Was McVeigh justified in taking down the federal building? The second ammendment was made so that citizens could take on rogue and tyrannical government bodies, and the ATF was indeed to some extent corrupt in their handlings of the Waco siege and the Ruby Ridge incident. Now he might be justified but I still believe he deserved his death sentence, he killed children with that bomb, but was taking on the ATF the right thing to do in order to stop this federal body?
>pic related, ATF's favorite hobby
>>72485888
With society the way it is there are no innocents. Children are fair game if it furthers the cause.
>>72485971
>>72485888
Also the ATF stated what the rules were when WACO and Ruby Ridge happened. Never forget.
>>72485971
ALLAHU ACKBAR!
>>72485888
treat Americans like the german did jews, get blown the fuck out.
>>72486113
HURR DURR I am a cuck and scared to actually do anything HURR DURR.
Timothy Mcveigh was a man unlike u pussy.
>>72485888
HE DINDU NUFFIN
Waco and ruby ridge were faggots
Mcveigh would know that if he hadn't been brainwashed by militia and sovcit movements
>The second amendment was made so that citizens could take on rogue and tyrannical government bodies
Yes, but they have to be foreign or rebellious in nature. Waging war on our current government is not the intent of the second amendment, that shit was made to be mutable without violence, which is why we included that clause about treason alongside the second amendment.
>>72486286
UR A FAGGOT
>>72486499
All enemies foreign and domestic
>>72485971
What bothers me is how the government is allowed to do, with its apologists.
>McVeigh unknowingly kills kids (he said afterwards he didn't know the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building had a nursery inside it, or he'd have picked another target) and he's a monster
>Government knowingly attacks compound full of kids at Waco, and uses incendiary tear gas in the process, and it's peachy-keen
>>72486286
Rubyridge I believe deserved it but Waco was something else man
They made claims and then never went in to do interrogations after they found out all of the Davidians guns were legal, then they made false claims saying the Davidians were making the guns into machine guns, then they lied and said there was a meth lab in there in order to get militarized power via a drug nexus for the war on drugs, then they shot at Waco so Waco shot back which under Texas law was legal, then when Waco let their children go the FBI said the children were sexually assisted in order to get authority to do another raid, then they retracted there statement on the children being assaulted after they were done.
>>72486499
Militias fought against Washington and he still allowed us the right to bear arms so I am implying it also applies to government tyranny.
>>72486722
Also ignore the spelling mistakes, I can spell but I'm on mobile.
>>72486637
You want to join my organization against the system?
McVeigh would so fucking post here if he would've just waited a few years.
>>72487586
I imagine he would be one of those hardcore redpill/x/stormfags. He'd be the pol version of Mulder.
>>72485888
Dropping multiple relevant wiki links
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco\_siege
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby\_Ridge
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma\_City\_bombing
>>72485888
Well, when was the last time the government carried out an attack like Ruby Ridge or Waco?
>>72487275
Shh, Jim, we don't talk about that.
>>72488482
So are you implying his act ended their fucked ways if handling things?
Because if you are that is actually a great point .
>>72486286
>brainwashed by militia and sovcit movements
You know he was in the military during the Gulf War, right? He's killed and saw executions of prisoners. That probably did more than any militia
>>72485888
The government fed McVeigh the weaponry and looked the other way to let it happen.
This is a must watch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpNIMSDwvOw
>>72486722
ruby ridge was justified in no way.
he got a settlement for a reason
>>72487586
>>72487926
He said after reading Unintended Consequences he wish he would have carried out assassinations instead of the bombing.
I do need to read that.
>>72485888
this here is a decent book
>>72488815
>>72488832
>anal
kek
>>72488853
some neato cast recipes
>>72488872
wtf is guar gum anyway?
>>72488643
it can be considered the final nail in the coffin after ruby and waco
>>72488886
slurry
>>72488787
He was in a militia literally called aryan nation's and you don't think he was neckdeep in illegal Shit? Then again ATF made the official report ..
>>72488935
slurry2
>>72488643
Yeah, that what was I getting at.
The worst I can think of are police shootings.
I guess the Oregon ranch standoff is the closest to one.
>>72485888
I'm not going to say he's justified, just that McVeigh was the consequence.
>>72488963
hmmm
I wonder if the ATF permitting binary explosives like tannerite is still legal if you add smokeless powder to it or modify it a bit?
>>72485888
>Was McVeigh justified in taking down the federal building?
Yes. The bottom line is that Oklahoma City caused the federal government to back off for a generation. Clinton's ATF became noticeably quieter afterwards, Bush treated the militias with kid gloves, and even Obama has been merely obnoxious. It gave the gun rights movement the breathing room it needed at the federal level to pursue the very successful state-legislature-and-litigation strategy we've seen for the last twenty years.
