What's wrong with EOtech exactly?
>>28594011
Thermal Drift and a few other things they failed not notify consumers about.
Nothing for you and me.
But they lied about their product and are facing the repercussions.
They lied.
>>28594034
>20" shift at 100yds
>Total loss of nitrogen in a month
>Nothing
>>28594011
you tell me
>>28594047
>Russians
So, I'm dumb but what are the difference in all their models, besides size
>>28594037
people died
>>28594083
their mothers cried
>>28594073
what is your point?
Russian make some fine glass
>>28594086
then got cream pied
>>28594044
http://soldiersystems.net/2015/09/30/ussocom-issues-safety-use-message-eotech-enhanced-combat-optical-sights-plus-goings/
looks like it's just a few models? seems like their most popular (the 512) is not affected
>>28594103
i dont know what this is but i need it..
>>28594103
It's not at all surprising that Russians would break an Eotech.
And if Russian glass is so great why did their SF choose Eotech over domestic?
>>28594103
What is the name of that?
I WANT that. No i NEED that!
>>28594011
>charging $500 for a tier one oper8r holosight
>doesn't hold nitrogen
>doesnt hold laminate for reticle display
>doesnt even hold zero
Eokeks will defend this.
My L3 check cannot show up soon enough.
>>28594081
Battery cases, size, subtly different reticles, NV capability, built in QD systems.
>>28594133
>didn't read most important document
http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/United-States-v.-L-3-Communications-Eotech-Inc.-et-al.pdf
They are all affected, this is a legacy issue that has persisted since 2006.
>>28594184
Then how come we have not heard more about it?
How come Russian SF (Who operate in the temperature shifts that supposedly cause the most obvious problems) use them so much?
Why has this not been a common issue in reviews?
How come nobody from SOF has brought this up before for causing lethal errors in marksmanship?
>>28594201
It's fresh news as of like a month ago, m8.
>>28594168
Cool, thanks man.
>>28594201
>How come nobody from SOF has brought this up before
They have been, for years. You eocucks just kept shouting LALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!
>>28594142
>>28594161
BI-focal sight EE 13,5х14 u
>>28594143
only the special force operator, who can use the gear they buy use Eotech
so they chose the most expensive and whiely use optic over domestic one
>>28594223
PROOFS!
>>28594214
If it has been an issue since 2006 then how come nobody has come out and said "These fucking suck and are going to get people killed"?
>>28594243
Because it's being dramatically overblown.
>>28594243
>These fucking suck and are going to get people killed
Why didn't you listen?
>>28594228
>BI-focal sight EE 13,5х14 u
any shop shipping to west europe selling this beauty?
>>28594201
>Then how come we have not heard more about it?
Eotech themselves admitted to the problem and it's only open news now.
>How come Russian SF (Who operate in the temperature shifts that supposedly cause the most obvious problems) use them so much?
Because they got lied to as well.
>Why has this not been a common issue in reviews?
Reviewers are generally fat, lazy bastards who don't know much about guns and certainly aren't willing to do an actual controlled battery or tests in freezing temps.
>How come nobody from SOF has brought this up before for causing lethal errors in marksmanship?
They have, it was just under the radar until now and SOF don't generally have any obligation to discuss their going ons with the public.
I have a strange feeling it was only the milspec ones that had the issue, cause I've spoken with a number of people in the gun retail business and they've never heard of any issues with EOTechs, and they also recommend them over Aimpoints, particularly for the advantage in visibility.
>>28594201
they use it because Eotech is the most pride optic in the market
their life defend on the optic, and those weren't cheap. and as seen in >>28594047 one broke
>>28594247
Eocuck spotted. Is your optic running? Because the nitrogen is getting away!
>>28594271
Hell no, I sent that fucker in for a profit.
>>28594124
It was a bad time....
>>28594266
>I'm going to disregard what the actual manufacturer has admitted about their product and listen to these fat ass gun store experts instead
Pls tell me that was a poor attempt at bait.
>>28594258
i think some belarus or kazakhstan company would ship Russia make optic to weast europe
and it isn't impossible to smuggle one
The optics cost nearly twice as much as the guns they are often put on.
>>28594306
http://fettershop.ru/index.php?route=product/product&path=25&product_id=13027
over 1100 USD is a lot of cash for a product of a company i know shit about... is it milspec quality ?
>>28594247
Pretty much this. /k/ loves to pick up on any defect in a product and act like it's undeniable proof the product is nothing but shit.
The truth is this won't affect 99% of the shooting public. If you like EOtechs go and buy one- I personally think they have the best CCO reticule out there- just be aware of the issues you may run into.
