>>15030327
Ok time to take a break from the "I want to verb character!" threads and talk about gameplay, if that's something we can still do.
You know the drill, whats your favorite pattern, game? Do you think the direction ZUN is going with the games styles and especially gameplay bodes well for the series? Are they getting harder or easier? Hell, just post a webm/gif of your favorite pattern if anything.
Let's just talk about official games for a bit.
Gameplay thread.
Touhou is a game!
Still grinding my face against MS Lunatic, still a massive scrub. Please send help I'm going insane.
>>15032706
holy shit, you are actually playing a PC 98 game, in lunatic mode, at that. May God have pity on your poor poor soul.
How to capture Youmu's spellcard on the final stage of PCB? i bom errytime
>>15032769
Also, how do I unlock Yukari? I know I have to capture 60 spellcards, but what are the specifics? 60 spellcards for the whole game, extra + regular, for all characters?
>>15032782
any characters across all difficulties
Couldn't even check the catalog, huh, OP?
>>15032769
>i bom errytime
Yeah, it's just like any other card in the final stage - dodge 75% of it, then bomb anyway. Fucking Yuyuko.
Salt aside, that one's actually not too bad; you can do it without moving very much, though keeping track of shots that are going in so many directions is usually too much for me and I get nervous.
>>15032769
>>15033105
whar difficulty are you guys talking about? Lunatic sure is hard if you have a bit of bad luck, but normal and hard aren't that bad
>>15032769
There are incredibly easy safespots for it. Watch any decent replay.
>>15034043
Just at a glance, that particular card doesn't even seem different between Normal and Hard. And you're right, it's not terrible, but it's just difficult enough that I can't do it consistently. Similar to Unnatural Phenomena, or Laser of 17 Articles.
>>15035006
>Unnatural phenomena
this is static
>laser of seventeen articles
stick in the bottom and just watch out for the speed up
Are there any games similar to that Youmou game, Youyou Kengeki Musou?
>>15032723
>>15037618
The sequel, Adventures of Scarlet Curiosity?
>>15032643
>Ok time to take a break from the "I want to verb character!" threads and talk about gameplay
I want to beat Sakuya on hard mode!
>>15037587
It's being static is cold comfort when it's still a clusterfuck coming from all directions.
Also, I know how to do Laser, just can't pull it off all the time. Keeping track of bullets from more than two directions is frankly beyond me.
I 1cced today
>>15034322
I just figured out where the safespot was, but it was not immediately obvious where it was, since "decent replays" tended to milk it for graze once they got a border, or moved around a bit earlier than you would normally cap it.
Posting an image of where the safespot is in the next post
>>15032769
For Youmu's stage 6 spellcard (on lunatic), be at the very bottom of the screen, between the n and the e in the Enemy sign. Just shoot without moving and you should cap the spell before anything hits you. I did this with Reimu B. For some other characters, you might have to move at the very end.
I don't know where the safespot is for other difficulties.
>>15038385
just learn to dodge, focus only in a small area around you and don't mind anything else in the screen, also, try to not focus your sight in a single bullet; If you try to read every bullet one by one, you'll get rekt
While I'm not very fond of fangames that are put out some of the spellcards that in them are actually pretty unique such as https://youtu.be/7Rue4WDUqhw?t=11m5s
While unique as well that sanae shot seems abysmal to work with
tfw no talent
>>15038576
Congrats on the Lunatic 1cc!
>>15039347
That seventh one looks cool as hell.
And I'm sure that Sanae shot is still better than the one from 13.
>>15040169
IKTF, the only reason I still play Touhou is because I think it might have some cognitive benefits.
>>15041217
>cognitive benefits
My EOSD installation freezes on Windows 8. Any known fix?
>>15041522
install gentoo
>>15042644
>I have a 27 inch screen, but use windowed because upscaling looks like shit.
Any upscaling, or the built-in full-screening? As long as you have enough resolution to pixel-double, I'd say use vpatch to do that, since it gives you all the advantages without the shitty aspect-ratio distortion.
>>15041248
Maybe it'll improve my ability to focus.
I'm a scrub, I don't have endurance and I often lack the reflex to deathbomb. Any tips?
>>15041522
The game itself shouldn't lose functionality until windows 10.
Are you using Japanese app locale? Other than that I don't know enough about your system to say anything
Can't 1cc on normal mode
how to get good at houhou
>>15043280
>don't have endurance
I have no idea what this means
>lack reflex to deathbomb
It's rarely a reflexes thing(as in something you don't see coming at all), it's basically predicting your own death. It takes practice.
practicepracticepractice, practice until your fingers bleed, that's the only way friendo, if you don't like it then touhou is not for you, or any shmups really
>>15043311
>predicting your own death
Yes. I don't expect anyone to hear the death sound, and then press down the x button to bomb in time. Most of my deathbombs are done through telling my finger to press down on x, then I get hit, then the bomb goes off an instant afterwards.
Anyone should be able to reaction deathbomb for IN though.
>>15042644
>>15042691
I think windowed is fine. I suggest 1280x960 resolution, since that's what I use with vpatch and a 24" monitor.
>>15042691
>>15043369
Thanks for suggesting vpatch upscaling, looks much better than fullscreen. The only problem is the taskbar at the bottom, but I'll take that over using fullscreen.
I want to try Touhou out. Is EoSD a good starting point or should I start elsewhere?
>>15048801
EoSD is a good starting point. Remember to use vpatch with it.
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Game_Tools_and_Modifications#Vsync_Patches
Vpatch might already be included with your Touhou game folders, depending on where you download them from.
>>15048801
Yeah, it's a fine place to start. But if you really have a hard time getting into it, try 7, 10, or 14 instead.
>>15048811
The latest bundle on Nyaa includes it.
>>15048022
If the 'AlwaysOnTop' flag doesn't make it cover the taskbar, you can always just hide the taskbar while playing.
>>15048801
I started with 6. It's probably the most straightforward of the Windows games with the easiest patterns. Only thing I can say is that lives are handed out somewhat scarcely in normal mode.
If you want some alternative suggestions, 4 and 5 have easier patterns and more lives than 6, and 7 and 8 have harder patterns but considerably more lives. Keep in mind you need a PC-98 emulator for 4 and 5, np2fmgen is what I use.
>>15048913
The taskbar still shows two pixels when hidden (you can sort of see it in the image I posted), but it's not too hard to ignore. I'll try out the AlwaysOnTop option later, thanks for the suggestion.
I recently started up EoSD again.
It's amazing how much more fun I'm having with this compared to LoLK.
>>15048984
Am i the only one who finds LoLK funny?
Just started playing, got maybe 4 hours total
How do I bomb? I keep dying with at least 2 bombs on me. Should I bomb first and worry about learning patterns later or what?
Also how long do you think it should take me to actually finish normal mode? I think I'm pretty bad at this.
>>15050770
If you mean 1cc, days at least, maybe weeks(if you're new to shmups/bullet hell, if not, not long at all).
Finishing at all shouldn't take long, if you use all your credits. Maybe same day, if not tomorrow.
How do I stop my mom from coming in and making me pause the game so that she can tell me some useless shit, which in turn kills me 100-fucking-percent of the time?
>>15048984
I also, recently started up EoSD again.
It feels terrible.
Why do people like it so much, again?
>>15048984
Same.
Going back to it feels great. Remembering how i fell in love with these games.
>>15051245
Stop being B&
>>15051345
Normies leave
>>15043301
I have the same problem, but it's really just a matter of practicing and studying replays, then trying to implement those strategies. I lack the time and conviction to play Touhou for more than a few hours at a time, but I enjoy what time I do spend playing it. A 1cc isn't everything as long as you're enjoying yourself, anon!
>>15048984
I really do like the earlier games more than the more recent ones. For example, I really like DDC, but IN just feels so much more fun to play.
>>15051442
But I want those sweet, sweet extra stages!
>>15051442
>studying replays
Fuck off, cheater.
>>15051424
Only normies use "normies".
>>15048984
Having recently played EoSD again, you're a nostalgiafag, sorry to say anon.
>>15051252
It was their first game, so mostly just massive nostalgia. In all honesty, it's probably one of the weaker mainline games, if only for lacking many of the small things that make the other games better.
>>15050049
Only contrarians hate LoLK, everyone knows that the actual low point of the series was MoF, UFO, and TD.
>>15051663
>Only contrarians hate LoLK, everyone knows that the actual low point of the series was MoF, UFO, and TD.
That's a funny way to spell MoF,MoFandMoF.
>>15051977
>>15051663
>>15051252
From a mechanics standpoint sure MoF is terrible and EoSD is rough. The characters and music and patterns blow LoLK, DDC, and TD out of the water.
