Recommendations
>Fantasy
Selected: http://i.imgur.com/r688cPe.jpg/
General: http://i.imgur.com/igBYngL.jpg/
Flowchart: http://i.imgur.com/uykqKJn.jpg/
>Sci-Fi
Selected: http://i.imgur.com/A96mTQX.jpg/
General: http://i.imgur.com/r55ODlL.jpg/ / http://i.imgur.com/gNTrDmc.jpg/
Previous: >>8187738
Today I will remind then.
15 and/or 21 days until The Great Ordeal
>tfw there are turboplebs in this thread that read anything newer than Orlando Furioso
Reactionary / regressive fantasy?
>>8192747
Iron Chamber of Memory.
The Duke of Uranium (sf).
And... I can't think of anything else but Chesterton, and I actually am a reactionary/regressive.
>>8192694
sweet image
>>8192747
Derogatory terms for tradition. Fairy tales and phantasies, tales informed by myth and not the petty political bickering or the quasi-intellectual masturbation of the day is what you are after. The reactionary/regressive label only exists in the minds of progressives.
>>8192791
It's a pretty nice thumbnail.
>>8192747
The Once and Future King.
Although I'm not particularly a fan of the "reactionary" label.
>>8192839
OaFK very much is a vehicle for T.H. White's own pacifistic ideals. While it is reactionary in the love it shows to knights being good knights, and a wonderful treatment of the Arthur legend all around, I wouldn't call it a reactionary story in itself.
I'm a huge Moorcock fan, but I don't understand him, he declared himself an anarchist when it was incredibly popular to do so but never advanced his political character, he seems obsessed with belittling Tolkien because of his mild conservatism and claims his Elric novels advocate left-anarchism...
But they don't, If I hadn't of read his essays I would have thought the guy a social darwinist.
Is the guy just projecting his neo-fascism onto other authors?
I must kek.
I told these faggets that red knight was bad. Just because they disliked my chart they thought I had bad tastes. They vowed to drop their current books the next dayand pursue the red knight... two of them dropped red knight already.
I'm awaiting my apologies from you fucking dinosaurs.
On that note finish the red knightthe part with the dragon was more interesting than the entire book
2/10 would not read again or recommend.
>>8192947
I mean, I didn't bother with Red Knight, and I still don't like roughly a third of your chart, so...
>>8192800
Somebody hasn't heard of those rightwing neckbeards who call themselves neoreactionaries.
>>8192924
Moorcock claimed he met both Tolkien and Lewis in his teens and liked them both as people. He just personally found Tolkien's writing boring and resented that people were obsessed with rehashing it over and over again. He also included Lord of the Rings in "Fantasy: The 100 Best Books," which he co-wrote, and he didn't shit on it there.
As for his anarchism, I believe that Elric, given how it ends, may be a critique of power to some extent. Consider that Elric's power, even if he ultimately believed he was using it for good, caused him to do horribly evil things and destroyed his soul (figuratively and then literally).
>>8192882
>While it is reactionary in the love it shows to knights being good knights
It's also reactionary in the love it shows to traditionalist sports like falconry, duelling and equestrianism.
>>8192800
That's what I mean. I started reading fantasy recently, picked up GRRM and Sanderson just to have a modern reference point, but then read Tolkien and Le Guin and liked them a lot better for their sparseness and similarity to folk tales and myths. I was just wondering if anyone else still wrote in that style, rather than as a modernist.
>>8193061
LeGuin is an anarchist, though. Pretty sure she'd object to being called reactionary. Though if you want work more based in myth and fairytale, you could have just said that without using terms that people generally interpret as political.
The "flowchart" image under Fantasy in the OP has two things that are listed as fairytale:
>Wicked, by Gregory Maguire
>Daughter of the Forest, by Juliet Marillier
It also has several entries for "classic fantasy" including A Wizard of Earthsea and these:
>The Tower of the Elephant, by Robert E. Howard
>Lud-in-the-Mist, by Hope Mirlees
What are your opinions about invented species or original magic system like Sanderson's?
>>8193088
they're fun
inb4 dinosaurs start talking about how magic should be "numinous" and "wild"
>>8193088
Both of those things are fine in principle, though /sffg/ doesn't tend to think Sanderson does it very well.
>>8193088
That's how you're supposed to do it. Sanderson has a lot of problems as an author but he always paints a novel picture in terms of setting, so even a mediocre story from him can be interesting. There's no excuse for using elves and dwarves and Medieval England pastiches these days except laziness.
>>8193085
I see. I don't really care about the author's politics as much as the writing style. As a protagonist Ged seems believable as a mythical figure, for example, whose skeleton of a psychological profile isn't fleshed out by moment-to-moment television-like reports of his activities and introspections. The latter I associate with modernism in literature generally, which feels bloated and self-indulgent to my tastes. In that sense, especially after reading GRRM and Sanderson, Le Guin's writing style struck me as very conservative and 'old-fashioned,' which I like because I like to read myths.
So that's what I meant. Anyways, thanks.
>>8193103
Those things aren't mutually exclusive. You can create your own magic system, explain it in broad strokes but leave it largely mysterious. And I don't understand what that opinion has to do with old vs. new books, at least not inherently.
>>8193088
I like Sanderson's superpower systems, but unless you're dealing with secrets man was not meant to know/summoning demons or fairies as servants/making an offering of some strange substance to some powerful being, or something of that nature, it's not really magic, is it? I mean, where are the dribbly candles on skulls in the Steel Inquisitors' chambers, where are the ancient grimoires to be laboriously perused in Stormlight Archives' palindrome cities?
It's a shame, too, doing magic through spren could have been an awe-inspiring process. But if you can systematize your magic and build airships, all you've done is discover another natural law.
>>8193117
Do me a favor? Read Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser and let me know what you think? It does a great job of making you care for characters without feeding you their thoughts in real-time.
