>Dear Phil,
>The other day, I did something that I’m normally used to doing: I pirated your album, The Glow pt. 2. I didn’t even think about it as I clicked the download button. I just heard from a lot of music sites and message boards that it was a great album, and I wanted to see what the fuss was about. Once the zip file loaded, I immediately gave it a listen. Once the title track came on, I was immediately interested. When the next song came along, I was invested. After listening to the album a couple of times, and giving it some time to digest, I fell in love with the album.
>A couple of days later, I did something that I’m normally not used to doing: I bought your album. I didn’t even buy it from iTunes or Amazon; I bought it from your label. I rarely even buy albums, let alone physically. I only do it when I really like an album or if I’m interested in the artist or band who made it. Being a high schooler, I’m usually strapped for cash, so I usually get CD rips from online sources. (I recently got a job, so I think this habit will likely go away.) However, this album was so good, that I had to buy it.
>I wrote this letter as a way of saying thanks for what you do. The Glow pt. 2 will very likely become one of my favorite albums in my collection. I haven’t listened to the Mount Eerie album yet aside from a couple of songs online (I heard it’s just as good, if not, better than The Glow), and I haven’t really delved into the Mount Eerie discography yet (I really want to listen to Wind’s Poem since I’ve been interested in black metal recently as well). However, once I earn more money, I will hopefully be able to get some more albums. Anyways, keep up the good work. I hope to be purchasing from you more often.
>Thanks.
Phil Elverum wrote back:
>Hi (name),
>Thanks for writing, and thanks for liking my album. I’m grateful you bought it, especially from me directly. That’s certainly the best way.
>I do have to say that the general message of your letter is a great example of the precarious future that artists and musicians find themselves in in 2015. In the past a “fan letter” would naturally have come from a starting point of financial support. Nowadays the norm is to say “I like your music so much I did a crazy radical thing: I supported you financially.” I realize this makes sense to you given that you are in high school and have grown up in a world where everything is free on the internet and the necessity of paying for music is not a given. It is probably easy to tell yourself a story about how artists don’t need the money that bad and pirating is no big deal, and in many cases this is certainly true. I have done it too.
>But what is striking to me is the shift in what’s “normal”. We are approaching a time when it is unusual and special to pay for music. You are a good dude, writing a kind and earnest letter to me, and not trying to make any special point about the financial times we live in. It seems that you are writing to say “thanks”, but there is also a tone of “you’re welcome” in there, as if you made a special exception for me by buying the record, which I guess is what you did.
>>60520359
cringe.
>>60520359
I don't understand. What did he say to the kid? Where is the source of this information?
>I am older and have a different conception of “normal”. I take it for granted that a musician deserves to get paid for an album. If a high schooler doesn’t have the money then the high schooler just temporarily has fewer albums to listen to. I know I am from another time and technology has made my “normal” no longer true. Still, the underlying ethical tradeoff seems basic and eternal to me. I am weirded out by the fact that it is a special exception for someone to buy a record from me vs. quickly and easily pirating my whole discography. (Questions of if people like it or not are beside the point here.)
>I have yet to adjust to the new state of things, and in fact I don’t know what adjusting would even look like. How would it work? I could not make the stuff I make if I had to sustain myself by also working at another job. The music would disappear, and I think this is true for most artists. This basic fact seems like a clear enough argument against pirating. It’s personal. It’s not about big businesses and “victimless crimes”, or about a teen with no money just needing it so bad that they are exempt from the ethics. It’s a simple exchange of support and art.
>Of course, I am super appreciative you like my album and I’m sorry to go off on you. It was just a thought provoking message. I know you get it and you were clear about your intentions to buy more records from me in the future. I just want to say “yes, good, thank you very much” and also, don’t treat this as a special scenario. Pay your musicians. Think about the whole system.
http://pwelverumandsun.tumblr.com/post/132240206696/fan-letter-and-response
Wow I had no idea Phil was such a douchebag. I know he has the whole "folksy man living in the mountains" image to maintain but he's acting like a dinosaur here. Fuck him.
>>60520369
>it should be normal to buy music
fuck off. the ease and popularity of pirating music is the best thing to happen to music. since the invention music as a physical format it has transformed into a consumerist product-- completely devaluing it. by making it accessible to all and removing financial insentive for the creator it can finally be honest again.
i think he was being pretty respectful in explaining his point and made it clear that he didnt blame or dislike the fan for doing what he did
i assume this is generally how most artists feel about piracy, at least the ones who dont have a bandcamp or who started before piracy and streaming became the huge thing that is it today
i respect phil for being upfront and honest, trying to change someones viewpoint
literally nobody would give a shit about Phil if it wasn't for piracy.
