was this guy a great general or a piece of shit?
>>29550186
5 silver stars in WW1 by leading from the front...next question.
>>29550186
Bruce Willis?
Only dirty ungrateful flips talk shit about him.
Yes.
Yes he was great. The kind of personality we need in our leaders.
Imagine if Patton was still alive to be his right hand man in Korea
I read he had to have a personal guard a lot because his troops hated him so much they thought one would actually kill him for abandoning his troops at Bataan. He had one success at Inchon which was more a stroke of good luck landing at a spot where the commies were'nt and then foundered for the rest of the war until Truman fired him.
Theres also a lot of talk that he was the slimiest ladder climber in the history of the military whining for medals he shouldn't have earned.
Why is he great?
>>29550290
MacArthur was ordered to leave the Philippines.
>>29550186
Korean War would've been over in weeks if Truman didn't puss out on using tactical nukes at the border with china.
None of this cease-fire bullshit.
China had no nukes at the time and we had a lot more than the soviets, so if there was ever a time to use some small-scale ones to equalize a 50,000 americans vs 1,000,000 chinese fight, that was the time.
>>29550290
autism detected.
the guy saved more lives with his style of warfare.
MacArthur's concept of "hit them where they ain't".
he had a huge ego but no more that some of his contemporaries had.
PS he earned seven Silver Stars (a record), a French Croix de Guerre, two Distinguished Service Medals, and two Purple Hearts for WWI
>>29550186
>a piece of shit
was not responsible for the bloodbaths like Tarawa, Peleliu, Iwo Jima etc etc.
>>29550186
Great guy in WW1
Piece of shit for killing ww1 American vets asking for their benefits.
Piece of shit in ww2
Great guy in keeping Japan from turning into a third world country
Piece of shit for not properly punishing Japanese war criminals
Piece of shit in Korea.
The man had his moments, but he was a self aggrandizing drama queen
>>29550242
>Thinking flips would shit talk ol' Corncob and Khakis
>>29550510
This is a fairly accurate summary, although Inchon was bretty gud. His generals hated his guts, too.
Every famous general was pretty much a piece of shit.
It's easy to look at someone's life in retrospect and see all the flaws, but it's very very hard to live through that life not knowing what you'll do in the future or what challenges await.
Hipster artisan pipe shiller...
>>29550609
I don't know you or general corncob or really anything.
I love your pov in this post.
>>29550609
I mean, OK, sure, but compare what the men serving under Ned Almond thought about him to what they thought about Matt Ridgway when he took over. There's a lot of room for variation.
MacArthur had Monntgomery level autism.
What kind of General publically annouces his support for turning the Norc/Chinese border into a nuclear wasteland?
It's on par with Henry Morgenthau drafting a plan to divide and industrialize Germany, then publicly expressing his support for the plan. All it did was add the will to resist in Germans and the Nazis had a field day with it, (a Jew in FDR's cabinet announcing the total destruction of Germany no less). It got so many Allied soldiers killed as it turned even the most war weary German into a radical.
>>29550818
Deindustrialize
who was the best US general of all time?
>>29550818
One that tries stopping a conflict before it goes any further
The threat of nukes was real and within our capabilities to use.
If Truman hadn't been a pussy faggot, the Korean war would have been over after one Davy Crockett.
>>29550924
I'm not saying I disagree with the usage of nuclear arms. The General should have shown a little discretion. The moment it came out of his lips, his career was over.
>>29550510
The Bonus Army was not asking for their benefits. They were asking for shit that wasn't promised.
>>29550910
>>29550186
if only he conquered china or atleast the south part of it i bet the world right now would be alot more stable
>>29551085
screwing with the status quo is always a recipe for disaster
Took one look at New Guinea and noped the fucked out. Aussies went in a got the job done.
>>29551013
oh this is sure to trigger the dixiefags
and for the most part they are right. he did nothing but burn through villages. its pretty much been accepted by most historians that the CSA had better commanders and had a better track record in battles.
