What texts should be ABSOLUTE mandatory reading before leaving public schooling?
My list:
The Epic of Gilgamesh
The Iliad
The Odyssey
The Republic
The Bible (KJV)
The Divine Comedy
Hamlet
Romeo and Juliet
Paradise Lost
>>7395526
the god delusion
guns germs and steel
infinite jest
>>7395544
more like infinite duress (when you are reading it)
I would remove Romeo and Juliet from your list. Go for Hamlet and Twelfth Night. Hamlet is obvious, Twelfth Night is a great contrast and very prevalent in popular culture while being less known than Romeo and Juliet. Students will know the story of Romeo and Juliet even if they don't read it, and while obviously it would be best for them to experience the entire story, we're better off exposing them to Twelfth Night, which is popular enough to be relevant but not popular enough to be known by all.
Chaucer is necessary, you missed him. At least the general prologue and a few of the regularly anthologized Canterbury Tales.
Sir Gawain is essential.
I honestly think that covers it for British stuff. At least longer form stories/works.
I think that in general we shouldn't force our youth to read too many long form works though. Short stories allow for a much wider range of experience. Instead of reading three books a semester a student can read 30 short stories or excerpts.
>Public School
>Plebelic School
>>7395675
>being this American
>not knowing what it means here.
The cat in the hat
>>7395526
Half of the kids in public school couldn't read the divine comedy
shitty Shakespeare pic
>>7395712
Fucking plebs don't even speak Italian
>>7395526
This list doesn't make sense. Why “Romeo and Juliet”, “The Divine Comedy”, “The Iliad” and “The Odyssey”? What would it bring to a child?
First of all, I wouldn't teach anything related to the Bible before secondary school, and would then restrict it to selected pieces. Probably a book from the Pentateuch, a couple of verses from the Ecclesiastes or the Proverbs, the gospel of Matthew and one of the epistles to the Corinthians or to the Romans. It would illustrate clearly and lightly the Biblical law, a bit of Hebrew poetry, the philosophical shift made by Jesus of Nazareth—The sermon on the mount is one of the most significant written testimony in our history—and finally a letter of Paul, both for its positive and modern interpretation, its influence on Christian doctrine and its importance regarding a future study of Protestantism.
“The Epic of Gilgamesh” isn't geographically relevant enough to be made mandatory and, honestly, I can't find a lot of advantages in reading ancient tales. It applies to “The Iliad” and “The Odyssey” as well, I don't think we gain so much. Furthermore, since these two are hexameter works poetry, any translation would compromise the benefit yielded and reduce its suitability in such a corpus so I would rather teach a comprehensive course on mythology with some excerpts. I have the same opinion with “The Republic”; since we don't plan to cover it in the original text, I would avoid its dense prose and twisted approach through dialogues by giving an adequate course in philosophy.
“Romeo and Juliet” is a bad choice due to its already broad popularity, as it was mentioned above. I can't really comment this part, I'm not a native English speaker but it looks to me “Hamlet” is a wise choice with, maybe, a comedy and a bit of poetry to show multiple genres. I have no opinion on “Paradise Lost” but I doubt “The Divine Comedy” is relevant in any way. It's an Italian classic, one of its main feature is to have been published directly in Italian and not in Latin—which doesn't concern us—and its theme albeit of a modest relevance in fine arts has hardly its place in the kind of list we're looking for.
(1/2)
>>7395723
Excluding the Bible regarding what I stated earlier, here is my following titles but note I'm French and write in a French perspective. I suggest the four following authors for their literary and cultural influence, and the next four to form train the student's mind. I prefer to focus on political philosophy for its concrete application and leave the ethics to the study of the Bible and the literature. This list may change or expand, it depends on what the curriculum is made of. If Latin also becomes compulsory, selected works among Latin poets might be a good idea yet a comprehensive introduction to Ancient Greek is unfortunately a bit too tough so I wouldn't consider it.
“Toilers of the Sea” by Victor Hugo
“The Flower of Evil” by Charles Baudelaire
“Wind, Sand and Stars” by Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
“Against the Grain” by Joris-Karl Huysmans
“The Concept of Anxiety” by Soren Kierkegaard
“The Technological Society” by Jacques Ellul
“Being and Time” by Martin Heidegger
“The Imaginary Institution of Society” by Cornelius Castoriadis
(2/2)
>>7395526
>Romeo and Juliet
Macbeth is so much better. Othello too.
>>7395670
>>7395734
Agree Macbeth is the shit. Othello too.
But, Romeo and Juliet is mad essential for high school because it's about idiot teenage love. Kids in high school are gonna be reading Shakespeare in class with an hour-long boner because Sally Cooperschmidt is wearing a push up bra that day. Romeo and Juliet is going to be a lot more relevant than other plays.
