What are /pol/'s thoughts on this.
I live in an around 50 to 60 year old building.
The building is paid for a gazillion times. The cost of me living here are not that high since i take care of which is not even my own.
I also put in some money up front .. added a new floor, painted the walls and put some wallpapers on. All in all its taken care of.
What are the owners true costs? Even the taxes, garbage memes, water and shit is included in my rent.
I pay for the electricity myself aswell.
I get the point that its necessary in new buildings to get back the costs but the building i live in now is a pure money maker for my landlord.
Is this justified?
>>75186686
>Is this justified?
It doesn't matter.
>>75186785
Not an arguement
>>75186785
how so?
Shouldnt a society uphold some decency? It already spiraled out of control in many places.
I get why its happening but it seems there is no end to this spiral nor does anyone talk about it.
>>75186919
"Society" is just a bunch of people doing whatever they want. You can't expect them all to act a certain way. Shit happens.
>>75186686
No, it's not justified. You should just steal the building that guy paid for and keep it for yourself.
Don't pay for a house of your own though. That'd be stupid.
>>75186686
Its justified in the sense that they are not obligated to let you live there for free or for any price lower than what they ask for.
Its why I wont move out of my moms house until I am making a comfortable amount of money. The pros just do not outweigh the cons and I get along very well with my mom.
>>75186686
Yes, it's a scam.
Now move out of there and live on a bench so that you don't have to pay rent.
>>75186686
over here in belgium usually the landlord pays for renovations, isn't that the same with you guys?
Rent is justified. Just because the building if paid off doesn't mean there aren't property taxes, or maintenance costs, etc.
Is buying food a scam?
10 years of rental income is usually the price of the unit.
The issue with renting is if you pay 1k/mo and rent for 3 years, you've lost 36k. If you were paying a mortgage of 1k/mo, you'd have roughly the 36k in equity. It doesn't make sense to rent if you're in a position to buy.
Just trash the place when you move out. Do thousands and thousands of euros in damage. Sure, you'll lose your security deposit, but it's worth it. And they were probably going to jew you out of it anyway. I have to sue three different landlords for the return of my security deposit. Now I just trash the place.
>>75187207
Food is a scam in general. I shouldn't have to eat to live.
It's a business, OP.
You living there is not for charity. It's so the owner can make a profit.
Don't like it? Move out.
are you a fucking retarded piece of shit. You need to live somewhere and they have a place to rent out for you. Guess what you need that fucking place cuz u need shelter so they will charge you as much as they know ur willing to pay dumb fk
>>75186686
Your mind is wrapped. You're a brainwashed socialist, I'm truly sorry for you.
Do you have anywhere else to live ? Would it be better or cheaper to live somewhere else ? If so then go there, if not then shut up.
Don't want to pay a landlord for living somewhere ? Then shut up and work to buy your own place.
>>75186686
No, renting/leasing vs buying each have their own pros and cons. Most of the cost of housing goes to jew bankers via interest, and property taxes. The owner makes money because he took the risk and put up money.
>>75186686
The assumption that the value of something is equivalent to the cost to produce it is a bullshit marxist idea.
It's an extreme simplification, and not true at all in the real world.
You've been fooled the socialist propaganda.
>>75186686
Your only other options are
1. Take a loan from a bank and buy a house or apartment and own that, pay the load instead of rent.
2. Inherit property from family (depending on where you live you might need to take out a loan to pay inheritance tax, but it's much less than a full house loan)
3. Move back in with family.
4. Make enough money that you are able to pay for a house up front without a loan at the same time that you're paying rent where you currently reside or live rent free at parents.
>>75187181
>property taxes
that's silly. Why would you tax land?
>>75186686
For the price one pays in rent most could qualify for a mortgage on a condo the exact dimensions of said apartment.
The problem with owning a home is that you're solely responsible for its upkeep, insurance and paying taxes.
Condos have commons fees which cover all of that, but more often than not exceed the mortgage expenses...which is asinine.
If you prefer city living, buy a co-op or condo, if you live outside of a city, buy a house. That's what I did. I bought a 4br house and moved 3 of my friends into vacant rooms charging them $600 a month in rent. They paid all the bills, everyone benefitted from it. When I got engaged I asked them to leave.
Only idiots rent, yes...my friends were idiots for paying off 1/5 of my house.
>>75187181
If there weren't any property taxes or maintenance costs it'd be justified just stealing some guy's house and living there, of course. Good point!
This is why I'll never rent anything to anyone and always make a point to get paid for everything upfront. People are a bunch of communist savages nowadays.
Doesn't matter, it's a free market and you choose to live there. It was your choice that the rent was well worth the money and you were happy to exchange your work for his roof over your head.
If society as a whole didn't decide that the rent was very reasonable and well worth the cost, there wouldn't be demand to live in his building and he would be forced to lower his prices.
>>75187551
To get money. Same reason you tax anything else.
>>75186686
Go read what rent-seeking is.
Don't reinvent the wheel.
No, property is inherently valuable and not utilizing it is wasting the value.
If it wasn't being rented to you to live in, it could be used as space to build/grow/sell things.
Letting some deadbeat live there for free is equivalent to letting it sit vacant.
>>75187551
The OP lives in a country which exhumes corpses when cemetery fees aren't paid. In comparison taxes aren't too terrible. Property tax in your town is what pays for road maintenence and for the police/fire department. It's mutually beneficial.
>>75187006
>You can't expect them to all act a certain way
Its what we do though
Thats why we have laws, constitutions etc. We expect a framework.
>>75187033
>that guy paid for
He didnt even pay for it. It was his dad hes just managing it now. Now its paid for multiple times already.
>>75187181
I get that but the taxes are part of my rent. I literally pay for it.
