Daily reminder that there are four sexes;
Male, Female, MTF, & FTM
Transwomen =/= women
Transmen =/= men
>>6299143
There are two sexes dipshit.
Male and female.
MTFs are males, FTMs are females. They just fucked with their endocrine systems and possibly got surgeries to make themselves appear more similar to the opposite sex. They are still their original sex though, and always will be.
t. realistic tranny
>>6299152
Seconding this for truth
Inb4 some butthurt tranny but muhh .000001% intersex conditions
>>6299143
>>6299152
What sex are hrt femboys?
>>6299162
Males you fucking retard. What the fuck do you think I would say, when I think even MTFs are males (because they are)?
Even if I was one of those asshole trannies who went "hurr hurr you're all mtfs in denial lololoololololol" I'd still think you were male.
>>6299174
>>6299161
>>6299152
You're kinda brainless. Sex traits are controlled by sex steroids, they determine what gets transcribed, histology and everything.
If someone doesn't produce gametes and they have femaleish secondary traits then, that sure isn't a male biologically.
That's an intermediate third sex, sorry it triggers you.
>>6299225
No it doesn't you semantics-twisting retard.
A man who alters his body is still a man. It doesn't make him some third sex through magic. His natural body would not be capable of maintaining that form, he must manipulate it to gain secondary sexual characteristics of the opposite sex.
It gives him traits of the other sex. It does not make him the other sex, and it does not make him some third sex. Biologically they are a male. It is in their DNA. Every cell is a male cell, it's just a male cell that's been bombarded with the hormones of the opposite sex.
Sorry bro but you're just playing around with words.
Was Michael Jackson a man of pure European descent because he was white?
No.
Back to tumblr with you, you delusional fuck.
>>6299243
What natural form?
You're talking new age nonsense here.
>DNA
Actually that's controlled by gene expression. It's stuff everyone has. Chromosomes are just assortment structures for mitosis and modern genetics says they're useless. What autosomes get transcribed is the only relevant bit. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/18348162/
You say we can't consider phenotype or gametes and have to go of your magical force or something. You're pretty much one of those delusional trailer trash trannies from jerry. We can't say something cause it triggers you.
>>6299288
>I have created a made-up concept and through my horrible understanding of science have bullshitted myself into believing it.
t. you
>genes mean nothing! at least that's what my daddy said, because I came out black but he and mommy are white. He told me it's just gene expression and genes mean nothing at all.
>>6299288
> modern genetics says they're useless
Ok, let's just fuck with chromosomes and see what happens if they're so "useless"
When you mess with the number and/or type (sex chromosomes) of chromosomes you end up with down syndrome or whatever the fuck you have, which indicates that they are extremely important in our development as a whole.
>>6299288
>chromosomes don't matter
Okay.
>>6299243
There is no single gene that says male vs female. If there was, then intersex would never be a thing because the gene is either there or it isn't. Hell there's people who have gone all their lives thinking they're a woman then bam they can't get pregnant and find out they're XY even though their body naturally developed as a womans. If only the world was so black and white and made easy to understand for you, you need the reality of your existence spoon fed to you like a little baby so you don't fucking kill yourself because it's too hard to wrap your head around huh.
>>6299349
>There is no single gene that says male vs female.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Listen to yourself dude, you're really grasping at straws.
I can tell you know you've been fucking wrecked in this discussion, with how insanely buttmad you sound.
>>6299391
>a third gender exists because instead of a single specific gene that dictates biological sex, it is a collection of genes or a lack of that collection of genes
lmao
I think there are 8 genders
Male
Female
Trans male
Trans female
Third gender
Agender
Bigender
Kin
>>6299399
Well at least we've moved you a little step farther down the road of what dictates biological sex, so I'm making headway with the retarded here.
Okay so now that you understand it's a collection of genes or a lack of that collection of genes, exactly how many of which genes do you need to be male? Which ones to be female? Do you have a specific number? What if you have some of each? Is someone who has half the genes for male and half the genes for female either male or female when there are males and females who possess only exclusively their set?
Or do you arbitrarily push people over the fence based on if they have the penis vs vagina gene? If that's true then what about intersex people? Or those who develop a vagina but have testes internally because they were born XY but testosterone doesn't interact with their cells?
>>6299152
This but I would go as far as defining MTFs a subset of females and FTMs as a subset of males.
>>6299152
why do republicans and self-loathing uncle toms think being trans is just some thing someone would decide to do one day? like do you think someone would fuck their hormone balance and morph their genitals because they're bored? i don't think anyone would do it unless they really felt it was right for them
>>6299143
transmen = deformed women
transwomen = deformed men
still man and woman, still only 2 genders.
>>6299422
you're being reductionist around a bunch of face-value dualism republicans. they're just gonna throw animu/trump reaction images at you until you give up
>>6299422
protip: nobody has a specific number.
The only retard here is you, claiming that chromosomes and the genes contained within do not matter, and in fact enable some sort of intersex condition that does not exist in nature, without having fucked up genes.
