Has there ever been a successful communist country?
China, with deng Xiao ping leading capitalism favored policies.
>to get rich is glorious
>>72948642
Literally no.
>>72948642
Are you retarded?
>>72948642
Has there ever been a communist country?
>>72948782
So in other words, no.
>>72949047
Plenty but leftist create new definitions as a defense tactic for when people call them out on their retarded beliefs so they can claim that's not "real" communism
Marx said that communism would occur once a socialist state finally reached its perfect form and the government dissolved.
Thus, somalia is the one true communist country.
>>72949312
Fuck you dumb nigger.
Which countries in the world are the major based? The western capitalist countries or the communist ones? Communism under Stalin worked he created homogenous socialist states which functioned until faggot traitors and jew decided to break the system.
>>72948642
Romania
Oh wait... no there hasn't
>>72949488
>it worked until it stopped working
>>72949488
Please don't talk about traitors and Jews while you spout about communism with an American flag next to your post you dumb faggot
>>72949488
Pretty funny because you have it basically opposite. The bolsheviks were all jewish, with the sole exception being stalin. And they all wanted all these super-pozzed trotsky-style cultural marxist policies not unlike what the jews are doing in the western world today. It wasn't until stalin purged all the jews that it became socially conservative.
>>72948642
Nope
>>72949312
Oh you
We were until capitalism came
Say what you will but if communism has any chance, it's not anytime in the near future. The world is far too unstable with niggers and others destroying everything they touch. It's gonna have to be in some Star Trek era.
t. not a commie
Plenty of them, but capitalists ruined that. Just look at USSR in 60's. Fucking utopia.
>>72948642
Canada
>>72948642
China
>>72950135
>only reason it didn't work is because the whole world wasn't also communism!
t. leon trotsky This is tantamount to saying that the niggers' 85 IQ average wouldn't be a problem if not for the people with a normal IQ doing better than them.
>>72950258
Umm, nope.
>>72948642
Soviet Russia before it seceded
Economically speaking, China is doing well. Singapore has a very large state owned enterprises. State owned investment enterprises itself accounted for 17% of capitalisation on our stock exchange. We're doing well.
>>72950416
Just because not everything is privatized doesn't mean it's communist
>>72950310
Successful when it stopped being Communist in most senses yes.
>>72948642
Has there ever been a successful capitalist country?
All the best and most successful countries in the world are mixed economies with Keynesian economic policy and a free market with socialist safeguards.
Yes: USSR, China, Viet Nam, Cuba, etc.
People forget that the West was at *war* with socialism wherever it appeared, attempting to direct the political destiny of indigenous populations for them with economic sanctions, political terror, or outright violence.
I think most of these countries did quite well considering they only had the entire world against them. Russians went from being peasants to star travelers in less than 50 years: a far more rapid pace of development than the US or Britain ever achieved.
Most of these countries were never good to begin with, but they were able to provide a simple dignified life for their citizens where it did not exist previously. That is the definition of success.
>>72950382
Nah, I mean in general communism is a good idea. Haters mixing it with dictatorship, but it's state regime and can exist with capitalism too.
And TBQH capitalism and free trade failed too. The whole world is cucked by monopolies and IMF.
>>72950901
You can't have communism without an authoritarian police state keeping it in place for any decent length of time.
>>72950397
Yes
>>72951003
That's fine.
You can't have any government without authority.
Those who say that the USSR did well have no idea what they're talking about. The USSR was a fucking totalitarian regime that humiliated human dignity to the max.
>>72948642
has there ever been a successful capitalist one?
>>72951154
But it takes a lot more effort put into combating entropy, since communism flies in the face of the natural order of things. There are degrees of authority necessary.
Furthermore, anon's point seems to be that the issue is merely with dictatorship and not communism itself. But you can't have communism without a dictatorship (or effective dictatorship/oligarchy/whatever you want to call it)
Anarchist Catalonia, before Franco and his fascist shits destroyed it.
Communism would be less susceptible to complete failure if it would actually trade and make deals with capitalistic countries.
Somewhat like China
>>72951444
It also mass murdered its people and outright robbed other Warsaw Pact countries off its products and resources, but hey, commies dindu nuffin cause few retarded countries allowed raise of oligarchy and monopolies, amirite
>>72950135
Russia had no economic growth in '60. Kosygin reforms were forced to adress the issue.
>>72951444
Butthurt belt strikes again. Commies were no good either, but you people are fucking gullible
>>72951744
But no one's defending Yeltsin and monopolies, why are you acting like what he said isn't true? Just because we fucked up the privatization doesn't mean communism was good
>>72948642
Relatively speaking yes. USSR industrialized rapidly, became a superpower, literacy became universal, better healthcare, people lived longer etc.
Still there were too many faults with it.
>>72949228
Communism is not the same as socialism.
Communist state is an oxymoron, because communism is stateless society.
>Successful
>Communist
Pick one
>>72951661
What's communist about China? Expect the ruling parties name.
>>72951744
How can't you be butthurt if bolsheviks fucked up totally everything?
>>72949906
keep listening to hitler and his kike bullshit. this shit about soviets being 1/100th jew meme is stupid.
kikes on this board never stop with the stalin meme about killing millions, it's completely impossible for him to have killed that many.
keep listening to that jew history, believe their memes about how terrible things were. polacy on suicide watch when they realize their major problem was jaruzelski and not communism.
