Do FtMs even exist on /lgbt/ or at all for that matter, are they an urban myth?
After spending much time on 4chan I have hypothesised that FtM might be an urban myth of sorts or maybe a bed time story to scare the poor non-passing MtF hons to sleep each night before bedtime.
Are FtMs real /lgbt/, do they exist?
FtMs of /lgbt/ are you real or are you merely elusive like the infamous big foot, are you a collective delusion, dream a segment of our collective imagination?
I, an FtM, am simply an illusion crafted by retardation.
>>6270094
There's an FtM gen somewhere in the catalog isn't there? They're a hell of a lot less common than MtF. Like if MtFs were every normal gun skin in CSGO, FtMs are knives. Also I was going to ask who the cutie on the left was, Google tells me it's Aydian Dowling. God damn what a sex bomb. Would never guess he's a transman and honestly don't even care.
They are a made up conspiracy by the patriarchy to promote toxic masculinity.
Everybody knows that.
>>6270129
Seriously though, are FtMs just that uncommon or are they uncommon HERE on this board.
>>6270143
I was talking in general. They seem less common. I think it might be because it's easier to pass as a guy than as a girl and so they don't do a whole lot of talking (maybe?). I mean, even just soft butch girls get confused as men, which I find ridiculous, they're clearly girls, you know what I mean?
>>6270094
>>6270119
>>6270158
Sure, but do people assume they are rarer or has there been any research done here.
>>6270094
The main problem with FTMs is that they tend to disappear when you mention they're FTM.
Imagine a whole demographic of men with powers like The Shadow.
>>6270178
They're not rarer. Existing research tends to be unsure whether there's more mtfs, more ftms or an equal amount and there's statistics for all 3.
Which would tend to point towards roughly equal numbers.
>>6270094
nah they're all just dykes or tumblr snowflakes
>>6270194
>nah they're all just dykes or tumblr snowflakes
I read some article by a lesbian complaining that there are no more young butch lesbians. They all become ftms instead,
>>6270094
Yeah nah, urban legend
>>6270188
Yeah, the statistics that report MtFs being more common than FtMs are going solely off of numbers of people getting SRS. Of course less FtMs are going to get SRS when it sucks so badly. We're decent at making vaginas that can be used for sex, but with making dicks, either you get teeny tiny clit dick not big enough to penetrate, or an arm flesh tube with a pump in the "balls" to get hard.
>>6270210
>actually believing terfs
There's plenty of young butch lesbians.
>>6270416
Meto can in theory penetrate but it's dependent on how good the effects of T have been for you.
Also iirc there are improvements with phallo, it's just that it's pretty expensive to get access to those.
>>6270391
>Too simple minded to understand satire shitposting.
>>6270434
>Too new to say autism
>>6270417
why would someone be butch when they could be ftm ?
Are there any feminine ftms ?
>>6270455
I know a trans guy who does drag, I know one who passes super well and basically acts like a twink.
>inb4 aidan
They're both definitely men when you're around them.
More importantly, why would you be ftm if you don't have the neurological makeup to cause dysphoria that way. Are you that retarded terfanon who sincerely believes the "trannies are the real conservatives" meme?
>>6270455
sexual orientation vs gender identity
a ftm is not a lesbian, and a lesbian doesn't feel like a man.
>>6270822
>this is hary the place to have a genuine political argument
hagrid wholeheartedly
>>6270143
They're just less common on this board. We tend to inhabit more female-oriented spaces on the Internet, because we weren't socialized as male.
Lots of mtfs, because they started out as male and this is a typically male place. Dumblr has oodles of trans guys. It has a lot of transtrenders, but it also has a looootttt of trans guys.
I also think that trans girls need more validation, so they seek it by going on the Internet. Trans dudes pass better and they don't have as many people telling them they're disgusting, so they just live their lives and don't give a fuck. So we don't see them as often.
>>6270416
>teeny tiny clit dick not big enough to penetrate
>tfw frot master race
>tfw into size difference
>tfw can be perfectly happy with shiny new micropenis
feels good man
>>6270094
no we're all stealth
because no 1 cares if we're trannies or not
>>6270143
Mtf here
Anecdotal account - I know 3 mtf, and at least a dozen ftm plus a few I suspect are ftm based on what they told me but just live their lives as very butch lesbians.
