> "In rock music, people have certain assumptions that it makes people more enlightened, and it really doesn't."
Is she right?
Are there any 20th-21st century lyricists that could stand alongside Eliot and Shakespeare?
>>7872229
>more enlightened
she just NEEDS to take the brown pill
IMO the greatest poets of our age have taken to music. Nevermind and Highway 61 Revisited are achievements in language and storytelling that truly stand their own against the works of older wordsmiths like Pound or Whitman
Kurt Cobain:
Come as you are, as you were
As I want you to be
As a friend, as a friend
As an old enemy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vabnZ9-ex7o
Bob Dylan:
Oh God said to Abraham, "Kill me a son"
Abe says, "Man, you must be puttin' me on"
God say, "No." Abe say, "What ?"
God say, "You can do what you want Abe, but
The next time you see me comin' you better run"
Well Abe says, "Where do you want this killin' done ?"
God says. "Out on Highway 61".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXjAVqLhXuo
>>7872229
I think they are just playing a different game. Lyrics have a different aesthetic context than poetry does.
Things like delivery and complementary instrumentation put different demands and liberties onto the musician than they do the poet.
On the one hand, I would say that it gives the musician the opportunity to be more experimental and bend and break the rules in ways that poets can't because they don't have that extra context to fall back on. On the other hand it has the potential to foster laziness and produce the ridiculous amount of shitty songs that exist.
Also it is more focused on the visceralness of what is produced that repetition becomes acceptable in a way that doesn't work with poetry.
>>7872229
yeah, Elvis.
>>7872245
cobain is average at best lyricist, discarded that opinion
Hip hop is usually lacking in complex subject matter but makes up for it in the beauty of its lyrical acrobatics:
Yes love, love your fucking attitude
Because the nigga play pussy, that's the nigga that's getting screwed
And bruised up from the pistol whipping
Welts on the neck from the necklace stripping
Then I'm dipping up the block and I'm robbing bitches too
Up the herringbones and bamboos
I wouldn't give a fuck if you're pregnant
Give me the baby rings and the #1 Mom pendant
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRh-wd8TbtI
>>7872245
Is "come as you are" an homage to Schmitt's concept of the political?
>>7872272
I agree he's highly overrated, but the adoration of middle school plebs in flannel doesn't sap his genius
The simplicity is deceptive, and extremely difficult to imitate. I've seen very few others write about youthful angst without slipping into emo angst/edgelord memery:
I'm so happy because today
I've found my friends
They're in my head
I'm so ugly, but that's okay, cause so are you
We've broken our mirrors
Sunday morning is everyday for all I care
And I'm not scared
Light my candles in a daze
Cause I've found god
Townes Van Zandt is the only answer.
>>7872245
i was about to shit on you but those nirvana lyrics are pretty solid t bh
Matt Berninger of The National:
I am good, I am grounded
Davy says that I look taller
I can't get my head around it
I keep feeling smaller and smaller
I need my girl
I need my girl
Remember when you lost your shit and
Drove the car into the garden
You got out and said I'm sorry
To the vines and no one saw it
I need my girl
I need my girl
>>7872284
it's an homage to Killing Joke's music
No one will have heard of them but I think Walter Mitty and His Makeshift Orchestra will be recognized for their lyrics some day. Relevant as all hell:
I saw the best minds of my generation popsicle
Frozen all the same and slowly melting from the adderall
And always getting dragged around by gender roles,
and zombie pharmaceuticals, the cubicle, the pay.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zlt1gvoAJC4
>>7872304
Won't you lend your lungs to me?
Mine are collapsing
Plant my feet and bitterly
Breathe up the time that's passing.
Breath I'll take and breath I'll give
Pray the day's not poison
Stand among the ones that live
In lonely indecision.
Fingers walk the darkness down
Mind is on the midnight
Gather up the gold you've found
You fool, it's only moonlight.
And if you stop to take it home
Your hands will turn to butter
Better leave this dream alone
Try to find another.
Salvation sat and crossed herself
And called the devil partner
Wisdom burned upon a shelf
Who'll kill the raging cancer
Seal the river at its mouth
Take the water prisoner
Fill the sky with screams and cries
Bathe in fiery answers
Jesus was an only son
And love his only concept
But strangers cry in foreign tongues
And dirty up the doorstep
And I for one, and you for two
Ain't got the time for outside
Keep your injured looks to you
We'll tell the world that we tried
Josh Tillman / Father John Misty
Oh, I just love the kind of woman who can walk over a man
I mean like a god damn marching band
She says, like literally, music is the air she breathes
And the malaprops make me want to fucking scream
I wonder if she even knows what that word means
Well, it's literally not that
Of the few main things I hate about her, one's her petty, vogue ideas
Someone's been told too many times they're beyond their years
By every half-wit of distinction she keeps around
And now every insufferable convo
Features her patiently explaining the cosmos
Of which she's in the middle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iY37fixfN_A
>>7872268
populist dreck
>>7872337
pleb tier desu
>>7872344
Yes, that's what rock music is.
