>>25583

you mean only a portion of the population will directly benefit from the tution waivers. Indirectly, this could help employers, tax payers (an educated workforce may mean more people in Ontario getting decent jobs or more businesses relocating to the province), more educated citizens may be better at making choices when it comes to voting, saving, and health practices, and so forth. Mind you these are all possible indirect effects.

As for the gas tax everyone is directly effected by this. I'd personally like to see more people in Toronto on bikes, on the street cars (we need twice as many street cars), subways, etc. rather than driving around. Shit, I just wish the province we reduce the cost of riding the GO Train. I don't know how it is any less expensive to live in Toronto than it is to live in Pickering if one has to take the train in each day.

While I would rather not pay more for fuel, it's still going to be cheaper than 1996-2006. And we had some pretty fucking neato cars due to the need for fuel economy. Little 4 cylinder turboed things like the Eagle Premier, for example.

But I qualify for this subsidized post secondary education. I can use this to uplift myself. I'm really thankful for it

>>25583
Great more money being stolen out of my pocket to help other provinces except mine, at least it's not Quebec though.

I live in ontario and make 16 bucks an hour as a cook, I make about 30k a year and live pretty comfy, if anything 50k seems a little bit too low, if it was a combined income of 55 or 60k it would be a bit more sane to me, what happens if one of the parents gets a promotion(unlikely considering a normal family the parents would be in their late 40s or 50s when the child is of age for university) and then they make all of a sudden a combined income of 52k, are they then saddled with a full college tuition to pay off? That would hinder the family as opposed to being useful.

Also plz ban shitty useless courses, make trade school free, we need tradesmen not historians.

>>25602

The cost is negligable, I rent in north york toronto a 2 bedroom around 850sq feet for 1250 a month, I pay 650 and I consider my place pretty big. Similar apartment units in pickering might be 50 dollars or 100 dollars cheaper, but taking a 7 dollar go trip to union and then a 3 dollar token to work, thats 20 dollars a day or 400 dollars a month at a 5 day work week. Driving could potentially be cheaper if you have free parking at work and your insurance premiums are low, but it'd probably be around the same. So take that 400, I use 40 subway tokens in a month to get to work, which is 116 dollars, even if your apt is 100 dollars cheaper in rent to actually get to the city to work is still going to hover around 150 dollars more, with the lack of benefit that living in the city provides.

Personally I'm a 6 minute walk to the station and a 10 minute walk to a grocery store, so assuming you can find a good place to live with a decent rent, it can be worth it to live in the city compared to outside of it, at least as far as renting goes.

But theres a bit of hope for public transit, the eglinton LRT line should be done next year, and if that is successful we may have a lot more options.

I do agree with the GOtrain though, if you buy a monthly pass its clearly for work, and that price should be reduced compared to single fare riders. I don't even buy a toronto metropass because I lose a bit of money every month buying one.

>>25583
To explain what's going on a bit more:
Tuition is free. But the cost of living is still on loan.
While tuition would cost something around $4.5k per semester for STEM students, the cost of transportation, food, school supplies and other expenses will be on loan.

This applies only to what the school directly charges you.
Students will still have to take out loans. From my person experience, if tuition was free, I'd have to pay around $4k/year just for school.

For a medium/high income household, that $4k/year is nothing. They can write it off.
For a low income household, that $4k is still a major deal. But it's less of a deal than $13k per year.

>>25632
Tution is a small part of the cost of university. Especially if you live on campus, as in most colleges/universities dorms in cities cost more than tuition. This is coming from your own pocket or you can take a loan for it.

I'd say even $50k a year would still be hard to manage if your kid was living on residence and had to pay $12k/year on rent, $4k on living costs, equaling to $16k/year. This isn't even including tuition.

Also, they won't pay off 100% of tuition if your parents make more than $50k, but they'll give more grants, so you only have to pay a portion of it. I saw an example in which one person's parents made $80k/year, and the student had to pay only half their tuition.

>>25633
Sorry to break it to you but the LRT line won't be done until 2021 at the earliest.

how does this work, have they released the details yet?

Is this only for like recent graduates still living at home going to PostSecondary for the first time?

If you have a place to live can you still qualify? Age/employment etc?

Like what if you quit your job and your income goes to zero.

>>25583
HOLY FUCK WHAT
WHAT
I CAN
WHAT
WHAT ABOUT MY OSAP DEBT!?
I GET TO LEARN STUFF AGAIN!!!!!

>>25602
Great, and again Toronto fucks up the rest of the province for us. Like I need to pay extra tax on gas so that fucking city can bloat itself even more.

>>25632
>Also plz ban shitty useless courses, make trade school free, we need tradesmen not historians

Fucking this

>>25583
>""""""""""""""""""""""""free"""""""""""""""""""""""""""

>>25791
>>25632

I love the idea that anything non-STEM or non-trade is "useless".

It amazes me that people seem to believe our only function in society is to find a narrow place in the division of labor and become a robot. I don't know about you, but I have a role as a worker, but I also have one as a friend, son, citizen, community member, and so on. Without a decent liberal arts education my ability to play all my roles would be much more difficult (or I would do a much shittier job).

Adam Smith pointed out (while cheerleading for capitalism) that it makes the workers stupid because workers are expected to only know how to perform one small task really well. Being highly skilled in one small narrow aspect of the division of labor leaves us incompetent in many other fields. This is worrisome since we are part of democracy where we, as citizens, need to vote, need to elect leaders that have ideas on to solve problems. Without a strong understanding of history, politics, geography, sociology, and philosophy we can be (easily) fooled by dubious leaders and ideas.

