The last thread turned into syrup
Actions Per Minute Edition
> What's this thread about?
As usual this thread is for the discussion and pics of tracked and wheeled AFVs of all kinds from MBTs to supertanks to self propelled AA guns. Please keep it civil and cite sources for statistics.
The pinnacle of ROKA infantry carriers, the K21 is currently replacing the M113 derived K200. The project began in 1999, with Doosan Infracore, now known as Doosan DST, being awarded the contract in 2003. However, throughout this period, there was collaboration from no less than eleven different domestic firms under the supervision of the Agency for Defense Development (ADD). In 2005, Doosan completed three prototypes, which then underwent evaluation until 2007, and the public unveiling in 2008. In 2009, full time production commenced. The K21 is certainly a step up in armament from its predecessor; it sports a two ATGM launchers and a 40 mm autocannon, which is loaded automatically using a carousel system, similar to the BMP-3, which suggests inspiration from the ROK’s Russian equipment. In addition, the K21 boasts advanced FCS and thermals, able to spot at 6 km and identify at 3 km, along with the Samsung Thales IFV Commander’s Panoramic Sight and IFV Gunner’s Primary Sight, able to engage both land and aerial targets. Armour is a blend of ceramic plating and a fiberglass aluminium alloy combination, frontally effective against large calibre autocannon rounds that can penetrate up to 50 mm at 1 km, and the sides are proofed against 14.5 mm AP rounds. It also allegedly features a soft-kill active protection suite, with the Product Improvement Program (PIP) expected to include a hard-kill for extra top protection as well. A hydropneumatic suspension and Doosan turbocharged D2840LXE V-10 with self-sealing tanks completes the package.
> Gun
Rifled 40 mm K-40
> Dimensions (l w h)
6.9 x 3.4 x 2.6 m
> Weight
25 tonnes
> Engine
750hp diesel
> Speed
70 km/h
>>30543147
OP: As always, feedback, suggestions wanted and appreciated.
The hallmark of the vast majority of South Korean armoured fighting vehicles tends to be their ability to tackle difficult terrain, whether it be rugged slopes, or various waterways. The K21 is no exception, but it must be said that it has had a rather colourful history in that respect. The K21 utilises a hydrojet and pontoon system (despite contrary claims by Doosan, used out of necessity as the K21 proved too heavy to stay naturally afloat) to propel itself and stay buoyant respectively, and on paper it should have had no difficulty in crossing rivers even bearing its full combat load above 25 tonnes. However, in 2010, a K21 undergoing testing sank during a river crossing exercise, prompting an investigation of the causes. The key flaw was highlighted to be a faulty pump that failed at the maximum fording speed of 7.8 km/h. This marked the second time a K21 had sunk during its post development stage, and had culminated in a death. In addition, the pontoons themselves proved to be somewhat awkward in practical use, and vulnerable to all the usual ills regarding rubber materials. Other complaints included an unreliable and quickly wearing powerpack under intensive use, such as in amphibious crossings. Nevertheless, 466 are projected to be delivered under the terms of the 2020 Defense Reform Initiative. Many commentators feel justified in positing the K21 as qualitatively superior to the Bradley, yet such judgements are premature, as it has seen no combat, and has only been used in limited quantities as export orders have not been forthcoming. That said, the K21 is a high-tech, modern defense solution – and interestingly, a K31 is also in the works.
>>30543161
More tank news, as per the new format.
If you have more queries regarding a news story, just point it out, and I’ll further elaborate and provide links.
While we’re on South Korean affairs, while not necessarily AFV related, THAAD has been officially confirmed in its deployment to South Korea, which would have enormous ramifications for the geopolitical landscape in the region as a whole. Keep an eye on this development.
Saudi Arabia is set to receive 200 AFVs comprised of 100 VAB Mk 3 6x6 APCs and 100 Sherpa Light Tactical Vehicles. The vehicles were ordered from Renault Trucks Defence on behalf of the Lebanese Armed Forces as a Saudi aid grant, although political complications since 2015 have now put the notion of a transfer in doubt, and it may very well be the case Saudi Arabia retains the vehicles for itself.
NORINCO has released the latest details regarding its SWS2 SPAAG/SAM system, now currently being touted for export markets. Based on a 8x8 VN1 chassis, the vehicle is armed with a 35 mm revolver cannon and a pod of four SAMs, ammunition including high-explosive incendiary (HEI), high-explosive incendiary-tracer (HEI-T), and semi-armour piercing HEI-T (SAPHEI-T). In addition it can fire the recently developed Programmable Time Fuze Pre-fragmented (PTFP).
A new version of the Type 96 Main Battle Tank has been spotted by keen military watchers, reportedly featuring a new engine and fire control system. The tank is allegedly dubbed the Type 96B, according to Chinese sources (likely forumgoers).