>>72951543
More state authority may be necessary, but it's short-sighted to think that tyranny starts and begins with men in police uniforms.
Capitalist societies can host a smaller police apparatus because the force is baked into the system itself. There is nothing democratic about a society where individuals vote every four years but take unilateral orders from management day in and day out.
If more men with guns are required to keep these swindlers out of power and ensure a dignified day to day existence for working people, then so be it.
>>72952174
According to you people Eastern Europe was paradise before communism.
Russians is right, you live in myths. USSR was flawed and I agree with you somewhat, but this is ridiculous.
And now you replaced communism with neoliberalism.
>>72951444
*lights a candle and plays sombre, reflective piano music for u*
>>72951444
cry litewski nigger because they didn't provide you with more hand outs. they gave you baltic niggers everything to try to help you, and you fucking cry about it, to this complaining like some sjw. sorry, maybe the soviets needed their priveledge checked.
fucking nation of oppressed transgenders.
>>72948642
No.
/thread
>>72948642
No. There were a couple small communal experiments in the past, but I believe that they all failed and people there had to move back to cities.
>>72952174
the only reason any of you dumb niggers wanted out was because the soviets weren't giving you enough money. all you wanted to do is lay around like the niggers in the united state. you know watching bullshit american propaganda showing the niggers living easy getting everything for free.
you know understand what that freedom is, having your sovereignty taken away. you can't do nothing and collect welfare from other countries and have your sovereignty too. complete sjw nigger logic.
>>72952442
If you compare interwar-period Lithuania with commie Lithuania, then yes, it was paradise.
>And now you replaced communism with neoliberalism
Still better. I couldn't even shitpost under communist regime.
Rojava is doing pretty good atm.
>>72952509
How do you even have money for the Internet, mate
>>72953010
except you have no sovereignty. in order for you to shit post like a proper worthless nigger you gave the eu your sovereignty.
now you think you can complain about immigrants and what eurabia wants, you gave that up to live like niggers off eu welfare.
same problem with ukraine they are pissed because they want free money and no one will give it to them without taking some of their sovereignty.
North Korea :^)
>>72953224
But we are niggers of Europe because we had to start from the bottom when we left the USSR. And the USSR got us to the bottom. Before the annexion we were on par with countries like Denmark or Finland.
>>72952442
No one's saying it was a paradise before communism but it wasn't as bad as you may think, at least not here. The main reason why people bitch about it isn't its legacy nor the overwhelming terror which accompanied its reign, it's the belief that we might've been much better off without it, that's all. And honestly, if you look at 25 years of "freedom" that we've had now, there's no comparison. We're much better off without it and we're only getting better. And for the record, Balts were literally celebrating when Nazis liberated them from the Soviets during the world war.
>>72952886
I'm not sure if this is bait but let me clarify something. People were doing nothing during communism, literally nothing, anon. Every institution was employing too many people. We've had this saying that "Whether I stand or lie down, you have to pay me x amount". And money wasn't even that big of deal because you simply couldn't buy some products without ration stamps, there was shortage of everything.
>>72953010
I do and interwar Lithuania was pretty shit m8.
USSR is gone and it's over, thank God, but let's be realistic.
>>72953493
No you weren't. Poland for example was poorer than USSR in interwar period, per capita.
Soviet-style socialism had major faults but it wasn't that bad in purely statistical terms.
Reason why you were at the bottom in 90's was neoliberal "shock therapy".
>>72953504
poland had its own unique problem with their dictator. i am not saying it's paradise but russians did the same hiring too many people in tsar times also, they do that shit now. there was no difference between now and communism, it's part of the culture. and the real problem started after the system disappeared. then the constant media propaganda about how bad soviet unio , in fact they stole election from communists in 90s. yeltsin had lost, everyone was sick of his bullshit.
>>72952221
60 million is debatable. But that infographic is misleading.
Stalin did kill millions of people though disastrous policies. You cannot displace a few million peasants without suffering, or execute a significant portion of you military command structure and not have a kill count.
The first flag is that this only has three fucking citations. One of them published in Moscow in 71. This is most likely biased. Another is published in 1905, years prior to Stalin's regime.
The second flag is that the timeline only goes to 1945. This ignores the post war period.
The third is that it ignores the evidence we have from the Soviet Archives about the mass displacement of peasants, the military purges, and political prisoners sent to gulag in siberia. Your infographic fails to mention that. It also fails to take into account the thousands of hours logged by historians, in the actual archives where your evidence should be taken from, trying to make sense of that mess.
>not based on any inquiry or physical evidence. lol.
Again, completely ignores the numerous western historians that entered the archives after 1991.
This graph blatantly ignores the work of non-Russian historians that have confirmed evidence directly from the archives that millions died. 60 is only an estimate, but it ranges from 3 to 6 million. Not exactly saint like.
In other words, get your shit infographic that relies on 3 sources out of here. Your shitposting is weak like your bloodline.
0/10 you would be a shit historian.
>>72953504
>it wasn't as bad as you may think
It was far behind Western Europe in every aspect.
