Once you learn how to arrange notation it all comes down to taste
Because you literally choose which note comes after the previous note
People with shit taste fail hard at this
And it's the same with every other aspect of music. Drums, timing, key. It's all just taste
Those with good taste make good music
>>53778075
>There is no talent in making music
why does talent matter?
>>53778075
how about rap or just music with lyrics that arent a chorus on repeat during the whole song? You need talent to write poetry/lyrics
>>53778102
Rap isnt music
>>53778090
because supply and demand, dipshit
>>53778102
that's a retarded argument. you are accepting that choosing the next note doesn't take talent and then asserting that choosing the next word does take talent. i'm not taking a side either way, just pointing out that you're dumb.
>>53778205
i guess so your post actually made sense
>>53778205
And rappers still use notes when they rap words wether they realise or not
You can't escape notation
>>53778141
Le.
>>53778075
>there is no talent in making music
correct
>once you learn how to arrange notation
ehhh yes but there is no 1 way about it
>It's all just taste
yes
>>53778205
the difference is in that words have meanings, notes do not
>>53778075
where's your hit song then talent anon?
>>53778273
you're dumb too. notation and notes don't actually exist. they're abstractions that make communicating about music easier, not the music itself. you're dumb ass can't tell the difference between the shadows on the wall and the thing that casts the shadow.
>>53778157
Elaborate. Isn't art dependent on interpretation, rendering the artist's intent and talent meaningless?
>>53778382
shutup idiot. words don't have meanings.
>>53778382
Notes do have meaning though
>>53778075
What the fuck are you talking about
do you have ANY musical training?
>>53778421
Yeah numbers don't exist to right lmao
>>53778382
if notes don't have meaning, words don't have meaning either.
>>53778075
I don't think that talent exists, but if you are implying that it's easy to make music then you're wrong.
>>53778447
L-LANGUAGE GAMES!!!!
>>53778075
ya true
but composing takes talent then the muscians become your puppets
same with mixing
>>53778455
I'm classically trained jazz guitarist with over 10 years experience 5 of which at an acredited music college
>>53778434
art is dependent on clarity. and it's not like the shit is being interpreted by a bunch of god damn aliens. people are people, maaaaaan
>>53778538
>jazz guitarist
Ah, a bullshit musician then.
That's all about what you're trying to get out of music. If you just want music that sounds good, sure, but if you're looking at music as art there is a lot more depth to it.
>>53778552
if you think that music that sounds good and music as art are two different things, and/or that one has more "depth" than the other, then you're doing it fucking wrong
>>53778075
how are you enjoying your guaranteed replies
>>53778604
They aren't mutually exclusive, retard.
>>53778550
all musicians are bullshit my man
>>53778665
Give a good reason why.
>>53778539
>clarity
So do you claim that an ideal piece of art should, theoretically, lead to only one correct interpretation?
>>53778674
Because kanyes ass
ITT: A guy who has never played a musical instrument gets all philosophical about music.
>noice
>>53778674
i was just shitposting i actually never did anything music related that wasn't listening to it
>>53778449
>>53778489
Citations and/or deductive reasoning required.
>>53778447
Very well, then we can surely say that works using vocals employ phonemes and sequence them in the way that they do purely for aesthetic affect, right? However, if you were to study every single piece of vocal music and compare each to their respective languages, you would find a very high degree of these vocal works not only feature defined words but also to actually conform to the grammatical standards of the times in which they were written.
Can you prove that this occurred merely by accident? I think not.
>>53778434 >>53778539 >>53778691
Art is not dependent on any interpretation, it is only a vehicle for pleasure by way of aesthetics.
>>53778359
Rap= Rhythm and Poetry
Music also requires melody &or harmony
>>53778075
WHAT the fuck is going on ITT?
Why aren't more of you calling this moron out on his bullshit?
OP, you're obviously not a musician.
Threads like this make me lose faith in you /mu/
>>53778794
>he genuinally doesn't understand notative expression
That's called musical autism
>>53778538
>classically trained
>jazz
doesn't mean shit
Jazz is learned on the streets
>>53778885
le faith in humanity le lost
>>53778075
This is only true by taking music very broadly. I mean, you could easily just drum fingers on your desk, loop it in Audacity, and call it music, yeah, no talent there. But that will appeal to very few people.
The talent is in making music that sounds good.
>Once you learn how to arrange notation
This in itself requires at least some talent. A lot of people cannot arrange notation. Further to my above point, a lot of people also cannot arrange notation in a way that appeals to people.
>>53778913
>le wrong generation
>>53778794
Words and Notes are given meaning through the culture surrounding them.
gooooooodoasdfg is not considered a word by us. It is considered to have no meaning. But another culture could have this word, and it would have meaning.
Similarly with say, a quartertone. Is it a super sharp/flat version of a note? Or a distinct entity?
Learn moar.
>There is no talent in making music
yes there is
/thread
>>53779143
this
>>53778833
And how does one translate aesthetics into pleasure?