The Indian negotiations for the K9 Vajra-T howitzers continue, with talks over the price of the deal being concluded between the Indian Ministry of Defence and the agent Larsen & Toubro. Along with the Korean made K9, the K10 ammunition resupply vehicle will also be part of the package.
And that’s all for now.
>>30543183
Addendum: I’d just to mention that I’ll be running the same poll from last week again, since I only received a handful of replies, and I’d like a bigger sample size for the poll. I’ll likely be doing the Type 89 IFV next week while I compile notes on the poll’s winner, most likely. Thanks you chaps in advance.
Picture is the CMI 120 mm variant of the K21, in case you were wondering.
http://www.strawpoll.me/10643755
>>30543183
The UK is going to evaluate MUSS APS for its Challenger 2 tanks.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/active-protection-for-our-armed-forces
>>30543183
>A new version of the Type 96 Main Battle Tank has been spotted by keen military watchers, reportedly featuring a new engine and fire control system. The tank is allegedly dubbed the Type 96B, according to Chinese sources (likely forumgoers).
>>30543640
>>30543653
>>30543603
That's some big news I missed. I'm surprised, I'd thought MUSS had faded into the background after the Puma got initially delayed.
>>30543640
I thought they released that pic for the Biathlon.
haven't been here for a while but look like the Thai just bought VT-4 from the Chinese http://snafu-solomon.blogspot.com/2016/05/royal-thai-army-to-buy-battalion-of.html would love to see the info leak very soon and do you guys think the tank is good?
>>30543203
Also I won and 1) not sure that was intended 2) wth people.
>>30543640
>>30543653
>>30543669
2015 sensha-dō pic for comparing sake
>>30543882
apparently there are too camo skim
so i don't think those are sensha-dō tank
>>30543919
For an export tank, it's not half bad. And if the Pakistanis are using it, well it should be fine, since the Chinese give their second-best stuff to the Pakis first.
>>30543970
Good job Frenchfag.
>>30543970
When will we get to hear the great tales of conquest ala Frenchfag?
Would love to hear a good one with dozen of FORAD tanks destroyed around Mt Clavet.
>>30543970
Tell us about the time you destroyed three hundred tanks in one day
>>30543147
K21 predecessor, the K200A1
This particular vehicle served in Malaysian army service
>>30544564
Apparently they also operates another type of identical IFV, the ACV300 adnan (which uses sharpshooter turret instead of ACAV open cupola)
>>30544190
>>30544237
Actually my stories are more like
>that one time I threw a track
>that one time I semi-crushed a radio under the breech
>that one time I got punished at OCS and we were forbidden to use bikes afterwards
And a rapidly expanding folder of FML "platoon leader edition" which are only thinly related to /thg/.
>>30544625
Please post these stories
>>30544625
LOL!
How do you manage to nearly crush a radio under the breech. Did you managed to disalign the gun by your strenght while installing the coax?
>>30544842
I'm betting he had a book or manual sitting on top of the radio. Skrunck~
>>30544920
So no net and the came bearer was actually the crushing component.
>>30544920
>>30544945
He has to place the whine and cheese somewhere, right?
>>30545126
wine, not whine
jeez
>>30545126
You still got the storage space behind a small bulkhead (you have the same on the TC's side).
>>30544842
>>30544945
>>30545126
I did have cheese with me for nutrition purposes at the time, yes.
Anyway, bear with me here as I lack a couple technical terms and obviously it makes more sense if you've been inside a Leclerc :
>be youngish tank commander
>2 days into an exercise involving OPFOR
>The day before I had already damaged an antennae (which lead to wandering away from the platoon and death by arty shot) and part of the MILES system.
>SSGT_is_midly_satisfied.webm
>we ride away from night position to a gathering point to await the day OPORD
>suddenly the radio just quits. No bip no sigh no throes just goodbye my lover goodbye my friend.
>we stop, I pull it away from its socket and try to fix it.
>such failure, much unsuccess
>it's OPORD time.
>back to the tank, be in a rush, I don't take the time to put the radio back properly in its socket, it just lays there behind me.
>ONWARD, TO GLORY
>200m later the spirit of the machine kindly alerts me that shit is going down hard
>look behind. Heart stops. I scream and shut down the turret.
>oh god o.. I mean oh mon dieu oh mon dieu OH MON DIEU
>the radio, free from its bound, went leaning against the net that separates the artillery from my station.
>jutting backward from the artillery is the thing with the elevation lock.
>the jutting stuff acted as a lever that the main gun used to crush the cooling metal thingies at the back of the radio.
>the elevation lock is broken and held by wires, threatening to get stuck and cause further damage.
>pieces everywhere
>spent the rest of the day with a 1000yrds stare
>quiet and worried crewmates tell me gently that I should report it
>overhear them say in hush voices "the marechal des logis doesn't look well..."
Cont.
