Ask someone who recently visited the Holland and Holland New York Gunroom on Madison Avenue anything. Got to molest some nice stuff and ask way more questions than you'd expect even though I told them I wasn't a real customer.
Proprietors of prole-tier gun stores, take note.
>>29584876
Real informative thread.
>>29584876
The same gun over and over makes a gun room?
>>29584876
Has Holland and Holland ever made a semi auto rifle for some really rich guy's shits and giggles?
>>29585057
Well it is a room full of guns you fucking faggot.
>>29584876
Where's the grease?
Where's the buckets of cosmoline?
Where are the 5,000 round boxes of various ammunition hazardously stacked against a wall covered in motor oil?
Where are the AR-15s strewn about in some corner?
Where are the meme-tier guns in display cases the owner bought soley for meme value?
WHAT KIND OF GUN STORE IS THIS?
>>29585063
If they have it probably isn't one of their own design. Could see them using a slightly modified existing rifle/copy of one built from the ground up using prefab parts for everything except the stock, barrel, and any exterior bits that get finished.
>>29585112
Guns for people that say are into guns but have never fired a single bullet, nevertheless take care of them personally.
>>29585057
They're not the same gun. There are two different grades of double rifle, two grades each of over-under and side by side shotguns, and the bolt rifles. They have both used guns, guns finished except for the butt of the stock (so it can be fitted to the buyer), and books upon books of options for a custom ordered gun.
They also occasionally stock rifles that are not Holland and Holland but are exceptionally interesting and valuable and fit their aesthetic, like a custom-engraved Model 70 by a famous engraver from the 40s.
>>29585037
Maybe you should ask a question,
>>29585063
No
>>29584876
What was the most exspensive gun there?
>>29585116
That would be still cool.
>>29585297
Owners do actually hunt with them. They have some photo albums of people with bigass dead animals and lots of birds.
Way to be salty though.
>>29585343
A Royal double rifle in .500 Nitro Express. Something like $190,000 dollars or pounds, I forget which one. There are substantial differences between the Royal grade and the lesser grade. The royal has more intricate and complete engraving, slightly nicer wood, a more heavily reinforced action and stock, and a fancy moon sight and flip-up sight hood.
>>29585384
Sexy. Did you see any other nice elephant gun caliber rifles?
>>29585404
This OP? Does Holland and Holland still make 4-Bores? Anything that uses Black powder?
>>29585404
The double rifles pretty much don't come in anything smaller than .375. I think there was a .416 in there too, and a box of .700 Nitro Express ammo on display.
What was the average price point in there? What were they selling other than guns? Would you go back, or was it just kind of cool to see and wouldn't be interesting a second time? Did you get any pictures?
>>29585513
I'm not gonna go back next week or anything. I'd love to be able to afford one of their guns some day and go back to order mine, so hopefully they made a new customer.
No pics. Felt too touristy and they were already being super cool and treating me like a customer.
The new guns vary widely in price, with side by side shotguns starting new in the $75k range and the double rifles going for at least $120k. Things that would be accessories on other guns are very expensive because they have to be hand-crafted to the individual weapon as there is NO use of interchangeable or machine-made parts. For example, a scope base for a bolt rifle is $8k.
Fortunately for us plebs, the double rifles can fall to $80k or so on the used market, and the bolt action rifles can go for as little as $25k used. All the used weapons were in great condition, but the cheapest ones were quite old, like from the 50s and 60s.
Other than guns, there was a decent selection of clothing, which seemed to be of excellent quality. A little on the pricey side, but nothing like the premium for their guns. I already owned garments analogous to a lot of what they had, like sweaters, tweed jackets and ties.
>>29585464
I think they pretty much phased out black powder when they brought in the nitro express magnums. I didn't see any rifles with bores measured in gauge.
>>29585513
If you have to ask they dont want your business
>>29585761
Not really. They had recently sold a Model 70 for like $6k and their used bolt rifles are down in new Toyota Camry territory. A middle class person who really badly wanted one could make it happen.
>>29585467
>nothing smaller than .375
My dick is so hard.
>>29584876
That desk looks beat to shit.
I bet there's dust bunnies in the corners too.
>>29586259
Gotta remember that their rifles are designed 100% for use in Africa where things are big and shots are short. The double rifles obviously aren't precision weapons, but the bolt rifles only come with a barrel-band swivel, which is an obvious no-no for accuracy. The salesman told me flat-out that the longer ranges people shoot in North America are better served by a nice custom rifle from someone out west or a Sako.
I always make a point of going to the H&H store when I'm in NY. It's a somewhat unusual store since it isn't a street level retail space, it's located on one of the mid level floors of a commercial high rise office building, I always forget which floor.
You walk into the ground floor lobby and have to check in with security, I think they even walk you to the elevator so the guy can use his key card to select which floor you need. Once on the floor, the H&H gun room is just down the hall and you knock on the door for them to buzz you in. I was a bit nervous the first time I went but as the OP said, they are actually very friendly and unpretentious.
>>29585735
>No pics. Felt too touristy and they were already being super cool and treating me like a customer.
This has been my experience as well. One time I was there and the only other customer in the store was a South African dude picking up a $220k matched pair of SxS shotguns. He noticed I was trying to sneak glances at what he was picking up and invited me over to take at look since they had some custom engraving done that he wanted to show me. Very friendly guy.
It’s been a couple years but I believe the manager was named David and he was very friendly and let me handle pretty much everything in the store. I got the impression that they don't get too many walk ins and were happy to have someone visiting.