>>29550510
>Piece of shit for killing ww1 American vets asking for their benefits
kind of dramatic overkill and inaccurate to boot.
this was an unfortunate incident that he along with his contemporary Patton played a mostly minor part in.
the "Bonus Army" was like a lot modern vets in that they feel like America owes them a never ending living for life for their service.
also one of the unintended consequences of this incident was that Roosevelt easily won the election later that year.
General MacArthur was partially responsible for the adoption of the "U.S. rifle, caliber .30, M1 ",
the "dumb ole Garand", during the time that he was Army Chief of Staff.
Making America the only major player in WWII
to have a "standard issue" automatic service rifle.
that fact alone should earn him a honored spot on /k/.
>>29550186
>was this guy a great general
Great does not mean good.
>or a piece of shit
Greatness and shitness are not mutually exclusive.
>>29550290
>abandoning his troops at Bataan
Anyone here from the Philippines?
would love to here your opinion of General MacArthur.
>>29551103
>Took one look at New Guinea and noped the fucked out.
you would too if you went there.
>>29550186
In the words of historian Richard B. Frank, it's important to hate MacArthur, but it's also important to hate him for the right reasons.
>>29550242
Lived there friend, he is more popular than Jose Rizal.
>>29550186
Doesn't he have the largest surrender of US troops (Philippines) and the longest retreat retreat of US forces ever (Korea) under his belt?
>>29551319
He was also the reason the Garand wasn't adopted in .276 pedersen.
To be perfectly fair it wasn't a bad decision at the time as the army was poorly funded, however it was a bad decision in the long run.
Adopting the .276 would have likely prevented the development of the.308 and maybe even the .223.
At least that's what Ian thinks:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwntZVIoPpI
>>29550359
Nukes weren't used because that would have set an insanely dangerous precedent, that any war with the US at all would result in the use of nuclear weapons. That turns very bad when your enemies DO get nuclear weapons, and any nuclear war is bad.
They're still a weapon of absolute last resort, and that's a good thing.
>>29550186
The fact that he was a stickler for his soldiers carrying gas masks in WW1, yet managed to get gassed twice speaks volumes about the man's unwarranted arrogance.
He was nowhere near as good as he thought he was. He abandoned Rainbow Five, got his planes caught pants-down at Clark field, and when he got wedged onto Bataan with little food and no medicine, he accepted a bribe from Quezon and literally slunk away in the middle of the night. For these conspicuous acts of gallantry (and conspicuous sucking of congressional cock) he was awarded a Medal of Honor in order to "to offset any propaganda by the enemy directed at his leaving his command."
The guy was a massive fucking chickenhawk, and much more of a politician in a general's uniform than a true general. On more than one occasion he got butthurt when his plans weren't rubber-stamped by the other Pacific commanders, and threatened to resign his command. Roosevelt, seeing how much of a public shitstorm the resignation of the Diva in Chief of the South Pacific would cause, gritted his teeth and gave MacArthur what he wanted.
tl;dr, the best thing about MacArthur was the doujin of his sin getting fucked in the ass.
Reminder that when MacArthur was told the Japanese had more than double the forces available than the US thought in the home islands, he just said intelligence always exaggerated Japanese strength (just a blatant lie) and insisted an invasion was still a good idea.
>>29550910
No other leader ever had to deal with the complexity of threats President Obama has.
His robot assassination campaign against goatfucker jihadi has been remarkably successful. He deftly plays the factions against each other, a few arms shipments here, a few cash drops there, a few heroin shipments into USA over here.
President Obama is a real life Machiavelli with a noble heart. While managing incompetent military leadership with his genius stretegems, he has also enacted social justice reforms into our armed forces, bringing their antiquated boys club into the 21st century buy putting women and transgender in combat roles.
He has also ensured Americas strategic interests be subsidising our essential defense industry with programs like LSC, Zumwalt, F35.
Truly our greatest military leader.
>>29551819
Son, not sin, my bad.
>>29551365
Most everyone likes the guy. History classes across the country paint a positive light on his actions in the Pacific and are more than eager to emphasize the fact he came back to liberate us rather than leaving us in the first place.
I think commies hate him but nobody takes them seriously.
>>29551365
I think most people like MacArthur because of his whole "I will return." and liberation of the Philippines.
