Is anyone else tired of nonbinary people appropriating the whole transgender thing?
>>5176009
No. "Transgender" is necessarily pretty broad linguistically if you accept that gender identity is a continuum with most data points clustered around two somewhat narrowly defined "poles". What bothers me is that acceptable gender expression is so limited that these identities are appealing to people who are very comfortably male and female.
>>5176125
It's not their existence that bothers me it's that they seem to be constantly trying to steal the spotlight and the entire movement from legitimate "transsexual" people who are actually transitioning and have real problems and stuff
Like, I just opened up a documentary about bullying of transgender students and saw that all three of the kids interviewed were "nonbinary". You can't even talk about trans issues anymore without some DFAB nonbinary shit who thinks they must be genderqueer or whatever since they like wearing pants butting in thinking that their opinions on the topic actually matter and trying to speak over actual transitioning trans people, even putting us down sometimes and mocking our narratives and the idea that someone can be born trans
>>5176139
>...constantly trying to steal the spotlight and the entire movement from legitimate "transsexual" people who are actually transitioning and have real problems and stuff.
They're trying to have their voices heard, too. No one wants to be made invisible. Their problems are real, even if they're not the same as ours.
>I just opened up a documentary about bullying of transgender students and saw that all three of the kids interviewed were "nonbinary".
This is a problem, though. If it wasn't a local documentary, that shows an apparent lack of concern with representing the different faces of transgender discrimination. It's also a problem that is frequently faced by FtMs, since the eyes of the world are disproportionately (and uncomfortably) focused on MtFs. Anyway, if the documentary wasn't local, all three interviewees being NB is shameful, and the group responsible should be taken to task on their, ultimately, laziness.
>You can't even talk about trans issues anymore without some DFAB nonbinary...butting in thinking that their opinions on the topic actually matter...
They actually do matter, so it's good that someone is listening.
>...and trying to speak over actual transitioning trans people, even putting us down sometimes and mocking our narratives and the idea that someone can be born trans.
But this is unacceptable behaviour. A portion of it is unmistakably internalized transphobia - some not insignificant portion of nonbinary persons are exploring their gender identity from a comparatively "safe" position where they haven't necessarily "failed" at their assigned gender. Compassion may be needed, but the lack of respect for transsexual persons and the issues specifically pertaining to us needs to be addressed, too.
I can't say that I've encountered transsexual dismissal by NBs in my offline life, and my online life doesn't really extend to social media networks, so I'm probably being insulated from much of what you're describing.
>>5176293
>They're trying to have their voices heard, too. No one wants to be made invisible. Their problems are real, even if they're not the same as ours.
"I look like, sound, dress and act like a girl but people won't call me a boy(or vice versa)" are not problems. They face zero discrimination besides being fucking retarded.
>You can't even talk about trans issues anymore without some DFAB nonbinary...butting in thinking that their opinions on the topic actually matter...
They are not only pushing out legitimate trans people, but they are talking FOR them. It's like how I have zero business barging into help group for single dads or black people and started talking about aspects of myself that are only vaguely related("hey, i'm also human! we're so alike").
I've had 4 other transfriends who just gave up going to transrelated groups because they pushed out all the older, established transpeople and the ones looking for legitimate help and support to try and figure things out. It's a fucking mess and its making it hard to find actual social support unless you conform to their ridiculous and often harmful ideals("yeah you totally pass! you should totally go out in eyeliner and a dress, no one will beat the shit out of you at all").
>>5176488
>"I look like, sound, dress and act like a girl but people won't call me a boy(or vice versa)" are not problems. They face zero discrimination besides being fucking retarded.
I suppose that this not being my experience with NB people has a lot to do with my opinions on the matter differing from yours. If it's been yours, I'm sorry to hear it.
>They are not only pushing out legitimate trans people, but they are talking FOR them. It's like how I have zero business barging into help group for single dads or black people and started talking about aspects of myself that are only vaguely related("hey, i'm also human! we're so alike").