>>6270094
i'm ftm but i live as a stone butch
because i'm in college and the pussy i can get as an androgynous/male looking gril is higher quality
i'll transition when im 25+ and ready to settle down
>>6272634
You are literally a meme
>>6270416
"Fuck yeah girl you're so fucking hot. I'm gonna fuck you so hard. Just give me a moment to pump up my zombie dick..."
>>6272368
Is it that common for FtMs not to have been socialized as males? I've never been able to interact or relate to women, grew up in male-only circles of friends, family perceived me as anything but female. I thought it was instinctive to tend to male socialization for us ftm trannies.
>>6276455
I always hung out in male oriented internet places, but in real life the area was too conservative to want me near other boys past early childhood. My boyishness also definitely didn't change how my family viewed me at all.
>>6277143
You might think I've been living under a rock but I had no idea there still existed first world places that see male-female interaction past childhood as forbidden. Where the fuck do you live.
>>6272368
Sounds legit.
>>6270455
Me, sadly :^(
>>6275680
enjoy your liberal fat girl pussy
>>6270129
>Aydian
Why.
>>6272392
>Being this desperate for reasons to be living with a nasty T swollen vagina with no dick
Oh Aiden plz
Anecdotaly, I've met more FtMs than MtFs. Every tranny appointment I've gone to has been nothing but FtMs in the waiting rooms.
MTF outnumber FTM by 3:1 which coincidentally lines up with male-female ratios of most other behavioral addictions (autogynephilia and autoandrophilia are behavioral addictions).
FTM blend more often but also end up detransitioning much more often, as they typically realize that women in society are allowed to do male things and dress and present masculine with relatively little blowback, so there's not much reason for them to continue dangerous and expensive medical intervention.
>>6272445
I'm not sure, but I think the one on stage left has wide hips from her genetics due to how wide the top of her pelvis is. The one on stage right has wide hips from exercise, because her legs have tone that the genetics girl doesn't, along with her hips ending about where that muscle group would end and her pelvis not seeming particularly wide.
>>6279516
>MTF outnumber FTM by 3:1
Not even close, it depends on your location
>>6279315
I'm guessing it's because there's little reason for an MtF who isn't ready to go full-time to go to doctors for HRT thanks to the easy availability of anti-androgens and estradiol on the internet. Whereas if you're FtM, you need to go through a doctor to get T unless you know somebody.
>>6270188
I call Bulls hit on that. Sounds like se feminist fucked trying to pass more bunk research to validate opinions.
>>6279516
>not much reason
because obviously body dysphoria doesn't real amirite
>>6279727
you can call whatever you want, but do you have statistics to back you up?
I'm a transgirl and european, and here EVERYONE goes through the government managed psychiatry/psychology center, and in it's support group I found there were 3 MtF's counting me and 10 FtM's, just throwing some anecdotical evidence there.
>>6279516
It's already been said, but the source for the 3:1 ratio is the rates of people getting SRS.
>>6279589
I've seen a few pixels in my time
>>6280449
Well, I knew a girl in 9th grade who actually had hips like the girl in blue shorts.
>>6276455
I completely missed the female circles of friends, too - don't know how to behave there. This doesn't seem to be the rule on 4chan, though.
>>6277154
Late response because I had to go to the emergency room. Got called a hermaphrodite and asked creepy irrelevant questions and everything! Good times.
Anyway, rural US. Casual interaction wasn't forbidden or anything, it was just outright friendship or hanging out that was heavily discouraged.
>>6279297
>being this shitty at reading comprehension
i have a meto
>>6280458
Well I could tell this was shopped and a reverse image search proved me right so :)
>>6279702
that's the general statistics of people asking for gender dysphoria treatment thou
>>6270094
Hi, I'm an ftm
>>6280644
I'm lucky no one ever gave a damn about who you befriended here. I was free to hang out at LAN parties and pen&paper sessions with this group of autists, now I don't know how to behave around females or non-autistic males
>>6270094
Not gonna lie when I saw your thread I laughed, OP.
>>6281870
>implying most of ftmg is ftm
they're rare even in their own general
>>6276455
I mean, I was never exactly good at being a girl, but I was definitely taught girl social cues very... Aggressively. Wear makeup, keep your knees together, if you're hanging out in a group there had better be mostly girls or you gon get raped, etc etc.