>>7872229
IMO captures the fall of communism in Europe like nothing else
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDCDsKHCE8s
paul simon
leonard cohen
sufjan stevens
dude from talk talk on later albums
standing up to the greatest lyricist of the english language is a tall order, bub
>>7872229
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4rHizEn2aQ
The rabbit killer left his home for the club
And said goodbye to his infertile spouse
Carried air rifle and firm stock of wood
Carried night-site telescope light
A cemetery overlooked clough valley of mud
And the grave-keeper was out on his rounds
Yellow-white shirt buried in duffle coat hood
Keeping edges out with mosaic color stones
Jawbone and the air rifle
Who would think they would bring harm?
Jawbone and the air rifle
One is cursed and one is borne
The air rifle lets out a mis-placed shot
It smashed a chip off a valued tomb
Grave-keeper tending wreath-roots said
"Explain, move into the light of the moon"
"I thought you were rabbit prey, or a loose sex criminal"
Rifleman he say "Y'see I get no kicks anymore
From wife or children four
There's been no war for forty years
And getting drunk fills me with guilt
So after eight, I prowl the hills
Eleven o'clock, I'm too tired to fuck
Y'see I've been laid off work"
The grave-keeper said
"You're out of luck
And here is a jawbone caked in muck
Carries the germ of a curse
Of the Broken Brothers Pentacle Church
Formed on a Scotch island
To make you a bit of a man"
Jawbone and the air rifle
Who would think they would bring harm?
Jawbone and the air rifle
One is cursed and one is warm
The rabbit killer did not eat for a week
And no way he can look at meat
No bottle has he anymore
It could be his mangled teeth
He sees jawbones on the street
Advertisements become carnivores
And roadworkers turn into jawbones
And he has visions of islands, heavily covered in slime
The villagers dance round pre-fabs
And laugh through twisted mouths
Don't eat
It's disallowed
Suck on marrowbones and energy from the mainland
Jawbone and the air rifle
Who would think they would bring harm?
Jawbone and the air rifle
One is cursed and one is gone
>>7872360
Wrong. There's a difference between being populist and popular
>>7872374
true enough. But the only reason most musicians of the last century aren't taken as seriously as Coleridge or Dickinson is that crusty academics haven't gotten around to writing papers on them
And if a double-decker bus
Crashes in to us
To die by your side
Is such a heavenly way to die
And if a ten ton truck
Kills the both of us
To die by your side
Well the pleasure, the privilege is mine
>>7872390
Please, enlighten me about the pop nuances in rock music.
>>7872390
can't really tell if you're being serious or not but there are plenty of academic papers about/academics who write about song lyrics. they're certainly in the minority but to say that this is the "only reason" songwriters aren't taken as seriously is wrong on two fronts
also morrissey is probably not the best example for the high-water mark of lyricism
Out of the way, plebs, GOAT lyricist coming through
Somebody once told me the world is gonna roll me
I ain't the sharpest tool in the shed
She was looking kind of dumb with her finger and her thumb
In the shape of an "L" on her forehead
itt: anons trying to make their pop music adolescent feels "literary".
>>7872229
Basically just Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen. Maybe Jacques Brel
And they don't stand alongside Shakespeare, Eliot, sure.
>>7872399
Rock/pop/Hip-hop music is more conceptual than formal. You can see it as a continuation of trends originated in 19th century romanticism. Marshall McLuhan wrote about how the Beatles' music was about constructing an atmosphere, creating an artificial world. Music, lyrics, production are part of a whole, it's a mistake to try to isolate lyrics and disregard their relation to the other elements.
Popular music can be as analysable as literature. I think the average pop song can tell you much more about the zeitgeist than most contemporary works of 'literary' fiction. The artificial high-low distinction so cherished by /lit/ leads people to reject most of their world as 'unclean', unworthy of attention or analysis, reduces culture to something abstract and sterile disconnected from profane reality of reality tv, sponsored content and raw human emotion. In the end it's just a self-defeating and isolating attitude.
>>7872465
Most of the world really is unclean and unworthy of attention or analysis. Art is inherently elitist because beauty is rare. The trend in the past century or so of making art of the mundane and ugly is a bad joke that won't be remembered after the West is gone.
N I C K C A V E
I
C
K
C
A
V
E
>>7872465
>Rock/pop/Hip-hop music is more conceptual than formal
Do you actually believe this vapid generality? Truth is you are actively maintaining the high/low distinction by tying pop music to the zeitgeist.
>>7872399
It's simple anon. Like the sonnet, or the haiku, beauty in rock--a subset of popular music--emerges from the limitations of the form.
The challenge is building a meter within the verse-chorus structure, syncing it with a melody and rhythm, and then squeezing as much meaning into those lyrics as is possible in three minutes without resorting to cliches. All the difficulties of composing, poetry, and philosophy/politics are there, and yet all three of these things have to happen simultaneously.
This is why I believe writing a piece of powerful poetry as certain musicians have and making it listenable is artistry pure and simple
>>7872413
This kind of casual opinion is plebbery of the most pernicious sort, my friend
>>7872486
the world would be a better place if all you plebs laid down your smartphones and negroid syncopations for a while, took time to listen to some Bach and contemplate homoerotic neoclassical statuary. Y'all might learn something about Truth and Beauty.