>>15051663
>>15051977
Please don't lump MoF in with those kusogames, '''''kudasai'''''
>>15051998
MoF has great characters and music, yes, but the patterns are incredibly subpar for a vast majority of the game, the good patterns are few and far between.
EoSD has good music, but none of it actually stands out that much. The cast is fine, and hold a special place for having the most cohesive cast, but honestly their not really as special as people make them out to be, and are really just carried by EoSD fanboys who love to wank over the SDM. The patterns are some of the most plan in the entire series, and several boss fall back on the boring "firing random bullets in all directions from your location" trope.
TD actually has some really good music, even if not all of it is fantastic. The patterns are actually fairly solid, despite being mostly easy (though that exact phrase can apply to EoSD as well, so hating TD's patterns but loving EoSD's patterns is hypocritcal), but I really appreciate some of the thing the game does right, namely the Stage 3, 4, and Extra bosses, which are all fantastic. I really enjoy the characters as well, and Miko is one of my favorite final bosses in terms of personality and dialogue, but I know that's subjective.
Liking EoSD but hating DDC is perhaps one of the most hypocritical things you can do, seeing how much of DDC was inspired by the older games in the series. DDC's ost can be a bit rough with the more rock inspired songs (though I do enjoy them, personally), but you're crazy if you hate things like the Stage 5 theme, or the Final Boss's theme. And the patterns in DDC tend to be both fun to play and creative, so it does well in that category as well. The cast, again, is a subjective thing, but I really enjoy how we got to take a look at some of the weaker youkai in Gensokyo. The only weak part for me were the two stage 4 bosses, who were simply boring and uninspired.
LoLK has some of the best music in the series, has some interesting patterns, and has a fantastic cast that expands upon the greater world of Touhou.
>>15052069
The only kusogame in the Touhou series is HM, though.
That said, MoF is easily one of the weakest entries in the series.
What happens if you upload endings?
>>15052379
Eiki will judge your soul and you'll end up being forced to play UFO forever in the afterlife.
>>15052401
I'm uploading all endings so I can get a date with Eiki-Chan!
>>15052411
Eiki only dates people who follow the rules.
>>15052077
You sound like a truly casual player.
noooooob
>>15052573
Nice counterargument.
>>15052077
>The patterns are some of the most plan in the entire series, and several boss fall back on the boring "firing random bullets in all directions from your location" trope.
Even if the patterns are visually not as flashy as later entries the patterns are fine. I actually preffer the reaction based patterns of EoSD rather than the focused slow dodging of the most recent games since the aproach is more like a classic shmup.
>>15051663
>It was their first game, so mostly just massive nostalgia. In all honesty, it's probably one of the weaker mainline games.
Nice opinion fagtron. EoSD wan't my first game and i enjoyed it thoroughly. If you don't like it that's fine, but calling it one of the weaker entries is super retarded.
>>15052660
>If you don't like it that's fine, but calling it one of the weaker entries is super retarded.
But anon, even as someone who enjoys the game, it is objectively one of the weakest games in the series. It only has two characters, and a total of only 4 shot types. The danmaku and concepts in the game are even more plain than those found in some of the PC98 games. And that's not even mentioning the little things like Stage Practice being a mess, or the lack of visible focus hitbox (which allowed ZUN to justify adding more elaborate patterns in the later games.)
It's still worth playing, but it's also dated, and many of the games in the series have improved upon it in various ways.
>I actually preffer the reaction based patterns of EoSD rather than the focused slow dodging of the most recent games since the aproach is more like a classic shmup.
Except EoSD has plenty of slow dodging patterns along with the more boring random fire patterns. A major issue is just that EoSD tends not to be as creative with either type of pattern. Again, EoSD certainly isn't a bad game, and I would easily rank it above games like MoF or TD, but it's a very plain game.
>>15052660
Continuing from >>15052711, honestly anon, if you want a more classic shmup experience, then you should play the PC98 games, as they feel more like classic shmups than EoSD does.
>>15052711
>It only has two characters, and a total of only 4 shot types
Yes and all four of them are much more balanced that most other entries on the series.
> The danmaku and concepts in the game are even more plain than those found in some of the PC98 games.
How so? the only PC-98 game that has even more complex danmaku is MS, not to mention that the extra of EoSD has projectiles not found on any other main game entry (just like MS).
>Stage Practice being a mess, or the lack of visible focus hitbox
I don't understand what you don't like about stage practice other than not being able to save single replays, besides i already said that the approach of EoSD is more reflex based and therefore makes the point of "not having a hitbox" and "plain looking patterns" moot. There is enphasis in faster bullets and quicker movement. If you find that plain that's fine but is not a bad thing in the slightest.
>Except EoSD has plenty of slow dodging patterns along with the more boring random fire patterns
That's funny, because i consider the super slow patterns of recent entries boring. The only pattern that even compares on EoSD are the spambooks in stage 4 and some of the spellcards on the first two levels.
The nonspells of stage 5 of LoLK were a breath of fresh air for the newer entries in therms of patterns since they were really quick even if dense but not extremely frustrating like stage 6.
>>15052717
>if you want a more classic shmup experience, then you should play the PC98 games, as they feel more like classic shmups than EoSD does.
I already did and i like them a lot too, i don't get your point.
God fucking dammit I hate those fucking Grimoires in Stage 4 of EoSD.
>>15052791
The books right before Koakuma? Yeah those are really hard. Unless you mean the laserbooks afterwards, which are just streaming.
>>15052791
focus on destroying one book m8
>>15052781
>Yes and all four of them are much more balanced that most other entries on the series.
Other games in the series have been able to balance more shot types, those 4 shot types appear in most games anyway, and the homing shottype sucks in this game anyway.
>How so? the only PC-98 game that has even more complex danmaku is MS, not to mention that the extra of EoSD has projectiles not found on any other main game entry (just like MS).
I was mostly talking about MS when I said that.
>I don't understand what you don't like about stage practice other than not being able to save single replays,
There's also how it starts you with the default number of lives, despite that going against the point of practice mode.
Oh, and no instant restart in the pause menu, just remembered another thing that really bugged me about the game.
>besides i already said that the approach of EoSD is more reflex based and therefore makes the point of "not having a hitbox" and "plain looking patterns" moot.
It really isn't, random bullets =/= a more reflex based game, especially when many of the other patterns are based around streaming anyway.
Again, EoSD isn't a bad game, but it's a very dated game compared to the newer Windows games, similar to the PC98 games.
>>15052791
Everyone hates the Grimoires before Koakuma, anon.
Sup. Guys, anyone play in Soku? I`m new here and looking for players to have fun.Still don`t have static IP, only HamachiSorry for my English, is not my native language.
>>15052801
>Other games in the series have been able to balance more shot types
Not really, the only game that i can think of having more balance is UFO.
>I was mostly talking about MS when I said that.
Well you mentioned the PC-98 games as plural so i was kind of confused.
>There's also how it starts you with the default number of lives, despite that going against the point of practice mode.
I don't get how is this a bad thing, you can argue that since it's practice mode you should be able to get infinite retries but having only two lives helps you a lot on improving your style of play.
>no instant restart in the pause menu
That, even if annoying, is just petty anon.
>It really isn't, random bullets =/= a more reflex based game
You talk like there is RNG out of the ass in this game, even in RNG-Heavy spellcards like "scarlet meister" and "scarlet gensokyo", there is a clear pattern. Also i don't get how you don't consider dodging random fast bullets reflex based.
>especially when many of the other patterns are based around streaming anyway
That's pretty funny anon, there are very few streaming sections and most of them are on the stages themselves. The one game focused heavily on streaming is PCB.
>it's a very dated game compared to the newer Windows games
It's not that dated, even some newer entries with the flashy graphics and aditional features feel plain compared with EoSD. The most obvious example being TD.
>>15052868
>Not really, the only game that i can think of having more balance is UFO.
UFO had awful balance. What have you been smoking?
>I don't get how is this a bad thing, you can argue that since it's practice mode you should be able to get infinite retries but having only two lives helps you a lot on improving your style of play.
You should just start practice with max lives, so you have room to experiment. Only starting with two lives is shitty design.
>That, even if annoying, is just petty anon.
It's just one of the many small things that add up.
>You talk like there is RNG out of the ass in this game,
There is RNG out of the ass in that game, yeah.
>even in RNG-Heavy spellcards like "scarlet meister" and "scarlet gensokyo"
I wouldn't really call those two that rng heavy, since as you said there's a clear pattern there.
>That's pretty funny anon, there are very few streaming sections and most of them are on the stages themselves.
