![Vig_Backgunn[A13]-01chrome01-3DCD-Ao-01-V2b.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/77CRrWx.jpg "Vig_Backgunn[A13]-01chrome01-3DCD-Ao-01-V2b.jpg")
Exactly how badly has small arms technology been retarded by legislation?
What promising designs are verboten?
What could have been?
>>28637689
If you're not careful, you could hurt your hand with that gun, the way the cylinders are facing
>>28637724
He isn't wrong, you know.
Where is the hammer spring?
>>28637689
look howmuch engineering was wasted on muzzlebreaks and flahiders when a suppressor is better at suppressing recoil and reducing flash
then theres all that time wasted on fake fullauto
no open bolt guns
How do you aim it?
We could have had a space battleship patrolling from earth to saturn DECADES ago.
Legislation ruins everything.
>but why do you NEED it
Cry me a river when you find out aliens suck.
>>28637759
Good point. Shouldn't suppressors be standard on all rifles by now? It's such a practical feature.
>>28638263
Honestly, using a non-silenced handgun in a public self-defense situation is a hazard to everyone in the area.
International import restrictions prevent a lot of competition which would push innovation.
Soft-ban on machine guns prevents pretty much anything in that department, and even hinders recoil compensation technology.
Barriers to entry on NFA items prevents a lot of designs from being retail-viable and decreases the number of potential players in the market.
Increasing barriers to entry for manufacturers (ITAR) also lowers competition at a base level.
>>28637771
Kek
Short rifles have been completely boned. The military has been making guns shorter and shorter but they'll rarely see ideas from civilian manufacturers because that shit is restricted.
And like the other anon said -suppressors. I imagine we'd have some great designs with semi cheap manufacturing processes if there wasn't a $200 6-month wall in front of every purchase
>>28640821
Oh yeah and on the topic of short guns. Pistol caliber carbines are basically the PDWs that militaries have been looking in to. If it wasn't for SBR laws those would be a HUGE market for home defense, especially if suppressors were available. All this stuff could be ready to just put into the mil's lap if it could have been developed for the civilian market first
>>28638430
this is actually a major point that should open a lot of discussion
>>28640825
I don't know if this is accurate or just my feels, but it seems to me that firearm technology has slowed to a crawl. All the manufacturers are just optimizing preexisting designs for ergonomics and calling it a new gun.
When was the last time something truly different happened? Glock making polymer popular?
I'm sure IP trolls have a lot to do with this too. Consumer 3d printers only became a thing one a bunch of patents expired. You're still not even allowed to sell one with a heated chamber because some corp owns that "idea"
>>28640825
>If it wasn't for SBR laws those would be a HUGE market for home defense, especially if suppressors were available.
Seriously, this. Imagine an America where every household has a suppressed SBR in 9mm, or (and this actually makes my penis feel funny) a suppressed SBR in 10mm. Can the world even handle that much freedom?
>>28641487
Imagine a world in which the AA-12 was available
>>28641559
Sounds polite
>>28637689
>Exactly how badly has small arms technology been retarded by legislation?
Honestly if we didn't have the NFA, the most common HD gun would probably integrally suppressed PDWs and Subguns.
>>28637689
$260 grease guns are the most common firearm in America
You'd have more options for nice backpack guns when innawoods. Up here in Canada we can get 12 inch barreled lever rifles with full stocks, or 12 inch shotguns similarly stocked. With the US market in play, there'd be more manufacturers and more innovative models. You'd be able to get modern Marble's Game Getters with 12 inch barrels for survival situations.
>>28641582
Can anyone explain why certain features and certain types of guns are so demonized, while others are not? It all just seems so arbitrary. Was there a logic behind it when these laws were passed?
>>28638430
>>28640836
So theoretically let's say I'm retarded and need this explained to me. What does suppressed have to do with the hazard to people? Is it penetration or velocity or something?
>>28641941
The noise anon. Guns are really loud. Firing one in basically makes you and every one nearby temporarily deaf, especially if you're inside a building or something.
Actually I'm kind of wondering why they aren't more common on military equipment.
Severe lack of high explosive bullets due to treaty.
