Tell me /k/ how can I make a gun? I made a perfect design that I know will work. I have blueprints for it and everything. How do I get this produced into a functional weapon?
PIC unrelated.
Anybody?
>I made a perfect design with blueprints!
>lol how make
You haven't done shit besides doodle during your 6th grade math class.
>>30410300
machine shop
>>30410456
Dude. Asking how I can turn a blueprint into a functional weapon is kiddie somehow? Really reaching for insults.
If you don't know how to make it, you probably shouldn't be making it. I'd say post blueprints but you're probably just gonna bitch about one of us stealing your design.
>>30410475
If you legitimately got to that stage of planning you should already know 10 different ways to translate it into a physical prototype.
But you don't. You don't know anything.
Post your doodles so we can laugh at them, kid.
>>30410475
A good design factors in manufacturing considerations. If you don't know how to manufacture it you don't know how to design it.
You are retarded and so is your thread.
>>30410495
>>30410497
>>30410504
I know how to go build a weapon that looks like shit with some power tools. But making what I want to make needs a polymer base. I don't have a lot of equiptment at my disposal. And I want to know the legalities of it, and If I could go to say.. Beretta and ask them to help me build it.
>>30410527
3D print a fucking prototype first you god damn idiot.
>>30410539
I don't have a 3d printer. And from what I can find the 3d printer I need is half a million dollars.
>>30410475
It really isn't. You should already have some machining experience if you are planning on building something needing to withstand many ten-of-thousands of PSI pressure.
Just look at building a break open, like a shotgun or derringer. Once you have that figured out, look at how the Sten gun was developed. Move on to more complicated designs later.
>>30410546
>And from what I can find the 3d printer I need is half a million dollars
Confirmed for grade school dropout.
>>30410556
I'm not looking to build some bullshit printed in my fap-dome AR lower. I need something that can print metal, and that costs nearly half a million dollars.
>>30410567
>it needs a polymer base!
>I need something that can print metal!
Holy shit it just keeps getting better
What state do you live in?
>>30410574
I know my inconsistency's. That was stupid of me.
Basically, something similar to how the FN Five-seveN works. Metal base, polymer shell.
My bad, should have thought it all out.
Send it to Kel Tek
>>30410567
>>30410527
>>30410475
>>30410300
what kind of retard are you?
also show your shitty blueprint, come on and show it!
>>30410585
>should have thought it all out
/thread
i.e. for legality, resources
You're right. I was being stupid. I apologize.
BTW would kel tec really do something with it?
>>30410567
>Need polymer base
>muh printer needs to print in metal
Oh okay
What state?
Buy a cheap 3D printer. Buy a cheap mill. Buy a cheap lathe.
Build a rough around the edges prototype. Send a detailed report to a reputable manufacturer.
If you can't manage at least that you should stick to daydreaming.
>>30410300
Metalworking. Knowing what stresses you need in each part, which means does it have to give and flex or stay firm? Is it a part that needs oil and requires a certain angle to hold the lube with minimal friction? Lots of engineering quirks we don't think about are in these designs. Small oil catches we don't see even when it's pulled apart. Stuff like keeping the oil off the plastic of the gun because all oils always erodes all plastics when applied to them unless it requires a certain temperature. (Guns change from near freezing to +200faren so its always met eventually)
You have a lot to think about. Your design may not be so great after all. People go and say "My perfect design!" yet pay no attention to the materials themselves.
Nigger, what state do you live in? I want to know for resources, also if you're living in the great state of Arizona, you can build one legally, and you'll have access to a 500k cnc
>>30410300
Ok everyone, while mildly rude, is right. There's a few different ways to make a weapon and you need the design to take that into account. Milling, broaching, stamping, casting, and for polymer injection molding (or casting for you). Then lathe/rifling machine for barrel, if using gas tubes you'll need more machines etc. I'd our source for screws. Idk your design/action operation, but it's get a hydraulic press (>$200) maybe a welder, and some molding compound and casting resin (at least for prototypes) make up some stamping/bending jigs for the frame, place in mold and cast the resin around it. P.S. forgot vacuum pump (shop vac+5 gallon bucket=???) Go ahead, build your dream anon
>>30410621
This is what I will do. Thank you very much!
>>30410656
Godspeed, you beautiful misguided bastard.
>>30410300
How good of a job do you want to do? Guns are not that complicated a device, but if you want to make something reliable and relatively modern you need modern tools and know-how. If you want to stick a shotgun shell in a length of pipe, that is much simpler.
>>30410655
Outsource for screws, springs, tubes (?) Etc. Also Yeah make sure you know your stresses, look into steals and heat treating, (1040? 4140? 316? W1? D2??) Of you're wanting a solid slide you'll either need to mill steel or aluminum, or rough cast and finish aluminum (by hand?? Lol Pakis do it)
>>30410653
Sorry about that. I'm getting around to repsonding.
I live in Florida.
>>30410640
You are right. I need to rethink somethings. I am basing off an HK USP design, so i guess I know which parts need slack and to stay firm and to move, but I'll definitely rethink some things. Thank you.
>>30410678
I definitely want something modern and reliable.
I think for prototypes it will have to be a bit shitty but when I partner with a company hopefully we can make big design improvements on the gun.
>>30410699
If they can do it, so can I!
You can do anything you put your mind to, so long as you just believe
>>30410713
So what is it? Short recoil? What's makes it different than a USP? Unless you wanna keep that trade secret lol
>>30410475
Quality steel.
A milling machine.
A lathe.
Some machinist tools.
How detailed is your blueprint?
How do you know how to make a blueprint but not how things are made?
