MP7
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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
MP7 used to be a failed PDW for fat tankers but nowadays it has this weird cult following because it was adopted by operators?
What happened.
>a failed PDW
But you repeat yourself. :^
>>29821782
operators are good with basically any gun and don't want to carry heavy shit
Compact, light, quiet, shootable.
>>29821782
isnt it just devgru and german sof and police forces that use them?
>>29822328
>compact
Debatable. With suppressor and stock extended it isn't more compact than your regular SMG
>light
Maybe, but weight is terribly unbalanced
>quiet
Nope, .45acp suppressed is quiet, but with the MP7 even if you minimize the gas report the sonic crack still remains. And you don't want a fucking .177 go subsonic, enjoy your full auto pellet gun.
>shootable
What kind of metric is that?
>>29821809
Crimson M&M on why PDW's are terrible.
From what I understand they're meant to fill in the from AR's to sidearms.
And what happened to the PDR? All I see how is airsoft versions with no real steel guns floating around anymore. Looking it up only turns up fucking airshit results and it annoys me.
>>29822360
It clearly has this weird cult hating it too.
>>29822360
Only people opposed to it are poor as fuck so they hate H&K to justify why they don't own any.
Didn't they kill bin Laden with one of those?
>>29822643
Stop believing this bullshit.
He was killed by the pakis in his cell and nothing else.
>>29822609
>you're too poor to afford this weapon, that's why you think it's a militarily shit weapon
OK then
>>29822734
Why else would you care? Its not like you would ever handle one.
This gun does not need to be more compact than a regular SMG, it does not need to be balanced, it does not produce a sonic crack within 5 yards.
If the seals think its OK it probably is. Everyone bitching about these guns are usually H&K haters. Or they just cant stand its not made by a true American company.
>>29822643
OBL was killed with an HK 416
>>29822338
It's not an easy task to enumerate what SOF units from various nations are using at any given point in time. What we do know is they've showed up in US, French, German, and UK hands
Maybe they see the MP7 as better at that size than a short AR?
5.56 gets pretty miserable as the barrel lengths get closer to single digits
It's probably more than adequate for CQB while still being able to reach out and address targets at further ranges thanks to being fairly flat shooting (from what I've read)
>>29822382
That's because it never went beyond the concept phase. I don't think they even made a single functional prototype.
>>29822360
If you trust Larry Snickers, with MP7 it's common practice to dump half a mag per bad guy. It's meant to be a sewing machine.
>>29822934
>>29822382
I think they did make one working prototype. I think i've seen pictures from a gun show when they were showing it, or maybe it was just an empty shell. Either way i'd love a conversion kit for a .22lr so i could pretend i have the real thing.
>>29821782
buttmad AR fag detected.
m-muh sbr is way better XD
>>29822942
I highly doubt it was authentic and functional. I've never seen any sort of mention of a working prototype before your post and if in fact they made one it would have been select fire.
>>29822643
Daisy cutter in tunnel complex.
Tora Bora, Afghanistan, 2002.
>>29822858
>What we do know is they've showed up in US, French, German, and UK hands
Isn't the UK unit that uses MP7 some civilian LE agency rather than SOF?
The SAS bought an ultra-compact AR variant made by LWRC for the kind of role the MP7 has, IIRC
>>29823026
I know that because of some clusterfuck in the UK they started to use semi auto MP7s. So technically if the stock would be welded and the foregrip detached you could have had a legal MP7. The British Police guards have them i think.
>pic related.
>>29822810
Ok... I like the mp7 and all, but I have to call bull shit. Sonic booms happen right away. They dont just decide to go off after 5 yards of slowing down.
>>29822360
>.45acp
Enjoy your arched trajectory then.
>>29822360
>>29823322
Isnt it 4.6×30mm not .45acp?
>>29822810
>haters
Opinion discarded
>>29821782
Well, too bad that real operators don't give a shit about what HK hating armchair generals say on the interwebs.
>>29823153
>semi auto only
do the Brits not trust their cops or something? Even their MP5s and G36es are semi auto only, and limited to 20 round mags.
>>29823425
Most british police are not allowed to carry guns, actually.
Didn't the p90 btfo the mp7 so HK cancelled the NATO comparison testing or some shit?
Isn't the AK-74u basically a PDF? It works fine and it's basically just an AK-74 with no barrel. The west should make an equivalent version with the M4.
>>29823582
Germany threw a fit, yes. 5.7x28mm was found to be better in every way.
