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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
>Can own a gun
>Just need a nihil obstat document
Limitations are:
>convicted criminals
>psychos
>people who skipped military service on grounds of pacifism
WTF?
Yes, my boys.
Italy has conscription.
Libfags pushed hard to mak sure you have an option to skip it and become a civil servant for a year instead. This is called "conscientious objection to military service" -- a.k.a. "pacifism".
But hard-core left-wing partisans and old-school socialists agreed if you renounce to serve your country, you shall not own or bear arms. Sounds like a deal to me:
>fag declares himself a pacifist not to fulfill her duty = declared no-gunz for life
Problem is conscription (military service) has now been suspended (shame), even though not abolished.
So a lot of young people are becoming disenfranchised fags and they basically act no-gunz just because.
>yfw you realize everyone older than you got at least basic military training at least once in their lives.
I mean, it is fun to think the State provides you with basic recruit training. But people hated it for some reason.
People don't like being forced to do things. I mean voting is compulsory in Brazil and look at all their shenanigans, they have like 30 joke candidates every election.
On a not related to OP's post however, how does /k/ feel about hasguns lefties? Particularly libertarian socialists and the like?
>>30271980
>Particularly libertarian socialists and the like?
Like my mum.
It's based. Because these people have actually the balls to say: if you want some kind of anarcho-socialism to work, everyone needs to be permanently mobilized -- but out of their own will, not because of authority.
So they have the following features:
>they are particularly mellow on the promiscuity side (e.g. faggots are welcome, anyone can join)
>they have the mindset of doomsday preppers: own guns, learn to shoot, grow your food, etc.
>activism means they will keep up the good fight and try to have ppl engaged without dirty authoritarian tricks = the main idea is exactly gov shouldn't force you to do things, but you are also expected to fulfill your duties as a lefties
>possibly, the most demanding aspect is that you abide by some kind of economic vision. If you don't follow the vision you can fuck off. But they will not force you to adhere with authoritarian means
So basically they are like libertarian right but without some features of the right (namely, traditionalism). However we all know that even lefties, once they create their own "freedom towns", will eventually develop traditions like any other fucking tribe on the planet since world begun.
So it is a bit like having doomsday preppers who are not particularly religious, accept faggots and degenerates, and have a positive attitude towards weed.
Basically if you are a libertarian right-winger with a sense of community, a couple of gay childhood friends and you don't mind sharing goods when emergencies hit your folk... you will find yourself at ease among such very special brand of gun-wielding libtards.
>>30272051
I like you. Let's hang out at the range and talk about how international plutocracy is eroding freedom.
>>30272093
You sound like someone from the BRICs.
>>30271953
>Italy has conscription.
No it doesn't. It was suspended in 2001 and the Government will recall anyone born before 1994 in case it's necessary.
>How do you know this?
I'm italian and my Dad (heh) worked as a radiologist on a Selection Center in Sicily before it was suspended.
>>Can own a gun
Yes, you can't own something like an AR-15. the limits are:
3 Short guns (Pistols)
6 Sports guns (Low caliber)
and an infinite number of Hunting Rifles
You can't own more than 5kg of total gunpowder and you have to declare how much ammo you have in store.
Regarding the license either for hunting or personal defence, it has to be renewed every 5 or so years.
There's only one based country when it comes to guns in Europe, and that's Switzerland.
>>30271953
>>Just need a nihil obstat document
Need the government's permission.
>Limitations are:
>>convicted criminals
You broke one of their totalitarian laws or did something they didn't like.
>>psychos
The state and medical 'professionals' deciede you're crazy because you're not in line with the government approved, normal society mind self
>people who skipped military service on grounds of pacifism
Didn't want to be a tool of state oppression/fight for Israel/greed/all the other shit reasons people fight wars
>B-based, guys, right?
>>30271953
Can you still own service rounds? Last time I read, Italians couldn't own firearms or ammunition that was used in their current military service. What is the status for fully automatic weapons? Semi automatic weapons? SBRs and SBS? Any other restrictions? Ammunition restrictions? License renewals? Mandatory Safes? CC and OC allowed? Self Defense Laws to ensure you won't get prosectued or sued? Any unexpected or planned visit from police to inspect your home if you are following the firearm requirements?
>>30272164
If you like paperwork, permits, and having to serve in the military first.