>>7395526
In the English curriculum:
Lord of the Flies
Animal Farm
Macbeth
Romeo and Juliet
The Crucible
+ lots of poetry, lots of short stories
In other classes:
Guns, Germs and Steel
The Selfish Gene
(also for Divine Comedy, Inferno is all you need.)
>>7395766
>Lord of the Flies
>Animal Farm
I think these choices are outdated. They were more contemporary and relevant in the past but at this point they're just mediocre novels that won't stay with children in 2016 onward.
>>7395779
>books have used by dates
>>7395787
They do when they aren't particularly good.
Those books had a more obvious place in reading lists of the past. Now they're just easy, mediocre novels that explore dated, semi-complex ideas.
You could pick a far more timely novel to present to a child. Or even a non fiction book that discusses the impacts of the internet on our lives. Why not make our kids read The Shallows? It's warning of a dystopian future in a way that is more tangible for young people today.
>>7395678
underrated post desu
A Tale of Two Cities
Infinite Jest
Macbeth/Othello
1984/A Clockwork Orange
Green Eggs and Ham/A Critique of Pure Reason
Finnegans Wake
>>7395725
>“The Concept of Anxiety” by Soren Kierkegaard
Do you have an epub link? I can't find one for some reason
I was an above-average reader in high school and I seriously struggled with Shakespeare. I also hate Romeo and Juliet, but that's neither here nor there.
I feel like there's a certain amount of reading proficiency that just has to come with time and age. It doesn't matter how intelligent you are, as a kid you lack the general world knowledge that is essential to understanding what you read. 400-year-old literature doesn't make any fucking sense if you don't already have some context to draw on. The language is just too different, and footnotes are a chore.
I think the way to do it would be to start teaching kids the stories when they're still in elementary (primary) school. Show them the plays, read excerpts aloud, teach them about the settings, introduce some basic logic concepts if you're going to have them read philosophy. Then by the time they're leaving school they will actually be capable of interpreting these things.
>>7395779
I have never met a single person who didn't love Lord of the Flies. As for timeliness, come on, when will kids being shitty to each other ever stop being relevant?
>>7395526
>Bible
>Divine Comedy
>Paradise Lost
Mods ban this disgusting eurocentrism! I've never seen someone out themselves so quickly before.
>>7395843
>I seriously struggled with Shakespeare
>I was an above-average reader in high school
No you weren't. I mean sure, freshman year maybe, but by the upperclassmen years you should have little trouble with Shakespeare--as you say it 'comes with time and age'
>standardized curriculum
>mandatory reading
yeah, no thanks
>>7395526
I read the last word as shooting.
>>7395670
>Sir Gawain is essential.
I wouldn't say so. Really, replace Gawain with something GOOD from that time period. Dante is the obvious choice. Maybe some Cavalcanti. Gawain is a nice poem but considering its time period it's quaint, unintelligent, and folksy. All students should read a good translation of Dante, at least the first two canticles. I think the third would be a bit much for most.
> I honestly think that covers it for British stuff.
I think schools should have students memorize and pick apart some Donne poems for a few weeks, but that's me.
>>7396506
>it's quaint, unintelligent, and folksy
As a postgrad who did a lot of work on the Pearl/Gawain poet, 10/10, I'm livid
imo desu senpai
>>7396516
yeah I was mostly joking, the hunting scenes are beautiful
but being serious, why Gawain when there's Dante?
>>7395841
No, sorry. I dislike eBooks.
>>7395536
The End of Faith would be better in my opinion.
>>7396546
Not him, but I assume that we are focusing here on an English-language audience
>>7395526
+ Don Quixote
>>7396611
I suppose, but they're not going to give the students the middle english Gawain in school anyways, so they're still reading a "translation" (in the case of Gawain) or a translation (Dante) either way. The former is a pleasant poem from the time period, the latter is a work for all ages
>>7395723
>but I doubt “The Divine Comedy” is relevant in any way. It's an Italian classic, one of its main feature is to have been published directly in Italian and not in Latin—which doesn't concern us—and its theme albeit of a modest relevance in fine arts has hardly its place in the kind of list we're looking for.
oh god this is what people who haven't read more than Inferno actually believe
>>7396164
I went through the same thing. It took a lot of familiarization and dedication for me to understand the phrasing and diction in Shakespeare. I was probably 20 before I had the chance to sit down and listen to it to really get it.