>>29823153
>that fucking mount
wew lad
>>29823372
>Isnt it 4.6×30mm not .45acp?
>>29823425
Cops don't need full auto guns
>>29823982
But all other yuropeans countries issue full auto guns to their cops !
>>29822942
From what I've read, they didn't continue the project once it was clear the US Army wasn't going ahead with the program which it would have competed in.
>>29823982
I don't disagree, but
>need
>>29823026
Ah yeah I think I cocked that one up, you're right.
>>29823629
The Russians have been recycling those AKs-74u receivers for a lot of other things. Maybe not phasing out per se, but definitely not as common as they were ~10 years back. Seems the shorty might have been a little TOO short?
>>29824636
probably just realized you could get a lot more performance out of 12 inch barrels and still be quite compact.
>>29822382
The point of a PDW is that it has pressure and barrel length similar to a pistol/SMG but instead of an effective range around 100yd it has an effective range of around 300yd.
>>29823976
am I seriously missing something here or what
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HK_4.6%C3%9730mm
>>29824951
Yes, he was saying that the 4.6mm is too loud unlike .45.
>>29824951
>>29825055
>>29823976
>>29823372
Why can't people on this website put in an ounce of effort into comprehending what they are reading?
>>29825154
Generation Twitter. What matters is what I say, not what others say.
>>29824636
Aks74 u's use the same receiver as all normal aks74's. It's the front end that's different.
>>29822382
>From what I understand they're meant to fill in the from AR's to sidearms.
>From what I understand
which is not much, as evident by your posts
>>29823582
>>29823685
Pretty much the story. MP7 and P90 and their corresponding cartridges were developed to meet a NATO request. 4.6 got BTFO so H&K never even got around to finishing their companion handgun. All the voting countries except Germany said yes to making 5.7 NATO standard, with the P90 to fire it.
To my knowledge, the MP7 design wasn't an issue though, just the 4.6 cartridge.
>>29827122
>the MP7 design wasn't an issue though, just the 4.6 cartridge.
DESU the MP7 is the better PDW platform, the 5.7 cartridge just happened to be the superior round at the time.
Who knows if further development/testing after a decade has changed anything for 4.6 though, but it does appear that the MP7 has been a very popular choice in use amongst team guys for a while now, and I'm sure subsonic rounds are in use.
>>29823629
I don't know why I laughed so hard.
Anyways PDW is a role designation, not a technical designation. Kinda like DMR.
They have the mp7 because with its caliber it punches through armor even up to 300 meters. Im in the german military and its light, compact, has a lot of power but literaly no recoil.
>>29827122
It's more like HK took the original PDW requirements (weight less than 1.5kg) seriously and tried hard to make their weapon as light as possible. P90 is almost 2 times overweight. Caliberfags focus on the wrong shit, as usual. Both rounds fulfill the penetration requirement.
>>29821782
The MP7 and others like it are only really used by a small set of maritime sof types.
>>29822360
>4.6 not quiet
Lel.
I read a story from a guy in DEVGRU that they would shoot people in a room with a suppressed MP7 and the people asleep in the next room over would still be in bed.
>>29823425
Well the BTP officers I see in Waterloo station definitely have full-auto capable AR variants with 30 round magazines.
But it's probably due to the fact that the likelyhood is that police will be operating in an area where there may be collateral targets so careful, considered shots will always be used over spray and pray. Also something about having to account for every single round fired.
>>29823153
MoD police and some County forces use MP7s.
>>29823153
MoDPlod at work carry them, only the semi-auto variety mind.
>>29827607
>read a story from a guy in DEVGRU
OK buddy, probably could only hear the bolt sliding back amirite?
>>29822858
>flat shooting
please, explain to me how a gun can "shoot flat"
>>29821782
It has a very limited presence in special operations forces and hardly has a cult following. Why are you making shit up?
>PDW for tankers
That's really cute. But there's nothing stopping us from using rifles anyway. The Abrams holds several M4s for the crew, and a M240 that can be turned into a dismounted weapon. If you need an SMG because there are people doing some fury shit, and crawling all over your tank, you fucked up. Most countries realize this too, you see a lot of european vehicles with things like AKS's and the works.
The MP7 is unavailable to civilians and for good reason. We all know that’s technology no civies should ever get to lay their hands on. This is a purpose-built weapon with no sporting applications to speak of. It is made to put down scumbags, and that’s it. Mike Cabrera of Heckler & Koch Law Enforcement Sales and veteran law enforcement officer with SWAT unit experience points out that this is a gun that you do not want in the wrong, slimy hands. It comes with semi-automatic and full-auto firing modes only. Its overall size places it between a handgun and submachine gun. Its assault rifle capabilities and small size make this a serious weapon that should not be taken lightly.
