Is it a violation of Asceticism if I get drunk?
duh, ya fuck
>>7482909
>Asceticism
Fuckin' dumbest thing I've ever heard. Buncha fuckin' twats. Dumb motherfuckers.
>>7482909
/lit/ - literature
asceticism is a spook
>>7482959
immediate pleasure is a spook
>>7482968
making up dichotomies is a spook
What is your goal in being an ascetic? That is likely relevant.
>>7482923
rahted, is that there lady giving birth mid-whatever it is thats going on here?
>>7482909
IM MARRIED TO THE CROSS AND THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB
>>7483003
Hi. I don't usually post things like this but I legitimately fucking hate living. I've alienated my friends, I'm miserable, getting out of bed in the morning is a chore. I don't have the courage to kill myself, at all. I've decided to dedicate my life to a "greater good" or higher purpose and go into medicine. I have very little concern for my own well being but I figure I may as well try to do something good while on Earth. I didn't even know what Asceticism was until about an hour ago when some anon mentioned it to me but I'm trying to figure out what my life is.
Thanks
bump
please /lit/ help
being on the computer is a violation. asking for advice is a violation. i bet you even eat things other than unleavened bread, you fucking indulgent creep. also, bumping is a violation.
>>7483162
I ate some oranges and pomegranates today.
>>7483164
citrus is a violation. also, superfruits are a violation. obviously i would suggest self flagellation, but you're probably a masochist and the endorphins would be a violation. really, you may as well just go out and find new friends and live life as a hedonist, you've ruined asceticism before you even started.
>>7483171
I didn't even intend to start it please help me I don't believe in reckless hedonism
>>7483175
hedonism isnt reckless if it pleases you to do what is right for yourself above all else. be less optimistic about your pessimism, and things will look a lot less grey and more monocromatic. soon, you'll be looking off into the distance, the doleful symphonies of ancients rising and falling with your slow breaths, a sunset scorching your cheeks and a freshly soiled nudey mag in your clutches. dude, just cheer up. find some therapy, don't get into psychiatric meds, and find and establish a support system you can rely on, make the steps necessary for getting yourself out of this rut, and don't rely too heavily on new concepts that will likely serve to make you feel more guilty.
>>7483188
Thanks for your sincerity anon
>>7483200
no problemo. it's possible to live a life worth living, anon. just work towards something, make goals for yourself that are attainable, simple, and that can be changed when circumstances change. you don't need to build your life up in a day, and no one really expects you to. just, don't give up. you're not alone.
>>7483086
Asceticism is going to be the hardest thing to do from the outset, you are better off just being a stoic first if you are giving us free reign over what you should believe in order to solve your problems.
>>7483188
>don't get into psychiatric meds
Even when I was at my most anxious and depressed I am most glad that I did not take these and found a conscious solution. You will find that every doctor will want you to have them as an option because they have no idea how people operate - sure they can describe it and measure your pain well, but they are afraid to offer or force a direction other than stagnation because that would be "unethical".
>>7483297
i will say that sometimes medication is an absolute necessary at the direst of situations.
however, 999/1000, it's just guesswork in a white lab coat.
'moderate asceticism' is a decent lifestyle choice. i've been having a better time at living ignoring females and their representations and eating rice and beans.
>"Life is full of suffering, and its chief purpose is pleasure. There is no god and no after-life; men are the helpless puppets of the blind natural forces that made them, and that gave them their unchosen ancestry and their inalienable character. The wise man will accept this fate without complaint, but will not be fooled by all the nonsense of Confucius and Mozi about inherent virtue, universal love, and a good name: morality is a deception practised upon the simple by the clever; universal love is the delusion of children, who do not know the universal enmity that forms the law of life; and a good name is a posthumous bauble which the fools who paid so dearly for it cannot enjoy. In life the good suffer like the bad, and the wicked seem to enjoy themselves more keenly than the good”
>>7483086
Hi, idk if you will end up reading this but I hope you don't feel too bad this morning. Stay hydrated!!
Anyway, ascetic practices can be a great thing, but it likely won't help you with the root of your problems right now. Please see a professional, if only to talk and figure out a plan moving forward. Once you're in a better place you might look into slowly incorporating ascetic practices for cultivating willpower, etc. Many different religions have histories of ascetic orders, and books on general mysticism will give you ideas about specific practices and their reasons (fasting, celibacy, meditation or contemplation, reducing ones possessions to the minimum, avoiding inebriation, etc.)
Good luck, I believe in you anon!!
>>7483841
Thank you anon.
>>7483086
Make sure medicine is definitely something you really want to do, and that you're not just doing it because it's the "right" thing to do. Not saying you shouldn't give it a try, but taking such a big step and finding that it's not what you really want can leave you in an even darker place than before. Focus on being happy with yourself first, consider seeing someone to help you with that. When you're happy with yourself, and believe in yourself on a basic level, what you want out of life becomes much clearer, and it's like a mist clears from your mind.