I always got along better with dudes, girls are a mystery. And I mean, I'm on 4chan so it's not exactly a hard and fast rule.
However, I think a lot of ftms do just happen upon more female-oriented places because of who they hang out with.
Tumblr is full of trans dudes, not a whole lot of trans girls.
4chan is full of trans girls, not a whole lot of trans dudes.
I dunno. It's weird, but it's just a trend I've noticed and a hypothesis I came up with. No idea if it's actually right or not.
>>6270094
All trans people are a meme gone wrong
>>6270455
google fakeboi
>>6270094
In the real world, I've personally known more FTMs than MTFs since high school.
>>6281916
The tumblr crowd is 3\4 made up of "trans masculine demiboys wearing dresses" as far as I've seen from outer sources, since I'm not on tumblr myself. Is it a good enough reflection of the environment? Wondering if there's a decent amount of legit FtM stuff over there. Judging from outside it seems not.
The fact ftms happen upon female oriented place is probably due to the first factor you mentioned, being taught girl social mannerism. So imo the whole deduction is correct if there was, as you said, aggressive influence to behave a certain way. I didn't experience that in the first place, parents let me do fuck all so I was drawn to male oriented circles. In conclusions, can we say FtMs who haven't been influenced as kids naturally socialized as males and those who have been taught girl mannerism are instead still drawn to female socialization?
>>6283944
>as far as I've seen from outer sources
You mean autists with a selection bias and usually unable to tell troll blogs from the real deal?
>>6283957
Troll blogs are mocking and exaggerating something that exists, though. I doubt they're trolling basing their shitpost on nothing. I don't know how the environment is there but I bet it's not that uncommon to find trenders and far from legit stuff. Though this applies everywhere, it makes sense they would fish for attention through a non-anonymous medium. How is the real deal? You hang there?
>>6281870
99% of FTM general, is not FTM
>>6279516
There's so much wrong in this post I don't even know where to start.
>>6281769
Source or gtfo. There is data pointing all ways. The study the 3:1 ratio comes from skews towards clinics where the people who go are usually old hons seeking srs first. I could easily make similar studies going through IC clinics across the US and Canada and coming to the conclusion that the average for north america skews 2:1 ftm and has an average age at transition comparable to Thailand's 25yo.
>>6283944
What is so hard to understand about this? MtFs are the same way, some are very girly and less repressed and hang out with the girls, the rest just tries to fit in with the autistic guys. There is more than one factor that plays into it - how acceptable is gender-nonconformity, how motivated are you to conform anyway, how good are you at faking it, how well are you getting along with the girl/boys and so on.
>>6270129
>Aydian
>that's his actual name
being a girl I feel like I should go on websites populated with more women like tumblr but fuck that website is awful for talking to people, the layout is just terrible, I'd rather use reddit than try have a conversation on tumblr.
>>6286084
nothin personnel kid
>>6286109
the amount of posters who say they're cis and mtf and polls
>>6281913
We have a lot of pre-everythings and at least a handful that will always be pre-everything.
I don't remember the poll exactly but we had more post-ops than I originally imagined and at least one 30+ years old ftm.
>>6286191
I used to pop I'm rarely, but I've mostly been in /gd/ and /ic/ for a while.
Incidentally, I was on a low dose of T for a year, but stepped off for financial/personal reasons. I won't go back on until/unlesd I find it to be crucial to my sanity again.
I'm basically stuck in twink mode that can pass as female or male if necessary, so it helps that I'm not exactly back where I started...but I could if my safety absolutely depended on it.
>>6286191
what does that have to do with anything? pre everything are still ftm ftmg has a lot of cis male, cis female, and mtfs in it and the average amount of posts per user is around two or three per general
it just isn't a good example of a place that's full of ftms pre or post everything since most of the people who frequent it aren't either
>>6286109
most of the posts in the current thread are mtfs, passerby cis men, and straightwhiteguy who's cis
>>6286259
He's implying that there's trenders.
>>6286286
i read it as him saying there are a lot of ftms there
>>6286328
That might actually be cis women who only think that they're trans, but may not be in actuality.
>>6286423
if that was it, then what i said is even more accurate
also people mistakenly go on hormones then realize they were cis all along or having never experienced dysphoria, or have various circumstances and reasons that prevent transition while experiencing dysphoria so pre-everything is not an indicator of whether or not someone is trans and neither are hormones
>>6286259
>>6286286
I am implying this. Most pre-everythings do plan on it according to some poll I made but I don't have the link to it. Those are usually the ones with medical problems, are in the process of it or are not in the situation to transition.
