![1416867-sj_shoulder_shrug[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/3mauyTn.jpg "1416867-sj_shoulder_shrug[2].jpg")
>tfw you actually don't like rap or country
What is wrong with not liking these genres?
Nothing, it just makes the people who like those genres more aware of the fact that they are basic bitches with pleb taste.
Not liking rap or liking country makes you a racist.
It's not about not liking them. It's about why you don't like them. if it's purely sonic, then you're okay. But if you're more deterred by lyrical content or the cultural/social influence of the genre then you're a fucking idiot and i'm glad i have better taste than you.
>>53059420
>burgers
>>53059426
>But if you're more deterred by lyrical content or the cultural/social influence of the genre then you're a fucking idiot
but both of those things are hugely important in both genres, especially rap
Its more the statement "I don't like genre-x" that irks me. I try to listen to a wide range of music and am actually very happy that I do and its kind of sad to see people unable to like large groups of music just because they can't immediately get into the genre.
I always thought that the cringe-y part of "everything but rap and country" was the "everything but" part.
>>53059437
but who cares if it sounds good. do you get what i'm saying? Lyrical content isn't shit compared to how it sounds. That's why I like Chief Keef monolithic rap anthems over Eminem/Aesop Rock/Kendrick Lamar shitty word vomit.
>>53059448
Country really sucks dick though for the most part, the only time I have liked it is when a distinct artist like Bob Dylan dips into it or takes influence and even then I'm not crazy about. For me, Country sucks cock.
>>53059464
yeah maybe that's it.
>>53059466
>Lyrical content isn't shit compared to how it sounds.
Fans of rap music would violently disagree with you. If the lyrics are there, they are important and worth studying.
As far as how it sounds, some instrumental hip hop is really good and interesting, but that isn't rap, and a lot of what is used in rap is just repetitive beats built on samples so it is not very interesting musically if you subtract the lyrics and rapping, which is almost always pretty limited.
>>53059466
I disagree. I think there's a balance between sounding good and artistic substance that needs to be met. Sure I'll never mind listening to something that sounds pleasant but I won't consider it good necessarily. Also, I don't like Aesop Rock. I think even though he has a wide vocabulary, he doesn't have that much to say, there are songs with no words that say leagues more than some of the most verbose lyricists. That being said, it's all fairly subjective what you think has the most artistic fidelity, but we all have opinions and most of us are here to argue over which musicians are have the most. A lot of people like saying Neutral Milk Hotel and there are even some people with interesting opinions.
All I'm trying to say is there is some good country music and aesop rock makes boring music.
>>53059426
>rap
>taste
>>53059503
Well saying country sucks dick is kind of like if someone looked at lil'b and said all rap sucks because he's rap and he's popular. Honestly Ween's 12 golden country greats is what got me to appreciate it. If you can get past the tear in your beer pop hits there's some interesting stuff.
>>53059503
> a lot of what is used in rap is just repetitive beats built on samples so it is not very interesting musically if you subtract the lyrics and rapping, which is almost always pretty limited
you aren't listening to the right hip hop, or you dont have pop sensibilities.
>>53059518
All I'm saying is that if it sounds excellent, i don't care what they are saying at all. They could literally be calling me out specifically in the song calling me a faggot and if it sounded good i would listen to it. but then again, i dont listen to music for the image or thoughts like most people here. I listen for the sound.
>>53059531
you have no pop sensibilities do you
i don't like industrial sludgenoise. is that wrong
I used to listen to rap but it really is the worst shit there is. You're just wasting time listening to hip hop. The melodys are shit and most of the time they're stolen. But when they arnt stolen they're always shit simple 3 note garbage. The vocals are terrible and your missing out on imo the most important part of music, the emotional output tht comes with good vocals. The lyrics in rap are cringe enducing bullshit about being a cool dude and being a skilled mc
The whole genre is a joke. Our kids will look back on hip hop and Gangsta rap and feel embarrassed for us
>>53059420
The Carolina Chocolate Drops are racist despite being black and in no way indicating racism besides the fact that some anon thinks liking country makes you racist. Good to know.
>>53059545
That's just where we're gonna disagree. I can appreciate when music sounds good but if you make music just for it to sound good and not to be challenging, interesting, or artistic, I don't see any point. If I was only listening to music to feel good I could jerk off all day and get the same effect, but instead I jerk off like 3 times on a slow day and the rest I listen to music.
>>53059554
Can you link me some industrial sludgenoise so I can form an opinion and tell you whether you're wrong?
>>53059580
but to sound good, it usually has to be challenging, interesting, and/or artistic...
how can it just sound good without being any of those.
>>53059573
Please don't fall for it, /mu/.