Maintenance costs - sure i'll pay for them but rent prices are way way higher than the "true" costs.
>>75187292
i didnt have to put up any security deposits cause i did all the work here .. like i explained in my OP
>>75187486
>>75187500
>>75187512
>>75187557
Unfortunately its borderline impossible to afford a house in Germany as a single men.
Banks won't give you a credit ever.
>>75187603
What if the demand is only there cause not enough new houses get build?
>>75186686
You rent so that you don't have any responsibility to pay a mortgage.
Rent is perfectly justified because it is for people who need a flexible structure for their cost of living. If you miss a rent payment you get an angry call and a passive aggressive letter, you miss a mortgage payment a very polite man who looks like the undertaker will show up at your door to break your hands before the cops send you to debtors prison
If you are secure enough to be able to do long term projects on your rented home you should either consider buying it or atleast look at getting a mortgage and buying a place of your own.
>>75186686
>Is this justified?
Supply and demand.
You are not paying for keeping the house intact. You are paying for the profit of the owner.
Same thing when you buy something in the supermarket.
>>75187291
no you wouldn't, most of that payment would go to interest and escrow. but your point is that buying is better, which i would agree with if you are in a position to stay put in one spot for 15-30 years.
I'll just leave this here
http://www.zillow.com/wikipages/List-of-Closing-Costs-and-Fees/
Between all the pointless fees involved in buying a house, old people have a vested interest in keeping available housing low. The property values of their homes go up when the supply is low, so you're stuck being their little bitches forever. So they make lots of fees and laws to prevent you from buying a home. Construction companies have to deal with these barriers so they don't make money on building cheap houses.
don't ever complain about it either, or you're a socialist who hates muh "free" market
>>75186686
Depends on where you live.
If you live in a city then it isn't that much of a scam.
Owning property in a city is a very expensive thing, so paying rent is more feasible than owning some land.
Also you can't really own a room in a building, so that means you would have an entire building in a city to yourself.
So pretty much renting is you letting someone else live in part of your property for something of equal value.
Sure you do not own something, but being able to live near some place where you can not afford to own property is an investment.
Buying a house might be a better investment however because all you have to do is pay off the expense of owning it then you have it, you can sell off your house for money, it is a form of currency. But owning property is very expensive, depending on your job, you will make more money by investing it in something else besides property, working at a job, and just paying rent to live near your job is better than owning a house nowhere near an optimal job opportunity.
>>75187805
>if you are in a position to stay put in one spot for 15-30 years.
nobody is anymore in todays society
we need to be flexible or we can't pursue our careers. That way we get cucked in paying rent for the rest of our lives.
>>75186686
Yes rent is money down the drain
Only first worlders fall for it
Landlords are able to NEET comfortably off rent money
Buy property as soon as you can
>>75187291
you aren't factoring in interest.
but yes you will have equity, and eventually 100% equity when you pay off the mortgage, but not every dollar is going towards the principal
interest rates are super low right now, it basically makes no sense to rent when you can buy - unless you are moving very frequently (ie college student), because there are unrecoupable overhead expenses (finance costs, closing costs, selling expenses) every time you buy and sell a home
>>75187721
>He didnt even pay for it. It was his dad hes just managing it now. Now its paid for multiple times already.
So when your dad dies you're gonna hand over everything he owns to the poor? It's his inheritance. Why should the shit his dad paid for be handed over to you?
You have no respect for property rights, you fucking thief.
I'm out of this thread. I have low tolerance for communist bullshit.
>>75187756
>If you miss a rent payment you get an angry call and a passive aggressive letter, you miss a mortgage payment a very polite man who looks like the undertaker will show up at your door to break your hands before the cops send you to debtors prison
In America, it's actually the opposite. Legally, it's much harder to get kicked out of a home that you have a mortgage on compared to one that you rent.
That's why during our housing collapse of 2008, many people simply stopped paying their mortgage, because the house was worth less than what the owed. It often took the banks 1.5-2 years to get them fully evicted from the property.
Conversely, a landlord can get a nonpaying tenant out of an apartment in as little as two weeks via court order and sheriff enforcer, in many circumstances.
>>75186686
>but the building i live in now is a pure money maker for my landlord.
Yes, that's generally how running a business works if you're successful at it. Do you think you should be allowed to just live on the guy's property for free?
>>75187721
The laws, constitutions, etc. are just a subsection of "people doing whatever they want". Some people want to be politicians, so they end up making laws.
>>75188020
no i don't. I respect that but should the costs be10 Times higher than they actually are?
Lets say it costs 100€ per person but the rent is 1000€ ... 900€ every month for free for no other reason than a shortage of living space created by banks and politicians to cuck us into wageslavery until we die.
>>75186686
Why shouldn't you pay to live in someone else's place?
No because you pay for a place to live.
You get a place to live, see.
It's called rent seeking. Not a scam per se, but about on par with taxation
>>75188100
no i dont expect to live here for free
I'm happily paying for all taxes and whatever it costs (i even pay for it already .. the taxes, garbage stuff etc - its listed on my yearly overview bill memes).
Its just a fraction of the actual rent. He never had any maintenance costs here either (so far) but even if you factor that in its still just a fraction of my rent.
I'd even give him some profit on top but this is getting out of hand entirely.
>>75187721
Then move cities. You are not entitled to live in the place of your choosing at the price of your choosing. You can live exactly were you want at a price you have no control over, or you can move and live at the price of your choosing in a place you have no control over.
If demand was too high and prices got too steep the free market would solve the problem with other businessmen who would come in and build new buildings to take advantage of the lucrative rent profits, until the margins of profit got so low that it wasn't justified in building more houses.
Paying rent? Who fucking does that in their own country? Only a fool would.
>>75188456
You wat? Do you also believe you should be able to buy an iPhone for its assembling cost?