>>30545407
Since I'm a convincing weasly fuck I managed to report it in two unrelated parts and got away scott free :
- first I told the radio didn't work and I was on the turret top and slipped and dropped it and it bounced off the armour and was bent (no one bothered to check the armout for corresponding signs)
- told the repair crews I must have forgotten the elevation lock before using the turret and it behave weirdly anyway.
Not my proudest moment by far but at the time I was preparing for the OCS competitive exam and I was convinced my career would end right now.
I kept the elevation lock. No pics though.
posting in a frenchfag thread
>>30545407
>>30545417
ROFLITPOFAOTTIATHM!
It's indeed a FML moment.
Just wow for the elevation lock. I thought the plate carying it would shield it from the PR4G...
>>30545407
>damaging a €7,000,000 machine
>>30545417
You ever brought a lady friend inside th3 Leclerc? I've done stuff in an M113, not my proudest moment.
>>30545496
14k € at worst.
>>30545526
>a Leclerc MBT is only 14k euros
That's incorrect.
>>30545715
never said the Leclerc was only 14k €...
The only thing put at risk was the radio and the elevation lock...
If it was a real combat condition with actual loading etc, the total at risk would have been higher if not the total price of the tank.
>>30545764
Quit being so anal about this. It was a joke, it doesn't require this level of examination.
>>30545522
CV90 here.
>>30545764
he was joking, what's wrong with you?
>>30545822
Speaking of anal...
Talk to my butt if you wanna talk shit.
>>30545863
Yeah dude, I definitely meant that the radio was seven million euros, because I am a big stupid retard. It's a good thing you corrected me, because now I am much smarter. Thank you so much for making a big deal out of this instead of just recognizing that I was kidding.
There, are you happy?
>>30545522
Nope, though it's Mrs Frenchfaguette's dream.
>>30545474
Well the radio was stuck between the lock and the radio socket and with the massive weight of the gun bearing down on it... couldn't stand very long.
I look forward to hearing stories from the other tankers here btw, not just mine.
>>30545439
wrong pic
>>30545823
Must be more comfortable being a newer kind of vehicle
>>30543995
Hull is different in the new vehicle, look at that pic >>30543653 again.
And don't compare a tank biathlon full of cheating to GuP, that really does a disservice to the series.
>>30544121
>no Twingo on that image
>>30546109
>look at that pic
i already look at them
the tank in 2015 sensha-dō have the same road wheel, mud shield and that thing with the red arrow in your pic
those tank in your pic are the new tank and 2014 sensha-do tank
>And don't compare a tank biathlon full of cheating to GuP
don't you watch the new movie, GUP is full of cheating, that make it more fun
>>30546512
more pic from 2015
you can see this tank have the same main gun sight as the new Type-96
and the same new mud shield
i have high res pic but it is 9mb
or you can just use google
>>30545961
Anything is more comfortable in an vehicle thats not a M113.
>>30546575
the new tank for comparing sake
Type-96A 2014
>>30546630
>>30546638
>>30546663
>>30546512
The tank from 2015 matches the top picture, the bottom picture is the new vehicle.
Look at the engine deck and exhaust.
>>30546694
the tank on the top is the 807 from 2014
as you can see i am dumping it pic here
>>30546694
>>30546705
and the 908 the one on those pic >>30546575 >>30543995
is the one from 2015 with the same chassis and gun sight as the new type-96
>>30546705
And it has exhaust pipes and a engine deck ledge not present on the new tank.
>>30546723
>engine deck ledge
>two exhaust ports
Not the same as the new tank.
>>30546730
>>30546744
because the 2015 is only a test bed for the new chassis
you should know that test tank and production tank are not always the same
remember Armata
>>30546787
The 2014/2015 pictures have the existing 96 hull, this new vehicle has a completely new hull.
>>30546630
Half of the turret height is slopped roof. Half... In 2016..
>>30546787
The addition of an APU exhaust port to the T-14 is not a completely new hull.
>>30546817
>>30546856
at least the engine and road wheels in the 2015 are new
they also have the same gun sight as the new Type-96
>>30546512
How were they so innacurate, was the gun not configured with the FCS or something? I think the Italians had a similar problem with the Ariete during that Tank exercise a few months ago.
>>30546981
don't know
must be the range finder
they stop and shoot and drive away right after they finish shooting( don't have a second change if they miss, because the rule is similar to the real Biathlon rules)
so a bad range finder could cause a lot of problem
>>30548189
look pretty good, this is the one Russia use in their T-90SM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNUmkbw56UE
>>30548596
I think they put the same thing on the Armata.
>>30548931
the KORD in the T-90SM is above the TC sight
the Aramata one is next to TC sight
>>30546512
it's obstacles, idealy you would want to recalibrate you gun after all that.
>>30549026
>it's obstacles,
the water obstacle was more like a trap than a obstacle
>>30549151
don't forget logs is brutal and all that falling and jumping
>>30547097
in here tank is sighted in, drove to range shot, no extreme driving
totally doesn't lose zero after that
>>30550156
>>30550170
>>30545823
Nice, Boden?