>>53059573
I don't really see any grounding in your opinion, and honestly it comes off as pretty miopic. Not liking a genre is one thing but actively trying to discredit the entirety of it is pretty childish. There's plenty of good, interesting, and artistic rap music. You can't let what's popular define your opinion, and even then I just think its mean spirited to detest such a large part of the industry.
>>53059587
no because i made it up
but that doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't exist
>>53059598
I think anon means catchy stuff that isn't grating to hear but isn't likely to hold your attention either.
>>53059608
Pretty sure you're taking the bait/feeding the troll/being duped by an epic ruseman.
>>53059545
>you aren't listening to the right hip hop, or you dont have pop sensibilities.
AKA "Lower you standards to like bad music"
No thanks. I've listened to plenty of rap, the problem is that it exists in a bubble. While other genres like rock and techno gave rise to more and more experimental and complex and shifting music (which gave birth to tons of new genres over the years), rap has used the same formula for 40 years but with changing fads and attitudes- and it's quite proud of it.
If you take something like Death Grips, which just barely mixes up the old rap formula into something different, you have "hip hop heads" reject it for being too different. Maybe 1 guy out of 10 who considers himself a hip hop "head" will embrace it.
Rap will never really be a complex or interesting music genre for these reasons. Hip Hop, yeah, because it's instrumental. But rap is just the same fucking shit in slightly different ways. Hearing about how some guy grew up in a shitty hood or a rapper telling you his name over and over, rappers who celebrate dealing crack as if that is something to brag about, etc. Yes, they have witty word play and rhymes and flows but it all amounts to jack fucking shit, it doesn't mean anything emotionally 90% of the time and they are not challenging your ideas musically or philosophically. It would be like if the past 40 years of rock all had the lyrics of AC/DC songs. It'd be terrible.
Rap a shit.
>>53059610
>>53059587
wait i might have found some top lols
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4576CB33AC1435C0
so am i wrong
>>53059598
Some people think jam bands sound good, I think the greatful dead are boring. If you think music has to be artistsic and innovative to sound good maybe we agree more than I thought. But I would also say a lot of lo-fi, pc music, and pop don't exactly hurt my ears to listen to and make fine background music, but I don't really consider it interesting art and it would never rank on any list of favorite musicians.
>>53059608
No there isn't I've explored the whole genre
It's garbage
Can you imagine what our kids will say
"So wait these rappers stole other people's songs added a drum beat to it and spoke over the top of it about how good they are at speaking over stolen melodys and they call it music"
>>53059646
>and spoke over the top of it about how good they are at speaking over stolen melodys
This was Rakim's entire career and many consider him to be among the greatest if not the greatest rapper ever:
Turn up the bass, check out my melody, hand out a cigar
I'm lettin knowledge be born, and my name's the R
A-k-i-m, not like the rest of them, I'm not on a list
That's what I'm sayin, I drop science like a scientist
My melody's in a code, the very next episode
Has the mic often distortin', ready to explode
I keep the mic at Fahrenheit, freeze MC's to make 'em colder
The listener's system is kickin' like solar
As I memorize, advertise, like a poet
Keep you goin' when I'm flowin', smooth enough, you know with the rough
That's why the moral of my story I tell'll be
Nobody beats the R, check out my melody
DEEP STUFF!
Rap really does suck dick dick. Maybe I'll put on chief keef just because his music has a lot of emotion and anger in it and feels authentic
But "real rap" is shit
>>53059587
wait i really found it this time and it's exactly how i imagined it. low end noise
everyone listen to the shit genre i created with a mere thought
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XroCyJ-wdxc
>>53059622
I'm a film student and the term we use to refer to people who can sit through old, or foreign films is "cinematically literate", meaning you can sit through a movie despite it not having the tropes you're used to. My point is I think anon meant you aren't "rap literate". There's no "lowering your standards" involved, you just need to sit back and let the music hit you instead of anticipating it. Further, I don't think you're being very fair to rap/hip hop in the slightest to the point I'm a little embarassed I'm even responding to your post.
>>53059613
but that's not what i'm talking about. I'm talking about challenging, artistic, and interesting hip hop and country
>>53059622
but there are hip hop artists out there that progress the sounds and create interesting and unique sonic soundscapes. And usually the rap artists that are the best are the ones that aren't depending upon wordplay and flows, moreso on melody and the tone and texture of their voice. That's why I find chief keef to be a good artist, because he does interesting things with his voice that other rappers dont. Also if literally no rap is challenging your ideas musically then you aren't hearing what i hear. I hear a type of music that would've never been imagined in the 60s, 70's, 80s, or maybe even the 90s. It's nihilistic, futuristic, idiosyncratic, and has its own history. It's very interesting and I love that it has influenced the mainstream so much.