>>30272164
How's that concealed carry coming along, eh?
>>30271980
I don't like leftists in general, just a few concepts I accept such as workers rights and unions, and what not. I do tolerate them... Unless they act like commies, marxists and cunts
>>30272143
>Yes, you can't own something like an AR-15.
lol source fag
I go on the website of any Italian gun store, they stock AKs and ARs and other center fire semi autos.
>>30272143
>No it doesn't. It was suspended in 2001 and the Government will recall anyone born before 1994 in case it's necessary.
Did you even read my OP or just the first line?
I said:
>Problem is conscription (military service) has now been suspended (shame), even though not abolished.
What part of this you didn't understand, faggot?
>I'm italian and my Dad (heh) worked as a radiologist on a Selection Center in Sicily before it was suspended.
Who gives a fuck
>Yes, you can't own something like an AR-15. the limits are:
>3 Short guns (Pistols)
>6 Sports guns (Low caliber)
>and an infinite number of Hunting Rifles
Newfag detected.
Man you cannot have an AR-15 full auto because it is "arma da guerra". But you can get a version adapted for semi-auto civilian use.
>license for target shooting
Free with subscription to a National Target shooting association (TSN)
>self defense
5 years
>hunting
5 years (or 6?)
Aside from the fact you repeated what I said in the OP (i.e. military service is suspended but not abolished), what make me cringe the most is the fact you think you cannot own an AR-15. Do you even have knowledge of what you talk about? You can easily have an AK47 semi-auto, why wouldn't you get other kinds of rifles?
>italian poorfag thinking he can teach me
>>30272164
Austria
>>30272176
>The state and medical 'professionals' deciede you're crazy because you're not in line with the government approved, normal society mind self
Right, because you american fags didn't have that exact problems a couple of days ago where 50 fags died and a qt3.14 singer was killed in cold blood hours apart.
>>30272263
>Implying Americans really give a shit.
No on will care 3 months from now. Just like no one cares about Sandy Hook and mentioning Columbine with anyone under 30 gets you a what the fuck are you talking about look.
Freedom>Security
>>30272176
>Need the government's permission.
I hate you faggots because you always forget the gov is elected by the people and not an independent entity.
Italy does not have individual right to arms in its Constitution. Get over it.
>You broke one of their totalitarian laws or did something they didn't like.
Which usually means you are Tyrone or some Romanian or Albanian house burglar or some Mafia shill who was stupid enough to get caught.
>convicted criminals
Man, people are not jailed in Italy as often as in the US. Fucking Americans jail people even for being drunk at night or shit like that. The likelihood of being convicted or jailed in Italy is so low the measure is fully justified. Don't apply to me your cultural prejudices.
>The state and medical 'professionals' deciede you're crazy because you're not in line with the government approved, normal society mind self
No. This means batshit crazy and detained in a mental facility or anyway so fucking nuts you have been proven a threat to others beyond reasonable doubt.
Moreover, all this shit you can appeal.
Finally, you just need a random GP (private or public) to sign a piece of paper. And since usual mental illness can be cured privately, you can go to therapy and take pills and still get a public GP who ignores the fact to sign the paper.
>Didn't want to be a tool of state oppression/fight for Israel/greed/all the other shit reasons people fight wars
People who smoke weed all the time and didn't want to take up arms and do their duty guarding the Eastern Italian border from Slav shit and communist invasion.
>not based guys because they have rules which work and they are the least cucked country in Europe (possibly after Hungary)
I know you ppl love to argue for the sake of arguing. But get over with it. You can have fun with guns in Italy.
>>30272263
the mudslime wasnt insane though, he was literally even investigated for possible terrorism but they decided "nah he's cool"
he was literally licensed as a security guard to professionally handle firearms but somehow his rights should have been taken away just because of his religion when he seemed to be a model citizen?
>>30272176
The "permission" you are scared about is a 30 days document that expires after purchase
You don't need to renew it. Once you make a purchase, you own and can keep it within your private property.
>>30272212
>But you can get a version adapted for semi-auto civilian use.
So an AR-15?
>>30272306
No, reports indicate that he was a regular at that bar and that he was pissed that men kissed in front of his child. After his divorce he started using gay dating apps.
He was a fag and mixed with his religion that turned him insane.