>>30550206
Norway
>>30550239
Aha. Okay. I've heard that those CV9030s are much more modern than our CV9040s
>>30550195
>dat idler mount snapping off
>>30550707
it was extremely painful
>>30551023
For you
Some sort of truck mounted artillery, note the bracing legs in stored position.
>>30552319
? ? ? where?
>>30543147
thanks again thg guy this thing reminds me of the cv 90 a bit
>>30552362
It is a Koalitsiya turret on a Kamaz truck.
>>30551023
what about the other idler, it's not even moving... reminds me of an old 1/35th scale motorized model when new.
>slavshit, not even once
>>30550156
>>30552553
It hit the concrete block with its right tread.
>>30550195
I need a Eurobeat edit of this
SWS2, 35mm SPAAG on a ZBL-08 chassis that was displayed at Eurosatory.
>>30553190
It seems to me that a lot of countries are moving away from the whole dedicated tracked and armored SPAAG setup (like the Shilka, Gepard or Tunguska) to basically putting extremely advanced AA suites on really simple truck beds or APC hulls.
>>30553623
Its cheaper and most don't have fleets of older MBT hulls to reuse.
Lmao this thread >>30552228
>>30553623
Not really. Its a new niche, that of PD systems protecting higher up SAMs in turn protecting fixed positions. SPAAG/SAMs on tracked and armored albeit lightly hulls were meant to move in with the units they are protecting or the SAM that are protecting a much larger formation.
>>30554291
Patently copypasta
>>30553711
Well, there are thousands of M60 and T-72 hulls just lying around, but nobody is willing to pay the money to have them refurbished, fixed, and shipped.
Plus the parts for older vehicles are often out of production, so you have to resort to cannibalism to keep the things working if you don't have enough domestic heavy industry to make spare parts.
>>30554582
Also China has dickloads of Type 59s hulls.
>>30554711
kek
>dickloads
>>30546587
Don't know if it's true, but looks like a similar area to where they wheeled out the ZTQ.
>>30555541
Might be Hebei province, considering the mountainous terrain and the slightly arid climate. It's also where the PLA 3rd Arm. Div. is based.
>>30552527
So basically the successor of A-222?
>>30556289
When I first saw that photograph, I thought it was a Koalition turret being transported somewhere, but you're telling me there's a truck mounted variant too? Why couldn't they just for a truck mount in the first place, like some European howitzers (ie Caesar)?
>>30556507
There are plans to make Coalition-based A-222 successor, but the chassis were promised to be from Typhoon-K.
>Why couldn't they just for a truck mount in the first place
Because tracked is better.
>>30556556
What's the difference between the two Typhoon models? I know they're both transporte but I'm not clear on how they diverge in their roles.
>>30556673
You mean -U and -K? One is produced by Ural, other by Kamaz. From my understanding -U is more of an utility truck and -K is more of a combat vehicle, but I may easily be mistaken.
>>30545907
>Mrs Frenchfaguette's
My dreams are crushed
>>30556507
>Why couldn't they just for a truck mount in the first place
Unacceptable downgrade in mobility from what they are supposed to replace (MSTA in theory, but likely Akatsiya in practice, they aren't that old). They could make a version that is based on the Kurganets though that version would likely be a rear-engined one like the tank variants.
>>30557278
Coalition is supposed to be on Armata chassis.
>>30557305
I know. I'm just thinking they have to replace the 122 mm SAUs anyway and I haven't heard of a future replacement utilizing the same caliber, and the Gvozdika seems ok with a 152 mm gun at its 25 ton weight class, so might as well...
>>30543147
How much do we know about the K21's AT missiles? Comparable to the TOW at least I would assume.
>>30556507
Tactical mobility vs strategic mobility.
Although wheeled vehicles have far better tactical mobility than the WHEELS REEEEEE crowd will admit.
>>30558065
Apparently it's based on spike
There were a lot of literature regarding K-ATGM in mp.net but sadly shit went to hell
>>30549019
That's a 7.62 mm PKTM, not a Kord heavy machinegun.
>>30558433
the one in the video is a Kord
>>30549019
How does the T-90SM compare to the T-90A? Judging from the photo its got slat armour and ERA for days and an RWS. Did they upgrade the engine or does it have to lug around another 5 tons ish or armour on the same engine?
>>30558973
they have the same gun
T-90SM FCS is much more advanced and it have a 1130 hp engine( same engine they put into the T-72B3M)
T-90A engine is 1000 hp
>>30558973
-newer version of the 2A46 gun
-newer FCS and sights
-independent thermal sight for the TC
-RWS
-Relikt ERA
-bustle ammunition storage
-new engine that brings it up to Western tanks hp/ton
-APU
>>30543147
Anyone here play the game War Of Tanks on your PC it's a free game
>>30559017
>>30559151
Thanks guys, appreciate it. Ive got a small question about the bustle storage.
