Is Loomis a meme, or is it really helpful for beginners?
Both
>>2481270
This fampai
I didn't really understand Loomis when first starting out, but after getting around some of the basics, I find him a lot more helpful.
>>2481268
it's a tool, mate. you develop your won tools and ways of construction as time passes. sometimes it's automatic but having tools is handy.
>>2481281
what book did you start with
>>2481268
>goes in with hard perspective for absolute beginners
the reason most people who start with loomis get awkward blocky retarded looking drawings then get frustrated and give up is because loomis requires two foundations which beginners do not have; structural knowledge and proportional knowledge.
Loomis is good but recommending him to absolute beginners is definitely a meme
>>2481290
well then where do you start
im tired of not going anywhere near what i want to do
>>2481277
I always kind of thought that ball head shit was retarded, like, when you're getting serious all that crap goes out the window so why even teach that. everyone can draw circles but getting the hang of making a jaw look like a jaw on a head is hard.
seems kind of outdated too like it was just in fashion at the time because mickey mouse cartoons and such.
>>2481268
Its not really good for beginners, especially not drawings head and hands. If you're an absolute beginner then drawing on the right side of the brain and juliette aristedes' drawing book are pretty good
>>2481292
with a life drawing class
you absolutely cannot replace drawing from life with drawing from photos on a monitor.
also a word of personal advice, make sure you balance your work from imagination and studies. I ONLY did studies for like the first year of wanting to learn to draw and barely got anywhere. You need to apply what you learn, regardless if the results are good or not
>>2481296
> drawing on the right side of the meme
Yeah I think he's the best when you already have a little bit of experience and basic knowledge and find yourself asking questions like "okay so that's how you draw a face. but how do you draw it at an angle? how do I keep all these proportions together in perspective?" etc.
He gives you those answers but it's no use if you're too noob to even know what to do with them. I've made the mistake of recommending him to total beginners mostly because I can't myself even remember what it was like when I was at their level (I was something like, what, 5?)
>>2481298
I was in a community college drawing 101 class.
You know what what each week was?
"here, draw this stuff in class"
"here, draw this for homework"
barely any teaching whatsoever.,
>>2481307
Well obviously the quality of teaching differs. Don't expect a good education from a community college teacher though. See if you can sit in on a university drawing class (most animation courses have them) or find a private class from a good artist.
when you draw stuff don't just blindly copy it, too. learning is half thought process and half practical, in my opinion
>>2481316
she's also a professor at a uni, so that should've made SOME difference.
Only useful shit i got from her was the pencil/thumb measuring method, which im still horrible at. I can't make drawings exactly the size they are, letalone making them bigger/smaller. I'm always warping the hell out of it.
>>2481300
I'm sick of every book recommended in the sticky being a meme. What a fucking shitty sticky.
>>2481318
Well, it starts with you anon. Go sit in a park and draw people around you for a few hours. Don't spend all your time on one drawing, do lots to lock an understanding of gesture and proportion. Do some self portraits from your mirror, and do some master studies.
Doing any sort of study will help you massively as long as you're asking yourself the right questions while doing it. Try to figure out how stuff works by emulating it. I can give you some pointers if you'd like
>>2481320
a few anons banded together to make a better sticky but it's on google doc/reddit somewhere, they seemingly wont unsticky the shit one
>>2481326
How long should someone practice 2D before attempting 3D?
Also I'm only comfortable drawing faces. Once I start incorporating the rest of the body, it looks bad, and even worse when it's below the waist. A kid could draw legs better than I could.
>>2481331
Can you link it or tell me the name?
>>2481332
How do you mean 3D, like painting? Do both at the same time, there's no point in limiting yourself.
>Also I'm only comfortable drawing faces. Once I start incorporating the rest of the body, it looks bad, and even worse when it's below the waist. A kid could draw legs better than I could.
Of course, if you're a beginner it's gonna look shit, it's just the facts. Rome wasn't built in a day and so on. The important thing is don't be afraid of bad results, hiding from things you're bad at and sticking to your comfort zone will do nothing but stunt your growth til you do tackle it
>>2481331
that's because the mods have deserted this dead shithole of a board, just like all the good artists
>>2481326
that other post isn't me. I don't exactly have any parks/etc to go around here. I live in a very small city.
My main goal is to draw realistic looking people.
I'm just....blah. No idea where to start, because I know if I work on perspective im going to get sick of drawing cubes. Especially if they keep coming out wrong, and applying perspective to something like the face is going to be an even bigger headache
>>2481340
>im going to get sick of drawing cubes
studying isn't always fun. you have to power through it.
It's hard but you have to start somewhere, nothing anyone can say here will enlighten you. Just start studying regularly and you'll slowly but surely get a handle on what you should and shouldn't be doing to get better
>>2481268
1. "Fun with Pencil" is trash and bad for beginners.
2. Other books are fine, but hard to read through.
3. Best option - watch Proko 5-10 minute videos on how to draw heads and you'll immediately see what it is all about. Want more details? Go Loomis after.
>>2481495
what if you can't stand his cringeworthy jokes/seemingly can't do what he shows to do.
I try to do the ball/plane method and it constantly looks like shit, whenever i chop the sides of the ball off. Forget the features. I can't even do that right
>>2481501
post your work? I'm wondering how one can fuck up drawing a circle and slicing off the side.
>>2481511
I forgot to write here - "Keys to Drawing" by Bert Dodson. Straight out minimal bullshit (ok, maybe not much) and a lot of drawing.