>>53059646
I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, but this is just low quality bait at this point. You're implying no hip hop artists has ever made a beat from scratch.
>>53059675
>I'm a film student and the term we use to refer to people who can sit through old, or foreign films is "cinematically literate",
Well I WAS a film student and filmmaker in college and I apply the same fucking attitude to film. Actually I have a real problem with a ton of the bullshit people act like you NEED to like as a "cinephile"- something I don't call myself. I have a funny but long and boring story about that. Basically in one of my film classes, a teacher gave up showing us challenging films because no one in the class cared. So she said "OK bring your own movies in". We wound up watching Evil Dead and some movie called "Zombie Strippers from Outer Space". I didn't stay for the later and actually had an autistic outburst. I was paying for that class and this is what education came to?
But that type of mentality in film studies- what I call "film jocks"- are the same type of people who are the "hip hop heads". They fetishize bullshit like really stupid fucking rap that sounds cool because the guy raps about dealing crack and how great he is at rhyming the same way a film jock fetishizes the absolute dumbest shit like bad zombie movies that are utterly meaningless and devoid anything intelligent while prattling on about how a film "must have" this or is "all about the story!".
So I understand the difference and I get the being "literate" part, but the genre is extremely limited. Cinema went very far in a century, rap has gone almost nowhere in 40 years.
>>53059697
No hip hop artist has ever made an intresting piece of music off top. Rappers make "beats" the literal lowest form of music
>>53059723
>rap has gone almost nowhere in 40 years.
>>53059750
>Rappers make "beats"
i giggled m8
>>53059399
>dubs
check these!
>>53059675
>not liking foreign films
what the actual fuck
>>53059750
And the fact is the overwhelming majority of rappers do not make "beats"
Which makes it even worse
"hey guys I got this cool idea for music, we talk about how good we are at talking over get this, beats that we stole off youtube get this, that not only contain samples stolen from talented musicians but actually base the whole melody around a stolen melody"
"Trust me guys it's art"
>>53059723
Well I was just making an analogy but okay we can go that route. Honestly, evil dead is one of the first highly successful independent films and it should be studied, of course not for any value of its writing, but as a film that does a lot stylistically with very little capital investment.
Anyways I reiterate I don't think your opinion on hiphop has any grounding whatsoever and if you really think there is no good hiphop you either have not tried to listen to that much or you just don't want to like it for whatever reasons you have, and at that point I don't know what you're trying to get out of this.
>>53059793
>>"Trust me guys it's art"
pls tell me who you are quoting
>>53059794
>Honestly, evil dead is one of the first highly successful independent films and it should be studied, of course not for any value of its writing, but as a film that does a lot stylistically with very little capital investment.
I think that's a bad reason to study an entire film because there are lots of interesting independent films that do a lot with a little, but of course did not get the kind of cult following.
Also we didn't even analyze it. She just showed it when some kid brought it in and she went "Yeah I liked that. OK next movie"
that's why I freaked out, she had just given up on us because the majority of our class and my major literally had no interest in actual filmmaking.
One of the saddest moments of my college experience was walking past this one classroom- the class had 3 walls which were completely glass, so you could see into the class walking by it on campus. The professor was showing Late Spring, one of the top favorite films of all time, a film that is important for its technique, unique artistry and complex emotional themes and impact. And I watched as most of the students just texted or browsed the internet on their phones. A few were asleep. I couldn't find a single student who was really paying attention.
Here comes the saddest part. I actually went into the building and stood outside the class and waited for the movie to end. When the students came out I looked to see if any of them were crying or thinking or talking about the movie. All of them were on their phones or bullshitting about other shit like parties.
Sorry for the rant, when you brought up the "cinema literacy" thing I just thought of how terrible my school was.
Think about how much cringe enducing shit happened during Punk
Now think about this punk atleast had a positive angle involved in it with politics
It based its whole self around political ideals
Now think about rap. It based its whole self around being a cool person and killing people to prove you are cool guy to other cool guys
Imagine the cringe our kids are gonna have when they look back on this bullshit
It's not even socially acceptable to me at this point
How did this trash ever take off and why did I ever listen to this mess
>>53059840
>How did this trash ever take off
>It based its whole self around political ideals
:) anything else?
>>53059840
Punk is mostly bad too but at least it has some primal emotions in it.
But god damn, people who define themselves as "punk" nowadays....yuck.
>>53059840
i can't believe people like you. everything you said, you pulled out your ass. just absolute fucking waste. why not actually read up on the things you try to discuss, it might be more fun for you as well.
