What is the best military attack helicopter and why ?
Seems like the tiger is overpriced.
Whatever the latest Apache variant is
the British longbow probably had an edge for a while, but the latest US.Army ones are better
>>27931032
It really comes down to engine and weapons design
and Europe laggs behind the US and Russia in both, really i cant think of any rreasons to take an Tiger over an Apache
As far as best, Mi-28, Ka-50 or Apache
>>27931032
Stealth Apache
So that's what I thought, the tiger is an expensive flying shit
>>27931142
This is the correct answer.
OUTTA THE WAY, BEST CHOPPER COMIN THROUGH INFIDELS
1. Tiger
2. Comanche
.
.
.
5. Ka-50
6. Mi-24
.
.
.
10. AH-1Z
.
.
.
15. Mi-28
--
POWERGAP
--
EXTENDED POWERGAP
--
6 000 000. Apache
9 999 999. HAL LCH
---
POWERGAP
---
Googol. T129 ATAK
>>27931142
These helicopters are much more heavier than the Tiger and thus require more powerful engines.
>>27931357
...ok, and?
>>27931350
kill yourself
>>27931032
I think right now, the AH-64E is the top dog of attack helos. Composite rotor blades that increase speed and payload, ability to directly control UAVs, and loads and loads of datalinks so it essentially becomes its own communications hub. Also now has native naval strike capability and there's talk of replacing its Longbow radar with an AESA radar.
>>27931350
Accurate.
>>27931386
Apache is a flying tank tough and can't be compared to smaller guys like the Tiger/AH-1.
>>27931407
Um, OP's question was asking what was the best attack helo in general, not the best light attack helo. Capability-wise, the Apache Guardian is light years ahead of the Tiger and Cobra.
What about the Mangusta? Rooivalk? Nobody ever talks about them.
>>27931277
...why does everything they produce look like a prop from a bad '80s action movie?
>>27931446
>Italy
>South Africa
Though honestly, the Mangusta and Rooivalk seem like good budget western helos for smaller nations, but they pale in comparison to what the Apache and even the Tiger can do. Also, very, VERY limited exports. Mangusta is only used in Italy and Turkey and South Africa hasn't been able to find anybody that wants to buy the Rooivalk.
>>27931366
>...ok, and?
The "engine design" has absolutely nothing to do with a so-called technological gap.
>>27931366
>...ok, and?
>What is power to weight ratio
>>27931032
What does it matter you'll never fly or ride in one?
>>27931386
The E is also much, much quieter than previous models. Probably due to the composite rotor blades. You can't hear them from miles away anymore; depending on weather conditions, they can sound almost as quiet as a Cessna.
Source: I live under a major army helo flightpath, and have been watching/listening to them for over 30 years.
>>27931460
MEGAFORCE!
>>27931816
Maybe not.
I might be a pilot in french army...wich has tigers...
>>27931386
That and it's fully IFR capable, now.
>>27931460
Because their population doesn't know better and its mainly for propaganda.
>>27931460
Where do you think all those 80s action movies got their ideas from?
>>27931430
>Cobra
Old and busted, Viper is where its at. Nothing faster.
>>27931765
>Tiger has a higher power to weight ratio
>AH-64 and Mi-28 are still faster, carry more weaponry, climb faster and higher
Nice job Europe!
>>27931504
The Rooivalk is awfully expensive for what is mostly a Super Puma with a nice bodykit.
Someone post P ELITE's comparison chart.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vm83vfcm8Po
>>27932119
Tiger has twice the range of Apache and Mi-28.
Being few kh/h faster means shit for an attack helicopter.
Tiger can stay in the air two times longer and hover three times longer. And is harder to detect.
>>27931142
Apache is a lightweight piece of shit.
>>27931407
Literally Europoor: the list
Even as a slav i would rate the mi-28 far ahead of the Mi-24 and Ka-50
and what puts acapches and Mi-29ss on the tops of the list, its the ablitiy to actually penetrate tanks with their American/Russian ATGMs and the ablity to take fire
>>27933141
The Apache has a 300 mile combat radius. The Tiger doesn't have anywhere near double that.
>>27933141
>Tiger has twice the range
And only a third of the ammo capacity and can't carry heavy missiles on its outer points. Gee, it's almost like having fuck all ammo lets you be light or something.
