"The Fighter Mafia was a controversial group of U.S. Air Force officers and civilian defense analysts who, in the 1970s, advocated the use of John Boyd and Thomas P. Christie's Energy-Maneuverability (E-M) theory as the sole driver in designing fighter aircraft.
The mathematical model they developed enabled quantitative (number-driven) one-to-one comparison of the performance of various aircraft in terms of air combat maneuvering, independent of real world flight testing. The model was used to identify deficiencies in service and proposed designs of the time."
>>29271647
It's fine, but Sprey was never actually part of it.
>>29271647
A bunch of old men who had zero air combat or engineering experience who believed they knew best.
>>29271667
It is true they had no combat experience. They remind me a bit of the "Moneyball" guys.
>>29271667
>zero air combat or engineering experience
>40-second Boyd, who went his entire career undefeated at Nellis and smoked Vietnam fucking shits in the jungle
>Pierre "Child Prodigy" Sprey with an IQ of 200+ and multiple degrees in engineering
Someone has been reading too many anti-F35 meme-o-graphics and taking them as fact.
Pick up a damn book and learn some facts holy shit.
>>29271719
"Neither Col. Boyd nor Col Riccioni had air combat experience but both (especially Col. Boyd) were brilliant aircraft analysts. Col. Riccioni was criticized for his lack of air combat experience, having seen no combat before his assignment to the Pentagon. Later, after cornering a senior officer, Air Force Deputy Chief of Staff, General John C. Meyer, at a party and ranting against the F-15, was given the choice between a combat tour in Vietnam or a desk job in Korea, and chose the latter.[4] Similarly, Sprey had no military expertise and scarce professional experience with fighter aircraft prior to his participation in the Fighter Mafia. While Sprey's education included aeronautical engineering and he wanted to be a plane designer, he later abandoned that path to focus on probabilities, statistics and operational research.[5] In addition, Sprey was noted to have exaggerated his participation in both the testing of the A-10, the design of the F-16 and in NASA's operation of its F-15 test aircraft.[4]"
>>29271739
>Wikipedia
If your high school history teacher doesn't accept it as a reference I'm certainly not, dipshit.
>>29271719
>>Pierre "Child Prodigy" Sprey with an IQ of 200+ and multiple degrees in engineering
being smart doesn't mean you can't say stupid shit.
>>29271753
Yes, and your teacher would also ask you to explain the actual why of why you support a position.
So provide evidence that supports your position.
>>29271753
I provided it as a useful shorthand, since the Fighter Mafia don't get nearly as much attention as the F-35.
Also I'm asking for opinions, not a college history paper.
If they're against ECM, advanced weapons and radars, sensors, and multi-role capabilities; I'm in opposition to them.
Radar & sensors are critical for detecting enemies and hitting enemies.
ECM is critical for surviving missile attacks.
Multi-role gives you more combat options.
>>29272335
This, I know they had a few good ideas in terms of encouraging fighter designs to be actual fighters. But Multirole fighters like the F16 are awesome in practice, BVR combat is a must for any modern treat scenario, long range radar and sensors help keep the pilot and plan alive.
>>29272380
Personally if I was a weapons designer, I'd be a simulator all the time in situations I could barely win at best. The stream of constant near-defeats and defeats would motivate me to learn what needed to be improved in my own aircraft.
>>29271647
E-M theory is a tremendously useful way of analyzing aircraft performance and understanding how to get the most out of your aircraft in BVR and WVR combat.
now a lot of what they ended up doing with it wasn't fantastic. but it's still a tremendous tool and a way to explain what can feel like a massive flail (and i should know, i had my first 2v1 sortie today and my head feels like it's about to fall off my neck)
>>29271719
>Boyd
>Only spent half a combat tour in Korea with zero kills amd never firing his weapons even once.
>Spent all of Vietnam fucking around on a training base.
>Had the balls to tell Phantom pilots who shot down MiGs it was physically impossible for Phantoms to shoot down MiGs.
>Combat experience
>>29272380
>F-16
>multirole
If the fighter mafia had their way it would've been little more than a cheap WVR air superiority fighter.
>>29272698
Yeah, I know.
![Ukraine.JPEG-0e9a5[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/luEgDaV.jpg "Ukraine.JPEG-0e9a5[1].jpg")
>>29271647
My opinion is it doesn't fucking matter. The days of dogfighting are over. The days of tank battles are over. The days of real sovereign nations going to war are over. The days of conventional warfare are OVER.
>>29272740
until a conventional war breaks out and the country that based their entire military off the incorrect assumption that conventional war is over gets their ass handed to them.
>>29271647
They weren't completely wrong. After all, the USAF eventually did accept the idea of making a small, single-engine fighter their main combat aircraft. But the USAF wanted it as a fighter-bomber that could take up the air-to-ground role while still being able to support the F-15 in air superiority duties.
It's a little frightening to imagine how things would have gone if they'd had more power though.
>Radar-less F-16s. Radar-less F-16's everywhere!
>>29275089
>until a war in which either side uses only nuclear weapons breaks out etc. etc.
The assumption is the same, but the result is too. That day is dead and gone.
>>29272499
What do you fly
>>29275425
It happened to Israel when they had to fight a conventional war against Hezbollah
>>29275483
If it's anyone on here it's the F-18 pilot
>>29275579
>conventional war against Hezbollah
You're joking right? Is this similar to Germany fighting UK? Both have jets...
