http://www.pcworld.com/article/3075284/hardware/us-government-agencies-are-still-using-windows-31-floppy-disks-and-1970s-computers.html
>Some U.S. government agencies are using IT systems running Windows 3.1, the decades-old COBOL and Fortran programming languages, or computers from the 1970s.
>A backup nuclear control messaging system at the U.S. Department of Defense runs on an IBM Series 1 computer, first introduced in 1976, and uses eight-inch floppy disks, while the Internal Revenue Service's master file of taxpayer data is written in assembly language code that's more than five decades old, according to a new report from the Government Accountability Office.
>Some agencies are still running Windows 3.1, first released in 1992, as well as the newer but unsupported Windows XP, Representative Jason Chaffetz, a Utah Republican, noted during a Wednesday hearing on outdated government IT systems.
>The government is spending more than US$80 billion a year on IT, and "it largely doesn't work," Chaffetz said during a House of Representatives Oversight and Government Reform Committee hearing. "The federal government is years, and sometimes decades, behind the private sector."
...
I don't see why this is a problem. If they're still using 50 year old technology, it must be reliable and functional. That's what I want from a nuclear control system.
>>46376
other coverage:
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/us-nuclear-force-still/2817910.html
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/26/us/pentagon-floppy-disks-nuclear/
>>46377
It's because of this:
>The GAO said the federal government is spending a lot more on "operations and maintenance" of its computer systems than it is on "development, modernisation and enhancement."
>Last year, for instance, the government spent US$61.2 billion on operations and maintenance, compared to US$19.2 billion in the other category.
Probably nonesense
>not using icloud lol
>>46376
>Why isn't our nuclear bomb controls on Windows 10 guise?
>5 years later
>Accidental launch after windows froze
>Windows blamed for millions of deaths and injuries
Lol, not going to happen.
>>46376
This is a good thing.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
>>46376
But that just means the systems are closed off and unhackable. Not to mention if there's a breach, who will know how to run the system.
>>46415
Yeah bikes and other weapons systems I can understand. A command line that works 100% of the time is better than the alternative.
That said, the computers used by the non-military government agencies desperately need an upgrade. Stuff like the VA, or CPS, or social services, or even the IRS. Paper records are still really common and it slows everything down.
>>46376
holy shit!
i will never grill another steak over an open flame ever again. its all microwave tech for me!
>>46376
Russia still uses vacuum tube tech from the the 40's to protect their most sensitive computer shit from potential EMP threats.
Seems smart, you really can't hack something that ancient anymore.
>>46376
I doubt that XP or even 3.1 is really "unsupported" if it's being used by the DoD, because they can pay Microsoft or a third party to continue supporting it when they need a fix. They're just bearing all the costs themselves instead of letting the market do it.
Also, it really depends on what systems we're talking about. Hardened missile silos don't have to be complex, because in a nuclear war they're meant to be used as missile sinks, requiring the enemy to use first strike missiles to disable them, instead of using them on population centers or other strategic targets. If you look at a map of where missiles would land in the US, most of them are in sparsely populated areas like Montana, Wyioming, and North Dakota. Most of the Targets in Russia are in Siberia, and most of the targets in China are in Uigurstan. For civilians in a nuclear war, this is a very good thing. It also doesn't take a whole lot of processing power to hit static targets that are the size of cities. The Nagasaki bomb missed its target by like 8km, and it still got the job done.
Most of the offensive capability comes from the submarine force and bombers like the B-2 spirit, as well as stand-off missiles in Europe that can hit Russian population centers before the ICBMs make it to the United States.
>tfw the primitive FAT partitions on the floppy disks break down and become unreadable every 10 years and you have to make new backups ever 2 years just to be sure
>>46379
What modernization do you really need if the system works? What additional processing power are you going to need to hit Moscow? They don't need a nuclear missile terminal to be able to watch youtube or check facebook or play Call of Duty.
>>46452
It's a widespread and nuanced problem. Most agencies should be fine as long as it's all shielded from EMP, but if an EMP goes off I'd worry more about things like nuclear power stations and military hardware than government records... and then worry about whoever did the EMP.
Part of the problem is replacement parts just in case something breaks. The US military and intelligence agencies, for instance, have triple redundant standards that are increasingly expensive to meet but Congress will always throw money at one temporary fix after another to keep things running.
Other agencies like the IRS or The Veterans Administration have problems just upgrading old database equipment without losing years worth of old records or crippling efficiency.
Then there are agencies like NASA or the USGS or NOAA who rarely get the money they ask for from Congress to upgrade so they make do with what they can.
On top of that, the original COBOL/FORTRAN/etc. programmers for these ancient computers are dying off or are otherwise unreachable. There are many instances where today's officials would have to redesign everything from scratch (at great expense) with a loss of all data if for some reason the equipment became inoperable.
>>46454
One of the other problems that comes with modernization is that too much modern computing equipment is manufactured in China. You cannot have Chinese components in computers that are vital for national defense.
During the Iran-Iraq war, the Iraqis depended on US-manufactured Xerox color copiers to disseminate vital information, including operations orders. After the invasion of Kuwait, when it became obvious that the United States would be fighting them, remote kill switches in the printers were activated, and suddenly the Iraqis were stuck trying to disseminate information, including orders that could be dozens if not hundreds of pages long, by hand.