Tiger is good at low intensity fights and hunting missile targets. But in a sustained conflict scenario it's going to be completely inadequate without time on station from lack of ammunition.
Read 'Apache' by Ed Macy. If Apache's with 1200 rounds of ammo were running dry in intense periods, you can imagine how Tigers with only 450 or something would get on.
Also take note that the Tiger achieves that range through not having a mast radar, which is a fucking massive oversight. Those ranges everyone loves to quote are only for the Tiger HAP, which is so lightly equipped that it doesn't even have the kit to launch Hellfires.
To use the range arguement is hilariously impotent. Shove heavy missiles, 1,200 rounds and associated gear with a mast radar onto a Tiger, lemme know what happens to that range.
>>27933229
It also doesn't have twice the range. He is just straight up wrong about that.
>>27933229
>Tiger is good at low intensity fights and hunting missile targets. But in a sustained conflict scenario it's going to be completely inadequate without time on station from lack of ammunition.
Why not use a Mi-28 or Apache, that actually have the range on their WEAPONs to pic off 3rd world tanks
and if you need good CAS, nothing beats an mi-24
>>27933141
https://www.airbushelicopters.com/website/docs_wsw/pdf/Tiger/TigerHAD-BR-0714E.pdf
> Max range “armed” with standard fuel tanks: 400 NM, 740 km
That's total range, not combat radius.
>>27933258
> and if you need good CAS, nothing beats an mi-24
Uh... what?
>>27933287
for just shooting at dirt famers with
It can take alot of abuse, and the yak-b is better versus flesh targets than some of the 30mm just for ammo capacity
>>27931504
>Rooivalk
Those niggers almost duped my country into buying one.
>>27933334
It literally carries around a ton of 100% worthless and unnecessary weight.
>>27933350
Malaysia?
>>27933354
Ton meaning a lot, not 2000 lbs. I should have used a different word.
>>27933354
>implying you cant use it to hold more ammunition instead of flying back to FOB
>implying transporting soilders is usless
europoors everyone
>>27933369
He does have a point. The big troop compartment makes the Mi-24 larger and heavier than it should be, and the engine isn't powerful enough to let it carry both weapons AND troops.
>>27933360
Yep
Though looking at the current threat, I'd rather have Super Tucano or even AC-295 gunship than any attack helicopter
>>27932882
Because the Rooivalk has a ton of specialized equipment for the dusty and sandy environment of South Africa. The Rooivalk would have been perfect for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan just for that reason alone.
>>27933390
>and the engine isn't powerful enough to let it carry both weapons AND troops.
Hence why it has big ass wings to generate lift.
>>27931032
As far as avionics goes i'm pretty sure the Apache takes it. The ability to control UAVs and use them for targeting is pretty amazing as well.
>>27933369
1) You can't use the space for more ammo.
2) It lacks the power to be used as a troop transport without SERIOUS limitations.
You'd know this if you weren't an uneducated nigger.
>>27933460
Which it has to constantly keep moving to maintain. The Mi-24 can't even hover under its own power. That's why it has to rely on low altitude strafing runs rather than pop up attacks that are standard for other attack helicopters.
>>27931880
You're not.
Faggot.
>>27933369
And how do you recommend getting that extra ammo out onto the hard points?
I'd pay to see you try and crawl out on the wing of a flying Hind with an armload of FFAR rockets and try to shove them into the launcher.
>>27931863
Huh. I used to work on Longbow Apaches and always found that the AVPU was the loudest thing about it.
Not like even the earlier models had the annoying, concussive rotor thump of a Huey to start with ofc.
>>27933879
the sound of Hueys is a lullaby for me, they always, always flew over my house at 5 PM, in a nice row formation.
in the winter, when it got dark early, there was an apocalypse now postal every day.
In any real shooting conflict, choppers are gonna be shot out of the sky in huge numbers
So cost/total numbers is a pretty relevant part of things.
>>27935057
only if you use them like a retard
>>27932882
U wot m8?
>>27933350
And you got what instead?
