What's a good book to help me understand depression? I know lots of people with it and I just don't get it. Thanks
People will tell you it's a meme, but, no kidding, David Foster Wallace. Particularly Brief Interviews With Hideous Men. The most on-the-face example is a short story in there, The Depressed Person, but there's a general portrait of depressed psyche in the highly self-conscious and self-deprecating style.
Some of it is funny, too. You should give it a try, OP.
>>7775443
Thanks anon I'll give it a go
Not necessarily depression but surely worth looking into: Al Alvarez wrote a book called The Savage God attempting to understand suicide from a variety of perspectives. It starts with a brief recollection of his time with Sylvia Plath before she passed, but if she doesn't interest you or hold some resentment for her work it's fine to skip. The chapter on the history of suicide from roman antiquity through the rise of christianity is particularly interesting.
William Gaddis taught it in a course called Literature of Failure for a short while as a professor, if that means anything to you.
>>7775435
Start with the Greeks.
>>7775653
I can really tell you're new.
>>7775435
Depression isn't a real illness
>>7775655
Kinda, been here this august.
>>7775667
*since august
>>7775435
No such thing as depression.
It's nothing more than the aftermath of a shitty lifestyle; namely, a shitty diet and utter lack of exercise.
Eat clean, get fit; depression fades away.
It's basically a invention by cultural Marxists so they can whine about having to go to work and shit
Same with most other """""""mental illneses"""""""
>>7776093
And how did you come to that conclusion.
>>7776097
Because I was depressed for 2-3 years.
Started eating clean (as opposed to shit like 4-6 cans of Coca Cola per day, a whole box of Lindor chocolates pet day, etc) and getting fit.
2 years later and I laugh at how pathetic I used to be.
Depression is your body's way of telling you to either drastically change your lifestyle, or remove yourself from the game.
>>7776108
>I am going to change my views thanks to what you've written.
You'll thank me lad.
>>7776102
but doesn't it like physically show on your brain in a scan?
>>7776108
Due not die.
>>7776102
how can you be this retarded?
depression affects different people accordingly. just because YOU got better with exercise and good eating, doesn't fucking mean everyone will. and it certainly doesnt prove that depression isn't a very real illness. jesus christ, how can you be so ignorant?
>>7775435
Darkness Visible by Styron
OP, what don't you understand? Pretty much everyone on this board is depressed and can answer any questions you have.
>>7776129
Ignore all these faggots OP and listen to this guy
>>7776113
Maybe.
If it's due to a chemical imbalance, I'm saying that eating clean and getting fit will fix it. Ever wonder why everyone who's depressed is fat/lazy/hideous/etc?
They get themselves into a rut; eating shit, doing nothing of any worth and spending too much time thinking 'woe is me.' I've been there; it's a vicious cycle, they have to break it for themselves.
Find me a depressed Chad. You can't.
>>7776126
Are you depressed m8? Eat clean, get fit. Thank me later.
>>7776102
i eat clean and play hockey but i strongly suspect i am depressed, your solution is far from universal
>>7776593
Well, you get depression that goes along with Orthorexia, for example. But discounting eating disorder situations, you're probably not far wrong.
>>7776093
Completely wrong
It's true a lot of people experience similar symptoms from shitty eating and lack of exercise. But there are lots of healthy, well adjusted athletes (I know many) that are seriously depressed to the point of being suicidal.
Whether or not modern psychiatry is exactly right, irrational chronic despair is absolutely afflicts many people regardless of their lifestyle
>>7775435
A psychology textbook you idiot.
>>7776102
jesus christ if you were drinking 4-6 cans of coke a day no wonder you were fucked up
and if you assume all depressed people do anything remotely like that youre an idiot
i assume im replying to either a troll or someone massively retarded
>>7776093
This is complete bullshit.
It's true that exercise can help to alleviate depressed symptoms. Researchers aren't 100% why this happens, but it could be down to increased self-confidence and self-efficacy, a physiological boost of improved brain functioning, or some combination of these. I'm not aware of any completed dietary interventions for depression although some are in progress and, again, I wouldn't be surprised to see that changing diet helps to alleviate depression symptoms, for the same reasons as exercise does.