What kind of firearm we talking here, pistol, revolver ( the tround revolver has been dun b foe), rifle, shotgun? What kinda gat? young JMB
>>30410527
send the design to kel-tec
>>30410546
Rent on you half wit!
Ya!, kel tek will know what ta do
>>30410752
He said like a USP but I'm not so sure if he really understands the different actions and functions, hope we don't hear about a mauling by a case head separation in a homemade handgun, or it just coming apart
Does it have a carry handle?
>>30410300
why is it so easy to tell the Indian posters from anyone else?
B8: the thread
You can smell the curry?
>>30410784
I understand the actions perfectly. So to prevent any error I am basing it off the USP's action. Because it works already.
>>30410749
I know how it's made, I wanted to know how I can get access to the materials and how I can market it.
>>30410741
Short recoil operation.
>>30410300
>I made a perfect design that I know will work. I have blueprints for it and everything.
>But I can't make it because my only engineering experience is pretend
>MFW it's this thread again
>>30410820
So... something identical to the USP except with one or two small changes.
Enjoy your lawsuit.
>>30410888
No, no, no. The action is based on the USP. Just as a guideline. It will look and feed completely different.
>>30410845
Ok well watch this for inspiration blowback but still
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/khyber-pass-colt-copy-at-ria/
If you guys see a front loading semi automatic pistol that takes pages from the mausers c96's book, you'll know I made it.
>>30410966
>front loading semi automatic pistol
>>30410567
>Designing a gun so retarded it can only be 3D printed
Welp OP, you are dumb as rocks.
>>30411181
It's been done before, It's not impossible. It's actually very possible. Many competition guns use that loading style.
>>30411199
Replace retarded with complex.
>>30410806
>why is it so easy to tell the Indian posters
Total ignorance combined with complete overconfidence.
OP will do the needful
>>30410749
What is drafting? For 500.
But on the serious though, i want to see OP's doodles.
>>30411213
If a thousand other designs manage to work beautifully with out that complexity, then that complexity is unwarranted and retarded.
>>30411258
You've not seen my designs. You cannot judge what you do not know.
>>30410905
>The action is based on the USP. Just as a guideline. It will look and feed completely different
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_Sigma#Legality
>>30411295
Thank you for this. I will make changes to it. I will use my own action design instead of copying. Thank you once again.
>>30411204
>It's been done before, It's not impossible.
No shit, but that wasn't my point.
>>30411341
Sorry about that, my bad. Tell me your point, please.
Mech eng here. Listen up kiddo, you gon get learned 101 in prototyping.
First, you don't need crazy machines and million dollar 3D printers. Effective prototyping is the key. For dimensioning for pressure, there are formulas. You need to test the mechanical design, dimensions, ergonomics, such things. A first prototype for this can be made out of paper. I designed medical instruments and robots with paper! Then step your game up to cardboard, 2.5d. Glue that shit together, build it up layer by layer. This gives you an ergonomic prototype. Then build the internals in cardboard, you now have a mechanical prototype. After 10 such prototypes each, you start combining the two. Integrate mechanical cardboard into ergonomic cardboard. Then dimension everything properly, 3D print it in the cheapest polymer, test form and function. Redimension, test slings, mags, everything. THEN, ONLY THEN, YOU GO TO THE MANUFACTURING PEOPLE. They know more than you. Ask them, learn, then step up your prototyping. Only then you might need a multi million dollar machine. You can build a gun without firing it ever before the zero series!
>>30410456
>>30410497
Fine. You want to see my blueprints so badly, hear they are. Don't Steel Them!
>>30411371
Thank you VERY much for this. I will start building a prototype soon. I will post back on /k/ when it's built if anyone would care?
Thank you very much man.
>>30411353
That the design is outdated and relegated to vidya and specialized guns.
>>30411458
I like that design. It's inspired me.
Also the kriss Vector. The recoil system, but I don't think that would work for a handgun. becuase it would make the space behind the magazine too large.
>>30411371
Why do you go through all these steps? Can you not picture the thing in your head?
>>30411496
Well, If you have suuuper good idealization yeah. But it's always best to work off of a on paper design.
>>30411476
>I like that design. It's inspired me.
Read as: I am the person who made a thread about the Atlas45 earlier this week but people caught on to me so I jumped ship and got some new bait.
>>30411417
Mech eng OP here.
Forgot the most important part: start with the PROBLEM, not the solution. For example, nit many care about the newest gun. But people were annoyed with the stupid reloading process of revolvers. It takes a long time, takes a lot of focus. This is the problem. A magazine is the solution. Try to find the problem before thinking of the solution! And don't be afraid to scrap ideas, you can alwqys come back to them, but you don't get the time back you wasted on them. Every week, take a step back amd ask yourself "Am I doing the most effective thing now? Isn't that just a minor detail? Do I have to do this now?"
>>30411534
Yep that was me. I really enjoy the design, so I made some blueprints for some.
>>30411544
True. I'll take this to heart. Importance first. Cosmetics later.
>>30411496
>>30411531
Well... No. You will always forget something. You will always discover an issue. And also, it gives you confidence in your solution. You don't stand in front of your boss and go 'eeehhrmm' when he asks you 'why didn't you do this like so and so?'
In my opinion, the best engineers are those who iterate the most. Those who say: I don't know, let's test this. And then test some more. Those who say: 'that was always done like that, we will loose time and money, we won't do that!' are the bad ones.
Nobody is perfect, the process forces you to admit this, become humble and finally succeed because you were forced to think of everything.
Do yourself a favor and see if any of the shit you came up with should be patented.
Is this all drawn up or is it AT LEAST a CAD rendering ?