>>7872503
Idiot
Dylan is eternal
They're selling postcards of the hanging
They're painting the passports brown
The beauty parlor is filled with sailors
The circus is in town
Here comes the blind commissioner
They've got him in a trance
One hand is tied to the tight-rope walker
The other is in his pants
And the riot squad they're restless
They need somewhere to go
As Lady and I look out tonight
From Desolation Row.
>>7872319
I love Matt's lyrics so much, but they always seem underwhelming when I see them written down. They're great lyrics because of how well they work musically, the rhythm of them, the obsessive way he latches onto weird little turns of speech and metaphor, the delivery. And then you see them written down and they just look trite out of the musical context.
That's what good lyrics should be imo, even though it's not great poetry.
>not a single post of Astral Weeks
>not a single Trout Mask Replica post
You're all awful
My smile is stuck
I cannot go back to your frownland
>>7872229
Against Shakespeare? No.
But Scott Walker is completely brilliant, so I'd accord him and his work considerable literary merit.
>>7872842
>>not a single post of Astral Weeks
my nigga
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ech6pZoBJ4
If I ventured in the slipstream
Between the viaducts of your dream
Where immobile steel rims crack
And the ditch in the back roads stop
Could you find me?
Would you kiss-a my eyes?
To lay me down
In silence easy
To be born again
To be born again
From the far side of the ocean
If I put the wheels in motion
And I stand with my arms behind me
And I'm pushin' on the door
Could you find me?
Would you kiss-a my eyes?
To lay me down
In silence easy
To be born again
To be born again
There you go
Standin' with the look of avarice
Talkin' to Huddie Ledbetter
Showin' pictures on the wall
Whisperin' in the hall
And pointin' a finger at me
There you go, there you go
Standin' in the sun darlin'
With your arms behind you
And your eyes before
There you go
Takin' good care of your boy
Seein' that he's got clean clothes
Puttin' on his little red shoes
I see you know he's got clean clothes
A-puttin' on his little red shoes
A-pointin' a finger at me
And here I am
Standing in your sad arrest
Trying to do my very best
Lookin' straight at you
Comin' through, darlin'
Yeah, yeah, yeah
If I ventured in the slipstream
Between the viaducts of your dreams
Where immobile steel rims crack
And the ditch in the back roads stop
Could you find me
Would you kiss-a my eyes
Lay me down
In silence easy
To be born again
To be born again
To be born again
In another world
In another world
In another time
Got a home on high
Ain't nothing but a stranger in this world
I'm nothing but a stranger in this world
I got a home on high
In another land
So far away
So far away
Way up in the heaven
Way up in the heaven
Way up in the heaven
Way up in the heaven
In another time
In another place
In another time
In another place
Way up in the heaven
Way up in the heaven
We are goin' up to heaven
We are goin' to heaven
In another time
In another place
In another time
In another place
In another face
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ke27QakSPxM
Little Jimmy's gone
Way out of the backstreet
Out of the window
Through the fallin' rain
Right on time
Right on time
That's why Broken Arrow
Waved his finger down the road so dark and narrow
In the evenin'
Just before the Sunday six-bells chime, six-bells chime
And all the dogs are barkin'
Way on down the diamond-studded highway where you wander
And you roam from your retreat and view
Way over on the railroad
Tomorrow all the tippin' trucks will unload
Every scrapbook stuck will glue
And I'll stand beside you
Beside you child
To never never never wonder why at all
No no no no no no no no
To never never wonder why at all
To never never never wonder why it's gotta be
It has to be
Way across the country where the hillside mountain glide
The dynamo of your smile caressed the barefoot virgin child to wander
Past your window with a lantern lit
You held it in the doorway and you cast against the pointed island breeze
Said your time was open, go well on your merry way
Past the brazen footsteps of the silence easy
You breathe in you breathe out you breathe in you breathe out you breath in
you breathe out you breathe in you breathe out
And you're high on your high-flyin' cloud
Wrapped up in your magic shroud as ecstasy surrounds you
This time it's found you
You turn around you turn around you turn around you turn around
And I'm beside you
Beside you
Oh darlin'
To never never wonder why at all
No no no no no
To never never never wonder why at all
To never never never wonder why it's gotta be
It has to be
And I'm beside you
Beside you
Oh child
To never never wonder why at all
I'm beside you
Beside you
Beside you
Beside you
Oh child
Am I the only one who thinks Marc Bolan was totally underrated as a lyricist? rare collision of camp and the sublime. Bebop Moons, Mambo Suns, Hubcap diamond star halos etc.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCUIuCuzdII
You gonna look fine
Be primed for dancing
You're gonna trip and glide
All on the trembling plane
Your diamond hands
Will be stacked with roses
And wind and cars
And people of the past
I'll call you thing
Just when the moon sings
And place your face in stone
Upon the hills of stars
And gripped in the arms
Of the changeless madman
We'll dance our lives away
In the ballrooms of mars
You talk about day
I'm talking 'bout night time
When the monsters call out
The names of men
Bob dylan knows
And I bet alan freed did
There are things in night
That better not to behold
You dance
With your lizard leather boots on
And pull the strings
That change the faces of men
You diamond browed hag
You're a gutter-gaunt gangster
John lennon knows your name
And I've seen his
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QzDWIOUnM0
And I will stroll the merry way
And jump the hedges first
And I will drink the clear
Clean water for to quench my thirst
And I shall watch the ferry-boats
And they'll get high
On a bluer ocean
Against tomorrow's sky
And I will never grow so old again
And I will walk and talk
In gardens all wet with rain
Oh sweet thing, sweet thing
My, my, my, my, my sweet thing
And I shall drive my chariot
Down your streets and cry
'Hey, it's me, I'm dynamite
And I don't know why'
And you shall take me strongly
In your arms again
And I will not remember
That I even felt the pain.