There are an ungodly amount of bullets that are based upon your positioning in EoSD, anon. Stage 4 is practically "Graze, the Stage"
>It's not that dated, even some newer entries with the flashy graphics and aditional features feel plain compared with EoSD.
Flashiness has nothing to do with it (in fact, part of the reason I really enjoy the Touhou series is because unlike many other danmaku games, Touhou never gets too flashy.), but the addition of smart gameplay features and mechanics really go a long way.
>The most obvious example being TD.
I had already stated that I believe that TD was a weaker game than EoSD, don't know why you brought that one up.
>>15053007
>UFO had awful balance
lol
>>15053115
>>15053138
Weak shottypes are not necessarily bad. MariB has it's uses in scoring, at least.
>>15053115
UFO has absolutely terrible balance. He's right.
The fact that you think otherwise is comedy gold and shows how much of a shitter you are at the games.
>>15053201
UFO's shot type balance actually isn't too bad. MariB's pretty obnoxious to use, but at least she has her benefits. All the other shots are more than usable. UFO has better balance than say...MoF or DDC.
Filthy touhou casual here, when you guys say terrible balance, do you mean the playable shot types or the overall progression of the game and its difficulty spike?
Because UFO's stage 4 on normal as absolute nonsense.
>>15053251
They're talking about shot types. But all touhou games usually have a difficulty spike on stage 4.
>>15053244
I actually thought MoF balance was not too bad. Youkai Buster sucks, yeah, and Reimu A is a bit too good, but other than that I'd say it's pretty well balanced.
>>15053297
...especially compared to PCB. PCB is easily the worst offender as far as unbalanced shot types go.
Friendly reminder that UFO is one of the easiest games in the series.
https://a.pomf.cat/gooewh.mp4
If you struggle with UFO at all, you should just off yourself immediately, because the only two games that are arguably easier than it are PCB and MoF.
>>15053309
>PCB is easily the worst offender as far as unbalanced shot types go.
There isn't a single useless shot type in PCB.
>>15053297
MoF was decent in that regard. Youkai Buster is good for stages and does high damage at point blank. Marisa A is the one that feels weird.
>>15053297
What's weird is that MarisaA's shot is supposed to be high power, but instead it's not even as strong as ReimuB/MarisaC. MoF's best shots are the aforementioned two, while ReimuA is pretty good, MarisaB is a poor man's ReimuB but is still more than usable, and ReimuC/MarisaA are pretty bad.
>>15053325
>There isn't a single useless shot type in PCB.
That's not the problem. The problem is that Sakuya gets 4 bombs, pretty decent ones I might add, very good shot types, as well as a not huge cherry penalty. If you're good at bombing the game becomes an absolute pushover, and if you're not then it's still pretty easy.
Also, a run with Marisa is easily doable, but she is the worst character to play(coming from someone who prefers Marisa for every game EXCEPT PCB). Reimu B has comparable power and superior range, as well as more bombs, and bombing correctly with her shift bomb, although very hard to do, does comparable damage to master spark. Also, she has a much lower cherry penalty than Marisa. There's simply no reason to play Marisa unless you just can't live without the speed.
>MoF was decent in that regard. Youkai Buster is good for stages and does high damage at point blank. Marisa A is the one that feels weird.
Hm. I only tried it once. Maybe I should have given it more of a chance.
Also, Marisa A is my preferred shot type for MoF so... yeah...
Marisa A is really good for stages if you use it right, and holding down at the bottom of the screen will center them all on your character to do the most damage of any shot type in the game(except Youkai Buster point blank, possibly). Since the options trail behind you, she's also really good for certain spell cards that involve a lot of right to left movement. It's hard to explain, but "Two Bows, Two Claps, and One Bow" and "Ancient Fate Linked by Cedars" are some of them. When I say good for those spellcards, what I mean is better than other shot types like Reimu B or Marisa B that simply have the options by your character. Surprisingly better too, honestly.
>>15053007
>>15053138
So you are saying that UFO has bad balance because it has one weak shot type?
Even thought most other games are a hot mess in that department?
And here i thought you knew what you were talking about.
>>15053138
>There isn't a single useless shot type in PCB
Marisa B is not useless in UFO either, besides PCB has incredible unbalanced shot types considering that Marisa is a much better Reimu and that Sakuya has very strong shot types with free bombs included. That not even mentioning the fact that one of those shot types breaks the scoring system.
>>15053348
>What's weird is that MarisaA's shot is supposed to be high power, but instead it's not even as strong as ReimuB/MarisaC.
I highly doubt that Marisa A is not at least very, very close to the strength of Reimu B.
And Marisa A not being as strong as Marisa C? Give me a break. Marisa C is designed completely differently from Marisa A and is a lot less flexible, as well. Also, good luck getting her options back up to a boss if you release shift for too long during a spell(without bombing or dying, at least).
>>15050770
Press X to bomb, but don't waste them. X is more of a panic button than anything. Wait until the very last second when you're in an unavoidable pinch and then bomb. Instead of dying, you'll just use the bomb. If you do it right, you should hear the death noise but you don't actually die. It's called death-bombing
>>15053385
Ok, now I'm actually getting a little offended. Sakuya gets 4 bombs, yeah, but they're perhaps some of the worst bombs in PCB, only good for scoring purposes.
Marisa, on the other hand, while lacking in bombs, has bombs that are easily powerful enough to take out entire spellcards.
And fuck you, Marisa B is by far my favorite Marisa shot type in any Touhou game, as someone who plays as Marisa in literally every Touhou game I possibly can.
>Reimu B has comparable power and superior range, as well as more bombs
Oh shit, so you mean it's almost EXACTLY like EoSD was?
>and bombing correctly with her shift bomb, although very hard to do, does comparable damage to master spark.
Too bad NDL outdamages both easily in almost every situation.
>Marisa A is really good for stages if you use it right, and holding down at the bottom of the screen will center them all on your character to do the most damage of any shot type in the game
I'm sure it is. I just have never been able to use it well, and as a result I personally just prefer Marisa B (with Vsynch patch) and Marisa C.
>>15053433
>Marisa is a much better Reimu
>a run with Marisa is easily doable, but she is the worst character to play
Fuck you guys as a collective.
>So you are saying that UFO has bad balance because it has one weak shot type?
Marisa A is alright, but lacks options for collecting UFO fragments, which bring her down in this sort of game.
Marisa B is awful for everything but score runs, and has a hilariously bad bomb that actually runs out of invincibility before the animation ends.
Reimu A is good.
Reimu B is kind of bad in this game.
Sanae A is decent and has the most busted bomb in any game in the series.
Sanae B is good.
>>15053348
Yeah, I kind of felt that too. That's why I typically just stick with Marisa B.
>>15053466
While Death Bombing is what you should aim for, always bomb before actually getting hit, as getting a Death Bomb every time is unrealistic.
>>15053486
>a run with Marisa is easily doable, but she is the worst character to play
come again?
>Marisa A is alright, but lacks options for collecting UFO fragments, which bring her down in this sort of game.
Nigga what? You can get UFO pieces more easily because her penetrating shot type can pierce toward multiple enemies, killing the ones that spawn UFO's more easily. Not to mention that she is extremely useful to deal with familiars, like Nue's. The only bad part of her is that she moves super slow while bombing.
>>15053535
You don't understand, anon.
Yes, her shot is good for shooting down UFOs, but collecting the ufo fragments to spawn UFOs is way more difficult, as you can't simply bomb to get the UFO fragments that are out of reach, you have to wait for an opening to grab them. This gimps her ability to collect resources fairly hard, especially on higher difficulties.
That said, she is very good against Nue, I will agree.
>>15053486
>Sakuya gets 4 bombs, yeah, but they're perhaps some of the worst bombs in PCB, only good for scoring purposes.
...I'm baffled, honestly. Sakuya A's bombs are great for how many she gets. Her shift bomb does almost as much damage as Marisa A's shift bomb, and consider she gets literally double the amount of bombs that Marisa gets, that small lack of damage is a sacrifice any sane person would be willing to make.
>Marisa, on the other hand, while lacking in bombs, has bombs that are easily powerful enough to take out entire spellcards.
Except in Extra and Phantasm stage boss fights.
And I know that those are only a small part of the game, but... man... two bombs. As compared to what could be three or four. There's just no room for error at all, especially when she has such a damn high cherry penalty.
>Reimu B has comparable power and superior range, as well as more bombs
>Oh shit, so you mean it's almost EXACTLY like EoSD was?
Uh... everybody had the same amount of bombs in EoSD. And Reimu B actually had inferior damage to Marisa A, and equal damage to Marisa B, except at point blank in which she was the most powerful(but situations in which point blank shooting are advisable are incredibly rare, obviously). For EoSD I actually hold the opposite opinion of that there is no point in playing Reimu, either A or B.