>>30411618
I see your point. It would be very unlikely to get it perfect by just visualizing it. It's best to make archives and modify them based on what would be best for the development. Correct?
>>30411653
It's drawn up, not rendered. I'm going to be designing it in 3ds max soon.
>>30411660
Exactly.
I am trying hard to find some good material on product development and iterative prototyping. But it seems most things are paid resources. This pdf has some good words to search for, but not a good structure.
http://core.materials.ac.uk/repository/eaa/talat/210102.pdf
>>30411674
>It's drawn up
No it isn't.
>>30411772
Thank you for this. I'll look it over. You are an extremely big help to me.
>>30410475
Yes, this actually makes you kiddie.
When you design a weapon, or any part really, you should already be considering manufacturability, sustainability, price, and performance.
There are plenty more design considerations that go into creating a part before you even touch CAD software.
Then when you're ready to begin, you start with a design document that lists all your intended goals of your finished product, and you design to those.
Basically, if you already have a so called "perfect design" for a gun, you'd already know how to build it.
Since you're probably an illiterate high-school retard who drew your "perfect design" on binder paper, I'll tell you that you almost certainly need a mill, lathe, drill press and possibly a bend brake, depending on if your design is stamped.
bonus points for owning a CNC mill, as it'll make things far easier.
Go to school.
>>30410585
>metal base, polymer shell
Metal base is either milled/stamped/cast, and the polymer shell is probably a second casting over the top of it. Naturally, the knockout pins are on the underside.
If you have made a design so retarded that the only way to actually build it is to use a 3D printer, then you have seriously fucked up on the "design for assembly in a single plane" department.
Get fucking good.
>>30410905
>short recoil
>feeds completely different
please
>>30412023
Dare to dream.
>>30411281
Show us your designs then.
>>30412130
You'll steel them.
>>30412135
No, I'll polymer them.
>>30412135
I can guarantee that nobody here gives shit about stealing your sonic OC. Most people probably just came to laugh at you.
>>30410300
>blueprint
it's called a technical drawing. If you don't know what it's called, you definitely don't actually have one.
post ISO or ANSI/ASME standard technical drawings of all 6 planes and your isometric view or gtfo
>>30412181
Hey guys, I just bought some for skinny jeans.
>ACKTUALLY THERE CALLED just called PANTS. PROOF YOU DONT ACTUALLY HAVE THEM.
>>30410966
What do you mean like a tip barrel? That's kinda cool but idk why you'd have mag infront on handle if possible
>>30411417
Yes bring if here if you do. I have a half baked plan to make a steel tube semi auto .30 carbine ar upper, probably lever delayed blowback
>>30411476
>I don't think that would work for a handgun. becuase it would make the space behind the magazine too large.
Why? You're already making it mag foward? What cal anyway?
Lever delay is cool but you probably need to set up a forge, press and die, and learn metal treating, also checkout reising m50 for simplicity (it's open bolt though, also might be too long) unless you wanna stick with short recoil, then why not mag in handle?
>>30412246
behaving ignorantly is a good metric for ignorance you retarded 14 year old with a napkin drawing of a vidya'd polymer short recoil version of the c96 meme gun
pics or gtfo
>>30412253
Im REALLY like the 5.7x28mm and EA is open to cooperation in bullet making for clients. BUUT I think a traditional 9mm or .45 ACP would be the round I'd chamber it in.
The primary reason I want the mag infront of the Handle and trigger is so the Handle can be as thin and ergonomic as possible.
I want it to traditionally load like a short recoil handgun, but where it feeds would just be placed forward towards the tip of the gun.
>>30410300
Hey /k/. OP is pretty special, but I have a related question.
What is a good introductory book on gunsmithing that doesn't assume a lot of prerequisite knowledge (i.e. not The Modern Gunsmith) and doesn't focus on building one specific weapon?
>>30412303
>perfect handgun
>front heavy and long as fuck
you don't have a damn Idea what you're doing OP. post the isometric drawing of your pistol design so we can better help/ridicule you.
>>30412338
Trust me, I know exactly what I'm doing. To combat the front heavy ness, I'll make sure that the handle is weighted accordingly.
>>30412337
gunsmithing relies on a lot of prerequisite knowledge, there's no getting around that. what would you hope to accomplish without a firm basis in machine work and mathematics?
>>30412253
http://www.google.com/patents/US2356726
Forgot link, not to sway you on the action but I just can't fathom why you'd want a mag foward pistol unless your using a simpler action. Never played CoD but do you honestly just want to make the pistol off the game? Or do you think it has merits? Because unless you're using a cartridge to large to fit in the grip I'm really not seeing a point of a modern handgun in that confirmation, and thats from someone who loves those early pistols like the Bergmann–Bayard, c96 and pic related
>>30412371
Well, the gun off of CoD is really an inspiration. PLUS i've posted tons of topics on here about grip size. It's an obsession for me, I think having a grip that can be any shape or ergonomic is the best thing to do.
By the way, thank you for being nice in the way you do things. I appreciate you.
>>30412355
>perfect handgun
>fuckhuge
>double the weight of a design that would already be double the weight of a normal handgun to brute force your way around it being 100% front heavy
please post your napkin drawing, I need the giggle. in what world do you think this retarded concept of yours is "perfect" for anything?
>>30412412
Perfect for me. It's a perfect gun for ME.