>>27935104
Right now, nothing. The air force is looking for both Mig-29 and Sea King replacement, so attack helicopter isn't a priority
Airbus been shilling hard on this though. Probably the best option considering the current threat we're facing
>>27935104
it IS true that the Rooivalk is a converted Super Puma, but that's not really any weird, considering the Hind is a Mi-8 conversion and the Cobra is an UH-1 conversion.
>>27931875
>>27933842
>And how do you recommend getting that extra ammo out onto the hard points?
jesus christ just land in a clearing a few km's away.
>>27931135
British have better operability seeing as they can operate from carriers
>>27935296
>Helicopter rearming manually by the crew.
>While hot
>Not at a FARP.
>>27931277
>7.62mm MG mounted in turret
Why? Would it not be possible to mount a GShG-7.62? Surely it wouldn't be too heavy.
>>27935378
Damn thing is the iranian version of Kiowa. Hell both of them came from the same lineage (Bell 206). Even Kiowa rely on gun pods
>>27931407
>flying tank tough
>Literally using gunner as additional armor for pilot.
>>27935594
>Guy in front getting way to into porn on his phone
>Guy in back casually whacking off
>>27935605
Russian helicopters have side-by-side seatings to facilitate bro-jobs.
>>27935620
How thoughtful. Western attack helicopters are so impersonal.
>>27931995
why didn't they just get apaches?
>>27935620
reminds me of western tanks that have the gunner sitting between the commanders legs- however the T-14 has them beat- its like the back of a van in that crew capsule
>>27935666
too expensive i reckon
>>27931875
THIS.
>>27935677
v22.jpg
>>27935666
Marine Corps? It's not just because the apaches are more expensive, but also means the corps needs to overhaul its entire helicopter logistics to accommodate the helicopter, and the corps operates hundreds of AH-1s and UH-1s (they share a good chunk of spares).
Sure people would go "hurr if the army can, why the corps cant", but thing is, the army got their budget directly from DoD, while the corps get their budget through the Navy. Also, the army usually get more than 30 percent of the annual DoD budget vs 4 fucking percent for USMC
>>27935677
AH-1Z Viper is 31 million
AH-64E Apache is 35 million
They'd need the Longbow modifications of folding rotors and salt corrosion protection of course
>>27935739
>but also means the corps needs to overhaul its entire helicopter logistics to accommodate the helicopter,
v22again.jpg
> and the corps operates hundreds of AH-1s and UH-1s (they share a good chunk of spares).
And if they went with Seahawks they'd be able to share parts and maintenance with the navy and army and air force
>vs 4 fucking percent for USMC
So it should look towards common equipment with the rest of the armed forces instead of being a unique little princess
economy of supply of ordering more of the same ensures cheaper prices
>>27931032
>What is the best military attack helicopter and why ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqcQUmKJEK8
>>27935780
>v22again.jpg
That's because the USN and USAF were also involved its development.
>And if they went with Seahawks they'd be able to share parts and maintenance with the navy and army and air force
Except there is no widely available dedicated gunship that has parts commonality with the Blackhawk.
>>27935808
>Except there is no widely available dedicated gunship that has parts commonality with the Blackhawk.
>>27935808
the blackhawk components would not have commonality with a gunship thats true, but it would have commonality with navy helicopters which commonly transport around marines, commonality with army, commonality with airforce, navy maintenance crews would be able to work on marine hawks and marines would be able to work on navy hawks, and et cetera
>>27935833
and you would be accessing an existing production run, reducing costs for everyone
>>27935819
The DAP is literally just a Blackhawk with stub wings bolted onto it. It's in no way a purpose built attack helo on the level of a Viper.
>>27935819
>>27931142
>It really comes down to engine and weapons design
NIgger, the fucking Ka-50 takes ages to aim its shitty beam riding ATGM. And the manual says it's safer to fire them in salvos of two.
>Russian attack helis
The copters are good but if I have to use shitty ass Russian PGMs, no thanks. I'll take something that can use a Hellfire because they actually work
>>27931142
Mi-28 is a just plane fierce looking chopper, love that bulk.
>>27935921
>The Vikhr missile laser beam control system provides for its precise guidance owing to data transmission to the missile in the course of its launch, which is excluded in homing systems. The Vikhr missile control system has high jamming immunity because its receiver faces the carrier, thereby protecting it from jamming signals.