Again, I don't *have* this experience with NB persons; the ones I have dealt with have been either repressing soft, had comparatively manageable dysphoria, or were decidedly outside the norms of gender expression. All of them were a fairly good fit for "transgender". I suppose your wildly different experiences account for your use of the word "legitimate" so as to distinguish from "illegitimate" (them?) here.
I think you've picked up more hostility than is warranted (again, in my experience), but you raise an issue that "trans" may be a large (and diverse) enough group in some places that specific help groups for *transsexual* persons, and nonbinary persons should probably be established.
>>5176009
I don't have problems with nonbinaries if they're actually dysphoric.
Non-dysphoric nonbinaries can fuck themselves. They push out trans people from support groups like straight "allies" shove gay kids out of GSA's when they start looking for a gay best friend to objectify.
>>5176009
There's no such thing as nonbinary, they're just retarded special snowflakes
>>5176009
No. To do so would give credit to feminists who are tired of transgender people appropriating their identity and invalidating their own problems.
And that seems hypocritical.
>>5176125
fuck. offf. you. reddit. fuck
>>5176939
No.
>>5176684
>I don't have problems with nonbinaries if they're actually dysphoric.
Pretty much this. If they're just some fujoshit genderspecial who wants to be called a boy because they like to wear bowties on Wednesdays and be quirky they can go fuck off back to Tumblr.
If they're legit like, androgynous and don't feel male or female or feels like both idgaf. If they're dysphoric and transitioning they're just trans to me.
>>5176638
>specific help groups for *transsexual* persons, and nonbinary persons should probably be established.
I wish. You literally can't even mention dysphoria in trans groups these days without triggering all the non-binaries.
>>5179402
Also doesn't help that even the word "transsexual" seems to piss too many people off to really use it officially anywhere anymore. I'm sick of this transgender both replacing TS and encompassing everything gender related at the same time bullshit.
Let's just call it "transsex" to deal with the "it's not about sexuality" arguments, and call it a fucking day. I hate this linguistic idiocy we're having heaped on us.
>>5176009
No, am glad. All transgender people should be represented.
>>5184114
That doesn't sound so much like gatekeeping to me as simply wanting to have a demarcation between those with dysphoria and those without.
The fact that one can be considered a medical necessity to treat is a pretty crucial difference, since that's when you go beyond mere gender presentation. It's what can be used to club insurance companies over the head in order to get them to cover such things.
If all someone has going on is being gender non-conforming non-dysphoric non-binary, then they honestly have a very different issue.
>>5184114
THis post is literally what happened to the transgender community.
THe dysphric transitioners are being kicked out of our own spaces.
>>5184114
MtF non-binary here. I agree with everyone else and my definition of dysphoria is looser than some people here I'm sure. To be trans you have to experience some amount of distress about your gendered physical features and/or be uncomfortable in your assigned gender roles. That's it. Anything else is just gender non conforming cis snowflakes trying to be part of a club they don't belong in. We need some way to identify dysphoria in a clinical sense so doctors will continue to treat it. Society isn't just going to allow people to transition for no reason and it would be stupid to allow people to transition if they didn't feel there was a compelling reason to.
>>5187059
also nonbinary doesn't mean doesn't have dysphoria. it just means "identifies as something other than binary male or female". maybe both or genderless.
>>5176009
As far as I care, transgender is still an umbrella term. Enbies, bigens, crossdressers, drag queens, transsexuals, any other gender non-conforming people.
I am transsexual, when talking about it I just say trans for short. I welcome those other kinds of trans people. I don't welcome SJWs and faggots, even though there's overlap, not all enbies are snowfags. I wouldn't want to be confused with any other group in the trans umbrella simply because I'm not them, but that's no reason to get mad and "kick them out."
>>5187116
I forgot agens and GQs even though they are included in "gender non-conforming people"