>>28641859
Yeah, it's called prohibition.
>>28637759
Open bolt guns are trash anyway, the open bolt just means that your gun gets filled with debris. The only advantage is that they are a simpler design.
NOTE: I don't think that open bolt firearms should be illegal, I'm only saying that a ban on open bolt guns isn't retarding small arms development because open bolt is long outdated.
>>28642056
So basically the press making Tommy guns scary?
Is all this shit just the result of yellow journalism?
>>28642131
That, and people watching too many Hollywood movies. Why do you think shit like butterfly knives got banned?
>>28642131
I think what he is saying is the prohibition of alcohol. Prohibition during the 1920s created a huge black market and drove a lot of crime and violence. The NFA was an attempt to curb this violence, it failed miserably. The only way to stop the violence was to stop the market that was driving it, thus prohibition was repealed.
>>28642194
Then we did the exact same fucking thing in the eighties
>>28642194
>>28642273
And then as a cautionary tale, the failed laws that we put in place weren't repealed. Legislation rarely is.
>>28642194
This too
>>28642465
>implying it wasn't the plan all along
Why else would the CIA smuggle drugs into the US? Black market violence is a great way to get gun legislation passed, it worked during prohibition.
>>28637689
>that rotopology
As a 3D hobbyist, this kinda hurts
>>28637753
>2012
>not using hydraulics
>>28637759
>no open bolt guns
ATF never declared all open bolt guns to be easily convertible, only the tec9 and mac10/11 in open bolt configuration to be so.
>>28641559
The patent is long expired, all you need to do is make it semi-auto and not call it an aa-12.
>>28637759
Suppressors don't reduce recoil; they actually increase backpressure.
>>28641859
It all has to do with the 1934 National Firearms Act.
Suppressors are banned not because of human-oriented crime, but because of fears of poaching. Prior to 1934 the only confirmed use of a suppressor in a crime was when some men in New Jersey with suppressed rifles shot six horses and tried to extort the owner. Now bear in mind that 1 in 5 draftees in 1940 was turned away for malnutrition and you understand just how bad the situation was in the depression and the perceived threat that poaching would have on farmers, hence the need to ban suppressors.
Short barrel rifles and shotguns were partially banned as a means to a backdoor handgun ban, but also because poaching guns were usually short-barreled, and often could be disassembled quickly.
So yeah, most of the national firearms act was literally invented to make sure that starving people continued to starve instead of threatening farmer's business and "endangering our food supply."
>>28643041
This is hearsay but someone with an FFL mentioned to me a while back while you could technically build an open bolt semi auto and keep it Title 1, FTB won't approve any firearm as such for sale.
>>28643171
>Be me
>Be a farmer in the 30's
>Had to sell or slaughter most of my livestock to keep the fucking banks from shutting me down and seizing my property.
>Luckily I've retained some of my breeders, so I might get back in the game.
>Suddenly my horses start dropping around me
>confusedfarmer.telegram
>Turns out it's a pack of wild potato-niggers with suppressed carbines trying to scare money I don't have into their pockets.
>Feds arrest them, and ban suppressors to keep shit like this from happening to others.
>commie newspapers run a story about how greedy farmers are starving the masses by refusing to be bullied and extorted.
>mfw
>>28643171
Wasn't the SBR/SBS part a leftover from the proposed (and removed) handgun ban, so people wouldn't "circumvent" the law by using shortened rifles and shotguns?
>>28643559
Not that guy but as far as I am aware that's pretty much what happened. They tried to ban handguns and added in the SBR/SBS definitions before the handgun ban got shot down but they never were removed afterwards.
>>28643576
I fucking hate our law-making process.
>>28637759
>look how much engineering was wasted
That's an incredibly simplistic thing to say, it's not as if the people who designed muzzle breaks and flashiders (regardless of the your stupid assertation that that was a waste of time) would have been off engineering things you consider to be useful.
>>28643508
>Farmers
>accusing anyone else in the country of being communists
Boy howdy do I sure love paying for all of my food two times over
>>28643608
Pretty sure there are still uses for muzzle breaks.