You're right though, I can't think about a way that could've been prevented.
Remains why that other guy killed Christina Grimmie and why nobody checked on him.
Needs mention of
>mandatory subscription to local branch of firearms association
>mandatory subscription to hunting club for long guns and proof of going there
>very long bureaucracy times+Italian tendency at being slow as fuck
>psychological screening beforehand
>appliance can get rejected for no reason
>>30272185
>Can you still own service rounds?
This depends on commercialization rather than danger. This is because Italians are more concerned about markets and cash than anything else.
Basically, it works like this: when something (ammo or weapon) is imported in the country for the first time, it gets assessed for permit of import. Once. After this, anybody can import, sell, buy, etc.
So it is usually dealers who do the paperworks. Calibers who are not available to the wider public have simply never been "officially imported" by some Anon for the first time. If you want something that is not on the "marketable" list, then you will have to be the first one who does the paperworks for all the future generations of anons.
I make exampels of available and fully marketable stuff:
>.460 steyr
>.50AE
>ak47, M16, M4 (only semi-auto)
>remington M40 sniper, sako trg, uzi, mp5.
Not marketable (afaik 6 years ago):
>barrett (M82, M107 ecc)
Not becuase "illegal". It's just no dealer or buyer ever bought one or filled the first import bull.
>Last time I read, Italians couldn't own firearms or ammunition that was used in their current military service.
Lel. Is this the 9 Parabellum meme? You can have parabellum.
Actually, the issue is that there is a legal definition of what a "war weapon" is.
War weapons cannot be marketed or owned to the public.
But as you see from my example above, there are zillions of weapons that are military in all respects and yet they do not match the narrow legal def of "war weapon".
This is source of misunderstanding: you cannot own a "war weapon" ((legal def)) but you can definitely own military weapons.
(cont.)
(cont. from >>30272379)
>What is the status for fully automatic weapons? Semi automatic weapons?
Full auto is war weapon. Can't own. All semi-autos are fine.
>SBRs and SBS?
A law says that it is illegal to mod firearms to increase lethality. This doesn't mean you cannot add mods. It just means you have to buy them from the "marketable" list (see above).
This is because some goatfuckers in Sicily used to go around with shortened weapons to better kill wolves at close range; later this became the weapon of choice of mafia.
HOWEVER, there is AN ENTIRE CATEGORY OF WEAPONS THAT DO NOT NEED TO COMPLY WITH THE "MARKETABLE LIST", so that there are no records about lengths and other shit. Such weapons are all shotguns.
So there is a bit of contradiction and our Supreme Court never settled the matter.
TL;DR = grey area
(cont.)
(cont. from >>30272467)
>Any other restrictions?
Some war-like stuff must be semi-auto AND reduced mag capacity. I know it's shit man.
>Ammunition restrictions?
- up to5 kg gunpowder
- up to 200 handgun ammo (or non-hunting ammo) [special rules apply to regular sportsmen]
- up to 1,500 hunting ammo (.308 falls into this category)
- up to 1,000 slugs (and slugs are basically uncharted and not reported)
- in any case, the sum of all of the above shall never be above 1,500. Otherwise you will need a licence as a seller.
I don't know if you followed me so far, but basically the "marketable catalog" (that has 1 entry per type of weapon, usually created by the first individual who imports something) is meant just for handguns and rifles. NOT shotguns. Shotguns are just off the records, together with various hunting stuff.
> License renewals?
every 5 years for bearing arms.
Slight differences depending on use (e.g. it's free of stamp in case you have an Italian NRA subscription = TSN). Hunting is more expensive because of laws on hunting in general.
However
### No license needed if you keep a weapon within your own property ###
So, basically, the rule is:
1. Get a permit to buy weapons in general (once) [restricted for convicts, minors, drug addicts, etc.]
2. Buy, transport, etc.
3. Declare ownership (for handguns and rifles). That's administrative duty. It's not a permit. You just have to notify. I know some /k/ shills think nobody should tell the government anything, but there is a world of legal difference between "duty to tell you own" and "asking the gov permission"
4. Then you don't need a proper licence to carry unless you want to leave your property.
(cont.)
>>30272379
>Is this the 9 Parabellum meme?
