Aussies, what do you think of this?
>Human Rights Watch executive director Kenneth Roth told ABC's Lateline the closure of the Manus Island facility was the "beginning of the end" of Australia's policy on asylum seekers.
>"Australian policy has basically been to make life so miserable for the asylum seekers in Manus and Nauru that they ultimately just go back home," he said.
>"Ostensibly there is a right to asylum, ostensibly they can seek refuge in these islands."
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-27/png-pm-oneill-to-shut-manus-island-detention-centre/7364414
>>72248165
no no no NO NO NO
>Australian policy has basically been to make life so miserable for the asylum seekers in Manus and Nauru that they ultimately just go back home
GOOD
>>72248165
It's about time. The detention centers are inhumane and a legacy of that fuckturd Philip Ruddock and his desire to torture little kids in order to get votes in the west of Sydney.
Australia helps to fuck up other parts of the world and has an obligation to take care of some of those people. This has been basic Liberal party policy since Fraser decided Australia was obliged to take in plenty of Vietnamese boatpeople.
I mean I just don't get it, haven't they learned from our mistakes? We opened immigration for shitskins in the 1960s and 50 years later we've gone from 85% white to 63%.
and there's goes the last bastion of hope for the world
Australin people have no heart, buying a goosubmarines to torpedo culture enrichment boats.
>>72248511
>obliged to take in shitty people from a shitty country who couldn't stop their shitty village idiot from picking a fight with the king.
How about they fuck off or alternatively put some of that effort it takes to construct boats out of garbage into fixing the country they let go to shit.
>Living in a Muslim theocracy isn't that bad because I am a Muslim so I don't get mistreated as long as I adhere to the rules of whatever fundamentalist group is strongest in this region.
Well it socks pretty hard now doesn't it Abdul. Maybe you should have as a collective whole crushed the crazy extremist groups before they rose to power and started shit with countries who could eliminate you from across the globe.
>>72248511
Kill yourself
>>72248511
>West of sydney
You..do realize that half ot the population, if not all of it is basiclaly refugees and immigrants?
I hope you're trolling.
>>72248165
One migrant lights himself on fire and the Aussies buckle.
>>72249398
Yeah, Australia's a nation of immigrants, so it doesn't make so much sense to create anti-immigrant sentiment. It means basically the second-last people off the boat attacking the last people off the boat for coming by boat. Pretty fucking stupid.
>>72249041
They're literally fleeing for their lives, in most cases, and trying to build a positive future.
Personally I think the mess in the Middle East owes a lot to how the British set up borders there and which tribes they chose to support and elevate. The Al Maktoum family were not a particularly good option, for instance. Australian here who lived in the Middle East for a while.
>>72248165
RIP Straya
>>72248165
>Shut down our concentration camps
>We start shooting them on our borders
Only logical thing to do.
>>72249894
>nation of immigrants
No they're a nation of Anglo colonists you idiot
>>72249894
You just took my words way out of proportion.
I'm talking about citizens, not permanent residents. Refering to people who've got ancestory dating back to the origins of the country as immigrants is dumb as fuck and out of context. It'd be like saying british people are immigrants because they interbred with romans.
>>72249792
I love how we are calling terrorist, "migrants" now. Do you know why they are called terrorists? because the aim to strike terror to disrupt the peace. Which is certainly what this "migrant" went and achieved. If these "not real muslims" cannot hurt others, then they set out to hurt themselves.
>>72250266
Actually, it's an attempt to replace the word "refugee" with migrant and to restrict the use of the word "refugee" to the very narrow definition in the 1948 UN convention. I dislike this move because it's a retarded use of English -- someone is a refugee if they're seeking refuge. It's a word that defines itself.
>>72250125
My first family members came on the second fleet and were definitely immigrants (not convicts of colonizers). The colonizers are the ones who created and administered colonial policy. The rest are people who were just looking for a better future and a way to stop having to live with the shitty miserable weather of England. They're people who were migrating = immigrants. The language stuff here is pretty simple, imho.
