Strategic Airlifting
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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
How come Euros are so shit at at?
Can it really be as simple as underfunding and overreliance on the U.S.?
Are developments like pic related turning things around?
Tactical airlift maybe. You aren't really increasing your strategic airlift capabilities with a few A400's. The US is far, far beyond the rest of the world in terms of airlift capabilities. Europe has good platforms..the A400 is great. However, they lack the numbers and strategic hubs. Which is why when a lot of European militarys often need the US to help airlift them into combat zones.
>>28560838
>Which is why when a lot of European militarys often need the US to help airlift them into combat zones.
And the Russians, they did alot of the lifting for France in Mali.
Most European military forces are focused on homeland defense and don't have strategic interests in being able to deploy forces across continents.
>>28560953
I don't think so. You have a source for that?
>>28560986
>and don't have strategic interests in being able to deploy forces across continents.
And yet they do, constantly.
>>28560953
Maybe commercial Il-76s but not Russian Air Force
>>28560953
>And the Russians, they did alot of the lifting for France in Mali.
I think you'll find RAF means Royal Air Force, not Russian Air force.
>>28561031
NATO has a SALIS agreement with some Ukrainian companies that operate the An-124. For example, the US utilized the An-124 to move battle damaged Strykers from the AOR because they have cranes and it's a lot more feasible than putting them on 436L pallet trains.
>>28561031
It was An-124s from Volga-Dnepr. Saem company that lifted the S-400s into Syria.
>>28561018
>Can it really be as simple as underfunding and overreliance on the U.S.?
Search your heart, anon. You know it is true.
>>28560699
When will Americans realise there is no big bogeyman out to get them? You don't need a huge overfunded bloated military.
Why is Europe so shit at strategic airlift? Because we spend our money on healthcare, education, public transport and debt free university for our citizens.
>>28561058
>with some Ukrainian
Volga-Dnepr is Russian based and owned company, don't now why its played up as 'Ukrainian and Russian'
>>28561118
Well this is some tasty bait.
>free university
Lmao, my bank disagrees
t. euro
>>28561116
>>28561118
What is deterrence? What is geopolitical standing? Why do you think the USD is the #1 reserve currency? Who protects global shipping lanes? Who launches satellites that has GPS that you use?
No, I should be impressed by the free healthcare and money you throw at the mudshit hordes pouring into your borders raping your women while your countries become more and more irrelevant.
>>28561136
Could be because Antonov is a Ukranian company and Antonov Airlines also performs NATO airlift.
>>28561151
posting this only shows your lack of understanding of modern diplomacy and interdependece. there is zero benefit for russia in invading europe, it would only bankrupt them even if there was zero resistance.
americans wil never understand this, they are indoctrinated from birth to fear foreign invasion and so they actively alienate the whole world with their hostile foreign policy.
>>28561234
Russia just took land from one of the few non NATO countries in Europe. Russia doesn't touch you because you are protected by daddy USA.
>>28561234
How convenient you forget it was because of the USA that the Russians stopped their rampage across Europe.
>>28561293
Russia took eastern Ukraine because of the strategic position of Sevastopol, there are also ex soviet factories near the border that contained tooling for aircraft/tanks; just like how Georgia had ex soviet factories for Su25s
>>28561118
How's that working out for you, Mohammed?
>>28561293
Russia would lose badly if they tried to invade Western Europe, even without the help of the U.S.
Even with their anemic budgets, the Entente alone outspends Russia.
Strategic airlift is mostly a meme
Far cheaper to drive or boat things
C-5 bro here
>>28561156
>No, I should be impressed by the free healthcare and money you throw at the mudshit hordes pouring into your borders raping your women while your countries become more and more irrelevant.
Holy shit you need to stop reading and listening to US propaganda
>>28561420
Yes, boat things into Afghanistan.
>>28561441
Have you been living under a rock?
>>28561405
Why is Saudi Arabia spending so much on defense? Is it to give to Isis? Or defense against Iran?
>>28561468
Because delicious American toys.
>>28561466
You boat things to pakistan and drive them in
Or rail through russia
this is how they got most of the shit there.
>>28560953
That was an Ukrainian private contractor.
>>28561513
Except when Pakistan shut off the borders and the US had to airlift most shit into Afghanistan. Also, planes don't get hit by IED's, and they don't get ambushed.
You airlift important shit and move casual shit on train or boat.
>>28561545
Defend your convoys and patrol the road, then they don't get ambushed or IED'd either.
There was zero reason to be in afghanistan in the first place.
>Except when Pakistan shut off the borders
This was only temporary.
>>28561437
that's really fucking cool
>>28561543
Volga-Dnepr supplied most if not all of the aircraft, I cant actually find any sorties flown by Antonov Airlines.
AnA was mainly included due to political reasons.
>>28560699
Because most of them don't have any aims to expeditionary warfare to "need" it.
Thats why the UK is the only EU country with any strategic lift ability at all, with their 8 C-17's, because they have huge emphasis on expeditionary operations to anywhere on the globe.