Yes
How's the situation for revolvers here? I want one as my first. I'm 25, no criminal record, relatively sound of mind so there should be no problem in getting the permit but the gun and ammo? Sorry I'm a faggot
>>30272563
>Some war-like stuff must be semi-auto AND reduced mag capacity. I know it's shit man
>war like stuff
So "scurry black gunz"
>>30272563
>Mandatory Safes?
Lel no. A 2011 Supreme Court sentence made it clear there are no specifications made for locked cases or cupboards or other shit like Ausfailia. Basically laws says:
>keep it safe and keep it away from Dindus, drug addicts, minors, and impaired people
But there is no mention of locked cases.
>CC and OC allowed?
If you carry, transport must be concealed. E.g. rifle in a bag. No shitty rules about "keep X in the trunk and Y in the backseat".
Also penalties apply for leaving your weapon unguarded. It must stay with you.
>OC
It's just not a thing in Italy unless you're a police officer, military or security guard. Open Carry is just not a thing here. I'm sorry.
>Self Defense Laws to ensure you won't get prosectued or sued?
That's the worst part, possibly. I need a whole post just for this.
>Any unexpected or planned visit from police to inspect your home if you are following the firearm requirements?
Are you fucking kidding me? They need a warrant from a prosecutor and only if they have justified reasons that you may be undertaking criminal activity. Owning a gun and, as such, having it declared does not allow them to just knock at your door and ask for shit.
Of course if you are CCing your gun somewhere they might check it as part of a normal road block (say, they are inspecting vehicles looking for shit or doing alchol tests and they see it = they can ask you if you have a licence to carry).
Police breaking into your house is serious stuff in Italy. People don't take it lightly if abuses are done. Some old granny might let policemen in just because. But that's an exception.
>implying they'll give you guns
>implying you don't have to pay the local mafia money
>>30272467
>HOWEVER, there is AN ENTIRE CATEGORY OF WEAPONS THAT DO NOT NEED TO COMPLY WITH THE "MARKETABLE LIST", so that there are no records about lengths and other shit. Such weapons are all shotguns
So some brands and types of shotguns are allowed to have their barrel length reduced without legal reprucussions, right?
>>30272608
>yfw you realize the "in Italy you cannot own Parabellum" meme will never die
>>30272349
And also the limits on the number of weapons that can be owned, and 9x19 being banned for handguns...
>>30271953
>I mean, it is fun to think the State provides you with basic recruit training. But people hated it for some reason.
>being this fucking stupid
Conscription doesn't "provide" you with any abilities that would be useful in daily life. It's a waste of time for anyone not interested in a military career.
Furthermore, it's a mechanism of involuntary servitude in which you are viewed as a disposable piece of meat who - in Europe - is not trusted to own a firearm outside of service without having to go through a lengthy "licensing" (begging the state to allow you the privilege of firearms ownership) procedure.
tldr; you're a chickenshit "m-muh need" bootlicking faggot. Firearms ownership is the right of every man, no matter his creed or color.
PS. You're conflating pacifism with unwilligness to serve a shitty state.
>>30272625
I won't answer to this troll any more.
In my previous post I said "war weapons" are a particular legal cateogry that is not as fluctuating and vague as American media say.
It is a clear cut thing.
Full-auto is usually the box you tick to get a war weapon.
They look at the mechanism. Not at how scary it looks. It is not a fashion contest for fucks sake.
Anyway, I can own an AK47 semi auto. What else do I need?
>>30272263
>Right, because you american fags didn't have that exact problems a couple of days ago
Actually, they didn't have that problem. The shooter was cleared to own firearms despite numerous FBI investigations.
He was a poster-boy for islamic terrorism, and the state could do nothing about it. That's proper gun law.
>>30272671
Alright, so they judge by mechanism. So what are the legal magazine capacities for long arms?
>>30272639
>So some brands and types of shotguns are allowed to have their barrel length reduced without legal reprucussions, right?
As I said, it's a grey area.
And it never occurred to the Supreme Court to settle the matter.
So e.g. some people got their weapons confiscated because they got their barrel length reduced.
But then it was discovered they were shotguns, so there was no "legal table of lengths and specifications" to refer to. So they were unable to say:
>muh do you have modded it
Result: charges dropped.
>>30272655
Fucking this.
PS : I shoot more in a day than a western soldier will typically shoot in a year, so much for "training"
>>30272688
Nice, so I can technically have SBS. Are CC permits limited to pistols, or can I CC any firearm like in the Czech Republic?