>>72250768
They're mostly economic migrants, not refugees.
>>72250768
Colonists =\= immigrants
How hard is that to understand?
>>72250768
What the fuck do you think a colony is?
It isn't just the british general and his army, IT IS A SETTLEMENT OF PEOPLE.
Also, talk about pot calling the kettleblack, fucking liberals.
>>72250883
I would say they are more than likely rape migrants.
>>72249894
>Australia's a nation of immigrants
Care to share the name of the nation we immigrated to?
>>72251544
Holy fuck! Australia is the name given to a place -- a land mass. It wasn't even a fucking nation until 1901. Call it Terra Australis or New Holland or whatever name you want, but they weren't migrating to a nation.
>>72251444
It depends on what proportion of immigrants to Australia you want to blame for fucking up the lives of Indigenous Australians. My first relative to move to Australia was a doctor and I'd prefer not to blame him for all the bad shit that went with colonizing.
I think that the only people who want to see immigrants as non-white arrivals to Australia are asswipes who want a justification for their own racism, so they use a made up arbitrary distinction. Go to the Immigration Museum in Melbourne and you'll see they take this apart pretty well. Every new arrival in Australia who stays is in immigrant. The only exception are those who arrived 80,000 years ago because of obvious differences.
>>72251544
I think he's baiting you.
>>72248165
they will shitpost
>>72252077
>It wasn't even a fucking nation until 1901.
Exactly. Australia isn't a nation of immigrants, it is a nation built by colonists.
>>72252268
>Arrived before 1901 = colonist
>Arrived after 1901 = immigrant
This really doesn't work as an argument. There's no fucking difference between someone who moves to Australia from Tipperary in 1890 and someone from Glasgow in 1910. Arbitrary distinction that falls to pieces under the slightest bit of scrutiny.
>>72252077
Thats some nice moving the goalposts you illegitmate fuck, I know you're trying to avoid that you had a shit argument.
>>72249894
This is why it's retarded to import immigrants.
If there is already an established nation it doesn't need anyone else
>>72252651
The reason why Australia accepts immigrants is for economic growth. That's always been the reason and is why anyone with real power in Australian politics, whether left or right, is in favor of immigration to Australia. It helps create a workforce to build new stuff!
>>72252442
I think it may be opposite day, because the only argument I'm seeing falling to pieces is your own.
The definiton of immigrant would be moving to another already existing country, state or nation which has rules and governs itself. Aboriginals didn't have this development and they were tribal. Meaning, beyond the few hundred convincts everyone up to the point states were defined and australia became a federation lived in a colony, settlement, whatever the fuck you'd like to call it.
>>72252961
An immigrant is a person who migrates to a place.
An emigrant is a person who migrates out of a place.
No nations are needed here. Just movement.
For confirmation, check the etymology:
classical Latin migrāt-, past participial stem (compare -ate suffix3) of migrāre to change one's residence or position, to move from place to place, to pass into a new condition or form, to move or shift (belongings, etc.), probably ultimately < an extended form of the base of meiere (see mighe v.), mūnis (see common adj.), and mūtāre (see mutate v.); a different extended form of the same base may have given rise to ancient Greek ἀμείβειν to change, exchange.
>>72253232
Immigration is the movement of people into a destination country which they are not natives of or where they do not possess citizenship in order to settle or reside there, especially as permanent residents or naturalized citizens, or to take-up employment as a migrant worker or temporarily as a foreign worker.[1][2][3]
When people cross national borders during their migration, they are called migrants or immigrants (from Latin: migrare, wanderer) from the perspective of the country which they enter. From the perspective of the country which they leave, they are called emigrant or outmigrant.[4] Sociology designates immigration usually as migration (as well as emigration accordingly outward migration).
>>72252442
People who arrived in 1901 came upon only wilderniss and landmass. Before they came there was nothing but animals, wilderniss and bunch of tribes who were still playing with wood. They then created civilisation with infrastructure and an economy.
