Help me get this shit
I read the first two stories and thought: wow, he sure does know a lot of names.
Didn't want to bother with it afterward.
>>7698018
you're reading it in spanish ?
>>7698023
baka
>>7698018
Reality is confusing.
Fiction further mediates this aspect.
Within this confusion we can identify constellations of meaning.
This revelation can be nauseating, or wondrous.
Borges amplifies this in all regards by placing philosophy within fiction, fiction within fiction, fiction within history.
What you are left with is either a proliferation of symbols to the point of vertigo (mirrors, cities, legends, history, mazes, libraries, lotteries, metaphysics, dreams, immortality), or a benign poverty (rural, night, death).
Familiarize yourself with Zeno's paradoxes. Borges himself wrote an essay explaining it. If you come across a school of philosophy in his writing, just google it. Not only is it not that difficult to read, it's also one of the most engaging and exciting books I've ever read.
>>7698055
How fluent are you?
>>7698081
I don't really think Zeno's paradoxes are the skeleton key to his work.
They're just one contradiction in a vast play of ideas.
>>7698018
we're reading selections from this for my detective fiction class. read ahead and I really liked The Garden of Forking Paths and the Circular Ruins
>>7698102
lo suficiente como para leer a garcía márquez (not even that fluent)
>>7698018
What part of it did you not get?
desu i like borges but have never gotten the love. his work seems to me often lacking in depth
What's to get?
How did this hack become a meme here?
>>7698018
There's not really much to get. The historical and religious allusions are there to give the stories a seemingly grounded tone, in contrast to the paradoxical and bizarre things that actually occur in them. You're not necessarily supposed to recognise each and every one of the references, but if you do, then I guess it's a bonus.
And yes, some of the stories are quite difficult, and it doesn't help that the translations don't exactly read smoothly. Borges isn't the kind of stuff I could read with the TV blaring in the background, put it that way.
>>7698762
Oops, didn't realise you were reading it in Spanish. I'm not sure if the prose feels as contrived compared to the translations, but I dunno. Which stories are you struggling with?
>>7698018
I read it today as my first Borges
Tlon, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius blown me the fuck away, shit was beautiful.
>>7698791
Lol, really?
Why?
It's cool because even when you discover some new truth in his universe it just makes things even more confusing.
The more he dishes out information the more you are lost. The feeling of seeing these horizon of the rational speed up in front of you as you approach makes the mystification of the past speed up behind you as you try to escape it.
>>7698018
It's about undermining verisimilitude. Borges stories often contain a piece of fiction presented as a document that as the reader you know is fake and you aren't asked to suspend your disbelief. Instead this this sits there and a smolders in it's falseness until the story itself burns up along with it.
>>7698210
what, to you, gives a story depth? if you're looking for "deep" characters, relationships, narratives, you wont find much of those in borges. the stories of borges more or less intellectual exercises, experiments which explore a set of philosophical ideas (which almost always conflict) through fiction.
for example: the garden of forking paths. a quick read will give you a story about a spy and his unexpected encounter with his ancestry, which he destroys in his efforts to reinforce. however, the appeal of borges lies in the mechanics operating underneath the story: time as both changeable and fleeting, infinite and singular. speech as action, action as speech (where advocates of these two ideas often contend in real life, borges places them neatly beside each other), the objectivity of the written word and so on. there's always plenty to chew on.
>>7698018
borges demands rereading. if you don't really get it, read it again. and again.
>>7698952
Man is that so true about borges. I've re-read him so many times and have come to a lot different and disparate conclusions about his work.
>>7698803
Because shit is tipitty top tier, mayne
>>7698018
You might want to provide further information.
What is your problem ?
What short story are you having problems with?
What did you already get/notice?
Also >>7698075
is nice.
Borges takes a little brainbreakage to get into and immense knowledge/brains to exhaust what he offers to you, so, don't give up, skeleton.
>What you are left with is either a proliferation of symbols to the point of vertigo
This was exactly what scared me away at first. Tlon, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius was just overwhelming and I would have quit then and there, but The Circular Ruins and Library of Babel were a bit more accessible and thoroughly enjoyable.
You really take more away from Borges the more well-read you are. Now when I read his works I just let some of the stories go over my head. I can still respect them, but I'm resigned to not being able to appreciate them.
Hey guys what about the Aleph and other stories
Should I read that after fictions?
>>7698952
>what, to you, gives a story depth? if you're looking for "deep" characters, relationships, narratives, you wont find much of those in borges. the stories of borges more or less intellectual exercises, experiments which explore a set of philosophical ideas (which almost always conflict) through fiction.
His stories are just clever little metafictional jokes. I mean real clever but there's hardly anything seriously literary going on.Borges is a hack desu
>>7698791
One of the greats. Pynchon liked it enough to work an adaptation of it into Mason & Dixon. This story just lets you consider so much. What really is the difference between fiction and reality? The cult of scholars searching for any more information, not knowing whether or not the encyclopedia is detailing a real world and culture, or if they're just being led on a most intricate practical joke. Did they ever really want to find out the truth? Did they just want to be the first 'explorer' to find the truth, and destroy the mystery? Was there any artistic merit in the project itself?
>>7699656
You really have selective reading. You seem to only notice things that confirm your own retarded ideas.
I hate to burst your bubble but trump won't be elected president.
>>7698018
I'm about to read this book. What should I read beforehand to get the most out of it? Or is that even necessary?
>>7700183
>trump won't be elected president
we'll see about that
>>7700562
Point taken. I'll cut it out.
>>7699550
this, and also read a A Universal History of Infamy
>>7700464
Metamorphoses.
Know important parts of the Bible, know important parts of 1001 Nights. Know some stuff 'bout Freud. Have at least an Idea of what jewish mysticism is about. Just a general outline of what all of these mean (besides the bible).
Generally, Borges is well read. More so than you. You won't get everything, that is not expected and not needed.
If that is too much/not needed in your opinion have a general idea about the intellectual landscape (the state of idea history) before and after him. That will suffice!
If all that is still too much or too broad, just pay close attention to the topics presented. That will be enough to get you thinking and exploring.
Enjoy the ride and tell us about your experience.
> Rodríguez Monegal asserts: I could not understand why he took so long in arriving at the same luminous perspectives which Borges had opened up years earlier. His famed >“deconstruction” [...] was all too familiar to me: I had experienced it in Borges avant la lettre. (1985/1990: 128)
>>7699656
i've heard this opinion before, and it all it tells me is that you haven't read borges very well or at all. a joke implies some sort of definite punchline. borges's stories leave more questions than answers, i've even seen borges criticized by many (including bloom) for not committing to a single solution to his labyrinths/puzzles/"jokes".
>>7699656
As Chesterton said, taking literature seriously is a very amateurish thing to do.
>>7701048
then stick to hunger games. seems your level if you like borges.
>>7699656
You must really dislike David Lynch's last two movies.
>>7701055
Ah so you're just attempting to sling poorly thought out insults and are not really interested in critiquing Borges. Noted.
>tfw jumped into it thinking it was going to be just your average light reads short story book
>>7701059
while you sling poorly thought out quotes and have no actual interest in critiquing that post
Haven't read any yet, but here's an interesting doco that may help to place him in context for other newbies like me: https://youtu.be/_krRAietcTI
>>7701086
Who was I quoting and what was there to critique?
>>7699782
Is this a serious post? I can't tell if you're parodying.hurr that's the joke.
>>7700643
Thanks man.
>>7699035
.....
