The degradation of the study of classics is symptomatic of the overall degradation of our education system in general.
It used to be that an emphasis was placed in universities on an understanding of history, and of the ancient debates that form the foundation of our modern society. The better your understanding of the past, it was thought, the better your understanding of the present would be. Under this way of thinking, western civilization was built and maintained, using governmental and economic systems with their roots 2000 years in the past.
This has all changed in the past century. Our focus myopically shifted to the here and now, with any study of history mocked as "irrelevant." The result has been that university is now seen exclusively as a pathway to employment. It fulfills this function well enough, but now graduates are too specialized to comment on general issues with anything approaching wisdom.
Those who favor the practical realities of the world study STEM fields and ignore everything else, but the humanities have not been spared from this trend either. Because those studying them now do so because they want to commit their entire life to them, it has become necessary to invent practical uses where previously none existed. So humanities has splintered into many separate "studies," which teach that something is wrong in the world, that human nature can somehow change, and that it is their job to do it, no matter how many traditions must be upended.
Thus the study of classics perishes, and the result is an ever-increasing tide of SJWs, and an inexcusable acceptance of Marxism.
You're wrong.
>>7389195
I'm not in academia but I'll tell you what's really going on: the post
as a classics student i really have to point out thatyou should go back to /pol/ zzzz
>>7389195
>which teach that something is wrong in the world, that human nature can somehow change, and that it is their job to do it, no matter how many traditions must be upended
anyone who knows anything about history would know how psychotic this statement is
>>7389211
4 IPs as of now
two out of three of those were samefag
>>7389211
He is right tho. In France at least.
>>7389195
>mfw coworker says there's no point studing classics because "it's so obviously wrong"
I concur with everything OP said.
>>7389195
Reported to your Unis diversity officer you bigot.
>>7389221
Shoo Shoo dumb frog poster
>>7389211
>>7389217
There were 4 unique IPs before that guy's post so he must be OP.
I agree. Studying the classics is the only way I've come to feel grounded in modern society. Without it, the times seem too bizarre to exist.
>>7389227
>>7389230
forgot pic
>>7389228
you're autistic
>>7389225
It isn't about getting a degree in it, that's useless except in pure academia. Humanities should be studied alongside something practical rather than specialized as it is now. OP is saying that the current state of the Classics is symptomatic of the way education has gone, not the cause.
Whether you agree that the effects of modern humanities are detrimental to society is another discussion that may or may not belong on /pol/.
>>7389228
But you're bullshitting or delusional.
Because there is no way that you consider ancient times or pre-modern times in general to be less "bizarre" than the very world you were born into, experienced first-hand, and utterly shaped by in every conceivable way, including, for that matter, the way in which you learn about the past.
This hallucinatory traditionalism /pol/ kids have adopted is the ultimate result of their social isolation and impotent, self-aggrandizing psychosis.
>>7389256
I too am confused why he would find ancient times to be less bizarre.
But maybe what he's saying could be rephrased. I think on a basic level classics can be grounding. Our systems of government are heavily modeled on classical philosophy, to the point that the people who framed them were known as classical liberals. To understand the classics is to understand why we live in the systems that we do.
At this point we go into more controversial subjects, but I think these people understood through their study of history that human nature fundamentally does not change, and built their systems with this in mind. (They were able to do this of course because they studied humanities alongside practical subjects) This is probably where OP gets the idea of the Marxist thought that it depends on its surroundings. I personally think that's been disproven multiple times, but there's been a lot of talk about it recently so maybe that's up for debate.
>>7389256
By "bizarre", I don't mean it in a sense that it's wrong. I mean instead that it's difficult to understand why things are done a certain way until their intentions are understood, and reading the classics has helped me a lot with that. It seems you're assuming I'm relating this to a recent shift such as in America over the past hundred years, but I mean development of societies in general.
>>7389256
/pol/'s definition of classics is Aurelius' Meditations and that's it. Maybe that's why they feel so self-certain and assured.
>>7389256
I think that was intended as a joke anon.
>>7389195
It's kind of terrifying how little people care to contextualize themselves in culture, society, and history, and there's a certain irony in failing to observe the warnings of historians over thousands of years who point out the dangers in failing to familiarize oneself with and avail oneself of the lessons and examples of history.
I was wrapping up Machiavelli's Discourses when this struck a chord with me: "[Men of our day] should be ready to hear of how those acted who in olden days had to deal with such problems, whereas, instead, so feeble are men owing to their defective education and to their little knowledge they have of affairs, that they look upon the judgements of their forefathers as inhuman in some cases and in others as impossible."
Also: "He who would foresee what has to be, should reflect on what has been."
I suggested that this ignorance is ironic because it is an ignorance that scorns "the classics," which when not scorned educate readers on the value of reading...the classics. If you totally remove people from interacting with literature and history, they have little reason beyond mere speculation to believe that those texts have anything of value to teach.
Have you ever noticed that people contemptuous of the classics have usually never read any of them? Most people who have read (some of) them may have texts they didn't like, may nitpick, may disagree with them, but will rarely if ever suggest that the classics are useless.
I studied in STEM and was really saddened by the narrow-mindedness of my classmates, who were preparing themselves to be great scientists, but wholly ignorant of history, culture, art, and really any idea of what it means to be human. As far as utility goes, that's great for the rest of us; they'll do well at work and make the world that much better/more efficient. But it's a sad shadow of life.
>>7389489
This is more or less exactly what I was getting at.
Also, read The Prince and Discourses on Livy this summer, loved them.
>>7389500
The Discourses were my first peek into modern political philosophy, and they were a lot of fun (I had just read Livy, so I figured I'd give the Discourses a shot while the source material was still fresh in my mind). Definitely an interesting contrast to what "Machiavellian" nature is so often and so widely considered to be.
>>7389256
Don't shadowbox the /pol/ bogeyman in everything you read and you won't sound so much like a paranoid retard. =)
Having taken a short course in Latin in High School, it was one of the most comfy and illuminating things I ever did. A feeling of being 'grounded' is exactly right. You can begin to see the influence of the ancient world in the present, and things can make a lot more sense when understood as a part of that continuing history and cultural heritage rather than simply being the present "what is".
Studying the past doesn't mean you have to worship it or take up traditionalism.
>>7389228
I'm currently reading The History by Herodotus. Twice already have people been fed the meat of child relatives without their knowledge. That seems less bizzare to you then today?
>>7389500
Um, shut up.
I approve of this thread.
>>7389195
Oh hey, this is an interesting opin...
>SJWS
>MARXISM
>>7390893
you retarded starbucks swilling faggot
he meant by reading the classics he gets an idea of how humans lived their lives, stared down adversity, and understood their world in a time when there weren't any modern conveniences to desensitize us to nature and reality
like jesus christ how hard is this to understand. but I guess I forgot, it's 2015 after all
>>7391071
>my bogeyman is realer than your bogeyman
kill yourself
>>7391142
Fuck off back to tumblr first
>>7391071
top kek
I'm about to break the fallacy meter but if you support either of those groups you are a retard