>>8193103
Even Sanderson has said there's a place for magic that's mysterious and poorly understood; he just thinks it's unwise to use magic the audience doesn't understand as a problem-solver because then it's deus ex machina.
>>8193119
>>8193103
>>8193105
>>8193114
Thanks. I have invented species in whatever I'm writing. From what I'm getting, the more mysterious the power is, the better. I had to show the limitations of what I had invented at the start, though, and I dunno if it breaks the consensus ... I just hope it doesn't turn cringey when a beta/alpha reader reads it.
>>8193088
They grow boring incredibly quick.
It's like reading the Martian, masturbation material for nerds, instead of "I'm going to science this shit up!" it becomes "I'm going to have to use my superior intelligence and wit to out-logic this jock!".
>>8193151
Whatever you think of Sanderson, I think he's right here:
http://brandonsanderson.com/sandersons-first-law/
>Sanderson’s First Law of Magics: An author’s ability to solve conflict with magic is DIRECTLY PROPORTIONAL to how well the reader understands said magic.
So basically, don't have the heroes get out of trouble using magic if it's all mysterious and the audience doesn't understand it. Because then you're just hand-waving and "then everything got better, the end." It's fine to have mysterious powers, but they can't be the solution to your characters' problems.
At the opposite end, you can explain your magic so that it's a clear part of the plot where all parties, including the heroes, can use it in ways that advance their goals.
And there's a range in between, but just remember that the less you explain your magic's capabilities, the less your characters should be able to conveniently use it to get out of trouble.
>>8193147
Not necessarily. Prophecy as a plot device is a form of magic. No one might understand how it works, only that it does, but the reader expects the fulfillment will match the words of the prophecy but not the expectations of the characters.
>>8193151
Invented life is great, I don't see what it has to do with invented physics.
>>8193178
>Not necessarily. Prophecy as a plot device is a form of magic. No one might understand how it works, only that it does, but the reader expects the fulfillment will match the words of the prophecy but not the expectations of the characters.
Sure, that's true. Generally, though, the prophecy predicts something that will happen; other events actually CAUSE it to happen, and those are mostly understood.
>>8193151
Mysterious is generally better for magic, but there's a place for Sanderson's systemic style too. I think you should always know what your magic can do even if the characters don't. My own story uses magic based around probability, but to the viewpoint character, a layman, it's just "holy shit did she just shoot someone from halfway across the planet" until the story needs someone to explain any of it to him.
Basically, depict magic and world-building however you want, but remember >>8193161. As one book I read put it, when you're an author your job is harder than god's. God can get away with shit happening for no reason - you can't. Don't cheat your audience.
What are some of the best sci-fi book series that make use to some extent of psychic/psionic powers?
>>8193185
I can see that. Still, there's a place in storytelling for a terror of the unknown. I see in Sanderson an author who has grown up in a world where everything that is not known can one day be known. There actually isn't a lot of cosmic horror in Mormonism, the idea is that we're being shepherded by a loving God and we can only fail if we really want to.Not saying there's no potential for cosmic horror, Joseph Smith once told church leaders " If I were to rell you all I know of the kingdom of God, I do know that you would rise up and kill me." That's a good story hook.
That said, he seems to have a place for the numinous in Way of Kings with that strange god that grants twisted wishes and stole the guy's memory of his wife. I hope he leaves a lot of mystery in, and doesn't wrap it all up tidily in the Cosmere.
>>8193200
City of Illusion, by Le Guin. She hated it because it had a clear antagonist, but it's my absolute favorite of her books. The idea is that humans in the future gain telepathic ability, but that you can't lie with telepathy. Until a group of humanoid aliens show up that can, and very quickly crash the entire League of All Worlds. The story's about a golden-eyed man crossing a post-apocalypse US trying to learn the truth about himself. Very cool Taoist philosophy all through, I'd say it's a more effective declaration of faith than Dispossessed.
>>8193225
>Still, there's a place in storytelling for a terror of the unknown.
I agree entirely, and actually tend to prefer what Sanderson calls "soft" magic, where it's barely explained at all. I just agree with him that, in that case, it shouldn't be used as a handy problem-solver.
>>8192961
That's fine, i don't like some of your books either. Just remember that we can't all like the same things. Stop shiting on my list, I'll take you out to dinner and we can be friends.
If I say something is shit, don't gleefully jump on it to "show up" the chart anon, because you just might get burned.
>>8193128
Sure! I'll pick up one of the stories. It might take me a while but I'll try to hang around these threads.
>>8193452
Publication order of stories is probably better than in-universe chronological order for your first time reading them. I started in chronological order, but reading Fafhrd's back story without already knowing and caring about the character was a struggle.
>>8192320
Not the shill, and no you didn't miss anything.
>tfw no human girl offering all her holes in exchange for your soul
Why live? Just fuck my shit up.
>>8193459
>he doesn't read in publication order
How noob are you?
Do you cook a chicken and call it an omelette?
>>8193479
>Do you cook a chicken and call it an omelette?
Depends on if it was still in an egg, and if so, how I prepared it.
>>8192717
REMOVE DUNYAIN
What happened to the thread?