We shall walk and talk
In gardens all misty and wet with rain
And I will never, never, never
Grow so old again.
Oh sweet thing, sweet thing
My, my, my, my, my sweet thing
And I will raise my hand up
Into the night time sky
And count the stars
That's shining in your eye
Just to dig it all an' not to wonder
That's just fine
And I'll be satisfied
Not to read in between the lines
And I will walk and talk
In gardens all wet with rain
And I will never, ever, ever, ever
Grow so old again.
Oh sweet thing, sweet thing
Sugar-baby with your champagne eyes
And your saint-like smile....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8jPDdHd9y8
And I'm caught one more time
Up on Cyprus Avenue
And I'm caught one more time
Up on Cyprus Avenue
And I'm conquered in a car seat
Not a thing that I can do
I may go crazy
Before that mansion on the hill
I may go crazy
Before that mansion on the hill
But my heart keeps beating faster
And my feet can't keep still
And all the little girls rhyme something
On the way back home from school
And all the little girls rhyme something
On the way back home from school
And the leaves fall one by one by one by one
Call the autumn time a fool
Yeah baby my tongue gets tied
Every every every time I try to speak
My tongue gets tied
Every time I try to speak
And my inside shakes just like a leaf on a tree
I think I'll go on by the river with my cherry cherry wine
I believe I'll go walking by the railroad with my cherry cherry wine
If I pass the rumbling station where the lonesome engine drivers pine
And wait a minute, yonder comes my lady
Rainbow ribbons in her hair
Yonder comes my lady
Rainbow ribbons in her hair
Six white horses and a carriage
She's returning from the fair
Baby, baby, baby
And if I'm caught one more time
Up on Cyprus Avenue
And if I'm caught one more time
Up on Cyprus Avenue
And I'm conquered in a car seat
And I'm looking straight at you
Way up on, way up on, way up on....
The avenue of trees
Keep walking down
In the wind and the rain, darling
You keep walking down when the sun shone through the trees
Nobody, no, no, no, nobody stops me from loving you baby
So young and bold, fourteen years old
Baby, baby, baby...
Ooooh-ee
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFSmkY1hOsE
We strolled through fields all wet with rain
And back along the lane again
There in the sunshine
In the sweet summertime
The way that young lovers do
I kissed you on the lips once more
And we said goodbye just adoring the nighttime
Yeah, that's the right time
To feel the way that young lovers do
Then we sat on our own star and dreamed of the way that we were
and the way that we were meant to be
Then we sat on our own star and dreamed of the way that I was for you
and you were for me
And then we danced the night away
And turned to each other, say, 'I love you, I love you'
The way that young lovers do
Do, do, do, do...
Then we sat on our star and dreamed of the way that we were and the way
that we wanted to be
Then we sat on our own star and dreamed of the way that I was for you
and you were for me
I went on to dance the night away
And turned to each other, say, 'I love you, baby, I love you'
The way that young lovers do, lovers do, lovers do
Do, do, do, do....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrOgYjp20j0
Down on Cyprus Avenue
With a childlike vision leaping into view
Clicking, clacking of the high heeled shoe
Ford & Fitzroy, Madame George
Marching with the soldier boy behind
He's much older with hat on drinking wine
And that smell of sweet perfume comes drifting through
The cool night air like Shalimar
And outside they're making all the stops
The kids out in the street collecting bottle-tops
Gone for cigarettes and matches in the shops
Happy taken Madame George
That's when you fall
Whoa, that's when you fall
Yeah, that's when you fall
When you fall into a trance
A sitting on a sofa playing games of chance
With your folded arms and history books you glance
Into the eyes of Madame George
And you think you found the bag
You're getting weaker and your knees begin to sag
In the corner playing dominoes in drag
The one and only Madame George
And then from outside the frosty window raps
She jumps up and says Lord have mercy I think it's the cops
And immediately drops everything she gots
Down into the street below
And you know you gotta go
On that train from Dublin up to Sandy Row
Throwing pennies at the bridges down below
And the rain, hail, sleet, and snow
Say goodbye to Madame George
Dry your eye for Madame George
Wonder why for Madame George
And as you leave, the room is filled with music, laughing, music,
dancing, music all around the room
And all the little boys come around, walking away from it all
So cold
And as you're about to leave
She jumps up and says Hey love, you forgot your gloves
And the gloves to love to love the gloves...
To say goodbye to Madame George
Dry your eye for Madame George
Wonder why for Madame George
Dry your eyes for Madame George
Say goodbye in the wind and the rain on the back street
In the backstreet, in the back street
Say goodbye to Madame George
In the backstreet, in the back street, in the back street
Down home, down home in the back street
Gotta go
Say goodbye, goodbye, goodbye
Dry your eye your eye your eye your eye your eye...
