So the consensus seems to be, in terms of efficiency, there is no appreciable difference between platforms and clipless.
But what about soft vs stiffer shoes?
I decided to ditch clipless for my upcoming tour, but now I'm deciding what type of shoes to wear. I want to bring my minimalist runners because they are very light and breathable, but the sole is like a wet noodle. How exactly does flex in the sole decrease efficiency? Is it mitigated by the large contact area of a platform pedal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNedIJBZpgM
http://www.bikejames.com/wp-content/uploads/Top-3-Clipless-Pedal-Myths-Building-a-Better-Pedal-Stroke.pdf
https://www.bikejames.com/strength/top-3-clipless-pedal-myths/
Probably not enough to matter, unless you're cranking out some serious watts on a tour(lol)
>>964924
so what is behind the "you need stiff soles for cycling" thing. thats been around for longer than clipless systems
>>964927
It helps, for sure. More so if you're at/nearly pro level and crank out some serious watts.
For touring? It seriously doesn't matter a bit. It's not worth the extra weight of bringing hardsole shoes for pedaling AND trainers for campwear/exploring. It always baffles me when people buy hundreds and hundreds worth of titanium shit even cut off the handles of their toothbrushes, yet bring way too many clothes and fucking two pairs of shoes plus sandals.
Do whatever you need to do to justify clip fear OP
>>964929
lol I did a 4000 mile tour two years ago with clipless. saw people using platforms and thought they were insane.
But the 20% EFFICIENCY is a meme. The real benefits, keeping your foot on the pedal at high cadence or bumpy terrain, better sprinting/climbing/accelerating, and extra points of contact for manipulating the bike, don't outweigh carrying an extra pair of shoes and having to walk around restaurants and stores in SPDs.
At least that's the idea. Guess I'm about to find out
>>964928
>. It always baffles me when people buy hundreds and hundreds worth of titanium shit even cut off the handles of their toothbrushes, yet bring way too many clothes and fucking two pairs of shoes plus sandals.
That was me on my first tour. Shelled out the extra 30 bucks for the leatherman with the carbon fiber shank, then had cans of beans sitting in my panniers for weeks without thinking twice about it.
>So the consensus seems to be, in terms of efficiency, there is no appreciable difference between clipless and cage pedals.
ftfy
>>964933
none of those links are talking about cage pedals.
>>964931
A rite of passage for tourists, lol
At least you have a super sweet leatherman, those things last forever.
So... Where you going and how much time have you marked off for your tour OP?
>>964922
I started with platforms, tried clipless on one tour, and I went riiiight back to platforms.
It's touring, not racing, and having to carry extra stuff is just a pain in the ass. IMHO the weight isn't even an issue, its the amount of space shoes can take up.
>>964938
It's going to be 1 month in montana, idaho and washington. Dont know the route actually. Going with family this time and dad has it all worked out. Going through missoula so gonna get the sweet ACA pic.
>>964940
Eyyy, sounds fun.
>>964922
I'm a big fan of 'approach shoes' like pic related for cycle touring with platforms. They are for climbing and hiking but the stiff, flat, sticky sole is perfect for this purpose. And they look decently non-autistic for around town.
>>964922
>How exactly does flex in the sole decrease efficiency?
Energy flexing the sole isn't put to useful work.
>Is it mitigated by the large contact area of a platform pedal?
Compare a stiff SPD-SL CF roadie shoe, with no flex, vs floppy shoes with a small platform vs floppy shoes with a large platform.
Think of the clipped in shoe sole as a platform pedal the size of the shoe when trying to figure this out.
>>964927
Flex is proportional to wattage.
>>964928
The quality of your stroke makes a big difference to your efficiency as well.
>>964930
As an experienced tourist, you should be able to shake this one out on an overnight trip. No need to guess. I would think you could also buy your way out of the problem mid trip, if it turns out your minimalst shoes were a bad idea.
>>964922
>So the consensus seems to be, in terms of efficiency, there is no appreciable difference between platforms and clipless.
Complete and utter bullshit.
>>964939
Opposite for me, started with SPD, went platforms just to see if it was feasible, switched back to SPD mid-tour by having my roommate ship my shoes and pedals to my cousin's house.
