If you can't see a picture in your mind's eye, you can't become good at drawing from imagination.
Do you agree?
P.s. don't misunderstand the difference between vizualization and imagination.
>>2504632
You just need to be able to see one step ahead. You don't need to see the end product perfectly from the start. Most artists just have a vague idea of the end result, then they are able to just consistently build slowly upon what they already have on the canvas towards the general direction they want.
>>2504643
Which means you have to visualize. 1 step ahead, 5 steps a head or 100 steps ahead.
>>2504667
Uh, yeah, you do need to visualize at least a bit. No shit. Either you draw from reference in which case you draw what you see, or you draw without reference and you need to be able to draw what you think of. It's pretty obvious.
>>2504643
I agree with this. The reason people sketch and thumbnail is that they have to get down a rough element.
For example.
You're in a studio and have to make goblin pirates, 15 of them they are evil goblin pirates. I have an image floating around but the first thing I do is sketch some quick 1-2 minute head shapes with with evil expressions. Tweaking them and adjusting. Doing multiple palletes to get a colour. This is how most work is done as far as I know.
>>2504632
creating something isn't about converting something in your head to something material. its about performing mechanical motions and then seeing if the result provokes the desired response. so no... its irrelevant.
This is actually a very important point. In my opinion all those construction methods ala loomis really can hurt your progress if you just mechanically learn them. You draw a ball, then establish the middle line and so on and at the end the result may look like a not so bad face, but you just cheat yourself with that because you have no real inflience on the look of the final product because you don´t have a vivid picture in your head, just a set of rules to follow. I always callange myself with imagining the faces of friends, family members but I never get a clear image inside my head. That´s probably the reason im still shitty at drawing.
>everyone can learn to draw well! there's no such thing as natural talent*
*except that you need the natural ability to visualize very well, which not everyone has
>>2504715
The ability to visualize can be developed through practice though. I agree that talent is real, but I also feel a lot of technical things like construction and visualization are skills that can be taught. Some people just might take a bit longer before things in their brain "click".
>>2504632
Top quality bait, as far as trolling on /ic/ goes. I commend you.
>>2504726
So you cannot visualize well but still got gud? Post your work.
Why is it that I can visualize everything, but I don't have the skills to actually pull it off?
>>2504781
You're not actually visualizing it as well as you think. Your brain can basically summon up only a very foggy and vague idea of something but it "feels" complete so you think you picture it perfectly and in detail. Try to picture a bicycle. Easy, right? Except you are probably picturing the "idea" of a bicycle--a couple wheels, a seat, handlebars. How do they actually fit together? What does the frame look like? How does the chain attach? Ask most people to draw it and they will get it messed up really badly and if you tried to build it then it wouldn't function in the slightest.
>>2504717
Sorry my friend, that can't be developed.
Skill can be developed. Visualization is not skill. Eather you can visualize - see with a "mind's eye" or you can't, also called "blind mind's eye" and recently (2015) got official name: APHANTASIA (google it).
And this is what 99% people on /ic have, who complain that they don't have an imagination. Its not THAT hard to make up some story, the problem is they can't visualize that story.
You can give them story, they won't see it with mind's eye. They can read books, but they won't be able to visualize.
>>2504869
So a rare hypothesized condition that has no way of really being measured is your argument. Good one.
>>2504869
Nah, my visualization ability improved ten-folds since I started drawing. Sucks to be you I guess, there must be something wrong with your brain.
>>2504869
Ya, everyone has an obscure condition now... You guys are getting more pathetic by the day.
You don't want to draw then don't draw. Don't waste other peoples' time trying to pull them into your time wasting bullshit.
Furthermore, people with aphantasia still can draw, they can't plan shapes ahead of comitting them to paper, but they can still conceptualize on the canvas like everyone else. The canvas is their RAM.
> can't be developed
Hardly anybody has aphantasia and everyone else can develop it further. Hence thousands of articles and books on the subject.
>>2504963
>Hence thousands of articles and books on the subject.
Provide them
>>2504869
Top notch shitposting, all these guys are taking you seriously.
>>2504715
anyone can draw well, but you need this to draw interesting.
>>2506560
You are one of those who can't handle the simple OBVIOUS fact
Check out this thread on a pixel art forum, it's quite a good discussion on the topic:
http://pixelation.org/index.php?topic=20133.0
>>2506873
How is it a fact? Just because there is something wrong with your brain and YOU cannot improve your visualization ability doesn't mean that's the same for everyone or even for the majority of people. People like you who suffer from aphantasia are a tiny, tiny minority. Your condition is rare as fuck.
>>2506921
That condition is not rare
>>2506921
Just because you didn't knew you have a dissorder it doesn't mean you don't have it.
>>2506925
The only thing that's not rare is moron plebs on IC finding bullshit "conditions" on wikipedia to explain why they suck, are lazy and can't get out of their moms basement.
Have a nice life anon.
>>2506933
>living in moms basement
Judging by yourself? ;)
>>2506933
when will the basement meme die
>>2506940
When you get a job and move out of the basement
>>2506937
Whos mad? Just stating a fact.
Every week some pleb comes on here with some new ultra rare disease that explains how they're really not a lazy unmotivated fuck off, but they have this "thing" that's stopping them. I'm just pointing out that, no, you're just lazy. Plenty of people with handicaps accomplish their goals. I don't see these anons with "aphantasia" posting their insane realist still life paintings or portrait work, something you don't need to visualize to paint. Its all just excuses for being lazy.
Seeing that you're defending them you must also prescribe to this explanation on why you can't "make it". Which is fine by me, just admit it.