>>53059723
> rap has gone almost nowhere in 40 years
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSdGjY_T0MQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9imvF9ZQtlY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xb-inYzfO4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16ghTB4UFUw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWgU5vpUOTI
these all sound embarrassingly similar for sure
I used to listen to rap, WHEN IT WAS GOOD. Beats, hell even the raps themselves, are pretty terrible compared to the golden age of rap.
As for country I don't mind if it's being played somewhere. Better than Autismstep any day.
>>53059837
Well I do agree Late Spring is great, but I also prefer Tokyo Story. One of my favorite movies is Crumb. I legitimately think it's the most intimate documentary ever made and it is married so beautifully with the soundtrack that I view it as a perfect film. However, plenty of people look at the film and go "Robert Crumb is an asshole! This movie is terrible". I don't think there's any legitimacy to that logic jump. Yes, Robert Crumb does seem like a jerk, but that in no way makes its a bad film, im fact I think it makes it better. Why this man is aggressively vulgar in his work and distant with most of his family is extremely interesting to me, its a tragic story of the flawed psyche.
That being said, you might be able to see how I could look at some more sobering gangster rap and see beyond the drug slinging and the guise and view it as a compelling life story of a flawed human being. Of course this isn't always the case, some rappers never let down the guise and show the hearrt, but it is there and I don't think it's fair to say no rapper has ever said anything worth considering. Currently I'm thinking about Piñata (an album with great production) and really one of my favorite albums of 2014. I don't thing Gibbs is a good person, but the album tells the story of why he isn't, and he shows deep into his own psyche.
All I'm saying is Crumb is the gangster rap of movies.
>>53059883
There is nothing structurally or compositionally different between Kurtis Blow or Grandmaster Flash and Kanye West or Eminem except the technology has updated for stealing samples.
It's fine for specific genres like crunkcore or something, but saying you plain don't like all country or all rap is most likely wrong. There's such an insane amount of styles and subgenres, that it's likely there's something in there you'd at least appreciate, assuming you had reasonable taste.
>>53059922
but i dont like any of those artists and i wasn't talking about them and music isn't structure it's sounds you idiot.
>>53059922
did you even listen to those samples? None of those songs have the same structure (besides the 2 with verse/chorus/verse but those have completely different textures, tones, instruments and vocal performances).
>>53059922
Well your big problem is assuming a major pop rap artist like eminem is trying to innovate. Also I don't think that's true at all and if I was going by your logic the same could be same about any genre over the same amount of time.
>>53059933
>>53059883
listen to each song
same shit
repetitive samples
dumb lyrics rapped with minimal and distant emotions
now compare AC/DC to say, Radiohead or GS!YBE and see how rock has evolved into much different structures and deeper, more emotional lyrics.
Most people who say they don't like country or rap usually know fuckall about country or rap.
>>53059916
>That being said, you might be able to see how I could look at some more sobering gangster rap and see beyond the drug slinging and the guise and view it as a compelling life story of a flawed human being.
I would if those same rappers didn't turn around and make cash off that image. Like Jay-Z.
>>53059959
>he can't into repitition
>he doesn't have pop sensibilities
haha i feel so weird being on /mu/ because people here don't appreciate pop music
also, Radiohead and Godspeed are both below average bands, get better taste and/or examples.
>>53059959
But radiohead and ac/dc are argueably inseperate genres and certainly in seperate sub genres, for some reason abstract hip-hop and art rap haven't been even remotely brought up in this discussion.
>>53059979
>radiohead and ac/dc
rock
> abstract hip-hop and art rap
hip hop
also
>art rap
kek
>>53059622
There you go, fag, now have the decency todo shut the fuck up.
http://youtu.be/XbU9UUwxBxA
>>53059975
>don't appreciate pop music
I do appreciate "pop" music if it's good music with emotion, intelligence and/or interesting composition. I don't know why you keep harping on pop when we're discussing rap though.
>>53059959
>Radiohead or GS!YBE
>much different structures and deeper, more emotional lyrics
>>53059979
>inseperate genres and certainly in seperate sub genres
my point is rock evolved into these genres because of shit like 10 minute guitar solos and bands like The Doors and The Stooges and David Bowie stretched out and opened what "rock" could be.
With rap it just becomes "trap" or "southern rap" or "West Coast rap". It's the same shit in different flavors.
>>53059975
>he can't into repitition
So you are agreeing its all the same
>he doesn't have pop sensibilities
>people here don't appreciate pop music
hip hop and rock are both pop
>Radiohead and Godspeed are both below average bands
Irrelevant
Now try again and actually show hip hop has changed in 40 years from an MC and a beat to err, an MC and a beat.
>>53059723
What exactly would you classify as a "challenging" film?