Doesn´t the T-72/T-80/T-90 use the same autolader, where the ammunition and propellant is stored vertically on the floor of the tank? How do they load the ammo into the gun if its coming from the bustle, not the floor like usual with Russian tanks.
>>30559151
the bustle which is only accessible from outside is only for extra rounds
>>30559348
horizontally I meant btw, sorry
>>30559348
The T-64/T-80 and T-72/T-90 use different autoloaders.
To get the ammo from the bustle they have to exit the tank, it is just a means of getting spare rounds outside of the tank as most of the turret pops come from ammunition stored here and there inside the tank.
>>30559427
>>30559360
Alright, thanks fellas.
>>30558282
Wheeled artillery in its role is the successor of specifically towed artillery. It's not simply WHEELS REEE, it's WHEELS INSTEAD OF TRACKS REEEEEEEEEEEEEE.
>>30560054
>it's WHEELS INSTEAD OF TRACKS REEEEEEEEEEEEEE.
So WHEELS REEE.
Joining ADF soon but I cant decide between tanks or cavalry (IFVs).
Can anyone share experiences/advice? Thanks
>>30548189
so what happens if the camera is shot? Is the entire thing useless?
>>30560213
It can still be operated like a normal MG.
>>30559427
But T-90 also uses different autoloader than T-72. It takes longer shells and can rotate in reverse.
IIRC the autoloader was changed in 1987 or 1989.
>>30560531
The basic design of the T-90 and T-72's autoloader is the same. The long rod ammunition developed by Russia is still too large to fit in the autoloader and requires manual loading.
>>30560992
T-72B3 has modified autoloader that allows the use of Svinets-1/2 rounds.
>>30560992
Is that the same for the T-90SM with its turret changes?
>>30559427
Anyone have that T-64 autoloader webm?
>>30562749
no, it can load long rod ammo.
>>30560188
Cav is terrible, because ASLAVs aren't really that comfortable. The M1A1 AIMs are pretty dope though, but I personally miss the old Leopards.
>>30559151
Isn't the T-90SM turret transplants on hold because of the added priority given to upgrading existing T-72s and getting T-14s out?
>>30563182
not quite
http://youtu.be/B4B4Yd6q-zg?t=1m41s
>>30564092
Holy hell that's a lot of smoke, is that normal?
>>30564681
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNTDyJmKCnQ
Abrams loading in action
>>30565016
Dunno how many of my copypasta are still good.
>M1A2 Abrams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNTDyJmKCnQ
>Leopard 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwXwrx_lkSg
>Leopard 1A5DK
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Es05tyz6cg
>Challenger 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxEhnD_Bo-0
>Leclerc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6nlvii-bP0
>T-90
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iEZmKB0XSM
>T-80
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSzh2Ot2niY
>T-72
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTGM1n8CYyQ
>T-64
http://youtu.be/B4B4Yd6q-zg?t=1m41s
>T-55 (labeled as a T-62 but it is a T-55)
http://youtu.be/QK0jaWmTIWM?t=30s
>Stingray II
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSOQn3h5nAA
>M48A3 Patton
http://youtu.be/HXeHEUTWqkw
>2S1 Gvozdika
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQ0JOgKNB1g
>2S19 Msta
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9ah-EZDTTc
>M109A6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYM_n-LmhVc
>>30565244
Challenger 2 one is dead, sadly. Is there another video?
>>30565244
>>30565283
Pretty much the closest one I've found for the Chally. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2OlLUZ4jEk
Don't know why the bongs are so anal about filming the interior.
>>30565696
Someone told me a lot of the interior components are still classified, but even then it's been an age since the Challenger 2's introduction.
>>30565696
Another reason the one I had might have been taken down was the loader had a propellant charge in the bustle rack.
>>30565696
>Don't know why the bongs are so anal about filming the interior.
Embarrassment, I expect.
It's probably the most unsafe modern western tank there is.
>>30546512
as a vietfag this picture make me feel alot more reassuring about fighting the chink when the time come. It will be a one sided affair, sure, but it's less likely that I will get kill by a tank
>>30567016
hello, i am the anon uploaded that pic
and i am a Vietnamese too
you mind have forgot that our best tank are T-62 with ancient FCS, and the Jew T-54 upgrade is nothing but failure .
not to mention that Type-96 was shooting at 1600m range
>>30566186
Might be faster, but I'm fairly sure that negates the safety of the two piece separated ammunition.
>>30567116
and not just the Type-96
those Type-59 with 105mm gun and thermal could easily out range our T-62 and T-54/54
holy fucking shit it is 2016 and we have just started putting laser range finder into our T-54, the T-55 and T-62 are still using soviet monkey model FCS
>>30567116
it's unlikely tank battle would occur in northern vietnam, so we are good friends. Just hold on to those RPG 7VR and RPG 29
![tumblr_mmpus3WpcY1qdlh1io1_400[1].gif](https://i.imgur.com/sQCD3zO.gif "tumblr_mmpus3WpcY1qdlh1io1_400[1].gif")
>>30551023
Was looking at the idler on the right hand side thinking it was a idler mount issue like the left...