>>30412303
>>30412338
>>30412355
Well you'll have a shorter barrel to oal length ratio, also ugh can't even type this just doesn't sound like a good design, those are already pistol rounds why not just have those in the grip? Do you have small hands? Cause I do (my name) and full size guns aren't bad, the shield almost feels too narrow. Why add extra weight than necessary to a pistol? You want it slim will it be for conceal? Why mag forward then again?? Ughhh
>>30412429
I am not for a compact gun, Imagine a smaller KRISS Vector Pistol
>>30412403
>>30412427
Ok well maybe look into a tombstone/snail mag so you can have a slim grip and it still be like a regular pistol, otherwise just try and make the front light, maybe even do a hybrid slide with the part over you hand steel then transition to partial aluminum or polymer? Idk look into exotic barrel maretials? I guess if you use 5.7 if shouldn't be TOO Unbalanced
>>30412448
What exactly is wrong with the current Vector pistol? It was mentioned explicitly in your previously thread and all you said was "hurr durr its an SMG".
>>30412427
so a retarded gun for a retard?
also you're a few decades too late with your breakthrough design in the world of substandard handguns. But the czechs who made this intended it to be a stocked machine pistol, not a giant pistol.
>>30412448
so a potato version of a kriss vector that doesn't have any of the advantages of the vector bolt design.
post a drawing already so we can confirm how fucking dumb your concept is. if you thing you're ready for making one you have to have a isometric drawing
>>30412448
>smaller vector
You realize the actual vector pistols only have 5" barrels, right?
post blueprints
>>30412359
I have a very firm base in mathematics. I'm a physicist.
I'd assume though that such a book would introduce me to the skillsets required to begin gunsmithing. That's why I asked.
>>30412427
Post a drawing of your perfect gun or GTFO
>>30412489
I've seen how big the vector pistol is in the hands, way to big.
BY THE WAY I will not weight the grip. a front heavy pistol will be perfect for negating muzzle flip.
>>30412512
>mathematics
>physicist
>gunsmithing is ezpz basic bitch work compared to my massive intelect
Ahh now I understand. You are too autistic to comprehend art.
>>30412466
And I should have said modified tombstone(casket w/e), going from double stack at the bottom to single in the grip, make your gun look like a battery powered drill. Unless you're hell bent on forward, then do casket anyway
>>30412535
That's my point. And here you are, no experience in anything whatsoever, thinking you can shrink it down to something actual pistol sized.
>>30412512
There is no "gun-smithing for dummies".
Most books focus on certain aspects of gunsmithing, whether it be pistols/rifles or countries of origin.
>>30412557
It will be a completely different operation. I'm just talking about it's general look.
>>30412536
Ebin meme bro! Tehe back to cowadooty with me xDD :P
Can anyone older than 12 answer my question? It's here. >>30412337
>>30412512
look into your local technical college. most have a 2-4 week crash course in mill and lathe work for hobbyists.
most of "gunsmithing" from a commercial standpoint is banking on people being ignorant of the internet. if you know about gunpartscorp.net you never need a gunsmith. drill and tap work for scope mounting is basic shit anyone with a drillpress can do in seconds. anyone with a lathe can cut threads and a machineshop can thread a barrel for much cheaper than a gunsmith will jew you for.
as far as designing firearms you don't need gunsmithing, you need a mechanical engineering degree. Or for the hobbyist a firm understanding of machining and research into the action you want to replicate.
>>30412566
Well surely there must be something that introduces things like:
>design philosophy
>materials selection
>machining technologies
>etc ...
Obviously I can read accompanying books to gain depth, but I need something to start my progress.
>>30412611
Actually I have been involved in a lot of fab work, smart tards are universally terrible at it unless they have a background in doing stuff with their hands. It because they can't wrap their minds around their book learning being worth absolutely nothing. It always comes down to 'I read this', or 'whatever says it should be like that'. Absolutely no capability for paying attention to something in front of them and working with it.
>>30412611
Gun digest do a bunch of solid books on the subject, but as others have said, they wont do you a lick of good if you don't have a firm base of experience (thats machine time, not reading about it) with the equipment required.
>>30412617
Well our local technical college is closed for the summer. However, I should be able to afford the machining equipment/materials and more forward on my own.
Are there any good books on machining that you'd recommend? What will be my bread-and-butter as far as industrial equipment goes? (drill press, mill, lathes, etc ...)
>>30412692
You're wasting your time.
>>30412682
Physics as a discipline is nothing like you describe. Half of it involves experimental work or mechanical prototyping, and all of it includes extrapolation/theorization. Nowhere in physics do you follow a strict set of procedures.
>>30412569
post pics already. you said you had a "blueprint" of it already finalized.
>>30412647
there is no "design gunz 101". gunsmithing isn't even remotely about that, it's repairs, parts fitting, tuning, and modification. You need an engineering degree i you are interested in designing new firearms from the ground up.
>>30412692
you're going about this the wrong way
as far as design, you need to git gud at solidworks (pirate it) and either the the solidcam addon or mastercam for computer aided milling (also pirate this shit)
>>30412690
Yes, my question assumed that I would need to build up the pre-requisites through such a book. However, I need to know what those are and where to begin. See >>30412692 for more elaboration.
>>30412692
Lathe and drillpress I guess, but you really should wait and get instruction from your local polytech. Countless people have been turned to literal ribbons by fucking around with lathes.
>>30412647
>design philosophy
>materials selection
>machining technologies
there are hundreds of different specializations in each of those categories.
>>30412757
I have a very good fondation in SolidWorks and a computer designed specifically to run it.
>>30411458
that would be considered a VFG legally, right?
>>30412782
Hence the question "where2start".
>>30412810
No.
>>30410831
>ifunny.co
>>30412757
That is airshit.