>>53059965
Well the funny thing about Freddie Gibbs and Jay-Z is that Freddie Gibbs isn't the same rapper as Jay-Z
And for anyone who doesn't think there's any variation is rap ever, which I didn't even know was an opinion beyond low quality bait until now, I implore you to listen to this.
http://youtu.be/zx_BfRa3Vko
>>53060001
hokie song
>>53060019
Sayat Nova
Pretty sure hip hop is the worst genre that ever existed
>stolen melodys
>the beats they didn't steal are shit
>shit lyrics about being cool
>shit vocals with no melody
>responsible for the death of probably hundreds of thousands of impressionable people at this point
>responsible for the imprisonment of probably hundreds of thousands of impressionable people at this point
it's poisonous, the music, the culture everything. It's shit and people are gonna look back on it and laugh cry and cringe
Hell I'm cringing at it already
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=trDFi_zSttQ
Lmao embarassing
>>53060038
That's hilarious.
>>53059723
You are an idiot. Compare the difference in sound and progression from Public Enemy & N.W.A. to Shabazz Palaces & Death Grips. Actually study a genre before judging it.
Just out of curiosity, what does everyone ITT think of this?
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7H43ZE8_v5I
The real joke here is the rock fags think no one in rock has ever stolen a melody or that some of their favorite songs don't have stolen progressions.
>>53060038
lol wow film students sure are plebs
>>53060063
>Public Enemy & N.W.A.
rappers and a beat
>Shabazz Palaces & Death Grips
rappers and a beat
Your point?
>>53060063
And what is the best the genre has to offer is my fucking point. Not "ooh it sounds kind of different?"
I like death grips but they're workout music tier. They have retarded, shallow lyrics just like every other rap song. They mostly have the same type of structure as other rap songs.
Rap is limited.
>>53060065
I mean I already shared a song off Alopecia itt and they all ignored it, but hey glad someone else likes Yoni Wolf projects.
>>53060073
I'm not a film student and if you don't think Sayat Nova is challenging you're either a liar or an Armenian kid who grew up 50 years ago.
>comparing every rock subgenre to just one hip hop subgenre
lel, cherry picking much rocktards
>>53059889
>Autismstep
Huh?
>>53060065
This is neckbeards rap
>>53060092
get some taste, nerd. you've already cemented your pleb status.
>>53060118
OK dude, have fun googling the rest of Parajanov's films.
>>53060138
are you joking? parajanov is entry level as fuck. i bet you also think klimov is challenging
I'm really proud of you guys. We managed to get over 80 poss while still maintaining some level of civil debate before completely devolving into name calling and accusing each other of being plebs. That must be a /mu/ record.
>>53060074
>>53060074
ahahaha people actually believe this. music is way beyond the sum of its parts. idiots.
>>53060155
>parajanov is entry level as fuck
to who? on what planet? I can guarantee you 95% of "film fans" have never heard of him or any of his movies. You're being a smarmy, trollish retard.
>>53060159
Good meme, buddy.
>>53060074
>The Roots
>>53060166
There's that charm.
How many people has hip hop killed?
How many lives have been ruined by hip hop and hip hop culture lol
It's a disaster
>>53060164
ok friend, you just keep believing that :^)
>>53060162
> music is way beyond the sum of its parts
Just not structurally, compositionally, musically, sonically or anything else in hip hops case.
>>53060191
None? You know those people who have died did more than just record songs, right?
>>53060164
/tv/ here, guaranteed 50% of that pleb board knows who he is
>>53060192
good retort dude
now off to bed! You don't want to miss the bus tomorrow morning and be late for school again.
>>53060164
He's a pretty famous Soviet director. Film fans not hearing of him is probably more attributed to their ignorance rather than his obscurity.
>>53060200
what, hip hop has completely morphed sonically since its advent. show me a genre that sounds more futuristic and yet in touch with society. it's the ultimate musical indicator of our times.
>>53060210
>guaranteed 50% of that pleb board
You're being generous. Most likely most of them have heard his name in passing or seen it on some chart somewhere but never saw his films. Also this started as a discussion about challenging films, not "obscure" films anyway. If you think Sayat Nova isn't challenging, that means you understand the completely unique visual tableau style, the abstractions and lack of dialogue, the many obscure references to Georgian culture and folklore, which none of your do.
And btw I said "film fans" not "pedophiles"
>>53060215
there is nothing to counter in your reply. you threw out an imaginary statistic because some of your friends haven't heard of a certain director.
>>53060233
see
>>53059922
The only thing thats changed is the technology improved, which wasn't their doing.
>>53060229
>Film fans not hearing of him is probably more attributed to their ignorance rather than his obscurity.
Most people are ignorant. The average person has no idea who Godard is. Maybe Kurosawa. Most people do not care about film, and most "film fans" are people obsessed with Tarantino or PTA or something.