Say goodbye to Madame George
And the loves to love to love the love
Say goodbye
Oooooo
Mmmmmmm
Say goodbye goodbye goodbye goodbye to Madame George
Dry your eye for Madame George
Wonder why for Madame George
The love's to love the love's to love the love's to love...
Say goodbye, goodbye
Get on the train
Get on the train, the train, the train...
This is the train, this is the train...
Whoa, say goodbye, goodbye....
Get on the train, get on the train...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdB5N4meH9g
Spread your wings
Come on fly awhile
Straight to my arms
Little angel child
You know you only
Lonely twenty-two story block
And if somebody, not just anybody
Wanted to get close to you
For instance, me, baby
All you gotta do
Is ring a bell
Step right up, step right up
And step right up
Ballerina
Crowd will catch you
Fly it, sigh it, try it
Well, I may be wrong
But something deep in my heart tells me I'm right and I don't think so
You know I saw the writing on the wall
When you came up to me
Child, you were heading for a fall
But if it gets to you
And you feel like you just can't go on
All you gotta do
Is ring a bell
Step right up, and step right up
And step right up
Just like a ballerina
Stepping lightly
Alright, well it's getting late
Yes it is, yes it is
And this time I forget to slip into your slumber
The light is on the left side of your head
And I'm standing in your doorway
And I'm mumbling and I can't remember the last thing that ran through my head
Here come the man and he say, he say the show must go on
So all you gotta do
Is ring the bell
And step right up, and step right up
And step right up
Just like a ballerina, yeah, yeah
Crowd will catch you
Fly it, sight it, c'mon, die it, yeah
Just like a ballerina
Just like a just like a just like a ballerina
Get on up, get on up, keep a-moving on, little bit higher, baby
You know, you know, you know, get up baby
Alright, a-keep on, a-keep on, a-keep on, a-keep on pushing
Stepping lightly
Just like a ballerina
Ooo-we baby, take off your shoes
Working on
Just like a ballerina
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMEExDZEgoo
Slim slow slider
Horse you ride
White as snow
Slim slow slider
Horse you ride
Is white as snow
Tell it everywhere you go
Saw you walking
Down by Ladbroke Grove this morning
Saw you walking
Down by Ladbroke Grove this morning
Catching pebbles for some sandy beach
You're out of reach
Saw you early this morning
With your brand new boy and your Cadillac
Saw you early this morning
With your brand new boy and your Cadillac
You're gone for something
And I know you won't be back
I know you're dying, baby
And I know you know it, too
I know you're dying
And I know you know it, too
Everytime I see you
I just don't know what to do
Shine, shine, the light of good works shine
The watch before the city gates depicted in their prime
That golden light all grimy now
Three hundred years have passed
The worthy Captain and his squad of troopers standing fast
The artist knew their faces well
The husbands of his lady friends
His creditors and councillors
In armour bright, the merchant men
Official moments of the guild
In poses keen from bygone days
The city fathers frozen there
Upon the canvas dark with age
The smell of paint, a flask of wine
And turn those faces all to me
The blunderbuss and halberd-shaft
And Dutch respectability
They make their entrance one by one
Defenders of that way of life
The redbrick home, the bourgeoisie
Guitar lessons for the wife
So many years we suffered here
Our country racked with Spanish wars
Now comes a chance to find ourselves
And quiet reigns behind our doors
We think about posterity again
And so the pride of little men
The burghers good and true
Still living through the painter's hand
Request you all to understand
ride the snake to the lake guys
>>7872229
None whatsoever.
Jeff Mangum is probably one of my favourite lyricists, but he can't touch the greats.
>>7872229
She is talking about rock music in general. OP asks about lyricists, why? What made you think that rock music's 'enlightenment' came strictly from lyrics?
It is rock music, not pottery. Album is not a book of poems, though it might as well be. Rock music is a form that can implement any other art form and still stay rock music. Poetical genius of Eliot and Shakespeare in theory can be part of a rock song.
All I mean to say in the end is that lady in the picture is wrong and doesn't understand what she had said.
>>7872412
ahahahaha
Who the fuck honestly cares about lyrics?
>>7872229
I listen to rock music mainly for a few momentous chord changes and the occasional turn of phrase. Gordon is completely right.
>>7872229
>listening to music for the lyrics
plebs are out in full force today
I fuck the music
I make it cum
I fuck the music with my serpent tongue
>>7873080
I was starting to think I was the only one who noticed this.
Come on guys, basic reading comprehension.
I wish I could be as happy as you
I wish I could have as much fun as you do
I wish I could be your friend
but I'm afraid
>>7872998
based irish
>>7872523
>syncing it with a melody and rhythm
I cannot endorse this extremely cardboard cut out view of the singer's relationship to music. It's dishonest, plain and simple. The human voice is the ur-seat of music. Why should it slavishly follow the notes and rhythm of the accompaniment? If you think mere mimicry of the secondary apparatus of music to create some superficially harmonious and rigidly formulaic whole, you're the pleb friend.
Name one pop song that has a time signature not in a multiple of 2 or 4.