>>30272349
>>mandatory subscription to local branch of firearms association
1. Mandatory safety courses are a good thing.
2. Anyway, that's a requirement for "carrying". Not a requirement for "owning" and keeping within your premises. For that you just need a "permit to buy" and you get it once, you buy, and you need no other subscriptions to keep the thing.
>>mandatory subscription to hunting club for long guns and proof of going there
1. Only if you want to carry
2. Only if you want to enjoy the "unlimited shotguns" waiver
>>very long bureaucracy times+Italian tendency at being slow as fuck
Okay, but that's the country being fucked up. Same goes for buying cars. Guns are no exception to other things.
>>psychological screening beforehand
Which is a kek-tier piece of paper signed by your GP
>>appliance can get rejected for no reason
But just because police is corrupt and arbitrary. Legal system is clear on that.
>>30272299
>I hate you faggots because you always forget the gov is elected by the people and not an independent entity.
Hitler was elected.
>inb4 "b-but -"
No buts, you dun goof'd. Democracy adds zero legitimacy to government.
>Italy does not have individual right to arms in its Constitution.
In other words: it's a fascist pisshole still living in the 20s.
>Which usually means you are Tyrone or some Romanian or Albanian house burglar or some Mafia shill who was stupid enough to get caught.
Here in Finland, which has "lax" gun laws by European standards, a speeding ticket (80 on a 60 road) can be considered grounds for revoking firearms licences.
tl;dr: you're wrong.
>No. This means batshit crazy and detained in a mental facility or anyway so fucking nuts you have been proven a threat to others beyond reasonable doubt.
A man who considers the right to keep and bear arms to be a god-given prerequisite for the formation of civilized society is labeled "batshit crazy" by your leninist officials.
In other words: you're wrong again.
>I know you ppl love to argue for the sake of arguing. But get over with it. You can have fun with guns in Italy.
>You can have fun with guns in Italy.
You're going the way of the UK sooner or later. Better bury those guns, Leonardo - you won't be enjoying them at the range in the not-so-distant future.
>>30272721
>Them police uniforms
>>30272633
>Owning a gun and, as such, having it declared does not allow them to just knock at your door and ask for shit.
>Police breaking into your house is serious stuff in Italy.
You have no equivalent to the 4th amendment afaik, and as such can not expect armed government goons not to barge into your dwelling at any time.
>>30272721
>1. Mandatory safety courses are a good thing.
Darwinism is a much better thing.
>2. Anyway, that's a requirement for "carrying". Not a requirement for "owning" and keeping within your premises. For that you just need a "permit to buy" and you get it once, you buy, and you need no other subscriptions to keep the thing.
Does "owning" permit purchasing ammunition and using the firearm for self defense in one's home?
>1. Only if you want to carry
Doesn't that translate to "shoot the gun" in Italian law?
>>30272655
>Conscription doesn't "provide" you with any abilities that would be useful in daily life. It's a waste of time for anyone not interested in a military career.
Man, I heard this argument so fucking many times I am sick of it.
I'll tell you what happened for real:
>army gave people opportunities
>people were lazy and didn't seize them
>then they go a-ranting about "naja was shit"
A friend of mein was smarter than the average Dago and got himself all driving licences (truck, bus, sheit) with the driving course paid by the army.
Other people learned:
>how to cook
>how to wash themselves
>how to clean their shit
>how to keep a building running
Sorry if I am harsh, but 20 years later it is pretty easy to see that most Millennialfags are unable to mend their own socks or do some basic scout shit.
Also:
>Conscription doesn't "provide" you with any abilities that would be useful in daily life
That because it was a badly managed resource.
You can elect your own politicians and make conscription great again. But people loved to complain, so they prefer to have shit naja and complaining than having good naja and skills.
>Furthermore, it's a mechanism of involuntary servitude in which you are viewed as a disposable piece of meat who - in Europe - is not trusted to own a firearm outside of service without having to go through a lengthy "licensing" (begging the state to allow you the privilege of firearms ownership) procedure.
What is the iron curtain.
What is being the border between the West world and Communism.
>involuntary servitude
Your fucking grandfathers fought invaders.
You are asked by THEM to do the same or at least spend some 10 months watching the border.