>>29551680
To be fair about the surrender, Japan invaded the Philippines after they attacked Pearl Harbor so there wasn't many options for the American forces in the Philippines other than to surrender since they were essentially cut off. They held out for a good couple of months though.
Korea was kind of bad though.
>>29551986
>I think most people like MacArthur because of his whole "I will return." and liberation of the Philippines.
If the Philippines had been bypassed as the Navy wanted, then a few hundred thousand more Filipinos would have lived and Manilia wouldn't have been reduced to rubble, in exchange for a few more months of Japanese oppression.
>so there wasn't many options for the American forces
There was the option of following pre-war plans instead of his idiotic ad-hoc ideas. The US still would have lost, but not as badly.
>Incompetent fuck up who botched the defence of the Phillipines
>earned the nickname "dugout Macarthur"
>wasted time, resources and lives in retaking the Phillipines solely for his bruised ego, at a time when it already had no strategic value for the Japs due to it being cut off by US naval blockades
>had Marines carry out the completely unecessary invasion of Pelilliu as preperation for the invasion of the Phillipines, resulting in massive losses for the Marines to take an island that the Japs had no ability to launch attacks from
>claimed Peliliu had an important airfield, when there was already an airfield being built on Iwo Jima which was already carrying out the purpose that he said he needed Peliliu for
>gave jap war criminals immunity after they did shit that made the nazis look like choir boys
>got his butt handed to him by the Chinese in Korea
>tried provoking the Chinese on purpose, and succeeded, resulting in America's loss in Korea
>him having his career scuppered by the Chinese was probably some kinda karma for granting said immunity to the jap war criminals
>due to the hand he had in drafting the Japanese constitution after the war and all the laws with it is probably responsible for why they pixellate all their porn was well
He was a turd with a few kernals of gold nuggets, but a turd none the less
>>29551680
Thanks anon for reminding me that this is the 74th anniversary of the surrender of Bataan by Major General Edward P. King when he presided over the biggest mass surrender of Americans since General Robert E. Lee's Army of Northern Virginia surrendered to Lt. Gen. Ulysses S. Grant at Appomattox Court House on April 9th 1865. exactly 77 years before.
>>29550910
>>29551846
Ok
I see your point
And I discarded it
But at least I saw it
And that is all that matters
>>29552035
>dugout Macarthur
Dugout Doug, moron.
try getting your "facts" at least half right before posting please.
>>29552035
>He was a turd with a few kernals of gold nuggets, but a turd none the less
think you are the "turd", lad.
>>29551846
Learn how to bait, newfag.
>>29552118
I aint the one responsible for the US army's longest retreat in history so far senpai
>>29552039
Just because he escaped and didn't have to surrender himself doesn't make it any less his surrender.
![[citation].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/JOV2rry.jpg "[citation].jpg")
>>29552137
>I aint the one responsible for...
shitposting on /k/
yes you are, here's your citation.
offense 'E'
>>29551365
Flip here. He's worshiped as a hero, especially when he did return to liberate the Philippines which he always kept telling us. History books would often mention about his triumphant return that he even got his own memorial at the place where he landed.
Of course, they don't mention the rout he had caused during the defense of the Philippines. Doubt they even know it in the first place.
>>29552637
So was it better to return and liberate or should they have stuck it out?
>>29552654
Personally, I think they should have skipped the Philippines. It's true with probably be under Jap oppression by a few more months or so, but the carnage at the battle of Manila was too much it's like the Stalingrad of the Pacific.
Though because of that, the people here are still grateful to him and America as a whole which is probably why the Philippines, next to Japan or even greater, is a very staunch ally of the US.
>>29550186
No. He was a piece of shit that cared nothing for his men and his 'victories' pale in comparison to his failures which history swept under the rug. He was a politician in a military uniform that failed to understand politics OR warfare.
>>29552692
Sounds like one of those long view strategies.
>>29551986
>Japan invaded the Philippines after they attacked Pearl Harbor
the Japanese took out the air force at the same time they were attacking pearl harbor meaning that Americans had no air cover during the defense of the Philippines...a fact that most detractors of MacArthur conveniently overlook.
look how well that worked out for everyone else
without air cover. Barbarossa, defense of the Reich, 6 day war, desert storm etc etc.