'Cause it's a bittersweet symphony, this life
Try to make ends meet
You're a slave to money then you die
I'll take you down the only road I've ever been down
You know the one that takes you to the places
where all the veins meet yeah,
No change, I can change
I can change, I can change
But I'm here in my mold
I am here in my mold
But I'm a million different people
from one day to the next
I can't change my mold
No, no, no, no, no
Well I never pray
But tonight I'm on my knees yeah
I need to hear some sounds that recognize the pain in me, yeah
I let the melody shine, let it cleanse my mind, I feel free now
But the airways are clean and there's nobody singing to me now
No change, I can change
I can change, I can change
But I'm here in my mold
I am here in my mold
And I'm a million different people
from one day to the next
I can't change my mold
No, no, no, no, no
I can't change
I can't change
'Cause it's a bittersweet symphony, this life
Try to make ends meet
Try to find some money then you die
I'll take you down the only road I've ever been down
You know the one that takes you to the places
where all the things meet yeah
You know I can change, I can change
I can change, I can change
But I'm here in my mold
I am here in my mold
And I'm a million different people
from one day to the next
I can't change my mold
No, no, no, no, no
I can't change my mold
no, no, no, no, no,
I can't change
Can't change my body,
no, no, no
I'll take you down the only road I've ever been down
I'll take you down the only road I've ever been down
Been down
Ever been down
Ever been down
Ever been down
Ever been down
Have you ever been down?
Have you've ever been down?
>>7875149
What, you don't like being baited by neo Nietzschean aesthetics?
>>7872229
Goodnight, my love
Remember me as you fall to sleep.
Fill your pockets with the dust and the memory,
That rises from the shoes on my feet.
I won't be back here
Though we may meet again.
I know, it's dark outside
Don't be afraid.
Every time I ever cried for fear,
Was just a mistake that I made.
Wash yourself in your tears,
And build your church
On the strength of your faith.
Please,
Listen to me,
Don't let go,
Don't let this desperate moonlight leave me,
With your empty pillow,
Promise me
The sun will rise again.
I, too, am tired now
Embracing thoughts of tonight's dreamless sleep.
My head is empty,
My toes are warm.
I am safe from harm.
any spiderland song really
>>7875186
So good. I always thought it was "dust of the memories, which rises from the shoes on my feet", which I like better.
https://youtu.be/I625zPMQ4r4
Mike Patton is my main nigga
>>7872402
>also morrissey is probably not the best example for the high-water mark of lyricism
i'd argue he is a good example but the lyrics the anon above used were not his best work.
many lyricists, or whatever we call them, tend to have one great stanza or even one line that stands out amongst the rest of the lyrics, rather than an entire song composed of magnificent lyrics.
>>7872283
This out of all Biggie tracks is still fire
Early and raw is best of most artists, few learn to maintain upward motion
>>7872337
Can this guy be any more fake
>>7875160
Trash
>ctrl f
>jandek
>no results
Fuck this gay board
Nothing comes close to this. Transcendent.
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/bobdylan/itsalrightmaimonlybleeding.html
And if my thought-dreams could been seen
They'd probably put my head in a guillotine
But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only.
>>7872260
You're wrong about the quality because of the contextuality of lyrics in music. Bad poetry exists too, it's just less noticeable1. The other thing to note is that music is way more accessible to the general public than poetry, I don't think this need an explanation. Like you mentioned, lyrics have context, it's not only good just as a fallback in regards to the lyrical quality but to create an atmosphere and even transfer meaning through it.
That's why rap is the pinnacle of popular art, it marries poetry and music, slang and beats. Thugger is the ultimate post post irony artist, he's the DFW of our generation.
1less commercial poetry is produced than music too, it's just harder for it to reach the audience.
>>7872229
"New Dawn Fades"
A change of speed, a change of style.
A change of scene, with no regrets,
A chance to watch, admire the distance,
Still occupied, though you forget.
Different colours, different shades,
Over each mistakes were made.
I took the blame.
Directionless so plain to see,
A loaded gun won't set you free.
So you say.
We'll share a drink and step outside,
An angry voice and one who cried,
'We'll give you everything and more,
The strain's too much, can't take much more.'
I've walked on water, run through fire,
Can't seem to feel it anymore.
It was me, waiting for me,
Hoping for something more,
Me, seeing me this time,
Hoping for something else.
"Twenty Four Hours"
So this is permanence, love's shattered pride.
What once was innocence, turned on its side.
A cloud hangs over me, marks every move,
Deep in the memory, of what once was love.
Oh how I realised how I wanted time,
Put into perspective, tried so hard to find,
Just for one moment, thought I'd found my way.
Destiny unfolded, I watched it slip away.
Excessive flashpoints, beyond all reach,
Solitary demands for all I'd like to keep.
Let's take a ride out, see what we can find,
A valueless collection of hopes and past desires.
I never realised the lengths I'd have to go,
All the darkest corners of a sense I didn't know.
Just for one moment, I heard somebody call,
Looked beyond the day in hand, there's nothing there at all.
Now that I've realised how it's all gone wrong,
Gotta find some therapy, this treatment takes too long.
Deep in the heart of where sympathy held sway,
Gotta find my destiny, before it gets too late.
>>7872283
I don't think it lacks complexity, why would you say that?