>>8193551
REMOVE SRANC remove sranc.
you are worst tekne. you are the sranc abomination you are the sranc smell. return to agongorea. to our kyranean cousins you may come our false men mansion. you may live in the mediel screw….ahahahaha ,golgoterath we will never forgeve you. rascal FUck but fuck asshole sranc stink bashrag sqhipere shqipare..sranc genocide best day of my life. take a bath of dead sranc..ahahahahahINCHOROI WE WILL GET YOU!! do not forget apocalypse .cil-aujas we kill the king , nonmen return to your precious mansions….hahahahaha idiot sranc and nonmen smell so bad..wow i can smell it. REMOVE SRANC FROM THE PREMISES. you will get caught. Kunuiri+Aorsi+Eamnor+Meori+Kyraneas=kill consult…you will ordeal, seswatha alive in meori, seswatha making mandate of meori.. . fast gnosis seswatha meori. we are in mansion and have nimil now hahahaha ha because of gin'yursis… you are evil stink sranc… you live in a arc hahahaha, you live in a horn
seswatha alive numbr one #1 in meori….fuck the kuniuri ,..FUCKk ashol srancs no good i spit in the mouth eye of ur arc and no-god. seswatha aliv and real strong wizard kill all the sranc farm aminal with gnosis magic now we the meori rule . leader of the mangaecca shauriatus fukc the inchoroi and lay egg this egg hatch and no-god wa;s born. stupid baby form the eggn give bak our clay we will crush u lik a skull of sranc. meori greattst nation
>>8193694
Sometimes it just goes quiet. Maybe people are actually reading. There's no need to post useless shit like "what happened to the thread" if there's nothing to say.
>>8193551
We need more of these desu. Anybody with skills wanna make a Conan one? Something like:
"Barbarism Ain't free. The fields of Aquiolonia gotta be litterd with the blood of soft civilized men. Set aka "THE CHAOS SERPENT" is not my god.he is an evil demon and probably eats virgins as well :DD. SWORDS and savagery not snakes and WIZARDRY ok. by crom
>>8193757
Here's a Severian one.
>>8193763
I liked this one a lot better.
Anything similar in setting/style to Dishonored? I hear it's got a couple prequel books coming out due to the second game but we all know how good video game novels are.
>>8193795
I haven't read them but I know China Mieville's Bas-Lag books are set in a pseudo-Victorian secondary world.
The malazan book is trying to brainwash me into believing the ideology implanted in the words
>>8193973
Which ideology might that be?
>>8193974
SJW-leftist-liberal-culturalmarxist-BBCist-cuckism
I don't know yet but I will find out
>>8193978
Not nationalistic-patriotic-racist-militarism?
>>8193978
So tell us then, what do you think the world ought to be like?
>>8193551
My fucking sides
>>8193987
Whichever ideology guarantees me a multicultural harem and psychedelic drugs on the reg.
>>8193978
>>8193973
>an incensed reader wrote to say, 'Dear Comrade, we don't want to hear about these bourgeois writers like Shakespeare. Can't you give us something a bit more proletarian?' etc., etc. The editor's reply was simple. 'If you will turn to the index of Marx's Capital,' he wrote, 'you will find that Shakespeare is mentioned several times.' And please notice that this was enough to silence the objector. Once Shakespeare had received the benediction of Marx, he became respectable.
>>8192747
Gene Wolfe and Chesterton all around.
>>8192947
Your taste is complete garbage.
Your reasons for disliking Red Knight are supremely dumb.
It's a bad book, but you can't tell gold from coal.
Wow, Rand just got kidnapped in broad daylight, in the middle of his own palace filled to the brim with guards.
He might just be the most retarded protagonist in all of fantasy.
>NO GOOD WITCHES, I DON'T WANT YOUR HELP. HERE LET ME TELEPORT TO WHERE THE EVIL WITCHES ARE, THEY WOULD NEVER BAMBOOZLE AND CAPTURE ME!
>>8194330
Don't bully the mentally ill
>>8194330
Why do people put themselves through it, just read the wiki.
>>8194330
that's kinda the point, it's not the like the narrative is trying to say what he did was smart
I'm so fucking sick of reading about the "swarthy hordes" and "dark-skinned monsters." Seriously why can't white people just leave us alone.
Please recommend me some black fantasy books with a black perspective preferably written by a non-white (black preferred)
>>8194390
No. Submit to the supreme white cock or fuck off, scum.
>>8194390
You can try Delany, I guess.
>>8194390
Try N.K."Ess Jay double you"Jemisin
>>8194424
There's not a lot of "good" sff to begin with.
Let alone good black fantasy by a black that reaffirms my political views
>>8194390
>Seriously why can't white people just leave us alone.
Why couldn't the Ottomans or Mongols leave us alone? Who knows.
Black people are provably more evil anyway, statistically speaking. There's a reason the Irish and the Japanese used to be Black.
I need my Lovecraft fix, running out of Laird Barron books.
>stop liking what I don't like
>>8194390
Dark skin includes Indians, Arabs, Blacks and just about everything else that isn't European. Dark is also seen as bad since forever, as light is day and dark is night, the symbolism stuck since the Egyptian myth.
There are also barbarians often as dark skinned hordes, don't see why I'd get triggered by that.
>>8194390
B L A C K
L I V E S
M A T T E R
Right, so I've relatively recently got back into reading fiction. Read loads of YA tripe when I was a wee kiddy and obviously read LotR when I got a bit older.
My most recent series has been the Mistborn trilogy which makes even a newbie like me cringe sometimes at bad lines and inconsistent language. Nevertheless it's been a fun return.
Lurked here for a while and so I've bought Dune, some Gene Wolfe and the apparently better Sanderson series Way of Kings.
Can I get some recommendations for actual, grown-up fantasy? Maybe something about a traveller in a cynical fantasy world (i.e. not an epic with the world at stake - something more grounded). I also don't particularly like the idea of magic being the boring, played out, fire and wizards and shit that it is in every other fantasy world. Mistborn seems to do that well if little else.
While I'm at it, some space naval warfare would be cool too.
>>8194655
>Can I get some recommendations for actual, grown-up fantasy?
Gormenghast
>>8194671
>Erikson middle tier
Malazan is the greatest fantasy series ever written
>>8194671
Sup shill
>>8194655
>While I'm at it, some space naval warfare would be cool too.
Jack Campbell's The Lost Fleet series did that fairly well I thought, but it got a bit repetitive after a few books.