Platforms worked fine, but it just isn't for me. Climbing was annoying on them.
>>964953
>As an experienced tourist, you should be able to shake this one out on an overnight trip. No need to guess. I would think you could also buy your way out of the problem mid trip, if it turns out your minimalst shoes were a bad idea.
I'm sure I CAN manage with floppy shoes, the question is how much efficiency I'm losing that I may not be aware of.
And testing this is going to require a few timed loaded long rides with each, not just an overnight.
You seem like a knowledgeable guy, do you have any sources or can you give me a ballpark percentage?
>>964922
>bikejames
>heterodox source
>consensus
Yes, the pulling up on the pedals at normal cadences is dumb, and it mostly exists as a strawman myth perpetuated by anti-clipless and casuals. The GCN clip is extremely inconclusive except that if you're going at a casual pace, then it makes very little difference.
>>964922
Clipless pedals are like drop bars. They only have an advantage 10% of the time. 90% of the time, there's almost no advantage.
The difference is the casual will be intimidated by the perceived difficulty of drop bars and clipless, and wonder why anyone would put up with them when flat bars and flat pedals work fine 90% of the time.
The experienced cyclist is already used to drop bars and clipless pedals. There's no drawback because he is not intimidated by them and has gotten over the learning curve. All things being equal, he will almost always choose drop bars and clipless because he's been spoiled to expect the extra performance for that 10% of riding and not having clipless and drop bars just makes him feel like the bike is holding him back every ride for 10% of it.
I mean if you need a bike for normal shoes, then no one is forcing you to go clipless. It's a personal choice.
>>964972
but... but.. the upstroke on every pedal?
Imo best shoes for touring are light hiking shoes. Durable, comfy, good grip on and off the bike and the shoes should be stiff enough to help with pedaling a bit. Plus the hard rubber soles are strong enough to survive longterm contact with your pedals without breaking. Something which softer soles, like on sneakers or normal running shoes don´t do.
There is probably some efficiency gain, but that's only one of the things clipless does. It's more for comfort, effortlessly keeping your feet on the pedals at high RPM and bumpy roads. Unless you are wilderness bike-packing (is that even a thing?), you don't need to stress too much about it. Just drop into Wal-Mart and get some $10 runners if you need them.
>>964977
Yep. I have a set of Shimano MT44 shoes that I wear around pretty much all day, every day - I bike to work, and it's great to not have to lug around a second set of shoes. I even wear 'em to the gym occasionally. When I go touring, they're the only footwear I need (although a light set of sandals is also nice to have).
>>964922
Finding the right shoes for platforms is a bitch that I haven't solved yet. Well, there are plenty of options, but they're all ugly as hell.
You want a very solid sole on the shoe. Adidas Sambas are what I use now, but they get really hot. Back in 2008 when I was city hipstering around, Sperry Docksiders worked really well too. Their thinner basic models have a rock hard, thin sole.
Another thing to look for is BIG contact area pedals. Track pedals are no good. The thin edges flex the sole a lot.
Half clips are great too.
Right now I'm running cheap dimension (I think?) brand pinned pedals from amazon. $25. They work great with the Sambas, but I'm still looking for a harder shoe that doesn't look like shit.
There are vintage touring shoes on eBay that look sweet, but hard to find in my size.
The main problem is Sambas are too thick. Feet get too hot. I just ordered a pair of Merrell hiking sandals/water shoes/whatever to help my feet breathe. The soles are hard and my feet are cool, but they look so lame I'm returning them.
>>964922
Nikki please go
>>964945
>e real benefits, keeping your foot on the pedal at high cadence or bumpy terrain, better sprinting/climbing/accelerating, and extra points of contact for manipulating the bike, don't outweigh carrying an extra pair of shoes and having to walk around restaurants and stores in SPDs.
>At least that's the idea. Guess I'm about to find out
Interesting option. How hard are the soles? I want
>>964973
upstroke is probably bs, see the bikejames research
It feels good to upstroke. I used to do it with my clips (yea you can upstroke with them). It feels faster but research says it's not, possibly even less efficient
Platform + Birkenstock for touring
>>964996
Should I link you the Communist Manifesto and say there's a consensus on communism? If you want research the guy wrote an entire book about it.