>>75188548
>If demand was too high and prices got too steep the free market would solve the problem with other businessmen who would come in and build new buildings to take advantage of the lucrative rent profits
>what is cronyism
it doesnt work like that in the ((current year))
the free market is just an illusion
>>75188684
i love you somali bro
hope you post pics of your house soon
>>75188456
>what is opporunity cost
He can sell the property and invest in stocks or some other shit. Why should he just let it sit there to be used by you for free?
>>75188548
>muh free market
The fact that rent seeking exists at all proves your theoretical models false
>>75186686
Think of it this way: You're paying the landlord not to sell the apartment to somebody else.
>>75188456
>I'd even give him some profit
HOLY SHIT
Like you're a fucking saint for "giving" him "some profit" out of the goodness of your heart.
I tried to go but I can't look away from this trainwreck of a thread. I must force myself.
>>75188803
*glurf glorf*
Mmm thank you mr shekelstein
*slurrrrrrp*
>>75188725
except in my example i'd pay full new price for a 60 year old iPhone and the guy after me pays the full new price again and again and again
>>75188803
>rent-seeking
others have pointed it out already! go look it up!
>>75188795
thats kind of the opposite of how it should work though in a "free market"
this is what enslaves us all
>>75188902
You're adorable. Tell me all about your plan to go around stealing houses from people. I'm sure they're all jews, of course.
>>75189009
> 60 year old
That's not how property value works
>>75187291
No, you'd have maybe 5k in equity because of >>75187967
Subtract house loan fees, property taxes. You might even be in the minus area. This is why people rent instead of buy you fool
>>75189009
>go look it up!
While I go look it up you'll just move into my house and stay there without compensating me. Nice try.
>>75189009
> thats kind of the opposite of how it should work though in a "free market"
Lel, no it's not. In a real free market, prices would be even higher. Welcome to lolbertarianism. Decent housing is scarce in Western Europe and our countries are overpopulated.
>>75189009
>thats kind of the opposite of how it should work though in a "free market"
>this is what enslaves us all
How is it the opposite?
He can make a lot more money in the short term by selling the house to somebody, than he can by renting it to you.
How is that against the free market?
>>75189032
>Be GRATEFUL you had the chance to suck dis cock, goyim! You some kinda thief tryin ta steal my house and gas me?
>>75186686
if you dont like paying rent, easy, just move out!
>>75186686
Do you know how businesses work? Do you think people only pay what is necessary to recover costs?
The cost of goods in a free market is determined by what consumers are willing to pay. Obviously your apartment is worth that much BECAUSE YOU ARE PAYING THAT MUCH.
The people who bought that building have the entire value of the building tied up in the building. They made their capital illiquid so that they could yield a return on that investment. If they don't get a high enough return on that investment, then they take their capital elsewhere and get a more desirable return. If rent is reduced so much that their return is no longer comparable to other ventures, then they invest their capital in something else and you lose your home.
Yes, the prices they are charging are fair. If they weren't fair, people wouldn't live there.
Learn 2 economics.
OP is acting like a "muh feelings" feminist who doesn't understand how the world works
>>75189246
>provide no benefit to the economy
>make money anyway
Reality isnt an econ 101 graph
>>75186686
Don't know, I don't pay rent and I see no reason why anyone would unless they are actually, you know, not the owner of the property and are just renting it from someone.
I own the property and I just pay for water, heating, Internet, electricity and maintenance. Oh and whatever taxes the fascists in the government come up with.
>>75188735
Hay germanbro, I have been gone from sometime, but I promise I will post my living quarters in my next thread. You will be in for a suprise.
>>75189363
>paying rent is a jewish conspiracy
>just squat in someone's house and pay them nothing because that's not greedy
I am learning so much today.
>>75189295
>decent housing is scarce in western europe
yeah i wonder why that is goyim ...
>>75189308
in a free market the owner is the one who is worried about not being able to rent to me anymore but to someone else providing me with a better housing experience for less money
since the politicians, banks and housing businesses have 0 interests in that happening there is no such thing as a "free housing market" in western europe
Germany has these large organizations for example that rent out a lot of property. They actively bribe and lobby politicians so that there will always be a shortage of available living space. That keeps their profits huge and our rents high.
>>75186686
>He pays rent while rapefugees get free, brand new housing
You are a massive moron.
>>75186686
> complains about rent
Then buy the apartment? You won't need to pay rent then.
> but I can't afford it!
That's why you're paying rent you moron.
If you don't enjoy it or think its unfair (which it isn't) enjoy being homeless.
Fucking moron
>>75189458
After posting my response, I've read some of OPs messages, and I regret saying anything. OP is clearly either underaged and therefore knows nothing about the world or is undereducated, yielding the same outcome.
Go read a book or some shit before trying to reinvent economics on your own via 4chan.
>>75189593
>Do you want to live in my house?
>Yes, I do
>I'm asking for X amount
>Yes, I would pay that
>Ok, we have a deal
>This is unfair. I'm not paying you anymore rent. This is my house now.
>>75189680
>in a free market the owner is the one who is worried about not being able to rent to me anymore but to someone else providing me with a better housing experience for less money
In a free market, it's always both.
The people who are buying need to offer more than anybody else.
The people selling need to offer less than anybody else.
If housing is too expensive in germany, don't live there. That's how the free market actually works.
>>75189660
>Youre not ecstatic with me charging you out the ass because physical space limitations prevent competition from actually occurring?
>Help! Thief! Gypsy thieves!
>>75189950
This
You rent, you pay a set amount of money for a place every month, but the landlord has to pay for all the other expenses. You also have the freedom to move out within a month's notice. No sweat.