>>8194681
I agree that he shouldn't be middle tier. Maybe stuck in a weird undecidable area between middle and high-tier instead. While I love Erikson, I have to be reasonable (and so should you); Malazan isn't the greatest ever written. It trumps many, but let's be honest, and admit that Eriskon's prose is stilted and try-hard. His also seems to be unable to exploit his character's potential to come to life. They seem flat, but that's purely because of his style. Which lacks, sometimes.
But fuck me, I wish someone could attempt to adapt him. Too bad the project is to massive to attempt.
Tolkien is reconized not because he was the 1st but blecause he was the 1st to deliver an action-packed well-written fantasy series.
>>8194671
Few more to add to my list. Thanks.
But with Moorcock, how I approach his works? Seems like Elric is the more famous of them but I have no idea in what order to read them. Publishing order? Internal chronology? Skip the novellas? Focus on one series?
>>8194390
Charles R. Saunders is a pretty good black colored African American independent black writer of color.
>I managed very little sleep that night, and Losi came closer to killing me than Felurian ever had. She was a delightful partner, every bit as wonderful as Felurian had been.
>But how could that be? I hear you ask. How could any mortal woman compare with Felurian?
>It is easier to understand if you think of it in terms of music. Sometimes a man enjoys a symphony. Elsetimes he finds a jig more suited to his taste. The same holds true for lovemaking. One type is suited to the deep cushions of a twilight forest glade. Another comes quite naturally tangled in the sheets of narrow beds upstairs in inns. Each woman is like an instrument, waiting to be learned, loved, and finely played, to have at last her own true music made.
>Some might take offense at this way of seeing things, not understanding how a trouper views his music. They might think I degrade women. They might consider me callous, or boorish, or crude.
>But those people do not understand love, or music, or me.
![13413069_1148885555168949_7046970029175524512_n[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/rctPt7l.png "13413069_1148885555168949_7046970029175524512_n[1].png")
I highly recommend the Red Rising trilogy by Pierce brown.
It's a modern sci-fi series about a non interstellar but scientifically advanced human civilization with heavily roman renaissance type culture base on a strictly hierarchial social structure.
Pic related, fan art.
>>8194803
I remember reading this when I was 16 and thinking it was great writing.
>>8194803
I refuse to believe the person who wrote that isn't a virgin
>>8194808
I don't recommend anybody read this. The cringiest prose I have seen in a book in a long while.
So what the hell are Warrens in Malazan? Can anyone make them?
>Small private warren in a sack
>>8194826
Just the prose?
>>8194820
His wife probably has a boyfriend, if you know what I mean.
>>8194830
They are other realms. Mages can either enter them or draw power from them. You'll find out their origin later.
So, I've just finished the Dread Wyrm by Miles Cameron. The best thing I can say about it is that it feels very real - not in a historical sense (though it is that) but more that he conveys the impression of day-to-day life, it's joys and sorrows very well despite not actually being that focused on ordinary people. The bit characters who only get a few line feel like real people, and he's one of the few authors I've read who can convincingly write of the power religious faith had for near everyone in the premodern world.
On the other hand, the major characters lack depth, the plot seemed to meander a bit and everything eventually devolved into a lot of magic-flinging that possessed no dramatic satisfaction.
Anyone else read it and have thoughts on it?
>>8194808
>"I live for the dream that my children will be born free," she says. "That they will be what they like. That they will own the land their father gave them."
>"I live for you," I say sadly.
>Eo kisses my cheek. "Then you must live for more."
yeah nah
>>8194808
Universal Pictures is making a movie of this already, there's also rumors of a tv show.
>>8194786
Publish order is always the best. For everything, ever.
>>8194844
Is their reality just another warren?
>>8194853
The beginning is pretty cliche, but it gets better once the action starts.
It's the authors first book, they get more refined with each new installment.
>>8194845
Read it a while ago, I largely agree with that. He made a very 'real' world, but the story spluttered along at times and was in desperate need of an editor to cut some of the chafe.
>>8194865
Not the original anon, but I think so. Then again, I got up to book seven and haven't gotten any further.
>>8194867
While the numerous smaller characters getting brief point-of-views did annoy me, it did mean that when he has a big battle and wants to kill off a bunch of characters to emphasise that this is war, you have a genuine emotional connection to them and feel sad at their deaths.
And for every character that dies in a noble sacrifice to aid another, with some meaningful last words (likeFather Arnaud) there's another two (likeNell and John Crayford) who die in the middle of battle, some amidst a valiant but pointless last stand, some in a brief sentence that the character watching doesn't even have time to process.
>>8194882
I know right, I imagined him to be snot-nosed and pudgy faced manlet with a mischievous look.
>>8194895
"Murderous" is what I'd say. And he needs to have an actual wolf head. A dripping, untanned, rotting wolf head on his head. He probably has a collection, some of them are nicer and he brings them to formal occasions.
Just read Watchmen (I know, pleb, blah blah).
what are some good sff books with an ensemble cast of characters that have loads of depth within each of them?
>>8194895
>6'2" manlet
What a beautiful world the Golds made.
>>8192747
Aren't reactionary and regressive the opposite of eachother?
Confused senpai.
>>8194901
He should read Hyperion. Retards love Hyperion.
No, but seriously you'd love Hyperion.
>>8194390
Try Ash: A Secret History. Post-apocalyptic fantasy set in Africa. Also, let us know what you think if you don't mind.
>>8194903
Reading the book, I sometimes wonder why the carvers even bothered to add all that height.
Wouldn't it be more economically efficient if everyone we're of similar height? The golds could just have better muscles to keep the shitters down.
>>8194905
Are you calling me a retard?
