Is it a meme, /k/?
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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
Is it a meme, /k/?
No it's a gimmic.
It's so bad it can't even be classed as a meme.
>>29421234
Only one thing is good for
Stopping power became the ultimate meme, even 9fag picked it up
>>29421234
I've heard a lot of shit about them not feeding. I've never bought any though, so I wouldn't know. I've also never seen any non-marketing material about their effectiveness.
Is there a reason why they're worse than HST, or is it just the hype and price that makes them so hated?
>>29421259
It's the latest in a long line of light weight high velocity fragmentation ammo. It looks impressive when used against pumpkins or other soft targets, but gel tests show that the blade sections (called trocars) break away from the main mass of the bullet and penetrate about 4" into ballistic gel. A pellet rifle and No. 7 birdshot also penetrate about for inches, which against a real living human target amounts to a flesh wound. The remaining body of the bullet, which weighs about 40 grains does penetrate an impressive 16" or so. Which is about what a lead round nose high velocity .22lr will do.
So what RIP ammo does is turn your 9mm handgun into a .22 with a small shotshell.
Hardly ground breaking self defense technology.
>>29423373
https://youtu.be/psGFPRpWZ3w
>>29421265
hollow points will do this just as well. Better in fact.
>>29423421
based ShootingTheBull is based
>>29423373
They basically turn your 9mm pistol into an overpriced, shitty .380
>>29423411
>4 inches into human torso
>flesh wound
Lol no
That's more like fatal wound you fucking retard. You don't need 16 inches of penetration to hit heart/lung/liver/spleen
>>29423448
This guy actually thinks that 4 inches in ballistics gel will even make it past the bone in an actual human body.
Fucking bird shot will go 4 inches in ballistics gel.
Bird shot.
For birds.
>>29423473
>make it past bone
You mean a rib will stop my bullet?
Ribs are literally the only bones you have to worry about and they're fragile at best.
>>29423487
It will stop those little petals like it's nothing. Skin and bones are not accounted for in Ballistics gel. Even your skin makes a much bigger difference than you'd think. The minimum amount of penetration required in ballistics gel to be able to reach vital organs is 12".
>>29423487
>wad ids da sdernum
RIB AMMO GUYS :DDD
>>29423502
So the sternum is basically a bullet shield?
>>29423516
against your shitty meme rounds. Yes it is.
>>29423501
It doesn't pedal out until impact. The impact would be the rib or flesh around it.
Impacting a rib would essentially turn it into a hollow point, would it not?
>>29421256
manufacturers of ammunition like the RIP round are all about marketing. The high water mark of self defense round has already been achieved by bonded hollow point ammunition which delivers a large, deep wound.
So how can a new ammunition company break into the scene when companies like Speer, Hornandy, Remington etc. already make a wide assortment of high quality and proven hollow point rounds? By using visually striking images that play on peoples misunderstanding of ballistic testing results.
Ballistic gel is NOT a 1:1 simulation of human flesh. It is a standardized medium used for scientific study of projectiles. Ballistic gel allows for reproducible results allowing for scientific inquiry, it does NOT replicate human flesh. However, you hear "ballistic gel" and it KINDA looks like skin, and the average consumer thinks "oh, this stuff replicates a human body!" So a company makes something like the RIP round that makes this very impressive looking result in ballistics gel, it look like it would REALLY fuck you up internally. But in reality a good hollow point round would be much better at killing a human.
You want the mass of the bullet to stay TOGETHER when it enters a body, you want that big, sharp, bloomed hollow point to go deep into the body to hit vital parts, you don't want a lot of little bits going in barely at all.
RIP rounds and rounds like them aim to make a pretty picture in ballistics gel to put on a box to sell ammo, they don't actually care about making a good self defense round. Get some Speer GoldDots or some Hornandy Critical Defense rounds, those are actually made by companies that give a shit about your protection.
>>29423516
No, but it is a pretty good "shitty little metal flakes" shield, which is why you should use an actual goddamned bullet.
>>29423501
Don't forget about clothing and other conditions
>>29423520
No. Not reliably anyway. If a bullet doesn't perform to IWBA and FBI standards, don't use it.
4'' of penetration is never enough
>>29423519
Let me just be clear, I too think it's a stupid round.
I'm just saying 4 inches of penetration into the human torso could be lethal, regardless of the round. Even if the ribs or sternum are impacted there is still the possibility of death simply because there is a high velocity projectile entering your body.
Now the same could be said for pellet guns, etc. but again - I'm not arguing the practicality or reliability of it, only that it could be lethal.