>>30412787
so why aren't you out becoming the next warfairy then? if 3D design and a physics degree haven't let you conceptualize firearm design then not much will. Firearms are a collection of simple machines, the hard part is dynamic forces so you don't end up having locking blocks shear like old beretta m9s after 30,000 rounds.
what part of firearm design is holding you up? a certain amount of it is the art, not the science. you can take an out of copyright acton design and design a pistol around it any way your black heart desires. there is a reason why pretty much every production handgun utilizes short recoil or direct blowback actions.
>>30412885
what an astute observation no one has ever noticed before.
Since everyone keeps insisting I post my design, here it is.
>>30412903
>why aren't you out becoming the next warfairy then?
>warfairy
Wasn't he also full of shit, or am I thinking of one of the other /k/ vaporware projects?
>>30412903
As mentioned, I am not OP. SolidWorks and a physics background will not magically translate to becoming a master gunsmith.
Design != production. There are many skills that are necessary when it comes to manufacturing firearms, and I would like to know what they are/how to master them.
>>30412961
the receiver and the grip are going to be one solid piece of polymer and the slide will be metal.
Well since op won't post sketches here's a hilariously rough sketch of a vector based thing
>inb4 muh patent
Also note the lack of trigger space, idk if you could fit a striker mechanism in the but at least it's balanced?
>>30412961
>>30412998
Oh shoot beat me
>>30411592
>I made some blueprints
Sure you did OP.
>>30413022
Hey, I drew my designs with a blue pen! that's what blueprints are.
>>30412961
A DC9M? How original.
>>30412966
Warfairys printable stuff is freely available. You're probably thinking of unicornfucker
>>30412966
>>30412903
To expound upon this further, consider pic related. I am not sure how to even begin fabricating such a piece or whether it is even feasible from an engineering perspective. Design must take into account the end machining process or the design is worthless.
Is is economical to machine the edges like that? How would I operate the machinery to construct such a piece, which machinery would I use, and in what order?
So yes, I need to have a base, and /k/ isn't helping much. (likely because /k/ doesn't know)
>>30413055
Oops didn't mean to include >>30412966. Meant to include >>30412969.
>>30413055
Omg cause most of that technology isn't gun specific. Firearms are like any other high pressure machine. And usually for a given design there's only one or 2 ways to manufacture (think milled vs stamped ak, milled vs injection molded ar lowers etc) look into machining, milling, latheing, broaching, forging etc. Look up patents for early guns and how they were made and why most modern guns aren't made that way. Read books about machining, wasn't Mr. Glock a plumper? See how you want to make the gun/what you have access to and go backward.
>>30412961
>>30413041
Also were we really just trolled?
>>30412966
considering I have the entire fosscad megapack on my phone and it's full of warfairy's lower and furniture designs, no he isn't full of shit. unlike most his re enforced printable lower has actually been tested and his furniture looks a s t h e t i c
you actually just reminded me I should print out his stock for my AR build.
>>30412969
so.... machining. for the 5th time.
pick up mastercam or buy/pirate the solidcam addon for your solidworks box and practice computer aided machining. you really need to get your ass to a technical college for a machining crash course if you're serious about this. it'll be fun.
>>30412961
are you actually OP because that looks worse than the other guys pretending to be OP posting hillarious napkin drawings of gun shaped objects. >>30412998 this is better and it's to make fun of you. still pointless, but better
>>30413055
thats literally just a skeletonized magwell and an integral buffer tube housing. Cosmetic alterations. And to answer your question of how to make it, the real answer is casting and the shitty but also correct answer is 3D printing. You could make it out of a big block of aluminum as a billet lower on a 6 axis mill, but it'd be far less economical at any form of scale beyond a small machine shop operation except for the boutique points.
I'm not even an engineer, just a law student who jumped ship on an engineering degree because I couldn't stand the thought of spending my entire professional career with shifty chinks and dead eyed curryniggers.
you're still asking the wrong questions. it might be the dunning-kruger effect on my part but this is pretty simple stuff, you haven't even scratched the monolithic hard, boring parts of design.
>>30413135
>And usually for a given design there's only one or 2 ways to manufacture (think milled vs stamped ak, milled vs injection molded ar lowers etc) look into machining, milling, latheing, broaching, forging etc. Look up patents for early guns and how they were made and why most modern guns aren't made that way. Read books about machining, wasn't Mr. Glock a plumper? See how you want to make the gun/what you have access to and go backward.
This is true advice. However, I'd like to hear from someone who has actually gone through the same learning process. Every single time I obtain a new skillset, I am able to look back and realize that there was a far more optimal path to learning said skillset.
Specifics, whether this means books/courses/etc, are strongly preferred over "just go do stuff".
>>30413150
Ok thanks, but do see this >>30413221 for why I'm being so insistent on a more detailed answer.
>>30413221
Well then as
>>30413150
And several others have said take a few machining courses, watch YouTube videos about molding objects and casting resins/diy 3d printers/dremel cnc /drill press mill/hydraulic press stamping. I mean half your questions I learned from Google, will take a machining class myself soon hopefully but I have the gist of how things are made
>>30413221
>>30413247
And again do you want stamped guns like akm/hk? Milled like m14/ar? Injection molded like many handguns?(Don't know anything about that yet) will you want to open your own company someday or just do hobby build(cast/3d print/lite mill plastic or al) or do a few one off prototypes?(Rent equipment)
>>30412303
sounds stupid man, really.
Most women can handle a glock, do you have babby hands?
>>30413332
I'm likely going to focus on milling/machining for now, but you're right in implying that it's probably best to learn all such technologies in the long run.
This will be a hobby rather than an actual business.
