G36
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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
Why hasn't anyone created a better rifle yet?
but FN has.
>>29499329
Armalite has
HK has
Kalashnikov has
like >>29499337 said FN has
>>29499344
>Armalite has
when will this meme finally die?
>>29499358
No sooner than the meme of a G36 actually being good or serviceable.
Forgot to mention that Garand, and Browning did better too.
>>29499364
>ambidextrous side charging
>Easily replacable barrel
>Entire inner workings can easily be replaced within seconds if they stop functioning
>Real easy maintenance
>Integrated 4X scope
How is it not good?
They already existed before it was created.
>>29499380
Totally unremarkable features in the age of modern weapons, and it melts.
>>29499364
Ursula pls
>>29499390
Spiegel online plz
>>29499395
>>29499402
No.
>>29499329
Well if it didn't melt, it would be a perfectly fine rifle.
>inb4:
>Hurr, it was never intended for use in Afghanistan!!1!!1!
>It was never supposed to be used as a suppressive weapon!1!!1!1
>The goobermint used shitty plastics!1!!!!!
>>29499428
They melt just as much as glocks explode
>>29499482
this tbqh
>>29499369
Mankind wasn't ready for it.
>>29499428
>>The goobermint used shitty plastics!1!!!!!
>Implying m16 fags don't use this type of excuse to defend the A1
>>29499548
I don't, but you're still wrong. Most of its issues were solved with the A1, the first M16 alteration 0 had problems.
>be Von der Leyen
>want to do something so people think i'm a competent politician
>invent melting may may to justify modernizing the Bundeswehr
>>29499428
>H&K used different polymers that were cheaper in the production run that resulted in melting
you are fucking stupid and people like you are why /k/ is now shit
G36 is quite heavy, it's about half a kilo heavier than M16A2.
Most of the service rifles today are a stones throw away from each other, with the exception of the INSAS (designated, etc.).
Nothing will be worth the expense of upgrading and a adding new supply chain until something like LSAT rifle matures.
>>29499329
Personaly I like the xm8 a little better, but it's pretty much the same rifle.
There is no good reason to defend this design. It looks cool, but that doesn't mean shit, especially when the most of the body is lightweight polymer. The part that sucks is the insides. It's just another meh ar-180 clone.
>>29499369
That's a dank meme anon
>>29499428
Why have forgotten mediocre integrated optics and top charging handle which makes scopes sit higher than necessary in flat top variants?
>>29499726
Do you even lift? Oh wait no, you're american.
>>29499627
How did she invent it when she just inherited a situation of conflicting reports which summoned a larger conclusionary report with all the previous participants together? You make it sound as if she wrote the report herself.
>>29499482
G36s are the new Willy Pete then?
>>29499726
>G36 is quite heavy, it's about half a kilo heavier than M16A2.
???
The M16A2 without magazine and sling weighs (depending on source) 3.4-3.5 kg.
http://www.armystudyguide.com/content/army_board_study_guide_topics/m16a2/m16a2-study-guide.shtml
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m16-specs.htm
An empty G36 weighs 3.66 kg which includes a dual optic.
An empty G36A2 weighs 3.47kg which includes a Hensold RSA-S reflex sight.
http://www.deutschesheer.de/portal/a/heer/!ut/p/c4/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSSzPy8xBz9CP3I5EyrpHK9jNTUIr2S1OSMvMxsvYzEvJTyxLS01Dy99NTy1IyidGMz_YJsR0UAI88zGQ!!/
>all these people badmouthing the G36
Have you ever actually shot one?
I have (in the Bundeswehr), and it's a great rifle.
Pls stop this meme.
The fact that our minister of defense used to be the minister for family affairs is retarded enough, and now people trust her to have any idea about guns? Smh senpai
>>29500126
Oh we lift,but we're getting tired of carrying europe.
>>29499380
>Integrated 4X scope
This was cool in the 90s when glass was only for certain roles, but its a liability today. Especially considering the ZF3x4 was such a turd as far as optics go.