>and bombing correctly with her shift bomb, although very hard to do, does comparable damage to master spark.
>Too bad NDL outdamages both easily in almost every situation.
...am I missing something? I can't get NDL to do nearly the damage of master spark. Is there some trick to using it?
>>15053553
>as you can't simply bomb to get the UFO fragments that are out of reach
What? you are telling me that you bomb every time to get the UFOs? what the fuck man? There are enough openings in the game to get them. Most patterns can be avoided if you stay in the lower screen. Every time you destroy a UFO the bullets are cleared, come on man.
>This gimps her ability to collect resources fairly hard, especially on higher difficulties
I never had a problem with resources in my hard run with her, specially since UFO showers you with them and you can max out your lives by midway in stage 4, satage 3 if you have a good strategy.
>>15053575
>...I'm baffled, honestly. Sakuya A's bombs are great for how many she gets. Her shift bomb does almost as much damage as Marisa A's shift bomb, and consider she gets literally double the amount of bombs that Marisa gets, that small lack of damage is a sacrifice any sane person would be willing to make.
Ok, if there's one bad thing I can say about the difference in Bomb amounts, it's that Marisa A's bombs are really crappy for the amount she has. I'll agree with you there.
>Except in Extra and Phantasm stage boss fights.
Well, sure, but you really shouldn't be bombing much during those anyway, especially since bombing too much during those can put you at a disadvantage.
>Uh... everybody had the same amount of bombs in EoSD.
That's why I said almost.
>And Reimu B actually had inferior damage to Marisa A, and equal damage to Marisa B, except at point blank in which she was the most powerful
The point blank advantage is more powerful than you'd think, especially combined with her bomb.
>...am I missing something? I can't get NDL to do nearly the damage of master spark. Is there some trick to using it?
NDL is programmed in a funny way. You see, it actually has 4 active hitboxes, which all intersect at Marisa's location. Basically, if you activate the bomb and hover right over the boss, they'll basically be getting hit by 4 lasers simultaneously and constantly, which racks up damage very quickly, to the point where it can basically carve through any cards up until Stage 6. You do have to be careful though, as you'll have to give yourself enough time to retreat before your invincibility wears off, and you want to start fairly close to get the maximum effect.
>>15053593
>What? you are telling me that you bomb every time to get the UFOs? what the fuck man? There are enough openings in the game to get them. Most patterns can be avoided if you stay in the lower screen. Every time you destroy a UFO the bullets are cleared, come on man.
You're intentionally ignoring my point, anon. Marisa A has fewer options in tough situations than other characters, and that hurts her overall, especially in Lunatic play.
>satage 3 if you have a good strategy.
I'm pretty sure you can't fill up that invisible last life before stage 4, anon. I might be wrong, of course.
>>15053627
>You're intentionally ignoring my point, anon
No, i get that it hurts your play style but considering that you can take down a lot of enemies at the same time making many parts of the stages a lot esier, have a really powerful shot type for bosses and a really good speed for macro dodging it balances out. You can't really say that is a crippling disadvantage since , as i already said, UFO showers you with resources and it's one of the few games where you can plan routes.
Besides you can always time your movements on the duration of your bomb with the direction of the UFO's on the screen, you don't get completly stationary while bombing, you can predict were the UFO is going to land at the end of the bomb and even if you end up a little far from the UFOs you have the speed to salavage them.
>The point blank advantage is more powerful than you'd think, especially combined with her bomb.
I've 1cc'd EoSD with her. It is powerful, but not enough to offset the disadvantage. She is a doable shot type for sure, but from the standpoint of purely getting through the game Marisa is a better choice.
Also, she gets Patchy's hardest spell cards. Not a huge deal, but just another point in Marisa's favor.
Reimu A on the other hand is abysmal and I hated my 1cc with her the whole way through.
>Well, sure, but you really shouldn't be bombing much during those anyway, especially since bombing too much during those can put you at a disadvantage.
Not a disadvantage worth dying over. And I'd rather bomb four times and have my cherry absolutely #rekt than bomb twice with the same effect.
>You see, NDL is the operating system and the hitbox is the kernel, so I've taken to calling it NDL/hitbox, or NDL+hitbox...
Just tested it out and you're right holy fuck. That has indeed elevated Marisa B much higher. Marisa A is still irredeemable though.
>>15051663
Which is the best (most fun) 2hu game?
I only played MoF(1cc in normal with reimu's homing only)
>>15053737
>Also, she gets Patchy's hardest spell cards. Not a huge deal, but just another point in Marisa's favor.
To be fair, Marisa A also gets some really tough Patchy cards. The only shottype that really has it easy during Patchy is Marisa B.
Talking about Lunatic by the way, I can't remember who has it easier on Hard or Normal at the moment.
>Not a disadvantage worth dying over. And I'd rather bomb four times and have my cherry absolutely #rekt than bomb twice with the same effect.
The point is that you aren't dealing damage while bombing, and patterns tend to get faster over time. Having more bombs is nice, but during Extra it doesn't matter as much either way.
>Marisa A is still irredeemable though.
She's not great, but I still enjoy using her, if only because I'm more comfortable with Marisa than Sakuya or Reimu.>You see, NDL is the operating system and the hitbox is the kernel, so I've taken to calling it NDL/hitbox, or NDL+hitbox...heh
>>15053757
>Which is the best (most fun) 2hu game?
That's subjective. That said, I personally enjoyed PCB most for a few reasons. SA and DDC are also up there.
>I only played MoF(1cc in normal with reimu's homing only)
I would personally consider that to be one of the weaker games in the series.
>>15053436
Like I said, MarisaA's description is 'High Power Shot'. IMO she should be the strongest in the game just from that description, but she's not. She does fair damage, but my point is that ReimuB/MarisaC do more.
As for MarisaC's option placement, learn to make quick, unfocused bursts whenever. She's not too bad to use to her full potential.
>>15053486
Yeah. Like I said, MarisaB is pretty much just ReimuB with a bigger hitbox, piercing that doesn't come in handy too much, and weaker damage. She's the most convenient to use of Marisa's shots, though.
>>15053782
I'm just a huge sucker for Marisa's laser shot types, I suppose. I just find them to be more fun overall.
It's kind of sad that Marisa's PCB laser shot type is never coming back. Even if ZUN does bring back her traditional lasers, they'll probably come back as a MoF styled forward focus shot, with no spread like her older laser shots have.
And speaking of Marisa's damage, she dealt less damage than Reimu from UFO all the way until DDC. What was up with that?
>>15053776
>The point is that you aren't dealing damage while bombing, and patterns tend to get faster over time.
1. Only on certain spell cards
2. Typically characters with more bombs have less powerful and therefore shorter bombs, so it's less of a disadvantage
3. I'd say the tradeoff is still worth it
>To be fair, Marisa A also gets some really tough Patchy cards. The only shottype that really has it easy during Patchy is Marisa B.
Yeah, she does. Still not as hard as bury in lake and that other crap, though.
>Talking about Lunatic by the way, I can't remember who has it easier on Hard or Normal at the moment.
I think you're right, it's basically that way across all difficulties if I remember correctly.
Strangely, I find Emerald Megalith to be very fun and I don't know why. It's possibly even my favorite spellcard in the whole game.
Top tier:
LLS, PCB, PoFV, MoF (cast and music wise)
High tier:
PoDD, MS, IN, SA
Mid tier:
EoSD, DDC, LoLK
Low tier:
HRtP, MoF (gameplay and mechanics wise) UFO, TD
SoEW tier:
SoEW
What did yall think of DDC?
>>15053782
>Like I said, MarisaA's description is 'High Power Shot'. IMO she should be the strongest in the game just from that description, but she's not.
Dude, it's ZUN's engrish. You can't expect too much.
>She does fair damage, but my point is that ReimuB/MarisaC do more.
And my point is that those shot types are a lot less flexible, with Reimu B doing barely if any more damage.
>As for MarisaC's option placement, learn to make quick, unfocused bursts whenever. She's not too bad to use to her full potential.
Eh, that makes sense but it still doesn't sit right with me. One mistake and you're done. Also, if you die, you have to spend time getting the P's and then the boss will probably have resumed their attack, meaning you'll probably have to get bomb in order to get your options close again.
I mean, I'm not saying Marisa C is shit. I'm just saying that it doesn't blow Marisa A away, and that it's lack of flexibility is it's downfall. It's not for me, either way.
>>15053838
Just, overall?