And in any case, obscurity has nothing to do with how challenging something is.
>>53060206
Hip culture and romanticising of "gangster culture" on a mainstream level has killed a lot of people and led a lot of people down dumb ass paths
Rap is cancer, how did black people go from jazz and blues to rap?
>>53060258
This is why /tv/ laughs at you
>>53060258
I never said obscurity has something to do with how challenging it is. You're the one who brought up obscurity.
>I can guarantee you 95% of film fans have never heard of him or any of his movies
>>53060246
>you threw out an imaginary statistic
You've been doing the same thing before me. You asked me opinion and ANY film I would have replied with, including a made up film, would have garnered the same reply from you because you were never interested in a discussion, just "HAHA U PLEB I AM BETTER AT MOVIES THAN YOU".
>>53060258
Tell me how Inherent Vice isnt challenging
>>53060117
If someone cut off your face and used it to make a burrito, that would be a neckbeard wrap.
>>53060251
see it doesn't matter who improved what, what matters is the sound and it sounds completely different. if you hear a rapper over a beat, i hear the intricate and well produced details within the beat and the idiosyncracies of the rapper. i'm not trying to convince you of anything, but you're really helping me see why i like rap so much.
>>53060275
/tv/ can barely hold an actual discussion about a mainstream film together, much less anything deeper.
>>53060277
because you called him "entry level" implying he is some super famous easy to watch director that most people just breeze through, when most people don't even watch his films. And when they do, I'm sure most people find it challenging.
>>53060289
I never saw it. Stopped watching PTA films a while ago. He doesn't appeal to me.
I think you also missed the point in me mentioning PTA.
>>53060261
Implying something like let's say neo nazi punk has never killed anyone by your logic. The culture has nothing to do with it, we're talking about the music dude. Also I find your comment about "black people going from jazz and blues to rap" racially ignorant.
>>53060322
I think the master is his best movie and it's also his most critically panned so by your previous logic you might enjoy it.
>>53060339
Rap has killed far more
Considering one of the main themes of rap music is killing people and how cool it is
>>53060309
For what he represents, he is entry level. Have you even seen any of his other films? Then you just make a bunch of assumptions I can't respond to.
>>53060382
You're just generalizing at this point.
/tv/ is the worst art board on 4chan by far
literally you browse the whole catalog and if you're really lucky you'll find a single thread discussing a good movie
The rest of it is super hero films and pedofile threads
This isn't an exogeration btw. There's better film discussion on facebook
>>53060382
Well if you're going off the CULTURE of neo nazism in punk it's rooted in nazism and, buddy, I'm gonna break this down for you; no, there is not a holocaust level of people being killed as senselessly and as systematically in gangster rap culture.
Way to go, don't know how you did it, but this thread wound up being about the Holocaust, you should get a medal.
>>53060439
It's not like this board is that much better. /mu/ is only salvaged by the sharethreads.
>>53060414
Um no
Even the softest rappers have glorified killing people. Drake has referenced killing people. Tyler the creator has referenced killing people. I'm sure childish gambino has a line somewhere about killing people. Every single rapper has glorified killing people to be cool at least once and the majority base their whole career around the subject
Killing people
Robbing people
Getting money
Fucking bitches
Rap music and hip hop culture set the black community back 30 years and ruined hundreds of thousands of lives
>>53060444
This.
>>53060400
>For what he represents, he is entry level.
What the fuck is that supposed to mean man? There is no place on earth, even in Georgia, where is films are not challenging in some way. His visual language is completely unique by Sayat Nova and his films following his prison release can be just as disorienting.
Sorry, but if you don't find these "challenging" that would mean you're saying you can absorb and understand everything he is trying to convey throughout each film in each frame and abstract expression and obscure reference he puts in his films. You can't, unless you're a fucking Georgian historian of folklore, and then that still wouldn't explain away his visual style. Someone who is challenging is someone who does something unique and new structurely and someone who deviates from norms of the medium. He does all these things. Just because you heard of him does not make him less challenging.
You know who else is challenging? Godard. Bresson. Tarkovsky. Brakhage. All very well known directors who made complex films.
I think you mistook a discussion about film and learning to appreciate it with an 8th grade pissing match. Maybe you should spend more time appreciating film and it's complexities instead of bragging about your lettrbox diary on /tv/
>>53060444
Diffrence is Neo nazi punk was never popular it was a small little niche genre that was heavily looked down upon
Gangsta rap was the biggest thing in America at a time and it's probably largely responsible for African Americans ridiculously high crime rate
>>53060479
Again, you're just generalizing. There are a ton of rappers who have never referenced killing people. You're just being ignorant and judging a whole genre of music by cherry picking the most popular artists. I don't know why I'm even replying to this bait, honestly.
