So I've been reading books on the train to work all year so far. On a whim, I picked up Kafka on the Shore, positively loved it, although the ending was less than stellar.
I immediately picked up Wind Up Bird Chronicle, liked that even better, although the last 1/3 of the book, until the very last chapters was such a cluster of unnecessary additional characters and links, in my opinion. Still really enjoyed it.
Then I read 1Q84. I just finished today. I can hardly fathom how empty it felt. Extreme, constant repetition, illogical character choices, This is CAT TOWN that is CAT TOWN everywhere is CAT TOWN. Killed best character for literally literally literally no reason. Then provided zero closure on any plot point, which I understand is intentional, but it is not a good feeling after reading 1200 pages.
I'm not sure how /lit/ considers Murakami on the meme scale, but boy howdy did this one make me feel absolutely nothing, except for Ushikawa. Any differing opinions? Opinions on which, if any, of his books to read next? Regardless of opinion, I'm up to read at least two more, if not everything he's got, depending on how those go.
>>7885184
Don't read Norwegian Wood, it's even worse
>>7885184
I enjoyed some of the way he spun sentences, but overall Murakami is a meme pleb writer. There are real books out there.
>>7885193
This. The worst part is that now my brain linked the beatles song to that shitty book.
>tons of references to western culture
>explicit lesbian sex for no reason between a 12 year old and a mature woman
>>7885193
That's good to know. I figured that if it has a movie adaptation, it probably can't be complicated or abstract enough to match the books I liked from him.
>>7885195
Agreed on the sentences. Although it's difficult to tell in translation, either way. Not once did the translators even try to translate an "itadakimasu", which I'm sure exists in the original text. So I have no way of knowing how those sentences functioned in Japanese/ how hard they had to be mangled to make sense in English. Either way, you have to wonder when a modern author achieves any sort of international fame, whether they are, in fact, a meme.
Why would you read more than one book by Murakami ? They are YA shit
>>7885210
>explicit lesbian sex for no reason
This is also a complaint of mine, particularly in 1Q84. I actually had to close the book when attempting to read on the train because the segments on detailed sex with a teenager were awfully long. And only vaguely significant, and made much less so through plot twists. Of course, Fuka-Eri is legal in Japanese law in the novel, but that's hard to explain if someone peeks over your shoulder and reads "Her sixteen year old body sucking the semen out of my dick, which was not just hard, it was the hardest erection I have ever had: a perfect erection."
>>7885215
As I said, I really liked Kafka on the Shore and Wind Up Bird Chronicle. I don't think it's shameful if they appeal to that audience. Although I've certainly never met someone who reads Twilight and also mentions Murakami, if that's what you mean by YA.
>I'm not sure how /lit/ considers Murakami on the meme scale, but boy howdy did this one make me feel absolutely nothing, except for Ushikawa. Any differing opinions? Opinions on which, if any, of his books to read next? Regardless of opinion, I'm up to read at least two more, if not everything he's got, depending on how those go.
Same opinion - I dropped it somewhere in the second book, it was about 500 pages too long.
Just got up to the part where greenpeas somehow justifies to herself (.:. the reader) that because the Dotahs are not really real people it was pretty much justified to rape them. I can see where that might be a plausible direction to but I don't really trust it to go that way. I'm starting to sour on it but it's fine enough to can soldier on.
I never read any Murakami books but have one question: Is he/she a jap or a western asian?
>>7885248
I thought others might be reading this, so I tried to avoid spoilers as much as possible. But just as a side note- the young girl with the destroyed womb does not return to the story at any point after that. Just one of many plot points that are utterly dropped, to no great effect. Still, I suggest reading on, at least until the point that Ushikawa (New Japan Art Committee Rep) returns to the story.
Also, it's never mentioned in the story, but in case any missed it, Maza and Dohta are Japanese-twinged phonetic alterations of "Mother" and "Daughter." I have a feeling that they were simply the english words in the original version, but either way, it's a bit silly.