Did this thing replace the mp5 for SOF types or is it used for something else.
>>29827772
Get your shit together.
You're receiving the MP5 schallendampf series using super-sonic ammo.
The suppression is so good it turns normal bullets sub sonic before they leave the muzzle.
With a "wet" suppressor, most of the noise you're hearing is the bolt slapping back to the chamber you nimrod.
What killed the PDW?
>>29827917
The carbine, especially the M4.
Also, the Cold War ended.
>MP7 thread
>no one pointing out that the P90 is superior in every way
>no one pointing out that the P90 rendered all SMG obsolete
Seriously /k/? I'm somewhat disappointed.
>>29827917
The realization that SBRs have existed since forever and use standardized ammunition that surpasses a snowflake round trying to bridge the capabilities of a pistol and intermediate.
>>29827935
>holding that ugly gun
i pray not
>>29821782
>they have a cult following
Not in any meaningful capacity, if you look at pictures of American SOF their may be about a 3% chance that they are running a PDW/SMG. This number is also substantially less if you only look at pictures from the past decade (the MP5 was slightly popular during the initial invasion of Afghanistan). The only major power that I know of which runs SMGs regularly is Russia with the Vityaz.
>>29822360
>if you add a can and pull the stock all the way out, it's longer than another subgun with no can the stock collapsed! obviously this means it isn't compact! :^)
Kill yourself.
>>29826334
That's wrong, though.
>>29827879
top kek
>>29827448
>b-b-but the rules said!
Good thing no firearm that didn't 100% meet requirements has ever been accepted... Oh wait.
>>29825055
If the goal was to have the quietest gun, they'd be using integrally-suppressed ammo or .22 shorts or somesuch. It's barely a consideration for PDWs.
>>29823425
France does the same shit, in a way. Elite cops have access to select fire weapons while street cops are limited to semi-auto ones, such as the Mini 14 or the latest G36C with a longer barrel. On the other hand they've still got a bunch of full auto SMGs, go figure what the fuck is wrong in the head of the people in charge deciding those things.
>>29827879
HK marketing pls
>>29828014
firearms that failed the requirements100% sure as hell didnt
>>29828122
>P90
>100% failed
Pick one
>>29827879
>It comes with semi-automatic and full-auto firing modes only
kek
>>29827935
Yeah but it looks like a fuck ugly prop from a bad Sci if movie
>>29828146
its almost 100% over the weight requirement.
>>29822937
According to Mark Owen, he had to mag dump on the bad guys when he used the MP7. So yes, Mr. Vickers is right despite the amount of hate he gets because of his ego.
>>29822681
kek
specialized soldiers use it here in norway. jav gunners, some radio people for example. I think vehicle crew get them, at least the driver. its also issued to pilots. MP and some people in medical units.
its basically used as the m1 carbine was used.
got to shoot it alot, when i was taking some schoolkids to the range to shoot guns, while i was conscripted. FA on that thing is hilarious
>>29823026
>The SAS bought an ultra-compact AR variant made by LWRC for the kind of role the MP7 has, IIRC
The 10" IC-A5?
>>29822858
>5.56 gets pretty miserable as the barrel lengths get closer to single digits
Indeed, that's why the designated assaulters have the 10" SBRs while the guys on overwatch have 14.5" rifles.
>>29828229
https://www.lwrci.com/p-427-ic-pdw.aspx
it's a PDW, compact, light, can be made quiet, and it's an alright weapon
it's being used by california motorcycle police
>let's give our TIER 1 OPERATOR gun to california
>>29828333
Interesting, thanks.
>>29827879
You don't need that to hunt
>>29827879
Remember, that meme about H&K hating civilians.
Also, the superior PDW, P90 IS available to civilians because FNH loves us.
>>29827895
You sir. You with your you are wrong
>>29827812
>please, explain to me how a gun can "shoot flat"
A rifle that ignores gravity, atmospheric conditions and basically all laws of physics.
>>29822937
this is because it's been designed for law enforcement and security, it's main purpose is to defeat body armor.
how often do police go after more than 1 armed target in a stand off anyway?
>>29821782
>What happened.
Burgers and krauts can't into proper subsonic suppressed guns so they stuck with lowest supersonic caliber in the attempt to be sneaky. Finally after 50 years burgers reinvented subsonic 7.62x39 with 300 BLK and could go away from 0.17 peashooter. And who knows maybe after another 50 years they would make their own 9x39 mm.