>>29552637
The battle of Manila is a underrated battle of WW2. The Japanese tried to pull off a Stalingrad type defense and MacArthur NOPED out of it to level the city first. It greatly reduced US casualties.
Doug could have been worse.
He could have been the pacific front version of Mark Clark with his glorious liberation of Rome... and allowing the entire 10th Army escape behind the Gustav Line unscathed.
>>29552000
>following pre-war plans instead of his idiotic ad-hoc ideas.
his plan was the pre-war plan with a few tweaks.
>>29550186
I will never forgive him for preventing .276 Pedersen from being adopted.
>>29552875
>Japanese took out the air force at the same time they were attacking pearl harbor
Except you know, they were attacked 8 HOURS AFTER the attack on Pearl and they knew the Japanese were coming. They actually planned to strike Formosa first with their B-17s but for some reason that history couldn't elucidate, it was postponed.
> Brereton claimed that Sutherland, MacArthur’s chief of staff, kept putting off his requests to stage a raid over Formosa. MacArthur claimed that Brereton was responsible for keeping the aircraft on the ground. Either way, when the postponed Japanese raid finally arrived over Luzon, it caught half the aircraft of the FEAF on the ground at Clark Field, where they were promptly destroyed.
>>29552940
>I will never forgive him for preventing .276 Pedersen from being adopted.
poor ole Doug can't rest in peace...'cause of you.
just let it go anon. just let it go.
>>29552986
>8 HOURS AFTER
time zones anon
>>29552935
http://www.history.army.mil/books/70-7_06.htm
>eneral MacArthur had the answer to those who saw no way out of the difficulty in the Philippines: transform WPO-3, which he regarded as defeatist and defensive, into an aggressive plan whose object would be the defeat of any enemy that attempted the conquest of the Philippines.
>Almost from the date that he was recalled to active duty in the Philippines, on 26 July 1941, MacArthur began to think about replacing WPO-3 with a new plan.
>>29550186
Ultimately, what you need in a general is someone who can into logistics. Anything and everything else is a plus.
(That said, I think he was a sack of shit. Anyone who wants to work around their deficiencies as a general through nukes is kinda lacking imho)
>>29553022
They got word that Pearl was under attack in the wee hours of December 8 in the Philippines, December 7 at Pearl. The air force at the Philippines were utterly destroyed at around noon of December 8 in the Philippines. They got 8 hours advance warning that the war is on. 8 hours to prepare and intercept a Japanese attack, which they failed to do so.
>>29551365
>would love to here your opinion of General MacArthur.
my best friend's late father was a marine on Corregidor who survived the death march the prison camps on Luzon, the boat trip to Kyushu where he managed to finish out the war working at the Fukuoka Airport as a slave laborer.
wish i could ask him what his thoughts were on MacArthur... i know his son knows more about weapons than myself or most other /k/ommandos that ive read about do.
>>29553055
>http://www.history.army.mil/books/70-7_06.htm
thanks anon.
>>29550275
Imagine how Patton would have handled Vietnam had he lived that long
>>29551013
>Looks like Tywin Lannister, generals like Gregor Clegain.
> mah Stonewall riot
>>29550242
Nigger I've been to the Philippines and the guy is venerated to hell and back. There's statues of him all over the place.
why not both seemed compatent enough until Vietnam and korea
>>29551124
Sherman was probably the first general in history to command a campaign at an operational level rather than view a campaign as a series of battles.
Previous generals, with the exception of Fabius, viewed the defeat of the enemy in the field as the primary objective. Sherman winning in the in the field doesn't matter if you can destroy your enemy's ability to make war and support a field army. That said, he won field battle after field battle as well.
Sherman would probably lose an equal field battle to Napoleon, but he would know better than to march into Russia with 750,000 men, and given equal forces in a theater, he can probably show up with more men at any given battle than Napoleon.
>>29550239
No you dumb fuck, General of the Armies Hunter S. Thompson.
>>29550910
>>29552000
>>If the Philippines had been bypassed as the Navy wanted, then a few hundred thousand more Filipinos would have lived and Manilia wouldn't have been reduced to rubble, in exchange for a few more months of Japanese oppression.
no one knew about the bomb. it would have meant staving the japanese off the island if they didn't invade.