>>7885262
Japanese man, born and raised. I believe he has a strong knowledge of the English language, has lived abroad for extended periods, and translates some English books into Japanese. I believe all of his writing is originally in Japanese as well.
>>7885184
"Hard-Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World" is his best.
>>7885317
Alright, then. I'll go for that one next. Thanks, bruv.
>>7885184
I agree with you on all those points, but those things didnt bother me that much. With a book that long I dont expect a neat and structural story or tightly wrapped ends, to me it added to the loseness of the atmosphere. plus, big underage jap titties.
>>7885227
people arent reading your book. And even if they were, it's a fucking book, m8. who cares?
>>7885325
Fair enough. I can see how it can be enough for a reader to just be "along for the ride", if you will. It is striking that I remembered events from Book 1 as if they were distant, dreamy pasts, which is exactly how the characters perceive them.
I think it's also significant that Aomame dropped Proust midway through and chose instead to re-read the world's current flavor of the month. But why, I can't really say.
>>7885331
I mean, fair enough. Maybe I shouldn't be so self-conscious.
But I often take glimpses at what a seated person is reading if I'm standing over them on the subway. Maybe it's different in other parts of the world, but in the city subway, I find my eyes wandering to anything that will catch their attention, especially if I don't have my headphones in or the train is too crowded to comfortably do other things, which it usually is.
Use a spoiler you fucking child
>>7885331
The main issue is that Tengo fucking Fuka-Eri adds nothing to the narrative. Personally I'm on part three right now and while I guess you could call this a great work of art - it's polarising like nothing else and it certainly has a shitload to say - it aggravates me a lot as a writer. There is no reason for Tengo and Fuka-Eri to fuck - their relationship has this lovely innocence to it, breast descriptions aside, that Murakami tosses aside because, as always, he has to get his rocks off. And Aomame has gone from 'fuck this dude he beat his wife icepick to the neck' to 'I HOPE THIS IS TENGO'S BABY I WANT TO FEEL HIS STRONG ARMS TENGO TENGO TENGO OH GOD YES'. It's really shitty in that typically Japanese kind of sexist way.
Murakami is a good author that is simply very hit and miss.
>>7885411
why should there be a reason? Unreasonable things happen every day.
>>7885439
Because Murakami is not writing real life. He's writing fiction, and in fiction everything means something. You can talk bullshit post-modern whatevers here however much you want, but fiction has to have a cohesive purpose. Often Murakami's purpose is purely aesthetic. But 1Q84 is a thousand pages and some of its events should, you know, mean something. Instead Tengo fucks Fuka-Eri and that one guy's wife but it's okay, he really loves Aomame, who is 100% prepared to forget everything in her life because Tengo's STRONG ARMS are too compelling. As a narrative, at least to a westerner, this is a fucking atrocious way of rounding things out.
>>7885452
you're saying in a world with alternate realities,two moons, one of them being green, tiny kidnapping elves, women reading Proust, something has to make sense? Huh.
It's magioc, anon. InMyCountryHeIsNothing aint gotta explain shit.
>>7885472
But that's the thing. Any narrative, whether it's crazy Murakami shit or the driest of modern American realisms, has to make you interested in its conclusion. American Psycho? You don't like Patrick Bateman, but you're interested in what happens to him. 1Q84's problem is that Tengo is an asshole and a boring asshole. I don't want Aomame to end up with him. I don't care if he fucks every woman in Japan because (as Murakamai says) "women just seemed attracted to him". That is not a narrative. That's an author getting off on his character being able to fuck anything any time and still have a True Love (so pls be sad when they can't get together). Real life doesn't have to make sense. Fiction does not have that luxury. I don't care about the Little People, the two moons, etc. not making sense. But the characters should make sense and they don't. It reads like a puffed-up version of Twilight and nothing more
>>7885472
two of my close female friends have read or are reading Proust. what's your point?