You buy your own place, it's an investment you have to take care of. You have to pay property tax, you have to pay for all sorts of maintenance, and if niggers move next door the value of your property can plummet overnight. If you're planning to start a family, buy a house at least ~5km from nigger infested areas.
You can basically rent anywhere with no risk, and while investing in buying your own property seems wiser, it has a hell of a lot more risk involved.
>>75186686
I pay like 37.5% in capital gains taxes on a few apartments I rent in the US in NYC. The building is paid for, I do write off expenses, so the gov. does take a good chunk of the rent payment, way more than any other possible cost, the gov. makes out good doing nothing. I DO KISS MY TENANTS ASSES THOUGH. The heat in winter is a stable 73F all around the clock, they don't pay for hot water or water usage either, they only pay natural gas for their stove and electricity they use, such as for lights and air conditioning. Something breaks, I try to repair it using professionals in a timely manner. A tenant like you spending so much to remodel the apartment would make me feel bad you had to do all that and I would say to bill me for it so I can at least write it off. I'm not sure if you can write off stuff in Germany like this though.
>>75188770
False. Land drives up the cost of owning a house. Land is finite. If you want to own a house cheaply then you need to move out into the countryside where you can buy a 1 acre plot of land for less than 2 years worth of rent.
You are not entitled to live in a city. You choose to live in a city and you choose to pay the price.
I myself prefer an upscale apartment over a house. No yard work, no maintenance. Toilet starts leaking water at 2 a.m.? I don't pay the $300 plumbing bill. I like living close to other people, I find it enjoyable to see my neighbors in the hallway or the elevator to chat in the morning. You can move out of an apartment whenever you want, within lease terms, were moving houses can be a huge burden of paperwork and fees. If you choose the wrong place to buy a house, 20 years down the road the neighborhood could go to shit and your property value falls through the floor.
>>75186686
Were you coerced into paying the rental agreement?
If no, then this is justified.
>>75189626
nice i can't wait
>>75189458
so uh you are saying businesses work like that:
>invest 100k
>get 100k back 10 times
>have 1 million
never invest anything again
expect to get 1 million again and again until the world ends
no additional value gets created?
How is the "initial investment" argument a thing if you already got it back 10 times.
The expected return is pretty much infinite.
Like i said in my OP its completely understandable if its a new building etc but this one here is at least 60 years old and paid for multiple times so your arguments don't make sense.
Even compared to traditional investing the money 60 years ago instead of binding it up in this illiquid asset its still huge and since we all get cucked by this shortage artificially (there is no free market) its an unfair game.
>>75186686
Land Lord Jew here.
Over the past 10 years me and everyone else have doubled rent prices. Why? Big tech companies are moving and paying huge bucks to their employees. That means prices go up on everything, including real estate. Part of the what you are being is a rental unit within a 10 minute drive of these nice jobs. It's part of the value. If you want a good deal move out of town, they have the same rental units for half the price but it's a 4 hour commute to the nearest decent job.
Also repairing things is fucking. The city, the county, the state, the fed, the contractor, the union they all want a cut of my shekels. A building is collectively damaged by all the tenents and so they all need to pay for it. Awhile ago I had a dindu nuffin burn down half the roof. We think he fell passed out from his malt liqueur while smoking his cigarettes but couldn't prove anything. Insurance premiums went up after that. Before that we had a Mexican couple move in and we got an infection of some huge giant bug I had never seen before.
>>75187557
Well said. I'm doing the same thing right now. Just bought a house and have a friend paying rent and half of utilities. I charged him a bit less than normal but I've known him forever and it still saves me close to 400 dollars a month + those utilities on a 1500 dollar mortgage.
Market forces retard, they reason why rent cost so much is because people are willing to pay that much.
>>75186686
yeah but unlike public housing most apartments are decent to live in and generally much safer. as long as your not living next so some curryhead or drunkard you should be okay. most people generally live only 2-3 years in an apartment anything longer and your just cucking yourself out of a decent home.
>>75190292
Are you in NYC brother? How do you jews do this? I'm just a goy who wants to learn! Teach me!
How come there aren't more homeless people with rent being so expensive?
I live in a city. I make around $10 per hour. I can't afford a one bedroom apartment. That shit is like fucking over $500 per month. I still live with my parents.
The only way that I could afford to live on my own would be if I had like three or four roommates in some shitty house/duplex. Is that even better than living with my parents? How? It's equally as pathetic in my eyes, shared housing is shared housing. If I live with some random cocksuckers I run the risk of one of them stopping paying rent or breaking the lease and getting us all evicted. Or other dumb bullshit like that.
>>75190243
>Were you coerced into paying the rental agreement?
the alternative is losing my job, living on a park bench and starving to death
so yeah kinda feels like i am being coerced into paying htis much rent
>>75190464
nobody likes paying that much
they are actively trying to prevent the creating of new living space for dubios reasons that can't be explained anymore
i live in Munich btw
>>75186686
You might call it a scam.
Housing/capitalism is a system that is meant to fuck over the poor. It forces you to a choices that fucks you over.
Option 1: Buy a house to get fucked over by jewish bank interest rates because you are poor. Have to buy insurance/closing fees/taxes. If you have to move within 5 years, you literally get nothing when selling because most of your money went towards interest.
Option 2: If you do rent, its literally throwing away your money for someone else's benefit.
>>75190597
Nobody likes paying that much but they do anyway, what is so hard to understand about this?
>>75190478
There's no magic. Invest wisely, intensely manage your costs and reap the benefits later.
>>75190877
>but they do it anyway
they have to or else they end up on the streets
whats so hard to understand about the fact that there is no such thing as a free market here?
if there was we had lower rents but ((they)) don't want us to pay less
>>75186686
>I also put in some money up front .. added a new floor
If you put this kind of money into a rental you are a fucking moron
>>75190277
>no additional value gets created?
