So I'm a fairly muscular, 220 lbs guy, and I'm gonna be buying my first self-loading rifle. This is actually gonna be my first firearm at all, since I gotta get a firearms license in this state to have guns. I'm gonna go with a short stroke piston since I'd like to get a rifle I can get decent follow up shots with.
There are three rifles I can get for a decent price range. Starting from the cheapest to the most expensive options are Vz 58 in 7.62x39, FN FAL in 7,62x51 and an FN-49 in .30-06
I believe I have a pretty good physical strength, but which one of these rifles is the best all things considered? How is the recoil for each cartridge- does it allow for easy follow up shots? Are the rifles good for prolonged training sessions? How accurate are they? Which one represents the best balance of power and recoil for someone like me?
pic semi related
>>29880597
Something chambered in 7.62x39 is good for a first gun, mostly because of how cheap the round is.
>>29880597
are you in the US, do you have prior experience with weapons?
>>29880597
Your physical strength wont matter much for dealing with recoil, but more so handling the rifle. All of your listed rifles are fantastic, i suggest the vz for cheapness of ammo
Read the sticky, buddy. No matter how strong or tough you are, a .22 LR is the best first gun, because it's simple, good and fun practice before you move onto something with more oomph. Getting a bigger cartridge right away has made a lot of people around me get tired fast and end up abandoning shooting as a hobby. Still, your choice, but that's my two cents.
>>29880597
Those are all good rifles, but for a first magazine fed semi automatic, your best bet is 7.62x39. Skip the VZ though if you're set on that cartridge and just get an AK. If you're already considering an FAL, you can afford it. Your body mass has nothing to do with it, my 105 pound GF can handle my AR-10 and Garand without issue.
Not sure why you're ignoring the 5.56, but that's your prerogative.
>>29880632
Nah, I'm czech. I shot grandma's .22 lr and it seemed pretty boring to me, almost like an air rifle. I'd like to train myself to compensate recoil as well.
>>29880625
I'm afraid the price is pretty much the same here for 7,62x39 and 7,62x51 here nowadays.
>>29880640
Handling the rifle? You mean like compensating muzzle rise?
>>29880675
I'm picking between three given rifles, all of which are considered "assault weapons" by the other OP's standards, plus she is a woman, and not to be sexist, I am a physically trained guy. So I thought this deserved its own thread, no offense.
>>29880747
>I'm afraid the price is pretty much the same here for 7,62x39 and 7,62x51 here nowadays
buy it online you dingus
>>29880747
If your Czech, then you should get a SA vz. 58
>>29880732
I'm not really ignoring it, but I'm set on a short stroke system and the only thing I can get for a similiar price in that caliber here is a beat up Galil. That and I'd like to get a gun with stronger recoil so I can learn how to compensate for it. Also, you cannot really get AKs in 7,62x39 caliber here anymore.
If you live in a state that requires licensure, chances are that your state has a list of firearms that are outright banned, and another list of features that non-banned rifles cannot have. Doublecheck that, and then look into what autoloaders are available in a state-approved configuration. That more than anything is going to inform you of your options. In terms of caliber, first gun should be in 7.62x39 if you're hellbent on .30 cal. Cheapest ammo, and lightest recoil impulse of the three, though it is harder to find anything match grade, and most rifles in that caliber are AK's, which ban states hate with a passion.
>>29880814
I live in Czech republic actually. We can have anything that shoots bullets as long as it is in semi (and even full auto but you gotta be a good friend with the cops for that)
>>29880814
How much does the recoil matter and in what ways?
>>29880814
Like, how do these cartridges do and is the lower recoil enough to excuse the lower power of the 7,62x39?
>>29880597
>im muscular
>im strong
>I want piston gun for follow up shots
>fn49 in 30-06
I wish you were trolling but then this is /k so I have to assume you actually are that stupid. Protip: from now on for every deadlift or squat set you do, you go home and read 10 pages of a book. Hopefully this will enage the few brain cells you have left.
>>29881427
Calm down hothead. I said decent follow up shot. Not straight up bursts
Keep in mind I never shot any of those guns to tell if the recoil is that huge.