That said, it is a huge leap to claim that depression is a result of a lack of exercise or a shitty diet. All my life I've followed a healthy vegetarian diet low in fat and sugar, and I've always been sporty too - I now do some form of exercise (gym or sports) at least 6 times per week, usually more. Without wanting to brag, I'm in very good shape physically. Yet I'm depressed, and have been for years. Maybe I'd be worse off still if I didn't exercise/diet, but simply living a healthy lifestyle hasn't cured it for me. Depression refers to a set of symptoms (often completely different in two people) which don't necessarily come from the same source. While your depression could come from a dissatisfaction with your self in relation to your ideal self, mine could come from an inability to find meaning in anything I do. Another person could have depression for no reason at all, or at least no reason that they can recall consciously. Depression is a very complex state of mind, which is why different people respond better to different types of treatment. But changing your diet and exercising more is a good start I suppose.
t. personal experiences, and exercise psychology student
>>7776593
>Find me a depressed Chad. You can't.
>Are you depressed? Eat clean. Get fit. Thank me later.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/florida-gators/swamp-things-blog/os-gators-chris-johnson-suicide-20150302-post.html
Division I athlete. In peak physical condition. Following a strict diet per the football program's nutritionist. Puts a gun to his head and pulls the trigger.
tl;dr: shut the fuck up, you have no clue what you're talking about.
>>7776771
>>7776811
>>7776842
Stop finding excuses for your phoney illness.
Anti-depressants are the modern-day version of a lobotomy; no one really knows IF they work, never mind HOW. Don't even get me started on the side-effects; which again, are so unknown that the information leaflets with every anti-depressants list every side-effect imaginable, just to cover themselves from court cases.
Exercise and eating clean will do you much more good than your modern-day lobotomy pills.
If you want to take them, be my guest; just know you'll be a willing lab rat for big pharma.
>>7776875
>; just know you'll be a willing lab rat for big pharma
*tips violently*
What do you want to understand about it?
>>7776102
>Depression is your body's way of telling you to either drastically change your lifestyle, or remove yourself from the game.
This is so wrong. lol
>>7776875
There are people who do exercise and eat clean and suffer from depression
Just because you were a digusting lard ass with self control (you clearly havent improved much) it doesnt men others are
Next time if you dont know shit about anything, dont talk about it
>>7775435
My Twisted World
>>7776875
You failed to actually respond to my post at all. Explain, according to your theory, why Chris Johnson, a young man in absolute prime physical condition, following strict dietary and exercise regimen intended to keep him in that prime physical condition and even continue to improve it, who could no doubt bring home a different beautiful woman every night of the week, could be so depressed as to choose to end his own life?
You must be trolling.
>>7776912
a lot of dumb people get caught in in pop-psychology and start believing shit like this
he probably found some new age podcast from reddit
>>7776875
At this point I'm convinced that this is bait, but I'll bite. What about all the professional athletes who suffer from depression (the incidence rate is about the same as the general population)?
I'm also opposed to the use of anti-depressants, I think they should only be given in cases of severe depression. The most important treatment is some sort of talking therapy - mindfulness-based cognitive therapy is the one that looks to particularly efficacious, but there are lots of different variations. Exercise/diet in isolation (i.e. without talking therapy) typically tend to lead to no more improvement in depression symptoms than a control group. Instead, it provides an additive benefit when combined with the talking therapy, such that therapy+exercise is better than just therapy. There are meta-analyses of randomised controlled trials that point to this very conclusion, if you don't believe me.
>>7776878
>
There's no evidence that anti-depressants even work. Those that take them are participating in the weakest school of modern medicine. You'd probably have better luck practising magic.
>>7776901
>you clearly havent improved much
>
Nothing about my posts indicates anything about my degree of self control; save for the fact that it's lacking when it comes to resisting the bait of "woe is me" retards.