I guarantee you that when the Administration was talking about how to handle the Bundys somebody brought up McVeigh and the whole room went quiet for a second. Back in the 90s the militias were the crazies out at the margins of the gun culture, now they're the mainstream. Nobody wants to see what happens if the kinds of guys who give money to the SAF or GOA decide to start resisting.
>>72486722
>Rubyridge I believe deserved it
Why?
Something tells me you have no idea the circumstances of this "incident"
>>72488943
the whole thing happened because he told the ATF to fuck off when they wanted him to be an informant
>>72488963
>>72488815
>>72488832
>>72488853
>>72488872
>>72488886
If you're sending this because you think I'm some militia man or anti government person I'd have to inform you that I am not , but I might have some fun in my backyard with these.
The federal government is all jewish pawns.
Look at the history of the fbi and atf, its not to pretty.
Fbi exploits the fuck outta whites for its jewish masters.
>>72489182
Not at all, just an interesting book while we're on the topic.
It's in an explosives torrent and possibly by it's lonesome on piratebay.
Bretty neat.
>>72488943
>and you don't think he was neckdeep in illegal Shit
The only illegal thing he did was allegedly sell an ATF informant a short barreled shotgun in violation of the NFA (a law which is so confusing convoluted and retarded that it should be scrapped soley on this let alone it's clear violation of the 2ndA) which the ATF tried to use to force him to be an informant.
He promptly refused denying the sale of said SBS
>>72489474
For the ignorant pic related specifically the angled foregrip is 100% legal under the NFA.
1/2
>>72489633
>>72489474
But this vertical grip on an identical firearm means mandatory 10 years in Federal pound me in the ass penitentiary.
BTW the NFA only applies to law abiding gun owners as well.
>>72489787
For some reason they decided these were okay though.
>>72489787
>>72489474
The specifics of the case in question regarding Ruby ridge is the shotguns allegedly in Violation of the NFA were less than an inch to short
>>72489474
I see , thank you for informing me.
Also I heard that they baited him into selling them the gun , they identified themselves as agents before asking for It. But I'm not sure how legit that statement was
>>72489870
So long as you don't Shoulder it
>>72489878
Jesus fucking Christ.
McVeigh did nothing wrong.
>ATF kills your whole fucking family for making shotguns with a 15.9" barrel
Fuck the ATF.
>>72489931
what if it accidentally bounces into my shoulder?
>>72489959
I can't think of a worse government agency Tbh.
Holla to all my homeland security homies in this thread here.
>>72489633
>>72489787
How do those help anyways?
>>72489870
It's like I'm playing RE2
>>72489924
>Also I heard that they baited him into selling them the gun
Yes the ATF agent was the one who pushed to get said gun.
Pic kinda related.
Organizations like the ATF all but create these situations to justify their own existence.
Waco is probably the most drastic example as the entire ATF was being faced with the chopping block(they were to be dissolved with all their taxing roles placed into IRS jurisdiction and the enforcement of the NFA I to the hands of the FBI) due to being redundant and Waco ended up being an incident that "necessitated" their further existence
>>72489787
>>72489870
What a bunch of Bullshit the ATF should've been abolished after Oklahoma city .
>>72490051
CIA?
>>72489959
The only things he did wrong was not check for the day care in the building first[joke about Israeli muh human sheilds here] and not taking out the people who directly made the decisions
![hqdefault[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/4ibnqtz.jpg "hqdefault[1].jpg")
>>72485888
>Was McVeigh justified in taking down the federal building?
Yes.
>>72490268
The ATF as an organization should never have been founded.
We have the IRS to tax shit the FDA to monitor drugs and the FBI to investigate Federal crimes.
We don't need a fourth organization doing these same things twice.
Bit that's government for ya
>>72490246
I heard the FBI used the entrapment technique by hiring Crime informants giving them drugs to sell to civilians and then arrest them for having drugs like what a bunch of bullshit .
>>72490246
Ha, I was looking for that pic/story a while back.
>>72486499
>Yes, but they have to be foreign or rebellious in nature. Waging war on our current government is not the intent of the second amendment, that shit was made to be mutable without violence, which is why we included that clause about treason alongside the second amendment.
"defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic"
Domestic tyrants are fair game.
>>72490344
Oh fuck I'm not a shill, a shoutout to any lurking ATF/FBI/CIA shill's I swear I'm not a terrorist.
>>72486499
>>72486499
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion
Government didnt even try to take guns to end rebellions
>>72490216
>How do those help anyways?
Does it matter?
About the only thing they do is a slightly improved grip which is really a saftey feature.
The more you understand about firearms and the NFA (and gun laws in general) the more your blood will boil at just how absurd they are and how these laws will only ever get good people into deep shit.