>>29423528
To G2's credit, this bullet has been shown to perform exactly the way it's supposed to under the heavy denim test. It's still terrible, but clothing doesn't seem to be a factor with these rounds.
>>29421234
No, THIS is a meme
>>29423534
yes. But 4 inches in ballistics gel is not going to be 4 inches in a human torso. The center piece still has the potential to reach the vital organs, but it's shed all it's weight at that point and won't even be as effective as a .380 hollow point.
>>29423531
OP here, are there any reports of tests being done on these by LE agencies?
>>29423553
Not that I know of. But there's plenty of independent tests on Youtube that show it not meeting the standards.
Shootingthebull410 does some great testing.
>>29423552
So basically this is a retarded round that might fragment and cause some stupid minor injuries with the hope to maim the victim
>>29423568
pretty much. It still could very well deliver an incapacitating wound but you'll be relying entirely on the center piece. Go with some tried and true hollow points.
>>29423448
Gel isn't comparable with flesh inch for inch. Can't blame you; common misconception.
>>29421234
No, it's not even a forced meme. It's a constantly shilled advertisement.
So if this is not the best 9mm for self defense, which round actually is?
>>29423657
pretty much any hollow point that can perform to the IWBA standards will do the trick. HST is good but there are plenty more that work.
>>29423657
>hst
>gold dots
>critical defense
you know you can do your own fucking research by yourself, right?
>>29423684
>>29423553
>>29423520
>>29423487
>>29423448
If it doesn't penetrate to 12" on ballistics gel then that translates to it failing to perform effectively against a human target.
Should I buy HST in overpressure or federal? (Glock 19)
>>29423739
Are there studies that correlate the 12" mark and human gunshot wounds/fatalities?
I don't mean to sound condescending, I'm genuinely interested in reading about it.
I understand that ballistics gel is not human flesh
>>29423657
I think people probably make too much fuss over what round to use. If someone gets shot by a 9mm FMJ, odds are very good that they're going down. Even more so if you fire multiple times.
>>29423350
What on earth does that even mean
>>29423774
Europeans are scared by those dogs almost as much as they are by handguns
>>29421234
>Is it a meme, /k/?
Yes and we all said that when it was released 2 fucking years ago. Delete this shit thread and lurk moar newfag.
>>29423544
What will happen if you use it in a revolver?
>>29423533
I see what you did there, you're naughty.
>>29423848
It will revolve
you don't want it to revolve
>>29423848
it would be extremely painfull
>>29423523
Fucking this. No pity for fools who bought this RIP junk when your favorite flavor of JHP is at every store.
HST, GoldDot, Golden Saber, Crit Duty, Glaser, what fucking ever. I despise companies like RIP to no end.
>>29424015
But your a big wheel gun
>>29424055
BIG WHEELS 4U MOTHAFUCKA
>>29423761
Yeah there's a few. That's how that standard was set. It shouldn't be hard to find.
>>29421234
stop buying gimmick shit like this and just get some hornady critical defense.
>>29423534
Wow, the backtracking.
>>29423794
>Being mad about this thread
>Not being mad about /arg/
Go kill yourself.
>>29421234
>Went to Cabelas yesterday to buy ammo
>guy standing next to me in handgun ammo aisle
>takes call on Bluetooth as I try to find reasonably priced JHPs
>talks loudly forever
>finishes call and goes to find salesman
>salesman is older fudd like the rest of them
>guy: "I'm looking for rip ammo"
>salesman:"rip ammo?"
>g:"yeah, rip ammo"
>s:"I have never heard of that, let me see"
>salesman asks three other salesmen, only one of them even knows what it is
>s:"yeah we don't have any of that"
>midget covered in tattoos is walking with what I assume to be his dad
>tells dad "oh look they've got x gun yadda yadda..."
>dad repeatedly says "uh OK, I don't know why you're asking me..."
>salesman behind gun counter can't stop sneezing
>makes me laugh for some reason
>10 million Mexicans pointing and "awww yeah"-ing at S&W 500
>overpriced milsurp everywhere
>300 round bulk packs of PMC are more expensive per round than buying individual boxes
Such is life in IL suburbs
>>29423761
It was initially the FBI who correlated rounds recorded lethality and effectiveness in use against their performance in a gelatin substance.
They found that reliably lethal rounds that could reach human vitals would coorelate to 12 inches of penetration. They did this because the FBI was searching for a more reliably lethal round for their agents than the .38 special widely used in law enforcement at the time.
>>29424055
Checked 4U
>>29423657
If you want to do better than 9mm, get something with really high velocity and energy like a rifle bullet.