Tons of questioning people too. Honestly I take a lot of other ftms with a grain of salt because there has been a huge surge of just confused people who think being a little butch means they have gender issues and other people are quick to say, "oh yeah you're trans go for it".
>>6286567
That said, the fact that I'm off of T and I haven't had any major dysphoric meltdowns worries me about being this very kind of person. I'm always finding myself in an existential dread of "what the hell does this shit mean?", trying to figure out why the hell I feel mostly ok, and disappointed with the lack of answers.
>>6286631
>Disappointed with the lack of answers.
I fully support seeing a therapist but fuckin no one can tell you if you are 'really' trans or not. It's up to you to figure that shit out in the end.
>>6286631
> haven't had any major dysphoric meltdowns
That sounds like you still had dysphoria
But I hear you - I've never been on T, dysphoria comes and goes, and every time it's gone I take that as a sure sign that I was just confused, until it comes back to bite me.
>>6283944
It really depends on who you follow. There are for sure a lot of trenders, but I follow a lot of legit trans dudes (and a lot of trans dudes that are so hot they'll melt a hole in your knickers).
In my opinion, wanting to wear skirts and shit **sometimes** doesn't mean you're not trans though. You can recognize what you look good in, and if you're not feeling particularly dysphoric that day it can be okay. I couldn't, shit always makes me uncomfortable, but I'm not gonna shit on someone who doesn't really pass yet or is in andro mode wearing a feminine outfit.
That said, there is 100% a difference between "sometimes wears a skirt" and "I'm not gonna transition at all :3 and you can be trans without dysphoria/gender euphoria :3 they/he pronouns please :3 :3"
>>6286567
>>6286631
I usually find that those people are pushed by others. "But you're not super girly! You have A cups and wear men's pants, you must really be a guy!"
In my experience, a lot of people who identify as trans but feel mostly ok or say they don't have much dysphoria but still decide to transition, tend to just not realize how much they feel like shit until they really feel okay.
Like if someone with chronic pain finally got treatment and went "wow, so that's what that feels like, I didn't even realize how much it hurt until it didn't."
There are a lot of trenders, but not many that actually take it as far as transition. If you're that serious about it, knowing all the bullshit that comes with it, there's gotta be a reason.
I believe you, anon.
>>6286768
Goddamn this. "Oh, I feel gr8 today I'm just a silly trender. Time to live a carefree life~"
But dysphoria just took a bathroom break and life is suffering :^)
>>6287040
I am biased with ftms who just love wearing makeup and dresses as a practically daily thing but I'll also keep that to myself. Once in awhile why not. Then again I wore a skirt and let my friends kid paint my nails for a Rocky Horror Picture Show so maybe I'm just justifying myself. I think my opinions on trans is just weary due to tumblr trans. Pre-everythings(by choice), constant makeup and girly outfits but go nuts if someone calls them she(even by accident) and of course the junk you mentioned. it feels like an online persona because I can't legitimately imagine these people demanding to be called a man in person.
>>6287082
Also that. Maybe their lives are just shitty and boring too so something so 'new' feels better. Like going on a diet or working out. Everyone gets excited but if you're not serious then its just a chore rather than something you have to do.
FtMs pass better?
>>6293299
They be ninjas
>>6287153
Honestly though this guy is so fucking hot and good at makeup
We exist, I've met more fellow ftms outside of 4chan, but more mtfs on 4chan. It just depends on where you are. Usually we're less obsessed with our "trans status" so it doesn't come up as much.
>>6293519
I wouldn't count special effects makeup. Is he on anything? I see a masculine woman, enhanced by makeup to look rather androgynous.
I am a numbers person. I love them. I am also a robot neet so I have lots of time to look up things.
Less than 1% of the population identifies as trans. Much less. There aren't very many of them out there. When it comes to trans, you have about 2-5 mtf for every 1 ftm. Depends on the research you are looking at. At lowest trans-sex ratio, you are looking at 1 ftm per 1400 people and 1 mtf per 750 people. Higher ratios get you into 1 ftm per 5000-10000 people.
>>6293561
Yeah, he's on T as of the last couple of months I think. He does lots of costumey makeup but not all of it is like that.