>The high pinpoint target hit probability (reported 0.95 against stationary targets) is provided by the automatic target tracking system and highly accurate missile control system that makes allowance for changes in the parameters of the carrier and the target in the course of firing.
>The missiles can be fired singly or in pairs (at the same target to increase lethality). The high flight speed allows it to engage targets rapidly. The system is capable of launching Vikhr missiles against two to four targets during a 30-second period and starting at a range of 10 km, which increases its lethality to three to four times that of earlier systems.
nice meme. then there is the Hermes atgm coming online in a few years which is basically Vikhr on steroids.
>>27935991
>Beam riders
Have fun exposing yourself to AA fire while waiting for your missile to hit.
>>27935931
>plane
>>27935999
>AA fire
What AA fire? With air dominance doctrine, US forgot about ground AA.
>>27935999
Uh, how do you think the Hellfire is used?
>>27936010
Stingers are a thing, you know.
>>27936014
radar Fire and Forget since the longbow and Hellfire-K is a thing
now with Brimmstone and JAGM... phew.
>>27936014
Longbow mmw radar :^)
>>27935852
Yeah, but the name alone is worth it. Direct Action Penetrator sounds like a flying cock begging to violate the enemy
>>27935739
>Also, the army usually get more than 30 percent of the annual DoD budget
You do realize that the reason the Army gets so much is because it is the Army which pays for all the VA bills. Healthcare as you know is expensive as fuck, especially for fucked up active duty and vets.The amount of the budget that goes to the actual war fighter is MUCH less. Furthermore, you are ignoring how the corps mooches off of the Navy a LOT. The corps being underfunded is nothing more than a bad meme.
>>27935868
Where can i get this manual?
>>27931032
Might be because of the 10x larger production
>>27935991
>The high pinpoint target hit probability (reported 0.95 against stationary targets) is provided by the automatic target tracking system and highly accurate missile control system that makes allowance for changes in the parameters of the carrier and the target in the course of firing.
means the Kamov can dodge and as long as LOS is maintained with the rear of the missile its going to hit. Stingers like most MANPADS even latest Russian ones are DIRCM fodder anyways while the trick against AA is to outrange them.
>>27936059
SVR please go
>>27936038
No, they're not a thing, because Vikhr has 10km range, and best Stinger available has range of 8 km.
>>27936092
Stingers are used in ambush, same as AA guns. using mk.1 eyeball for target detection ekes out 2-3 klicks of engagement range at most.
>>27936092
>No, they're not a thing, because Vikhr has 10km range, and best Stinger available has range of 8 km.
Life's not a videogame where you have the luxury of always engaging at your max range all the time.
>>27936099
>using mk.1 eyeball for target detection ekes out 2-3 klicks of engagement range at most.
You've got pretty awful awareness if that's the FURTHEST you can see yourself spotting an aircraft. In my book 2 miles is a sure thing, and 5 is possible. I don't buy the whole "BVR = 20+ miles" thing though, unless you're talking about contrails or something.
![bct-heavy-toe[1].gif](https://i.imgur.com/cXwBxEV.gif "bct-heavy-toe[1].gif")
>>27936099
No "AA ambush unit". Stingers can not guarantee protection. Ambushes doesn't work when you're advancing.
>>27936086
Do you even 7 proxies?
>>27936115
Do you even lift?
>>27935807
kek'd
>>27935953
why the fuck did they put a pilot in there. Russians be crazy.
Would the F model be better? Everything the E-model has plus this
>AH-64F
In 2014, Boeing conceptualized an Apache upgrade prior to the introduction of the U.S. Army's anticipated attack version of the Future Vertical Lift aircraft, forecast to replace the Apache by 2040. The conceptual AH-64F would have greater speed via a new 3,000 shp turboshaft engine from the improved turbine engine program, retractable landing gear, stub wings to offload lift from the main rotor during cruise, and a tail rotor that can articulate 90 degrees to provide forward thrust.
>>27938390
Problem is, the F doesn't even exist yet.
Does anyone have blueprints for Apache helicopter? I American Joe working on Apache helicopters and accidentally leave my blueprints home. Please send plans to
[email protected]
>>27938487
Kek