>>30413382
No. I have large hands. 7.6 inches in length. I have ALWAYS loved the feeling of a thin grip on a gun. People like you and others saying things sound stupid is why the dark ages happened.
>>30412135
You're retarded. If you have a good idea it has already been done and/or is unfeasible and stupid. It's probably a stupid idea since you're retarded.
>>30413388
OP Here. I plan on contracting work. I have people to help me with machining. When everyone sees my weapon on the market, buy it knowing you were wrong to doubt my genius.
>>30413404
you can have your forward mag pistol with 3 inch barrel and takes up more space than a glock 26 with a 4+in barrel
>People like you is why the dark ages happened
Naw kid, you haven't got that far in school to learn its due to RETARDS like you
>>30413411
The same things were said by people in the 1800's. Have fun being stuck in the past.
>>30413426
Has an Idea for something that is new and something not seen a lot. OBVIOUSLY more stuck in the past then the person saying not to try anything because "it's stupid! I'm afraid of change!"
>>30412535
>a front heavy pistol will be perfect for negating muzzle flip.
Uh, no. Not even a little bit. You have to pull a front heavy pistol up, which is far worse for combating muzzle rise.
>>30412557
>>30413221
you don't need a book to decide a manufacturing process, you need a litmus test.
>design maguffin
>is it easily machined
>is it easily cast
>is it easily stamped
>is it easily injection molded
>is it most easily done by two processes
>do the one that makes sense
conversely
>Need to design maguffin for casting/stamping/machining
>design it to be cast/stamped/machined
now the question of "how" you design a product for a manufacturing process you're jumping into why you need a degree in mechanical engineering.
the layman answers and modus operandi should be pretty self apparent. Casting(/w final machining) is ubiquitous for metal, injection molding ubiquitous for polymers and plastics because besides start up costs and a grabbag of tensile/yield strength limitations, it is the cheapest and quickest way to crank out thousands of phone cases or AR lowers; they could technically be machined, but it'd be a slower, more expensive process BUT much more flexible in changing the design.
>>30413388
stick to a focus on milling and design around its limitations. I know guys that use injection molding for repeat parts in hobby businesses and it's expensive as fuck, thousands of bucks to make a mold for pager casing size components. The mold is a giant ass heatsink and a 50lb block of aluminum is pretty fucking expensive in and of itself.
the weaponeer forums are a good resource for hobbyist firearm design and seeing what others have built.
>>30413447
It's not like it's going to weigh 50 lbs. If your arm cannot lift a pistol, I doubt a bullet can.
>>30413442
>magwell outside of grip
>short recoil tilt barrel browning action circa 116 fucking years ago
>terrible ergonomics
>heavy
>large and colt dragoon tier long
yeah, we're the ones stuck in the past.
>>30413494
It's not like i'm replacing every gun made. But I will not conform to the standard. If you can modernize an old style why not?
Variety is the spice of life kid.
>>30413388
Again just Google what others are doing, you already know 3d printing, here's casting
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_4/676733_Fruity_Ghost___DIY_100s_of_ARs_cheaper__faster__gentler_.html
Cnc milling wood for casting silicone molds for casting resin(didn't read link but I got the gist somewhere else, but 2 and 2 together
http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/gcnc/ch4/
Think you can make a lightweight dremel cnc cheap (or just buy one)
Strongest parts will be barrel, bolt and whatever the bolt locks into (barrel extension or receiver) I'd contact for barrels but if your really want check out concrete lathe, designed cheap for tank barrels(or shells or something) for ww2 been s not of Taku but don't see anyone who's reproduced it yet. Then you'll need a rifling machine
>>30413514
>If you can modernize an old style why not?
because it's inferior and retarded, literally by all metrics you judge a firearm
have you ever shot a gun?
>one not controlled by the X button on an xbox controller or RMB
>>30413545
Let me tell you something. If something works, it works. If you can have both, why not? Imagine the 9mm, back then it sucked people moved on, but NOW it is just as good as any, because people didn't give up on it.
You are a quitter.
I've shot plenty of guns.
>>30413565
>Imagine the 9mm, back then it sucked people moved on
yeah you're retarded AND ignorant of history. the fbi wanting more barrier penetration=/=hurr 9mm sucks it just took them 80 years to find out and then we made it good again
>if something works...
worse. it works worse. that is why firearm evolution has not favored literally every "feature" of your napkin drawing.
firearms aren't shot via the x button kiddo, they have triggers and recoil and a pistol with all it's weight up and forward of the grip feels and shoots like shit.
>>30413642
To say that the 9mm round was not worse in the past just proves how much of an idiot you really are.
Give it a chance to be modernized. Give the action a chance to work in the modern day. Why do competition pistols that front load work? Oh because they use a modernized action that some people swear by.
Because you believe that something slightly heavier towards the barrel will be shitty, doesn't mean everyone else was.
And don't use the example that everyone in this thread hates it, because /k/ is full of kids like you.
Well as fun as this was Here's one more sketch, for a convoluted lever/toggle delay action. All in the grip for balance. You did say you want a front loading(tilting barrel right??) Pistol, idk how you'd have short recoil with that. Idk how the barrel locks in my sketch or how you'd cock it but I'm sure you could attach a slide to the bolt, or better yet some kinda plunger to the long arm on the lever. Trigger group roughed on ar, maybe make it easy and base your gun around a real ar group, or cut your own, w/e, the world is your oyster op
P.S. I'll be expecting royalties if I see this on shelves someday. You can just expect me to walk into your office with original sketch in hand
>>30413793
>Why do competition pistols that front load work? Oh because they use a modernized action that some people swear by.
