Cis boys on this board: how comfortable are you with FTM's identifying as/claiming to be men? Do you think they can ever understand masculinity and what "being a guy" is, or does that really matter in the end ?
I dont see an issue with it, masculinity is indifference so really by boing whatever they want and giving aproxx 0 fucks about what anyone else has to say it that basically nails it right there. Just do you.
>>6253679
It's not like it matters in the scheme of things either way so what ever tickles his fancy.
Maybe they'll have a different perspective on some aspect of masculinity, having dipped their toes in both sides of the gender system. As cis scum I can't imagine what it must be like to see the other side, and as a homo women are like a dark continent obscured in distant fog. I don't spend a single second of my day thinking about women or what it's like to be one cuz I'm thinking about bois
>>6253679
I don't give a fuck. I don't think ftm claim to "understand" manhood like someone raised as a man.
Why should it even affect me
>>6253679
I don't care. Seriously, I couldn't care less.
Of course not. They are not men. You won't see me advocating for their rights, but I am civil.
>>6253679
Why would I give a flying fuck if some girl wants to be a guy.
Whatever, really. Let them pursue their dreams and shit.
I love FtM's. I don't give a fuck about masculinity or femininity much, so they're bona-fide men in my book.
>>6253679
>how comfortable are you with FTM's identifying as/claiming to be men?
I don't care. People can do whatever they want with their bodies and appearances.
>Do you think they can ever understand masculinity and what "being a guy" is, or does that really matter in the end?
I don't know, most cis men don't understand any of that. So who cares. Although ftm's will always be ftm's in my mind. There is a distinction to be made here.
>>6253679
femgen fag here, I absolutely have no problem with them being guys. There's no such single true way of being a guy or any magic experience for that.
There's pe who'd say I can't be a guy cause I'm effeminate or some of my weirder habits and that's bullshit.
I've got no room to judge and theyve every bit as much guys as we are. Might have mor in common with them than other men. I welcome them with open arms and anyone reasonable will do the same.
The thing about the whole trans "issue" is that they don't even exist. Never met a transman and probably never will. We're talking about like 0.01% of the population.
>>6253964
The thing is, that's cool with most of us. Guys who see us as ftm aren't doing us any harm, and I've never personally made a stink of it. Even the guys I've met who don't see me as natural man still tend to treat me like a human being, which is more than I can say about the fighting going on at the other end of the spectrum.
>>6253975
Would want one as a bff
>>6253975
I would have said this too until in line at the grocery store I was talking to some guy about hot pockets or something(i was really drunk) and noticed him pulling up the sleeve of his shirt and adjusting a strap under it. I asked him if it was a binder and he very, quietly said yes. I was like, whoa.
I still think they are basically unicorns but I was pretty surprised that at complete random I met a ftm and if he didn't do that I would have never known.
>>6253989
Would want one as bf
>>6253679
Why would I care? I'm a cute, effeminate faggot. cis boys =/= giving a single fuck about masculinity
I just pity FtMs though because it has to make life so much harder to be a man with no penis.
Boys don't just become men, they have to grow into them. A FtM is fine with me if they understand that they don't go from girl to man, but girl to boy. They still have to learn to be a man just like any other male.
FtMs who don't take hormones, don't try to carry themselves in a completely masculine way, or are into men are jokes. There are some gay FtMs that aren't pretenders but they're the rarest of the rare.
>>6253988
>natural man
It's honestly a dumb concept. Assuming that all males have to be some hairy caveman
There's people who would say I can't still be a guy cause the whole estrogen taking stuff. So really then, isn't it just as dumb to say the same things about Ftm guys just cause of what they might have started as?
>>6253679
>Do you think they can ever understand masculinity and what "being a guy" is, or does that really matter in the end ?
Probably if our culture was less punitive of masculinity then it would be easier for FtMs to learn. I don’t think they’re intrinsically incapable — I do believe that they are, fundamentally, ‘actually’ men and not just deluded bulldykes — but the observable reality in the current climate is that most of them seem drawn to some faggy punk fuckboy notion of manhood, or rather, of boyhood. But then look at how many MtFs want to be anime schoolgirls instead of women.
>>6254039
>FtMs who don't take hormones, don't try to carry themselves in a completely masculine way, or are into men are jokes. There are some gay FtMs that aren't pretenders but they're the rarest of the rare.
eugh i hate people like you. literally every non-newfag knows that test makes the vast majority of ftms turn gay (or at least bi).
any 100% hetero ftm is usually just either: A) a transitioned ultra-bulldyke or B) a "no homo" dudebro.