>>964983
>Shimano MT44
But those are SPD shoes, no?
I meant 100% civilian not-bike-dedicated shoes for walking up them mountains that go well on platform pedals. The end effects would be pretty much same.
Cheers.
>>965003
>Should I link you the Communist Manifesto and say there's a consensus on communism? If you want research the guy wrote an entire book about it.
Did I say anything about a consensus you miserable little worm??? DID I? HUH?
>>965005
>So the consensus seems to be
>>964957
It's true and research has proven it. The only advantages to clipless pedals are a small power advantage during hard sprints and your feet are less likely to fall off the pedals.
This is probably really uncommon but I have my foot centred over the pedal (axle is under the arch, not the ball). It's always felt right to me and been more comfortable (never tried clipless but I have tried moving my feet backwards) and I would guess that having a stiff sole is less important for me. I would also guess it's easier on my calf muscles as there's less leverage trying to flex my ankle that I have to resist against.
>>965018
>This is probably really uncommon but I have my foot centred over the pedal (axle is under the arch, not the ball). It's always felt right to me and been more comfortable (never tried clipless but I have tried moving my feet backwards) and I would guess that having a stiff sole is less important for me. I would also guess it's easier on my calf muscles as there's less leverage trying to flex my ankle that I have to resist against.
I used to ride like this but after reading the bikejames method putting my foot a little farther forward and it's better for long rides
>>965018
As far I know, KOPs is a myth and the foot position depends basically on your legs measures and saddle position/height.
>>965018
This is very common among casuals.
why is it called clipless?
>>965001
with socks, right?
>>965018
the cleat being at the ball of the foot meme is from the really REALLY old days. like all things in cycling it's been pretty slow to change. Look at how long it's taken us to realize that 23mm tires aren't any better than the much comfier 28mm.
anyways, I do wear clipless shoes, and I have the cleats set as far back as they can go while keeping my knee tracking right.
it's absolutely fine to have your midfoot over the pedal and can be achieved with some brands of clipless shoes.
I honestly had the cleats originally set where my dad said to, over the ball of the foot, and it caused knee pain, then when I moved them back, less pain.
imo it's just best to try everything for yourself because cycling has retained the most unscientific old school knowledge aside from maybe boxing
>>965045
These are toe clips, which cyclists used to run with leather straps before clipless pedals came in. Still a very decent option imo, if you have good bike control (getting in and out is harder than clipless).
Anyone saying foot retention doesn't make a huge difference on the bike needs to git gud. Sure platform pedals have their place though and a loaded tour isn't the time for trial by fire or anything unfamiliar.
Rigid soles just make sure that flexible parts of your feet don't receive undue stress. If you ever go on a 6+ hour ride at high intensity in soft-soled shoes, you will almost certainly come home with (very) sore arches and a degree of pain anywhere your foot was allowed to move in odd ways (uneven toe pressure, etc)
If you keep doing it day after day, I expect you could develop various sorts of stress injuries.
That's probably about it.
>>965015
You nikkipoor luddites say that as if slipping off the pedals is no biggie, do you actually ride or are you one of those "bring your bike to the coffee shop" casuals who pedals six blocks once a month when it's sunny out?
>>965055
>Look at how long it's taken us to realize that 23mm tires aren't any better than the much comfier 28mm.
28mm tires are markedly slower than 23 or 25 on any half decent road, but you'd be right if you said;
>Look at how long it's taken us to realize that 23mm tires aren't any better than the much comfier and arguably faster 25mm.
There is definitely a strong case for a serious racing cyclist, pro or amateur, to run 25mm tires, go faster and fatigue less (this would be laughed down 15 years ago), however for someone who isn't competing it's different. For someone who isn't competing, perception is more important than reality. That person should ride the size they like the feel of most. What is fastest and what feels fastest might be different. Plus 'Comfiness' isn't a strictly positive thing. There's a joy in driving a loud car with stiff suspension and a stripped interior, it's not 'comfy' at all, but that's the appeal. The same goes for a racing bike. If you're just fanging around your columbus SL whip on nice roads in jean shorts for an hour, the harsher ride might be a lot more fun. Narrow tires on a road bike is a special feel. How old are you that you're seeking 'comfiness' in road cycling? I can totally get it if you're pushing yourself to the absolute limit and any comfiness is simply mitigating how brutal and uncomfy road cycling is, but if you're just having fun, maybe forget 'comfiness'. Also if you think 28mm is comfy then you are in for a treat when you try 32/35mm slicks.