>>60520478
also two records i ordered from phil's store arrived this morning after pirating and listening to his music for so long, so this is a pretty neat coincidence for me
lol memes
>>60520391
>>60520369
this is some major autism
>>60520449
Well yeah bud, that's how the current system is, congrats, we live in a capitalistic society where everything is a product. yes, this is a shitty situation, and art is by its nature something that ought to be not that well translatable towards any market economy, but firstly, financial support of the artists has ALWAYS been existing. Back before the enlightenment and the start of a modern economy, music for instance was hugely in debt to patronages, whether from the church or from the nobility. Do you think Bach composed out of beauty? hell no, he had to produce a weekly cantate because of his occupation as the local organ player. Composers always got (monetary) gains for their archievements, otherwise they couldn't compose. The whole download culture is actually the first attempt at deconstructing the idea of 'art independent of economy', while this has never been so, only in the idealistic visions of the new internet savy
>>60520387
>>60520388
>>60520449
>>60520483
High schoolers without a job detected
I wouldn't really consider that a "telling off." Elverum was just making a point that the music buying norms have shifted to a pirate then buy model. Obviously he doesn't want people pirating his music, but he wasn't ripping into the kid for pirating it before he bought the album. The only part of his response that sounded bitter was the bit where he said the tone of the kid's letter was a "you're welcome," but Phil does have a point there. It is a bit insulting to be told "you're welcome" for actually buying your art.
>>60520641
Yeah it's strange that these days it's seen as "going the extra mile" for an artist when you purchase their stuff. Anecdotal evidence says that people below 18 (probably even older) will laugh at the idea of purchasing anything wether digital or physical
>>60520709
I would say its because they don't have jobs yet so they would rather pirate it and buy later. It's incredibly immature but what can you expect from children like /mu/tants?
>>60520621
Hi Phil :)
>>60520641
agreed
i think insufferable phil should get a regular job at this point. his music fucking sucks.
>>60520603
get your head out of your white capitalist ass and see the rest of the world. many cultures celebrated music as something to be shared. study music across the world and throughout history. it was enough to make music that served the community or fulfilled an internal creative drive. the idea of creating music for money is not how it has ALWAYS been nor should it be accepted even if it was.
>>60520359
>tfw someone reposts your thread
>>60521736
>the idea of creating music for money is not how it has ALWAYS been
kek
check your facts m8
>>60520709
Not only that, but the most popular "legal" way of listening to music now is through streaming services, which, financially speaking, isn't that much better for artists than piracy.
"told off" is an overstatement
he's not wrong either
>>60520359
>>60520369
>entitled faggot acts like buying music is some sort of amazing thing that everybody must know about
>phil puts him in his place
thank you based phil for your blessing
>>60520554
>autism is anything I don't like or agree with
Wtf? I dont think you have any grasp of what autism looks like, even in the 4chan sense. Nigga was just explaining his position on pirating music and why he feels strongly about, didn't even sperg out of anything.
>>60520369
>but there is also a tone of “you’re welcome” in there
yep
add that to a letter that's already essentially the OP of a /mu/ thread and you've got yourself some serious obliviousness. I'm surprised he even responded at all.
>>60521736
>the idea of creating music for money is not how it has ALWAYS
The idea isn't creating music for money. The idea, which Phil touched on in his response, is asking for money so that you can continue to make music.
Phil doesn't live in a third world village where the community sits down in the dirt after a day of hunting to barely put off starvation, playing music by a fire before retiring to a straw hut for the night. Phil has rent to pay. He has to pay for recording equipment. He has bills. If he wasn't making money off of his music he'd have to work a traditional job to support himself. That's time and energy taken away from his music career.
Charging for art = production of more art.
In all honesty people like adele,taylor swift,kanye west should be doing more for the indie community with all the money they have.
If i had kanye west money I'd do shit like every month give $5grand grants to lesser known artist he likes on bandcamp to help them with equipment and such. give back to the community
but owell the machine is greedy
shit fans who don't support the artist they like but get pissed off over an arbitrary score from anthony or p4k
what a time to be alive ! ^.^
>>60520369
>>60520391
He's right, though. He wasn't even disrespectul