>might've been much better off
Or not.
>much better off
I'm not even arguing against that.
>>72954182
You can take care of society without Soviet-style system.
>>72954182
Or shoot her in the back of the head for political dissent in the army. Perhaps even taken away from her village only to die of starvation in a potato field somewhere. It's all the same right?
>>72948642
There is 0 cooperation with people - it cannot be successful - but it can achieve some goals.
>>72949644
Communist experiment here literally made us the shit country we are today.
>>72948642
USSR, I don't know why /pol/ praise modern Russia.
>>72954045
ok schekelstein history ph.d with your reliable western sources. it's a well known fact that those census numbers from the soviets were inflated and inaccurate to begin with before the war.
you want to talk about the famines? nigger please they had those in precommunist times also, under the tsar also. it's complete nonsense to say that he caused these famines, these happened all the time and were a part of life in pre industrial russia. they had a political agenda in the soviet system itself to discredit stalin the numbers from 71 are probably highly accurate.
>>72954593
>romania
>communism made you shit
lmao, nice try
No. Marxism in practice now requires a greater, stronger system to leech off of in order to exist vicariously through it, influencing only to periodically give judgement and incite class warfare, now stratified by "privilege." Not only does this serve as security through obscurity, but also gives the benefit of anonymousing the true people to blame, the people who teach this shit at universities.
It's likely no one will ever try a completely authoritarian Marxist system again.
>>72948782
...
That's not communism?
>>72954182
She'd actually be shot for having wrong opinions
>>72951489
The U.S. of A.
>>72954481
I agree. But it is impossible under capitalism.
>>72954771
Was not even funny, you're probably underage and uneducated. Enjoy Jewish media and propaganda.
>>72954963
>Commie shit
>in US
How mighty have fallen.
>>72954963
Is it possible at all?
I mean how do you protect your system from corruption or a revolt?
I feel like you'd need a couple of generations educated under certain guidelines to keep the system uncorrupted and working.
>>72954919
yeah happened all the time, because people were simply taken to the street and shot every day. what a fucking fantasy.
>>72955248
To be fair, their streets are filled with homeless people of all ages. I've seen that shit in both Canada and in the States, even had young people asking me for food. I really doubt all of those people are lazy niggers who don't want to work.
Here we barely have any hobos and they always just ask for booze or money for it.
>>72955450
Streets? No. They were usually taken to forests.
>>72955248
I'm a market socialist m8. The capitalist mode of production is destined only to create more crisis and slow growth. Having workers own the businesses they work is the only path towards high growth and less crisis.
>>72955419
I happen to think liberal governance of several parties has worked wonders towards stable government by allowing one party to take the blame instead of the whole state. All you have to do is make sure anti-capitalist principles are enshrined in the constitution.
Does defeating Amerika count as successful?
>>72955528
>Here we barely have any hobos and they always just ask for booze or money for it
Man I remember how many hobos we hade near and under Central Train Station in Warsaw before Euro 2012.
To these days I wonder what happend with them. You might find one or two sometimes, but not bunch like it used to be.
>>72955672
>Having workers own the businesses they work is the only path towards high growth and less crisis.
Won't happend, not in US.
>>72955528
masz jakieś dziwne marzenia.
strange dreams you have. I never saw any one taken to the forest, no matter what they said. you have nice fantasy.
Better dead than red
>>72955450
They would be send to gulags or taken somewhere and nobody will hear about them again.
It was considered normal in USSR.
>>72955759
>Won't happend, not in US.
Maybe not now, and maybe not all at once. But we are patient, and we can nudge things in the right direction.
>>72955822
>marzenia
>fantasy
>>72948642
My country :^)
>>72955839
lol nigger please, no one was taken to any fucking gulag when i was growing up. you read too many fucking stromfag comics and memes.
>>72955863
Just like bolsheviks nudged in Russia?
They would go full facism before this happens.
>>72955888
i don't try to be perfect in your faggot language
>>72955922
>stormfag comics
You live in a fucking US cunt.
It's not a fantasy, it was real and used to happend in normal.
For political dissent you could end up in prison.
>>72954763
The Tsar was shit and so was Stalin.
>complete nonsense to say that he caused these famines
I'm going to say no.
>Alan Bullock, "the total Soviet grain crop was no worse than that of 1931 ... it was not a crop failure but the excessive demands of the state, ruthlessly enforced, that cost the lives of as many as five million Ukrainian peasants."
It Stalin could have prevented some of the mass starvation by allowing for the grain reserves to be used.
>these happened all the time and were part of life in pre industrial russia.
So famines in the 30s count as pre industrial?
>they had a political agenda in the soviet system itself to discredit stalin.
Well no shit, wanna know why? Because he was a power grabbing mad man. You cannot kill a significant portion of your military command and officer corp only to replace them with incompetents and help perpetuate mass starvation without pissing a few people off.
>>72955672
>I happen to think liberal governance of several parties has worked wonders towards stable government by allowing one party to take the blame instead of the whole state.
I agree with that wholeheartedly
>>72955678
No, but didn't your country turn out well after all anyway?
>>72955839
Not only in the USSR, we had that shit too. My uncle was sent to gulag even though he was from PRL. Also remember the whole deal with persecuted clergy like Popieluszko, it was even worse in the USSR, they murdered a lot of priests.