>See the hull lines separating
MFW the hole hull is ripped open like a cardboard
>>30567246
>Just hold on to those RPG 7VR and RPG 29
>he believe the RPG meme
let me remind you that artillery is the king of battlefield
and PLA have fuck tons of SPG, most of them are highly mobile
and RPG can only triumph over tank in urban and jungle
unleast the Chink is Saudi level on tank warfare
oh way, i almost forgot that Chink RPG is way ahead of the RPG-29
PF-98 have a really nice paper record
>>30567349
>he believes the chink would put decent commander in the southern front against vietnam in the initial phase
i severely doubt they sent type 99 into vietnam, RPG will deal with T 96 just fine. Like i said it;s a one sided affair, but at least there's one less shit i have to worry about
>>30567349
PF-98 is a 120mm recoilless rifle, not an RPG.
>>30560188
aslav's are to be replaced with whatever wins the land400 phase 1
>>30567528
RPG translated ti handheld anti tank grenade launcher
so any small arm that launch anti tank shell is a RPG
>>30567709
>so any small arm that launch anti tank shell is a RPG
The PF-98 does not propel its projectiles with a rocket motor, it is not an RPG.
Weapons like it and the Carl Gustav are a type of gun.
>>30567349
>>30567709
>dat engrish
>dat confusion
At least get yo facts straight
>>30567906
you mean recoiless rifle?
>>30567349
m8, recoilless rifles are still lethal against lighter vehicles, and are severe threats to tanks as well, particularly from the flanks and rear.
>>30567951
depends on if it is rifled
>>30565244
The T-80's "chuck" sound makes my dick hard
>>30568409
just recoiless gun then?
>>30567349
>and PLA have fuck tons of SPG, most of them are highly mobile
>highly mobile
>Towed artillery 6,246
>Self-propelled artillery 1,710
Not really Zhang.
>oh way, i almost forgot that Chink RPG is way ahead of the RPG-29
RPGs aren't used against other RPGs, they are used against opfor armor, in which case Chinese armor definitely has the edge over their Vietnamese counterparts.
>>30568984
>Towed artillery 6,246
It becomes mobile when you factor in the 183 angry chinamen that stand ready to pull each of those guns
>>30566572
Not even close. Tanks like the Leo 2, Ariete and Leclerc store full rounds in the crew compartment that are much more 'in the way' of incoming. The Challenger's rounds are separated into inert and combustable elements, with the latter stored in an armored box in the floor, so much of its ammo area to get hit wouldn't produce anything, and they're a much smaller target.
Meanwhile the other three mentioned have full rounds on display.
The Abrams is much safer in design than all of them because ALL of its rounds are behind an armored box, though.
The whole thing about "not wanting to film the interior" is pretty much bullshit. There's plenty of Challenger internal pictures/videos around, just there's a lot more Leos and Abrams around the world, so a higher quantity of pictures get dregged up.
>>30569174
What I want to see is an Ariete interior. Not because I like the tank or anything, it's just because I've never seen it before.
>>30569425
Gunner position
>>30569450
sauce?
>>30567906
>>30567933
the first RPG don't have a rocket motor
and before that RPG are the term they call anti tank hand grenade
>>30565244
Might be a stupid question, but does the Leopard 1A5DK have a different loading procedure? Otherwise I would have just expected the title to be Leopard 1A5.
China is sending tank to Tank biathlon
>>30569765
and IFV
>>30568984
1 710 is good number, anon
>>30569725
It is a 1A5DK, why would I just label it 1A5?
>>30570492
>>30570562
What kind of propellant do tank rounds use? Is it the same stuff as you find in pistol and rifle rounds or something completely different?
120mm 5000 grain ammo or the like...
>>30569772
Are those BMP-1 or just some chinese knockout
>>30570695
Type 86Gai
Chinese licensed built BMP-1, upgraded with new turret, main gun is the licensed version of the 2A72
>>30570492
>>30570562
>>30570569
are these from the Swedish tank trials?
>>30569174
>Tanks like the Leo 2, Ariete and Leclerc store full rounds in the crew compartment that are much more 'in the way' of incoming.
How can twenty or so rounds kept in hull-storage, condensed into one area and sat behind the thickest armor in the tank be more vulnerable than simply storing all of the ammo all over the place?
>with the latter stored in an armored box in the floor
Close, but replace "in" with "on".
>>30570814
yes
>>30567116
>Jew T-54 upgrade is nothing but failure .
why?
>>30571518
idk
but we have developed domestic laser range finder, ERA and thermal sleeves for the main gun so a foreign upgrade packet is unnecessary
pic related is the new T-54 during testing
>actually storing ammo anywhere within the tank
That's just asking for trouble.