>>965065
not the previous anon but in the past the wheels were really different. They where alloy, not aero and not really stiff. So having really narrow tires (and wheel) was a way to get more aero wheel. But now we have deep sections, more aero profiled, carbon wheel. So tire a little more wider like 25mm isn't such a bad thing for aero anymore. So the bonus in rolling resistance exceed the loss of aero and the tires get wider.
Tires got wider not because we suddently realised they were better but because wheels changed a lot and tires had to change accordingly.
>>965056
>Anyone saying foot retention doesn't make a huge difference on the bike needs to git gud.
100% true, *but* my experience with pinned pedals has been great. The pins keep your feet in place no matter how hard your pedaling or how wet conditions are
I did manage to get half clips on one set. It looked stupid but it was nice to have the power to lift the pedals at a stop sign. Took them off because they limited my ability to shift my foot forward on long rides (big feet)
>>965063
Pins baby. pins all day
>Also if you think 28mm is comfy then you are in for a treat when you try 32/35mm slicks.
I've got 35mm schwalbe marathon supremes, 28mm rubino pros on another. The supremes are very very nice. heavier but roll as fast the the rubino pros
>>965065
Comfiness and fun aren't mutually exclusive
>>965056
ya but the cleat "clips" into the pedal...
>>965001
ABSOLUTELY THIS
Everyone just try it, its the best for long ways if its not really cold, even in light rain. Can onyl recommend.
>>965065
>For someone who isn't competing, perception is more important than reality.
This is the best thing i've heard all day.
>>965018
The only time I would recommend doing that is bmxing or dirt jumping, so it doesn't put as much strain on your ankles when landing and it gives you a little bit better grip on the pedal
>>965108
I grew up BMXing so that's where it started. I never tried it the other way, it just felt right to have the foot centred and I noticed that whenever I did slip off the pedals it was always backwards. Then I moved onto other disciplines (trials, different types of mountain bikes, and most recently road) and it carried over never giving me serious issues (the only one I've run into is toe overlap).
One thing I did notice when trying the "right" way with road cycling is it seems to make it easier to pedal at a really high cadence (like 120rpm) without bouncing as much in the saddle. However I never need to pedal that fast and I can't push as hard that way.
>>965045
>i clip in to my clipless pedals
It is a really nonsensical name.
>>965063
I listed the actual confirmed advantages of clipless pedals. You can read whatever you want into it but pretending they make you more efficient doesn't make it so.
>>965156
ty
>>965001
birks smell nasty af tho
i have some beach flip flops that i like to ride in for ~50 miles
>>965156
>not knowing what clips are
>>965203
Everyone knows what clips are, and why they're called clipless pedals anon. You are not special, or smart for knowing. The name is just fucking stupid, regardless of its history.
>>965223
>had to google clips
>>965223
What would you call them?
>>965244
Clips. The other ones are straps.
>>965244
not OP but clipins since you fucking clip into the pedal calling it a clipless system is retarded and an oxymoron
>>965250
These are straps.
>>965253
YOU'RE a strap
>>965254
So's your mom!
>>965255
That's low man...really low...
>>965260
Yeah. Like your mother.
>>965065
Are those the Campagnolo Delta breaks?
Heard they weren't all that good.
>>965251
>calling it a clipless system is retarded and an oxymoron
It's a marketing newspeak made solely to catch attention and distinguish the _new_ system from the old one. It still is a clip-in system, just a different one, but calling it that wouldn't have the same impact.
>>965360
Campagnolo Delta brakes worked excellent when cleaned, lubricated, and with new pads.
The problems arose when the complex linkages because dirty, and the pad wear change the leverage. It's one of the parts that gained Campagnolo a reputation for high maintenance and finicky, along with their first indexing systems.