>>72955987
Then try to perfect in events that happend.
>>72955822
>>72955888
>>72955987
The worst thing is that you literally said it correctly. He's just being an edgy faggot.
>>72948642
Communism will never be succesful because of inbred retards like visitors of /pol/ exist who only think about themselves.
>>72955922
yeah gulags were a lie
so was the holodomor and the holocaust amirite
>>72955836
Jason Unruhue is just an autist, I wouldn't look to far into that.
>>72955941
I didn't mean in a revolutionary way, but in an entryist way, by slowly taking control of larger institutions like the democratic party and municipal governments.
>>72956073
>correctly
>marzenia = fantasy
It literally goes DREAMS fagmen.
>>72954963
>>72955672
I don't know how it worked in other communist countries but in Yugoslavia for example you could own small business, like 4 employees.
Yugoslav communism was pretty interesting, too bad Tito made many mistakes and didn't have a great material to work with. As we say here, you can't make a pie out of shit.
Anyway, what's the problem with capitalism, if state is allowed to correct it's failings?
I believe mixed system would work best.
the reason western countries were good to live in before the 1980s was because of communism. when communism was a threat, governments had to make sure people liked capitalism, so made sure they were paid well, wages increased along with the economy, that people had job security, and that social decay was kept in check.
since communism fell, western countries have gone to hell. no increase in living standards in 40 years, no jobs, mass unemployment, feminism, social atomization.
once communism fell the capitalists didn't have to make people like capitalism anymore, so got right back to fucking them over.
thank communism that the USA, australia, western europe, etc were actually good places to live for a brief time between 1945 and 1980.
>>72956146
Read his post again.
If theirs a currency? Its not communism.
If you can buy things? Its not communism.
Had a argument with my highschool teacher over how China wasn't communist. Its actually more capitalistic than america since you can buy or buy off anything to do what you want.
Capitalism unhinged I've heard it called.
>>72951444
Why would /pol/ raise offense to this? They don't want degenerates to have rights.
>>72955990
it's not reality you dumb nigger, no one was being killed like that or taken to prison. People got drunk complained to eachother same as they do now.
Cлaвa тoй pace, кoтopaя знaeт мecтa, гдe мoжнo cидeть нa кopтoчкaх!
Niggers
>>72956296
Nevermind, off to gulag with me.
Send me a rope or something will you?
>>72956384
But anon, gulags weren't real :^) No one was ever murdered or imprisoned in the commie times, it was the pinnacle of liberties
>>72956125
holomodor happened, but so did many other famine before soviet system. there is no reason to blame anyone, they used to happen frequently. sorry for trigger you fags.
>>72956384
Let my German friend Helmut help you :^)
>>72952507
So imagine China invades the US with a 300 million men army, and gets support from the rest of the world. They estabilish industries to employ you in them forcibly for a horrible wage, and periodically send chink immigrant workers to get the best jobs. Does that seem fair to you?
>>72956183
Tito failed because he took on too much debt and couldn't dispel the political corruption he already had. Economies that are already industrialized will have no such problems.
The problem with capitalism is that it creates inequality, which creates a political elite that controls the country, which creates slower growth since the rich spend less of their income than workers, and which creates crisis since for profit banks are encouraged to give out credit to workers to spur the growth the economy needs without significantly raising wages.
Mixed systems fail because capitalists will always undermine regulations and laws through lobbying and their own twisted innovation.
Russia desu.
It did well enough to put the first man in space. Arguing that the system didn't work because it eventually collapsed is like saying democracy wasn't successful because Athens eventually lost to Sparta. And the crying balts are no different than the Spartan helots.
>>72956375
Do you have any evidence for that bold claim or are you just going to keep sucking dicks.
>>72956375
>it's not reality you dumb nigger, no one was being killed like that or taken to prison
They were.
Just to give you one, the one that cause big uproar, before you go full denial.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerzy_Popie%C5%82uszko
>>72950577
Point. Although one could submit the United States pre-1913.
>>72956073
oh me and my wife visited your faggot country before to see the holohoax for ourselves. i know all about you dumb nigger, and your monument to katyń and shit all over. we have relatives in your country.
>>72950547
Other way around
If it is not in private possession anymore but in the hands of the government it is communism.
>>72956490
>they used to happen frequently
>that means there is no reason to investigate why it happened
>>72950577
This man knows.
>>72950577
There has never been a true capitalist country, maybe pre-1920s US. You can't have regulation if you want a true capitalist economy.
>>72956566
you couldn't make up that russian with a translator if you tried. polacy know it too
>>72948642
Yes.
Although only thing in which Communism succeeds is failing.
>>72954182
Shoo shoo, weeb.
>>72953141
Barely.
>>72956579
one fucking polish nigger goes missing and you faggots are in full sjw mode. nigger pleas enjoy the eu, faggots gave up your sovereignty for that sweet eu welfare. good look with that. you can live like the dumb niggers you and the ukrainians are together forever collecting money from eu, your women can collect afghan cock too.
never seen so many afghan before than in kraków
>>72956933
You're describing the Gilded Age and Industrial Britain.