One of the Snowden leaks included the fact that the US had equipped Angela Merkel's monitor cable with a hidden device that transmitted everything the monitor showed to the Americans.
Since this is what we know Americans are doing, they would be absolutely foolish to trust any other country with the manufacture of their own equipment, since it can be safely assumed that those countries will be doing the same thing, if they are presented the opportunity. Lenovo already got caught putting spying programs in their software.
Some working in the nuke department have also said that by using this ancient technology, they have all but eliminated the chance of viruses and hacking.
Given a choice, I would rather have them using floppy disks than using internet ready machines.
>>46376
> "The federal government is years, and sometimes decades, behind the private sector."
Yes! We need to modernize and bring all government technology into the 21st Century, like healthcare.gov!
... ... ohh ...
>>46451
This. Fucking bit rot. I really do hope they're backing everything up constantly.
It's not even the software that's the biggest problem here: it's the hardware used to run the software. On a long enough timeline, everything breaks.
>>46376
Good luck hacking a Series 1 from a remote location, or good luck getting physical access to the important one. This is likely the main reason.
Can't pull a stuxnet because it doesn't even have usb ports. Can't pull an OPM because no internet connection.
Also, where are they going to get new equipment from? Could possibly compromise the system if it came with anything extra... especially with the chinese producing most of this shit, who've been caught stealing records and information from the US government
>>46441
Russia's dead man hand is still active, probably with the same method from the cold war
>>46454
>EMP
You mean a nuke? Because that's the only thing that'd work.
>>46574
True, an EMP event would be as a result of a nuclear explosion, but the explosion could be several hundred miles out in orbit and affect half the globe. Plus they have improved on the effectiveness over the years..
http://www.futurescience.com/emp/super-emp.html
Got nothing to add, you guys covered it all.
This board is so underrated, it's sad
>>46569
last I checked ibm still made the s360 and the as400. and they would be amazed at how old some things in private hands can be. I work in private enterprise and we still have 80186 and freaking Zilog z80 procs used in places. hell even 6502.
>people actually want them to upgrade to modern shit that can be accessed by the outside world.
It's like nobody watched Terminator, you don't want nuclear silos connected to each other.
>>46415
the kids knew without using Bing or Snapchat in the movie T3:RotM?! Plus (bet u didn't know this) ants have consciousness and can be 'taught' how to invade and destroy these superpacs!
>>46376
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Y1ya-yF35g
>>46648
>using a movie to prove real life facts
You are a massive faggot
there may be a reason for running 3.1, it was the last gui mask over dos as far windows is concerned.
You really want your nuclear arsenal to be controlled with an iPhone?
>>46794
I think that post is a joke. I really hope that post is a joke.
>>46376
People act like having a more complicated system with more chances for failure or error is better than an 8" binary floppy disk.
Can you imagine the chaos if it ran on Windows?
>>46824
This. All of it should be run on tech as old as possible that gets the job done. Try hacking a mechanical computer in Colorado from China.
>>46849
I wouldn't say use old tech, use the simplest and most bullet proof tech possible instead.
Reliable, easy to troubleshoot and simple to use. Only upgrade the efficiency, not the complexity.
>>46376
At least it isn't hackable unless you are physically at the terminal or whatever
>>46441
Actually the Russian state department and military went back to using typewriters because of the backdoors inherent in almost all electronics.
>>46864
They have a good point, although as a point of interest typewriters have been subverted before (by at least the USSR).
http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/10/how-soviets-used-ibm-selectric-keyloggers-to-spy-on-us-diplomats/
>>46376
Specialized technology that is built for running a specific task can only run software that it was designed to work with. Most cash registers you see in supermarkets and gas stations still use MS Dos for example. Floppy discs are also still in use in manufacturing equipment in production factories.
>>46800
I thought 95 was?
>>46458
If the computer system is a closed system incapable of communicating with other systems, it is much less of an issue.
Upgrading those computers should be a non-issue since they are geographically isolated from stray communication signals (under dozens of feet underground), as long as they're electromagnetically shielded and not connected to the internet, it wouldn't matter much where you got the hardware or software from.
In fact, this should be real easy thing to do for no more than a couple million dollars because all you really need is a desktop with google earth and some embedded programming to link it to the missile guidance system.
But given that this is a government contracting job, expect it to run in the many hundreds of millions of dollars.
>>46941
What everyone's saying is that it's kept outdated for a reason. These older systems aren't really well known and easy to hack/infect with a virus, they're more reliable and have been tested and well proven, etc.
Because as a civilian if I run into a bug or the stuff crashes, it's whatever. What, I lose a text file maybe? Restart the computer? It's all fine. You can't have such minor inconveniences tied down to a nuclear weapon. The slightest fuck up there can cause nuclear war. Not to mention they need simple technology that does not allow for the tech to solely be in charge of everything (so it's not all tied together and someone can't shut it all down at once), needs to be ancient so it's reliable even during/after a nuclear war and all of the electromagnetic chaos, has less governmental backdoors from various corporations and governments, etc.
It's not ancient just because the government doesn't give a shit. It's ancient because it's more reliable for what they need it to do.