>>29827812
>>29828548
?
>a higher velocity projectile doesn't follow a less curved trajectory than a slower one
"Flat" shooting means that the cartridge/firearm produces a relatively long maximum point blank range for a reasonable target height, not that the bullet physically travels in a perfectly straight line.
>>29829101
But bullets do travel in straight lines, it's just through curved space.
>>29828229
LWRC UCIW.
The SAS' request was for a 5.56mm weapon that could be fitted with a suppressor with >22 inch OAL (sans suppressor) so that it could be stowed in the glovebox of cars.
Pic related shows the UCIW used by UKSF dog handlers, alongside the L22A2 SA80 carbine (same 22in OAL as the UCIW but was not desirable for the SAS' needs)
It competed against the HK416c and won - AFAIK because of better recoil characteristics. >>29828333 is a subsequent development taking a similar approach to the 416D with the stock design, but I'm not sure whether UKSF followed up the UCIW order by buying the IC PDW
>>29827812
>>29828548
I sincerely hope this was a troll-job
>>29828527
No I'm not I own a MKE 94 with three stamps you nigger.
>>29829436
Same gun (bottom) next to an L119
>>29821782
>what happened
The MP7 was not originally intended as a primary weapon. It was intended as a more lethal alternative to a handgun. Which is why they make holsters for it. Same vein as machine pistols and shit like the TMP that kinda bridge the gap.
Well turns out REMFs don't get shot at enough to justify tens of millions of [currency]s to rearm them all with a nonstandardized caliber, and nations are willing to figure out how to cram full size rifles into vehicles (often at the expense of the crew's comfort) instead. Which is why it (and literally every other PDW) "failed".
Meanwhile SOF, being kinda apart from everything, tend to use what they think is a good fit. Slap enough extra crap on an MP7 and it kinda-sorta passes as a rifle while weighing significantly less and being significantly smaller than an actual rifle with all the same crap on it. And since they almost always need to travel light, it works for them.
Doesn't mean it doesn't have drawbacks though.
>>29822643
kidney failure from being perforce no medical care a few months in a tunnel
>>29827277
It's quieter suppressed
Tier 0 SOF operator here. We use the MP7 because it has 40 round magazines - this allows us to put down 10 more bad guys per reload. Or more, if we score double kills.
>>29827935
oh man I love RCP90's like two of them is boss
>>29827237
>and I'm sure subsonic rounds are in use
No they're not. I can guarantee it.
The MP7 is direct blowback. It is literally mechanically impossible to have an MP7 capable of firing both supers and subs without breaking, much less being reliable, due to the HUMONGOUS difference in operating pressure. They can't significantly increase bullet weight to build pressure either, due to mag constraints and bullet jacket thickness. Which means you'd have to have an MP7 with a bolt for supers, and a second, separate, entire MP7 with a much lighter bolt for subs. And they'd look identical.
Then we get into the terminal performance. The 4.6x30 standard load is a 26gr bullet. A 26gr bullet at 1050fps at the muzzle will have 64 lb-ft/86J of energy. That's less than half of standard velocity 40gr .22lr (135 lb-ft) and about 70% of your average $100 pellet rifle.
>b-but what if they used a heavier boolet?
Fine. If they used a round nose bullet instead of a spitzer, they could load up to a *massive* 36gr bullet before they run out of magazine length. Since they still have to keep it subsonic (~1050fps) that increases the energy to a *whopping* 88 lb-ft of muzzle energy, or about 75% of standard .22lr.
>>29825154
>>29825324
boy making fun of people who don't know as much about guns and ammunition as me sure is fun!
i sure do expect my second amendment rights to remain intact when i viciously bully, and belittle people who are trying to get into the gun culture!
because why would anyone want to get in the gun society when a bunch of retarded small dick faggot nut jobs make the culture such a welcoming place!
oh yeah! second amendment rights are gonna maintain with this attitude!
historically self insulating elitist cultures have always done well.
>>29821782
>1st Special Service Force patch
This motherfucker needs to be purged.
>>29829971
I reallly hope that the magazine has some sort of tilt to it. I'd also love to see someone in cali have one of those converted to a 10 rounder to fuck with the grabbers.
MP7s are awesome.
>>29829971
>read
>the
>sticky
>BEFORE
>posting
>>29829994
Yeah fuck these faggots for using a patch that they trace their unit origins to
>>29829994
kill yourself
>>29829932
>The MP7 is direct blowback
Didn't read past this. I already know nothing you say is going to have value.