>>72948642
NORTH KOREA?
>>72956949
I'm taking about your claim that "no one was being killed like that or taken to prison" fruit cake.
>>72956949
So you have no evidence only your bullshit.
What about priesthood that was murdered in 1989?
What about people being imprisoned for political dissent, like this guy?
"Barchański EMIL, l. 17. A student political prisoner. He disappeared on 16 June 1982. The body was fished out of the river. In the course of the investigation he was beaten, he had to be a witness at the hearing colleagues"
or maybe this one?
"RYSZARD KOWALSKI, l. 44. The Chairman KZ "Solidarity" in Huta Katowice, twice a political prisoner. He disappeared on 7 February 1983. The body was fished out of the river on March 31, 1983"
You are so full of shit it's not even funny.
>>72957247
Yup, just like I said in>>72956579
DENIAL.
Your delusion doesn't hold up and you are on big cunt.
>>72948642
Define "communist" and "successful" first.
>>72948642
> successful communist country
>communist
>country
wat?
>>72956830
why do you need an investigation, everything was fucked up in that time. there was a famine and they were common, but now it's some type of fucking conspiracy theory.
>>72951955
Based WW2 montenegrin?
>>72950135
The late 30s were apparently quite good too, with the standard of living rising up until mid 1941.
>>72957347
not that i had ever seen no. i mean everyone was aware of the gulags, we even have seen the places but no one was taken away that i ever remember no, never heard about it either. ppl would run their mouths off all the time when they were drunk. where is your proof so many were shot in the 80s?
>>72957255
The state played a huge part in british industrialization, anon. Who do you think that conquered those sweet colonies and new markets in order to avoid superproduction crisis?
>>72956490
> USSR has a famine
> 23 million people die
> USA has a famine
> only produces enough food to feed the whole world three times over, instead of twenty times over like most harvests
Might be something else at work there.
>>72951003
That's exactly the opposite of what Marx wrote in Das Kapital. The whole world was supposed to eventually submit to it.
>>72957815
The burden of proof is on you.
Literally any google search would give you all the info you need.
>>72957425
you had a dictator who killed people? no shit, wow. conspiracy...
you mean he killed a few priests holy shit, check that mans privilege. you should be getting reparations nigger from eu.
wasn't russians killing these faggots.
>>72957536
>why do you need an investigation
I don't know, maybe to prevent another one from happening. But that would make too much sense.
>everything was fucked up in that time
Do you want to davel into why? Perhaps some policies and decisions made by Stalin could have prevented it, or maybe they caused it. But we will never know because according to you, it shouldn't be investigated.
>>72957815
>i've never seen it
>that means it never happened!
see >>72957425 for some evidence.
>>72950577
>All the best and most successful countries in the world are mixed economies with Keynesian economic policy and a free market with socialist safeguards.
Truth.
>>72956530
Tito didn't take too much debt. Debts only accumulated after 1976 and by then he lost much of power and wasn't really in charge.
>political corruption
That was a product of him removing competent people.
However, sadly, politicians are far more corrupt today than communists were.
Children of party chiefs weren't riding around in expensive cars.
And inequality is inevitable I guess, but obviously state should intervene to prevent great inequality. About your last sentence, yes, but no system can last forever can it? That's the sad truth.
>>72957425
Jaruzelski even invited Soviets to deploy troops in Poland but they refused.
>>72957997
>dictator
>literally rulled by USSR
Jesus Christ your delusion is all bad as all those Soviets saying they didn't do Katyń or did not atatck Poland in 1939.
Also I like how you went full goalpost
>lol nothing like that happend
>lol only one guy
>lol only few guys who cares
Your cognitive disonance is something scientist should study.
>>72951955
They would've done that anyway. That's what warfare does.
>>72957982
the only tragedy was when we decided to burn everything and make the world new again. throw away it all, we have an obsession with that shit, same as the revolution, build a new world.
always, building a new world.
yeah and no, no one was being taken into the woods and shot, be real nigger get ahold of yourself.
There was only one
>>72958238
China is economically a capitalist country.
>>72952264
>to: US Anon
>from: Jap Anon
>re:kt
>>72958235
was Poland actually ruled by the USSR? I heard the Warsaw Pact countries were a lot wealthier and generally better off than Soviets
>>72957908
The higher estimates on the number of people starved during the Great Depression are 7-8 million. Why do I have to tell an American about his own history?
>>72958189
> Debts only accumulated after 1976 and by then he lost much of power and wasn't really in charge.
Yes, yes, I suppose I should say yugo in general, I couldn't remember the last year he was in power
>And inequality is inevitable I guess, but obviously state should intervene to prevent great inequality.
It only does that when it knows revolution is around the corner if they don't.
>About your last sentence, yes, but no system can last forever can it? That's the sad truth.
Some can last several hundred years. In general, I think market socialism in an industrialized country would allow it to last longer than it would otherwise.
>>72954998
Privatization is one of the reasons why romanian farmers are getting fucked.
Country is getting richer but the people are getting poorer and losing their jobs.
>>72954763
Calm down Schlomo. We all know you're trying to act like you belong here at /pol/ to cover up the Jewish involvement in creating the Russian Marxist movement.