>>8194922
>Golds putting substance over style
>ever
I just finished The Axe and the Throne, great book, but I do have a problem now. I have 3 books here right now and can't decide which one I should read next: Theft of Swords (Ryria Revelations), Furies of Calderon (Codex Alera) or The Dragon's Path (Coin and Dagger)
>>8194969
Not putting substance over style is what led them to the degeneracy described in the book.
Something to learn.
>>8194987
Of course. One thing that kept me hooked to the story was this sense that the fatal sin of the Golds wasn't setting up a color-coded genetic caste system and enslaving Irish people to put griffons on Europa, it was that they were hypocritical about it. I love how Darrow keeps having his breath taken away by some new wonder the Golds built, and how his desire for revenge gives way to a desire for justice. Sevro isn't a fluke that destroyed the system, he's the kind of thing the system's designers were hoping for all along.
What sets the series apart for me is how we're allowed to believe that all Darrow does is set the system straight, so that maybe Reds still work the mines but they know why they're doing it and when they beat the quota they for real get the extra liquor.
>>8194922
Golds are designed to maintain control over the other colors. Being taller demands respect. And if the Golds cared about economic efficiency they wouldn't have outlawed robots.
>>8195003
Yeah, it seems like the author thinks that the way the original Golds set up society is actually the best way to have an utopia, as long as it's fair and Golds hold up to their side of the bargain by being benevolent leaders.
The original reds knew exactly what was up and agreed to it, imagining that their children would also reap the benefits in the long run.
It's easy to imagine how effortlessly such a system could fall to systematic abuse by the more privileged though.
>>8195024
I thought that they outlawed robots because they were afraid of a Skynet style robot uprising.
Haven't read Morning Star yet, maybe they clarified it there.
>>8192924
Moorcock was simply an edgelord. What Elric has in common with left-anarchism is THE EDGE. If Moorcock had been born in 1990 he'd probably be posting on TRS.
As for his dislike of Tolkien (and Lewis etc) these were all incredibly, in fact deliberately non-edgy writers. Moorcock's self-evident literary inferiority to these guys exacerbated the butthurt, especially given Moorcock's self-conscious effort to lead the New Wave movement to eclipse their influence for good.
>>8195043
Well contemporary fantasy is largely edgy garbage, to whom in comparison Elric is not edgy at all.
But that is Martin's influence.
>>8195029
I don't think it's that so much as he hates the kind of perscriptive SF where everything is peachy once they adopt 199X's standards in everything.
>>8195062
What?
>>8195098
I don't think the author believes in a genetic caste system as much as he is unwilling to have Darrow be his mouthpiece for whatever his ideals really are. The books are highly sympathetic to the ideals of Society because Darrow is. He really becomes a Gold's Gold in spite of himself.
Why do you kids keep remaking these threads as soon as they end? If you left a thread uncreated for a day or three, you might actually drive a lot of shitposters offbut I can unfortunately understand wanting to post with your own underage peers.
>>8193225
>I hope he leaves a lot of mystery in, and doesn't wrap it all up tidily in the Cosmere
Nigger, the Cosmere won't be finished until another ~30 years. He better wrap up each and every goddamn minuscule tidbit in that time.
Also tfw we have a 'Cosmere' symbol now.
>>8195103
>as he is unwilling to have Darrow be his mouthpiece
How do you know this?
I've imagined Darrow to be the authors self-insert character the whole time, as the book is in first perspective.
>>8195135
I can't say I see the reasoning behind that. Imagine trying to come up with a picture of Wolfe from his first-person narrators.
>hear Orphans of Chaos mentioned on /lit/
>read some reviews online
>SEXIST PORN TRASH
>sounds rad
>start reading
>it's actually really good
I mean, there's not even been any spanking or rape or anything so far. I'm halfway through and worst we've had is some mention of the stuff. Does this just nosedive into porn at some point soon? I don't get what those reviews were on about.
>>8195184
>Does this just nosedive into porn at some point soon?
Not really, no. I think the reviewers were upset at what Amelia mentioned she was excited by. As if Wright was making a statement on things that make every single woman excited.
>>8194671
>>8195059
And in the same way that idiots copied Tolkien's world and quest narrative while missing the depth (e.g. Shannara) idiots have been copying Martin while completely missing the point.
I'm not saying Martin's perfect or anything, but the brutality and violence he displays (which is restrained compared to a lot of other works) human beings capable of is to emphasise just what humans at their worst can do, which in turn emphasises the importance of "the human heart at war with itself" which he states is his central concern as a writer.
>>8194845
>>8195194
I don't get posts like this.
GRRM doesn't show humans at their absolute worst, it doesn't get even close, even the currently airing Outlander is more brutal.
>>8195190
I like that she's a super-logical fourth-dimension being who gets turned on by being spanked by people. It makes her a much more memorable female lead than most of the 'badass warrior chick' types you get in fantasy.
STOUT
TWO RIVERS
WOOLENS
>>8195172
The reasoning being the utopian nature of the world in the book. According to it, the separate nations of Earth were destroying the planet with our current societal model.
Only through the brutalist, dare I say, "eco-facist" way that the Society from Luna changed how humans live, could they save the planet and humanity.
Price being lower living standards for a chunk of the population.
>>8194970
>Theft of Swords (Ryria Revelations)
Theif and mercenary team up to get framed by "the man". The world is awe inspiring, there is magic but it isn't used much, even if you love magic in your books you will love this.
>Furies of Calderon (Codex Alera)
People bind with spirits to defeat the wild. It's like if the Roman legion had pokemon, but you are only allowed one per person and when you are defeated you both die.
>The Dragon's Path (Coin and Dagger)
It's shit (read the entire Long quartet series and the first of coin and dagger), Abraham makes his books sound like they are filled with magic but they are not. In a 800 page book you will probably get like half a page to a page of magic. His books are political and financial intrigue in olden times. If you like that then go for it, but after finishing his poet book then starting this to see it was almost the same shit, i dropped the series when I finished book one.