Prior to then, during the Nuovo Record and Super Record era of dominance, they were expensive, but regarded as no-nonsense and extremely durable and reliable, even if other more advanced derailers shifted better when new.
>>965489
Unless you are competing there is no reason to get clipless pedals. The added cost and inconvenience gets you very little benefit. They are only pushed by bike shops as an add on sale.
![velocio-sm[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/1Dul6y3.jpg "velocio-sm[1].jpg")
Pic is thread related. It's Velocio.
>>964960
It's really proportional to your power, and whether you're ever going hard enough for your footing to get sloppy, but as a general rule, if you can feel it flex or squish, it's probably a bad choice.
You'll notice that all of anons recommendations for a shoe with flats like the hiking shoes, and the birkenstocks involve more stiffness than your average sneakers.
I've also seen pedals specifically designed for barefoot riding. If I were to try those minimalst shoes, I'd take a close look at those specifically. I don't know anyone who uses them for serious riding though.
Also relevant to your interests, but more offroad oriented than road. http://www.bikepacking.com/gear/flat-pedals-for-touring-bikepacking/
>>965004
>The end effects would be pretty much same.
Not really. Recessed SPDs have the advantage of having the soft parts below the interface, so you could have padding like a cross trainer without affecting pedaling efficiency. On flats, everything that's under the foot goes into the stroke.
This doesn't directly apply to OP because he's thinking about zero padding shoes. There's also the caveat that there are loads and loads of different shoe builds out there.
>>964972
>Clipless pedals are like drop bars. They only have an advantage 10% of the time. 90% of the time, there's almost no advantage.
Both ends of your analogy are wrong.
>>965561
Look at that bars, the absolute madman.
>>965557
But it feels like I'm one with mai baiku
![paul-de-vivie-velocio[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/MRFxUsC.jpg "paul-de-vivie-velocio[1].jpg")
>>965563
Also check out the drivetrain.
>>965566
You better be riding a fixie.
>>965566
If you like them and can afford them then no worries.
>>965572
I'm not, and actually never have, but I plan to eventually. There's an open velodrome nearby.
>>964922
Idea: Shoe designed for touring with carbon fibre and regular inserts.
Carbon fibre insoles to be used with any shoe are also a possibility, but with the padding that would presumably be on top of the CF they would probably be too thick.
This shoe has a removable combination midsole/insole. For the everyday insert, its EVA and whatever the fuck fabric they use for insoles. For the riding insert the sole is CF on bottom with light padding of some type on top.
The inserts are secured to the top of the outsole with velcro.
The outsole is flat with sticky climbing rubber like Stealth. Minimal tread on the front for better grip on pedal that gets slightly deeper towards the back.
Shoe styling is classic basic sneaker, like Vans OG or Stan Smith, for good aesthetic versatility. White and black with no logos or weird designs.
Upper is some kind of nice looking dyneema, nylon cotton blend, or cordura, with DWR treatment or possibly goretex (goretex imo isnt breathable enough).
Could also be marketed to commuters.
Shit idea or no?
Pls no stealy
>>965624
Sounds fun. I wish there was a velodrome near me.
>>964922
There are minimal trail runners that have rock guard soles (basically a metal plate in the foam sandwich). That'd be my choice.
>>965561
>clueless namefag pretending to be a know-it-all
>>965617
that's true. Really, imo the most sensible nomenclature would be
toeclips -> toecages
clipless -> cageless
>>965895
but then you run into confusion about "cagers"
>>965617
its also a word that really triggers /k/
>>965557
>cost
I bought my shoes from a car boot sale for 8 quid and the pedals were 15 new.
They are more comfortable and allow you to pedal at higher cadences better, you can accelerate faster with them.
They're also not inconvenient at all, all you do is unclip your foot. It isn't difficult.
You're just too scared to try them m8
>>965966
Who the hell uses cephalopods as currency?
>>964930
>not much over 200g for lightweight runners
>worth making your touring effort literally 20% more difficult
The maths doesnt add up friendo
>>966013
Do you brew in the queue?