>>29500420
>trusting von der Leyen on anything at all
>>29499329
memes
>>29499358
Right after you stop thinking it's 1965
>>29500420
I've fired it a bit. Not enough for a real opinion but I did not like the feel of it. The balance and length made it unpleasant to point. I'm Brit infantry so I'm biased no doubt towards the ergonomics of the L85 but having also fired an M16 I can hands down say I thoroughly enjoyed the feel and pointability of the M16 while just feeling incompetent and uncoordinated with the G36.
Would very much like to try the carbine version though.
>>29499428
Rifle is fine get the fuck out.
>>29499329
This might sound sacrilegious, but how about an HK 33, with a short stroke gas system and rotating bolt, replacing the roller delayed blowback?
>>29500874
To my knowledge a wide range of rifles were considered in the original competition, before the two finalists, G36 and Steyr AUG, had to fight it out between the two of them. I seem to recall to have read somewhere that the HK33 was found as too heavy to compete against the M16. But that might also have been an HK-internal decision.
>>29499329
Unreliable crap
Heavy
Ugly
>>29501819
4 words, 2 wrong statements. Impressive
They already did.
M4a1
>>29501944
>preferring direct impingement over short stroke piston in a short barreled rifle
So, you just wanted to share with the world that you have no clue about gun design?
G36 is INSAS tier
>>29500432
>All units respond to thread location shots fired, shots fired.
>Advise EMS to stage, heavy burn casualties.
>>29502036
>he calls the M4 direct impingement and has the audacity to claim other people don't know anything about gun design
>>29502461
You're not trying semantics in the context of a comparison where this would be irrelevant, are you?
>>29499369
Damn you soviet union, all you had to do was keep the band together for like 3 more years and we could have had this.
>>29502514
Its not semantics when there is a measurable difference between a true DI design and stoner DI.
>>29502760
It's semantics if it doesn't matter in the context of a comparison focused on short barreled rifles as both the stoner DI and true DI require more barrel length in front of the gas port than a short stroke piston.
>>29502944
By what metric? Rifle >mid>carbine> pistol by pressure. By this comparison you could have a short rifle with the gas port near the muzzle and still have the required pressure. But is a longer dwell time required also?
>>29502996
DI systems need to be under pressure longer because the way for the gases to reach the working mechanism is longer: all the way through the gas tube. Short stroke piston systems don't have this problem as the working mechanism begins right above the gas port. The piston, as a rigid body, transfers the energy from the gases instantly to the working mechanism. The M4 and it's successors needed to bring the gas port further back when the barrel was shortened from the M16. This leads to higher gas pressure, which wears out the parts much faster than in a short stroke piston system like the G36 and increases the cyclic rate.
Remember: the original problem of the M16, when it was introduced, was that the Army used ball powder instead of IMR powder. The problem with ball powder is that it has higher pressure at the gas port. But the M16 was designed for IMR powder. Apart from wearing the parts out much faster, the higher gas port pressure lead to a higher cyclic rate, leading to light strike misfires from bolt carrier bounce and failures to extracts. Particularly the failures to extract killed many GIs.
An engineer at Colt thought up a workaround by making the buffer heavier and adding a rubber plug inside the extractor spring. But with the conversion of the system from the long barreled M16 to the short barreled M4 we're having the same problems all over again. A short stroke piston system is superior here.
>>29503186
So what are the benifits of a long stroke gas piston? OK that makes sense, forgotten weapons talked to the engineer with the most ass hours on the ar15, I think it was Jim or Ed Sulivan, he described carrier bounce on full auto as an early issue with the ar15 design. This was solved with ano increase in carrier wieght. Seems that carrier bounce is a recurring issue.
>>29503512
>So what are the benifits of a long stroke gas piston?
Simplicity, basically.
And, yeah, it must've been Jim Sullivan. He was co-designer of the AR-15 and described the issues of the system in several interviews. But I think it was a heavier buffer, not a heavier carrier that was used. For one, it was an easy fix that GIs could do in the field. And probably more important it let the Army continue using ball powder.
>>29503597
The carrier he mentioned specifically, he called out the current manufacturers for producing low mass carriers and reversing a specific design decision.