>>29586498
continued
We started talking and I brought up that I’m not in the income tier to be shopping for a H&H but that I appreciated the fact they treated me with respect. He told me they take a very long term view of customer acquisition and while a large part of their clients are extremely wealthy, they also have people who save for years/decades before becoming customers. This was before he was at the NY store but he told me a story of a NY City Engineer who would put away a certain amount of money every paycheck for his "H&H fund". He did this for 30 years, visiting the store a couple times a year to look around, and then one day came in with $90K to spend on a rifle.
>>29585735
>because they have to be hand-crafted to the individual weapon as there is NO use of interchangeable or machine-made parts
This isn’t entirely true. I know for a fact that a lot of the actions are primarily CNC made and then hand fitted/finished. For example, the action from their bolt guns is actually based on a Mauser design and the complete action is bought from a German company and then finished by H&H. They actually outsource quite a bit of stuff, the expense is mostly due to all the hand fitting/finishing.
Many people consider H&H and Purdey to be somewhat overpriced. You can probably get equivalent or nicer guns from Westley Richards, Boss & Co, and some of the smaller Ferlach gunmakers for less. They don’t have fancy gunrooms on Madison Ave though. With something like H&H/Purdey you’re definitely paying extra for the history and the prestige that come with the name. Also, not sure that you’re aware of this but H&H is owned by the billionaire brothers who own Chanel, and Prudey is owned by Richmont, which is one of the largest luxury goods conglomerates in the world behind LVMH.
Sorry for the long post. Glad you enjoyed your visit OP.
>>29584876
>>29586498
This sounds pretty cool. I didn't even know NYC has gun stores.
I'm gonna have to go next time I visit friends. Does the store have regular hours or do you have to make an appointment?
>>29587404
It has regular hours you can find with Google. No appointment necessary.
Another good gun store in Manhattan is the Beretta gallery on the upper east side. The first couple of floors are all apparel, then you climb a narrow staircase and are in a gun room staffed by Beretta sponsored pro shooters featuring primo product from all their brands like Sako, Benelli, Franchi and some custom engraved Berettas.
>>29586515
Everything's owned by a conglomerate though. LVMH owns many small brands that have images nothing like that of Louis Vuitton or Henessy. A lot of times it's more like an investment than a takeover.
On a related note though, they told me that sanctions on doing business with Russian plutocrats had hurt their London office's business pretty badly. They've had those guys call in while their guns are in production and ask if there's any way to make it more expensive so they can one-up somebody. I can't see lots of Brits or Americans making such a request.
That was a bit of a goof about the bolt actions, but the guy (Bob?) told me the mounts have to be fitted extremely precisely. Could be BS but I hope not.
I met David too. He's super cool and likes to tell hunting stories. Dunno if this was in there when you went, but he killed a fucking massive turkey in South Carolina that's stuffed in the showroom.
>>29586498
Well, I'm sure the pay at H&H ain't too bad. Not to mention if you liked guns and hunting, you get to talk guns and hunting and listen to all the rich people bragging stories.
>tfw dad has a pair of H&H shotguns
>tfw he's giving me them once he gets back from Qatar
I'll have to make a long post once I get them.
>>29589352
>H&H shotguns
>Qatar
Achmed pls
>>29585063
That would be really neat to see, just for the novelty.
>>29589454
Expats tardo.
Qatar has da monies.
If his dad lived there he wouldn't be coming back, because: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7qRjZ7pYdI&nohtml5=False
>>29589352
>>tfw dad has a pair of H&H shotguns
>>tfw he's giving me them once he gets back from Qatar
Do you happen to be a fuckin oil shiek or some shit?
>>29589480
>>29585063
I imagine that a going semi-auto, even for a one-off, would just muddle their brand. There are hundreds of fantastic rifle builders and engravers who don't have such a long-running and specific reputation to uphold who could probably make you something gorgeous out of a Browning or Benelli action though.
>>29589352
>being a terrorist
>>29589454
White, actually.
>>29589556
Dad is a contractor, so partially.
>>29590128
:^)
>>29590089
>I imagine that a going semi-auto, even for a one-off, would just muddle their brand.
Not if its a REALLY VIP or someone.
Like if the President of the USA or if Prince Harry became the King and wanted an autoloader. H&H would do it because muh head of states.
>>29590875
I don't think so. Brands are hard to establish and easy to lose. Holland and Holland thrives on the principle that archaic things are classy. BARs and R1s are cool, but they are not aristocratic by any means, and Holland and Holland can't make it so. H&H isn't in the "cool" business. They're in the "handmade in England" business.
It's like if you walked into the McLaren factory and started trying to order a McLaren minivan. They could do it, and it would probably be cool, but it wouldn't be a McLaren, and McLaren itself would lose a bit of its McLarenness.
There's also no pressing reason anybody would want them to do this. They don't have a monopoly on good wood and engraving, not by a long shot.
>>29590875
Also
>REALLY VIP or someone
They sell lots of guns to Russian plutocrats who are richer than the royal family and are constantly trying to one up another. It's definitely come up at one point or another.
>>29591025
>>29591043
>H&H isn't in the "cool" business. They're in the "handmade in England" business.
>It's definitely come up at one point or another.
Well...maybe they have concepts that they turned down later because of the branding or manufacturing issues. Because some rich tacticool liking rich dude was willing to say money was no expense or something which was enough to make H&H consider the idea.
Man...I'm just wishlisting at this point.