Colonists comes from an civilisation and moves to nothingness to create civilisation.
Immigrant comes from an civilisation and moves to another civilisation.
Actually, this argument is just semantics. Doesn't defunct the point that refering colonists, a legit term to refer to people who've settled on new land rather then Captain Cook and his Convicts.
I think anyone who actually uses the argument of nation of immigrants or bullshit, especially when applied to ex-colonies is pretty fucking stupid.
>>72253337
Country = land = a place.
No nation is needed. The definition of the term doesn't change in 1901.
Also, check the best authority on the subject: James Jupp's From White Australia to Woomera: The Story of Australian Immigration (1992). The first chapter is entitled "Creating an Immigrant Society, 1788-1972."
>>72253765
>James Jupp
>Pol-sci/Social Science
This is literally like posting dailymail/stormfront you idiot.
>>72253765
>1992
No need we have history going back to the 1800's our nations were built on colonial power not "immigration"
>>72253620
I would've though that the colony was Captain Cook and his administrators -- they created a "penal colony."
I just don't want to say that I have some special claim to Australia that's different from other citizens. Just because my first rellies showed up in 1792 doesn't make me better than my school mate whose Chinese great great great grandfather came across for the Gold Rush or my Greek mate whose grandparents came across to build the Snowy River Dam or than any other legitimate Australian citizen. There's a lot of hate in Australia towards other Australians and I think it's mostly driven by butthurt white guys who aren't good with diversity (and I grew up in the whitest fucking part of rural southern NSW).
>>72252442
Not what I was arguing. I am saying before the Brits arrived, this landmass was not, and was not going to produce, anything that could be considered a nation.
In places where the Australian government lets the noongas do their thing there are epidemics of child sexual abuse, alcoholism and crime. The stolen generation was a kindness.
>>72253970
Seriously, he's the best scholar of immigration in Australia. He knows his shit and how to define terms.
>>72253992
1992 is the year the first edition of the book came out. There's an updated second edition from 2007 too.
Fucking pussies in PNG are forcing it shut, ungrateful cunts
>>72254185
Political scientists shouldn't be taken seriously
t. Poli Sci major
>>72254185
I dont care about books written in 1992 talking about history that was written in the 1800's
>>72252442
>Arrive 80,000 years ago not an immigrant
>arrive 50 years ago an immigrant
You yourself made that argument, now you're disagreeing with it.
>>72254185
I don't give a fuck, why does some idealist have a monopoly over what we think? I don't give a fuck if you have scholarship. People get scholarships in fucking womens studies. It isn't credible information whatsoever.
>>72254057
I live in western sydney, right in the middle of fucking diversity. And in all fucking irony you've proved my point about whites right, the people making criticism never seem to actually live anywhere near what they're advocating.
Also, you are fucking stupid. You first of need to colonize. If australia was already colonized, it'd be valid to call our people immigrants. However, half of our history is basically based around colonies until federation.
>>72254400
I think there's an easily argued difference between First Nation peoples (or indigenous inhabitants) and recent immigrants. This is a major qualitative distinction that involves genetic alteration and a massive time gap. The distinction between 1900 and 1902 has nothing qualitative to it -- it's just arbitrary. It's also not how scholars use the term "immigration."
>>72254379
You must be a fan of Elle Macpherson's dictum that "I never read a book that I haven't written myself."
>>72254702
I see no qualitative difference in what you're arguing and what they are arguing.
The only difference seems to be one in magnitude of time passing and nothing else.
Anglo settlers have already had some minor genetic alteration over the past few generations.
>>72254702
You must be a fan of Tacitus abridged edition 2016.
Australian And New Zealand are not a nations founded by immigrants nor are they nations built by immigrants.
>>72254950
>Australians have absorbed dropbear genes so have genetically mutated.
>>72255060
Well they certainly seem to have developed the shitposting gene.
>>72254370
Nor should open border libertardian econfags
t. Econfag