Just because you're Jewish doesn't mean you get to pretend like Jews didn't slaughter tens of millions of Russians.
>>72957978
Marx didn't wrote shit about communist societies in Das Kapital, it's purely about the economical theory of capitalism.
But if you search Socialism: Uthopian and Scientific, or the Communist Manifesto, it says clearly than between the capitalist mode of production and the communist one society must be ruled by the "revolutionary dictatorship of the working class". Check your sources, man.
>>72958343
> That's what warfare does.
>warfare in the homeland improves their lives
you wat nigga?
>>72957565
Yep.
>>72956679
USA is a bad example, because USA was literally an empty isolated land with vast resources.
You'd be hard pressed to invent a system that would fail there.
>>72948642
try Yugoslavia
>>72958235
listen niggers there were many tragedies during the war. i mean people died everywhere.
>>72954182
>>72958428
>yeah and no, no one was being taken into the woods and shot
Nigga, I could give you a whole list of people being killed by secret police in years 1983 and 1984 only.
You so far haven't given any proof of evidence of your bullshit.
Do you not understand how this works?
>state a claim
>here is proof for my claim
but you so far did
>state claim
>lol you are all delusional if you don't belive me
So far you provided nothing. I did.
And you do know well that I'm in right.
You just don't want to admit it, because you can't be wrong can you? That's impossible.
How my world of perfect communism in Poland that didn't kill anyone and throw people in to the river could be shattered.
Go do something with yourself, like read a fucking book instead of commie propaganda.
>>72958536
>falling for the internet meme
The deaths were from malnutrition, not starvation. Falling sick and dying because you didnt have a good enough immune system because you werent eating enough isnt he same thing as dying from lack of food over a course of months.
If you want to prove other wise get your sources, you cant just come here and claim something that was clearly a meme for a time i true without facts.
>>72958576
>It only does that when it knows revolution is around the corner if they don't.
True, and people ignore that. That's one indirect positive effect of communism, socialism and all that.
And in general it's bad to fall into ideology trap. Ideologies take different turns in different societies.
>>72958490
Yeah, controlled by USSR till it fall fall down 1989.
>wealthier
If you mean we had few more potatos and more vingegar after vodka destilation then yeah I guess.
>>72958691
Just to say that i am enjoying your reading recomendation. Only haven't finished them yet because i have college commitments
>>72958697
>Yugoslavia
>communist
wat?
>>72958708
and we went full circle have we
>>72958874
I don't want to prove anything. Believe what you want.
>>72958839
i don't give a fuck what Jaruzelski did in your rat hole. that wasn't a problem of communism that was your own fucking problem.
what do you mean? where are all these ducking bodies they shot in russia? I have to prove to you there are no imaginary bodies?
where are all these mass graves for the thousands/millions killed in the 80s you are saying?
>>72948642
There has never been a "communist" country. Communism is a state of anarchy.
>>72954045
The sources are census data, showing the relatively stable population growth throughout Stalin's "reign of terror".
Population displacement and prison work camps are not genocide and mass murder.
>>72959123
Jaruzelski was under commie boot you cunt.
You cannot deny that.
That's like saying lol Hitler didn't kill anyone, he just ordered people to be killed, we as saint and innocent.
You make more and more goalpsot hoping for that score but so far it's not happening.
Wanna know why? Because your bullshit doesn't fly.
>mass graves
Now you went full retard.
They didn't kill people in thousands like Soviets did in Katyn.
Common thing was, beat or shoot and then throw in to the river.
>>72959114
Thats exactly what youre doing. Someone told you something, and you liked the sound of i, so you decide that its right and spread it around to others like you.
>>72959061
yeah #plm only polish lives matter apparently when millions of russian killed but cry to everyone about it. there were tragedy everywhere what the fuck do you want.
>>72959190
Why are you posting a clear mental defective person? What are you trying to prove?
>>72959289
>>72959190
>>72959088
>>72958068
>>72957914
>>72957838
>>72959364
Keep goalposting,.
You provided nothing of vaule to this thread.
But I know you are not baiting, because you keep replying and acting even more retarded than before.
>>72959437
Thank you for proving that Gay people are degenerate and will latch onto things to increase the degeneracy.
>>72959354
no proofs
second gorbavhev was busy sucking jew dick and planning his treason to break up Soviet Union, why would he tell your dictator to shoot someone? you think anyone had time for that shit?
you are dillisional if you think it was like some order from kremlin itself, blaming everyone else, then later asking for welfare from europe
true nigger tier country you have
>>72959437
With ahuviya harel you lose.
>>72948642
The soviet union
>>72959357
Cool.
>>72958980
Evans?
>>72958967
Poland was only controlled during Stalin's rule.
After that, control was no different from how Americans control their friendly regimes.
Within certain limits, Polish communists worked on their own.
Shit like 1956 and 1968 didn't occur without a lot of debate and even opposition from some officials. For example Kosygin.
You're making it too simplistic.
>>72959458
how am i supposed to prove that imaginary people didn't get shot and thrown in a river? that's tremendous claim requiring tremendous proof and you want me to provide you evidence?
>>72958697
>>72958458
Except Yugoslavia wasn't communist. You still had private property, private corporations, a competitive market... It was a socialist state to a large degree, but when it came to economy it was largely capitalistic with little governmental oversight.