Inb4
>you're just an eotech fanboy
I use an eotech on my service rifle and it's just fine. On my personal rifle I use an Aimpoint micro, mostly because I could get it for cheaper then an eotech.
>>28594011
>EOtech lied
>Operators died
>>28594011
They got caught being lying sons of bitches but at least they are giving full refunds.
>>28594367
>Operators died
There is zero proof of that. I don't think anyone has even claimed it.
>>28594359
>I use an eotech on my service rifle and it's just fine
For now.
http://www.eotechinc.com/hws-service-and-support/troubleshooting
>>28594359
I still wouldn't want to buy one unless there's a possibility the faulty ones are resold at a cheaper price. How likely is that going to happen?
>>28594286
To be alive.....
>>28594352
the company are trying to market it to the Force
the same optic was mount on this Zihamsh experimental rifle( the one on top) their other produce, the BI-focal sight EE 39×30 d have been seen operated with SF
> a company i know shit about
you should watch their promotion video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rJG08ht1AI
>>28594430
the BI-focal sight EE 39×30 d on a VKS-94 9x39 gun
>>28594228
where get in usa
>>28594397
>for now
I'm told there was a memo put out directing us to switch out our EOtechs till the issues got solved out. But seeing as how our armorers don't have enough Elcans to switch out everybody's optics, it hasn't really happened. I've kept mine because it's lighter, I like the reticle more, and nobody is making me change it yet.
>>28594415
Not a clue. I was kind of hoping prices would drop with all this coming out, but I haven't seen anything yet.
>>28594430
Nice thx
i like russian equipment and this scope looks great
>>28594276
how?
>>28594585
They ask you how much you paid.
Mark down MSRP.
>>28594336
>The optics cost nearly twice as much as the guns they are often put on.
If you seriously think this is something bad, I recommend selling all your guns, ammo and picking up another hobby.
well, what optic should i get instead? aimpoint?
I really liked the eotech holographic sight. big reticle made it easy to find my target quickly. low profile sides kept my peripheral vision open
>>28594745
>big reticle made it easy to find my target quickly
>preferring noisy as fuck reticles
>>28594745
I love my Comp M3. But I also loved my EOTech. So take it with a grain of salt.
Eotechs are good fun and easy to use but they aren't so reliable when abused and the effects are latent. I put one on my benelli M4 and it were great for about a year. Then my asshole friend dropped it when he borrowed it for 3 gun. It worked fine for 2 months after than and then it ceased to function entirely.
Still bought another since they are stupid easy to use.
>>28594368
>giving full refunds
More like taking your junk and shafting you when they declare bankruptcy.
Has anyone actually seen a refund yet?
http://www.schweitzeroptics.com/bi-focal/product/eagle-eye-35
>>28594986
Many have.
>>28594986
been 3 weeks since I shipped... no response
>>28595026
I hate to be "that guy", but...
CITATION NEEDED
I see many people who got authorization and returned it in early Dec still haven't actually received anything. I am unable to find any thread or blog post or other indication (other than your comment) that anyone has received a refund yet.
>>28595105
No actual refund yet, but I got this a couple days ago.
>>28594265
>Because they got lied to as well.
I'm sure if the thermal drift is such a problem they would have noticed and dropped it by now.
>>28595181
So you got promises in exchange for your sight, neat.
>Hey, I got some magic beans for trade if you got an AR15
>Or a cow
>>28595418
That's something I'm interested in, they definitely go to the temp extremes that cause the problems.
>>28594011
It's trash
ACOG ALL DAY NIGGA!
>>28595530
larry vickers pls go and stay go
>>28595535
I hate that fucker so god damn much.
>>28595478
We'll see in a few days, mang.
>>28594011
They're fucking garbage m8. Loss of zero in high or low temps, nitrogen leaks, delaminating holographic array etc.. Total shit and anyone who owns one should send it back for a full refund before they out tits up.
>>28595845
>days
More like weeks or months.
We should have listened.
>>28595921
>January 15
Yeah, boy you sure have been waiting a long time.
>>28595535
>larry vickers
Someone that is that big of a fuckup making it in Delta gives me hope
>>28595478
Reports like that are slow honestly, let's face it, russian special ops types aren't REALLY special ops types, they just make a few propaganda videos and don't even have enough training to raid a building and kill specific targets.
Likely they wouldn't go outside in extreme conditions to train save for maybe once in a blue moon, and any errors caused by drift may just be chalked up to being cold and shaky.
>>28594011
Law Enforcement Only.
>>28594688
>optics being nearly prohibitively expensive is a good thing
No.
>Gun ownership is a hobby
Yuropoor detected. Gun ownership and weapons ownership in general is the right of any man. If you decide to take that responsibility then practicing with your firearm is what's important. Upgrades being so expensive that it's almost not worth indulging in is worth complaining about.