I mean do you think the Americans would have been as gung ho on invading Afghanistan if they knew the Soviet Union recently engaged in a failed 10 year war/occupation with the nation? Would they have believed an easy victory would occur in Afghan if they had any understanding of the nation's history from 1900 on? How deep the internal fractions were and how strong the external pressures were on the country?

Would Toronto's transit system be better if we had more average citizens understand what solid transit systems look like? I mean it makes sense our transit system is weak compared to many Euro cities and our last mayor wanted to make it more accessible for cars because ummm, he likes his oversized and overpriced auto (brilliant! more cars is what every city needs).

>>25801
TLDR; You're made because you got an English degree.

>>25801
please explain to me what use a gender studies degree has or anthropology or African studies

>>25825
>>25804

>African Studies
Are you talking about studying Africa or blacks in America?

As for Africa, I'd imagine since China is making huge inroads to developing stronger relations with countries on the content it might be smart for us to understand the culture and the history so we can combat China's (soft) power in the region. Understanding how Euro colonialism affected the people and their nations may be smart for dipolmatic and business reasons. Also, when one of our leaders wants to create some sort of agreement with an African nation or enter into a war/conflict or invest in one of these nations, it might be a good idea if we have some clue what is going on there. So we can vet the leaders ideas on some level. If we have no clue what is going, we can be told any bullshit story.

If you are talking about blacks in America, I'd imagine having an understanding of a group that makes up a significant portion of the American population might be smart. (unless you enjoy being shrouded in ignorance). Maybe, if we understand how slavery, jim crow, the ghetto, and the war on drugs has affected the black community we can figure out a way to help solve some of the chronic issues that plague poor black urban areas. Maybe if we understand why blacks and whites often see the world through very different perspectives, we can come to a common solution and move forward as a society. Unless that is you think the current relations between the two groups are stellar and everything is going A-OK.

>>25804
>>25825

>anthropology
guess what companies spend a lot of money on? Market research. Anthropologists can (and do) get paid to do research on consumers and groups of consumers. Selling something to a consumer is a lot easier if you have some idea of their wants, needs, ideologies, and values. For a specific example, Nike hired anthros to conduct reseach on skateboarders because their award winning campaigns weren't convincing skaters to buy their shit. After the anthros studied the group, Nike was able to dominate the market and develop a fairly loyal consumer base which was once very hostile to the company.

Additionally, guess who else hire's anthopoligists? The military and private security companies in order to understand what the fuck is going on with the locals in key regions. If we want the locals to support us, to dislike our enemies, we should probably have a decent understanding of their culture. I mean who would guess that understanding the culture, values, and ideas of people in a region where a complex was is going on would be beneficial to the citizens and the politicians and the miltary? When someone says "drop more bombs!" or "build them a school!" we can say, oh well, actually due to these important events in their history and their culture and their continued feud with these people, it might be a better strategy to do x, y or z.

>>25804
>>25825

>gender studies
first i'm assuming you mean fem cause thats all gender studies is right?

once again women make up a little more than half the population and are gaining more and more ground in the working world. Understanding their world might be important, especially since it is a population that in many ways (not all) were second to men and their understanding of the world had a weaker voice than men. Also when it comes to finding a lady to marry or have an actual relationship with, understanding some of the issues she faces might help. Or understanding some of the shit our moms went through might help us there as well.

second, understanding gender might help us understand why men aren't making it through college at the rate that women are. it might help us understand why men now have lower IQs on average than women. What aspects of masculinity are influencing men to take school less seriously? And what effects will that have in the future? especially as blue collar jobs are vanishing. How can we promote school in general to young men so they don't end up uneducated, broke, jobless, and angry /pol/ posters.

>English degree
http://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2015-job-skills-report/
http://business.time.com/2013/11/10/the-real-reason-new-college-grads-cant-get-hired/

A survey by the Workforce Solutions Group finds that more than 60% of employers say applicants lack “communication and interpersonal skills”...managers also say today’s applicants can’t think critically and creatively, solve problems or write well.

hmmm, looks like someone with an liberal arts education would perform well in these areas. Who would have guessed people need to be able to communicate and having knowledge about more than a single task might be required in a complex social world.

>>25840

finally, yes i see the typos. and no i don't think they affect the message in any significant manner.

(typing in a small box sucks)

>>25840
Curriculums and teachers favor women

That's at least part of why men aren't making it through college at the same rates

They are also more likely to get a career rolling instead of furthering their education, due to various pressures

>>25841

Holy shit you sound like an ignorant biased faggot, copy down what you just wrote and read it back to yourself 5 years from now.

>>25583
yet another win for the re-distributionist socialists

>>25853

Good answer. really does a good job or arguing against anons points. You've convinced me that stem is the only way to go and the only things worth knowing.

>>25840
First you're implying people with liberal arts degrees can communicate well. Next you're implying people with liberal arts degrees can perform that "single task" as well as their peers who may not have a liberal arts degree. A person with a degree in liberal arts may be able to write a cute email, but they can't build a bridge. The person who can build a bridge can probably write a cute email, however.

>>25836
>African studies are about blaming the white man

You libtards just can't help yourselves. Go prep your bull.

>>25703
>STEM students
>$4.5k tuition
At what shitty university? Engineering tuition is about $10k/year here at McMaster.

But I already graduated
Fuck this

>>25633
>Similar apartment units in pickering might be 50 dollars or 100 dollars cheaper

In Durham you wont find a place for less than $1200 a month. Even a basement appartment with a 2 meter long list of rules and conditions without transit access will run you $1200.