>>29823629
Sooo, I can read it on my kindle?
>>29827935
It has worse ergonomics.
>>29830491
You've clearly never held one.
>>29829932
You're not very smart, are you?
>>29829022
where's the german? is it the guy in the portrait?
>>29827879
There is no safety only fire once or fire until you shoot a bystander.
>>29830510
>thumbnail of a thumbnail
>>29821782
>MP7 used to be a failed PDW for fat tankers
literally what? as soon as it came on the market it got farmed to these units for testing. what teh fuck are you even talking about you dumb cunt
>>29830625
>implying the tiny image isn't deliberate.
>>29822360
>Maybe, but weight is terribly unbalanced
nah, it actually feels great in the hand
>>29830648
>implying this wasn't startled awe of how far he was taking it
>>29823026
>>29823153
ministry of defence constables, responsible for guarding nuclear facilities (royal marines guard the actual weapons, it's a bit strange).
labour was in charge at the time and altered them to semi-automatic only, in the name of 'proportional response' which is labour-speak for 'fuck the military and fuck the country long live the revolution kill whitey'.
don't know what 'proportional response' is in the face of terrorists in your nuclear shit, according to labour though it's 'fuck the military and fuck the country long live the revolution kill whitey'.
>>29827772
>>29830515
I've spoken an armorer who was lucky enough to play with both. I trust his word.
>>29829971
delicious
>>29827245
Most of the PDW now being used around the world are just issued rifle or carbine.
And that's good enough.
>>29829101
You're almost there.
"Flat" shooting means that the optimal zeroing for a particular use of the rifle produces a long maximum point blank range, a term which is itself defined by the precision required (dogs have smaller vitals than deer etc).
You can make any round have a "flat" trajectory by moving the point of aim lower, it would just decrease the MPBR, similarly you can also zero a very "flat" shooting round for a very very very far away distance and the MPBR would also be very short due to the climb.
>>29823629
The m4 is the carbine version you mongoloid, m4 is to m16 as aks74u is to ak74.
>>29827607
>No Easy Day
Get the fuck off my board
>>29823238
>Never been shot at.
You would only hear it if it shoots past you.
>>29821782
P90 is better.
>>29829837
thank u 4 ur service
>>29824636
The AK-74u is mainly for people who joined the army, but don't want to hold a huge gun all day. Officers and the like would carry it.
>>29828014
If you're non frontline personnel and almost never use it but have to carry it, which is what the PDW was intended for, then you care a lot about the weight.
>>29821782
compact, light and gets the job done which in the case of PDW weapon is defending one self or other people by releasing enough lead towards the attacker to make them run for cover. PDWs primary purpose is to give you or your pals enough time to escape or keep the enemy entrenched long enough for your reinforcements to arrive. That's it. You don't need it to be the most accurate around and since it's only for certain ugly surprises you want it to be light since most of the time you wont be needing it.
>>29827607
>i literally have no understanding of physics
>>29828095
>>29828418
I really like this "hk hates you meme" meme.
Does anyone not know that they stood up for gun owners back in the 80's and 90's? Let's disregard Germany's extremely retarded export laws and ontop of that, our extremely retarded import laws.
>>29833791
And heavier. Even when both guns are empty. With ammunition the weight difference is significant.
>>29828218
Norwegian here serving the army. Where did you serve?
>>29833861
They could, of course, set up shop in the US like Beretta and SIG-Sauer and make those scary assault rifles here and thus avoid both sets of stupid laws. But they don't.
>>29833864
>P90: 2.6 kg (5.7 lb)
>MP7: 1.90 kg (4.2 lb)
My god! The weight difference is astounding! True, this is empty weights and doesn't factor in the ammo but it is not like a person that would carry either one would have thousands of rounds on them.
>>29832111
That's more about cost than anything else. It's not economically wise to buy new PDWs if you have a storage full of carbines that can do the job almost as well. Especially if it's not your ass carrying those things around since carbines are generally more heavier than special built PDWs.
>>29830693
>guarding nuclear facilities
Did somebody forget to tell the Bongs that the goal is to NOT over-penetrate in a nuclear facility? Did they think DOE developed these because they're so god damn sexy?
They could not have picked a worse small-form firearm. Except maybe a SCAMP or something ridiculous.
>>29833891
>My god! The weight difference is astounding!