Bustlin and gamblin, hittin' licks scramblin
Bricks I'm out here handlin, I'm pimpin and I'm payin the rent
Didn't choose this dirty game, this dirty game it chose me
Every city love cocaine, they'll get it from him if they don't get it from me
So I get cross-country wit that thang, makin that crisp, lettin 'em hang
Bangin that 'Pac, if I die tonight, least mama know I didn't die in vain
Cause I put up sum from every sale, so all my chil'ren can live well
Might go to heaven, might go to hell, but just put me in wood grain lane Deville
I wonder sometime how life would be, if it was no such thing as D
But then I put that Sweet down, cause that bullshit don't apply to me
Cause out here on the real streets, a dreamer always stay sleep
Cause out here the strong survive, and now they didn't die from thinkin weak
Gotta play for keeps, gotta play it HARD, still tryna get right with GOD
Still read my Bible lone, cause Reverend do wrong, still livin fraud
Tonight if I get down on my knees and ask the Lord to forgive me, please
You thank He gon' hear me? Cause tomorrow I'm still gon' be slangin keys...
>>7877127
>Bad poetry exists too, it's just less noticeable
by you
>>7877127
> Bad poetry exists too, it's just less noticeable
It is way more noticeable than bad song lyrics. Poetry only has itself to support it.
Lazy and awful lyrics can be hidden by a good song.
I get the point people make about context, but I think there is a separation.
For example, a song has lyrics that consist of one bland line over and over, but it works well with the song.
As poetry it is not good, but it is good in the same way an instrument is good.
Some song lyrics could be great poetry and not work with the song, in which case it would be reverse.
In my mind it is more important for the lyrics to work in a musical fashion rather than make great poetry.
If the words work well with the song, I do not mind if it's not good as poetry.
I listen to music as music and not as poetry. If the lyrics also happen to be great poetry, then that is just a bonus.
>>7872245
I think he says "as a known enemy"
anyway, Cobain had good lyrics for a rock singer but even as a rock fan I couldn't put him in the same league as Shakey, Coleridge, Whitman, or even Poe. Dylan and Cohen were better but I'm not going to totally vouch for them either.
>>7872940
>Am I the only one who thinks Marc Bolan was totally underrated as a lyricist?
>>7872940
Marc Bolan was underrated lyrically but also his music as a whole. the musical references to the 50s rockers, the studio sound he got, all of it. really dig him. still not gonna put him in the league of the poets of the western canon, but that cat was definitely on to something.
The very best of rock music is still the musical equivalent of what pop art is to art.
How do rockists cope with this?
>>7872229
Depends on who you're comparing to. Nickelback listeners are more enlightened than lil' wayne's fanbase.
John Darnielle (the Mountain Goats) anyone?
Bag full of oily rags
Fifty cent lighter
Dreams of retirement in Cancun
Burning ever brighter
There's a lot of ways to make money in this world
But I can't recommend insurance fraud
Burned out shell of a Volkswagen
Blood stains on the driveway
Torn up Mercedes by the side of the highway
Big plans, big plans
Let me tell you something, sister
You will never get away with it
You were sitting in the recliner with the TV on
When you said something evil and then you were gone
Explosives in the water main
A blown fuse
College graduation photograph
Splashed all over the six o'clock news
I won't be cashing in your policy
'Til I find out what it is you're trying to do to m
>>7872922
it's not even the best van morrison album, that would be veedon fleece
>still no David Tibet
Morrissey.
>>7877127
I PULL UP AND ARSON
ALL OVER YOUR GARDEN0
I MISS YOU
I WANT TO KISS YOU
I WANT TO LICK YOU
PUBIC HAIR
I'M GOING THERE
YOUNG NIGGA RICH
JEWELRY COLDER THAN THE ATTIC
IF SHE AIN'T A VIRGIN
THAT BITCH IS ONLY AVERAGE
(I live by those last 2 lines)
>>7872229
>Are there any 20th-21st century lyricists that could stand alongside Eliot and Shakespeare?
no probably not, but that's not what she meant by that quote
also, she was in Sonic Youth, and is still as cool as fuck even though she's in her 60s, so fuck all of you
and her book is pretty good for a rock memoir actually
>>7878107
kg is great no doubt
everyone in SY also has an impressive solo career to boot
>>7872283
slamming niggas like SHAQUILLE
shit is REAL
when it's time to eat a MEAL
i rob and STEAL
>>7872229
Enlightenment is a garbage criteria.
She's just assuming that people who listen to "rock music" are ignorant mystically inclined know-nothings.
Which is a pretty ignorant generalized stance itself.
Why should this woman's opinion be given more credence than that of an anonymous shitposter?
>>7875160
Shit song with shit lyrics
>>7877267
Yes, I 100% agree with you, what I was trying to say is that music is a way more popular medium than poetry so it's easier to come across bad music. You won't easily be randomly exposed to a bad poem but music is pretty much everywhere so you'll hear a lot of shit all the time. I should've chosen a different word than noticieable, I wasn't talking about the quality but the quantity.
>>7877384
Can you enlighten us as to how pop art has less aesthetical value than classic art? You're retarded.