>>30570439
lol ghetto boresight
>>30570815
>How can twenty or so rounds kept in hull-storage, condensed into one area and sat behind the thickest armor in the tank be more vulnerable than simply storing all of the ammo all over the place?
Because it isn't "ammo all over the place".
Anything combustable is in a single armored compartment in the floor, in the least likely part of the tank to be taking hits. Anything above that is just inert KEPs or entirely insensitive.
Meanwhile, there are full rounds in the crew compartment for the Leo, Ariete and Leclerc in much more likely to be hit places. The charges in the CR2 are very low and small, compare to the Leo 2's massive block of combustable ammo sitting pretty much along the full front left hull. Not to mention both the Leo 2 and Ariete have rounds in the turret that can be hit and detonated too, whereas the CR2 only has inert materials there that have nothing to detonate.
>>30567349
>RPG's literally cannot be fired in any terrain except jungle and urban
That's incorrect.
>>30571518
I doubt its their fault... there's a limit to how far you can upgrade a tank and I think the T-55 hit that limit in the 90s
>>30569723
RPG = Rocket-Propelled Grenade
if it doesn't have a rocket motor, it's not an RPG, dumbass.
>>30571720
The rounds in the turret on the Leo 2 is kept like in the Abrams; behind blast doors with blow out panels
>>30571777
not that guy, but it's a backronym, and an incorrect one
>>30571860
No, it's not.
How can someone be this stupid? It's right there in the goddamned name. Quit being a fuckhead about it.
>>30571777
Actually RPG stands for Ruchnoy Protivotankoviy Granatomyot. Dumbass.
>>30571999
No, it doesn't. It stands for Rocket-Propelled Grenade.
You're on an English-speaking website, learn how to speak English or fuck right off. By your shitty russo-chink definition, an M67 is an RPG.
>>30572340
>M67
Never knew it had a rocket motor which propelled it, I thought the guy had to throw it with his hands.
>>30570620
If you want APFSDS to go as fast as possible (~ 2km/s) you don't use gun powder. You use RDX and TNT mixtures.
>>30572340
Take your trolling and fuck right off. This is /thg/, not Tank Shitposting #43485015
>>30572497
This is where the distiction between RPG and RPG-# comes in.
>>30572395
>Never knew it had a rocket motor which propelled it
Holy shit, read the fucking thread you stupid faggot. That is *exactly* the point I am making, which you'd know if you had ready even a *single* post other than the one you replied to.
>>30572497
>not Tank Shitposting #43485015
Funny, because literally the only thing that anyone adds to this thread are shitposts.
Just look at this one. It's another "waaahhhh tanks have ammunition inside of them, what a CRAZY IDEA" bitchfest, followed by this garbage.
>>30572462
aka Composition B
>>30569425
>>30569537
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrBgmVudT9w
>>30571476
>alien head
Polish made 120mm and 125mm ammo.
If liquid propellants like kerosene + oxygen is so much more energy dense than gunpowder
Why don't we use that?
>>30573387
complexity, cost and danger outweigh potential benefits
From Nexter's Eurosatory 2016 display, note the programmable HE round and APFSDS which appears to have a data link like the M829A4.
>>30573687
>APFSDS which appears to have a data link
But why?
>>30573706
The guy who posted that image speculates that the 'sacrificial tip' can actually separate as a precursor to detonate ERA or fake out APS.
>>30571596
Okay, I'm taking the bait, where would you store the ammo then?
>>30575784
Not him, but I think he means to store it like Abrams/Leopards (and others I'm sure), where the ammo isn't technically inside the tank, and is separated from the fighting compartment by an armored shutter that only opens when the loader must grab a new round.
>>30573888
>detonate ERA or fake out APS.
so airburst APFSDS
>>30571720
>Because it isn't "ammo all over the place".
Did you somehow miss the four separate ammunition compartments spread around the hull in the image I posted?
Of course the Leopard and Leclerc have bigger hull storage blocks: It's because they have all hull ammunition storage centralized in one space.
That doesn't change the fact that overall, the Challenger has a huge amount more space where any damage incurred will risk an ammunition fire.
>Meanwhile, there are full rounds in the crew compartment for the Leo, Ariete and Leclerc in much more likely to be hit places
The Challenger also has hull storage in the front hull, beside the driver, the problem is that it has hull storage elsewhere as well.
>Anything combustable is in a single armored compartment in the floor
Do you have any evidence?
Apparently there's plenty of Challenger internal pictures/videos around.
Everything I've seen indicates that the propellant charges are kept in boxes within the turret basket.
There wouldn't be space under the floor because of the suspension
>Not to mention both the Leo 2 and Ariete have rounds in the turret that can be hit and detonated too,
Yeah, behind armored doors and blowout panels, something the Challenger completely lacks for some reason.