>>53060479
Well I'm not an expert in "all rap music", and we already know you definitely aren't either, but even though I don't find it to be very good, tyler the creators "goblin" is a concept album. So when he's talking about raping someone in tron cat he doesn't necessarily condone rape he's telling a story. Sure, it's a bad story, but its a story and its not anything else. I'm sure the same is the case for many other rappers aswell.
But on top of ALL OF THIS I would say again, as I have numerous times in this thread, that's we're oversimplifying rap and hip hop into a very narrow ammount of subgenres, and I will ALSO REITERATE that your initial point was there is nothing artistic or innovative about any rap, yet you keep returning to a very narrow section of subgenres and have not considered or commented on numerous points to the contrary.
>>53060504
You and me both man. I don't think these guys are worth it, this is getting borderline autistic how circular the conversation is getting. Gonna go listen to some busdriver, y'know a rapper who doesn't condone killing people.
Later taters <3
>>53060504
>>53060561
Lmao yall r weird
>>53060492
I don't really understand all the hostility, honestly. You seem to be the one turning this into an "8th grade pissing match". There is nothing to say beyond, I disagree. If you genuinely think I like films so I can be a part of some subculture there is really no reason for me to continue this conversation.
>>53060590
>I don't really understand all the hostility, honestly. You seem to be the one turning this into an "8th grade pissing match".
>There is nothing to say beyond, I disagree.
You didn't say "I disagree". After I mentioned Sayat Nova ou said one of these two things:
>>53060049
>>53060073
That's where the "hostility" came from, you being a dick.
>>53060648
This was my first post in the thread
>>53060229
Even so, judging a film for how "challenging" it is is purely subjective so I don't really see a point in arguing it. I'm not trying to say it is a shallow film, because it's certainly not. I just don't necessarily agree with your criteria for a challenging film. No insults need to be thrown out (especially considering the opportunity to discuss something like this is rare) but I guess you apparently mistook me for someone else. All is well.
>>53059399
Nothing. But "I like everything except rap and country" is the problem. It means you think you have diverse musical taste because you have both Lana del Rey and Arctic Monkeys on your iPod.
>>53059576
How are they racist?
>>53059670
Have we been raided by fucking /b/?
>>53060044
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/3187496/posts
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/features/mind-the-bach-classical-music-on-the-underground-800483.html
People ignore indoctrination when they themselves are the subjects. I'm sure most people ITT acknowledge brainwashing in other facets of life such as the the news (FOX news vs. Daily Show), or religion, but are incapable or simply unwilling to recognize it when its directed at them. I'm not saying that rap is part of a government conspiracy, but you cant deny that it effects people who sometimes grow up listening to this shit.
Rap is the glorification of the ego, that's why it feels so good to listen to for those who want to fantasize about being some hard ass thug that gets money and fucks hoes.
>inb4 #notallrap
You can namedrop a couple of weird rappers (who usually just use the same rap structure while sampling some other genre of music that isn't normally sampled) but the fact of the matter is that 95% of the rap discussed here is the generic shit, and people proudly listen to and defend it. Rap is to /mu/ as Capeshit is to /tv/.
>>53059426
Morons believe this.
Look, kid, they're shallow and have produced a vile culture. You have no taste, don't pretend otherwise. In the 1980s, the murder rate skyrocketed, this is also the decade that hip hop became popular and distinct. Country, a genre lampooned for its support of alcoholism, has become especially popular in my area, alcohol-related deaths have skyrocketed.
>>53059448
Fuck off you faux-eclectic.
>>53059518
A song by definition must contain lyrics.
Stop talking out of your ass.
>>53059545
Pop sensibilities aren't a good thing, you shallow fuck.
You're not special for only enjoying music like the basic bitch you are, nobody here has the capacity to appreciate music.
You are bottom of the barrel trash.
>>53059608
How is discrediting trash childish? There is no interesting or artistic hip hop, stating there is doesn't make it so, your low standards and non-existent taste does not make you an authority.
>>53059675
>student
A teenager who likes childish music!
>>53059677
Oh look, another ignorant child.
Ignorant poptimists, you know nothing yet you pretend to be geniuses.
>It's very interesting and I love that it has influenced the mainstream so much.
Childish psychopath.
>>53059840
Punk has the worst politics.
>>53059975
There is nothing to appreciate in pop music.
>>53061940
I'm hoping this is bait. The murder rate skyrocketed in the 80s, therefore hip hop is to blame? Surely you realize that correlation does not imply causation. I also hope you realize that in the 80s popular hip hop was generally party music about dancing, not about killing people. How can you explain the crime rate dropping in the 90s, when gangsta rap was at its most popular? How do you explain that the crime rate is at its lowest since the sixties and hip hop is incredibly popular right now? This post is so full of idiocy, hatred and bile it's hard to even know where to start. It may be the stupidest thing I've seen on /mu/. Do you also believe that horror movies make people into serial killers?