>>29553633
>>29551124
>>29551013
sherman's strategy was about 80 years too early. Nations didn't really practice total war until ww2. Even the devastation in ww1 was limited to the trench.
>>29550186
He was a general piece of shit.
>>29553904
You should read on the "gross production" of Georgia before and after Sherman's march.
Sherman absolutely had the capability and technology to lay waste to a huge swath of the countryside. Sherman estimates he did $100 million in damage, which is equal to all non-defense spending by the US government in that year.
The key difference compared to WW1 was that Sherman has a breakthrough on the strategic level to work with. Germany never got that, and they would never be able to knock the French out of the war industrially as long as Franc had their colonial empire, and could buy American supplies with British/American loans.
>>29550359
>Korean War would've been over in weeks
Well yeah, because it wouldn't have been the Korean War anymore, it would have been World War III. You're just flat-out delusional and retarded if you seriously believe that introducing nukes would not have escalated the war right up to that.
Also, there was no 50k Americans vs 1 million Chinese fight. The Chinese didn't even have the logistical ability to have a million men in Korea at the same time. Fuck,the Chinese were actually outnumbered by the combined UN forces during the entire mobile phase of the war.
>>29550924
Guess what was also eal and withing their capabilities to use and owuld have been used in such a case, dipshit? The Soviet's threat to react to any use of nukes by overrunning Europe and bringing their own nuclear arsenal into it.
Then again, you're the kind of delusional and retarded dipshit who thinks that not wanting to start a world war and sacrificing the lives of millions of your countrymen somehow makes Truman a "pussy faggot". By your utterly braindead definition of the term, "pussy faggot" has to count as one of the highest praises one could ever make to a man.
>>29550242
He said he'd be back...he came back.
>>29551727
Adopting .276 would've made the US not resist NATO in adopting an intermediate round.
>>29555474
>Only 4 years.
>>29551013
>"I have already received guns that can cast heavy and destructive shot as far as the heart of your city; also, I have for some days held and controlled every avenue by which the people and garrison of Savannah can be supplied, and I am therefore justified in demanding the surrender of the city of Savannah, and its dependent forts, and shall wait a reasonable time for your answer, before opening with heavy ordnance. Should you entertain the proposition, I am prepared to grant liberal terms to the inhabitants and garrison; but should I be forced to resort to assault, or the slower and surer process of starvation, I shall then feel justified in resorting to the harshest measures, and shall make little effort to restrain my army—burning to avenge the national wrong which they attach to Savannah and other large cities which have been so prominent in dragging our country into civil war."
>confederate general fled
>city mayor surrendered
damn, he was pissed as fuck.
>>29550254
Sinterklaas?
>>29550186
He was both.
>>29555821
Sherman was firm believer that, when it came to war, the harder you killed people, the faster you could stop killing people.
>>29555821
Before the war, Sherman taught at what would become LSU. We have several letters he wrote where he was basically ranting that the upper class Southerners who were so eager to go to war over their "rights" (i.e Slaves) didn't have a damn clue about what war actually was.
The thing people miss about Sherman was he mostly went after the Southern Elite, especially during the March to the Sea. There were strict orders not to go after common farmers, while the Plantations were basically free game.
He later would chew people out for talking about how great he was, and he couldn't stand it when bands would play "Marching through Georgia."
>>29556151
> You don’t know the horrible aspects of war. I’ve been through two wars and I know. I’ve seen cities and homes in ashes. I’ve seen thousands of men lying on the ground, their dead faces looking up at the skies. I tell you, war is Hell!
There's only a handful of post-Napoleonic generals who have fought a war and not become pacifists from it.
>>29552921
such a fucking idiot
things would've gone much smoother in Italy if it wasn't for Lucas being a huge fucking pussy and Mark Clark fucking capturing an open city
>>29550186
I lost any and all respect for him after reading up on Unit 731 and how he offered immunity if they gave up their data on human experimentation. He might have gotten the job done during the war, but he was a fucking dumbass afterwards. He wanted to nuke best Korea a little too close to their Chinese border.