>>53778075
OP
How high are you right now?
>>53778075
>Those with good taste make good music
I've been recording music for 10 years now, and this is the most accurate statement I've ever read on /mu/. Anyone can learn to master the guitar, piano, sing, etc. and some advance well beyond others, but that's not necessary to write great music. Music is literally the arrangement of sounds, and those that have good taste (have listened to and adapted traits from classic artists, AND have natural songwriting sensibilities) are the only ones we can entrust the future of music to. There will always be a band that can play a well-structured catchy song, there will always be a kid of his laptop that can juggle balls in the air with his multi-layered beats, and there will always be incredible singers.
But without taste, we're just acknowledging their talents, not what they're actual contributing to the world of MUSIC. We need people with their finger on the pulse of our culture. If they happen to have the talent to pull of their vision, that's when greatness happens.
>>53778885
musician here, OP is 100% correct even tho he's phrasing it weird as fuck.
>>53778075
This isn't really true, but at the same time "skill" isn't as important as being creative and having a strong artistic vision in making music
>>53779353
>We need people with their finger on the pulse of our culture.
Agreed with you up until here. Fuck culture, it's about the individual's perspective. Whether or not other people can relate to it, who gives a fuck? Naturally those who are more perceptive will be better at music, and those who have a similar view of the world will gravitate towards the same music.
>>53779422
truth. it's the people with unique visions that stray from the rut of pop culture are the ones who actually create the new pop culture
>>53779368
Explain why he is correct.
>>53779518
That doesn't explain why a person who can play an instrument exceptionally well isn't talented.
>>53779560
they're talented. it's just useless from an artistic standpoint.
>>53779669
all art is useless
saying creating music is talent-less though is fucking stupid
>>53779560
No one cares if little billy can play vodoo chile on his squier
Playing music and writing music are two completely different things
>>53779669
See, the problem was with OP's statement:
>There is no talent in making music
I can agree that people who simply know how to play well aren't very artistically enriched.
>>53779719
If a person can play a complex violin concerto, even without emotion or artistic liberty, they still have talent at their instrument.
So what I can gather from this thread is that you all fucking agree with one another but are just phrasing it differently.
OP says there is no talent, then some other anons say there is, OK OK but it has to come through meaning of notes or words, yes yes alright that's fine, but can you be talented at putting across meaning, it is all structures and composition, this is all taste, seemingly you cannot learn taste and so it is basically the equivalent to talent except in a way more accessible to the average /mu/tant.
Fucking congrats guys you're operating at a third grade level.
>>53778075
its a troll post you retards. no ones actually this stupid to believe this. he just wants you guys to reply "NUH UH YOURE WRONG AND DUMB I KNOW THE MUSIC THEORIES AND EVERY
>>53779741
creating music takes talent.
period.
>>53779717
I think what OP meant was that skill is useless in music, which is true
>>53779781
Having skill requires talent, or at least tons of practice which leads to talent.
>>53779781
it isnt.
>>53779780
what a dumb, self affirming statement though. you're basically praising something for existing. of course it took talent. you can have a lot of basic building blocks missing and still make great music tho. OP is obviously referring to skill, not talent.
Pop music, actual music takes extreme talent.
>>53778102
Hip hop has the most inane lyrics ever.
>>53779780
This is what I am saying. I think the point that is actually working here is more that talent has made the creation of 'great' music, or 'great' songwriting, inaccessible to the people who pursue it. Over-institutionalized. This I can agree with, and I think if you're sitting there disagreeing with OP then in some sense you're part of the problem.
>>53779808
Not useless but overrated.
>>53779808
unless you're a jazz or classical artist, it is
>>53779796
skill can be learned talent is inherent
>>53779849
You are implying only specific people can become virtuosos. This is inherently false.
Anyone can play an instrument/sing/whatever given the time and effort. "Talent" in the sense of innate skill from birth is a farce. An antiquated belief.
Here's a good example:
http://youtu.be/FBDMhOCc9rQ
Listen to this, pretty much every person who's played a guitar has played with an arrangement like that
It's the most basic arrangement it takes absolutely no talent what so ever
But only one person wrote a song as perfect as naima
his taste wrote this song
Daily reminder: you will never have the taste necessary to write a song (as basic as it is) this well
>>53779849
>>53779888
Great skill as a jazz or classical artist cannot be learned by everyone or even a minority of people. That requires a real talent, or at the very least EXTREME training.
You've kinda got a point. The fact is, any artist with substance makes music THEY primarily want to here and if people fuck with that, they get a following.
>>53779849
>>53779922
>jazz
>skill
>>53779925
What do you mean, 'if people fuck with that'?
>>53779935
>hasn't seen whiplash
>>53779080
>note vibrates at ratio to other note
>meaning
be less gullible
>>53779888
you think everyone has an equal ear for melody? that's just objectively not true. human perception varies from person to person therefore so does musical inclination.