Fun fact
A man was imprisoned for nearly 20 years because his rifle(I think it was an SKS) malfunctioned in a way that made it slam fire and shoot two rounds with one trigger pull. A police officer at the range saw it and he faced charges for "illegally manufacturing a machine gun" which to the ATF and the NFA is any gun which fires more than one round per trigger pull.
>>72486722
can you source some of these claims mr? don't believe it.
>>72486499
>>72490879
Literally read the wiki page it states all of these thing including the FBI restracting their statement on them being sexually assaulted .
See >>72488297
>>72490532
One example of this entrapment was the 93 WTC bombing where the FBI "accidentally" gave the terrorist real explosives instead of fake ones and also forgot to run the sting operation.
It would have been all covered up if their informant didn't record independently the telephone correspondences.
Who needs enemies when you can simply manufacturer the situation and sometimes "forget" to stop them.
It has more to do with the Machiavellien concept that armies should only be militias. When the government needs to raise an army, they need a well armed populace from which to do so
But whatever you like, /pol/
>>72490826
Thanks
If Muhammad-worshiping sand niggers actually took out legitimate government targets, I would be wearing a Turban by next week. But they're punks that target civilians, just like the ATF did in Waco.
McVeigh targeted a legitimate government target. That's why people ask if he did the right thing or not. Hadji terrorism targets civilians, which is always wrong.
They should've flew planes into Washington DC while congress was in session on 9/11 instead of the Twin Towers.
>>72485971
> kill 'em all, goy!
Found the jew
>>72491230
The capital building was one of the targets but type passengers caught the hijackers and it crashed.
>>72491104
>One example of this entrapment was the 93 WTC bombing where the FBI "accidentally" gave the terrorist real explosives instead of fake ones and also forgot to run the sting operation.
At least they've learned, they only give fake bombs and broken guns
But look at this
>Many such terrorism plots were created by the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation, with agents providing plans, materials, and encouragement to the supposed "terrorists" — often mentally unstable individuals, small-time criminals, and other vulnerable targets — and then arresting them on terrorism charges
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United_States_post-9/11
I find it hard to believe they're all set up by the FBI when they actually seek out others for bombs or guns
>>72491230
What about military?
Seems like half the terrorist attacks take out military
>>72490826
ATF just seems like the little retarded brother of the other federal organizations , always funking shit up and having to be bailed out.
>>72491230
>They should've flew planes into Washington DC while congress was in session on 9/11 instead of the Twin Towers.
>implying 9/11 wasn't a joint Israeli Saudi and a small faction in the US government operation through and through
>mfw there are people on /pol/ who haven't watched "War by deception" or it's newer more informative sister film "Empire Unmasked"
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pK6VLFdWJ4I
>>72491497
I believe it's because no one really wants to be an ATF agent.
Their job is to be massive faggots to innocent good American people. Guessing the cream of the crop don't sign up for that.
>>72491363
By the time they went to attack DC, the military was on the scene and shot down their plane. They hit the Twin Towers first, rather than DC (high value target).
>>72491474
Meh I'm not a huge military fan, but they're mostly just plebs and cannon fodder. They did hit the Pentagram though, but it was a weak attack.
>>72491583
2 hours 15 minutes?
>The traitors in government will never get their comeuppance
GODDAMNIT FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK
Surprised so many of you actually believe McVeigh did this (with *one* bomb?) Look into things a little deeper and realize it was a set up to justify many things that have come since
>>72488815
To thos of you not on some sort of watchlist now you are. Mfw ive been watched since i was like 14. Backtraced a washington dc adress to my computer. Got the real life address and it was an empty lot lmao
>>72491474
>Seems like half the terrorist attacks take out military
Of course or fellow countrymen are going to be targets when they are taking part in an occupation of another country.
I would do the same thing if a foreign nation's military came into America causing widespread havoc and death and occupying our nation.
I don't fault them for doing what any non pussy man would do when faced with such a situation but I do fault those in our government implementing such a horrible and failed foreign policy putting our countrymen into such danger.
I don't believe he was justified, if he did it at all. However, if he really was motivated by ruby ridge and Waco, I can't pretend like I don't understand why he did it.
>>72491728
Is short for the amount of information you're getting which equates to hundreds upon hundreds of hours of reading (and finding) obscure police and FBI reports various policy papers amongst other things.
Empire Unmasked is 5 hours long and worth watching several times just to digest all the information given but unlike War by deception one has to actually purchase it but it is well worth the $20.
For comparison if you shitpost in an average thread until it 404s on here that is well over 2 hours.
>>72491898
Well Shit I should have had a VPN
> tfw my search history has random Hitler Shit from pol in it
> tfw I could fit the description of a terrorist
>>72491888
>many things that have come since
Like what?
What laws or security was added after the bombing?