>>6293578
Even those numbers seem to big.
>>6293561
He honestly looks more masculine without makeup imo. This is from a couple of months ago, he started T only a little while before that.
>>6293578
I don't think those are accurate. I know a shit ton of trans people
>>6299072
I think those are accurate, because I don't know a single trans person.
Do you realise how ridiculous this sounds?
>>6286768
It seemed a lot like it pre-T, but on it and then off of it, it doesn't seem like it's much of an issue at this time. I have a lot of other issues in life, so I'm always worried that it's really something else. I also worry if it's some of screwball FTM twink mentality.
I've been focusing on working through mother issues for the past year, though. That's arguably caused more problems.
>>6280458
>tfw i have hips like that when i gain weight
>tfw ftm
>>6300456
His hair really ruins it
Looks like an effeminate male.
Most blend better than mtf, so they never have to mention they're trans. But trans individuals aren't that big of a population generally.
Is it even possible for an FtM to look bad? we always laugh at bad mtfs but what about the other way? i guess testosterone is one hell of a drug.
>>6306181
Ofc, the look like fat dykes.
>>6308267
all that's really required to reverse that (unless you're really fuckin unlucky) is lift and lose weight.
being pre everything currently it makes me mad there are ftm's who already are on t that don't do jack shit to help themselves pass and expect T to do everything for them (it helps but it's not a miracle worker) .. i kinda feel like their squandering their blessings a little.
>>6308267
but they just look like dykes
not like trannies. its not really the same
>>6313175
If smb doesn't put their 100% commiment, I very much doubt they are trans.
>>6300486
even without SJW hair he's very clock-y. sorry but the eyes, cheekbones, and lips are a dead giveaway.
>>6298807
GOD he is so fucking hot what the hell
>>6315101
My features look a lot like that and now I'm paranoid. I've been on T and have always passed so far, but then again I've never met anyone who knew in depth shit about clocking. What about all that is a giveaway?
>>6315147
not the anon you responded to but unless his voice is deep i would have gendered him female if i met him. his face is very feminine and young-looking. small, soft features; weak and narrow jaw; totally smooth skin both in texture and lack of hair; eyebrows groomed to within an inch of their life; etc. he doesn't look masculine at all to me. after a year on T he'll be golden but right now he doesn't pass at all imo.
>>6293519
Guy?
>mfw it's come to this
>>6315966
I have no idea if that's a biological female trying to dress up as a guy or a guy trying to dress up like a girl.
Either way it's not effective.
>>6270475
>lesbian doesn't feel like a man.
Butch lesbians dress and act like men... why not become the real thing ?
I'm a gay man so I don't have a horse in this race, it just seems obvious that there would be fewer Butch lesbians now a days.
>>6321503
>Butch lesbians dress and act like men... why not become the real thing?
Because they are women, not men. Gender expression =/= gender. They don't feel dysphoric
>>6287082
Not them but thanks for posting this. I go through periods of this too, and it can be really hard to tell if i just have thick skin wrt gender stuff or if I'm deluding myself. Hearing that a lot of actual trans people felt/feel the same is kind of comforting.
>>6270158
i'm 19, been on t for a year but i've been passing and stealth for the last 5. there's really no need for us to out ourselves and the one's i know of, including myself, aren't even active in the lgbt community on or off this board. we blend in pretty seamlessly with minimal effort compared to mtfs (obviously unless your genes just fucking suck.)
we just don't bitch as much as you guys. and testosterone makes this more true.
>>6306181
Honestly, I never see people mention this but (speaking as an ftm) there can sometimes be a weird uncanny valley thing when they have big eyes/long eyelashes, or weird prominent forehead wrinkles sometimes. But generally I agree that it's a lack of effort that makes them look bad.
>>6321503
>why not become the real thing ?
they don't want to?
>>6315977
>This is a shooped picture of Jennifer Connelly, you dumb cunt.
are you fuckin serious lel no its not
>>6323527
>weird prominent forehead wrinkles
How is that a giveaway? Don't all older people get those?
>big eyes/long eyelashes
Thank fuck this is normal for guys of my ethnicity.
i stuck my dick in a vagina but remained gay
FtM is only explanation
>>6323973
Not trying to troll here, but don't men actually have longer eye lashes?
I read this one, might be complete BS though
>>6326683
I heard that one too