All ammunition in the Challenger sits in the fighting compartment and will destroy the tank if it ignites unlike the turret ammunition storage in a Leopard or Leclerc.
>>30576398
More like an APFSDS that splits in two after a set distance, airburst would imply fragmentation.
Any of you armorfags tried out Pokemon Go inside a vehicle yet?
>>30571720
Both the Ariete and Leopard have fully functional blowout panels and separate magazine compartments
>>30577370
Bumpin for interest
>>30577981
>M1A2
18 ready rounds in a rack on the left side of the turret bustle (with blowout panels) separated by an armored door, 18 semi-ready rounds in a rack on the right side of the turret bustle (with blowout panels) separated by an armored door, and 6 rounds in a rack in the hull behind the commander (with blowout panels) separated by an armored door.
>Leopard 2
15 ready rounds in a rack on the left side of the turret bustle (with blowout panels) separated by an armored door, and 27 rounds in a rack next to the driver.
>Ariete
15 ready rounds stored in an armored bin in the turret basket, and 27 rounds in a rack next to the driver.
>Merkava Mk.4
10 ready rounds in a cassette in the turret bustle (with blowout panels) separated by an armored door, and 40 rounds in racks on either side of the rear door.
>Leclerc
22 ready rounds in the autoloader cassette in the turret bustle (with blowout panels), 18 rounds in a rack next to the driver.
>Challenger 2
24 APFSDS rounds in a rack in the turret bustle, 4 wet storage bins for HESH/WP rounds and propellant charges in the turret basket, 4 wet storage bins on either side of the driver for HESH/WP rounds and propellant charges.
>>30579217
derp not wet storage on the Challenger 2, armored bins
>>30579217
Is HESH more liable to ignite than APFSDS rounds? This might sound stupid but I thought plastic explosive was really stable.
what's this
https://youtu.be/taHFUKKKmJM?t=287
>>30579568
Obligatory tank instructional video (put on your rose tinted glasses)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVvBY_r7p-g
>>30579521
APFSDS cannot ignite.
>>30579521
"Is it harder to ignite explosives, or solid metal?"
>>30579729
>>30579763
Isn't the propellant flammable? Not even trolling or anything, just know nothing about tanks
>>30579830
Challenger 2's use two piece ammunition.
The APFSDS on the wall here with the orange bases are just the projectile, the propellant charges are in the armored bins below.
>>30579865
What I am not sure about is how the charges and HESH/WP rounds are arranged in the 8 bins.
Here you can see 20 tubes in the 6-5-6 bins that are fixed to the hull at the back of the turret and the 3 bin that is normally attached to the turret in the loaders position.
>>30579901
Forgot the picture.
>>30579909
The top pair of bins next to the driver are 6 tube, the lower pair I do not know.
>>30550156
>>30550170
>>30550195
How come the personnel inside don't hit their heads often at these speeds?
>>30580156
They are lashed to their seats. Drivers in particular had the left hand duct-taped to the left tiller.
>>30580156
>>30580259
Yeah, tanks should not be doing those kinds of maneuvers if crew safety is being prioritised.
>>30580259
>>30580351
But how stable are the positions of the others? They look like they're only sitting on chairs with no restraint. How do they not fly around and hit every part of their bodies?
>>30579865
I heard Challenger 2 gunners often have the rounds taken out of the bins and the pieces together for easy access in combat.
>>30579568
I was amazed at the running German tanks, but then i remembered this was probably made right after WWI was over.
>>30581376
I checked the description, the video was made in 1943, although the panzers in the beginning looked like actual US demonstration footage, not German stock reels.
>>30581392
You could tell it was made mid-war because they didn't have the big cats on display, or even any stock footage of them.
>>30580982
Lap loading is retarded and will get people killed. The US military drills this into their crewmen for a reason, cook-offs will end with the crew turned to batter and coated on the inside of the tank.
>>30580982
Chally 2 a shit.
>>30579865
I thought it was 3-piece ammo. Primer, propellant and projectile.
>>30581651
It depends on whether you count the primers or not, because without the primers, it's seen as two piece.
>>30579935
What's a PLAICE? Can't find anything on google.
so /k/ what would be your pick for Australia's new combat reconnaissance vehicle, for the land 400 project
contenders are...
patria AMV35
boxer CRV
sentinel II
LAV-6 with the new MCT-30 turret
any others i'm forgetting?
>>30582033
Patria or Boxer, based on jack shit.
>>30582033
There's the Lynx as well.
>>30582256
its an IFV not a CRV. a different land 400 project
the CRV will replace the ASLAV-25
and the IFV will replace the ancient m113AS4
>>30582256
Isn´t that phase 3 or something of the land400 program? Patria, Boxer and the rest of the vehicles, one of them will be picked to replace the australian LAVs, while the tracked vehicles like the Lynx will replace the M113.
At least thats what i think is happening.