You've probabl never been part of any military operation what so ever or you're a grunt who lacks the understanding since you've always hauled huge amounts of weight on you and think everybody else is a giant pussy for wanting to carry less.
Unnecessary weight is unnecessary hindrance. You never want haul unnecessary shit around when you got a important job to do.
I'm a grunt and even I understand this.
>>29833912
>le epic nuclear scare meme
You're not going to penetrate any part of a nuclear reactor with an MP7.
>>29833921
But you're going to mess up control systems and such.. Although accidentally pouring coffee onto and into the wrong console can get you into a lot of shit.
>>29829022
I wish I could still have that much hair when I go gray.
>>29833991
I'm sorry for your bad genes.
>>29833920
The difference in weight is because the P90 carries more bullets.
>>29833997
I never said I was going bald, retard. I said I wished I could have that much hair when I'm older. Learn to reading comprehension.
>>29834001
I would assume the extra weight is because the MP7 is a gas piston and the P90 is straight blow back. P90 has a pretty heavy bolt.
>>29834001
I know. It's like I'm talking to a total idiot here.
Why do you need a huge amount of bullets if you're not expecting to use them? Even in the offchange you have to use your PDW it's only for the purpose of breaking away from the engagement or waiting for the actual combat guys to arrive. If you need a lot of ammunition for that you're so deep in shit your practically dead already..
why do special ops have a history of using guns hated by grunts?
eg. SAS using the M16
>>29834028
Grunts hate everything and everyone.. Even if you'd give 'em hypothetical prefect firearm they'd still find something to complain about it.
As a grunt I know these things.
>>29834028
>>29834044
It is because to be a grunt you have to have failed somewhere in life. Grunts are just cannon fodder. They're not that bright and are easily replaced. Grunts tend to join the military because of "serve the country" or because they have no real means to make a living so they become glorified welfare queens.
>>29834055
The smart ones seem to complain the most. It's all about asking yourself why the fuck didn't you choose the easy road.
>>29834025
Every gun needs 50 rounds. 30 rounds is a pittance. If you get surprised, odds are you'll be outnumbered, so you need 50 rounds.
>>29829994
He died some time ago
>>29834092
Every single soldier needs a smg, dmr, mg and antitank systems amd ammunition on them all times and haul them around everywhere they go at all times just in case right? It's not like that shit would get in the way of doing your actual job.. Go back to playing COD/BF kid.
>>29833891
>They could, of course, set up shop in the US like Beretta and SIG-Sauer and make those scary assault rifles here and thus avoid both sets of stupid laws. But they don't.
the quality would be shit.
you already have HK-usa and thats where all the "hk hates you" memes come from.
they got the great idea to make a backwards HK-usa proprietary keymod on the 416s.
HK is okay here in europe. FN is the assholes here, when it comes to civillian market
>>29833821
Yeah but popular with SOF for a long time too for obvious reasons.
>>29834061
Grunt or not, complaining out loud doesn't necessarily makes you the smart one.
Whiny one for sure.
>>29821782
I always thought the MP7 was neat
>>29821797
Did they capture 2 Frenchies? Or did he carry two MP7s?
Is it normal to carry 2 MP7s?
>>29828931
Do operators ever carry clips of bullets and reuse empty mags to save weight?
>>29834182
>FN is the assholes here
>FN still refusing to work on their civi versions so they can be sold
I mean cmon, all they have to do is provide proof that these are civilian guns. Just like CZ or HK or Bushmaster does.
>>29836042
Author of that Val pic wrote that yes he carries ammo on clips in his assault backpack. If there is a pause in the firefight he refills empty or partially magazines which happen from tactical reloads.
>>29830009
> Youre OCing such a pathetic caliber to our date at applebees?!
So we are just going to over look the obvious explanation to why Seals are using the MP7? How about because no one else can have it but them, special snowflake weapons are trademark for SOF.
Isn't that the one where a gun magazine went all "oh this is cool as hell but the rest of you shouldn't get to experience this"?
Tell people they can't and they will want it.
>>29836998
But its standard issue in Norwegian Army for engineers, logistics, sappers units
>>29821782
I know some motorcycle California Highway Patrolmen have them on their bikes. But I wouldn't call them operators.
>>29836998
>"Hey, Joe, we're gonna go on a special mission. It's dangerous, we might die. But we've trained for this for years. What kind of equipment should we pack? Should it be practical, up to the task, reliable and lethal?"
>"Nah, it should set me apart from the plebs."
Rrright.
>>29833853
Holy shit you're retarded
>>29834010
Are you literally retarded?