PCB > SA > PoFV > DDC > LoLK > IN > MS > EoSD > LLS > TD > MoF > UFO > SoEW > PoDD > HRtP
If I had to put it into tiers it would be
Top Tier
PCB, SA
High Tier
PoFV, DDC, LoLK, IN
Great Tier
MS, EoSD, LLS
Relatively Weak but Still Pretty Good Tier
TD, MoF, UFO, SoEW, PoDD
HRtP Tier
HRtP
There's practically no reason not to put HRtP on the bottom.
>>15053847
Fantastic game, music isn't for everyone but I really liked nearly everything else about it.
>>15053854
I personally really like Marisa C because it allows for some really neat things that the other shots do, not to mention it's a clear improvement over Remi's shot type in IN, itself already fun to use.
It's just a shame we'll never see another "Shift to Freeze your Options" gimmick again in Touhou.
>>15053868
My fucking nigga.
PCB and SA literally are my favorite titles along with DDC. Shit is fun as fuck to replay.
>>15053868
>I personally really like Marisa C because it allows for some really neat things that the other shots do, not to mention it's a clear improvement over Remi's shot type in IN, itself already fun to use.
The only character I did a solo 1cc of in IN was Remi. I agree, I loved her shot type.
>It's just a shame we'll never see another "Shift to Freeze your Options" gimmick again in Touhou.
You don't know that. Besides, there's always other games.
>>15053882
It's really strange. I hate the bombing system from SA and MoF, and SA's shot types feel so weird to me, especially the Marisa ones. It feels like I shouldn't like SA.
But the game itself just gets everything else so right on so many levels. The mechanics are really solid, resource collection is simple but intuitive, I love how grazing works, the cast is fantastic, the dialogue is memorable and does an amazing job at both introducing these new characters and fleshing out some of the older characters, and it arguably does the best job of nailing the atmosphere and music of any Touhou game. I can't help but forgive those minor things.
>>15053895
>You don't know that. Besides, there's always other games.
I suppose so, but it feels like he's experimenting less and less with option placement, it's a little worrying.
>>15053800
Haha, fair enough. Maybe Marisa will get her lasers to return one day...
She actually does more damage than Reimu in TD, as well, but I see what you mean.
>>15053854
>Dude, it's ZUN's engrish. You can't expect too much.
True.
>And my point is that those shot types are a lot less flexible, with ReimuB doing barely if any more damage.
According to the MoTK shot type damage comparison thread, ReimuB kills DVoWG five seconds faster than MarisaA. They're not too far apart, though, yes.
>Eh, that makes sense but it still doesn't sit right with me. One mistake and you're done. Also, if you die, you have to spend time getting the P's and then the boss will probably have resumed their attack, meaning you'll probably have to get bomb in order to get your options close again.
Yeah, using her can be annoying. Especially when there are shot types you can use in which you don't have to do anything too crazy.
>I mean, I'm not saying Marisa C is shit. I'm just saying that it doesn't blow Marisa A away, and that it's lack of flexibility is it's downfall. It's not for me, either way.
Again, fair enough.
I really liked Youmu in TD.
I wish Zun would use that shot type more.
>>15053979
Youmu hasn't even shown up since then.
>>15053982
Well its not like it has to be Youmu.
I just want more charge shot types.
>>15053757
>Which is the best (most fun) 2hu game?
This might come as an unpopular opinion, but i really like UFO and LoLK
>>15053838
Top tier:
UFO, LLS, PoDD, LoLK
High tier:
DDC, MoF (music and pattern wise), MS, SA, IN
Mid tier:
EoSD, PCB, PoFV
Not as good tier:
TD, SoEW, MoF
HRtP tier:
HRtP
>>15055516
>LLS and PoDD top tier
Patrician taste, my friend
Should I even bother bombing with Reimu B in SA on a boss ? Currently trying to beat hell raven in practice mode and still struggling a lot with Rin's doll bullshit in stage 5 but making some progress.
>>15052831
I'm interested in playing soku, although I'm not sure how you want to meet to play, a hamachi server?
>>15053847
It was pretty good overall, but having the most difficult final boss in the series after five relatively easy stages is a real drag. Still, it had some great music, the collection mechanic worked well, and the shot types were interesting even if not all good.
>>15053838
Top Tier:
DDC, LoLK
Shit Tier:
UFO
MoF
Good Tier:
Everything else
>>15055998
I think he's baiting, anon.
>>15055928
It's always better to bomb than it is to lose a life, especially against bosses in SA.
>>15056054
Top tier:
LLS, PoDD, SA, DDC,RMI.
High tier:
MS, IN, PCB, PoFV,BPoHC, EE, EMS.
Mid tier: EoSD, MoF, TD.
I can't really dislike any Touhou game, regardless of their faults.
Is there a better extra stage?
>>15056563
>Seihou
My nigga. That whole stage was amazing, from patterns to music in general. It's easily one of my favorite extra stages.
>>15056563
Tons. The Seihou extra was obnoxious more than anything.
I cannot fucking stand PoFV. Mainly because you have to tap to shoot, otherwise it'll charge or slow down depending on your controls. Is there any way to change this?
>>15056853
Go to key config and change charge type to charge.
Have fun with an objectively worse key config.
In all seriousness, though, tapping to shoot isn't very hard, especially if you've played old shmups.
You have played old shmups, right?
>>15053838
>Patrician tier
DDC, SA, MS
>High tier
IN, PCB, EoSD
>Mid tier
UFO, LLS, SoEW
>Low tier
MoF, TD, PoDD, PoFV
>Not a shmup tier
HRtP
>IWBTG tier
LoLK
>>15057247
Now it slows me down when I hold. Fucking great. I don't get why these shitty games have to turn their back on the rest of the Touhou series and require you to tap. It's not like a keyboard doesn't have enough keys, so just add a fucking charge key and you're done instead we get this crap.
And I only played the PC-98 Touhous though I guess those aren't exactly old. I'm not much of a shmup fan anyway, I just like Touhou.
>>15056853
You get used to the tapping. Unfortunately, ZUN was allergic to using more than three keys back then, so there's no option like in 12.8 to simply hold and shoot with no drawbacks.
You should really give the game a chance though, because it's incredibly fun. The actual frustrating part is that the story mode is more about surviving a timer than applying strategy, but playing against someone else is easily the most fun thing the entire series has to offer.
Sadly, there was just a thread about it that died because apparently only a handful of people play anymore. Your best bet is to get some [spoilers]friends[/spoilers] to play with you.
What the hell did DDC do so well to make it be such a fan favorite? Usually people hate the newer games.
>>15057346
It gave birth to best girl and her flawless stage 6 boss theme.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jv1yYDzvFtQ
>>15057346
It didn't force a shitty gimmick (UFO, LoLK) and it was actually fun.
The OST is really good once you get out of stage 1.
The cast is really well designed and doesn't rely on silly clothes to be interesting.
The shottypes, even if a bit unbalanced, are pretty diverse and really fun to use.It gave us Seija
It's not part of a bigger arc, so the story is pretty straightforward.
And it's just fun, y'know. It doesn't try to be anything bigger than it actually is, but at the same time it doesn't fall flat like TD.
>>15057311
>pofv and podd
>low
why
>>15057442
Where the fuck is sakuya in that picture
>>15057498
They are not really fun with they "tapping" mechanic, split screen and simple patterns.
They are also especially weak when you play them alone.
>>15057442
>a bit unbalanced
More like super unbalanced. I remember Marisa B breaking the game really bad.
>>15057604
She only unbalanced in lunatic (If you know when to use her bombs), otherwise she just breaks the extra stage.
>>15057543
>They are not really fun with they "tapping" mechanic
You meant for you right? because that's one really stupid complaint
>split screen and simple patterns.
It's a VS game, have you ever played twinkle star sprites?
>They are also especially weak when you play them alone.
The single player is fine, specially if you play o harder difficulties.
>>15057711
>only on lunatic
lolno
You can farm a lot of resources in stages, 3,4 and 5 even in normal if you keep bombing mid screenand let the aimed bullets convert in points.
>>15057772
On normal, all the other shottypes can farm a lot of lives too.
That's the way it was designed you know.
>>15057320
>I'm not much of a shmup fan anyway, I just like Touhou.
That's pretty pathetic, although so is the rest of your post.
>>15057346
People hate UFO and TD for having unfun mechanics.
People hate LoLK because it's too hard for them.
DDC harkens back to older games, and isn't actually that tough.
>>15057923
>People hate LoLK because it's too hard for them
Except they don't. Stop trying to hide bad gimmicky design behind the difficulty.
>>15056824
Seihou extra was hype as fuck dude
It's mostly memorization, but the midboss and reimu fight are both rad as hell. Not to mention that the music is fantastic.