There hasn't been a great country album in 30+ years
>>53062105
>anything that offends me is le maymay
Go rot, filthy apologist.
>Surely you realize that correlation does not imply causation.
Kiddies believe this.
>How do you explain that the crime rate is at its lowest since the sixties and hip hop is incredibly popular right now?
A lit fire eventually calms down.
African Americans are responsible for the majority of crime in the US, music that glorifies this behavior just made them worse.
But you will defend these subhumans because you were told to.
Why are children like you allowed to speak?
>>53059677
>It's very interesting and I love that it has influenced the mainstream so much.
Fucking why? Rap music is poison. I've hung out around enough wiggers to know this is the case.
>>53062105
Not the guy you were responding to but
>hatred and bile
OH NO!
>>53059399
I wonder if rap will ever go through the same cycle as jazz, from degenerate negro music to modern genre of choice for white"intellectuals"
>>53062259
Jazz is trash, though.
>>53059399
well something must be wrong about it,if you have to ask such a retarted question,am I right OP?
>>53062289
I didn't say I wasn't, though I do disagree.
I like how all the white American boys defend hip hop because of p4k/fantano/white guilt but no one defends country at all.
What can you expect from a genre made by people in the 2 digit IQ range. You can argue that blacks have low IQ's because of racism or the drug war (and you would be wrong), but that doesn't change the fact that as of right now, the average black IQ is 85. You are listening to music made for, and by, people who used to classify as mentally retarded.
>The threshold I.Q. level for a diagnosis of mental retardation has been progressively lowered over the years, in part because of awareness of the damaging social prejudice suffered by those labeled "retarded." In 1959, the American Association on Mental Deficiency set 85 as the I.Q. below which a person was considered to be retarded.14 In 1992, the renamed American Association on Mental Retardation lowered the mental retardation "ceiling" to an I.Q. of 70-75,15 but many mental health specialists argue that people with I.Q.s of up to 80 may also have mental retardation.
>>53062339
because country is shit and all songs sound the same, hip hop has at least subgenres and shit like that
>>53062357
this is why I never go to pol, because I'm afraid facts might turn me racist.
>>53062368
(not true by the way)
>Country subgenres
Bakersfield sound - Bluegrass - Close harmony - Honky tonk - Jug band - Progressive country - Lubbock sound - Nashville sound - Neotraditional country - Outlaw country - Red Dirt - Western swing - Texas country/Tejano
Plus of course you could pretend origin is a genre too so Southern country, Northern country, West coast, East coast etc
>>53062406
is that shit real?
>honky tonk
kek
>not listening to lubecock sound
>>53059399
>Surely you realize that correlation does not imply causation.
>Kiddies believe this.
It's a generally accepted fact you intellectually dishonest dunce.
>>53062431
Thats the short version
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_country_genres
>>53062357
Wasn't the average IQ around 70 in 1900? Was everyone retarded back then?
Rap is for smelly niggers and cucks.
>>53062164
I want /pol/ to leave.
>>53062465
>its true because my teacher sed so
Anti-intellectual trash.
>>53062500
The test has changed, the average then is the same as the average now.
>>53062551
>m-muh feels stop triggering me boogerman
>>53062500
I assume you are talking about the Flynn effect.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect#Proposed_explanations
>Some studies have found the gains of the Flynn effect to be particularly concentrated at the lower end of the distribution. Teasdale and Owen (1989), for example, found the effect primarily reduced the number of low-end scores, resulting in an increased number of moderately high scores, with no increase in very high scores.[9] In another study, two large samples of Spanish children were assessed with a 30-year gap. Comparison of the IQ distributions indicated that the mean IQ-scores on the test had increased by 9.7 points (the Flynn effect), the gains were concentrated in the lower half of the distribution and negligible in the top half, and the gains gradually decreased as the IQ of the individuals increased.[10] Some studies have found a reverse Flynn effect with declining scores for those with high IQ.[11]
So the dumbest of society have gotten smarter, but everyone else is about the same.
Also, note the distinction between familial and clinical retardation.
>Familial retardation is usually not detected until a child enters school and has academic difficulties, at which point the teacher recommends psychological evaluation. Unlike the parents of clinically retarded children, who generally seek out help for their youngsters, the parents of those with familial retardation may take offense when their children are labeled mentally retarded and deny that there is a problem, especially since their children are often able to function competently in their daily lives outside school.
>>53062392
Don't let the facts affect your ability to discern people at the individual level. Then you shouldn't have a problem