>>30272655
>bootlicking faggot
Maybe you are not aware Italians were offered possibility to transform conscription into a "paid job" with proper training. Only thing is that instead of 10 months you had to serve for 12 months.
And many refused because:
>muh I don't need a job
>muh I don't like authority
>muh my granpa died for the country, but only fascists like the army
>muh I want to have 2 more months at home with mummy.
>>30271980
Put the guns to good use and kill yourselves.
>>30272686
Tell me a model and I will tell you the size.
It all depends on what was agreed in the import file.
Btw you should know such registries are not owned by the State, but they are kept by the National Association of Weapon Dealers and Sellers. It's like the NRA keeping the list. Not the State.
E.g.
AK (Adler)
7.62x39
Max size: 10
http://www.3dugo.com/ugo/SCHEDA.ASP?ID=12705
>>30272691
>PS : I shoot more in a day than a western soldier will typically shoot in a year, so much for "training"
Okay but what about gun culture?
It is still better to have people who shot 2 weeks in their lives than none.
>>30272733
>Hitler was elected.
Mussolini wasn't. He was appointed by His Faggotness the King.
>Democracy adds zero legitimacy to government.
Please live in your world with no roads, no healthcare. Nothing. Libertarian Utopia it is.
>Here in Finland, which has "lax" gun laws by European standards, a speeding ticket (80 on a 60 road) can be considered grounds for revoking firearms licences.
Well, just because you Finns are a bunch of faggots... what does it have to do with thread-related?
>A man who considers the right to keep and bear arms to be a god-given prerequisite for the formation of civilized society is labeled "batshit crazy" by your leninist officials.
So now everyone who doesn't share your views is wrong.
Believe me that if it wasn't for American movies you wouldn't have ever come up with the idea that "owning an arm" is a right.
I believe there should be a right for Self Defense. But God-given shit is nothing because God doesn't exist.
>You're going the way of the UK sooner or later. Better bury those guns, Leonardo - you won't be enjoying them at the range in the not-so-distant future.
Why don't you Finnish people just leave the EU and welcome Russia as your new friend? No?
>>30272742
I hate them.
>>30272849
Alrighty, I'm starting to get the hang of this. So what would be agreed in the import file would be negotiated between the two parties (i.e. Dealer and the State). So if that's the case, there's a possibility of negotiating the rifle to be imported with standard magazine capacity and a minimum amount of the barrel length to be shortened (14.5 for example, standard 20")
>>30272793
>A friend of mein was smarter than the average Dago and got himself all driving licences (truck, bus, sheit) with the driving course paid by the army.
*paid by the taxpayer.
Fixed tgat for you.
>other people learned: a bunch of shit any thirteen year old should be proficient in
Shit parenting is not an excuse for instating mandatory armed service.
>That because it was a badly managed resource.
>implying
The army is worthless for civilian life because it doesn't teach you skills applicable in civilian life. Are you at all aware of what role the military plays in society?
>What is the iron curtain.
>What is being the border between the West world and Communism.
>actually blaming the european feudalist mentality on communism
Europeons made their own bed by not accepting the Enlightenment into their hearts and minds.
>Your fucking grandfathers fought invaders.
>person x was coerced into fighting nation y, because person z decided to declare war on nation y
I fight for my property and local town. I have no say in nationwide political matters and therefore cannot enact any meaningful change in my society, nor prevent megalomaniac/stupid politicians from shitting the bed. Why should I protect the very mechanism that enforces rules and regulations that I decry and despise?
>>30272754
>You have no equivalent to the 4th amendment afaik, and as such can not expect armed government goons not to barge into your dwelling at any time.
Try again.
>>30272803
>Maybe you are not aware Italians were offered possibility to transform conscription into a "paid job" with proper training. Only thing is that instead of 10 months you had to serve for 12 months.
If Italy is a country worth fighting for, it won't need conscription. Without conscription, the people will decide - completely democratically - whether or not armed resistance against invaders is worthwhile.
>>30272766
>Darwinism is a much better thing.
We'll see what you think when mumbo jumbo kills your kid at the range because of mishandling.
>Does "owning" permit purchasing ammunition and using the firearm for self defense in one's home?