>>8195251
I agree about the Long Price Quartet, and I'll add that I like politics in fantasy novels but Abraham isn't good at it.
AGE of Myth next week Tuesday.
Who hyped?
>>8195311
>Blood mirror next year minus two months
>ARC anon still hasn't shared
JUST
>>8194442
Ramsey Campbell - Cold Print
>>8195226
Well, the main characters don't do that. Yet some of the things the Mountain and his crew do, or the Brave Companions, or what Ramsey did to Theon, or Craster's actions are all horrific. Hell, Chett is a disgusting human being, and we get so see exactly why from his PoV.
I mean, I don't watch Outlander, so I don't know. Personally, I've always found the description of the torture used on Thecla in BotNS the scariest thing like that I've ever read.
does anyone in this thread discuss the witcher at all? i can't find any good discussion about it that doesn't involve constant waifu posting
>>8195377
No
Games are good entertainment and for fun with friends, but we leave narrative to, you know, actual literature.
Mild exception for 40k I guess.
>>8195458
are you retarded?
you do realize the games are based on a book series right?
>>8195473
I actually didn't. Hardly makes me retarded. I guess I take back my previous comments. Metro 2033 is a personal favourite of mine and made a banging game so goes to show.
I've never The Witcher mentioned however.
>>8195491
It started as short stories, influenced heavily by folk tales, legends, and so on. The short stories aren't masterpieces of literature or anything (at least the English translations), but they are enjoyable; especially if you have an interest in historical folklore, myth and such. After those the author started writing a series of novels, which really aren't good at all in my opinion, although I still like the world they take place in.
So I made to book 7 of WoT.
I actually want to kill myself, but I can't give up now.
>>8195509
you will eventually or you will lose your mind
none who have read WoT have escaped psychologically unscathed
>>8195513
Based on what I've gathered online the shit books begin with what I'm at now and end with book 10 and then 11-14 are alright.
I wish he wouldn't repeat so many phrases, also every book has to repeat stuff you already know from the previous ones.
>>8195515
Just skim read all the Aes Sedai scenes. IIRC I ended up skimming pretty much the entirety of book 10.
>>8195521
Sounds like good advice. I have yet to find one female character in this series that is not a gigantic, enormous, cataclismic bitch.
>>8194845
>muh women are better at everything except for war
The fact that so many female characters spout this nonsense makes me think the author actually believes it.
>>8195377
They aren't good books at all.
Mediocre, someone might like them, but that's it.
Games also have pretty bad writing, but they are fun.
>>8195809
>Games also have pretty bad writing
I like the fact that Geralt is an unapologetic asshole instead of a Gary Stu.
>>8195820
I find him terribly dull in the games.
I dislike the fact that they write 21st century characters and put them into an artificially grimdark setting. But this is basically what modern fantasy is in general.
the stuff with ciri and space elves in the novels is total trash. any potential it had went out the window with that.
>>8195837
>21st century characters and put them into an artificially grimdark setting
I'm an idiot, is that pretty much characters that share the same ideologies and world view as the average person in the 21st century even though their entire world should have them with an entirely different mindset?
>>8195862
Ciri is the worst part of the game too, I wish she wasn't there at all. She's so God damn boring to both play and talk to.
>>8195897
agree and it's hard to say whether it's because of CDPR dropping the ball or just ciri in general. i didn't like her in the books, but in the game she just...sucks.
>>8195892
Geralt is an enlightening atheist/humanist basically, but thankfully his fedora doesn't get tipped like so many similar characters do (The Red Knight is more or less Geralt with a massive fedora).
The medieval setting the books/games emulate would not have that kind of character at all, which makes the whole thing quite dumb.
Fun to play, but from a writing standpoint, lacks the skill and talent say Wolfe or Peake any other great fantasy author has.
>>8195918
Move to big save the world plot from cool politics is the main problem, Ciri is just someone you don't care about or want to play.
>>8195862
It went to shit after the mage coup. The battle of Brenna was nice though.
>>8195937
>Geralt is an enlightening atheist/humanist
really now
he struck me as pretty nihilistic, which given his background is more than understandable. I didn't get the impression he likes humanity.
>>8195937
i enjoy the short stories of geralt wandering around from town to town and having various adventures and so on. i'd say ciri is borderline mary sue.
>>8195377
I really like the Witcher world, but the story is shite. Geralt is a massive cuck aswell, pretty funny.
>>8195979
>Get stuck in a desert noone has every survived
>Get saved by a random fucking unicorn
>Save the unicorn in return because she is strong
>survive impossible desert
Ciri is cancer
I have zero idea what to read.
Or even what I want to read.
What are the best short stories?
>>8196066
A magic broken famalam
>>8196066
Call me a pleb but early short stories collections by Stephen King were really really good. Check out Night Shift and Skeleton Crew.
>>8196066
The Island of Doctor Death and Other Stories and Other Stories
Is the world ready for GRI YA?
>>8196111
Orphans of Chaos
I keep seeing "studied their eyes/face" or something of that sort when I'm reading, what does it mean? I am autistic just in case I will get bombarded with that question/statement
>>8196218
The things people do with their faces and eyes are called facial expressions. These facial expressions can indicate fear, nervousness and rage among other things. Sometimes they're obvious, sometimes they aren't. By studying them you're trying to understand what the person in question is thinking.
>>8196066
the scarlet plague
anything by lovecraft
or just read foundation (again)
>book has less than a 3.5 average on Goodreads
>Insta download provided reviews aren't talking about absolutely horrible prose.
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/362021.The_Light_Ages
>>8196296
The prose seems fine to me
>>8196326
That's what I meant.
The reviews don't make me think anything is wrong with the book.
>>8196296
>steampunk
>>8196343
That may be a deal breaker yes.
Is Earthsea a meme book?
>>8196370
It's a pretty generic childrens 'adventure' book.