>>7395544
Seems more like a grad school age read, I'm waiting until I'm out of uni
>>7395526
take romeo and juliet away and you're fine
2001
Paper Towns
Romeo and Juliet
Harry Potter
Slaughterhouse Five
Catcher In The Rye
>>7398163
funny post friend!
Goosebumps
C++ for dummies
Excel for beginners
Hatchet
Babyfucker
Naked Lunch
Robinson Crusoe
Dr. Jackal and the Arabs
>>7395712
>Half of the kids in public school couldn't read the divine comedy
The majority of adults, myself included miss a lot of the allusions and references.
Reading The Aeneid and Metamorphosis helps fill some gaps though.
>>7395675
Amerifat detected.
What was the worst book everyone had to read for highschool?
My diary desu
>>7395526
>The Iliad
>The Odyssey
Overrated
>The Bible (KJV)
Not even the best version
>The Divine Comedy
Dante is a spergling heretic with a hard on for self inserts.
You have shit taste, son. Yet, from an educational standpoint, you may be correct. Still have shit taste.
>>7395539
Wimpy Cultural Marxist detected.
>Mandatory to graduate
The Iliad
The Odyssey
The Bible
1 or 2 works by every great writer, for at least the 19 and 20th centuries.
>>Mandatory to get into college/academy
Illiad
Odyssey
Importent works of Sophocles
The Bible and The Old Bible
(Divine comedy?)
all of Shakespeare
Seleted works of great writers for at least the 19th and 20th centuries.
3-4 selected poems by the most importent poet.
Any philosophy 101 text.
>>7398746
poets*, of course.
>>7395526
what publisher is that?
>>7398772
appears to be Easton Press
>>7396759
>but they're not going to give the students the middle english Gawain in school anyways
Why not? They can at least give a bilingual edition like with Beowulf
If properly footnoted and glossed, the Gawain poet's writings are far from unreadable.
>>7395526
In no real order:
The Bible (NJB/Knox/NABRE)
Fahrenheit 451
The Catcher in the Rye
The Grapes of Wrath
To Kill a Mockingbird
1984
Catch-22
Animal Farm
The Great Gatsby
Of Mice and Men
The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
Lord of the Flies
Slaughterhouse-Five, or The Children's Crusade: A Duty-Dance with Death
A Tale of Two Cities
Moby-Dick
Nicomachean Ethics
The Elements of Style
Crime and Punishment
War and Peace
Oliver Twist
Death of a Salesman
The Iliad
The Odyssey
The Aeneid
The Divine Comedy
Paradise Lost
Gone with the Wind
Pride and Prejudice
The Civilized Engineer
The Existential Pleasures of Engineering
The Adventures of Tom Sawyer
Brave New World
Lolita
One Thousand and One Nights
The Abolition of Man
Fashionable Nonsense (Intellectual Impostures)
>>7399013
Nobody should read War and Peace without having read (alot of) other works by Tolstoy.
The fountainhead and atlas shrugged.
>>7395766
>>Guns, Germs and Steel
>The Selfish Gene
Worthless
>>7399013
>One Thousand and One Nights
Don't you think that's too big to teach in school? Maybe selected stories would be okay but that book is huge.
>>7399013
Way too fucking much for a teenager.
The reel list:
>literary criticism
>Elements of Style
>Hamlet
>Fahrenheit 451
>Odyssey
>The Bible
>1984
>Lord of the Flies
>The Republic
>>7399013
>Fashionable Nonsense
This. Postmodernism needs to die last year
What about the Qur'an, OP?
>>7399051
But honestly, I feel like we should be giving a ton of weight to literary criticism and how to interpret style, as well as teaching students different schools of thought and how culture has shaped literature. I would be opposed to having students read complete texts of Shakespeare without doing this.
I think that most of high school should be dedicated to knowing how to actually read, i.e. teaching students literary crit and different political/social movements from a literary viewpoint, as well as learning how to write concisely, because if you can write good text, you can read it. Then during about senior year, we delve into very advanced lit, because if you can read those texts easily you can read less complex lit in a snap.
>>7399051
Why do people keep putting dense philosophy on the list for fuck sub-eighteen kids? What the fuck is a high schooler going to get from The Republic that's of any value unless they go onto college?
Germinal
>>7395843
This, no matter how smart you are a lot of literature just won't ressonate with you because most kids that age will lack the worldly experience and human understanding necessary to connect with those works. You can still appreciate Shakespeare at that age, but your appreciation will most likely be purely intellectual, there's simply no substitute for reading something at a time in your life when you'll just "get it" without needing any context or footnotes.
>>7398989
let me repeat it: they're not going to give the students the middle english
chaucer is easier middle english, and yet they don't give him without a "Translation"
War is a racket
Common sense
Civil disobedience