Your concept of value is wrong. Value isn't stuff.
"Giving somebody a place to live" is a valuable act.
The apartment isn't the value. The act is the value.
>>75186686
>Why don't people let me live in a building they own for free?
I don't understand how I, a neet that hasn't gone to school in 5 years and just dicks around all day, can still be less retarded than most of the people on the internet.
What is wrong with people?
>>75190855
>socialists don't understand startup capital and upkeep
>>75191003
Do you genuinely have mental issues?
>>75191018
>force politicians to maintain a monopoly on who to give a place to live in in a certain area
doesnt seem like value to me. Seems like you are ruining your own people.
>>75190478
Keep the wealth in the family. The worst part of real estate is the first 50 years when you have to pay it off. Also tax rates are based on the most recent purchase price. My jew-grand father bought these stuff in the 60s and we are still working with the original price.
Keep everything a trust fund so that if your children get a divorce the building is not split in two. Have as few as heirs as possible to consolidate wealth in one person. I am the 3rd in a generation of Bergs. My child will literally be able to be a NEET and live off rent money. Also teach your children to be miserly Jews and not piss away all the shekels.
Avoid renting to niggers and mexicans as possible. Asians and gay men make the best tenants because they are clean and do not damage property. Do not ever rent to a Lesbian couple no matter what you do.
>>75190214
You sound like too much of a nice guy pushover to be a landlord. Or, at least a landlord that gets rich. How do you think the jews in NYC do it? They rent the shittest apartments for the highest possible prices, never fix anything, never remodel. If they suspect a tenant is going to be trouble they use every trick in the book to get him out of there. They have pitbull attorneys on retainer to deal with uppity tenants. They are absolutely ruthless. That's why there was such a huge tension between the hassid slumlords and the blacks in brooklyn, which bubbled over when the hassid killed that black kid years back.
>>75186686
>he's not a homeowner
>>75191213
no i dont
You guys believe
>hurr durr the free market takes care of it and people would invest in new apartments and take their share of the profittsss
it doesnt work like that
You have this city in which you cannot just build new apartments. There is no escape.
Why am i even arguing with an australian about this? You have the same shit going on in Sydney or Melbourne.
There is no end to this bullshit.
>>75191215
That's a red herring.
I'm talking about rent seeking behavior.
You're saying a person shouldn't be paid so much rent after the house has been paid off because they aren't creating value.
One issue at a time.
>>75190572
How are you so poor? I had a $900/month 12th story penthouse apartment by the time I was 20 years old. 2 bedrooms. 1 bedroom has a kingsize bed and a TV, the other bedroom has my battlestation and treadmill+weights I work a factory job making 45k/year with no college degree.
>>75190277
>so uh you are saying businesses work like that:
>>invest 100k
>>get 100k back 10 times
>>have 1 million
If your math is correct, and it's that simple, why don't you just do it yourself? 100k is not a large loan, if you have a job, which you claim you do. You can buy (or build) your own apartment building, charge exactly as much as you need to cover the mortgage, and after a few years, you'll be able to quit your job.
Or even better, you can do all that, and once the building is paid off, you can start practicing what you preach and let everyone live there for free.
don't blame the landlords, blame government regulation.
In a free market, developers and landlords would compete for renters, and there'd be a ton of rooms available at affordable prices. But nowadays, government restricts building and has all these stupid regulations that keep the supply of apartments down.
>>75186686
Doesn't matter, you're using somebody else's property and they have a right to charge you for it.
>>75191451
I never said shit about building new apartments all I said is the very fact that people are willing to pay that much for rent is the reason why rent is that high. Why is this concept so hard to grasp?
>>75191502
>quantifiy the value
how high is it?
>it's that simple, why don't you just do it yourself? 100k is not a large loan, if you have a job, which you claim you do. You can buy (or build) your own apartment building, charge exactly as much as you need to cover the mortgage, and after a few years, you'll be able to quit your job.
lots of people would
You can get a 100k loan to buy a car .. but you can't get one to buy an apartment building
You won't get permission to build one. Old money keeps you out of town cause they don't want any competition that cuts in to their potential never ending profits.
>>75187925
my god, the brainwash is real
>>75186686
>I get the point that its necessary in new buildings to get back the costs but the building i live in now is a pure money maker for my landlord.
Yes, are you fucking stupid? The only incentive he has to even keep that building ope is the profit he makes off of his tenants. If people could pull a profit then people like you would not be able to rent apartments or houses.
>>75191846
you don't get one without the other
they only pay that much cause of the supply
>>75190933
True. Crazy part is the building I own doubled in price recently, I'm right outside of Manhattan and some huge mixed use buildings went up and are going up, so it drove up building values, but not so much rents yet.
>>75190292
I never rented to a dindu ever once, and the few hispanics I rented were pretty straight laced, even brazilians. I rent to arabs all the time and they always have the rent on time and are respectful too.
>>75191231
The lesbian bit is spot on, I rented to a lesbian couple, man I had the cops visit that apartment 3 times in one year. It was crazy! They got 4 months free rent off me too, but I had last months rent and a security deposit, so they just got 2 months free really! I had to run to court, but had a great lawyer, but I wrote it all off as a loss in the end so couldn't care less. Great part is they didn't wreck anything in the apartment, thought I'd have nasty surprises. It's a total pain in the ass in nyc to get a tenant out in under 6 months.
>>75189680
So you admit the problem is government interference.
>>75191955
So what?
>>75191881
>how high is it?
It depends on how scarce housing is in the area, and how much can be produced in the region.
If you want a number, or a simplistic function to figure it out, you're joking. It'd be an incredibly complicated formula.