I used to commute in clipless SPD. The shoes were fine to walk in, the pedals looked nice and fit in with the look of my bike (shimano combos), and they kept me on the pedals in traffic. I used to ride in heavy rain and the clipless helped there, and I needed to change at work anyway.
Other than that, I prefer flats especially the low-profile MTB flats you get now.
>>964930
why not get some enduro, mountain bike, or ffs even vans and airwalk have walkable clipless shoes.. and has for decades.
>>965056
Nylon straps are better than leather straps. Fuck leather straps.
And no, toe clips are not harder. I've spent substantially more time riding wth toe clips than I have clipless. I have never fallen with toe clips. I have fallen twice with clipless, as well as having at least one (probably several) close calls.
>>966128
>I've spent substantially more time riding wth toe clips than I have clipless
>toe clips are not harder
Do you even think about what you say?
>>966128
>he doesnt tighten his toeclips
might as well get shitty half clips desu
>>966180
Nothing wrong with half clips m8.
Grant Petersen was right.
>>965056
I've got more than a few 200+km brevets under me and prefer the feel of being able to move my feet around the pedal, just like I like to move my hands around the bars.
When you need purchase, it's better to go MTB style and center your foot on the platform, heel down and dig into the bike.
The same way a carbon bike is to an alloy frame for the most part.
>>966274
What, similar and often inferior?
>>965896
I sold my car 2 years ago. I'm cageless.
>>964922
Riding 'clipped-in' gives you better stability on the pedals, especially when used with a stiff-soled shoe. For the purpose of fit, this stability and also the consistency with which it places your feet in relation to the pedal, this allows you to access your core muscles more easily. In turn, your arms and upper body muscles take up less of the work for supporting your weight and are allowed to facilitate deep breathing.
Just my 2c
>>966324
>he doesn't track stand in traffic
Every day I commute to work I stop with traffic where appropriate & trackstand the entire time. I don't unclip once till I get to work. After every extended stand, I catch the eye of any nearby m'lady and tip my helmet like a fedora. Guaranteed wet panties.
>wow I bet h didn't even kno that
>>966347
>tfw I don't dare to incline beyond pedal strike level
Too much road rash man
>>966324
How much clipless riding have you done in the city? I commute on m540s in NYC on my current bike, I went through a few different versions of old fashioned toe clips before making the change. It took a week or two before I was used to it, but it's much faster to clip into the m540s than fucking around with an asymmetrical set of pedals that need your foot to be in JUST the right position otherwise you're either pedaling on the wrong side of the pedal or you lose 1 or 2 full revolutions before you get your feet in the right place
For me it's either platforms or clipless, clips (in any form) provide the illusion of compromise but are actually worse than both.
>>966353
>beyond pedal strike level
what is coasting?
>>965250
>not calling them magazines
>>964922
>decided to ditch clipless for my upcoming tour, but now I'm deciding what type of shoes to wear. I want to bring my minimalist runners because they are very light and breathable, but the sole is like a wet noodle
Have you considered SPD?
There are some very nice SPD touring shoes that are breathable with light meshes etc but still have stiff soles. They also have recessed cleats so are perfectly walkable too.
>>966446
I meant beyond the point where you'd pedal strike if you kept pedaling
>>965049
>with socks, right?
Is there another way to wear them?
>>965489
>Just get clipless. You WILL fall over though.
Start on SPD Clickrs, you have to try to fall over in them. I never did, bought some on the way to work because of a Ride-To-Work day sales on the bike path. It was natural by the second set of lights. I graduated to regular SPDs later and it's all compatible.
>>965156
>>i clip in to my clipless pedals
>It is a really nonsensical name.
>>965203
>>not knowing what clips are
>>965223
>The name is just fucking stupid, regardless of its history.>>965617
>Clip is a weird word now
It all made sense at the time. Each individual evolution of the name is logical, it's only from a future perspective that it becomes nonsense.
>>966449
>magazines
kek, you beat me to it
>>966513
That's what he's saying, if you don't pedal it's not an issue. I don't even know why you'd want to pedal whilst cornering, unless you're one of those idiots that thinks fixies are suitable for riding outside of a velodrome.