>>72491940
I mean Al Qaeda, Islamic State, and Taliban taking out military in the countries they're in
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents,_January–June_2016
>>72491888
>some of us don't know this
Video related leaf
https://www.corbettreport.com/okc-a-conspiracy-theory/
That being said the only reason McVeigh was the useful idiot for this was because of these two attacks
>>72491617
> shot down their plane
What? I need a very valid source on that one.
>>72485888
He didn't have any grievance that would justify that kind of violence, and he certainly can't claim to be justified by his results.
>>72486637
>Government knowingly attacks compound full of kids at Waco
They also kill plenty of kids overseas as "collateral damage" when waging pointless wars.
>>72492293
>I mean Al Qaeda, Islamic State, and Taliban taking out military in the countries they're in
>American israeli and gulf state proxy forces attack the governments of problem nations
Welcome to the grown up world anon this has been going on since at least the old English system of privateers. It isn't a new concept.
Oliver North has his infamous line regarding this practice "plausible deniability".
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VXCgQSY8ErE
>>72491898
>>72492178
I am literally enslaved by the American government.
If you're worried about a fucking "watchlist" you're still just fine and dandy.
When the American slaves are freed, it will most certainly be some interesting times.
>>72492189
>Like what?
>What laws or security was added after the bombing?
The militia movement, that was on the rise at the time, was basically squashed. They hauled a bunch of them to testify before congress afterwards and slandered them in the media after OKC. Only recently have the militias become more popular.
Not a single person mentions Terry Nichols meeting with Ramzi Yusef.
The Muslim connection is there.
>>72486499
>>72492461
>didn't have any grievance that would justify that kind of violence,
Do Waco and Ruby Ridge ring a bell?
>>72492534
As long as I follow the laws like a good goy I don't have to worry about the watchlist
>>72492523
Well now isn't it a big clusterfuck when we're sending in troops to help Syrians fight Islamic State
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-usa-syria-idUSKCN0XL0ZE
>>72492554
Care to elaborate?
>>72492328
>What? I need a very valid source on that one.
It doesn't exist because it isn't true.
Flight 93 was actually taken down thanks to the efforts of the passengers and the impact zone of flight 93 is congruent with a plane that crashed in a nose dive.
If it was shot down the debris feild would have been like MH17 in Ukraine.
This idea of 93 being shot down was pushed by various known well poisoners in the "conspiracy community" and what it act to do is redirect from more important questions.
Like Why wasn't one of the lead hijackers said to have been on the plane not on the black box recording despite the rest of the hijackers being present
>>72492491
>when waging pointless wars.
Waging war. Don't try and pass off a definite effort as something without an objective or direction.
>>72492731
>Well now isn't it a big clusterfuck when we're sending in troops to help Syrians fight Islamic State
>nation's fighting a proxy war against themselves is new
This is the same kind of narrative pushed when we started "bombing Isis".
It was a cover for bombing Syrian infrastructure causing massive damage to the Assad regime.
It is why we were so pissed when Russia actually started to bomb these rebels and started to truly push them back
>>72492546
>Only recently have the militias become more popular.
Thanks, Obama
>>72493080
I hope Obama frees me before he leaves office.
>>72492862
Pointless in the sense of American interest or the interest of the American people.
Sure it enriches the military industrial complex and we have taken out all of Israel's regional opposition at great expense to our own nation but yeah regarding the American people these wars are entirely pointless.
Video related
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TMW7x0fLaLA
>>72492979
>It is why we were so pissed when Russia actually started to bomb these rebels and started to truly push them back
But that didn't destroy or hurt Assad
>>72493080
One of the few times that phrase can be said unironically
>>72493144
>But that didn't destroy or hurt Assad
The huge damage done to Syrian infrastructure has done no small amount of damage both the Syria as a whole and to the Assad regime.
The goal is to leave the nation in a prolonged state of low level conflict for as long as possible.
It has been about as successful as any plan when faced with the real world can be.
Of course the whole plan itself is fucked and should have never even been entertained as legitimate policy but it is what it is
>>72492491
Those kids overseas aren't citizens.
>>72485888
>McVeigh justified in taking down the federal building?
Not even. 168 dead, 19 of them kids. 680 injured. Of the dead, 99 were federal workers, so his attack hurt far more innocents than his purported enemies.
Fuck McVeigh. He had no right and pretty shitty reasons to do what he did.
i think dick cheney said it best "we need to create a threat based society, how do we do it? It is like no one is scared anymore"
>>72493697
>168 dead, 19 of them kids.
It should be 150 dead
Also, collateral damage
>>72487275
Yes. We must let him join!
>>72493697
McVeigh had a better enemy vs innocent ratio than any US military operation in the past 20 years. Fuck off shill. Fucking government parasite. I bet you shitpost about Saddam and Palestine using human shields.
>>72493894
You'd think a guy obsessed about liberating the American people and a veteran of war should've done more research to know his enemies placement. And to protect theninnocent lives?
>>72493994
Pol is a board of peace and is satire trust me .