>>75191921
>brainwash
are you telling me i can just settle down and expect the static economy to cater to me for the next 30 years?
everything can change and since i work for an international company it can happen that ih ave to work in another country in 2 years
The business world and economy has been designed like that through globalism to keep us all enslaved
>>75192066
yes of course. Govt. could also interfere "the right way" and put an end to this non sense but they make their pockets full with cash so why would they
>>75186686
This is their bloody property, and you agreed upon terms of renting this place, including paying for stuff like rent and maintenance. If you don't like it, buy your fucking own apartment or whatever.
>>75191148
Basically this
>>75192408
>yes of course. Govt. could also interfere "the right way" and put an end to this non sense but they make their pockets full with cash so why would they
You're one of the people who can't understand why Venezuela doesn't have enough money to afford to sell beer right now, aren't you?
>>75191761
Lel no. Landlords would only compete for renters if there were a lot less people in the cities (and wanting to move there)
>>75192654
for the exact same reasons actually
corruption, cronyism which is rampant in a socialist society ... i live in a socialist society btw
thats why im complaining haha
>>75186919
Here's the thing: don't like it, don't live there. You aren't entitled to use someone else's building, and if they want to charge you any amount of money as per a contract, they can. You don't get to dictate the price, they do. Seller's market. Your option is to refuse and move on or take the contract.
Living space is a commodity, not a right.
>>75186686
Move out if you don't like the deal. But honor the contract.
>>75191955
>>75191881
>>75191451
>>75191215
>>75191003
>>75190597
>>75190277
>>75189680
>>75189009
>>75188735
>>75188456
>>75188193
>>75187925
>>75187721
>>75186919
hey goyim, get is this one of you? because you have got to unfuck his shit
>>75186686
So his building is paid for multiple times. Why should you get reduced rent as a result? Why not someone else?
Why should the owner have his capital stuck in the building if you limit the profits he can make?
If you limit the profits, what is stopping the owner from converting rentals to condos and selling them in units to new owners at market value?
>>75186686
Where I live, absolutely. Nothing in Germoney will last because your people are stupid fucktards and ruined it for you. You made a mistake putting so much effort and money into a place you do not own. Thats your fault not the landlords but I would say if they knew you were doing it, a good landlord would advise you not to spend so much on it. My family also pays for the sanitary and garbage bills on all of our rentals and you are responsible for water and power and keeping the house/lot in good condition.
>>75186686
Paying rent is not a scam, paying taxes is.
>>75191011
in Europe you can sue the owner for expenses incurred
>>75187551
You name something, I am sure we pay tax for it.
>>75187140
Yeah. all maintenance (unless damaged by the tenant) is done by the landlord
>>75192408
>interfere "the right way"
That's the problem. Governments are inherently slow. If they weren't slow, they would still be corrupt, if they weren't corrupt, they would still be inefficient because central control never works.
Try to make a new fucking building to compete in the market, i don't know how it is for your country, but over here you start with 40% tax before anything, then you move on to over a year of bureaucracy and in the end you never know if the government is gonna go full venezuela and say that renting is now illegal so you should give away your building.
>>75193449
In America you sign a lease and it is binding in a court of law. Whatever is on that lease goes. Reasons like this is why europe is dumb
>Be a Mason
>Build your own house for a fraction of the price because your family has at least one of every other Trade
Took longer than it would have if i had hired a company to build it, but the labour cost was paid in food and beer.
Houses are pretty cheap if you only pay for the property and the building materials.
Whats the cheapest way to own your own place?
Buying land putting a prebuilt mini house intop of it?
Living in a caravan?
What is it?
>>75192408
I work in a small family business with my father. the starting capital was just around 5000 euro ten years ago. Now we earn around 100k eur yearly (1000 eur is a totally comfortable living for a month) I pay 400 eur monthly for a 30 year mortgage of a new (finished this year) 160square meteres flat in a small city.
All you need is to do something valuable/have skills and not be a fucking brainwashed communist pussy. That may be hard for you Hans.
Around here, it is actually buying which is the scam.
Pic related is a 100 square meter apartment in Germany suitable for 2 people and maybe 1 kid max. It costs more than 1 million dollars. That is normal around here.
>>75193788
it's not stupid. the owner can obviously put a stop to any expansions, upgrades and whatnot in which case the tenet gets squat, but if the owner/landlord doesn't explicitly protest, it's considered that he tacitly approved of expansions.
I think that applies to most Continental Law countries
>>75193970
His name isn't Hans, its probably Ahmed. Someone with a proper german name like Hans would be a hard worker and not be a poor communist that demands free things.
>>75193859
Be nonwhite and apply for refugee status. You will get a free house from the government.
>>75194000
Its only normal in and around big cities, cuck.
You dont pay for the apartment itself, you pay for the privilege of living in a upper class suburb and/or close to a lot of infrastructure.
In the area where i live, you can buy property and build a fairly large house for around 100-150k.
>>75194143
Half of my clients are german, and some of them are nice, hard working conservatives. 10-15% are batshit crazy brainwashed liberal vegetables that spit bizzwords everywhere.And we talk about Workers/engineers not some liberal faggots
>>75193788
>Whatever is on that lease goes
That's not entirely true. Every state, to my knowledge, has various Landlord/Tenant statutes which prohibit various types of leases clauses, particularly those in which the landlord attempts to jew the tenant out of some of the tenant's statutory rights.
Here's California, for example:
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/what-types-lease-clauses-illegal-california.html
The policy rationale behind such statutes is that legislators recognize the inferior bargaining position of the average unsophisticated tenant relative to the sophisticated landlord, and believe that the tenant deserves some judicial protection.
>>75194544
*liberal arts faggots
>>75194052
Talk about mental gymnastics, Im saying if its stated in the lease you cant do any improvements to the house then this whole thing is handled even before it starts. Why would a legitimate person making a decent living in the rental market want to leave any loopholes where they could be sued?