>>72959354
>Jaruzelski was under commie boot
No he wasn't, as I said he even invited Soviets to help him maintain control.
I agree Soviet regime was responsible but you people are pretending there were no communists in Eastern Europe until Soviets occupied it.
>>72959615
>no proofs
Even a stupid wikipedia link would give you enough info.
I'm done. You do nothing but goalpost acting as if you know better.
You are lucky nobody else feel the need to pick a bone with you.
Keep living in your mass delusion and the fact you go for logical falacies rather than proofs and evidence means you were just a waste of time. What a shame and here I thought you were worth something.
>>72959775
Hint: USE INTERNET, Like I did.
>>72959754
It was a Soviet Satelite under USSR control.
>>72959754
Yes,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Third_Reich_Trilogy
>>72955759
>To these days I wonder what happend with them.
In the words of one of your politicians:
"If the camps are still there, why not use them again?"
>>72959802
That's why marsala Tita was such a genius of a politican lad
>>72959936
He was a soviet puppet, you cannot deny that.
>>72959802
>private corporations
Nope, only small business. That came later, in late 70's.
Yugoslavia was a socialist state, only far more liberal and pretty nationalist.
>with little governmental oversight
Self-management, yep, but all firms were collective property.
>>72955896
Ebin meme Brohammad
>>72959943
how the fuck am i or anyone else supposed to answer for a polish dictator? i don't know what happened there, i wasn't there, none of that shit happened here.
and pushing all blame for anything to happened to another country is nigger tier.
that's what niggers do is blame everyone else for their own problems. i don't give a fuck.
Yugoslavia
>>72948642
It's the "China isn't communist" meme again. Look, nothing was communist ever. Communist countries never existed. What exists are countries run by communist parties and China is one of them.
>>72959943
>>72960140
I can deny it because I know basic history which you ignore.
Jaruzelski was largely independent.
Again, communist regimes were more openly brutal, but Soviet control over friendly regimes was no different than how Americans controlled American-aligned friendly regimes (and still do).
Do you think Americans would stand idly if Canadians decided to invite Russian troops to Canada for example?
>>72960041
I'm reading 1776 by McCullough now, but it's going slowly.
No
Communism was never meant to actually be legit successful. It is a idealogical weapon designed to destabilize nations.
>>72956522
Pretty much this
Also I was wondering, are socialists more active and have bigger support in countries that never experienced actual socialist rule in compare to the countries that did have socialist rule?
Anyone know of any research about it?
>>72948642
No and never will.
>>72960551
Yeah but Chinese aren't even pretending to be communism-oriented anymore.
>>72960609
Soviet control wasn't openly brutal and that's what was so bad about it.
They did killed people and imprisoned them.
From time to time you could hear about some student going missing or some professor being arrested.
But control was much more tighter than US-Allies of US.
>>72960660
>are socialists more active and have bigger support in countries that never experienced actual socialist rule
Nope. For example Czech communist party is still strong, so is Russian.
But Eastern European socialism was always different from Western socialism.
In reality most of your socialists aren't even socialist.
Their main issues are transgenders and gays, and their economic ideas are ''free shit for everyone''.
>>72960136
And I assume that's also why Yugoslavia exploded on itself so famously out of pure ethnic hatred? An economic and military alliance like V4 in which individual nationalism is promoted would have survived to this day. Instead the idiot tried to sell us the tale that we're somehow all one people, which just factually isn't the case.
>>72960252
>That came later, in late 70's.
Because the infrastructure was so utterly destroyed by ww2 that we spent a good portion of 20 years doing community service and putting everything back together.
San Marino
>>72960887
It was exactly like American control today.
Regimes themselves were more openly brutal, but they didn't micromanage Polish communists (after Stalin that is).
>From time to time you could hear about some student going missing or some professor being arrested.
I'm not denying that nor am I supporting communist regime. I'm just saying, stop demonizing them.
It's the same shit commies did with Tsarist Russia.
>>72960609
Are you a historian by profession? Or amateur one?
>>72961035
It exploded after his death
Tell me, were there big ethnic problems during his regiment ? I don't think so, he knew how to manage us as one folk, that's why
>>72961281
There is nothing wrong with demonizing bad regimes.
>>72961411
>I don't think so, he knew how to manage us as one folk, that's why
Exactly, he was the only thing keeping it all in one piece. But that only goes to show that the system is inherently unstable. My initial point still stands.
>>72961443
Yeah like the Second Polish Republic. I am glad they got BTFO. Fucking tyrants and shit
>>72961443
True, but then don't expect to be taken serious in a discussion
>>72961623
It's not wrong when we do it :^)
We learned it from our dear friends to the west.
>>72961686
As much as I would like to stay civil with you.
You have lefty/pol/ as your name.
I don't need to bother being taken seriously by left/pol/.
>>72961035
>individual nationalism
Is the bane of any unity. Look what Bismarck did in Germany. Worked great for them. Before they were bunch of small states getting raped by everyone.
Same thing should've been done in Yugoslavia, if they wanted it to endure.
King Alexander had the right idea, even before commies, only his perspective was too ''Serb''.
Also Yugoslav unity wasn't even Serbian idea, it was Croatian.