>>966013
>says the person who uses deer as currency
>>966533
He doesn't want to pedal while cornering. He's saying he's afraid of leaning his bike that much.
>>966831
>He doesn't want to pedal while cornering.
Then what's the issue? He specifically mentions pedal stike which must mean he's worried about it, but if you correctly orient your cranks and don't pedal like an idiot it's not a problem.
>>966844
No! Argh! Learn some reading comprehension! Fuck you!
Leaning a bike when cornering can feel scary because it feels like the bike will slide out from underneath you.
He's not worried about pedal strike. He's using the leaning angle REQUIRED for a POTENTIAL pedal strike as a reference point for how much he's comfortable leaning in a corner?
Do i have to to draw you a shitty picture with 10000 hours in mspiant?
>>966968
It's a needless reference point and just adds confusion (as evidenced by the replies to his post). He could've just said that he doesn't like to lean his bike over very far (no need for an exact reference point) because he's afraid of low siding.
>>966968
Youre being trolled, bro
>>966974
Your face is a needless reference point and just adds confusion (as evidenced by your mom).
>>964922
Can someone tell me why this guy (who I assume is a professional athlete) has a peak heart rate of almost 180? Shouldn't it go down as you get better?
>>968814
If you train peak heart rate goes up, rest heart rate goes down
>>968815
Do you know why?
Can i mount toe cages on platform pedals like in OP?
>>968835
Because the heart pumps blood to the rest of the body as a way of supplying oxygen where needed. The more power you are putting out, the more oxygen you are burning, the more blood your heart has to circulate. Your heart has a given volume, which means that to circulate more blood it has to pump more frequently.
>>968838
You can install power grips
>>968838
Depends on the pedals, unless you are content with zipties.
MKS are probably what you want.
>>968838
Yes, my mini velo came with them you flip them over and it reveals a mounting boss.
>>968852
I actually bought the MKS urban platforms and the MKS x nitto tubular stainless cages from rakuten for my mini velo
Despite what improperly translated advertising states they are not sealed and will not work for trail riding
>>968870
You can stop pretending. We all know you don't have a bike.
>>968873
>>968893
Not OP's pedals. It depends on the particular platform pedal, some will have the holes (generally those that come with reflectors attached) whilst others won't (a lot of the higher end MTB and BMX pedals).
Also, those are just pedals and not a complete bike.
>>968900
They're the pedals in question that you said I didn't own
>>968901
he said you don't own a bike. which, of course, you don't
>>964997
Not sure if trolling but It definitely helps climbing trails when you need to keep your weight oriented over your rear wheel so you don't lose traction
>>965581
>and can afford them
Seriously brand new clipless pedals and shoes you can get for like 150 aussie dollars, how fucking poor are you jesys christ
Hey guys I just got a sram s300 crankset and I wanted to get some new pedals too.
Preferably higher end pedals.
Can I get some recommendations?
Also are cages necessary if youre running straps?
>>971126
150 dollars for something that is literally useless
why not both?
>>971187
>Also are cages necessary if youre running straps?
>>971230
Hi Nikki
No shop in town will sell me a pair of toe cages. They're all like "Nooo, you must spend at least 150€ on new shoes and pedals."
>>972041
Sounds like you have sensible shops that aren't afraid to try to get their customers to see reason
Clips and straps are garbage, harder to use and less effective than clipless
The only reason they continue to get sold is that inexperienced cyclists think clipless pedals are for hard core suicidal professional experts
If you don't like clipless there is literally nothing wrong with platforms, but don't fall for the vintage steampunk cosplay, serious cyclists dropped cages and straps for a reason and it wasn't fashion
>>972050
Yeah, naw.
I like to pop on the bike for odd runs and stuff without having to carry a second pair of shoes, and if it's been raining, platform pedals without straps/cages can get a bit slipperly. I like having them there for that.
How about you take your elitist attitude and shove it up your asshole, fred.
>>972053
What kind of "odd runs" are we talking here, steampunk-kun?