But all things considered what piston would be superior,Long or short stroke?
>>29503690
There's not a general answer to what is superior. Depends on the intended role. Does one need a short barreled rifle or not, is over-the-beach capability needed etc. Long stroke is said to be better in arctic conditions but I don't know if that's something inherent in the principle or just because of particular comparisons that were made between AK-derivatives and other types of rifles. The moving parts of a long stroke piston system are usually heavier and therefore also need to harvest more energy from the gases.
But overall it matters much more if a rifle is really well designed and produced than whether it uses DI, long stroke or short stroke piston. The finicky little details can make a rifle with a principle that's good in theory a bad choice if it's not well designed and/or produced.
![ZJnX1hq[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/7h9GUu3.jpg "ZJnX1hq[1].jpg")
>>29499482
Hasn't slowed HK down. They've still managed to find suckers in Lithuania.
>>29503899
OK, I'm was just more curious at the differences between a them and their strengths. Most of these newly designed rifles all seem to be short stroke.
>>29499329
They did, its called
>HK G41
>M16/M4/C7/C8
>VHS-2
>FAMAS G2
>AUG
>HK416
>HK33
>etc
>>29500420
Have you ever actually shot it in combat conditions, have you burned through 3 mags in under 3 minutes, laid it on thick? Or did you sit on a pretty little range never deploying anywhere like a faggot little cuckboy?
>>29502203
pretty much.
The only ones worth a salt are the later made carbines - G36C and G36K in their latest production variants.
>>29505200
At least the Lithuanians bought the G36 with most of the kinks worked out - they don't have the issues the early German and Spanish guns had.
It's hard to understand but the Spaniards dumped the Cetme mod. L primarily because of magazine related issues - Mod L's took STAMAG mags, and the spanish contractors made shit mags and all they needed was a slapped on rail and some good mags.
Instead they adopted the G36 early and have had issues
>>29499482
>under 1000 glocks out of 10 million made kB! - most of them are in one caliber
>over 1/4 and damned near 1/2 of German infantrymen in combat conditions have reported wandering zero issues thanks to melty trunnion.
>Several rifles taken from random throughout the German army when stress tested on multiple mags of fully automatic or rapid semi auto fire show groups opening up significantly after a 2 mag dump or 3 mag rapid semi, several lost their zero and had to be rezeroed when cooled
happy?
>>29499329
Honestly besides the melty trunnion
>Dual optic - the red dot blows, the magnified optic has no eye relief whatsoever
>Stock just plain out fucking sucks - plastishit that can't take a beating - look at how they are adopting a new beefier collapsible system.
>Folding charging handle breaks
>Fat and ungainly handguards
>Useless cheap shit bipod snaps easier than a grippod
>mags are fat, and unlike SIG550 mags the studs for linking mags together break all the time
>Trigger pull is god awful, seriously the G3 has a meh trigger but this is just worse in every way
>pencil barrel compounding heat transfer trunnion issues.
Fucking kraut fake germanic fucks should have adopted an actual germanic SIG 550 or AUG or just the superior G41 and called it a day. Fucking losers
>>29505644
I have 2000k base, 3000k with fixens.
I want a single rifle, a strong, reliable one. Semi auto of course, I live in Maryland. What do I get? I do not own a rifle currently.
>2016
>HK416 and HK417 available in US at worse than SCAR tier pricing
>416 uppers cost almost as much as a SCAR
>Still no civilian G36 - aka HK243
>still no MP7
I'm getting tired of their horseshit. The VP was a step in the right direction, but it's almost too little too late.
HK can't step up to the plate, FN is offering better products, stealing military contracts from under their noses, and here HK can't even produce products that are at least barely economical.
>>29502627
That and widespread use of PDW program weapons.
>>29500874
Its not sacrilege, it's just retarded in almost every aspect. Why would you bother replacing the roller delay for a piston, especially on a sheet metal gun.
>>29505922
Hk has to deal with German political policy, which is a big enough bitch in country. All things considered it's supriaimg they're even allowed to exist