>>72961751
>It's not wrong when we do it :^)
>Józef Piłsudski
REEEEEEEE
>>72959666
Get back to destroying your economy, Trudeau
>>72961409
Get out of my country, you faggot.
No because communism has never being tried ect...
>>72961869
Hey it was the Bolskevik shits that came first.
Second Republic wanted to just keep it to itself, but no..."Drang nach Osten" or some shit
>>72961409
Just an amateur one. I'm a law student.
>>72961443
Why do you even come here? If you want to push your ideology and learn nothing, go somewhere else. This is an anonymous board for discussion.
>>72961686
>get BTFO
>a-are you a historian by profession? haha
>>72961859
>Is the bane of any unity.
And yet look at V4 today. Each state individually nationalistic yet they cooperate perfectly, without having to pretend they share any culture or ethnicity.
>>72949488
Why are there so many tankies on /pol/ lately? Did you get driven out of /his/ and leftypol?
>>72962223
>If you want to push your ideology and learn nothing
>says lefty/pol/ a hugbox for commies
The good thing is that at least you come here to be challenged by different views.
But you still go to pretty one sided view Mongolian Dune Drawing Imagebord, so...the irony etc. etc.
>>72962082
>Second Republic wanted to just keep it to itself
Wrong.
>>72962455
Welp, I'm done with Indonesian Mohammed Praying Board today.
>>72962472
It was our rightful clay.
>>72962574
>Muh claim
The russians said the same.
>>72961831
You triggered bro? Nice.
>>72961923
No. I enjoy living here. Are you always the same one that says the same shit every time i post?
>>72962223
What do you think of the people that say that lawier will be automated in no time?
>>72962237
>>get BTFO
I'm not even arguing with Montenegro bro.
>>72962733
>wanna be taken seriously
>you triggered bro
OH THE IRONING!
>>72962455
I'm in no way a ''lefty'', at least in the sense you think of.
Nor do I support communism.
>>72962338
V4 is a meme (still).
>share any culture
Dude, we literally speak same language. If you want to see differences you will see them, but objectively Croats and Serbs are same shit, despite the fact we're different nations historically.
And I'm a guy who thinks Yugoslavia was a mistake.
>>72962793
Yeah I got you messed up.
You did too did you?
I haven't tried to spread any idology here so far.
>>72962223
>>72962787
I'm not trying to engage in a actual debate ITT. I just came to shitpost a little. Since only you engaged me in (you) exchange, then i continue on shitposting, since you don't deserve that i actually put an effort.
If you think my trip as anything to do with my political/ideological views, you are wrong. It's just to get those juicy good (You)'s
>>72962574
And you're Russian rightful clay :^)
>>72962733
I'd say legal professions are safest. Maybe notaries and stuff like that, but lawyers, judges, attorneys will never be replaced.
'Communist' states were all state capitalist. The means of production were not collectively owned but privately owned and managed by the state.
Real communism would be a stateless society without hierarchy in which the means of production are collective owned and private property is abolished.
>>72948642
yes
>>72961443
the regime you are blaming was your own, but you niggers don't like your independence. not enough of that sweet nigger freedom of collecting welfare from other countries.
you gave up your freedom very quickly again for some cash and unlimited afghan cock in your mouth. don't worry they will still come, no matter what your government says. they know you like that sweet welfare more than you care about your own sovereignty.
keep cucking faggots until you have a "regime" of your own again
>>72963140
Nah we are rightful Polish clay.
>>72963205
NK isn't even formally communist anymore. It never was. They just paid a lip service to communist ideals so they get Soviet aid.
>>72948642
>Has there ever been a successful communist country?
The USSR was successful until the early/mid 1950s. While Europe and the US were mired in the Depression, the Soviet Union was growing and growing. The economy was doing quite well. The Russians even managed to beat back being invaded by continental Europe, led by the Germans. By May 1944, the Russians had pushed the Germans back to the Ukraine. Soon enough the Russians were in Poland.
In the 1950s, Khrushchev became a revisionist and the USSR's economy began floundering. People today remember the tepid economy of the USSR from the 1970s and 1980s, not the 1930s when the economy was going like gangbusters while the US and European economies had halted.
Also - Russia's economy was equivalent to Brazil's in 1917. Americans have a strange attitude in this respect. They always say the US is richer than Cuba. But the US was richer than Cuba in 1958. It would make sense to compare Cuba to Haiti or the Dominican Republic or Jamaica or Guatemala.
Marx said communism would start in the most advanced industrial countries. Lenin believed this as well, and said Russia was just being taken over due to the opportunity to do so, and that it would by no means be a world leader. This has been completely forgotten though. It's like comparing the NFL to some high school football team. If Russia was way behind the US in 1916, no magic pixie dust happened to put the USSR equivalent, or ahead of the US in 1917.
>>72963336
And rightfull German clay.
>>72963403
Also ours.
>missing Austro-Hungarina Clay
>>72963401
>An american logical and sound post
What have you smoked, bro?
>>72963550
We can do this all day long, bro. Doesn't matter.
>>72963336
Where is this Poland you speak of?
>>72963685
Then.
Rightfull Umayyad clay.
>>72963762
Here