Neither hedonism nor asceticism will give you the answer you seek.
Things can always get better, you just gotta take a step to make sure you move forward and don't get stuck.
>>7483539
He had it all figured out yet for the succeeding millennium plus we've still been ignoring it
>Asceticism
>Not just chilling and saying "oh, look at that, isn't that neat" when you enjoy something without absolutely dedicating yourself to enjoying it
Extremes are generally inauthentic, as is your asceticism based on your desire to have it be validated by anonymous posters on an Uighur mincemeat preparation forum.
>>7482909
senpai, read The Bhagavad Gita
it's bretty good if you feel like >>7483086
>>7482909
What does this have to do with literature?
>>7483207
What to do when you have difficulty fully committing yourself to a goal? For the past few weeks I've been working towards being of sounder body and mind, and I've made some real, quantifiable progress, but lately I've been asking myself "what's the fucking point?" and am increasingly tempted to revert to my old habits of heavy drinking, pot smoking, snacking, and forgoing my daily exercise. How do I get my motivation back?
>>7484740
>"what's the fucking point?"
you'll feel like shit again, there's a nice quote in the Bhagavad Gita where spiritual pleasure 'taste like poison at first, but tastes like nectar in the end'.
for normal pleasure you derive from snacking,pot-smoking and drinking, it's the opposite. It tastes like nectar at first but in the end it's poison.
You'll feel better, in the long run, if you don't run after transient,destructive shit like alcohol and junk food.
>>7484751
I still feel like shit after constructive pursuits though. My mood improved immensely after I first got back into exercising again, but now that it's become routine I've gone back to feeling the same way I did before.
>>7484824
There's only so much you can do, m8.
>>7484841
not him but that chart is 100% bullshit, internal state of mind IS happiness, the rest is just window dressing.
>>7484858
That internal state of mind stuff refers to attitudes and such you can cultivate but you can only control those to a degree. If you're predisposed to be miserable there's only so much you can do.
Your mind is the activity of your brain, and what your brain is like is determined by your genes, and some people have brains with greater capacities for and baselines of happiness than others. People do not have equal opportunities to live a worthwhile and fulfilled life, some of us are just inherently fucked.
>>7484841
>implying we can control our circumstances
>>7484841
>genetics
What the fuck?
>>7484841
>>7485425
This is some next level fedora shit.
No offense to anyone, but the gene thing isn't that different from the God of monotheistic religions. Look at it and see the difference: you're miserable because it's God's will and you can do nothing about it; you're miserable because it's the genes' fault and you can do nothing about it.
All miserable people I've met were miserable because of psychological issues - like guilt, consequences of parental abuse, dissatisfaction with their life - and even they could actually experience profound happiness at moments. You can be homeless and be ecstatic, and you can be rich and miserable - it all depends on your inner mental state, and that thing is like playdoh, that is, it takes no effort to modify. Some people just prefer to be miserable because it's actually gives them a very good ego boost - the victim card - and so instead of actually changing their lives, they spend whining about everyone and everything.
>>7485425
How can you know what the 'genetic' range of happiness/misery is unless you make an effort to push your own boundaries? It's worth the effort, in my opinion.
>>7485466
So what, just tell myself I'm happy and I will be?
>>7485505
not him but it's obviously not as quick as that.
frequent meditation and cultivation of mental silence will dispel all worries and miseries.
>>7485466
>No offense to anyone, but the gene thing isn't that different from the God of monotheistic religions. Look at it and see the difference: you're miserable because it's God's will and you can do nothing about it; you're miserable because it's the genes' fault and you can do nothing about it
But that's not the point at all, the point is that part of it is within your control and part of it isn't. Denying the latter and saying that it's all within your control and some people are just whiners is unwarranted and has little to do with the facts. It's blind optimism and just world fallacy at work, kind of like thinking the poor are just lazy.
>>7485477
Of course, it's always worth the effort to try to be as happy as you can, because even the miserably inclined can have influence on how miserable they are exactly. But there are limits and there are people who simply can't be turned into happy people, at least not with science in its current state.
Some people need a psychiatrist and medication to deal with things and some aren't even helped by that. There are people on who all kinds of antidepressants and shock therapy and such have been tried and who are still so miserable they want to die. There are people for who there ultimately is no hope for happiness. This is an unpleasant truth, but denying or downplaying this is ultimately worse because people with serious, unsolvable problems are told that it 'takes no effort to modify your mindstate' and that they just 'prefer to be miserable' like the anon I replied to above thinks.
>>7485524
Meditation is obviously beneficial but a mindfulness course will not cure schizophrenia and clinical depression. Kind of like how moderate exercise is beneficial to cardiovascular health but will not cure a genetic heart condition.
Some people's brains are just 'broken' just like the rest of people's bodies can be broken.