Have you tried MTB shoes? They're fine for your average city errand use, unless you're planning on walking a few miles it's fine. I wear republics for commuting and sometimes forget to take them off and put on my office shoes
Tbh I think you've never even looked at the options and you think everyone wears clip-clop s-works horse hooves
>>972050
I like foot retention. I like not accidentally getting bumped off the pedal and i like having access to war emergency power. I don't like to spend 15-20 times the money i should need to for unnecessary shit and i don't like having to change shoes every time i feel like going somewhere or taking a ride or just fuck about in the forest. I like clips.
>>972055
>What kind of "odd runs" are we talking here, steampunk-kun?
Like, I just wanna go to the store for something or head over to a bud's.
>Have you tried MTB shoes? They're fine for your average city errand use, unless you're planning on walking a few miles it's fine. I wear republics for commuting and sometimes forget to take them off and put on my office shoes
I'd rather just wear the sneakers I already have.
>Tbh I think you've never even looked at the options and you think everyone wears clip-clop s-works horse hooves
Clipless just isn't optimal for all bikes and all rides.
My beater bike wouldn't work well with them.
I know it's hard when you're autistic, but try and put yourself in someone else's shoes.
>>972057
You can get a pair of MTB shoes for the cost of a pair of vans, the republics were just an example
If you're hell bent on wasting money on keiren cosplaying accessories then that's fine, you can just say you prefer the look and you're scared of trying stuff that's outside of your comfort zone
But your arguments are based on flawed logic
>>972055
Not the guy you replied to but:
>Tbh I think you've never even looked at the options
I asked about mtb shoes at the shops, just to explore my options..
>you think everyone wears clip-clop s-works horse hooves
I do think this. You know why? Because that's all they could show me at the shops! MTB shoes! Every single shop!
>unless you're planning on walking a few miles it's fine
Nah, this won't do. Unless you can show me a pair of decently priced clip in shoes that will work just as well as an ONLY pair of shoes, i'll still like my clips.
>>972057
>but try and put yourself in someone else's shoes.
ha!
>>972060
I don't know your definition of decently priced, for one guy it might be $400, for the next guy $30 is overpriced Veblen goods for zuckerbergs and rothschilds.
If you're really hard up and only have one pair of shoes to your name, I have to wonder why a pair of chromed mks cosplaying clips seems like a good investment
>>972064
Who said anything about chromed mks cosplaying clips?
There's an auto parts store that carries pic related in their catalog for 4€ a pair, which is what i was originally going to buy, but they ere sold out and didn't seem interested in restocking. I've used them before on other bikes and they've worked well for me.
>>972066
Oh, that's cool. Where I'm from that kind of part is only used by cosplayin fixiefag steampunk types, they sell for a great deal more than that. My local shop only sells vintage campy clips, but I've seen mks on the poorfag bikes
>>972072
Oh c'mon. Give the guy a break. Don't be an asshole.
Everyone have certain life experiences that defines their trains of though. You can't expect people to keep every contingent possibility in mind.
>>972073
Yes, you fucking can, when I'm asking not to be shit on because this asshole thinks the only clips you can get are priced out the asshole.
Don't call reasonable people steampunk douches because you can't think critically for a moment.
>>972072
I live in a very bike centric city, tons of people use bikes for commuting, shopping, etc. So clipless is not seen as a fred thing, and vintage awkward tech like toe cages are a niche product
Re: $60 being a lot, that's why I asked for a specific definition of "reasonable". Kids here happily drop $200 on sneakers that go out of fashion in a year. I think it's crazy but not everyone's priorities are the same
>>972075
A little hard to take that life lesson here when you're the only one still acting like a douche.
But whatever. I'm going to go play some ETS2 instead.
>>972077
>don't act like an asshole that guy's only acting like an asshole to you!
>>972076
One would think living in a bike centric city make the range of bike parts and ride styles wider, not narrower.
>>972081
It's pretty wide. For example we have a lot of commuter shoes that look like not bike shoes but take cleats. And also steampunk niche stuff that people understand is for cosplay, like keirin pedals and stuff like that. People who use bikes to"complete the look" rather than getting around town are willing to pay extra for that kind of impractical whimsy
>>972076
>vintage awkward tech like toe cages
you're fucking retarded
>>964928
I cut the handle off my toothbrush and my spork, but it wasn't for weight, I did it to be able to fit them inside my cookset.
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