>>28560699
We have to fly across the ocean or take a long ass sea voyage. Euro militaries are small and mainly for Euro defense and can be moved by train.
>>28561466
No I've been living in the UK
>>28561405
>Russia would lose badly if they tried to invade Western Europe, even without the help of the U.S.
Actually in their current state they would easily steamroll everyone until the Rhine where they would first encounter actual resistance from teh French. However, this is not because of the Russian's growing capability but more of the sad state of central Europe's militaries.
>Even with their anemic budgets, the Entente alone outspends Russia.
money != military capability, this lesson is pretty much hammered into everyone's heads time and time again.
>>28561787
Doubt france would last more than 2 weeks, and only because russia had overly long supply lines.
>>28560699
I worked on that plane :)
Airbus operates with all of the inefficiency and coordination of five nations speaking different languages. It's pretty bad.
>>28561584
>Patrol the road, then no IED's
Holy shit this post
>>28561787
Europe has four times the population and seven times the economy of russia. On top of that it has a higher military spending, a bigger air force, bigger navy, more soldiers .....
Europe doesnt need America for protection, stop using us for your masturbation fantasies.
>>28561725
Oh ok. You just live in a 3rd world shithole filled with muslims.
>>28562026
?
Which part is incorrect?
>>28562027
As much as the Jews in charge of the EU would like to make it, Europe isn't one big country. Yet.
>>28561381
> Russia wants something that belongs to another country.
> That country lies tragically out of reach of America.
> Russia takes what it wants.
Let America cut back its military spending, and see how long Europe gets to keep things that are of strategic value to Russia.
>>28562050
The part where patrolling roads magically eliminates IED's.
You must be a some fucking idiot if you think sending a patrol once a day will stop people from planting IED's, and that any military has the manpower to consistently man every single viewpoint of every vehicular logistics route.
>>28562201
Build a fence along both sides of the road
Don't allow pedestrains on it
24/7 drone coverage
Don't allow locals to dig it up & rebuild it with mines under the road
You think counter insurgency has never been done before or is unwinnable?
>>28562244
I never said it hasn't been done and isn't unwinnable. I said they are going to blow some of your shit up. Your suggestion is a fence (which they can cut and blow up too), not allowing pedestrians which is a great way to get people to like you during an insurgency, 24/7 drone coverage which is not happening, and not allowing locals it dig up dirt which is exactly the point of IED laying in the first place.
Tard convention is on >>>/b/ I suggest you head over.
>>28561441
Then explain what happened when those Pakis raped all those kids, and weren't arrested for the longest time because people thought it would be racist to do so. Having been to the UK, I'm not overly impressed with what you have. It's functioning yes, but not a marked improvement over us.
>>28561118
Ever heard of deterrence and the phrase "speak softly, and carry a big stick"? Granted I do think that we should stop waving the big stick a bit and have a thorough re-appraisal of our foreign affairs and military procurements, it currently serves our interest to have a damn big military.
>>28561234
Well the whole world already hates us and always will, so I doubt that bending over and being cucks like you Euros is going to help much. I will enjoy watching the EU eventually fall apart.
>>28562027
>Europe has four times the population and seven times the economy of russia. On top of that it has a higher military spending, a bigger air force, bigger navy, more soldiers .....
Nazi Germany did well with similar odds before Russia got its shit together and Murica came to the rescue...
>>28561041
France used Russian commercial cargo planes for operation in Mali.
>>28562244
>Don't allow pedestrians on it.
So your plan is to constantly maintain physical security over every inch of road you will be using?
You don't think that might be a little hard?
>>28560699
The A400M is such a shitshow. If it weren't for protectionism forcing them to buy EADS gear they would have bought AN-70s and had a better product.
>>28561234
>implying Russians don't want to recreate the war saw pact and unite eastern europe under the guise of pan slavism.
Stay delusional.
>>28561543
Volga-Dnepr is a Russian company.
>>28561441
>Holy shit you need to stop reading and listening to US propaganda
It's hilarious that it is always the yurocucks that whine about US propaganda when it is the yuros that all have state run media unlike the USA.
>>28561234
>NATO requires all member to spend 2% of GDP on defense
>The only country to do this is the USA which spends 6% of GDP
>UK spend 3% of GDP during Cold War but no longer
>France and UK want to kill Gaddafi
>Can't do it on their own so they drag USA along
Nah, the only clueless person here is you.
>>28564221
>>28562305
> which is a great way to get people to like you during an insurgency
yea i'm sure so many people in iraq and afghanistan love the fucking US right now
Right?
But I'm sure letting troops get blown up will eventually win their hearts & minds...
You know that people have fought counter insurgencies and won before? Unlike the US who only loses counter insurgencies, because they relentlessly bomb & kill civilians until the whole country hates them.
>>28562350
>because people thought it would be racist to do so
no, it was because there were also rapists and paedos in the council who were complicit with the pakis.
>>28564279
>NATO requires all member to spend 2% of GDP on defense
>The only country to do this is the USA which spends 6% of GDP
You do realise that the UK, Greece, Estonia and Poland all spend over 2% as well, right? They alongside the US are the only ones to do it.