>>7485553
>Blind optimism is bad
http://www.joyamartin.com/alice-herz-sommer/
https://oliviergoetgeluck.wordpress.com/2014/01/05/mans-search-for-meaning-a-concentration-camp-survivor-on-finding-meaning-in-life/
First of all, happiness is not a permanent state. You can be happy all of the time; just like you can be depressed all of the time. Even the most miserable person in the world sometimes experience a lifting of spirit.
>There are people on who all kinds of antidepressants and shock therapy and such have been tried and who are still so miserable they want to die.
Because all the things do is they treat symptoms, not the root of the problem. Oh, you're sad? Here, have this pill. Oh, the effect ended and you're still sad. Take another. It's like alcoholism and substance abuse - you'll never manage to kick the habit off until you understand what sets it off in the first place.
>>7485603
>Some people's brains are just 'broken' just like the rest of people's bodies can be broken.
I don't believe that.
I've had to deal with OCD myself and the worst thing you can do is think you're a victim and think that the obsessions and compulsions are 'natural'.
It's been proven that people with OCD brain's work much differently than people without OCD, however through CBT therapy the brain can slowly become normal. Just because its broken doesn't mean it can't be fixed.
>>7485607
Optimism can be a great coping mechanism of course, but can also be perverted into nasty things like saying something like happiness is within everyone's reach and those who aren't happy just aren't trying hard enough.
>First of all, happiness is not a permanent state. You can be happy all of the time; just like you can be depressed all of the time. Even the most miserable person in the world sometimes experience a lifting of spirit.
Sure, moods can differ, but people do have certain baselines and these differ per person. You can still say that person X is on average much more miserable than person Y even if they both laugh and cry once in a while.
>Because all the things do is they treat symptoms, not the root of the problem. Oh, you're sad? Here, have this pill. Oh, the effect ended and you're still sad. Take another. It's like alcoholism and substance abuse - you'll never manage to kick the habit off until you understand what sets it off in the first place.
Alcoholism is actually a good comparison, since it's caused by a mixture of circumstance and genetic disposition. Some people just don't stand a chance against booze even if they have an otherwise pleasant life.
Addiction is another one of those issues where a lot of people say 'lel just man up faggot if i can be sober you can be sober' because people don't actually realise that for some people being sober is the easiest thing in the world while for others it's nearly impossible for reasons mostly outside of their control.
It's strange how we can accept that people with healthy lifestyles and good habits can get cancer nonetheless but with mental issues that understanding goes out of the window. With a lot of things, the thing that 'sets it off' is you, not some easily removed external factor or long repressed childhood memory or something like that.
>>7485622
Some people's cancer gets cured, some people's cancer doesn't. Some people's disformed feet can be fixed, some people's disformed feet can't. Some deafness can be cured, some doesn't.
Thinking that matters of the brain are for some reason different than the rest of the body and that every instance can be fixed no matter what is completely unfounded optimism.
I'm not advocating for complete defeatism in every case, I'm merely saying that just because it is broken doesn't mean it can certainly be fixed either. Sometimes broken stays broken.
>>7485648
i get the impression most people's disagreement stems from the feeling that you're being inappropriately negative? there is a time and a place to say "some people are fucked, tough titties", and a discussion centered on one individual's struggles (where one opinion can carry significant weight) is not necessarily the place to continually argue for the fact that fate fucks some over. i hope that makes sense. it's not an argument against you yourself btw, just my own feelings on the matter. you might be doing more harm than good- but then, you might be doing more good than harm as well!
>>7482909
It is a component of most of the traditions and practices which are typically called or considered ascetic.
It is a minimal expectation of self restraint prevalent even for lay practitioners in, for example, Islam and most schools of contemporary and historical Buddhism. It may be considered Gluttony in certain contexts by Catholicism.
>>7486518
I see what you mean, but I consider it a cruelty to try to get people to believe there is always light at the end of the tunnel and giving them false hope, even if that hope might help them along for a while as well. It can make them even more miserable, alienated and self-hating when everyone is paying lip service to the emperor's clothes and they just can't see it.
I think unwarranted optimism is responsible for a lot more misery than what may seem at times to be inappropriate negativity, because a lot of the time reality will kick in sooner or later.
It's hard to see people be indignant and confused when, for example, their child is dying of leukemia because the culture of optimism around them didn't make them consider this as a serious possibility when they reproduced, for example. There's a certain optimistic bias that makes people take a lot of irresponsible risks that they ultimately regret, and since this mechanism is so deeply ingrained in them the answer generally is more unwarranted optimism. It's a self-perpetuating disappointment factory where denial is a constant tonic for the general cognitive dissonance most people live with.
>>7485466
You missed the point completely. This is (supposedly) based on science, on research. However the fuck you interpret it is irrelevant.
I don't know how trustworthy the studies are, but you're still full of shit.