1. Get the permit to purchase.
2. Take home.
3. Notify you have purchased.
4. Keep at home.
It doesn't make explicit mention of self defense because that's the subject of a completely different (and painful) piece of legislation that people hate because there is all that stuff about "reasonable force" when facing a threat.
So in the self-defence sense we are very fucked.
But I heard of people who went to court and didn't get convicted. However if you shoot somebody on your premises be prepared to at least go to court.
>>30272766
>Doesn't that translate to "shoot the gun" in Italian law?
Porto is "carry"
Detenzione is "possess".
>>30272890
>Mussolini wasn't. He was appointed by His Faggotness the King.
The rule of His Faggotness the King was accepted by a majority of the population, as evidenced by history books; he was neither lynched nor otherwise deposed of his status as monarch.
>Please live in your world with no roads, no healthcare. Nothing
I didn't claim government to be illegitimate, but rather that government enjoys no additional legitimacy through adopting "democracy" in it's various forms. L2read.
>Well, just because you Finns are a bunch of faggots... what does it have to do with thread-related?
It's thread-related because your police revoke licences with the same line of reasoning.
>So now everyone who doesn't share your views is wrong.
Welcome to politics.
>Believe me that if it wasn't for American movies you wouldn't have ever come up with the idea that "owning an arm" is a right.
>implying
Theft is wrong. Resisting theft is right. Government steals. Resisting Government is right. Resisting Government requires arms. Therefore, the right to arms is a concept sprung from common sense and intuition.
>inb4 "american movies taught you theft is wrong"
No, my mother taught me that.
>inb4 "y-you can't prove theft to be wrong!"
You reason like an idiot.
>I believe there should be a right for Self Defense. But God-given shit is nothing because God doesn't exist.
Fine. Replace "God" or "righteous ideals" with "State" - you have now arrived at the line of reasoning that is located at the helm of Europe's cancerous socialism.
>>30272964
>We'll see what you think when mumbo jumbo kills your kid at the range because of mishandling.
I wouldn't let my kid near a range. His adult decisions are not mine to control.
>>30272974
I didn't mean what I said in a literal sense.
>>30272299
>their duty
Who decided what that was then? You're indoctrinated up to the hilt, like most Europeans.
>>30272919
I'll translate some stuff for you:
War weapons:
>"***war weapons*** are all types of weapons that, because of their specific capability to offend, can be allocated as part of the modern equipment of troops, both national and foreign, with the purpose of waging war. Moreover, they are a war weapon all type of bombs or parts thereof, some chemical compounds, deadly war machines of all kinds, and incendiary bottles or similar containers"
Warlike weapons:
>"instead, they are called ***warlike weapons*** all weapons that, although not included [in the above classification], can EITHER chamber the same ammunition of war weapons OR are designed for full auto OR they have some ballistic specifications that are typical of war weapons"
Common weapons are:
>shotguns (non-rifled long guns), also semi-auto and with one or more barrel
>rifled long guns with two barrels, manual action
>long guns with two or three "mixed" barrels, either rifled or not, manual action
>long guns and rifles that use ammunitions with circular percussion, provided they are not full auto [I am not sure of this translation]
>semi-auto handguns
>all replicas of pre-1890 models
>all long guns and rifles that, although capable of chambering war ammunition [see above] display specific features that make them suitable for hunting or sporting purposes, whose rate of fire [but I think they mean magazine here] is limited, and they use ammo that is not strictly military.
>all gas propelled guns, BB guns (both long and short), and rocket launchers (except when meant for fishing or other purposes as specified in the law bla bla bla)
There is also another thing: war weapons (see above) can be demilitarized, so that they will be downgraded to common weapons (usually by making them semi-auto).
>>30271953
Nice troll thread...
>>30273005
>The rule of His Faggotness the King was accepted by a majority of the population, as evidenced by history books; he was neither lynched nor otherwise deposed of his status as monarch.
He was. In 1945 after the civil war that followed the 1943 uprising.
King was dismissed in 1946 by means of public vote.
>population didn't revolt under Mussolini
Doesn't mean they liked him or freely accepted his rule.
>Theft is wrong. Resisting theft is right. Government steals. Resisting Government is right. Resisting Government requires arms. Therefore, the right to arms is a concept sprung from common sense and intuition.
Slippery slope at best.
Plus a couple of framing fallacies and semantic mumbo jumbo.
>Europe is socialist
Try again, Shlomo.