>>2481505
can't post anything right his second, but whenever I try to draw the circle, and I draw the curved sides to cut it off. The curves are either fucked up, the circle is off, or a mix of both. And it just looks awful. Forget trying to add the jaw in. Thats a whole other mess
>>2481516
www.drawabox.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgDNDOKnArk
Do lines and ellipsies exercises. Draw in ballpoint/ink to up your confidence and line control.
And here is additional grueling stuff from Scott Robertson for maximum grind:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INHeI6Lwtes
>>2481529
yeah I've continued to work on that, my lines are still wobbly as shit though.
>>2481294
If you think the ball head technique is outdated, youre in for a rude awaking if you continue drawing.
>>2481588
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VfDTpLLVl5bWUGWguswKpPFml533luI8-NBd1EGYHnA/edit#
>>2481613
who the fuck recommends Keys to Drawing? I'm looking over it and its just page upon page of babbling.
Seriously, are there no resources that just get to the fucking point.
>>2481668
"Keys to Drawing" seem to be pretty on point, I don't know what you are talking about. One of the first sentences in the book are basically "get pen/pencil and draw what you have in front of you on your desk".
>>2481668
/ic/ thinks all drawing books are memes.
>>2481611
I mean specifically the cartoon ball head that's just a ball with no other forms of construction. his other techniques are fine.
>>2481677
yeah well it shouldnt take 200 fucking pages to explain some thing.
There's no way in fuck im reading all of that, letalone all of the shit in the other books.
>>2481710
Are you the OP of >>2478782 by any chance?
>>2481710
You're not going to make it if you keep being a whiny baby.
>>2481281
this brah, it took me months before Loomis was actually helpful
He's great, just not for absolute beginners! On a scale of difficulty I would put him on 4/10.
My path:
Perspective Made Easy(1/10)->Keys to Drawing(1/10)->How to Draw(Robertson)(Hard but necessary)->Proko(abridged Loomis)->Loomis
I initially started with Fun with a pencil but I got sick of imagining Andy on my shoulder so I gave up and went with that route. Much better.
I went skimmed through the figure drawing book and had no idea which drawings are explanations and meant only to be looked at and which drawings I was supposed to attempt.
>>2481831
This is my problem with every single drawing book.
>>2481773
Thanks, I'll try that progression path.
>>2481831
Just draw 'em all. Everything will help in the long run
>>2481883
Is that what you did?
>>2481903
Not him but
>implying anyone here practices what they preach
I sure as hell don't.
/ic/ is full of people that know what they should be doing but they're too busy gossiping and playing video games to do it.
Loomis is severely outdated. I think the Hampton book is much better.
Bridgman is still the best. Such a simple method and nice visual teachings.
>>2481331
I have the Google doc sticky
>>2481331
Have people tried bitching about it on /qa/?
>>2482089
>Loomis is outdated, here, try interpreting these incredibly ambiguous Bridgman sketches instead
It's almost like you're intentionally misleading people.
Hampton on the other hand is good (the ability to print in color alone has certainly given him a huge advantage over his antecedents; I highly recommend his book), but Loomis has him beat on heads. All Hampton's heads look the exact same both in his book or in his personal work, whether male or female.
Loomis' heads on the other hand are great and he draws them in a huge variety.
>>2481292
Life drawing, which will suck and you'll get frustrated. But whatever, you'll live. Do it a lot. I should do it more. Classes are good, but there's literally billions of people on this earth. I'm sure you can find someone in the wild too.
And I found Scott Robertson to be great. His technical approach helped me start to get a feel for proportion, perspective, and form. After that I moved to Loomis, and it all made way more sense.
The divided ball is great, but watch Proko if you don't get it. Loomis isn't always the most eloquent writer, and his instructions can seem confusing. Watching someone lay it out can be hugely beneficial. I also like his videos on facial features.
I'm still terrible, and I can't draw a decent face from imagination at all, but I'm improving. And I'm not angry at my results. I'm interspersing anatomy with my stuff now. I can already see how it'll help in the future, but don't go too far too fast, and don't be afraid to revisit a book you've finished. Drawing another basic face, or simple body can only ever help.
You've got a long grind, but so do I.
Oh, and draw big, and draw with a real pencil initially. It's scary and hard at first, but do it. Save the small journals for practice when you're traveling.
to;dr
Loomis, Proko, Robertson, life drawing, repeat.
>>2484204
Yea I completely agree, people get frustrated with Loomis because they aren't ready for him. I've seen that a lot here lately, and it doesn't help that people meme him to people who are very obviously just beginners who haven't yet grasped 3d forms and perspective and can't even draw good cubes.
>>2481710
guess you dont have the spark
>>2481332
Nigga most 3D/VFXfags can't draw worth a shit. It helps, but it isn't mandatory.
>>2481495
>Proko
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EPNYWeEf1U&index=1&list=PL39135B8D190B7C97
can you use his approach to draw manga faces?
>>2484576
Yeah. It's pretty much simplified Loomis. Drawing realistic proportions first is mandatory for good stylization; you have to know the rules before you can break them.
>>2484585
>can you use his approach to draw manga faces?
ok ty thanks for answer, once il get home il try this out. Faces is like my biggest problem
>>2481908
Stop describing me.
>>2482225
It's really a matter of what "clicks". I don't find Bridgman's sketches ambiguous at all, and I picked up the information immediately. Loomis on the other hand is really, really dry.
I didn't mention Hampton's book but it's great, I reference from a PDF I have quite often... it's a shame it's so hard to find in Europe or I'd buy it.
>>2481292
I'm very newbie myself but I've felt like Vilppu is a great place to start. Don't rush through it and just keep drawing/doodling outside of 'study'