Joanna Newsom
>>7878010
Dug up a fifth of Hood River gin
That stuff tastes like medicine
But I'll take it
It'll do
On the couch in the living room all day long
Music on the television playing our song
And I'm in the mood
The mood for you
Turn the volume up real high
All of that money, look at it fly
And you smoking
Like a chimney
Shadows crawled across the living room's length
I held onto you with a desperate strength
With everything
With everything in me
And I handed you a drink of the lovely little thing
On which our survival depends
People say friends don't destroy one another
What do they know about friends?
Thunderclouds forming, cream white moon
Everything's going to be okay soon
Maybe tomorrow
Maybe the next day
Carried you up the stairs that night
All of this could be yours if the price is right
I heard cars headed down to oblivion
Up on the expressway
Your drunken kisses, as light as the air
Maybe everything that falls down eventually rises
Our house sinking into disrepair
Ah, but look at this showroom filled with fabulous prizes
>write some pretty damn good lyrics
>sing them in an incomprehensible manner over chaotic, distorted music
Either way, there really are some lyrical gems to be found in death metal and other more extreme genres. Here's one of my favorites:
Pardon, please, the narrow
Confinement of your limbs;
Unfortunately, it's necessary
For your correction;
Shriek to your heart's
Content, if you wish;
I promise you pain and
Nightmares, in that sequence.
Permit me to introduce you to
"Tuesday"...
I favor her, this pretty blade
So tall and fine;
Hatred and violence are not
Our ways, but firm we are;
Squirming is useless, so is this
Colon, cry for me.
Svelte is implement,
Its gentle caress lets you Bleed;
its subtle curvature
Dancing, deeply slit your guts.
It's for your own good;
You need guidance, I provide;
What is your pleasure? This is
Mine; A welcome change!
Also Morrissey
""Seasick, Yet Still Docked"
I am a poor, freezing-cold soul,
So far from where I intended to go.
Scavenging through life's very constant lulls,
So far from where I'm determined to go.
Wish I knew the way to reach the one I love.
There is no way.
Wish I had the charm to attract the one I love,
But, you see, I've got no charm.
Tonight I've consumed much more than I can hold,
Oh, this is very clear to you.
And you can tell I have never really loved.
You can tell, by the way, I sleep all day.
And all of my life no-one gave me anything.
No-one has ever given me anything.
My love is as sharp as a needle in your eye.
You must be such a fool to pass me by."
Arabella's got some interstellagator skin boots
And a helter skelter around her little finger and I ride it endlessly
She's got a Barbarella silver swimsuit
And when she needs a shelter from reality she takes a dip in my daydreams
>>7872229
The /mu/ invasion continues.
The Doors, Dylan and Pink Floyd are probably the only rock musicians who approached lit territory. Patti Smith, VU and Bowie can also have A's for effort.
Modern music has lost it's base in the blues and older forms. Start with the Greeks for lit, start with the delta for rock music.
What do you guys think about Kendrick? I really enjoy his lyrics and think he's the best lyricist on the hip hop scene, currently.
>>7879080
Pop music is pop art, it has populist content, that's why is so easy to relate to it. Most people get their aesthetic feels from soup cans, it's nothing to be angry about. That's what happens in a consumer culture.
>>7872229
having just read all of the rock lyrics in this thread, i'd say, yes, she was correct. a lot of sincere poetry here and remember what Wilde said about that?
>>7880811
>decries a /mu/ invasion
>proceeds with pleb-tier /mu/ opinions
6/10 bait
>>7872412
Dylan. Particularly his stuff from the nineties forward.
Scarlet Town, in the hot noon hours,
There's palm-leaf shadows and scattered flowers
Beggars crouching at the gate
Help comes, but it comes too late
By marble slabs and in fields of stone
You make your humble wishes known
I touched the garment, but the hem was torn
In Scarlet Town, where I was born
A change of speed, a change of style.
A change of scene, with no regrets,
A chance to watch, admire the distance,
Still occupied, though you forget.
Different colours, different shades,
Over each mistakes were made.
I took the blame.
Directionless so plain to see,
A loaded gun won't set you free.
So you say.
We'll share a drink and step outside,
An angry voice and one who cried,
'We'll give you everything and more,
The strain's too much, can't take much more.'
I've walked on water, run through fire,
Can't seem to feel it anymore.
It was me, waiting for me,
Hoping for something more,
Me, seeing me this time,
Hoping for something else.
Why has no one mentioned Ian Curtis? Are you all plebs or something?
>>7872413
that's what's happening allright
I've never really considered them worth comparing.
I'm sure there are lyrics that constitute as poetry, but it's never something that concerned me much.
I don't look for meaning in lyrics - the shape of the words and their pronunciation are usually more important than what is being said.
In music, the artist provides emotion for the listener's context.
In literature, the author provides context for the reader's emotion.
Poetry is trading a little both ways.
Bob Dylan is a good artist because he's a good musician. He has an unrivaled ear for timing, presentation, and songwriting. Even when he nails the lyrics, it's extraneous. It's for separate appreciation.
There are, of course, artists who tell stories with their music. Who become the characters, like David Bowie. Who create little worlds, like Tom Waits. Who build cities, like Miles Davis. They're a different brand of story from literature, though. The listener is still doing most of the work.
You can't really speak universally on shit like this, though. A lot of it is directly dependent on the physical experience rather than the mental perception, which varies much more strongly from person to person.