I'm just saying I think I can handle recoil, not that I am an ace strongman.
>>29881297
A light FAL (8.5lb) is going to have about 12ft/lb of free recoil with M80 Ball. A 6.5lb AK (or vz. 58) will have about 8ft/lb of free recoil with 123gr loads.
Felt recoil depends on form on personal tolerance.
>>29881514
So I guess it's up to trying it out myself then?
>>29881545
Pretty much. Try to borrow a rifle at a range or something. Bolt action will be fine, assuming similar weight, though the longer impulse on an autoloader can reduce felt recoil.
I am 205lbs and can shoot a seven pound 300WM for hundreds of rounds (unfortunately, also hundreds of dollars) without issues. The same rifle pretty much disabled my shooting partner after 20 rounds.
>>29881596
Ahh I see. There is a shooting range with a Remington bolt action and a Vz 58 for rent, so I'll just rent them both and see. Thanks!
Just checked, it seems the price of the ammo is probably gonna push me over to the Vz 58. 308 seems to have soared.
>>29881734
Is reloading realistic in the Czech Republic?
Also, are you going to attempt to hunt with the rifle?
>>29881756
It is, the machinery is just expensive.
Hunt probably no, but I'm expecting to rely on it in the unlikely case of shtf. I may also go study to become a comissioned officer next year, so I guess some practice with actual rifles would be neat there.
>>29881776
I would probably opt for 7.62x39 then anyway. In a self defense scenario, I would rather have 30 rounds in a magazine for the same weight than something with another 1000ft/lb of kinetic energy I don't necessarily need.
>>29881800
I live in Burgertopia, so that is 5.56 for me but the same idea still applies.
>>29880675
Not really, I almost want to consider that fuddlore. You can learn to shoot with a higher caliber gun. Anything .30-06/.308/7.62x54 or below will be okay for a new shooter. I actually found the heavy Mosin-Nagant easier as a first gun because I was a lot steadier with it compared to the .22 Savage Model 64 that was my other first gun. Bolt action is easier to start out with as well. But, since OP wants a semi-auto, IDK. I would do the Vz 58 because I like cheap ammo. I think the FN 49 is the coolest of the bunch though.
>>29880597
>FN-49 in .30-06
I've been hunting one for ages, haven't found any less than $1k
how much is the one you're looking at?
>>29881902
16000 czk, not sure how much that is in dollas
>>29881902
I should add it's a single gun that appeared in a local gun store and looks somewhat worn
>>29882258
>Did quick google search
>Convert 16000 czk to usd
>$67.52 for an FN49 in .30-06
>$67.52
>mfw here in the US they range from $900-$1000 range
>>29882310
It's 675 actually, I think you forgot a zero. It still seems pretty cheap though, but Im not sure what state the gun is in.
AR15
and be done
>>29880597
Get the 58. Preferably used, the new CZUB ones are absolute bottom of the barrel trash.
Sadly, you missed the days of 5000 CZK Vz.58s and 2.90 CZK 7.62x39 by around two years.
And it's only going to get worse.
>>29882310
Kek, american education.
>>29880779
>the only thing I can get for a similiar price in that caliber here is a beat up Galil
Yeah, well, sorry to break it to you but the Galils are basically mint condition compared to the kind of 858's you'll see on the shelf right now.
Anyway, I'd suggest you consider at least 5.45 if not the 5.56, the Bulgarian AK74 are dirt cheap right now and the round is actually cheaper than 7.62 in most stores.
And unlike any Vz58 you'll be able to find, these 74s are new and unissued.
>>29882673
If I find a VZ 58 :T
I'd probably be preferring it to AKs because it's ours , and I'd prefer getting something with a short stroke piston.
It's kinda unfortunate how few there are on the market right now, only ones I can find is a couple of pieces from Vesely in Beareka, and nor BVS nor Alfatactical knows if they are ever gonna have Vz 58s at all again.
is .30-06 common over there?
I'd imagine 8mm mauser would be the more popular
>>29882763
Actually, 8mm mauser is about 35% more expensive. It's surprising.