>>15057879
>On normal, all the other shottypes can farm a lot of lives too.
Yes and with Marisa B you can make even much more, same for hard mode.
>>15057923
>People hate LoLK because it's too hard for them
nice meme
People hate LoLK because it tried to force the terrible point device mode and because the final fight was not as exiting as people hyped it up.
>>15057995
Anon, if you simply play the game on Legacy, it actually has one of the most straightforward and non-gimmicky resource and scoring mechanics in the series.
Say what you want about the danmaku (but you're probably wrong), but the mechanics themselves, outside of a mode that you can easily ignore, are incredibly solid, and the hilarious thing is that if ZUN were to paste them into another game, people would praise them.
>>15058090
>People hate LoLK because it tried to force the terrible point device mode
No, UFO and TD force their gimmicks on you. LoLK gives you the option to turn off the gimmick entirely.
>the final fight was not as exiting as people hyped it up.
That's on them, I thought the final boss fight was fantastic, and I enjoyed all of it.
>>15057997
>It's mostly memorization
That's why I dislike it.
>midboss
That generic boss enemy? Its patterns sucked.
>Reimu fight
That was neat, though. Although, I did prefer the Marisa fight.
>Not to mention that the music is fantastic.
Stage music was kind of mediocre, but the Reimu/Marisa themes were fantastic, I'll agree.
>>15058118
>No, UFO and TD force their gimmicks on you. LoLK gives you the option to turn off the gimmick entirely.
Following the same logic, you can just ignore the UFOs and play it like a normal shmup.
Therefore it's a great game with no gimmicks.
See how stupid your argument really is?
>>15058153
Oh, I didn't realize that UFO came in "UFO Mode" and "Legacy Mode" as well.
Yes, anon, you can ignore the UFOs, but unlike LoLK you don't get an alternative for collecting resources, meaning you have to clear one of the hardest games in the series with two lives and the bombs that come with. UFO is not designed with an alternative to the UFO gimmick in mind, while LoLK has a built in alternative to PD, if you dislike the mode.
Honestly, I thought that would be obvious, but I guess I'm expecting too much from a bandwagoner.
>>15058167
>but unlike LoLK you don't get an alternative for collecting resources
Bosses still drop life pieces, what are you talking about?
>I guess I'm expecting too much from a bandwagoner.
Says the one criticizing UFO without actually knowing anything about it.
>>15058167
> meaning you have to clear one of the hardest games in the series
This is why nobody is taking you seriously you shitter.
Since when have people found UFO hard? It's one of the easiest games in the entire series in terms of both pattern difficulty and resources given to you.
Bombs in UFO are incredibly powerful, all of the shot types are incredibly powerful besides Marisa B and the stages are a joke.
I LNV'd the game within a few weeks of clearing lunatic.
It is a joke.
>>15058118
The midboss was a generic enemy, but I couldn't help but stare when it got to the blue/green attack with the bigass laser. The other two are mediocre, I agree, but the last one really makes it.
As for the Marisa fight, it was good, but I feel like it was a little too easy.
As for the music, I really liked everything. I think the stage music actually was especially good, I think it captures Gensokyo pretty well.
>>15058118
>LoLK gives you the option to turn off the gimmick entirely
I was reffering in how the main game is designed arround point device and legacy carries the same design flaws of point device
>I thought the final boss fight was fantastic, and I enjoyed all of it.
I liked it too and i thought it was good, but fantastic? lol
>>15058177
Don't they drop like one life piece per boss? You're still only getting one extra life at best.
>>15058184
UFO has some pretty intense patterns, yeah.
>>15058243
Ok, you keep mentioning these "design flaws", but you never elaborate.
None of the LoLK haters ever actually elaborate on that shit. I always hear the same criticisms from you guys, all of which are to be frank kind of silly complaints.
>This shitter who is awful at shmups and finds UFO difficult actually thinks his opinion is in any way relevant.
Pottery.
>>15058297
Okay, first of all, i'm not a hater, i replied to your post because not understanding why people whould not like a game is super stupid, and you addressing the people that criticize it as haters is funny.
>you keep mentioning these "design flaws", but you never elaborate
I was talking mainly about how the patterns are designed under the idology of multiple tries to get arround them, a lot of the spellcards involve cheap deaths, specially in Lunatic and the whole unbalance between sht types only makes things worse. Even thought the game relies heavily in dense patterns, luck and memorization is not even that hard of a game to claim that people hate it jst for the difficulty.
It baffles me how you don't understand how most people didn't liked LoLK, i liked it a lot too but i can see how people dislike it.
>>15058334
>Anyone who dislikes UFO is a shitter at the games.
>>15058381
No, he's calling him a shitter because he thinks UFO is hard.
>>15058381
Not what I said at all. Not even what I implied.
Feel free to dislike that piece of shit game all you want.
I'm laughing because nobody finds it even remotely difficult.
New players can shower themselves with resources by abusing the easy UFO gimmick, and players who aren't shit can ignore UFO's completely and still beat the game with ease because the patterns in UFO are hilariously easy.
Kagerou in DDC is harder than any boss in UFO.
>>15058386
UFO is harder than the following games.
SoEW
LLS
MS
EoSD
PCB
IN
MoF
TD
DDC
It is relatively one of the harder games in the series, especially when you take away the boon of getting tons of resources, which is what we are discussing in this conversation, just in case you are mentally incapable of keeping up with that.
>>15058415
I'm not even the guy that called you a shitter man. Goddamn you are dumd.
Also i don't feel UFO harder than any of those you mentioned except for TF and PCB. The only patters i had problems with were Shou's glowing balls spellcards and legendary flying saucer.
>>15058415
>"I'm shit at shmups, please listen to what I'm saying!"
You cannot make this shit up.
>>15058415
You truly are awful if UFO is giving you more difficulty than any of those.
PCB is one of the only games in the series that is easier than UFO.
Classic case of git gud.
>>15058440
>>15058398
>>15058334
Here's your (You), Mr. "I Pretend to have a WR because it validates by shitty opinions"
>>15058437
I never said you were. I was just questioning if you were actually following the conversation at all.
And I honestly don't think you've been bothering to.
>>15058455
>I was just questioning if you were actually following the conversation at all.
Yes, you claimed that UFO is one of the hardest games in the series, which honestly is not true.
>And I honestly don't think you've been bothering to.
That's true, i'm not bothering at all, after all you are the one that doesn't understand why some people didn't like LoLK
>>15058455
>Tries his very best to ignore me
>Can't even accomplish that
Too easy.
No wonder you suck at shmups lmao.
Face it, you're the only shitter here who has difficulty with the game. You'll never grow up to be as good as me with that kind of attitude.
>>15058484
>Yes, you claimed that UFO is one of the hardest games in the series, which honestly is not true.
See, you're showing how stupid you are anon. I said that UFO has difficult patterns, and would be a very hard came to 1cc if you didn't utilize the UFOs to gain more lives.
>>15058505
Ok anon, since you apparently have amnesia let me quote back at you.
>>15058167
>meaning you have to clear one of the hardest games in the series with two lives
>one of the hardest games in the series
There you go anon. Cheers.
>>15058522
>with two lives
You're just pretending, right? You aren't actually this stupid?
>>15058544
He shows up every thread to shitpost. Don't encourage him, although it's clearly too late for that this time.
>>15058544
The two lives part is obviously irrelevant. You claim it's one of the hardest games in the series. It isn't.
And now you cry when people laugh at you for being shit and try to backpeddle to save face.
Embarrassing, really.
>>15058544
You see? i know you are trying to save face but i don't even know if i have to bother replying seriously to you since your backpedaling is not only stupid and ilogical but also wrong, because as most people already told you the bosses drop life pieces.
>>15058564
Sorry, I don't come to these threads very often. I'll make sure to ignore obvious bait next time, thanks.
>>15058564
>>15058584
>Bails himself out of a losing argument by samefagging
Who are you trying to kid?
>>15058564
I'm not maze thought, and i don't hate UFO, i actually like it, but i don't think it's difficult.
>>15058544
>>with two lives
Every boss/midboss drops a lifepiece, and nueball in stage 4 drops an extend unless you die/bomb.
You get as many resources as a standard cave game, but the patterns are easier and the bombs let you skip any card you want.
>>15058603
See, it's people like you who I like.
I don't mind if people actually like the game. The only thing that needs to end is this running meme that the game is hard.
Even when I was new to shmups, UFO on Normal, Hard and Lunatic was consistently the easiest game to 1cc along with PCB.
My LNV's came shortly after that.
UFO is factually a joke of a game difficulty wise.