>>7885479
>has to
Literature doesnt have to do anything. It can "be" for it's own sake, wether it interests you or not is your problem. Of course it can be judged (like you're doing right now) objectively, as in technically but that's besides the point. A writer should be able to put on the page whatever they wish to convey emotion, setting, or even a reaction such as yours.
I admit 1Q84 is not perfect and Murakami falls into the self insert mary sue Writer living a Writer lifestyle but it doesnt mean it's wrong, you get me? maybe there is some super lucky dude out there who gets tons of pussy by just being himself, or maybe he's just a pseud and chicks dig that, maybe there isnt. the point is, it doesn really matter if it makes sense or not, because either way they are human, they have flaws, Aomame is not perfect, the Dowajer isnt perfect, Ushikawa is full of imperfections, and even the most innocent character Fuka-eri is prone to being possesed and acting against her will.
>>7885491
iz just joke
>>7885504
Don't get me wrong, anon. I have enjoyed 1Q84 and I think it was a good use of my time. But I have issues with it. Again, that's why I'd call it art - because I (and so many other anons who gave up and who get the book labelled with a premature SHIT rating) have reacted so strongly to it.But Ushikawa is the best part and that seems a universal response.
wrote my undergrad thesis on Murakami and the way his works serve as a cultural and linguistic ambassador for western and eastern cultures. I can understand that he's not for everyone, but to say he's a bad writer is unfair. IQ84, Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Wild Sheep Chase, and Kafka on the Shore are all his most famous works, and for a good reason I think they're all spectacular, but
>>7885317
Nailed it. Hard Boiled is a masterpiece. One of my favorite novels.
I could write for days about Norwegian Wood but people who browse 4chan are not the audience so yea feel free to skip it.
>>7885582
Understood, Issues with it I have aplenty, but over all I see it as a flawed but very entertaining and sometimes beautiful casserole of japanese veggies, tits, and cats. I disagree with a lot of people that find it amazing as well as those that find it complete shit, but magical realism and the "literary uberman lifestyle" narrative isnt for everyone, there is alot of wish fulfillment and projecting going on in there and I see that.
Ushikawa and the body guard were the best characters in there for sure, I'd say maybe the dowager desreves merit too. either way there are better writers out there that can do better characterization and motives, but few have Murakami's style.
also, have this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QStFk-dIzhU
A Wild Sheep Chase is a nice little book, fun to read and a lot less complex than Wind-Up Bird. It was my first Murakami and I liked it, if you are looking for a relaxing enjoyable read.
>>7885645
Thank you! This music is really cool.
>>7885411
One thing I noticed and bothered me is the awkward intrusion of what I thought of as anime tropes but I guess are just Japanese fiction tropes.
>>7885210
>explicit lesbian sex for no reason between a 12 year old and a mature woman
please post excerpt..
>>7885193
Don't listen to this pleb. Norwegian Wood is his best work.
>>7885193
I liked Norwegian wood. Style different than other his books, but that's not bad
This man in my country, he is nothing.
i personally really enjoyed norwegian wood, although i know a lot of people disliked it and murakami after reading
i would honestly read the elephant vanishes - these strange stories are great talking points and packed with interesting imagery that leave you with a lot to think about after each story
i think murakami is more of a conceptual writer and it's all down to your interpretation, he leaves you with breadcrumbs and signs and if you like that type of shit you'll have a good time. sometimes he leaves you with really obscure signs like in norwegian wood and that can leave people feeling really estranged as to the actual point, other times his cultural references (occasionally in norwegian wood but also in wind-up) are too much and make him feel really cringey. sometimes he hits sometimes he misses but he's a great guy to read and digest afterwards, often the ideas are much better than their delivery
Anyone read this? Your thoughts?
>>7885193
No, it's not. NW and The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle are his best works.