>>29882757
eshop.antreg.cz
It's in Vyškov, but he has a couple pieces you can choose from and it's cheaper than elsewhere so it might pay for the the train ticket / gas.
I don't like to buy at Beareka, they're arrogant fags.
>nor BVS nor Alfatactical knows if they are ever gonna have Vz 58s at all again
We all sort of thought the supplies will last forever, but they weren't that many made, and between the ones that were given away as "aid" to former commie butt buddies and Iraqi or Afghani troops, the ones that were sent to Canada and the US, the ones that circle Europe, the ones we bought and the ones that were given away to the Kurds, it's no surprise we're finally scraping the bottom.
>>29882847
Man. Did this shortage have to come just when I am doing my Zbroják :T
>>29882877
>mfw AR prices and 5.56 prices stay the same while slavshit and slav ammo prices skyrocket
Just as planned. Now everyone will be left with no choice but to flock to the glory that is the AR-15.
>>29882847
Vyškov eh? I have some relatives there. Thanks for pointing me towards that guy!
>>29882904
Is it really that good? I'm noticing some old Vietnam colts m16s flying around, but I'd probably get something cheaper for now.
>first gun
>not getting g .22lr to gitgud first
>goes straight to semi
>>29882948
Such is the czech way.
>>29882926
I've been through the Vz phase, the battle rifle phase, the AK phase, the 20" AR phase and now I've settled at a middy carbine.
It's almost boringly reliable, accurate and well behaved, and will fuck shit up with good ammo.
>>29882948
Weird how all these people in the past were perfectly capable of getting gud without being babied with .22 bolt rifles beforehand, huh?
Protip: unless you're a massive vagina terrified of the soul-shattering recoil and noise of an intermediate cartridge, there is absolutely nothing wrong with starting with a semi rifle. First rifle I've shot was a 58, first rifle I bought was a 58 and I'm a reasonably good shot. The best in the company, actually.
>>29882948
>not celebrating graduating kindergarten with first gun
>first gun is not fine, American made 12ga Mossberg from WalMart
>not having McDonald's to celebrate first gun birthright
You aren't from the Midwest, are you?
>>29883116
Are those yours? Wow.
The thing that pisses me off is how UB claimed new 858s would be here come March. Now it's may and they don't say shit.
Definitely x39. x51 guns can be expensive and the round is also expensive to shoot/stock up on. When you get more into it and you're sure you want to make the investment go for it.
>>29882948
>bothering with .22 in these times
>bothering with .22 at all
Get a bb gun if you want to shoot for cheap. A .22 is not a viable weapon and doesn't provide as good of training as actually training with the gun you'd be using. And don't perpetuate the "survival rifle" meme. Anything you can kill with a .22 can be caught in a snare. If you carry the weight of the rifle and ammo in snares with your kit, you'd have a fuckload of snares, which can also be reused and are better for catching small game than trying to hunt them with a rifle.
>>29883274
The word is they're waiting for the verdict on the European Commission bullshit proposal.
I don't really believe it, though.
And yes, it's an OA-15 Black Label and Daniel Defense M4V11 (Cairo CZ imports them).
Unfortunately all the ARs around here are at the very least twice as expensive as they have any right to be, because lolDPH, clo, tormentace atd.
>>29883292
>.308 brass ammo starts at under 50cpr.
Not hard to stock up
>>29883329
Damn, those are no cheap brands. Looking great, too.
Speaking of the EC's proposal, any idea when the ruling is?
>>29883356
It's sort of painful to stock up on 50 cpr ammo when everyone is still used to the idea of 12 cpr 7.62x39 even though it's no longer even close to reality.
Most importantly, our median monthly wage is about $890, but closer to $600-700 with lower middle class and below $500 for the really shit tier jobs... but ammo prices are roughly the same as in the US.
That obviously means our view of a 50 cpr round is somewhat different than yours, even if you happen to have a relatively shit job in the US.
>>29883382
Nothing concrete yet, but you should write your representatives if you haven't yet.
http://gunlex.cz/clanky/hlavni-clanky/75-dulezite/2361-vyzva-k-aktivite
>>29883541
Ah, yeah. I signed several petitions, but I should write them.
