Honestly /lit/ how poor is Penguin when it comes to translations for philosophical works?
Take Plato, how poorly does Penguin treat his works?
Mostly they are fine. Good for English texts, but they can carry some good translations.
I never read any of these but I frequently heard the translation is awful. However, I wouldn't care too much about Plato and other philosophical texts as long as the key terms aren't butchered and work in verse—like Virgil—should never be translated, it loses all its sense. Eventually find a version en vis-à-vis with both the original language and a annotated English translation.
Plato's Aeneid is my favorite philosophical text desu
>>7392556
>translations
>>7392556
>'penguin translations are bad' meme
Where did this come from? Oxford might be preferable for many books, but the Penguins are still far better than the bowdlerized 19th century translations that many other publishers are still putting out.
>>7392556
they just use hollingdale for Nietzsche so I don't understand the stereotype. Do they even commission translations frequently?
>>7392617
I was under impression that the complete Plato and Aristotle were the go to texts, and that others like Penguin were worse off. Is that wrong?
>>7392556
really if you're being serious you'll want multiple editions of everything anyway and penguins are probably going to be included in that number.
If people worried less about the specific translation and instead spent more time actually reading the classics everyone would be better off
>>7392564
>Virgil—should never be translated,
Are you implying that everyone should learn Latin just to read Virgil?
Are you dumb?
>>7393218
Seems more likely anon's saying that only people who know Latin should bother reading Virgil.
>>7392556
why not just learn latin
Every translation of the Aeneid I've read was shit, you might as well read Dryden's because at least then you're reading Dryden
>>7392556
Penguin is perfectly good, I actually prefer their translation (Rieu) of the Iliad to any other and they are frequently used by my classics course.
They generally use good translations. Just check what translation they used and whether it is considered good. "what is a good translation of x" or "is x a good translation of x" generally bring up at least a few forum discussions/articles/whatever - it's case by case.
>>7393297
You've read multiple translations of Aeneid and once in Latin?
What is the point?
>>7393444
There are people out there who write > 500,000 words Sonic fanfiction
One anon reading more than one translation of a book he/she likes seems like nothing against that
>>7393448
At least the Sonic autist is creating something.
He's literally reading the same story over, with probably just minor differences in the translations.
And why would you read the translations when you can read the original?
People are insane senpai
>>7393453
>He's literally reading the same story over, with probably just minor differences in the translations.
>minor differences
how retarded are you
who let you in here
>>7393463
good response translation autist
>>7393463
>intentionally leaving out the word probably
>>7393471
>implying hedging your idiocy makes it any less idiotic
>>7393477
>coming from the guy who's response was basically REEE get out!
>>7393453
There's nothing wrong with re-reading works, one tends to get more out of them. Surely you've seen single films multiple times.
>>7393482
He's read it 3 times at least, which means he had to buy 3 different editions.
I can't imagine him doing that to multiple books, or is Aeneid just his favourite book?
Imagine someone owning 3 different copies of like 20 books, sounds weird
And movies tend not to last more than 2 hours, making re-watching it easier
>>7393480
however autistic i am, i prefer that than being retarded
>>7393494
Why do you care so much about his life and how he spends his time? Does it make you feel insecure or something?
>>7393498
No, I just get the nagging feeling that he's talking out of his ass.
>>7393503
So? The likelihood that he'll admit it, if that's the case, is absolutely none and people lie all the time on the internet.
Just let it go.
>>7393444
I've read some Fagles, all of Fitzgerald, and much of Dryden. Obviously this is not exhaustive. But I've also read other works in translation when I was learning other Latin poets and trying to sort out my own reading.
Every translation loses a great deal of meaning. This is partly due to the impossibility of translation, and partly due to somewhat sketchy trends in modern classicism and modern thought.
The best argument against translation I can give you is that nobody really knows everything that Vergil meant. Any translation is going to be limited not only by language constraints but also by the editor's understanding of the tone, the sense of each word, the effect that Vergil is aiming at. And these are restricted by what is thought consistent in modern thought; many editors, for example, have a hard time making sense Horace because parts of his mentality, to a modern man, seem inconsistent. How can he be very serious about wine AND Augustus? How can he advise against piety AND against presuming oneself above the gods? The only way you will ever get the whole Horace, and not a reconstructed personality imagined by some man who is not much more imaginative than you or me, is to read Horace in the original. Vergil is the same. The only way to get a reading that is neither too sympathetic nor too unsympathetic to Dido is to read Vergil's text.
And, as nobody doubts, you always lose the poetry in a translation. I do not need to tell you how good Vergil's hexameters are.
>>7393494
>He's read it 3 times at least, which means he had to buy 3 different editions.
Is that supposed to be unusual? I have 3 different Onegins, the Nabokov, the Norton edition and the Mitchell, and 3 Karamazovs, the Garnett and the McAndrew and the PV. And two of several texts.
>>7393515
>Is that supposed to be unusual?
No it's extremely common, every home I visit has multiple copies of the same books, it's something that most people do tbqh
>>7393524
>>>/trash/
Fuck off.
>>7393494
or I have access to a good library
>>7393255
I-is he right? I just bought a copy a week ago, did I waste money/
>>7393588
you're fine
The book is seriously fucked up. Whole pages: gone, pages transposed onto other pages. One page that's in Mandarin for some reason. And Penguin has all but told everyone to fuck off. Opening up my copy almost at random, I find a page that's entirely in capital letters and the facing page is just a giant doodle of a penis and at the bottom of the page it says "Fuck Penguin. I quit." So we're not just talking about a few ignorable errors. It's a catastrophe.
>>7393607
Nicely meme'd
I did some research on what Critique of Pure Reason to read and settled on the Penguin. I think it's good, and I like the way they divided the A/B versions.
But almost none of my philosophy books are Penguin, generally I would trust Cambridge, Oxford, or even Hackett editions first.
>>7393588
No. You must realise that the vast majoirty of people who know Latin were forced to learn it. 'Lost in translation' is a meme made to keep the working class man down.
>>7395013
[risus intensificat]
>>7393588
Well the Aeneid is a shit story, but otherwise, you're good.
>>7393588
>spending money on books
Well, you already fucked up, so you might as well read it.
>>7392561
this . I first read the republic translated on spanish and it was really hard, years later i read it on penguin classics and I was surprised how clear everything is .