>>75186686
its supply and demand. what you're paying for is the privilege of living there, you're competing for that spot with other renters, and the owners are competing with each other to attract tenants. renting is a recurring cost for possession of your apartment and associated services, buying is an investment, and apartment buildings are businesses. its natural you feel some sense of ownership of the place you live, especially after fixing it up, but at the end of the day you are a customer
look for a coop if you want to feel more equitable about your living situation, you own stock in the corporation that owns the building and have a some say in the management through the tenant association. I wouldn't, personally, but its just preference. I rent cheap while I save for a down payment.
>>75193837
This is true. I got a pretty handy family aswell. Electrician, Welding, Plumbers, Carpenters etc.
Only the prices for a piece of land are retarded.
>>75186686
buy your own apartment then and stop crying faggot
>>75194544
There's your problem, Engineers.
Engineers aren't workers.
Engineers are scum. All engineers do is make everything difficult and hard.
>OH YOUVE DONE IT THAT WAY FOR OVER TEN YEARS AND NEVER HAD ANY PROBLEMS? IVE BEEN AN ENGINEER FOR TWO AND I SAY THIS WAY IS BETTER. OH IT DIDNT WORK OUT AS PLANNED WELL ITS YOUR FAULT YOU DIDNT DO IT RIGHT.
Seriously fuck engineers, fucking cunts all of them.
>>75194726
>and the owners are competing with each other to attract tenants
not anymore
>pic related its berlin
people are visiting an apartment
The owners can set the price to whatever someone is willing to pay cause there is not enough space available and there won't be cause the banks, politicians and even businesses don't have any interested in this
>>75194599
I guess I should have said a decent landlord with a who doesnt want to jew the tenants. You can try and poke holes in it but the landlord will 98percent of the time win if it comes down to a court battle. And then in my world youre going to also be paying my attorney fees for me having to fuck with it if you lose.
>>75194739
Only if you buy from the government, m8.
Gov buys land from farmers and resells it to you.
At least in my area the farmers arent cucked yet and sell their land directly, that way you have less shitskin neighbours too, because the farmers here are racist as hell and dont want sandnigger neighbours.
>>75186785
Hello Stefan Memeux. good to see you.
last video was great btw.
>>75194391
>Its only normal in and around big cities, cuck.
What I said:
>That is normal AROUND HERE.
>>75186686
>I get the point that its necessary in new buildings to get back the costs but the building i live in now is a pure money maker for my landlord.
>Is this justified?
Yes, your landlord invested money for long term payoff, this is their payoff.
>>75186686
>Even the taxes, garbage memes, water and shit is included in my rent.
So you're covering their costs then.
That's how rent works, retard.
>>75195342
Then why live in or around a big city?
Those places are cancer. You have no one to blame but yourself.
>>75186686
you're dumb, you must be 18, 19 tops.
>>75190224
This, people who are saying 'rent is stupid' aren't see all the pros of renting.
Now, having to pay every utility is getting shafted and that's when you look for a new place.
>>75194661
>Why would a legitimate person making a decent living in the rental market want to leave any loopholes where they could be sued?
because you don't get refunded for every expense you make. you only get refunded for necessary expenses (i.e. you fix a leaking roof) and for expenses that raise the price of the property (to the tune of either the amount of money you invested or the amount of value the expansion added depending on which is lower)
the owner/landlord literally can't lose any money because the tenet either saved the property from deteriorating or added value to said property.
granted you could add a clause to your rent contract stipulating that no expansions and alterations are permitted but knowing Hans here he probably didn't engage in doing something like that if his agreement with the landlord specifically prohibited it
>>75186686
I don't think it is a scam but it is certainly a waste of fucking money
>>75186686
the building has probably changed hands 3-7 times in those 50-60 years. each new owner pays more than the last.
they also have to pay property taxes yearly in most states in america dont know bout germany. property taxes are based off of the value of the property. more land more expensive structure more you pay
>>75186785
Fpbp. Whether it is "right" or not, you signed a contract out of free will. You could sign a contract giving me the right to kick you in the balls at any given time, but that would be stupid. Even more stupid would be to complain about receiving a foot in the balls every day.
>>75195044
You have a point.Everytime some degree is memed as awesome the quality of students drops. Too many cunts that don't know what they are doing get there.
>>75195104
>tfw reality gets past my mental block around whats going on in europe and I have to remember
thats a tough break, fritz. your country is economically broken.
>>75195212
>You can try and poke holes in it but the landlord will 98percent of the time win if it comes down to a court battle. And then in my world youre going to also be paying my attorney fees for me having to fuck with it if you lose.
That's more a function of disparate resources to pursue legal action than anything else. That's why I like to volunteer my legal services to tenants facing eviction. I do it just to fuck with the landlords and the their shitty attorneys. Through legal maneuvering, counter-claims, and affirmative defenses, I can buy tenants months and months of free rent in the apartment.
Plus, in my state at least, the tenant's liability for the landlord's attorneys' fees are statutorily capped at $75, which I gladly pay myself on behalf of the tenant. It's how I give back to the little guy and fuck with the landlord vultures and their attorneys from no-name law schools. Plus, my firm pays me to take on cases like this, as part of our pro bono pledge to the community.
>>75195044
I'm an engineer and that pretty well sums up my life
it always boils down to one thing
>you didnt specify that
>>75186686
you rent from someone or you rent from the government.. up to you to decide which is cheaper in the situation
I'm a landlord and yes it is justified. I am not going to let you live on my property for nothing. I have Maintance, taxes, fees, lawyer, ect. Hell I even need to make some money to put a roof over my head and put food on my table. You a real fuckung idiot. If you don't like it become a home owner or landlord.