>>7776912
Body Dysmorphia, most likely. Not depression, merely the consequence of constantly setting yourself new targets; to the point where they become unachievable, resulting in permanent disappointment.
Not depression; body dysmorphia is pretty common on /fit/
>>7776924
I agree with therapy in tandem with exercise/clean eating.
The first time I went to my doctor about depression, he metaphorically threw me a box of Sertraline; which I continued to receive for about 3 years, during which I was rendered a zombie.
>>7776924
>>7776936
>there's no evidence that anti depressants even work
Please just stop posting.
>>7776905
spectacular hobby you have, you're making great use of your time and convincing many
>>7776937
There isn't.
Anti-depressants are an entirely speculative form of medicine. The lobotomies of today.
They're founded on the Serotonin Theory; which cannot even be definitively branded true.
>>7776952
okay.
>>7775435
The Anatomy of Melancholy by Robert Burton
>>7776936
*tipping intensifies*
Have you tried actually talking with someone who has depression? Or maybe with a psychologist? It's not really difficult to understand (but maybe I just say that because I've suffered from it for twenty freakin years now).
I didn't believe I was actually sick until I went on medication for it. That was part of my sickness: logically I knew that I was sick, but emotionally I couldn't believe it. I thought there was something wrong with me as a person. But then I went on Lexapro. It was like someone flipped a switch in my brain: one day I was on the verge of suicide, and literally two days later I was happy. People will say that depression isn't real, but those people are idiots. "Oh yeah, I was depressed once, I just had a good cry and I was all better!" That's not depression. When you are clinically depressed, there is something wrong with your brain; you can't just get over it. It's a medical problem, and you need medical help: from a therapist, from medication, or from both.
I'm not sure of any books (aside from medical books) that can help you learn about real depression. Depression mostly involves inactivity, and that doesn't really make for a good story. Imagine a story about a character that can't get out of bed and then cries for three days straight.
>>7776936
I'm beginning to understand that you have struggled with depression and in an effort to cope with it have dismissed its legitimacy entirely.
Coupled with your spook memepost it's not surprising you'd imagine depression is one.
On a tangent I don't think existential positions that drive a hard line on ego and strict ideological independence are easily reconciled in conversation/wider society.
(Probably why existential literature is riddled with protags that seem like they have aspergers)
In order to keep this post /lit/ I suggest you read Family Ties by Clarice Lispector.
Good short stories situated in the home and addressing modern malaise and how to re-enchant it.
>argues for curing depression with excersize using anecdotal evidence
>dismisses anti depressants despite huge amount of anectdotal evidence, one case of which should be well known to everyone on this board
>>7776102
You do realize that depression actually causes people to eat poorly, not the other way around? Eating food makes you feel good, so some depressed people will eat large amounts of food in order to get that good feeling. Even people who aren't depressed will do this; lots of people eat junk food when they are stressed out.
Do you just not understand how the human body works?
>ctrl + f 'no longer human'
>0 results
guys what the fuck
>>7776593
>everyone who's depressed is fat/lazy/hideous/etc
Are you literally retarded? This isn't true at all. There are plenty of skinny depressed people. And depressed people aren't lazy, they physically are unable to do things because that's part of the illness. Are paralyzed people lazy too? Stephen Hawking just needs to eat right and exercise and he'll be up and running in no time?
I'm willing to bet that you were never depressed in the first place, if this is what you think. Jesus, you're an idiot.
>>7776936
Well this is one thing that we agree on, treatment for depression in the western world is far too reliant on pharmaceuticals. Anti-depressants can alleviate depression symptoms for sure, but these problems often return as soon as the course of treatment ends, because they don't tackle the root cause at all - relapse following pharmaceutical treatment is much higher compared to psychological treatment. The problem is, relatively few are trained in delivering psychological therapy, so doctors just prescribe antidepresants because it's easier than telling their patient they'll have to wait 12 weeks before seeing a psychologist. It's a temporary solution which has somehow become the treatment of choice.
