-between-crime-and-race.html
http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/statistics/mojstats/stats-race-cjs-2010.pdf
UK has more blacks in jail proportionately than the US:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/oct/11/black-prison-population-increase-england
Denmark saved billions by restricting immigration:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/putting-a-price-on-foreigners-strict-immigration-laws-save-denmark-billions-a-759716.html
TIM APPROVED VROOOOOOOOM VROM
>>75655487
Too easy.
http://archive.boston.com/news/globe/ideas/articles/2007/08/05/the_downside_of_diversity/
>Harvard political scientist Robert Putnam -- famous for "Bowling Alone," his 2000 book on declining civic engagement -- has found that the greater the diversity in a community, the fewer people vote and the less they volunteer, the less they give to charity and work on community projects. In the most diverse communities, neighbors trust one another about half as much as they do in the most homogenous settings. The study, the largest ever on civic engagement in America, found that virtually all measures of civic health are lower in more diverse settings.
>>75655487
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5386/british-girls-raped-oxford
>British Girls Raped by Muslim Gangs on "Industrial Scale"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peterborough_sex_abuse_case
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derby_sex_gang
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochdale_sex_trafficking_gang
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_sex_gang
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_sex_gang
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telford_sex_gang
and another 2015
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3312376/Schoolgirl-aged-13-14-repeatedly-raped-sexually-abused-passed-round-15-Asian-males.html
http://www.expressandstar.com/news/crime/2015/05/02/sex-abuse-gangs-in-black-country-significant-similarities-to-rotherham-scandal-say-police/
more 2015, 12/13 year olds
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/05/19/child-raped-by-60-men-in-asian-grooming-gang-only-11-ringleaders-in-court/
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/vulnerable-schoolgirl-raped-least-60-5717785
Girls lured into sex trade for the price of a McDonald's: Council faces legal action for not stopping Asian gang
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3225226/Six-members-Asian-child-sex-abuse-gang-jailed-total-82-years-grooming-white-girls-sex-exchange-milkshake-McDonald-s.html
now germany is being culturally enriched
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6527/migrants-rape-germany
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3434708/Iraqi-migrant-raped-10-year-old-boy-swimming-pool-Vienna-told-police-sexual-emergency-hadn-t-sex-months.html#comments
a 14 year old boy raped by invaders in public pool 2016
http://www.focus.de/politik/videos/opfer-ist-14-jahre-alt-nach-sexuellem-missbrauch-delbrueck-entscheidet-gegen-hallenbad-verbot-fuer-fluechtlinge_id_5407692.html
>>75656103
The scale sucks, as you can see.
>>75655487
now, with all this said, can you show me the positives that outweigh these negatives?
>inb4 you can eat a shitty kebab made out of your daughter
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2529487/Mother-girl-murdered-turned-kebab-meat-stalked-man-travelled-New-Zealand-meet-obsessed-case.html
>>75658961
>>75658979
>>75659062
>>75659088
>>75655487
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE
>>75655487
I would like to thank you for starting this thread since it created a situation where leafy-bro posted a shit-ton of pasta and I was able to acquire it.
Good job, Mr Shill.
>>75659247
You know. I'm not even surprised. We have a long history of eating the ones we love.
Though I suppose I'm a bit disgusted he would aim for some low-tier British slag over a nice homegrown Ewe.
>>75659777
he was a muslim living in new zealand you twat
>>75655487