That's irrelevant to the point you're trying to make, the question would be why the general public would want a feature that's currently generally only found on certain competition guns, and intrinsic to that is the matter of why certain competition guns have that feature.
At that, how is such a gun useful for anyone other than the people already using them? It'll have a shorter barrel in relation to comparably sized guns and the forward position of the magazine would make it hard to CC. What is to be gained for these losses?
What about a pistol with the feeding system of a Boberg, but with the magazine forward of the grip?
>>30414122
And since I already drew it here's the action, looking at it idk how well it would work, has no weight like a lever, but I guess toggles don't either.
Also what's an example of these competition pistols you keep mentioning?
>>30413793
>>30414150
>>30414122
I'll tell you what. If I make this specific design, I want you to email me on my site about this gun.
I will partner up with you.
I'll give you royaltees. IF I use your design.
>>30414292
>what's an example of these competition pistols you keep mentioning?
I'm tempted not to post anything since OP's the one bearing the burden of proof and I kind of want to see what he pulls up, but I kind of doubt he'll deliver so here you go.
>>30412961
kill yourself and burn that antiquated, inefficient bullshit
>>30414304
How much in royalties?
I demand at least 75% of the proceeds because it's my design and idea.
>>30414344
dont forget the walther gsp and osp and the other 3 letter pistols they made like that
>>30414344
OP here, That's exactly what I was thinking of, thank you.
>>30414372
I'm the one putting money to building it, you simply designed it, you'll get 0.5 percent of the first month gross revenue.
>>30414344
Ok Thanks, and what is a tip up barrel? "Front loading" only yielded muzzle loading lol
>>30414376
Also thanks
>>30414304
And yeah that's what I meant, there's already mag foward pistols, neither you not I came up with THAT concept
>>30414372
Also doubt it. 75% to big for anything, also I drew the sketches above. If a pistol comes to market with a lever and a toggle it originated here
.t Thomas Edison
>>30414412
>you'll get 0.5 percent of the first month gross revenue.
you mean .5 (50%) of the firsr month's gross revinue
>>30414372
>>30414477
And what did you design exactly?
>>30414451
>what is a tip up barrel?
I would assume that refers to a Browning tilting barrel.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoil_operation#Short_recoil_operation
>"Front loading" only yielded muzzle loading lol
Same here, it took me a while to figure out what OP was talking about. There doesn't seem to be a widely used technical term for handguns like that, I've seen both "forward loading" and "front loading" used, as well as a few others.
>>30410300
Google "tool room prototype"
and then you will need a tool room, and the know-how to use it.
Or you can hire a small machine shop to produce the parts, normally at great expense.
Either a lot of your time when you have the equipment, or a lot of your money and other people's time and equipment.
Op here, this is my design.
>>30414520
Oh I meant to type "that" not what, as in "that hammerli 280 is tip up?"
Yeah I knew of the Browning, taurus, and a few others, by the name tip up barrel, not front loading, interested me cause it could be quieter/easier for weaker people or w/e. thanks though
>>30414537
it's a blow-forward pistol
>>30414489
The world's most perfect handgun ofcouse.
>>30414537
Lol but the cartridge isn't in the barrel (chamber), barrel didn't recoil, and again how will you have a tip up barrel like that? On the odd chance you're op/serious Here's a site talking about straight blowback bolt weights, for 9mm you need 1.7lbs behind it so you don't get case head separation
http://www.orions-hammer.com/blowback/
>>30414639
It's simply a diagram of the feed system, it is short recoil. The barrel is stationary.
>>30414594
>>30414664
So is it blew forward or short recoil? How will the barrel to up either way? If your going to have that huge slide you might as well put it to use. Here's a lever delay blowback, real rough, look up patents/Kiraly. Also, still such a short barrel...
>>30414575
>Oh I meant to type "that" not what, as in "that hammerli 280 is tip up?"
Ah, then no. AFAIK most competition guns have fixed barrels.
>>30414803
It's short recoil, the barrel is not tilt up. The barrel is short yes, But I plan on making the weapon about 9 inches in length overall, so while being proportionetly small it is overall average. What's the difference between lever delay blowback and short recoil, it looks like the same operation.
>>30413458
Nigg are you retarded.
>>30414934
You're just a priss.
>>30414895
9 inch overall
Homie, at this point I'll just go for the SBR AR. Like its not even fucking interesting, now if you come at me with the triple overhead cam of the shooting world I'll be interested.
Or just make an open bolt handgun that's easy to "accidentally" make full auto and guise it as an utterly shitty design flaw. You got that last part down pat
>>30414895
Lever delay works like this with a fixed barrel
>>30412253
Short recoil pic related
Note how the barrel moves back a distance, and a ramp at the base slides it down slightly disengaging the slide from the ridges on top of the barrel.
So what did you mean by front loading?
Also about to go, sorry but it really doesn't look like you know much about different actions, mechanisms etc
>>30414974
Think about it the Beretta 92fs is 8.5 inches overall. But thinking again, I mean the slide is 9 inches long to account for the barrel.
>>30414982
Front loading means that the magazine is loaded infront of the handle. Short recoil like the m1911 right? The 1911's barrel doesn't move back.
I know about the actions, I was confused on the names.
>>30415009
OP again I see where I went wrong. The 1911 does move back slightly.
Then the Lever delay system is what I'm going for.