>don't try to carry themselves in a completely masculine way
the majority of non-beta cuck trutrans ftms don't actually think that much about their gender beyond "i'm a man and i can do what i want."
only the obnoxious former-bulldyke ones carry themselves in a completely, 100% snapback fag ,"no homo bro" masculine way.
>tl;dr every self-assured man is a little bit feminine unless you're a manchild.
>>6254039
I'm a guy who was born a guy and I think that idea is stupid. Not the right path for every guy isn't nessecary a hulking gorilla.
>faggy punk fuckboy
and your point is?
>>6253679
They generally seem to be pretty "man" like. I don't even know what the fuck it means to "understand masculinity" . It doesn't matter in the end
My neighbor was a cis lesbian who was more masculine than me in every way, kek.
>>6254039
mtf here, you're an insecure moron and you're making me wonder why it's ftms rather than people like you who get put in therapy.
ftm here who expected this thread to be a trainwreck
you guys are alright
>>6253975
Really ?
I've met 4 ftms just from my daily life and around ... Idk, a lot more at a trans event
Most ofthem just pass good enough you couldn't tell irl
Some don't tho, so that's how i knew the ones i met before were ftm
>>6253679
I don't give a shit.
>>6253679
>Cis boys on this board: how comfortable are you with FTM's identifying as/claiming to be men?
I would be pretty comfortable with it, but I've honestly never seen an FTM get assravaged like an MTF at just being called a transsexual, they just go "yeah what of it, I feel better" IME. Testosterone makes you chill and estrogen makes you histrionic, I guess. I agree with Anon who said it must be a bummer to be a man and not have the dick though, given how men get treated in society these days.
That said this guy >>6254316 sounds pretty credible to me though, probably has more experience of it than I do t b h.
>>6255724
>I've met 4 ftms just from my daily life and around ...
Either you hang around LGBT subculture alot, or you live somewhere like SF where it's just more common. Majority of people never meet an out transsexual.
>>6255767
I've met a mtf in another bar too
And it wasn't a lgbt bar, just a normal bar
It's a bit more underground (literally) and totally fucked up
There are lots of lesbians too
So idk, it's not even a liberal place around here, pretty conservative actually
And people who met me actually met a transsexual person ...
>>6254039
I agree with this.I'm sure you will instigate a lot of butthurt though
>>6253679
Is that the passgen caveman tranny?
As a cis-guy.
There is a lot of variation in what is is to be a guy, to be frank. So, as long as they are themselves it's fine.
Thing is though, there ARE aspects of guy culture you get if you're only hanging around with cis-guys. Some is idiotic, but some is core to what I'd consider what it is to be a guy.
Personally, I'd give them more respect if they've mastered the aggression that comes with the testosterone (meaning, they are in charge of what it does, not let it be in charge of them), cause that's something I've seen as something tough for guys to handle.
Also, I respect guys more (whether cis or ftm or whatever) if they are at least a little tough.. however that's defined. I don't know if it's instinct or what, but if i sense i guy is weak...it bothers me and makes me aggressive. I don't act on it, but it is a natural feeling that arises.
I wonder if straight ftm's will ever truly grok just how homoerotic straight cis-male culture is.
>>6257758
i'm still trying to get used to all the varieties of handshake
>>6257832
It will take you awhile. And cis guys still have handshake missteps/misconnects occasionally but we don't ever discuss it in a public setting. That rule applies to a lot of stuff you might see or experience. Yes, it may happen, but we never discuss it.
As for the question in the OP I am perfectly comfortable with FtMs identifying as men. Most men (myself included) have no fucking idea what they are doing and just plow ahead anyway. So if you're unsure about what it means to be a man, you are in good company.
Maybe you pick up a lot of the cultural trappings of manhood (or whatever you want to call it) when you grow up as a boy, but there's not some secret that you're missing out on. People can reel off a bunch of qualities that make "a real man," but those qualities aren't things that only people born with a Y chromosome can do (aside from impregnating someone through sexual intercourse- probably, that may change one day). Making babies is a big thing, but almost anyone can do that. Animals can. Raising good kids is much more important and the parents' gender identity doesn't matter there.
Genuinely I never gave it thought
>>6257964
>being on 4chan
>being live and let live
>>>tumblr tbdesu