>>28594359
It wont be long till the COC says you are not permitted to use this on your weapon.
I had one too. Its tough when you like something to admit its bad. But you need to junk it and get your refund, it might one day fail you on combat.
>>28596957
Luckily I didn't pay for it, it's our issued optic. Beyond that like I said, they just don't have enough other optics to replace everybody's right now.
As for failure, well worse comes to worse I've got back up irons, and a LA-5 that I'm using most of the time anyway.
They don't hold zero with temperature changes.
Battery life can be terrible. I hear they start good enough, but eventually start eating batteries fairly quickly.
While they aren't exactly frail like cheap optics, they aren't tough as nails like an Aimpoint.
It hasn't been a huge deal up until a few months ago. Because Bribes? Because the issues described are worst case scenarios, while actual field use isn't quite as severe. I guess SOF really wouldn't want to go around telling everyone their shit sucks. Maybe they just replace the shit after every mission?
As far as a range or home defense gun, I'd say that an EOtech would be fine. You likely aren't going to expose it to enough abuse to affect it. At home defense ranges, you should still be on target even if you experience the max drift. You don't have 100 yard hallways, do you?
If you are in the market for a good red dot, I'd go with Aimpoint, Meprolight, and Trijicon before EOTech. Some people really like the EOtech reticule. It is cool I guess, if it shows up in the right spot. Or a all.
>>28594228
how similiar are these to IOR bucharest
I've honestly never had a problem with my 512 I got in 2007 but then again I'm not running it in extreme combat conditions. I have had it out shooting in sub freezing for a few hours only to go right into a 70 degree house a few times with no ill effects. POI has never really changed more than an inch or two at 100 rested. Maybe I'm just lucky, idk.
I had a 552 delaminate just sitting in my safe with the occasional trips to the range on a sunny 65° days.
>>28594228
>>28594103
Holy... this shit is amazing.
>>28594011
They fail in unrealistically extreme conditions that you'll never subject them to.
>>28597466
like 50% ambient humidity
>>28597466
Or sitting in your house for a month and letting all the nitrogen purging leak out.
>>28597466
Or zeroing outside in winter then using it for HD
Or using it in the rain
Or zeroing it in the sun on a hot day then shooting it at night
>>28597520
>>28597546
>>28597748
literally none of that has ever happened.
>>28597784
well the humidity is relative, your mileage may vary
>>28597784
The company tested their own sights, report said 100% nitrogen loss on about a month.
>>28597811
Yeah, after unrealistic temperatures, like going -70 below to 120 F in a day.
>>28594011
Haloscopes were so 2006.
>>28597866
No, just from sitting
>>28594430
At first I thought it was kind of cool. Then I saw that promo...
>>28598032
This is of course why all EOtechs become useless after a month.
>>28598235
>Nitrogen loss == broken
Do you even own a fucking firearm?
>>28598254
>nitrogen loss == moisture intrusion
Do you even own any electronics?
I have an Eotech 554 that I purchased from a guy who lives in my neighborhood. I've had it for 6 years and it's still going strong. My friend accidentally dropped it off my second level and it held zero. I don't abuse my equipment but I figure that's a decent drop test.
On another note, I can't seem to find much about the 554 model. It takes AA's, looks like a 512 but is NV compatible.
This thread makes me not want to ever sell it though:
https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=511379
pic related
>>28595921
Iranian spotted.
>>28594994
wow. It's 2500 dollaridoos, but still
>>28594422
Their stock took a dive
>>28594430
>That promo video
SO BAD IT'S GOOD
>>28598781
Yeah, the company is dead.
>>28594228
>BI-focal sight EE 13,5х14 u
Where the hell do you find this.
>>28599812
Not even close. L3 is a massive company. EOTech is a tiny itty bitty brand that they own compared to their larger ventures.
Also, if I include Sales Tax do you think they'd cover that?
MSRP on an XPS2-0 is $539. $529.99 + $0.07/$ Sales Tax is $567.08. Thinking I may just put that down.
>>28595181
Same here, received friday
>>28599940
I gave them the value I paid, including tax shipping. They didn't ask me for any proof of purchase, they just send me an approval email.
>>28598781
now is the time to buy
>>28600394
Good show. Since they only allow whole dollar amounts on the return form $570 it is.
So what, under Description of Failure just put "Lawsuit"?
>>28595933
Shipped them off December 11th, it took Eokeks that long to send a confirmation email.
So yeah, been waiting for a minute.
>>28598663
Um, no?
>>28600483
My understanding is that they're literally getting trucks, with an s, full of returns daily. It's gon' be a hot second.