>>28560699
>How come Euros are so shit at at?
>Strategic Airlifting
We have very little need to transport shit halfway around the world.
And when we do we just use civilian transport to do it.
>>28566308
>Greece
I think you mean German banks.
>>28567705
>shots fired
>>28564279
The Tories are in in Bong land, while ever they stay in defense spending will grow inline with deficit reduction.
Tories grow the defense and economy, Labor are the lunatics taking over the asylum
>>28561441
>Holy shit you need to stop reading and listening to US propaganda
No, fellow Britbongistanian, you need to pull your head out of your leftist arse.
Rotherham was covered up for fear of "Rasicm"
Arab men coming forwards to report the crimes where told to go away or face charges
The girls where treated as though they where soliciting sex
A man has been convicted of sexually assaulting 2 children, the 2nd child was deemed by the judge to be particularly egregious as the child was a Mudslime resulting in an increased sentence.
Surveys of the social mobility of Britain show that poor white boys and girls below the poverty line are the least likely demographic to escape the poverty line in there life times
Now with all this happening in a nation where we are being criticized across Europe for not pulling our weight with the migrant problem, how do you think it's actually going in Germany where they are still tiptoeing around war-guilt and live in a PC society where they self police for any possible bad thoughts that could even look slightly, maybe, possibly Right-wing in any way and you have Cologne and Strasbourg coming to light despite the Police's best attempts to down play and outright lie about the truth, and the politicians who should be defending their citizens, what did they say? Don't dress provocatively and keep a safe distance.
That's right, the solution to an Immigrant filled rape crisis is give up the rights that are inherent in a liberal society and live in perpetual fear that you might offend the delicate sensibilities of Ahmed.
Just think of this if you think voting Jeremy Stalbyn into power
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money"
>>28561151
PRIVYET
R
I
V
Y
E
T
>>28560699
No requirement. Same as why every argument is made. No point having such good airlift when you aren't actively fighting in wars outside of minor skirmishes.
>>28560699
Why would they need it? Most of the fighting today is on the same continent.
>>28561437
>>28561615
C5 and C17 are top tier transport aircraft.
>>28564221
why are there so many blades in those props? i thought that the less there are blades in a prop the more efficient it is.
>>28569356
More efficient is not he same as more effective.
>>28561468
Probably their impending war with Iran. They seem pretty serious about this shit.
Saudis and their pocket terrorist vs Iranians and their pocket terrorists seems like an interesting war.
>>28569356
>i thought that the less there are blades in a prop the more efficient it is.
Any truth in this relationship is entirely indirect. Larger-diameter props have lower disc loading and thus have better peak efficiency, but for various reasons an enormous diameter might be unfavorable (ground clearance, parasite friction at high forward airspeeds, etc.). With a restricted-diameter prop, a higher blade count and more numerous blades increase the thrust and torque coefficients (i.e. more thrust per RPM, and more torque and power required per RPM), allowing the propeller to absorb and deliver more horsepower and thrust. RPM is restricted obviously by sonic effects on the prop.
HOWEVER, if diameter is unrestricted, using a larger-diameter prop with fewer blades is a more favorable way of increasing power absorption and thrust.
>>28561018
As long as America cannot keep its dick in its pants, yes.
>>28564279
>NATO requires all member to spend 2% of GDP on defense
>The only country to do this is the USA which spends 6% of GDP
You're such a fucking liar
>>28561615
My nigga. anyone on here avionics?
>>28571081
My dad works for GE's avionics division.
I'm just an attorney.
>>28569978
Why doesn't the U.S just go full imperialist and spend 10% of gdp on military? yolo
>>28560699
The Prussian and German warmachines from last century would weep over the Germans lack of military capabilities. I mean they use goddamn broomsticks for live fire exercises.
>>28568494
C-17s are far superior. They don't break all the time like the fat old whale.
>>28571400
Everything on the c-17 is new af. Most problems are solved by pulling and pushing circuit breakers and remove and replacing, at least in the avionics world.
>>28571125
I bet he's very well paid assuming he's been working in the field for a while.
>>28571661
>Everything on the c-17 is new af.
Damn right, I work with them all the time. They're not a headache to load unlike the C-5s and C-130s which have limitations depending where in the cargo bay something is going to go.
>>28568334
Speed. A plane can get something somewhere within a few hours whereas it would take days or maybe even weeks to go by land
>>28562244
I got a better idea:
>Load shit on planes
>Fly it directly to where you need it
>>28571400
How much did the M improve everything breaking when it was turned on?
>>28562244
Won't work. Hearts and minds bullshit only works on rational people, not crazed commie jungle gooks and religious zealots. Mongols got it right, just kill everyone until people get the memo and stop resisting. (except even they couldn't beat the Vietnamese, so they're probably just best avoided altogether)
>>28571740
Interdatsing, I always felt bad for everyone who had c-130's they had to safety wire everything on it. You a load master?
>>28571740
Well loading and building cargo are two different things. I assume you are a porter. Herc's are easy because you need 1 60 at most.