>mfw none of this would have happened if OP just posted his designs first and asked how we thought that would work then the thread could have been spent discussing design and educating OP instead of making fun of him
>>30414537
So you want me to somehow accurately shoot that without shouldering it? You're making a PDW at this point
>>30412961
Enjoy your 1.25" barrel
>>30415027
Then seriously start reading up. There are at least two lever delayed pistols, Hogue avenger and Benelli B76
Look at patents
https://www.google.com/patents/US3893369
Look at the patents those patents cited. Look up Pal (Paul) Kiraly blueprints
http://world.guns.ru/smg/hu/39m-43m-e.html
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/rifles/san-cristobal-carbine-model-2/
Get creative, make the most efficient use of parts (slide as the weight/bolt carrier) use pre existing springs and screws (unless you want customers to rebuy from you) good luck OP
>>30415370
Florida Manlet, I thank you so much. You schooled my ass and I learned so much.
I was thinking, the most simple way would be to make a Short recoil design. Thank you EVERYONE for schooling me.
OP, if youre still here, give the Boberg pistols a look (now under the name Bond Bullpup), that design should get you thinking.
I'm sorta in the same boat as you, looking for places to pitch to, once you think you have a finalised design and a prtotype, you need to talk to a patent lawyer before you do anything.
Im still on the fence about keeping my main project an open source design with regards to Mikhail Kalashnikov or making oodles of fun money,
if you want to bounce ideas or w/e i can give you my4chin email
>>30415453
You're welcome op. Just remember stay safe with pressures. The AR can have a plastic redirect because the bolt locks into the barrel extension. You already said yours will be steel reinforced polymer, so the "short arm" of the lever will have to lock into that, quick is firmly connected to the barrel. That will be the "weak point" that HAS to be strong enough to contain the force of firing, in addition to the chamber/barrel and bolt face. Again just read up a lot, what still you'll want for the bolt (impact resistance) lever(abrasion resistance) frame ("stretching" resistance) Etc I believe you said you'll take it to a manufacturer though, I'm sure they'll go over everything
>>30415758
Plastic receiver* compared to sks tilting bolt or danuvia/San cristobal lever locking into its steel receiver
>>30415758
very much this,
seriously OP, you need a friend in this endeavor
btw, Florida Manlet, would you happen to know where immediate stresses happen in a tilting block action like FAL or SKS? its all on the carrier lugs and receiver, yes?
>>30415869
I honestly don't know for sure, not working in gun design, or anything (still learning a lot) or having either gun, but that's what I'd imagine, in addition to bolt head and barrel threads or however you attach it. You'd need some kind of modeling system and calculate it all, saw an example somewhere.
Oh found the link I was thinking of
http://www.varmintal.com/abat85.htm
>>30415869
Oops this is me
>>30416031
Also if your Google "tilting bolt barrel extension" your find several places people discuss that concept. In theory though if just have a steel reinforced part of the receiver that's kinda a barrel extension (isn't a receiver sorta a barrel extension? Lol) that way you can use weaker(cheaper and easier to manipulate) materials for the bulk
>>30415758
BTW, The frame is polymer but the slide is steel reinforced with polymer much like the FN Five-seveN.
Will that change anything?
>>30415758
>>30416150
OP Here. Forgot to mention, I've changed my mind, I decided that the short recoil design would work best for the gun.
>>30416031
>http://www.varmintal.com/abat85.htm
I wish i had solidworks, its fucking awsome that you can simulate material tensions/stresses
Rotating bolt is usually the way to go, but it is caliber specific, my tilting bolt face is centered around being able to deal with different sizes of case heads, the same kinda design in a rotating bolt introduces too much stress on the lugs, and the boltface would cam itself shut in the carrier, locking the fired brass, i suppose i could work in the carrier design, but that is already overly complicating it. KISS is key
>>30416108
depending on the barrel-receiver interface yeah, in an ak or sks its pretty much that, but with an AR or other rotating bolt guns, the receiver just kinda guides and holds everything together
>>30416150
>>30416208
Ugh well whatever I already drew it
>>30416249
And case head effects bolt thrust right? Think I tag it on the onions hammer site, idk
And yeah I just meant you can look at things different, it slipped my mind the bagel extension goes on the upper, that's never plastic as far as I know, but you could have a barrel extension as part of the receiver instead, with the barrel mounting to if however you want.
Here's a lever delay on barrel extension someone thought up, http://docslide.us/documents/lever-delayed-musings.html
almost couldn't find gone from original site
http://www.homegunsmith.com/archive/T25910.html
>>30416513
Wow soon as I posted realized that wouldn't work at all. Know op said no Lever but it bugged me. Saged so I didn't pointlessly bump
>>30416550
Wtfff
>>30416513
>>30416567
Wow dude, you're pretty good at design drawing.
>>30415704
I would like to talk more, give me your email, lets discuss
Florida, give me your email too, lets do something together guys.
>>30416661
Thanks
>>30416665
And sorry idk about that. Kinda new to 4chan but know that I don't really want to post info. I don't have a "public" e mail, I should make one but I'll tell you what, check around home gunsmith and/or weaponeer, I'll make an account soonish, on both I guess, you start a similar topic there and/or post a pic of mine I'll be on look out. If this thread is still active tomorrow I'll go and make an account and tell you it here. Otherwise just keep a lookout for me here
>>30416940
Good idea, don't give out personal info on 4chan.
BTW the webside is called
homegunsmith . com?
>>30416940
Actually, here
[email protected]
This is mine.
>>30417045
Yeah just Google, and weaponeer. Haven't lurked either for a while actually but there's pretty cool stuff there.
>>30417093
And ok I'll still prefer to mostly interact over a site just cause (others input, open source etc) but I'll use it to find you and coordinate. Don't be bummed if it takes me a few days to get around/remember, busy week, but don't be surprised if I contact tomorrow either
This is Florida Manlet btw, forgot tag
>>30417180
>>30417093
email sent from @therapist