I can't wait for some actually intersex people to come in here and laugh their asses off at you calling trannies intersex.
>>6299451
I never said chromosomes and the genes contained within do not matter. Once again, I'm not >>6299288
>>6299225
Okay so thanks for stating the obvious: nobody has a specific number.
Therefore you concede there is no specific number of genes which dictate whether you are male or female. Therefore you yourself claim that genes do not matter in determining biological sex. Sounds like you agree with >>6299288 more than you want to admit.
>without having fucked up genes
All genes are fucked up on purpose by nature, mutations have a purpose. You wouldn't be arguing on a bunch of plastic and metal over lengths of metal in electric signals about this if it weren't for us "having fucked up genes" compared to the rest of the apes.
I was hoping this would be harder but nope, apparently not. Good day -SIR-.
>>6299152
That was beautiful, pham. I want to rape your feisty feminized man's butthole. :^)
>>6299143
I was born a hermaphrodite (true gonadal intersex) with a working penis/scrotum and a working vagina/ovaries....I have both xx and xy chromosomes!
I am both male and female. Please add my sex to your list. M/F
tfw had to detrans because i just couldn't deal with bait threads on 4chan
>>6299323
>>6299322
>black Dady
Uh... No
>Sex (It’s a Phenotype, "Not a Chromosome!"):
http://biologyclermont.info/wwwroot/courses/oldlab2/old%20m2%20geneprob.htm
I'm just telling you into level genetics course work. You wouldn't be able to pass any bio coursework if you insist chromosomes rather than gene product make sex.
It's basic college, you don't have to chimp out and tell me to check my privilege.
>>6299367
There are sex determining, they're all autosomes. It's stuff everyone has.
Listen to yourself argue with him. You sound like white trash saying you know better than all the doctors. Sad really.
>>6299337
That's a genome duplication event. Some of them were dose dependent. The baby gets damaged.
It isn't chromosomes though, those never exist during interphase where everything is transcribed. It's just a bowl of chromatin.
>>6299152
>>6299243
http://www.nature.com/news/sex-redefined-1.16943
>These discoveries have pointed to a complex process of sex determination, in which the identity of the gonad emerges from a contest between two opposing networks of gene activity. Changes in the activity or amounts of molecules (such as WNT4) in the networks can tip the balance towards or away from the sex seemingly spelled out by the chromosomes. “It has been, in a sense, a philosophical change in our way of looking at sex; that it's a balance,” says Eric Vilain, a clinician and the director of the Center for Gender-Based Biology at the University of California, Los Angeles. “It's more of a systems-biology view of the world of sex.”
Okay, sure you know more than the professors mister crazy
>>6299367
You are the one with the angry heiny here.
>>6300166
>I don't like their opinion
>therefore they are some ugly hon I ran into once
Excellent critical thinking skills my friend. You are a true gentleman and a scholar. You're the last person I'd expect to make a fallacious argument.
>>6300210
What? I'm serious though. He used to call himself the queen of pol, same image hashes and stuff. Was a real character.
>>6299143
>>6299152
>>6299367
>Sex can be much more complicated than it at first seems. According to the simple scenario, the presence or absence of a Y chromosome is what counts: with it, you are male, and without it, you are female. But doctors have long known that some people straddle the boundary — their sex chromosomes say one thing, but their gonads (ovaries or testes) or sexual anatomy say another. Parents of children with these kinds of conditions — known as intersex conditions, or differences or disorders of sex development (DSDs) — often face difficult decisions about whether to bring up their child as a boy or a girl. Some researchers now say that as many as 1 person in 100 has some form of DSD2.
>...
>Battle of the sexes
>According to some scientists, that balance can shift long after development is over. Studies in mice suggest that the gonad teeters between being male and female throughout life, its identity requiring constant maintenance. In 2009, researchers reported7 deactivating an ovarian gene called Foxl2 in adult female mice; they found that the granulosa cells that support the development of eggs transformed into Sertoli cells, which support sperm development. Two years later, a separate team showed8 the opposite: that inactivating a gene called Dmrt1 could turn adult testicular cells into ovarian ones. “That was the big shock, the fact that it was going on post-natally,” says Vincent Harley, a geneticist who studies gonad development at the MIMR-PHI Institute for Medical Research in Melbourne.
http://www.nature.com/news/sex-redefined-1.16943
>>6299174
>panders to right wingers just to appear like le rational biotroofs edgy tranny
lmfao
>>6299161
>intersex people are just an exception and don't count because they're so rare!
>implying they're significantly rarer than trans people and not even more underreported since most don't find out unless there's a health issue
>implying you can disregard facts you don't like because they represent something that occurs rarely
>>6299322
>science that hurts muh feels is just a made up part of da librul sjw jewish conspiracy!
What is the definition of sex again?
Why is this shit
>Transwomen =/= women
>Transmen =/= men
legit?
>>6299545
NO! you're LYING and DON'T EXIST because you offend MUH FEELS about le degenerates and everyone fitting into the neat little boxes that make sense to my mild autism!