>>8196379
According to most people it's a masterpiece
>>8196382
And Name of the Wind is the best book of all time.
>>8196370
It's YA done right. Think Harry Potter is it was written by a competent, non-hack writer.
>>8196385
Now THAT'S a meme
Earthsea on the otherhand, is highly praised even by the fantasy experts
>>8196404
They obviously aren't experts if they think that book is anything noteworthy.
>>8196233
How do you tell the difference between them?
And how can you know if someone is purposefully keeping a neutral face?
How can you tell if someone is making a facial expression on purpose?
>>8196370
No, there's no memes about it.
Meme book is also not conflicted with quality.
It's great fun.
>>8196419
Experience, mostly. By seeing different people exposed to different situations. By knowing the character of the person at hand. And of course, sometimes people fool you and you don't notice their intent. See the commonly used term "Poker face".Am I talking to a toddler
>>8196370
Name of the Wind borrowed from Earthsea.
Make of that what you will.
Can he save fantasy?
>>8196448
Save it from what?
>>8196439
>Am I talking to a toddler
I don't think so, I was diagnosed as an autist, I just make facial expressions when I need to make someone feel a certain why, for example if I need to make someone feel empathetic to me I won't keep a neutral face I will just make an expression that will make them think I am being sincere, for whatever reason, I don't know why they think I'm sincere, since I'm just making that expression, it doesn't come naturally to me, I've just learned to do them
>>8196443
Yeah and Shannara "borrowed" from LOTR, doesn't make LOTR bad. Or Shannara good.
I now know why you faggets like Warded Man.
It's about a father getting cucked in his own house, on his own bed, and they man that is cucking him is threatening to beat the shit out of him and his wife getting preggers by her lover... and the cuck is going to raise it as his own.
All these weak willed effete men.
>>8196474
"We" don't.
>>8196461
After calling and getting called an autist for so long it's refreshing to talk to the real thing.
What are your favorite SFF series or novels or authors? Do you like hard sci fi?
>>8196463
... I was saying that he took something good and made it shit.
>what is reading comprehension
>>8196483
My bad then, but the way you worded it was open to either interpretation.
>>8195237
Yes, that's how Darrow sees it. He's a convert. Quicksilver, for example, doesn't see a utopia
>>8195311
No one is going to read that shit. You and the Barker shill need to be strung up on a gibbet.
>Phone Rep: "Hello, this is James, representing Bigelow Tea and other fine beverages. How may I help you?"
>Caller: "Well, see, I have this problem with my tea..."
>P: "Which variety of tea are you having the problem with?"
>C: "Bigelow Blueberry Blast."
>P: "Alright...what seems to be the problem?"
>C: "See, there was this one batch of tea I brewed for myself one morning. I brewed it into a gleaming silver pitcher with a matching silver ropework tray and a set of three silver cups, each with its own saucer that was engraved around the perimeter with tiny flowers. I had bought the set in Saldea. Oh, the Sea-folk porcelain is wonderful, but I'm prone to breaking it. Anyway, I poured myself a cup of tea. There were piping hot scones in a silver bowl on the tray next to the tray that held the tea. The basket was covered with a white embroidered cloth slashed with blue silk, much like my dress. Oh, the neckline is a bit too low-cut for some of my acquaintances, who prefer good stout woolens to that Arad Domai silk that clings to the body in such a way as to leave very little to the imagination. So, as I was eating a scone and drinking my cup of tea, the steam from each rising and intertwining together like dueling serpents, I noticed a peculiar taste in the tea: it was cool and refreshing, with a hint of mint. Of course, I thought nothing of it. Giving my earlobe a tug and my braid a pull, I remembered the idiocy of every one of my male friends, indeed every male I have ever come into contact with, or ever will for that matter. The lot of woolheads can never compete with the superior logic and rock-solid reasoning that every female in the known universe possesses. It's no wonder we all behave the same."
Thoughts on J.V Jones?
>>8196513
>P: "Um...what was your problem with the tea?"
>C: "Oh yes, I'm sorry. After I had consumed the tea, I placed the cup on the silver ropework tray and covered the gleaming silver basket of scones again with the white embroidered cloth slashed with bands of blue silk, much like my dress. I remembered the stout man in the streets of Tar Valon: a vendor of sausages he was. Though I know I will never see him again, I felt it necessary to familiarize myself with every aspect of his appearance and personal history. He was a short, stout man with black hair that was beginning to grey at the temples, slicked back on his head in the manner of warriors, though it was obvious he was not one. He wore brown shoes of stained leather that rustled softly against the dirt of the streets, kicking up clouds of dust that lingered in the air even after he had passed. His pants were of stiff wool, dyed green and patched in many places. He wore a leather jerkin over a soiled white peasant's shirt, the cuffs of his sleeves rolled up and out of his way. Around his neck was a silver chain with a medallion attached to it that bore the image of a bear. He spoke with a gruff voice..."
>P: "The TEA, ma'am."
>C: "Well you don't have to be rude about it. I was only filling you in on the relevant details."
>P: "I don't have all day, ma'am."
>C: "You do remind me of a lad I once knew, back when I used to frequent the palace in Camelyn..."
>P: "Look, we'll send you a case of Blueberry tea, alright?"
>>8196513
>>Giving my earlobe a tug and my braid a pull, I remembered the idiocy of every one of my male friends, indeed every male I have ever come into contact with, or ever will for that matter. The lot of woolheads can never compete with the superior logic and rock-solid reasoning that every female in the known universe possesses. It's no wonder we all behave the same."
top kek
>>8196520
>C: "Oh...alright then, I suppose that will do nicely."
>P: "Do you have any other problems?"