>>75195663
I still do not agree. I have insurance on everything I own. Its not the tenants responsibility to worry about fixing a roof. If the roof does happen to leak then that tenant better have insurance on their possessions because its not the landlords responsibility to worry about tvs, sofas etc.
Youre making it too hard honestly and that would deter anyone from being in the business.
>>75186686
>I want to live someplace
Rent
>pay a monthly fee to use someone's property
Get a loan and buy a house/condo
>pay a monthly fee to a bank to slowly own a banks property
>>75191526
Found the boomer.
Also, I'm a Wendy's chef making 130k. Get on my level.
>>75186686
>I get the point that its necessary in new buildings to get back the costs but the building i live in now is a pure money maker for my landlord.
So basically, new buildings should have rent, but it should be free (other than service fees) to live in old buildings? How many do you think would choose to live in new buildings and pay rent then? Who should decide who gets to live in the old buildings rent-free?
Did you just arrive from Syria or are Germans taught to be retards in school?
>>75186686
> people who own property shouldn't be allowed to use it to make a profit.
Nice one, comrade. Those evil fascist capitalists need to stop with their delusional idea that they can do whatever they want with their own property.
>>75196842
You can easily afford a house with 900$/€ a month if you live frugal.
>>75196364
this is sort of true in the sense that unpaid property taxes will get you foreclosed on, but in the US, property taxes are local, not federal, its more like renting from the bank. you also have equity as you pay off your mortgage if you sell or collateral you can borrow against.
>>75196215
So youre a bottom feeding leach in other words? You should be ashamed. Most people will never own a sizable amount of property in their lives without an enormous amount of money starting out and even if they make a living solely from rentals. If you were to help keep a tenant in one of my houses for months and months of free rent, it would absolutely cause irreversible damage to my business. I could sue your firm for strong arming me out of the market. Ive never had anything as crazy as these hypotheticals happen to me but im just saying this so you see where it could lead.
>>75197587
are you some kind of ancap fag that thinks slumlords should be able to do whatever they want?
>>75186686
renting anything is a fucking scam
go buy a house you fucking dip
>>75198025
My shit aint slums nigger. And yes I fucking own it so its my way or the highway. Fucking commies I swear.
>>75198025
If tenets would leave or not rent from slumlord we would not have this problem. It also would help if trash did not wreck rentals in the way out. One time i had to gut a kitchen that I just remodeled the year prior. Lost 15k on that one rental.
>>75197587
>So youre a bottom feeding leach in other words?
No, I just do it for fun, not for money. Large firms take pro bono cases like these all the time as a way of helping the little guy, who can't afford legal representation. In my day job at the firm I work exclusively with corporate clients on more complex and nuanced transnational matters.
I only do cases in which the landlord is a scumbag and his attorneys are sharks. These are the types of people that like to fuck with tenants. They deserve to be fucked with right back.
Here's an example of a case I took: A 68 year-old black disabled widow had her rent money order stolen from the community's rent deposit box. The landlord called her a liar immediately filed an eviction action. I stepped in, told her to stop paying rent altogether, examined the apartment and found a variety of conditions defects that she reported but the landlord refused to fix. These defects were exacerbating her disability. So, I filed a countersuit alleging discrimination on the basis of disability, as well as a variety of other claims.
After about three months of all of this, we settled, she got to stay in the apartment, the landlord fixed the defects, and she lived rent-free during the pendency of the suit. That's hardly bottom-feeding. It's actually noble - because without my free services, a 68 year-old disabled widow would've been homeless because of a sleazy landlord. Or, she would've been forced to stay in an apartment in which the conditions exacerbated her disability.
>>75186686
yes its justified, because you live in a capitalist economy, youre buying space, its not owed to you
>>75198959
Well most people, especially attorneys, arent this nice.
And is this lady collecting disability because shes truly disabled or is it because she eats so much fried chicken from her free ebt card and is so fat she literally cannot move? In any case if there was mold or some other kind of defect in one of my places it would be delt with expediently and without question as long as shes paying rent . I do not offer homes for rent that are unlivable. And I hate to profile people but its necessary in my line of work.
>>75186686
>The building is paid for a gazillion times
>What are the owners true costs?
What the fuck does it matter you retarded fucking commie.
The room is worth whatever the owner can get someone to pay for it.
Yes it's justified.
>>75200269
>And is this lady collecting disability because shes truly disabled or is it because she eats so much fried chicken from her free ebt card and is so fat she literally cannot move?
She worked in a factory for over 20 years and developed severe COPD and asthma as a result of being exposed to aesbestos while there. She got jewed out of a settlement check for reasons too legally complex to go into in a /pol/ post, and lives on about $1200/month via social security and disability.
I agree that there are a lot of terrible tenants, but there are also a lot of helpless people. People who played by the rules their entire lives, but are old and infirmed and poor, and thus easily pushed around by people out to make a buck. It occurs so frequently in LL/Tenant matters because of how easy it is to fuck with someone when one of life's basic necessities is on the line.
>>75186686
>Is Paying Rent A Scam?
of course not, goyim! you need somewhere to live, right? who wants to do all the work of owning and maintaining a property that will potentially appreciate in value and make you a profit, anyway?
>>75201075
Yeah I know a few of the other landlords in my town are just dirty snakes but that is not how I run my business. At the end of the day I still have to live with myself and no amount of money could buy that for me. Ive had disabled tenants and most of them were very good ones but yes you do get those few that are not deserving any help from my end. That renter fucked up by not having the money orders mailed to him at some address. Having a drop box is just asking for it. Half of my rent comes by mail and the other half I pick up myself. It makes the first of the month a hell of a time for me but the bank doesnt care if the tenants check was stolen you know? They want that money and my credit and way of life is on the line.
>>75186686
Paying rent is for losers who can't keep a mortgage.