>>15058641
I've LNBed UFO quite a few times now, and I'm pretty happy with my progress. It took me a couple days to get my first LNB in it, compared to about a month for MoF. I consider the game's difficulty pretty moderate (there are only a few super tough sections in the game), but I don't think the game should be considered a joke. Just my opinion, at least.
>>15058641
Thanks, i guess. But you have to admit that it was kind of amusing how the other guy thought i was another person and posted without even reading the conversation.
>>15058641
What is LNV? I might be good at the games, but i don't understand much of the technical words, sorry.
>>15058832
No UFO
is this supposed to be a better kind of thread than "I want to verb character!"
>>15062593
yes?
If you ignore the guy that got completly destroyed in his UFO argument and bailed out and MaZe's terrible actitude towards everyone it has been a pretty formal thread.so far.
It ould be much worse.
Icycalm > MaZe.
Where do I get the newer games?
Ideally, with an english patch. I've tried torrent sites and looking or generals.
FUCK SAGUME FUCK HER STAGE
do japs sell their talent
where can i buy talent from a jap
>>15068034
>I've tried torrent sites
No, you clearly haven't, because going to Nyaa and searching 'Touhou' would get you everything you need.
I just got my first 1cc in Imperishable Night.
Feels good.Even if I had to max out my starting lives to win.
>>15073387
Good job, anon. Now try doing it with the regular amount of lives.
>>15073725
Also, what team did you use?
>>15073727
Reimu and Yukari.
>>15073725
What's the regular amount of lives?
I just did a 1cc of IN solo Marisa with one starting life
>>15073387
That's nice, but you clearly have a lot of progress to make.
Firstly, don't play on Easy. It won't teach you as much, and even when you get a 1cc, you won't see a good ending. Just bite the bullet and go up to Normal.
Secondly, only the first-gen games allow you to set the number of starting lives, so don't get used to that. Especially in 8, you can get plenty of extra lives in game if you play halfway smartly. And if you only died seven times, you should have had several in stock at the end of that run anyway, so you didn't need to do it in the first place. (If not, you're not collecting enough point items.)
Finally, you're clearly not utilizing your bombs. You should have closer to a 3:1 bomb-to-death ratio; otherwise, you're wasting them. It's always better to bomb than to die. Using the Border Team in 8 gives you a huge window for death-bombing, but that aside, you should just learn to anticipate when you'll need to bomb and then do so liberally.
Getting a good end is totally doable even if you don't play shmups, so stick with it. Have fun, and good luck.
>>15074029
Thanks anon.
I think the reason why I didn't use that many bombs was becauseI was using a PS3 controller and had the bomb button mapped to O, with shoot being X and focus being Square, so I couldn't really use them very well.
>>15074069
Why don't you use a keyboard?
>>15074075
I dunno.
I just decided to use a controller for whatever reason, and somehow I just so happened to get a 1cc on the same run.
LNBed UFO with MarisaA. Feels pretty good!
>>15074078
Well, congratulations on getting a 1cc while using a controller, but i would suggest that you use a keyboard if you want to go harder, it will make the bombing more easy
>>15074069
Jesus Christ. At least configure your controller properly, or just use a keyboard.
>>15074125
Yeah, I know.
Although I really wasn't trying to get a 1cc clear with that shitty setup, I just so happened to manage it like that.
Why the fuck are all of these scrubs recommending using a keyboard? Most good players use a controller, not a fucking keyboard. Post your fucking scores if you're one of these retards.
>>15074435
my score is 270 mil!
Fucking Tertiary here. Are the PC-98 games canon, or should I skip them.
>>15076394
>Are the PC-98 games canon
No.
>or should I skip them.
Yes, play them later.
>>15076394
The PC98 games exist in their own separate canon from the windows games. I would recommend newer players to skip them at first. That doesn't mean they're bad though.
>>15076394
I wouldn't skip them, especially Mistic Square.
But if you don't really care you can ignore them.
>>15076394
>Are the PC-98 games canon
The canon in the PC-98 series is loose. ZUN said that everything on them is canon unless there exists contradictions with the windows games. In that case one should take the windows events as canon over the PC-98 ones.
>should I skip them.
You shouldn't. I enjoyed all five games, and LLS and MS are excellent, but you should try them after playing the windows games for a good while.
>>15076394
Play the windows games first, then go to PC98
1 is a refreshing, yet awkward breath of fresh air after playing the STGs. It's sort of like a brick breaker except but you shoot at the ball and if you get hit by it you die. There's bullet dodging, but it's not real danmaku.
2 is garbage. If I were you, I would play it for the sake of experiencing it, but I wouldn't get invested in it. The shot types are all unsatisfying, the patterns are boring, and there's no focus.
3 is a very fun versus shooter, but will be a little bit harder than PoFV due to charge attacks not removing bullets and no focussing. It gets really fun on harder difficulties. I would really recommend it.
4 is probably my favorite. It feels like the first REAL touhou game. Focussing is introduced in this game, and the patterns sort of resemble modern touhou patterns more. The bullets are still faster and a little less numerous than windows touhou, but this is where ZUN is starting to become consistent in his style. The music is also great.
5 is the favorite PC98 for most people, and I can see why. It feels a little more refined than 4. I just like it less because it has curvy lasers and it's kind of hard to see bullets in stage 4. Other than that, it's a really good game.
>>15077089
I agree for the most part, except I honestly think 1 is just terrible. If there were a remake that was halfway decently made, it might be fun, but it's just so clunky and awful that I couldn't have fun with it at all.
>>15077089
>3 is a very fun versus shooter, but will be a little bit harder than PoFV due to charge attacks not removing bullets and no focussing. It gets really fun on harder difficulties. I would really recommend it.
TwinkleTouhou Sprites?
>>15077191
I'm not sure I follow
>>15077191
Yes.
Never played 3, but I love 9 to death, so I'm sure it's good.
>>15077641
Twinklestar Sprites is a versus arcade shooter with bright colors. The versus aspect made me think of that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZkkqkh7VPU
Where do the replays end up in TD?
>>15078562
Yeah, it's pretty similar to that
>>15078581
For 13 and onward, except the fighters, all the user data is in ~/AppData/Roaming/ShanghaiAlice
>>15077871
As someone who loves 9, 3 is pretty bad. You're better off just playing Twinkle Star Sprites.
Speaking of 3, does anyone have any good strategies for using Marisa in this game? I'm trying to get a Lunatic 1cc for reasons, but it feels like my success in the game is directly tied to how the AI feels at the moment. I can get to Reimu without losing a life fairly often, and have even gotten past her a few times without dying, but especially when I get to Chiyuri, it just feels like I'm praying that things don't get too crazy during the fight, and that she just decides to ram into my lasers (something she randomly does for no reason, regardless of how much offensive pressure I'm putting on.)
Oh, and Mima is almost always a pain, especially I end up facing her in later levels. Again, it feels like I'm just hoping that things don't end up getting too crazy, since that always benefits the AI way more than it benefits me.
Are the AI in this game on a suicide timer or something? That would explain their erratic behavior.
>>15080925
>Are the AI in this game on a suicide timer or something?
Basically, yeah. The same is true in 9. The 'AI' isn't anywhere near sophisticated enough to play like a human; it plays perfectly for a set amount of time depending on level and difficulty, then has a certain chance of dying for every unit time afterwards.
>>15083332
Thanks I guess.
I mean that doesn't help me at all, and this still feels like bullshit to be honest, but I guess it's nice to know.
>>15032643
I just got my first 1cc today in EoSD on Normal with a PS3 controller.It felt amazing.During Remilia last spellcard I got goosebumps and it almost screwed my run.Thankfully I still did it.
>>15074069
I had the same setup as you.Then I mapped focus to L1 and it made it so much easier.
I have a laptop with shitty directionals so even if I wanted to play with a keyboard I couldn't.
Plus I have been using a controller all my life to just be able to switch to a keyboard.
>>15052077
>The patterns are actually fairly solid, despite being mostly easy (though that exact phrase can apply to EoSD as well, so hating TD's patterns but loving EoSD's patterns is hypocritcal)
What is this garbage? People love EoSD patterns because they're fast, random, and mix macro and micro movement instead of slow, static/aimed, and micro-heavy. Stage 4, 5, and 6 patterns in EoSD are extremely random and very fun to dodge. Patterns like Dream Vine, Green Books, Emerald Megalith, Sakuya's 1st, 2nd, and 3rd nons, Killing Doll, Eternal Meek, Vampire Illusion, Scarlet Meister, and Scarlet Gensokyo are all good examples of fast, heavily random patterns. Compare them to Miko's slow micro-dodge shitfest non-spells. When it comes to actually dodging/grazing them, EoSD patterns are amazing.