>>28600511
Yep, they're probably buried up to their asses in them.
I'm guessing q4 of 2016 before anyone sees anything, if at all.
>>28600464
Mine delaminated, so I put that down as the reason along with a note that researching my problem lead me to the reports that they don't have a permanent fix and plz gib refund.
The only reason I waited so long was I wanted to fit another optic before I gave the eotech up. My fear is that they accept all these returns and scrap the aluminum for cash, then declare bankruptcy. I've already pretty much written it off, but I would like to get my money back.
If they do release and updated product and someone can show that they've fixed the problem. I would probably buy another.
>>28594011
price vs. what you get. Would really only be worth it if i could drop the rifle onto the optic from shoulder height and still have a functioning, zeroed sight.
>>28596439
>BI-focal sight EE 13,5х14 u
You are delusional at best, and completely fucking retarded at worst.
>>28600534
So long as I get it, I mean I could use more practice with my irons anyway. I've been spoiled with the optic. And realistically I could see a couple month wait though, probably not a full year though.
>>28600551
I beat mine to hell and back because I'd assumed it could take it. It's on my brush gun and while I know a lot of this probably won't effect me I'd rather not give it the chance to. Been considering replacing it anyway and figured this was my chance to get something more than $300 for it.
Also, I'm pretty sure if L-3 for some reason shuts down EOTech (which I don't see happening) they'll be forced to reimburse people directly. L-3 owns chunks of Lockheed and Raytheon is memory serves. They aren't gonna go down any time soon.
>>28600775
Wrong person?
Aimpoint needs to release a line of red dots with BDCs like EOtechs have.
>>28600534
It's not going to take that long. I sent mine in late December and got a confirmation email that my refund was being processed a few days ago. I'm thinking 30-60 days max.
>>28595062
>tfw they are reselling them all on foreign markets to get one last big executive bonus before they chapter 7
>>28601899
>Post YFW they all go to Russia
>>28594011
Cost more than the gun most people put them on
>eotech
>the second most popular non-mag'd sight in use, period
>literally millions of them out there
>no one could figure out this issue for over a decade
>took a lawsuit by SOF doing extreme testing like zeroing the optic in the arctic and bringing it to the desert and seeing it if holds zero
>ignoring the fact no optic holds zero in extreme temperature changes because many reasons including literally the laws of physics
I have heard many examples of people saying "If you leave it in your truck on a hot day it'll lose zero" despite this situation occurring every single day for the past ten years on countless duty weapons, not a single fuck on AR15 thought to do any "tests" on these optics for an issue that is reportedly so common it could happen if you sneeze.
So, basically, for the average person in average use? eotechs are most likely fine. There are real issues with eotechs that are bigger than this, like the delamination, the 552's destroying themselves by turning the AA's into battering rams under recoil, the loss of brightness making them useless on sunny or snowy days, poor battery life, and others.
If you still owned an eotech before the lawsuit, you should still continue to own it. You hve all these other, tested, common knowledge issues you have accepted, the circumstances in the lawsuit will quite literally never affect you.. Your HD Weapon will not go 100 MOA off target and be useless because you set your thermostat to 76 instead of 72.
I'm keeping mine cause I got them cheap.
>>28602412
>Your HD Weapon will not go 100 MOA off target and be useless because you set your thermostat to 76 instead of 72.
Nobody has even implied that.
>>28603084
Good, then we agree the sight works then!
>>28603093
Yeah, it's great for airsoft and russians that can't hit anything anyway.
>>28603108
>implying
I know you want to make others believe your Sega is better than your Nintendo, but what we adults do is simply buy both if we want both.
>>28594228
Here is the modern version
https://www.leupold.com/hunting-shooting/scopes/d-evo/d-evo/
they suck
>>28604077
>putting reddot above a scope
>modern
i don't understand the hype about this, Trijicon did that with their ACOG and micro reddot
>>28605229
You can see through both at the same time though
>>28605577
>they aim at the same place
Zeroing is literally witchcraft
>>28604077
>>28605577
WTF am i looking at, the pictures on the site dont shoe the dot sight on the scope, am i missing somthing? sold separately?
>>28594228
I literally need this.
Who actually manufactures this?
>>28605839
Gotta buy them niggases seperate.
So $10,000,000,000.
>>28604077
yeah that's not a bi-focal scope, that's just two optics stacked on top of each other
>>28594994
this is an actual bi-focal
>>28594994
did ROS sell their brand name?
>>28605839
>sold separately
total they're about 3300 or so.
I love mine, unfortunately I purchased it a week or two before the drama started. I don't think that issue will ever change my opinion on the optic though.
Honestly I'd take an EOTech over a PRO or MRO.
theres aimpoint, then theres everything else