>>7776985
I read No Longer Human while I was depressed and expected to relate to it completely. I actually found the main character annoying and even deserving of his own depression. It was okay, but I think I was expecting something like my (non-existent) personal diary and it was nothing like that at all.
>>7776998
>I read No Longer Human while I was depressed and expected to relate to it completely. I actually found the main character annoying and even deserving of his own depression. It was okay, but I think I was expecting something like my (non-existent) personal diary and it was nothing like that at all.
I was in a similar spot reading various novels for the same reasons as you, the one that helped me the most was probably Steppenwolf.
>>7776997
>Stephen Hawking just needs to eat right and exercise and he'll be up and running in no time?
Calm down dude, you fucking destroyed him...
>>7776875
>no one really knows IF they work
I know for a fact that antidepressants work, because they worked for me. See >>7776968. I was about to kill myself, but as a last resort I went on Lexapro. I didn't expect it to work at all, and was planning on killing myself when it inevitably failed (since I'd been on Prozac before and that did nothing). But it didn't fail. Literally two days after I started on the pills, I felt better. I no longer wanted to kill myself, I could actually get out of bed in the morning, I wasn't angry at everything. That was five fucking years ago. I'm still on the drug, and I still continue to feel its effects. If I stop taking it, I immediately become more angry and tired. These symptoms disappear as soon as I start the medication again.
Antidepressants do actually work. Not every drug works for every person, but that's true of any type of drug. Please try and educate yourself instead of spewing pseudo-intellectual garbage you got from some hippie anti-medication website.
>>7775435
>>7777026
Antidepressants don't cure you, they just make you numb from your shitty reality. But in the sense of working, yea they do... and now you are addicted because you can't live without them.
Im sorry brother...
>>7776968
>I didn't know I was sick, I thought there was something wrong with me as a person
Fuck iktf, my self esteem's been so low that it's a struggle to accept that I have a problem and I'm just not inherently a piece of shit waste of space.
>>7776968
How old are you?
>>7775435
>>7776936
>There's no evidence that anti-depressants even work.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3712503/
>Conclusions
>The magnitude of benefit of antidepressant medication compared with placebo increases with severity of depression symptoms, and may be minimal or nonexistent, on average, in patients with mild or moderate symptoms. For patients with very severe depression, the benefit of medications over placebo is substantial.
Randomly selected from the bottom of the Wikipedia page on escitalopram (Lexapro). There are dozens, if not hundreds, more studies that show that antidepressants work. You've just never bothered to look for them, because you're a fucktard.
>>7777057
I'm 28. I've been depressed since I was about seven or eight. I had my first suicidal thought when I was eight. It didn't help that my mother was also in a suicidal depression when I was a kid. Sometimes she took me in to see her therapist.
>>7777038
I'm not numb at all. I was numb when I was depressed. When I started on the drugs, I felt alive for the first time in years. I was actually able to enjoy things again.
Stop talking about things you know absolutely nothing about.
>>7776102
You were sad, not depressed.
>>7776102
I was in the exact same state and I can confirm this.
Depression is your body's way of telling you to learn your shit and man the fuck up, or do humanity a favor and remove your weak self from the genetic pool. If you succeed in passing the test of depression, you'll come out far stronger than anyone around you.
>>7775667
pro-tip: only invoke the Greeks when the OP is vague and childish, e.g. "New to reading/literature; don't know where to start!!" etc. if you'd like to recommend a specific work of the Greeks against a more specific OP, like the above, go right ahead. but just saying that to everyone is just terribly sad and banal.
>>7776095
you can argue against the unreality of mental illnesses in a similar manner, but "cultural marxists" is the wrong thing to point to.
>>7776102
>using personal anecdote to write off all clinical studies
>not being aware that depression can undergo spontaneously remission\
>>7776875
8/10
>>7776936
>You'd probably have better luck practising magic.
u'd b surpise
>>7776977
this guy knows
>>7777038
>numb from your shitty reality
>implying that isn't one of the main feelings of depression in the first place