>and several boss fall back on the boring "firing random bullets in all directions from your location" trope.
And yet Eternal Meek is more fun to dodge than literally any of TD's patterns. You basically described a random pattern. How the fuck is a random pattern a 'trope'?
>>15052801
>Again, EoSD isn't a bad game, but it's a very dated game compared to the newer Windows games
The only ways that EoSD is dated are minor quality of life issues like replays or retries. Does a lack of visual hitbox now mean that literally every other STG without visual hitbox is now dated?
>>15053737
>Also, she gets Patchy's hardest spell cards. Not a huge deal, but just another point in Marisa's favor.
Only notable difference between ReimuB and MarisaB on Lunatic is Bury in Lake, which has a highly variable difficulty depending on RNG. Altogether though ReimuB's Patchy fight is nothing compared to MarisaA. MarisaA's is completely insane on Lunatic.
>>15088049
I love fast paced random patterns. Too bad most people seem too like static micrododging patterns more.
Are the windowed resolutions higher than 640x480 supposed to look downscaled/blurry?
I'm playing on Linux, by the way.
>>15088124
If you meant upscaled then yes.
>>15088101
>Too bad most people seem too like static micrododging patterns more.
I don't think that this is true.
>>15088049
I don't know why you're bringing up TD as a counterpoint, I would agree that it's an inferior game to EoSD.
Also, not sure why you brought up Dream Vine, as that card is boring as fuck. And the Green Books are perhaps the best argument I could ever make against rng heavy patterns. I enjoy most of those patterns, sure, but even the good rng heavy patterns generally have more structure to them than the more boring patterns, such as Extreme Color Typhoon or Eternal Meek.
And don't get me wrong. I think a level of rng in cards is a good thing, as it keeps patterns from becoming just memorization fests. I just don't like patterns that are practically just firing random bullets, often times from one location, in every direction, I think they're boring to dodge and boring to watch, and EoSD seems to have a lot of patterns that feel like that.
>>15088068
I feel like the lack of shot types also hurts it a bit, and a vast majority of the patterns are very simple. Again, I think EoSD is a very good game, but to even call it one of the best in the series just seems silly, when other games in the series do the things EoSD does better.
>Does a lack of visual hitbox now mean that literally every other STG without visual hitbox is now dated?
Nah. In fact, I think lack of visual hitbox is fine. However, when ZUN added a visible hitbox, I believe it gave him an excuse to start creating more intricate patterns, which overall I believe is a positive thing. I mean, even just comparing Youmu's patterns (at least, assuming you don't cheese them) to Sakuya's patterns, the difference is pretty clear. Not to say that Sakuya's patterns are bad, mind you, but compared to Youmu they just seem so basic.
xth for 4chen
Any tips on dealing with Youmu?
Her "double-colored interlacing waves" non-spellcard attacks in particular. Is there a way to somehow avoid having to keep 'crossing' the bullet lines in zig-zags, or is just a matter of developing the skill to do just that?
Or any tips in general would be appreciated. I seem to struggle more with her than even Yuyuko.
>>15090386
Midboss non
>>15090386
Boss 1st non
>>15090538
>>15090544
Thank you, that answers my question
What do you guys use for English patches?
I noticed the wiki doesn't have something for 15.
>>15090538
>>15090544
Cheesing is lame.
>>15090725
but it does.
>>15090743
Nevermind, I'm retarded.
Any good plays with commentary? I like kefit's ones.
Would you guys say that the bottom-of-the-screen boss marker was an improvement?
I think it actually takes something away; in Scarlet Devil you had to keep your eyes on the enemy in order to sustain the maximum damage output, but if you took your eyes off yourself, you were more likely to be hit. This made battles more tactical, because there was a clear difference between being on the offensive and being on the defensive, and for Marisa especially this mattered a lot.
I kind of liked that. Are there any games where there's an option to turn off the bottom-of-the-screen boss markers?
>>15096062
I hardly ever notice it. I'm usually busy keeping my eyes up above my hitbox/sprite instead of below it. If you don't like it, you could cover it up with some tape.
>>15076394
>Tertiary
How is it possible to be a tertiary Touhou fan? If being part of the primary fandom means that you're into the games, and being part of the secondary fandom means you're into the fanmade material from the primary fandom, what does tertiary mean? You're a fan of the memes from the secondary fandom?
>>15096062
>in Scarlet Devil you had to keep your eyes on the enemy in order to sustain the maximum damage output
No you don't, you can easily tell where the boss if via where the bullets are spawning most of the time, and you can tell if you're hitting them via audio cues.
>This made battles more tactical
No, it really didn't. You're just stretching to make a lack of features look appealing, when in truth there's nothing wrong with the enemy marker.
>and for Marisa especially this mattered a lot.
I play as Marisa, no it didn't.
Even now I barely use the boss marker myself, but like the new boss hp bars it was a nice, quality of life addition that at the very least made the UI look a bit better.
>>15076394
>Are the PC-98 games canon
Debatable. Most people agree that they're at least somewhat canon. However, the soft reboot between 5 and 6 means the elements of the PC98 games almost never come up, and they may as well not be canon.
>should I skip them.
1 and 3 are optional, I would recommend playing 2, 4 and 5.
>>15096117
>3 is optional
really man
do you think that 9 is optional too
>>15096134
9 is actually important to the story and the lore as a whole, providing a massive amount of characterization both to several important recurring characters, and to several minor characters who finally get a chance to shine in that game. The Eiki lectures alone make the game worth playing, and the tight gameplay mechanics and great ost wrap it all together. Plus, the game has some of the best endings in the series, making playing as each character well worth the effort.
3 isn't even important to the other PC98 games, the only reason you would really need to play it is if you want some more Reimu/Marisa/Mima characterization. The gameplay itself lacks the mechanics that make PoFV fun, making it feel like a lackluster version of TSS instead. It really suffers from not having pre-battle conversations as well, as it makes the characters feel so forgettable in general, especially if you don't go out of your way to play as everyone. Some of the music is pretty good, but other tracks are kind of bland. Also, kind of a subjective opinion, but I thought the newhus in PoDD aside from Chiyuri and Yumemi were kind of garbage.
>>15096292
Chiyuri and Yumemi were great, as they were probably the most developed single appearance characters in PC98. I agree the other newhus were pretty bad.
As of now, I also agree that the story didn't have much to do with the rest, but I mean, which PC98 games WERE relevant to the plots of the other games?Hate to theoryfag here, but Yumemi may be more important soon. Renko is looking more like her in every ZUN art for her.
>>15096351
>Chiyuri and Yumemi were great, as they were probably the most developed single appearance characters in PC98. I agree the other newhus were pretty bad.
Cool, we can agree on that then.
>As of now, I also agree that the story didn't have much to do with the rest, but I mean, which PC98 games WERE relevant to the plots of the other games?
I suppose none of the plots really interconnect, but at least the other 4 introduce recurring characters (HRtP has Reimu and Mima, SoEW introduces Marisa/characterizes Reimu and Mima, LLS introduces Yuuka, and MS introduces Alice), which is about as much as you can ask for in a Touhou game. PoDD is the only game in the series to introduce characters, only for none of them to ever appear again. The only thing PoDD really did was give Marisa/Mima their first playable roles, and Marisa her now normal hair color.>Hate to theoryfag here, but Yumemi may be more important soon. Renko is looking more like her in every ZUN art for her.I've always loved that theory, anon. It's been a personal pet theory of mine for a while, and even though I know it's probably just coincidence, I just love the parallels that it would create between Renko/Yumemi and Maribel/Yukari. Plus, it would make PoDD an actual relevant game.
>>15096117
>Debatable. Most people agree that they're at least somewhat canon. However, the soft reboot between 5 and 6 means the elements of the PC98 games almost never come up, and they may as well not be canon.
Totally agree. It's hard to say whether Windows Alice even has access to PC-98 Alice's grimoire, and other situations like that exist aplenty. I try to treat them like two separate series.
>>15096434
>It's hard to say whether Windows Alice even has access to PC-98 Alice's grimoire
The funny thing about that is that Windows Alice canonically has a grimoire that she both always keeps around (you can see actually see it in the fighting games), and never opens (which I believe is even emphasized in one of the books). While it's never explicitly confirmed to be the same grimoire as PC98's, it's heavily hinted that it could be. That's probably a poor example to bring up when talking about how PC98 and Windows are different, because it's one of the biggest hints towards PC98 maybe being canon. If you really want to make a case against PC98, bring up Marisa's inconsistent backstory, and Mima never being brought up despite clearly being her mentor in the PC98 games.
>>15085257
>with a PS3 controller
Disgusting, KB or gtfo.