>C: "Well, there is this one other problem I have, but it's not with your tea. The other day, I was pouring myself a goblet of spiced wine. Only the wine had grown cold after being left on the windowsill for whatever reason. So I siezed hold of saidar. It was pure rapture...like opening all of my petals to the sun, for I am a flower. It was like floating in a river that tore along with great speed: resist it and you would be consumed by it. So I accepted it and was consumed by the sweet joy. I sent a tiny thread of fire into the pitcher to warm the wine. Soon, steam rose from the pitcher of gold, sunlight rebounding on the inset gems. I removed the pitcher from the stark Cairheinien plinth of the finest marble and poured myself a glass. But the use of saidar had turned the spices bitter..."
>*CLICK*
>C: "Hello? Hello? Wool-headed sheep-herder..."
>>8196111
A YA novel can never be GRI Approved, by it's very definition GRI is an adult topic.
YA is about crushes, love triangles and being friend zoned.
>>8196534
It can have the G, just (usually) not the R or the I. Though I guess the Lovely Bones was YA and it had rape but no gay.
>>8196461
Which ones apply to you?
>>8196518
she is Robert Jordan's even more autistic sister
So is Bakker and this Prince of Nothing good or is it all memes?
>>8196534
That's just the most popular YA that paints a bad picture. Same shit with "adult" fantasy really, the most popular stuff represents shit. Though it's easier to find good adult fiction than it is to find good YA fiction, only found Orphans of Chaos for the latter so far.
>>8196460
Kikes
>>8196370
Yes. A shitty Facebook tier meme.
>>8196565
Is there a single popular Jewish fantasy author?
>>8196589
They work in the shadows maaaan, it's all their fault that i read shitty fantasy! It's all the juuuuus!
>>8196602
>0.02 has been deposited into your account
Out of curiosity since I've never read his works, but why is Cory Doctorow never discussed or recommended here?
>>8196688
Young Adult commercial author.
>>8196688
I've brought him up a few times. Down and Out in the Magic Kingdom was a fun read, but as he kept putting out novel you could start to see that he really believes this left-libertarian philosophy of innate human goodness if they're only given a chance; lately he's been publishing a stream of near-identical YA books where some kool kids who just want to be creative have The Man after them for a while but they're just too creative and they beat The Man.
Someone Comes To Town, Someone Leaves Town had the opportunity to be decent magic realism; like almost everything he writes, it turned trite and saccharine and neatly sliced up rewards for each character according to their alignment with the author's beliefs.
It's a shame, because I really, really liked True Names. It's a bunch of internal politics within godlike AIs trying to trap each other in simulations while they convert more of the universe to computronium. I still think about DaOitMK's Whuffie system now and then, the guy has great ideas, but there's this wide-eyed optimism that puts me off. Plus that he writes books about MMO gold farmers starting unions.
>>8196688
His short story "Craphound" was really good, found it in one of those year's-best anthologies.
>>8196563
You could always try reading it and finding out you philistine
>>8196803
can't, I'm going through WoT right now.
>>8196820
If you can slog through WoT then Prince of Nothing shouldn't be a problem
>>8196589
They don't write fantasy, they publish it.
Any sci-fi novels that deal with time travel stuff (closed loops, paradoxes, parallel worlds...)?
>>8196929
Try End of Eternity, Asimov.
>>8196482
I think I must disappoint you, I was only diagnosed as an autist, I had that done to get some benefits that suited me, it's unclear to me if the diagnosis is correct or not.
I'm new to this genre however, I don't have any favourites yet
>>8196931
Really sounds like what i was i looking for, thanks will do.
>>8196929
The Man in the High Castle - PKD
The Light of Other Days - Clarke and Baxter
Somewhere in Time - Richard Matheson
Night Watch - Terry Pratchett
>>8196966
>I was only diagnosed as an autist, I had that done to get some benefits that suited me
>I defrauded the man to live the literary NEET lifestyle.
>don't judge
>>8196589
The same amount as black fantasy authors.
I can't wait until the Clapistan election is over so we can go back to shitposting about funny magic books without politicalfags ruining it.
Anyways what are some book that will make me feel like pic related?
>>8197008
Black fantasy authors at all or famous ones? Because I can name a few black fantasy authors, but as far as popular ones, N. K. Jemisin is fairly popular at present.
>>8197027
Them and the Brexit people are cancerous af right now. Maybe Johannes Cabal the Necromancer?
>>8196996
Not NEET, being registered as disabled simply gave me a multitude of privileges, some of which I wasn't even aware of before I got them
>Here is my theory: There are only two possible attitudes for a society, or an individual man, to have toward women: the mystical and the practical. There may be endless variations on the theme within these two broad categories, but those do not concern us here.
>The practical attitude is that women are dickless men, easy to beat up, fun to ravish, emotionally vulnerable and easy to manipulate. This is the attitude of the cads, including everyone from Bill Clinton to Hugh Hefner to Solomon the Wise, and every man who gave in to the werewolflike hunger.
>The mystical attitude is that women, because they are weak, and precious, and fair, the mother of your children and the hearth and heart of your soul, must be served with the devotion of supine priests in ancient rites their pagan goddesses, or knights who pray and fast before an icon of the Virgin. When the Titanic is sinking, you give up your seat on the lifeboat for a women, and die. This may not be the logical or the egalitarian method of approaching the whole man-woman question, but is it a far mile more practical than the practical attitude.
Is he wright?
>>8197183
Not really,
>There are only two possible attitudes for a society, or an individual man, to have
is just asserted out of nowhere
>>8197032
I only know
>Jemisin
>Butler
>Delaney
>>8197183
No, fuck women.
>>8197027
Where is the fedora?
>>8196490
I love Quicksilver's monologue, even if it is idealistic libertarian cliche shit.
The part where he states they could be technologically so much more advanced yet they're just using it to play at being in the stories told by a bunch of pedophiles around the campfire some thousand years ago, that had me laughing pretty hard, not gonna lie.