>>28643094
the weight of a suppersor will reduce recoil
>>28637689
>>28643171
This country would be doing a lot better if it wasn't being held back by century-old legislation...
>>28640821
Is it really down to 6 months now? Was 9-10 last i heard.
>>28637689
Smart guns.
The reason smart guns have not been advanced by the gun industry is a New Jersey law. NJ passed a law saying a few years after smart guns become "commonly commercially available," they'll be required for all handguns. That law, if it's allowed to stand and pass into effect, will likely be used as a springboard for future gun regulation. First it'll be all guns, not just handguns. And then non-smartguns will need to be retrofitted. What's that, you can't or don't want to? Then they'll need to be deactivated. Oh, and we should let the government have a backdoor so they can jam smartguns, you know, to stop criminals and school shootings...
>>28645271
I don't believe this. You are telling me that the entire gun industry, down to the last company, have a gentleman agreement to not pursue this specific technology, and that there are no defectors.
Bull. If there is demand, someone will sell it. If the gun industry was this coordinated we wouldn't be having to deal with these laws in the first place.
>>28645271
The only "smart guns" i want are the Shadowrun variety.
>>28645271
oh god if they use rfid all the crooks will run around with jammers and the cops wouldn't even be able to fire at them.
>>28645502
well imagine wearing a glass that shows you with a crosshair where your gun is aimed at also shows the barrel temperature and approximate remaining barrel life and how many and what type of round in the mag if safety is engaged or not...
yeah it's cool.
>>28645476
Do you really want to be the company that fucked over an entire state out of common handguns and rifles?
>>28645594
>this
It's very much an image game, some people still refuse to buy ruger because of the shit Bill spewed.
Especially with front end costs for equipment and the amount of money that it takes to tool for production, its a lot cheaper to start second hand and produce whats already at market.
At that point if you're profitable there's not much incentive to innovate.
>>28641559
>long stroke
It's shit.
>>28643508
>government then buys all your food & dumps it in the ocean to "keep prices stable"
>This same government then starts a world war
Thanks FDR
fucking commie
>>28645594
> mfw I get special legislation passed to subsidize companies to produce "anti school shooting lock" guns
> mfw I'm the only company that gets the pork because the rest of the industry has "ethics"
> mfw butthurt funlovers are meanies to me on the internet
> mfw still no 2nd American Revolution
> mfw I was a patriot all along and was just trying to get my countrymen to rise up
> I'm so disappointed with you all.
> mfw fuck it, I'm Oprah rich
>>28645476
http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2014/06/24/325178305/a-new-jersey-law-thats-kept-smart-guns-off-shelves-nationwide
>>28646178
Smart guns are a technology seeking to solve a problem that doesn't exist.
Nobody wants a bunch of electronic garbage that can make their gun not work when we already have cheaper and reliable methods of accomplishing the same objectives.
>>28646178
Thanks, interesting article. Kinda raises more questions though. If I was the German company who manufactures the Semitic iP1, I would simply open a gun store (or pay an unscrupulous American to) that sells it. Boom, instant state wide monopoly for my product. Why hasn't this happened yet?
>>28646340
Since when do gun laws have any relationship to practicality, reason or ethics?
>>28645271
This is the only smart gun that matters.
>>28637689
If you count rampant unilateral action faggotry by the ATF as 'legislation', Gyrojet.
>>28645502
>>28645271
>>28646178
I wish they made robot guns and robot war machines that were so smart they could vote and had AI that was programmed to be proud republican americans.
Like Liberty Prime, and all weapon laws would be dismissed as discrimination. Also we could create a new sentient /k/ube and make it an avatar of our god.
>>28646463
Wait, gyrojets are illegal? I thought they were just impractical.
>>28637689
open bolt guns would be more popular
>>28646375
>Why hasn't this happened yet?
Because it pisses off a lot of gun owners and actively hurts the gun industry.
>>28646816
They were .51 caliber originally and got defined as destructive devices in the 1968 GCA, so the company had to retool everything for ..49 caliber
>>28642567
But anon, the FAQ on the CIA's website told me they have never smuggled drugs!