As I said, if Europe is socialist, why don't you fucking leave and leave us alone?
>>30273080
>Who decided what that was then? You're indoctrinated up to the hilt, like most Europeans.
Man, Constitutions are not negotiated in every details every fucking generation. So you are born in countries that already have Constitutions that have been signed by your forefathers and that list duties and rights.
The same goes with laws,but with the difference laws are subject to greater variability.
So I don't see your point. Are you telling me I should respect no laws because I haven't personally drafted it?
>>30273133
>33
Kek has spoken.
>>30272164
>What's czech republic, austria and finland?
>>30273206
>Are you telling me I should respect no laws because I haven't personally drafted it?
Not necessarily, but that is a possibility. You must decide for yourself what is to respected and what is to be disregarded, likewise only you are able to set something as your duty.
>>30272193
There are not permits, the paperwork is one A4 piece of paper and you don't need to serve in the military to own guns.
>>30272202
Pretty good, only fag Cantons are strict about that. Czech Republic is shit in all aspects of gun ownership besides CC compared to Switzerland.
>>30272252
You mean the country where you can't even own a semi auto AK chambered in 7.62?
>>30273381
All have way more gun control and worse gun laws than Switzerland.
Just admit it, there's no other country in Europe as good as Switzerland to legally own guns.
>>30271953
And what's the proposed new EU legislation going to do to all of this?
https://www.all4shooters.com/en/Shooting/law/EU-gun-ban-European-Council-approves/
Contact your MEP today and tell them to reject this European Council Proposal.
>>30272193
>>30272143
yeah, we soo miss ar-15... FAGGOT (frocio del cazzo)
>>30273593
God damn the EU is terrifying.
Who honestly thought making a continent wide government seemingly outside of the peoples control a smart idea?
>>30275556
Socialist Europeans
>>30275556
our parents the fucking shits
>>30272633
So what you're saying is if Clinton has her way with America, I should emigrate to Italy?
>>30275893
Italy would be the last on the line. My first would be Estonia since English is spoken like a second language there. Czech Republic, followed by Italy last. Finland I'm not sure, then again, I'm a brown man, so I don't know if that'll give me an advantage
>>30275556
>the EU is terrifying
Nailed it. People we NEVER ELECTED into office are deciding what our laws will look like.
Hell, not even the people that represent our very country in Europe were directly elected by us, and they sure as hell don't answer to anyone in this country anymore.
And if the EU was a mistake, then the Treaty of Lisbon was a fucking suicide.
>>30272051
>Basically if you are a libertarian right-winger with a sense of community, a couple of gay childhood friends and you don't mind sharing goods when emergencies hit your folk... you will find yourself at ease among such very special brand of gun-wielding libtards.
This is me
>>30276005
Answer something for e czech friend.
Eastern european nations are part of the EU yes? Why didn't more stand against the EU after being in soviet union? Did they not see they harm these type of governments do?
>>30276071
Back then it seemed like a cool idea to do away with extensive border control and make international trade, travel and work less of a hassle for everyone.
It wasn't until later that the EU turned into a nanny state with zero accountibility to the actual people of its member countries and the right to override all national laws including the constitution without the need for unanimity.
I had a gigantic argument with my Bulgarian friend over conscription. Nobody here supports that shit r-right? Fuck dying for Israel just for your gun rights.
>>30275893
Is that Zizek?
>>30275556
Everyone was happy under the Roman Empire for 2,000 years why is the EU any worse? It's about time Europe was reunified.
>>30271953
>Based Italy
>Can't even take over Ethiopia
>Twice
Lotza Spaghettiii Mama Luigi!
>>30271953
what are black powder laws like there? all the cap and ball revolvers in america are made in italy, what permits do you need for those?
>>30276199
Well when the idea of you going to war is held by corrupt politicians who don't give a fuck about your life or the fact that the war they're sending you to is retarded in the first place ya conscription is a fucking retarded idea.
>>30276255
in america you can order them in mail, buy in store, between people etc, with no background checks since they are not considered firearms. is it the same over there?
>>30271953
>Sounds like a deal to me:
SHALL
>>30276369
TUTTI
>>30276369
BE
>>30276369
INFRINGIATTA KEKADA
>>30272633
>cross draw
>holster flaps.
Interesting.