Cartridges like .40 are marginally better but not in any way that will influence the outcome.
Reminds me of those drill bit "bullets" that dumb woman found in a petrol station.
Shitty MIRV rip off.
>>29425268
>local range
>in pro shop
>100 round packs of cci 22 are 9 bux a pop
>bulk box of 500 is 80 bux
>point this out to owner
>"if you aint buyin, get out"
>>29423523
Right, except even then RIP has terrible results in properly prepared gel.
>>29424633
Autism
>>29423448
Ballistic gel duplicates the consistency of muscle tissue. Skin is much tougher and denser. four inches of ballistic gel roughly duplicates the resistance of human skin.
In other words, four inch penetration in ballistic gel is equal to a flesh wound.
>>29427874
>9 bux
They're 11 at budsgunshops store in lexington and that's the only place i've been able to find them reliably
>mfw
>>29421234
I'm so glad for this thread.
I know fuckall about physics, but I guess I'm just ever so slightly smarter than most of the people around me and I've been preaching this since I first saw the ultra-meme round.
It looks like it wouldn't even go straight.
>>29423534
>>29423520
>>29423516
>>29423448
Four inches in gel == less than one inch in a torso because skin = three inches or so of gel, then you have bones to contend with.
>>29423373
Also I've been preaching this too.
They just LOOK like they are going to be the last round you'll ever need, because they're going to fuck up feeding and your entire magazine full of them is going to fucking fly out the top of your gun and you're going to die because your gun fucked up when you were attempting to utilize deadly force.
>last round you'll ever need.
>>29424066
Dubs replying to dubs, nice
>>29421234
I'm pretty sure RIP rounds were a clever ploy buy the lead industry to give solid copper rounds a bad name.
>>29423774
Russia arms their dogs unlike Americucks.
>>29423448
Cmon man my finger can penetrate 4 inches of gel. Gel doesnt simulate the skin covering soft tissue
>>29423848
The bullets will pull themselves under recoil, and stop the cylinder from revolving.
If you look at lightweight Smith and Wesson 357 revolvers there is a warning not to use 125 grain ammo. Which is a light bullet for a 357. The same thing applies to this. 70 grains is light for a 9mm.
It didn't make sense to me at first. Thinking a lighter bullet would have less inertia. Therefore it would be more likely to recoil with the gun than a heavier bullet would be. Which I guess is true. The real problem is there is less length of bullet in the case. Which means less friction holding it in place. No matter what caliber it is. It has to be that diameter to fit the barrel. So lighter bullets are shorter for any given caliber, in general.
>>29423610
And they make these posts realizing that their potential customers are so fucking stupid that they won't read the entire thread of people pointing out that RIP rounds are shit, just see the picture on the catalog and go "ZOMG MUST BUY"
We're all playing ourselves by posting in here.
>>29423487
>ribs are fragile at best
Is that why footballers have injured ribs?
Oh wait...
>>29423473
I get what you're saying, but...
>>29421265
Hey, I posted that. Nice to see that it is going to good use.
>>29432082
Basically it's guaranteed to at least knock the wind out of them if they're not wearing a leather jacket?
>>29432643
I'm actually convinced that some #8 target load is all you need if you have a semi auto shotgun.
A guy my aunt knew took some target load to the abdomen and they had to keep the wound open in the hospital for a few weeks to let the shot work its way out of his muscle, he had to piss in a bag because the pain of getting up and standing was unbearable. The works. She was there. Someone shot him from a car, it knocked him the fuck down that's for sure.
>>29423411
Yeah it looks cool, if we lived in cybrrpunk future we make it some alloy turning 22lr shotshell to a 9mm shotshell
Maybe one day.
Be fucked up if it was like magnetic actived by blood. Like the fragments try to pull together to the core bullet.
>>29434151
well yeah, but plenty of things will do that
If you're firing a handgun at someone you generally want to do a little more damage than what a solid punch will do
>>29434162
I don't especially want to ever got shot with anything coming out of shotgun - birdshot, confetti load wads, cum shells, bees - but that doesn't make those things viable self-defense loads.
Fucking someone up really bad for a couple of weeks =/= making them unable to shoot back in the moment
>>29434204
I mean the shit blew him to the ground, if that's any shit.
Give one in the chest/face and they're don-diddily-done.
>>29434204
ripping off flesh, embedding in muscle, anon.
It rendered his abdomen muscle unusable and he collapsed from an inability to hold himself up, as I understand. This isn't a he said she said, I know the guy, he still walks fucked up and hurts a lot.