> tfw Fuka-eri was a dohta all along
>>7885184
I finished Colorless Tsukuru Tazaki and His Years of Pilgrimage and I kind of liked it. The imagery was appealing to me at the time. I'm reading Kafka on the Shore and I find that Murakami is verbose UT he utilizes it corrsctly. Also I noticed that he definitely has a thing foryoung slender men and their cocks.
>>7887758
>>7888712
Same anon here. To be honest I liked it and as it was my first Murakami novels I hyped it up but still it was great on its own merit. There's just the thing about that young boy he works out with and I felt like that went unresolved. Maybe I missed something because I was distracted by theHOTTER THAN SIN BOY LOVE AND DARE I SAY BOY LUST HAPPENING WHILE I'M TRYING TO PASS TIME IN BETWEEN CLASSES
9/10 would recommend.
Currently reading A Wild Sheep Chase. Am I good if I stick with the Trilogy of the Rat for now?
Anybody else you can recommend that does magical realism with POV characters who are pretty introspective, like the protagonist in Sheep is (at times)?
>>7885210
>for no reason
hahahah are you really that simple?
>>7885452
you can't argue that just because someone is writing fiction, they can't write in meaningless happenings...
The majority of what happens to us is meaningless, and even the meaningless stuff can be looked at in a different way to mean something
I for instance, disagree with the person earlier who said that there was a lesbian sex scene with a 12 year old and a grown woman for "no reason," since I found a lot of meaning in that scene and in the way the story was told.
If you cannot find meaning, it doesn't mean there isn't one. And if there is no meaning, it doesn't make it bad, just part of life
Murakami writes from his life, even if he writes fiction
>not a single mention of South of the Border, West of the Sun
Absolutely disgusting. Read it immediately, OP.
>>7885618
write me something about Norwegian Wood. I finished it last week and would love some insight. I felt like Toru was really interesting, and also that many of the things that characterize him are not things that normally are used to characterize people, and I connected with him a lot. I'm not a young adult male, btw, so it's not that I'm connecting with that stuff, but more the thoughts he describes in weird ways.
My favorite description was of the cherry blossoms and the spring in a negative light, in a rotting sort of sense instead of a lively bright sense
>>7889458
NW loses a lot of it's meaning without the context. It's pretty clear when reading the novel, but it's a critique of the student right's movement that was happening worldwide throughout the late sixties. Murakami (and other writers tackling the subject) criticized the movement as being aimless and hypocritical. As I said before, my focus was on how Murakami's works serve as a sort of bridge between eastern and western cultures, and in this case he was sort of commenting on how the kind of widespread cultural paradigm shifts that were taking place in other (western) states couldn't really happen in Japan due to the nature of what it meant at that time to be Japanese.
Murakami also writes a lot about loneliness through Toru, which is the more surface level theme that comes through and tends to be discussed more by readers. Because of the way Murakami writes about loneliness and relationships and love, as well as referencing western writing styles and culture like food and music, the novel became insanely popular with the Japanese youth. It was different, sexy, and 'controversial', so young people ate it up and catapulted Murakami to fame, which he actually hated. Murakami felt that the people reading his work didn't "get it", and sort of resented that he was known for NW instead of his other work. Obviously, he would go on to write several other amazing pieces, and they wouldn't have gotten nearly the widespread recognition nor acclaim if NW hadn't exposed him to a wide audience, so I'd wager that he doesn't really care at this point.
>>7888712
Colorless was aight. Did what it wanted to do well, but it was pretty simple and straightforward compared to his other work. I would have liked it more if it was from a different author, one I don't expect so much of.
>>7889453
its my favorite murakami too!
for some reason its his most disliked by people but its a very good slice-of-life(?)/story about being lost in middle-aged depresseion
From best to worst
HBW/Trilogy of the Rat
everything else
1q84
Colorless
>>7889250 here.
Anyone?
>>7889782
You could always do Kafka, arguable Murakami's biggest influence, but in general magical realism is associated with Latin American literature. Jorge Luis Borges is my fave.