>>6299545
This comment saves the day!
>>6300244
>nobody saves images off of 4chan
>>6301145
>not understanding the post
trannies try to use rare intersex conditions to justify themselves.
>But muhh complete androgen insensitivity! Therefore women can have Y chromosomes too
Trannies are pretty sad and delusional desu.
>>6301698
>According to some scientists, that balance can shift long after development is over. Studies in mice suggest that the gonad teeters between being male and female throughout life, its identity requiring constant maintenance. In 2009, researchers reported7 deactivating an ovarian gene called Foxl2 in adult female mice; they found that the granulosa cells that support the development of eggs transformed into Sertoli cells, which support sperm development. Two years later, a separate team showed8 the opposite: that inactivating a gene called Dmrt1 could turn adult testicular cells into ovarian ones. “That was the big shock, the fact that it was going on post-natally,” says Vincent Harley, a geneticist who studies gonad development at the MIMR-PHI Institute for Medical Research in Melbourne.
http://www.nature.com/news/sex-redefined-1.16943
Trailer trash is pretty delusional and pathetic desu
>>6299545
That's actually kind of hot :x
>>6299143
Streamline the four sexes to three plx.
Everything with traits in between can just get chucked into three then
>>6299451
Actual intersex person here; I actually have no problem with trannies being considered akin to intersex and there's not really a lot of difference.
Most adult-transitioning intersex trannies knew they were trans before they had an intersex diagnosis, and even when you knew before, the social stigma is ultimately the same.
>>6301698
>rare
Kleinfelter's alone is probably more widespread than trannies are.
Silly, OP. There are two sexes.
Sexy, and not sexy.
>>6299143
There are 2 sexes and 2 genders, and they are always together
>>6299225
That's cool pham, but every single cell in your body still has an XY chromosome
>>6299288
Oh wait you don't believe in chromosomes
>>6303512
>According to some scientists, that balance can shift long after development is over. Studies in mice suggest that the gonad teeters between being male and female throughout life, its identity requiring constant maintenance. In 2009, researchers reported7 deactivating an ovarian gene called Foxl2 in adult female mice; they found that the granulosa cells that support the development of eggs transformed into Sertoli cells, which support sperm development. Two years later, a separate team showed8 the opposite: that inactivating a gene called Dmrt1 could turn adult testicular cells into ovarian ones. “That was the big shock, the fact that it was going on post-natally,” says Vincent Harley, a geneticist who studies gonad development at the MIMR-PHI Institute for Medical Research in Melbourne.
http://www.nature.com/news/sex-redefined-1.16943
Plebeian detected. Central dogma is genes to product, not chromosome for good reason.
>>6303512
>oh wait you dont believe in chromosomes
Not even that anon, but jesus fucking christ you are dense, famalam.
>>6303512
>never passed a college level bio class
>but wants to teach genetics
>>6303521
He doesn't belive in genes. The spaghetti of chromatin is all that exists according to him.
>>6303520
>>6303521
>>6303525
>>6303529
>Muh made up definition of male and female is correct even though it's not backed up by any science
Jesus you trannies are hilarious. It's a shame you'll kill yourselves within 5 years.
>>6303544
>he thinks he knows better than Nature
http://www.nature.com/news/sex-redefined-1.16943
Rectaly ravaged trash detected. Please tell me how your GED courses let you know better than the most prestigious journals?
It's a shame you'll still be trailer trash five years from now famm
>>6303544
> not backed
> genes don't exist
You'll just get mad about this but
>Sex can be much more complicated than it at first seems. According to the simple scenario, the presence or absence of a Y chromosome is what counts: with it, you are male, and without it, you are female. But doctors have long known that some people straddle the boundary — their sex chromosomes say one thing, but their gonads (ovaries or testes) or sexual anatomy say another. Parents of children with these kinds of conditions — known as intersex conditions, or differences or disorders of sex development (DSDs) — often face difficult decisions about whether to bring up their child as a boy or a girl. Some researchers now say that as many as 1 person in 100 has some form of DSD2.
>According to some scientists, that balance can shift long after development is over. Studies in mice suggest that the gonad teeters between being male and female throughout life, its identity requiring constant maintenance. In 2009, researchers reported7 deactivating an ovarian gene called Foxl2 in adult female mice; they found that the granulosa cells that support the development of eggs transformed into Sertoli cells, which support sperm development. Two years later, a separate team showed8 the opposite: that inactivating a gene called Dmrt1 could turn adult testicular cells into ovarian ones. “That was the big shock, the fact that it was going on post-natally,” says Vincent Harley, a geneticist who studies gonad development at the MIMR-PHI Institute for Medical Research in Melbourne.
>>6303565
>>6303569
>>6303544
>Sex (It’s a Phenotype, "Not a Chromosome!"):
http://biologyclermont.info/wwwroot/courses/oldlab2/old%20m2%20geneprob.htm
And way to admit you never went to uni
>>6303572
>ITT highschool dropout getting defensive
>>6303572
You're mad aren't you?
